Date: Tue, 21 Feb 1995 11:12:40 +0100
From: Rene Mueller
Subject: Re: The Positive UFO friends?
To: "Light Workers List"
(*** Rene answering Allexzander's Post )
Allexzander:
>I believe that before you will see a landing the people of Earth
>must first decide if that is really in their best interest. This
>type of thing is clearly in violation of the Non-Interference
>Objective put in place by the Galactic Council, of which the
>Plieadians are a *member*.
Non-intereference ... hm, a word with a lot interpretion space ...
ie. the different galactic 'races' are here embodied as humans,
to interfere, in the moment they breath air of Earth, they grew
up and maybe don't remember where they come from, but just the
way they think affects the reality they live now, on Earth.
We are here ... to learn and share ... if the 'assistance' turns
into 'controling', then we start an old story again ... so far
without me ... :)
>Does Earth want to be just another
>planet in the Federation? A slave source to the Orion Empire?
>A communication grid line for the Sirians? Or does it want
>to be an independent unit, with its own representative for the
>Galactic Council? Without this independent classification,
>the planet Earth will simply fall under the representation of
>whoever takes control of it.
The manifold influence on Earth is not a battle about the 'control' of
it, it will be a summary of consciousness streams which are 'invited'
to be here and solve and balance many imbalances, many ... Earth is
small, nevertheless affects the entire universe, what is happening
here ... no accident that so many influences are going on ... maybe it
takes some time, when now more people get aware of their ET origins.
May we turn the key together, instead everyone tries to break the
door.
,
Rene
Date: Tue, 21 Feb 1995 11:51:23 +0100
From: Rene Mueller
Subject: Re: Sirians, Pleiadians & Rigelians etc.
To: "Light Workers List"
(*** Rene continuing to answer Allexzander's Post )
Allexzander:
>I think that 'negative' is quite a relative term. I have a slightly
>different view on the Zetas than most, I don't think that the
>abductions are negative at all. How could a species which has no
>ability to perceive or generate emotions produce negative emotions?
Ups, quite a strong claim!
>On that note, how could they produce positive ones? The Zetas are
>very neutral in their emotional standing, it is the human abductees
>that make the situation a negative one. Now I am not saying I would
>jump at the chance to be abducted by a Zeta, quite the contrary.
>However, I am enlightened enought to know that it is *I* who will
>producing the negative emotions and feelings with that situation
>should it occur, and therefore have no right to blame these intense
>feelings of negative energy on the Zeta collective.
Collective is the main-point, we are acting individually, they as
collective.
>From our point of view (individual to individual) it may be difficult
>to perceive their emotions or feelings, on my personal experiences I
>share feelings with them ... since I'm very young (when didn't
>heared/read about them), as well with other beings ... and somehow, I
>learned, that it's my limited understanding and perceptions, which
>sometimes makes me believe others are limited - but finally they
>reflected my ignorance.
>>Oh, you remind me to look bigger, thank's :) It's somehow very
>>similar when people talk about Pleiades in a manner, hmm, where I
>>think, they are describing just a time-frame by selecting it, and
>>the try to describe the whole expression, but they are even missing
other periods.
>
>The Pleiadians are notorious for doing this.
I was saying "people talk about Pleiades in a manner", I meant people
or humans talking about Pleiades, without knowing it's bigger context
... I was not saying "Pleiadians" talking about Pleiades and miss the
bigger view ...
>They are galactically known for "leaving out things" in their
>explanations.
Interesting to hear, new for me! :) Maybe to allow others to think
too, since "Michael Channelings" were suggesting, Pleiadians are
little bit arrogant in offering "their" solution ... now I take the
average of both views - it's ok! :) :) :)
>It is never done as some kind purposful event, but nonetheless is
>very common. Many of those members of this list who have known me in
>the past are aware of my feelings of the Pleiadians, and their
>actions on this planet, more of that to come...
I'm listening, your patterns seems deep, here is a place to release
it!
>There is much to learn from the Orions, they provided the template
>for duality for many eons. This planet is reliving that endless
>struggle everyday, we have not overcome this most basic concept.
>Duality exists up to the very edge of the source itself,
>the Pleiadians have not overcome it, the Sirians have not overcome
>it, the Arcturians have not overcome it.
>As much as they like to think they have, if they are trying to
>convince you they have done it, then by that very argument, they
>haven't.
The influences are here, because it's something we have to put
together ... TOGETHER, not each one should think about another, he or
she is just an 'ABC'-ian, coming from a planet and links a certain
behaviour to it ... we are spiritual beings ... and used to wear
cloths by embody ourselves on certain stars, and finally are sending
our consciousness into human-bodies to expand the experience in
duality.
We are one, and that's also the way to go 'back' ... means, inside of
ourselves ... there is good and evil side on side ... patterns went
into our consciousness to express the Self ... releasing (as we talked
already in lw-l) is done by many ways ...
,
Rene
Date: Tue, 21 Feb 1995 07:40:20 -0600 (CST)
From: "Richard L. Shapiro"
Subject: Re: The Positive UFO friends?
To: "Light Workers List"
(*** Joshua answering Allexander/Marcus post )
Marcus ... Nice to meet you ....
> >However, when I start to read information from more loving and
> >non-intervening races (Pleiadians, Andromadeans, etc )
>
> Might I add "so-called non-intervening races"?
>
Marcus, are you implying all ETS are interferring that are having
contact with Earth?
> I think the reason we have not seen a landing is that the critical
> point has not been reached yet, not enough members of this planet
> have made the decision that is what they want.
>
I agree with your point that permission must be given before a contact
occurs but also that we, humanity, as Divine Children of God, have the
ability to create the world we want without any outside help. What I
feel is the key in working with other entities (spiritual, angels,
devic, ascended masters, ETs, etc) is are they making suggestions or
telling us what we should do. I have always found a relationship with
whatever inner source provides information as suggestive knowing that
this source respects me as an individual soul and that since I am here
on the Earth plane, there maybe some suggestions that are not
appropriate (i.e. since time and space do not exist on the inner
levels). A balance must be reached and if one is sensitive, they can
feel if these entities are coming from Love (which to me is mutual
respect of all life, no desire or attachment to change but willing
to offer suggestions if -- permission -- is given.
> >below) and to those in charge. Why did the Greys ask that the
> >Gov't not reveal their presence, seems to me, if we link into our
> >inner part, the soul in unity, the power of this energy is beyond
> >any technology used to control.
>
> I don't quite understand your question here ....... (Marcus)
What I was saying, according to information about the treaty made with
the Govt and the Greys (via Cooper), the Greys said that before they
would exchange any technology, their presence must not be revealed by
the Govt. I felt that they requested this, because they knew that
inherent within humanity, in his deepest level, is a spiritual quality
that would be activated if people had the knowledge of a force or
preceived enemy (not a good work maybe a challenge to the way they
live their physical lives) that could literally unite humanity. For
example, if we all meditated for 5 seconds on the same thing, the
vibration of this combined energy would shift the reality of the earth
instantaneously. So if we sent these beings the vibration of love,
all together, with the geometric multiple of the inherent divine power
within us, I believe a Golden Age would begin. This is what I was
trying to express here.
Then we must also consider the races that live under the earth and
inside the inner surface, who are beings that are resident of Mother
Earth. What is their role in all of the prophecised changes to come?
Thanks for sharing Allexzander ... good questions and ideas. The
answers to such things will probably be coming soon.
Joshua
Date: Tue, 21 Feb 1995 07:46:43 -0600 (CST)
From: "Richard L. Shapiro"
Subject: Re: The Positive UFO friends?
To: "Light Workers List"
(*** - Joshua answering Flemming's post)
Flemming ... thanks for your feedback
I still consider the Greys must learn about permission ... since they
are reported to have no emotions, they must consider us just a species
that will further their ends without consideration of how this will be
beneficial for humanity. Also if the reports of implants is true, we
must also test our thoughts and feelings to see if what we think and
feel is true. I have found when you are in alignment with your higher
self or life purpose, you will receive confirmation via chills, an
energy of incredible joy or just feel incredibly connected to
creation.
IN any case, all things are in Perfection, we are each where we chose
to be for our own individual growth and the world as we know is in
transformation where the Light and Truth will be much more clearly
perceived by the people at the end of this cylce.
Thanks for sharing your info and insight ... not here to argue I hope
you know, we each have our perception on an incredible time of life
for Mother Earth ..... Joshua
On Mon, 20 Feb 1995, Flemming Funch wrote:
> At 10:22 AM 2/19/95 -0600, Richard Shapiro wrote:
> >In this time of transformation each of us has our own unique way at
> >looking at events. I agree on one level all experiences help us
> >grow and that people choose such lessons before incarnating. But I
> >also believe that the purpose of this transformation is that it is
> >a lesson to teach us all that we are all brothers and sisters and
> >we do not need to take things from each other. I still feel that
> >the Zetas are learning things from us too ....
> Right. The Zeta are learning as much from us as we from them. And
> the result will inevitably be some integration and now more need for
>stressful abduction scenarios.
>
> In part it is simply a change of mind. If the only way one can
> imagine interacting with aliens very different from oneself is as
>being the victim of an abduction, then that is how it will appear.
>Once one expands one's view and become willing to have other types of
>experiences, that is what they will appear as.
>
> Alien interactions is a powerful instrument to overcome fear
>through. As is earthquakes.
>
> - Flemming
Date: Tue, 21 Feb 1995 13:57:20 -0700
From: gerardus
Subject: Re: Sirians, Pleiadians & Rigelians etc.
To: "Light Workers List"
Allexzander says:
>I think that 'negative' is quite a relative term. I have a slightly
>different view on the Zetas than most, I don't think that the
>abductions are negative at all. How could a species which has no
>ability to perceive or generate emotions produce negative emotions?
.....
Gerardus here:
Exactly Allexzander! The Zetas are learning to experiencing what
emotions are all about by means of Human Kind. Would not Human kind
on Earth be the ideal species to cross-breed with? Human beings have
more emotions than brains most often, the two partners make a good
balance somewhere. Are not emotions the very beginnings of Soul
and/or Feelings in the first place?
That's what these electrical Zetas miss all along I feel. Soul!
However I've never met one that I know of consciously at the moment.
Probably don't have to for I sort of feel that I know what they are
like. Cooool Man... cooool as ice! They are like a computer that is
mostly monitor... Godly greetings and as always...
.!,
Light... Love... and Laughter... *!* Gerardus {-^o}
\~/
Love at first byte! `
! All Realities are Virtual Realities !
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Date: Tue, 21 Feb 1995 13:56:54 -0700
From: gerardus
Subject: Re: The Positive UFO friends?
To: "Light Workers List"
Hi Allexzander...
>I believe that before you will see a landing the people of Earth must
>first decide if that is really in their best interest. This type of
>thing is clearly in violation of the Non-Interference Objective put
>in place by the Galactic Council, of which the Plieadians are a
>*member*.
>I think the reason we have not seen a landing is that the critical
>point has not been reached yet, not enough members of this planet
>have made the decision that is what they want.
Gerardus here:
You certainly have a valuable point here. Another point is (mine)
that the masses on Earth truly do not have much of a clue of what's
going on. And on top of that, even the people on this list do not
really know what's going to happen exactly.
IOW: we lack the "Cosmic Info" to make an intelligent choice and go
for it. In a sense we are like the animals in a zoo that are just
about to be moved to another location or possibly set free. These
animals have not much of an input either. Mankind is just about in
the same boat or state of ignorance. I feel that this is due to the
fact that the majority of us are Baby-Souls and have no other choice
but to put our trust into the Almighty, so to speak.
I feel that this is what is happening and all who say that we create
our own reality, can only say this when they realize that the big
decisions are made by their Inner Light. (The Conscious Self for many
of us is a bit of a dud).
The Inner Light or Godself knows that we are being taken care of by
either older brothers or benefactors and all the lower self needs to
have is Faith!
Now!
Just in case anybody is interested in what my decision is; here it is:
I am 100% in favor of placing Planet Earth and its people in the long
awaited New and Golden Age. Whatever this will be I do not know
exactly, but to me it looks a lot better than what I can see develop
on this Earth in the future. Things are getting progressively worse
year by year for the average Human Soul. The old world is dying
rapidly and we definitely do not have a cure.
I feel that we have had enough of this State of Creativity! And if I
was an older Brother on a more advanced Star System and I would be
knowing what's going on on Earth, I would be out there like a shot and
help these poor buggers. So, maybe that's why I am here in the first
place, I do not really know or care. I do my best and God will do the
rest!
I trust the Universe or Life itself. It's infinite in Power and
Duration. To take care of a little planet like Earth is but like an
afternoon of picking flowers!
I'm counting on the 5th Dimension - All the Way!
I hope I get some comments on this. We need to reassure ourselves and
let them know we're waiting for them!
I say: Welcome to our Brothers and Sisters from Space... we are ready!
Come and guide us toward the Fifth.
,-, .-.
{o^o} ! My wife and I are ready ! {0^0}
\~/ \~/
` ? How about you ? `
Oh my... Come and get me...
*!* Gerardus *!*
Date: Tue, 21 Feb 1995 15:04:16 -0700
from: gerardus@indirect.com (Unverified)
To: rshapiro@interaccess.com (Richard L. Shapiro)
Subject: Re: The Positive UFO friends?
> Gerardus === you seem to be everywhere .... besides Internet is
> really starting to bring out some incredible information ... if
>something is going on ... I hear it (or I mean read it) here.
Yeah, sure Joshua, you let yourself in for this one: Gerardus == you
seem to be everywhere.
Naturally I AM and so are You!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
----------
>Did you hear about the man in England who is selling real film of
>Roswell or copies of real film to Fox, for their show Encounters (do
>you get this in Canada?) Another friend said that around the time
>they release it, the US Govt and others will admit Rosewell did
>happen.
No did not hear about this one! The governments need to "let go" real
soon I feel, otherwise NO credibility will be left AT ALL. It's
little already! They also will have to come out that they have some
UFO vehicles. We'll see what happens. All I can say is that we are
living in a very exciting time. Get that book soon!
Greetings and as always...
.!,
Light... Love... and Laughter... *!* Gerardus {-^o}
\~/
Love at first byte! `
! All Realities are Virtual Realities !
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Date: Tue, 21 Feb 95 17:24 MST
To: "Richard L. Shapiro"
From: reinart@infinityplus.com (Marcus Reinart)
Subject: Re: The Positive UFO friends?
Joshua,
>Marcus, are you implying all ETS are interferring that are having
>contact with Earth?
I don't think that I am implying it, I am saying, yes, by definition
any contact *whatsoever* is considered to by interference. The
Council's law is very clear on this. Now, we can argue whether or not
requested interference is really interference. If I ask you for help,
are you not interfering with what I might have accomplished on my own?
I say yes. Now, hmm, what if I am drowning in a lake, and you are
standing on the shore watching, and I ask you to save me, which would
you do, not interfere and let me drown, or interfere and save me
because I asked you to. Good question, any comments?
One thing to think about on that comment, if you interfere and save
me, okay, you have now prevented me from experiencing one of the
universe's available options, death by drowning. With the best of
intentions, you wanted to save me from dying in the lake, but at the
same time you have done a diservice by not allowing me to have the
experience I might have requested before birth. And now if I want to
have that experience, I am going to have to come back and do it all
over again.
>I agree with your point that permission must be given before a
>contact occurs but also that we, humanity, as Divine Children of God,
> have the ability to create the world we want without any outside
help. What I...............
Yes!
>feel is the key in working with other entities (spiritual, angels,
>devic, ascended masters, ETs, etc) is are they making suggestions or
>telling us what we should do. I have always found a relationship
>with whatever inner source provides information as suggestive knowing
>that this source respects me as an individual soul and that since I
>am here on the Earth plane, there maybe some suggestions that are not
>appropriate (i.e. since time and space do not exist on the inner
>levels). A balance must be reached and if one is sensitive, they can
>feel if these entities are coming from Love (which to me is mutual
>respect of all life, no desire or attachment to change but willing to
>offer suggestions if -- permission -- is given.
Very good points. I just wish to reenforce my idea, sometimes the
goal is more respected when it was reached with your very own sweat,
you figured it out on your own. What is the point of doing a
crossword puzzle if the answer to the whole thing lies on a sheet of
paper next to you?
>What I was saying, according to information about the treaty made
>with the Govt and the Greys (via Cooper), the Greys said that before
>they would exchange any technology, their presence must not be
>revealed by the Govt. I felt that they requested this, because they
>knew that inherent within humanity, in his deepest level, is a
>spiritual quality that would be activated if people had the knowledge
>of a force or preceived enemy (not a good work maybe a challenge to
>the way they live their physical lives) that could literally unite
>humanity... For example, if we all meditated for 5 seconds on the
>same thing....
Okay, very good point, I think I understand now.
>Then we must also consider the races that live under the earth and
>inside the inner surface, who are beings that are resident of Mother
>Earth. What is their role in all of the prophecised changes to come?
More pieces to the eternal puzzle! We are not in Kansas anymore...
Allexzander
Date: Tue, 21 Feb 1995 17:19:09 -0700
From: Tony Veca
Subject: Re: Galactic Council Membership: Coming Soon
To: "Light Workers List"
I've been doing some studing of the Mayan calander, and I do believe
our time is running short and we will be forced to as a race, to make
the decision as to wether we should join the rest of the "Galactic
Federation". Personally I believe that we should remain neutral.
History has proven, that the second you start irratating a human
beings, they fight back.
My other worry, is that we could find ourselves embroiled in a war we
didn't start. In a teaser for the Man-Kzin Wars, Larry Niven makes
the statement "The Kzin found the reason that man gave up war was
because they were so very good at it". Could any of you imagine what
would happen if we were to turn our one major talent, to make war,
loose on the rest of the galaxy.
==================
On another note. why is it that most of the Alien races seem to all
think in linere fashion, could this be the reason that they are
studing us, because of our creative abilities?
======================================================================
"And it harm none. Do what thou will"
--Wiccan Rede
darkstar@compumedia.com
Date: Tue, 21 Feb 95 17:24 MST
From: Marcus Reinart
Subject: Re: The Positive UFO friends?
To: "Light Workers List"
(*** Marcus/Alexander responding to Rene)
Rene,
>Non-intereference ... hm, a word with a lot interpretion space ...
>ie. the different galactic 'races' are here embodied as humans, to
>interfere, in the moment they breath air of Earth, they grew up and
>maybe don't remember where they come from, but just the way they
>think affects the reality they live now, on Earth.
I completely agree. I have been sent as an observer, however, as all
of you are very much aware, I have done a great deal of interference
just here on this list. This interference has existed since this
planet was first colonized, it has never been given the chance to
properly devolop on its own.
>We are here ... to learn and share ... if the 'assistance' turns into
>'controling', then we start an old story again ... so far without
>me... :)
This is my only hope, that Earth will be able to exist without the
control, from any source, no matter the "good intentions".
>The manifold influence on Earth is not a battle about the 'control'
>of it, it will be a summary of consciousness streams which are
>'invited' to be here and solve and balance many imbalances, many ...
>Earth is small, nevertheless affects the entire universe, what is
>happening here ... no accident that so many influences are going on
>... maybe it takes some time, when now more people get aware of their
>ET origins.
Earth is indeed a small planet, in a sortof distant portion of our
Galaxy,however it embodies a great deal of the duality that exists
everywhere. It is a slow process, but more and more people are
becoming aware of the galactic family, and will be much more accepting
when the time comes.
>May we turn the key together, instead everyone tries to break the
>door.
An excellent quote! ..... Allexzander
Date: Tue, 21 Feb 95 17:24 MST
From: Marcus Reinart
Subject: Re: The Positive UFO friends?
To: "Light Workers List"
(*** - Marcus/Allexzander answering Gerardus)
>Gerardus here:
>You certainly have a valuable point here. Another point is (mine)
>that the masses on Earth truly do not have much of a clue of what's
>going on. And on top of that, even the people on this list do not
>really know what's going to happen exactly.
Which leads me to belive, even those who know what is going on don't
know what is going on.
>IOW: we lack the "Cosmic Info" to make an intelligent choice and go
>for it. In a sense we are like the animals in a zoo that are just
>about to be moved to another location or possibly set free. These
>animals have not much of an input either. Mankind is just about in
>the same boat or state of ignorance. I feel that this is due to the
>fact that the majority of us are Baby-Souls and have no other choice
>but to put our trust into the Almighty, so to speak.
I think that you might be underestimating humanity here. I feel that
humans are very much capable of handling this situation all on their
own. It may seem like there are so many other advanced beings making
all of these decisions, but humanity still has a voice, and in
actuality, ultimate veto power if they choose to use it.
>I feel that this is what is happening and all who say that we create
>our own reality, can only say this when they realize that the big
>decisions are made by their Inner Light. (The Conscious Self for many
>of us is a bit of a dud). The Inner Light or Godself knows that we
>are being taken care of by either older brothers or benefactors and
>all the lower self needs to have is Faith!
The lower self has a voice, and speaks for the soul, it too, can let
its feelings be heard.
>I am 100% in favor of placing Planet Earth and its people in the long
>awaited New and Golden Age. Whatever this will be I do not know
>exactly, but to me it looks a lot better than what I can see develop
>on this Earth in the future. Things are getting progressively worse
>year by year for the average Human Soul. The old world is dying
>rapidly and we definitely do not have a cure.
Just a few questions for you...what is in this new Golden Age? Where
does it come from? What are your expectations of what life will be
like? What role does the Galactic Family have in your view of the
Golden Age? What role does the human species have in its Golden Age?
I thank you for your comments and support, Gerardus, I hope I don't
seem offensive here. Just some questions I am interested in getting
from the front lines, so to speak ......... Allexzander
Date: Tue, 21 Feb 1995 17:21:24 -0800 (PST)
From: "Lori E. Tostado"
Subject: Re: The Positive UFO friends?
To: "Light Workers List"
(*** Lori answerings Tony's post)
On Tue, 21 Feb 1995, Tony Veca wrote:
> >Right. The Zeta are learning as much from us as we from them. And
> >the result will inevitably be some integration and now more need
> >for stressful abduction scenarios.
>
> Would you mind explain that, from the few abduction cases that I
> have had the fortune to work on, the Grays (or Zet Rectilies)
> seem to have a total dis-reguard for human life. And until you have
> seen the fear, the anxiety, and depression, that sets in from these
> experiences. I wouldn't call the Grey friends, I'l call them a
> cosmic menence, just aching to be wiped out.
>
Well, I'll leave the most of this to our friend Rene, who has lots of
references for the Zeta Reticulans, but, I do have some books you
might want to look up if you want first-hand accounts and an objective
viewpoint from the psychologists who wrote them.....One is called
"Close Extraterrestrial Encounters" by Dr. Richard Boylan, whose
practice is here in my hometown of Sacramento. I have met him and
seen his lectures at ET/UFO expo's here in town, and he is very
reputable. The second one is "The Watchers" by Ray Fowler. It focuses
on one individual mainly and her hypnotic regressions to remember her
abduction experiences. (which are very very interesting, by the way) I
have heard many different points of view about the Zetas, and I can
only conclude that they are not all negative or positive, but are here
learning from us as well as doing some teaching. In many ways they
seem to mirror our fears, and at the same time, offer a gateway to
some for releasing or overcoming their fears. Whitley Streiber also
has two famous books, "Communion" and "Transformation" about his
personal experiences with these beings. Rene has told me about
"Visitors from Within" and "Preparing for Contact" by Lyssa Royal and
Keith Priest, which I have not read yet, but he says they give a more
positive message than the channelled tape I transcribed of Michael who
said that the Zetas want to take over the Earth, basically. (not the
whole story). So, you have a wide variety of material to choose from
and see for yourself what you think is "the real story"....It's very
interesting, but you may have to conclude as I have that there is no
one answer.... Lori
Date: Wed, 22 Feb 1995 10:22:28 +0100
From: Rene Mueller
Subject: Re: The Positive UFO friends?
To: "Light Workers List"
(*** Rene continuing to answer Marcus/Allexzander post)
>>Non-intereference ... hm, a word with a lot interpretion space ...
>>ie. the different galactic 'races' are here embodied as humans,
>>to interfere, in the moment they breath air of Earth, they grew
>>up and maybe don't remember where they come from, but just the
>>way they think affects the reality they live now, on Earth. (Rene)
>
>I completely agree. I have been sent as an observer, however, as
>all of you are very much aware, I have done a great deal of
>interference just here on this list. This interference has
>existed since this planet was first colonized, it has never
>been given the chance to properly devolop on its own. (Allexzander)
Hm, I see your point ... "on its own" you say ... as of Earth as
being, I don't doubt she went her way, and assisted many entities to
live within her aura, astral-planes and physical as well.
I would like to listen more on the way you think about
"it has never been given the chance to properly devolop on its own"
...
,
Rene
Date: Wed, 22 Feb 1995 10:46:04 +0100
From: Rene Mueller
Subject: Re: The Positive UFO friends?
To: "Light Workers List"
(*** - Rene answer's Lori post of Tony)
On Tue, 21 Feb 1995, Tony Veca wrote:
> >Right. The Zeta are learning as much from us as we from them. And
> >the result will inevitably be some integration and now more need
> >for stressful abduction scenarios. (Tony)
>
> Would you mind explain that, from the few abduction cases that I
> have had the fortune to work on, the Grays (or Zet Rectilies)
> seem to have a total dis-reguard for human life. And until you
> have seen the fear, the anxiety, and depression, that sets in from
> these experiences. I wouldn't call the Grey friends, I'l call them
> a cosmic menence, just aching to be wiped out. (Lori)
Lori:
>Well, I'll leave the most of this to our friend Rene, who has lots
>of references for the Zeta Reticulans ...
I wasn't sure whether I may reply this above statement from Tony ...
since I came across very often and finaly said always the same ...
"Don't put all entities who have Zeta-bodies into one pot ..."
"Do we the same of with humans, saying they are all the same?"
There are light-groups on Earth, there are people who torture others
in jails ... the duality is wide-range ... may we look in the same
careful view to the Zetas? I shared my view already, and it's just
what I tried to say, don't take my experiences as general, make your
own ... if you feel so.
Maybe to short reply on depression:
The depression of people is a deep process of releasing concepts,
mental and emotional. Hold on for a moment, and remember there is an
entire universum we all are contected, everytime, also in the moment
you read this lines ... and we deny sooooo much of our
interconnectivity with ALL-THAT-IS,therefore we have to be very
carefully, if we beat the ones who assist us to take away the veil ...
Flemmings early post about his own abduction-case was really
interesting ...
> I wouldn't call the Grey friends, I'l call them a cosmic menence,
> just aching to be wiped out.
Those who think it's an accident they interact with us,
may fight against them ... or dany them.
Those who trust in the way your Self has decided to go, may
look behind the veil, and at least understand their intentions.
Lori:
>In many ways they seem to mirror our fears, and at the same
>time, offer a gateway to some for releasing or overcoming their
>fears.
Well said Lori!
,
Rene
Date: Wed, 22 Feb 1995 10:03:24 +0100
From: Rene Mueller
Subject: Re: Sirians, Pleiadians & Rigelians etc.
To: "Light Workers List"
(*** Rene making additional comments with Allexzander)
>Rene:
>>Collective is the main-point, we are acting individually, they as
>>collective. From our point of view (individual to individual) it
>>may be difficult to perceive their emotions or feelings, on my
>>personal experiences I share feelings with them ... since I'm very
>>young (when didn't heared/read about them), as well with other
>>beings ... and somehow, I learned, that it's my limited
>>understanding and perceptions, which sometimes makes me believe
>>others are limited - but finally they reflected my ignorance.
Allexander:
>I am not sure that I fully understand what you are saying here.
>Have you had an emotional experience with a Zeta? I have never
>heard of this before, intellectual exchange yes, but emotional no.
>Was this with a hybird?
Let me say it this way, some entities loose their knowledge of the
Self, when they enter into a form, a body. Ie. entities identify
themselves as human, or more attached, as Americans, Germans, Mexican
or whatever ... hm, and then they think they are this, and just that,
and use to have a certain behaviour. If an entity realize it's own
Self, the entity get self-aware, and is no longer an American or
whatever, but a spiritual-aware being. The human body has some
'features', as well the Zeta body, or other races, each of these
bodies force and deny sometimes certain expressions of the Self, if
you get aware of your inner identity (which has nothing todo with
the body you use), you are neither human, nor Zeta, nor Sirian, but a
spiritual being, but you just use a body to remain in a reality, but
you have expanded the 'limits' of the body you use. (Sorry for the
longer answer).
There are entities, which use an Zeta-bodies, but went over the limits
of their bodies, by realizing themselves spiritualy.
When I was in trouble of myself about the mainly 'negative' press
about Zetas,I was doubting of a lot of experiences I had when I was
younger, I was not abducted, but I was with them ... I had contact
telepathically, and I knew in me how they look like, also what people
describe as 'hybrids' or 'Metahumans'. I forgot a lot ... denied other
realms, it tooks some time I was again able to look into myself ...
and their I found the friends again, some of them were in Zeta bodies,
some in more close humanoid forms as myself now. Yes, I had emotional
and intellectual contact, but I didn't got messages as channelings
hundred of pages, it was not much words, it was a message of love ...
in many forms, and often repeated. It was about the way of thinking
about the Self, and the self-limited concepts, primarly lot about
myself :), when I was in different bodies and used to express myself
...
Rene:
>>The influences are here, because it's something we have to put
>>together ... TOGETHER, not each one should think about another, he
>>or she is just an 'ABC'-ian, coming from a planet and links a
>>certain behaviour to it ... we are spiritual beings ... and used to
>>wear cloths by embody ourselves on certain stars, and finally are
>>sending our consciousness into human-bodies to expand the
>>experience in duality.
Allexzander:
>
>Quite an idealist aren't you? .
:) :) Yes indeed, some call me that!
Allexzander:
>I agree, this is the ultimate goal to reach, and is what would place
>us in a higher frequency. But let's take one step at a time, we
>cannot go from a complete dualalitic system to complete harmonic
>convergence in such a small time frame. First let's try to get to
>acceptance of differences before we try to dissolve them.
Yes, agreed! The acceptance starts within us ...
>Allexzander: A planet of beings that cannot even live in the
>slightest harmony with themselves will surely not fare any better
>trying to get along with species other than itself! There are still
>over 80 civil wars taking place right this minute.
Yes, "Release" doesn't mean all the time, a peaceful ceremony ...
Some lightworkers deny a lot of "ways of releasing" ... ie. some
people release and realize in ways, which are 'painfully' in 3rd
dimensional view. Pain is a way to realize deep, really deep ... also
a very fast way to release physical and astral energies.
>Allexzander: Earth is not even living in acceptance, much less
>harmony.
Maybe ... the hormony is there, we as humans just don't participate
with it ... and like to be with it, and have to do something for it,
to participate again. The price seems high sometimes, floods and
earthquakes, or more individually loosing job, and moving into another
state or whatever ...
>Allexzander: There is a great deal more work than needs to be
>completed before we can work on duality.
I don't understand this fully ... duality, as I felt, is in me and
projected into the reality I participate, because only there I'm able
to have this illusion ... like you said here:
Allexzander:
>Spirit may speak of riding itself of duality, by design a
>biologically based host cannot. Bio-Hosts incapsulate duality, that
>is so that we can experience what this is like. Spirit doesn't
>understand duality, that is why we incarnate. Humans have certain
>traits that make them human, Pleiadians have certain traits that
>make them Pleiadian. Spirit does not exhibit these traits, so they
>must be created by the biological host itself. Duality will cease
>when spirit decides it is no longer necessary, for the moment at
>least, it is necessary.
Very well said ...
,
Rene
Date: Wed, 22 Feb 1995 01:51:07 -0800 (PST)
From: Boyd Martin
Subject: Re: The Positive UFO friends?
To: "Light Workers List"
(*** Boyd making Comments on Gerardus Posts)
> You certainly have a valuable point here. Another point is (mine)
> that the masses on Earth truly do not have much of a clue of what's
> going on. And on top of that, even the people on this list do not
> really know what's going to happen exactly.
>
> IOW: we lack the "Cosmic Info" to make an intelligent choice and go
> for it. In a sense we are like the animals in a zoo that are just
> about to be moved to another location or possibly set free. These
> animals have not much of an input either. Mankind is just about in
> the same boat or state of ignorance. I feel that this is due to the
> fact that the majority of us are Baby-Souls and have no other choice
> but to put our trust into the Almighty, so to speak. I feel that
> this is what is happening and all who say that we create our own
> reality, can only say this when they realize that the big decisions
> are made by their Inner Light. (The Conscious Self for many of us is
> a bit of a dud).
>
> The Inner Light or Godself knows that we are being taken care of by
> either older brothers or benefactors and all the lower self needs to
> have is Faith!
But I think we really DO know what's going on from the perspective
that every one of us agreed to participate in the dimensional shift
when we incarnated. On a soul level we KNOW. Now, taking that as a
given, any uncertainties, fears, insecurities, etc. are all implant
reactions. Ascension is IN PROCESS and we are ALL creating it.
> I am 100% in favor of placing Planet Earth and its people in the
> long awaited New and Golden Age. Whatever this will be I do not
> know exactly, but to me it looks a lot better than what I can see
> develop on this Earth in the future. Things are getting
> progressively worse year by year for the average Human Soul. The
> old world is dying rapidly and we definitely do not have a cure.
>
> I feel that we have had enough of this State of Creativity! And if
> I was an older Brother on a more advanced Star System and I would be
> knowing what's going on on Earth, I would be out there like a shot
> and help these poor buggers. So, maybe that's why I am here in the
> first place, I do not really know or care. I do my best and God will
> do the rest!
>
> I trust the Universe or Life itself. It's infinite in Power and
> Duration. To take care of a little planet like Earth is but like an
> afternoon of picking flowers!
>
> I'm counting on the 5th Dimension - All the Way!
>
> I hope I get some comments on this. We need to reassure ourselves
> and let them know we're waiting for them!
Right on. Of course, just because we agreed to come in at this time to
participate in the ascension doesn't mean some of us may DECIDE not to
ascend, and I think that is the head space of young souls who crave
dense experience because of the extreme trip it puts them on. The more
extreme the trip, the more that is learned and the more the soul is
defined to itself. There will always be a place like the 3rd dimension
somewhere. But personally, I'm finishing up my version of it, fer
sure, and will be joining you in the 5th!
boydroid
Date: Wed, 22 Feb 1995 02:06:15 -0800 (PST)
From: Boyd Martin
Subject: Re: The Positive UFO friends?
To: "Light Workers List"
(*** Boyd commenting on part of a post by Rene)
> Would you mind explain that, from the few abduction cases that I
> have had the fortune to work on, the Grays (or Zet Rectilies)
> seem to have a total dis-reguard for human life. And until you have
> seen the fear, the anxiety, and depression, that sets in from these
> experiences. I wouldn't call the Grey friends, I'l call them a
> cosmic menence, just aching to be wiped out.
On the other hand...
Babies being born (as I recall myself) were also filled with fear,
anxiety,actually terror at the shock of being taken forcefully out of
their comfortable frame of reference in the womb. Yes, pain and
suffering are undesireable for those who are striving for comfort,
but, I keep thinking of Casteneda with Don Juan who would be peeing in
his pants with fear at the interdimensional experiences Don Juan would
put him through. Ultimately, Carlos would accept his universality, and
so do abductees. The other point is that abductees agreed to be
abducted on a soul level and accepted the hypnotic implants to allow
it in order to force soul growth. Other people get in car wrecks,
fight in wars, have life-threatening diseases, party all night, drink
too much, breath the air, get up in the morning, have kids, play music
-- it's all for learning. :')
boydroid
Date: Wed, 22 Feb 1995 02:21:02 -0800 (PST)
From: Boyd Martin
Subject: Re: The Positive UFO friends?
To: "Light Workers List"
(*** - Boyd commenting on Marcus & Rene's discussion)
Allexzander:
> Rene,
>
> >Non-intereference ... hm, a word with a lot interpretion space ...
> >ie. the different galactic 'races' are here embodied as humans,
> >to interfere, in the moment they breath air of Earth, they grew
> >up and maybe don't remember where they come from, but just the
> >way they think affects the reality they live now, on Earth.
>
> I completely agree. I have been sent as an observer, however, as
> all of you are very much aware, I have done a great deal of
> interference just here on this list. This interference has existed
> since this planet was first colonized, it has never been given the
> chance to properly develop on its own.
Just like raising a child in a family, the child is far from immune
from his parents influence, human society, whether it accepts it or
not, IS part of the galactic family and has felt that presence
"interfering" since humans were seeded. Non-interference is really a
military term popularized by the Star Trek Federation to preclude non-
efficient interfacing with primitive technological societies in order
to avoid inconvenient military retaliation to perceived threats from
things not understood. To me, it's a very precise term in a very
precise context. Spiritually, however, there is no escape
"interference" from god.
Rene:
> >We are here ... to learn and share ... if the 'assistance' turns
> >into 'controling', then we start an old story again ... so far
> >without me ...
I would add 'military controlling'...
Allexzander:
> This is my only hope, that Earth will be able to exist without the
> control, from any source, no matter the "good intentions".
>
Rene:
> >The manifold influence on Earth is not a battle about the 'control'
> >of it, it will be a summary of consciousness streams which are
> >'invited' to be here and solve and balance many imbalances, many
> >... Earth is small, nevertheless affects the entire universe, what
> >is happening here ... no accident that so many influences are going
> >on ... maybe it takes some time, when now more people get aware of
> >their ET origins.
Allexzander:
> Earth is indeed a small planet, in a sortof distant portion of our
> Galaxy, however it embodies a great deal of the duality that exists
> everywhere. It is a slow process, but more and more people are
> becoming aware of the galactic family, and will be much more
> accepting when the time comes.
>
> >May we turn the key together, instead everyone tries to break the
> >door.
>
> An excellent quote!
>
> Allexzander
I heartily agree! ........ boydroid
Date: Wed, 22 Feb 1995 02:34:58 -0800 (PST)
From: Boyd Martin
Subject: Re: The Positive UFO friends?
To: "Light Workers List"
(*** - Boyd commenting on Lori & Renes message)
> > I wouldn't call the Grey friends, I'l call them a cosmic menence,
> > just aching to be wiped out.
>
> Those who think it's an accident they interact with us,
> may fight against them ... or dany them.
>
> Those who trust in the way your Self has decided to go, may
> look behind the veil, and at least understand their intentions.
>
> Lori:
> >In many ways they seem to mirror our fears, and at the same
> >time, offer a gateway to some for releasing or overcoming their
> >fears.
>
> Well said Lori!
> ,
> Rene
I would add that perhaps fear is the only emotion left for the Zetas
to feed off of, and humans have plenty of it.
boydroid
Date: Wed, 22 Feb 1995 07:12:22 -0600 (CST)
From: "Richard L. Shapiro"
Subject: Re: The Positive UFO friends?
To: "Light Workers List"
Who started this message about the Positive UFO Friends? It seems to
be going on and on (good conversation though) for ever.
Whoever that person is, I want his/her name. Ooops ... wait a minute
here, let me think now, let me think .... could his name start with a
J, could it be that person, who keeps writing all these messages?
Ok, I admit it ... I did it ... I could not have imagined that the
sharing of this subject would take such steam ... but I guess with
things coming up around the UFO issues, we are all trying to sort out
what is really happening.
In any case, I must be in one of my crazy moods this morning ... so I
thought I would throw in a little lite fun .....
Thanks everyone in this list for sharing your thoughts on this matter.
May the Force Be with Us and tuck us in nicely when we go to sleep at
night
Joshua
Date: Wed, 22 Feb 1995 07:04:03 -0600 (CST)
From: "Richard L. Shapiro"
Subject: Re: The Positive UFO friends?
To: "Light Workers List"
To Allexander about the Golden Age
>
> Just a few questions for you...what is in this new Golden Age?
> Where does it come from? What are your expectations of what life
> will be like? What role does the Galactic Family have in your view
> of the Golden Age? What role does the human species have in its
> Golden Age?
>
The Golden Age is when the Earth shifts in its vibration from 3rd
Dimensional Consciousness to 5th. I feel this will take place by
2013. In this time, all life will be united with respect, in that
there will be more of a communion between the Mother Earth, the
elementals, the rocks and earth, plants, animals, humans and visitors.
Humanity will be back where it was before (perhaps during times of
Atlantis) where peace and prosperity, joy and harmony will be
everywhere. The family will become the brotherhood of man, each adult
almost like a parent to each child.
Now, the question is, based on the view of the world we have today is
this possible. To become from somewhat limited beings primarily
viewing reality from our five physical senses to people who will use
their inner awarenesses as easy as we use our physical senses. If the
prophecies are correct, whatever Earth changes (if any, some will
argue we won't see, but I still think the Earth will do a few ... just
listen within to the still small voice of where to be, not also
promoting these ideas to set in force that this must be, we control
our density but Mother Earth will move into this higher octave in some
form) will take place will assist the Mother Earth to move into the
higher frequency, the cleansing as the Native American Indians speak.
Usually when a planet is about to make such a shift, the people are
already close to this new vibration. Our world right now has so many
different levels of reality and vibration that this process will
probably be fast and quick.
Anyhow, this is what I feel is happening and each of us is involved in
this process. If we stay attuned to the inner guidance, the ride will
be challenging and uplifting. We may be called to assist others who
are open enough to see what this transformation is all about. I still
think things like David Hudson talks about via Gold Powder, is a sign
that a move into a better alignment with spirit using our inner gifts
is quite close.
Again, just your friendly networker, sharing a few thoughts as I
receive inspiration to do so. Hope all these e-mails help. Typical
for people who write books I guess ....
Joshua alias Illinois Shapiro
(did I tell you the story about ..... :-)
Date: Wed, 22 Feb 1995 15:02:51 +0000 (GMT)
From: "Mr. Obdulio Andrade-Salas"
Subject: Re: The Positive UFO friends?
To: "Light Workers List"
On Wed, 22 Feb 1995, Richard L. Shapiro wrote:
> To Allexander about the Golden Age
> >
> > Just a few questions for you...what is in this new Golden Age?
> > Where does it come from? What are your expectations of what life
> >will be like? What role does the Galactic Family have in your view
> >of the Golden Age? What role does the human species have in its
> >Golden Age?
> >
> Joshua's response...
> The Golden Age is when the Earth shifts in its vibration from 3rd
> Dimensional Consciousness to 5th. I feel this will take place by
> 2013.
[snip]
Hello, here Obdulio
I was browsing through some notes I have about the Aztec calendar and
the so called "Fifth Sun Era" of the Aztecs (we are supposed to be in
the 4th Sun now). Would this "fifth Sun" be the 5th Dimensional
Consciousness? Moreover, in the Aztec and Maya tradition, there are
Cosmological Cicles called the 13 Hells and the 13 Heavens, and it is
supposed that we are at the end of the "13 Hell", and therefore about
to finish the cicle of Hells, and enter the cicle of Heavens.
According to the Aztec & Mayan calendars this would take place in the
year 2011... the time when the tradition says Quetzalcoatl (which
means The Feathered Serpent, and also The White Man (Light Man?) will
come back for good. (I mentioned something about this in a previous
post RE:Mexico)
> In this time, all life will be united with respect, in that there
> will be more of a communion between the Mother Earth, the
> elementals, the rocks and earth, plants, animals, humans and
> visitors. Humanity will be back where it was before (perhaps during
> times of Atlantis) where peace and prosperity, joy and harmony will
> be everywhere. The family will become the brotherhood of man, each
> adult almost like a parent to each child.
That's exactly the description of the life during the 13 Heavens
cicle! :)
Obdulio
Date: Wed, 22 Feb 1995 10:28:44 -0700
From: gerardus
Subject: Re: The Positive UFO friends?
To: "Light Workers List"
Allexzander...
Gerardus here:
In the following I'm trying to answer some of your questions.
G:
>>You certainly have a valuable point here. Another point is (mine)
>>that the masses on Earth truly do not have much of a clue of what's
>>going on. And on top of that, even the people on this list do not
>>really know what's going to happen exactly.
A:
>Which leads me to believe, even those who know what is going on don't
>know what is going on.
G:
Yes, that's about what I suggested. There is no absolute certainty
anywhere except that there is a certain amount of uncertainty. This
does not negate that we cannot have projections about the future.
More later about this...
----------------------------------------------------
G:
>>IOW: we lack the "Cosmic Info" to make an intelligent choice and go
>>for it. In a sense we are like the animals in a zoo that are just
>>about to be moved to another location or possibly set free. These
>>animals have not much of an input either. Mankind is just about in
>>the same boat or state of ignorance. I feel that this is due to the
>>fact that the majority of us are Baby-Souls and have no other choice
>>but to put our trust into the Almighty, so to speak.
A:
>I think that you might be underestimating humanity here. I feel that
>humans are very much capable of handling this situation all on their
>own. It may seem like there are so many other advanced beings making
>all of these decisions, but humanity still has a voice, and in
>actuality, ultimate veto power if they choose to use it.
G:
Yes, it is possible that I underestimate humanity. It's partly based
on living among them for 67 years in this body. But then, humanity in
general is/are ALL kinds of Beings. Who truly knows where we have
lived and where we have been and what we are capable of. Many of us
are great Souls, but at this moment we are playing the role of a
somewhat backwards Awareness. Humanity at the moment lives behind a
veil (or wall) of separation from his full Awareness. I feel that
this is not just because some Race tampered with Humanity.
---> There are no accidents in the Universe. <---
We are what we are on purpose. We live to experience any and all
states or levels of awareness. And although Humanity might have veto
power, this does not mean necessarily that humanity knows what or who
to veto!
G:
If all the decisions are made by what you call advanced Beings, this
is so because they have come here to help. Some human beings might be
playing the role of the advanced or elite of Humanity and thus makes
decisions for many. They know the score of living in purposefully
forgetfulness. How else can the Source experience itself, but in the
forgetfulness of knowing itself?
----------------------------------------------
G:
>>I feel that this is what is happening and all who say that we create
>>our own reality, can only say this when they realize that the big
>>decisions are made by their Inner Light. (The Conscious Self for
>>many of us is a bit of a dud). The Inner Light or Godself knows that
>>we are being taken care of by either older brothers or benefactors
>>and all the lower self needs to have is Faith!
A:
>The lower self has a voice, and speaks for the soul, it too, can let
>its feelings be heard.
G:
Many lower selves deny their feelings. They find feelings inferior.
They like to reason a lot. In my experience; the lower self only
speaks for the lower self. Until the higher self is able to break
through, the lower self is a limited awareness and it more or less
circles in its own rational mind. It knows that it thinks and from it,
it gets the idea that it thinks that it knows! I have met many lower
selves who deny the existence of Spirit. How can these selves speak
for Soul? I do not blame them, I just notice...
--------------------------------------------------
G:
>>I am 100% in favor of placing Planet Earth and its people in the
>>long awaited New and Golden Age. Whatever this will be I do not
>>know exactly, but to me it looks a lot better than what I can see
>>develop on this Earth in the future. Things are getting
>>progressively worse year by year for the average Human Soul. The
>>old world is dying rapidly and we definitely do not have a cure.
A:
>Just a few questions for you...what is in this new Golden Age? Where
>does it come from? What are your expectations of what life will be
>like? What role does the Galactic Family have in your view of the
>Golden Age? What role does the human species have in its Golden Age?
G:
What is in this Golden Age?
Answer: I already said that I didn't know exactly. And also, well, if
I knew the complete answer, I would not want to live in it anymore.
Why do it twice? The projection of MY future is the experience of a
brand new ME! More awakened and more understanding of what I truly am.
A entirely new way of life, physically yes, but also etherial and more
spiritually. More psychic, more knowing. Compared to the way I have
lived in the last 25000 years - my future will be an enlightened
holiday! Joy. And the friendship of many like me. Cooperation,
sharing and understanding of other races on other planets and possibly
traveling there. For I will reach higher levels of awareness and
greater Human possibilities. I live - I grow - I advance. Piece of
Cake!
G:
Where does it come from? Where does anything come from? All things
are a projection of Mind. Yours and Mine and the Powerful Ones! All
Life or experiences are the result of Mind. We live - we create. All
of us are the Image of the Creator. We cannot help but create. It's
our nature!
G:
What are my expectations of what life will be like? I already
answered some of that above. Life will be a Cosmic Gig! Fun! More
so than ever, for many if not all will remember how we lived before.
We will be celebrating the very Light within us! We are the Light of
Creation in the form of Man - a more enlightened Man at that.
G:
What role does the Galactic Family have in your view of the Golden
Age?
Galactic Family means Kinship. Gatherings of Jubilant Souls, working
and sharing, celebrating Life. There is nothing else to do but be
Joyful! If I can be Joyful on Earth, I can be Joyful any place. I
expect Miracles for I am One! The rumors of wars that are fought are
fought by the special aggressive kinds, there are many different
groups. Same as here on Earth. Life is the Game of God being you and
me and Everybody...
--------------------------------
A:
>I thank you for your comments and support, Gerardus, I hope I don't
>seem offensive here. Just some questions I am interested in getting
>from the front lines, so to speak.
>Allexzander
G:
No offensiveness was noticed. Only Love can enter...
Greetings...
At one time I dreamt that I was God - but I gave up on it
I woke up as Gerardus and I knew that I was kidding myself!
Light... Love... and Laughter! *!* Gerardus
Date: Wed, 22 Feb 1995 11:56:18 -0600
From: "Richard L. Shapiro"
Subject: Re: The Positive UFO friends?
To: "Light Workers List"
(*** Joshua responding to Obdulio Post)
>Hello, here Obdulio
>
>I was browsing through some notes I have about the Aztec calendar and
>the so called "Fifth Sun Era" of the Aztecs (we are supposed to be in
>the 4th Sun now). Would this "fifth Sun" be the 5th Dimensional
>Consciousness? Moreover, in the Aztec and Maya tradition, there are
>Cosmological Cicles called the 13 Hells and the 13 Heavens, and it is
>supposed that we are at the end of the "13 Hell", and therefore about
>to finish the cicle of Hells, and enter the cicle of Heavens.
>According to the Aztec & Mayan calendars this would take place in the
>year 2011... the time when the tradition says Quetzalcoatl (which
>means The Feathered Serpent, and also The White Man (Light Man?) will
>come back for good. (I mentioned something about this in a previous
>post RE:Mexico)
>
Obudlio === I would be interested in more information about the Aztec
calendar, in the last few days I have seen reference to the years
2011-2013 within the Aztec, Mayan and Inca societies. 13 Hells and
Heavens = 26, which is a mystic number to the Mayan (26, 52) and also
26 = YHVH (the name of God in Hebrew). 26 years after 1987, when the
Mayan Calendar ended, or the Harmonic Convergence is 2013.
Quetzalcoatl was the Christed person (according to L.Taylor Hansen in
the book, "He Walked the Americas", who gave the Indians the Christ
Teachings and selected 12 apostles to continue this teaching after he
left. BTW, there have been discoveries of ancient Hebrew in some of
the Indian Mounds here in the US (or so I read). I am sure all of
this is linked to the Golden Age.
>> In this time, all life will be united with respect, in that there
>> will be more of a communion between the Mother Earth, the
>>elementals, the rocks and earth, plants, animals, humans and
>>visitors. Humanity will be back where it was before (perhaps during
>>times of Atlantis) where peace and prosperity, joy and harmony will
>>be everywhere. The family will become the brotherhood of man, each
>>adult almost like a parent to each child.
>
>That's exactly the description of the life during the 13 Heavens
>cicle! :)
>
Well, when I was describing this, I was kind of feeling the future and
seeing what I saw (is interesting to see that the Aztec/Mayans also
see this future)
Thanks Obdulio ....
Another possibility while I am at it is if there exists parrallel
dimensions of the Earth, it is possible other timelines might have a
different potential future. Sometimes I find people who say they were
in Atlantis and talk about the same time period but remember it
differently. Boy, as this type of information comes out can it get
confusing (but is interesting!!)
Joshua
Date: Thu, 23 Feb 1995 00:32:22 -0600 (CST)
From: "Richard Andersen"
Subject: Re: The Positive UFO friends?
To: "Light Workers List"
In message Wed, 22 Feb 1995 11:56:18 -0600,
"Richard L. Shapiro" writes:
>
> Another possibility while I am at it is if there exists parrallel
> dimensions of the Earth, it is possible other timelines might have a
> different potential future. Sometimes I find people who say they
> were in Atlantis and talk about the same time period but remember it
> differently. Boy, as this type of information comes out can it get
> confusing (but is interesting!!)
> .... Joshua
>
Rich here: Here is a piece about parallel universes, from Federation
Flash 28. (From Star Builders)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
UNCONDITIONAL ASCENSION
Parallel Universes
There are a vast number of parallel universes, and many include
parallel Earths. From the perspective of this particular Earth, the
other Earths are simply "probabilities." However, if we were to shift
our consciousness into a body in another probable Earth, it would no
longer be a "probability" - it would become the current "real" one.
Parallel Earths are almost exact duplicates of one another in terms
of form; it is the distinctive feeling tone and the unique
characteristics of their astral planes that clearly distinguishes
them. In terms of evolution, some probabilities are more primitive in
certain areas while excelling in others.
Of these probable Earths, Ascension - the mutation of a planet into
its Light body - is the destiny of a certain number. As we do not
believe that spirit would send us to support gloom-and-doom, non-
Ascension scenarios, the fact that we are here in this probability
suggests that the fate of this Earth is to ascend.
Date: Wed, 22 Feb 1995 17:13:43 -0500 (EST)
From: Jal Kae
Subject: Re: The Positive UFO friends?
To: "Light Workers List"
> >>Non-intereference ... hm, a word with a lot interpretion space ...
Although my interest does not lie in the area of "alien" species,
I think that the issue of non-interference is a moot point: We/they
are here. Like you say, there's "a lot of interpretation space..."
I do not see our presense as interference, but rather as
participation in the evolutionary process. (I am speaking for myself
as an other-dimensional walk-in.) Interference implies trying to
prevent something for happening, or to change something. Now, as far
as the UFO races go, what they are doing is there business. Claiming
that the Earth is exclusively ours is just a glorified form of
nationalism. And all isms have fear built into them.
The positive e.t. friends do not want to change anyone; that is
to act from a perspective of delusion. We are here to relate to all
beings on a spirit to spirit, master to master, basis.
When I share my perspectives with the world via the net,
sometimes I get "flamed." This is because the beings that I am
addressing or writing to are masters at various stages of awakening. I
find that not all beings identify themselves as awakening masters.
These transmissions apparently "interfere" with other peoples lives
because they make them angry. Is this interference? It would be my
guess that these beings act from a very biased reality base, and that
there are *many* things that get them angry - anything and anyone who
does not agree with their (relative) picture of reality.
As far as "the bad guys" are concerned, if they are here at the
time of Ascension, they'll have the option to ascend with us. Then we
will live the experience of oneness and know that they're not really
bad guys, after all. It's a matter of letting go.
In Love and Oneness
KenDon
Starbuilders
Date: Thu, 23 Feb 1995 00:02:09 -0700
From: Tony Veca
Subject: Re: The Positive UFO friends?
To: "Light Workers List"
(*** - Tony commenting on Lori's & Rene's statements)
> Lori:
> >Well, I'll leave the most of this to our friend Rene, who has lots
> >of references for the Zeta Reticulans ...
>
>I wasn't sure whether I may reply this above statement from Tony ...
>since I came across very often and finaly said always the same ...
>
> "Don't put all entities who have Zeta-bodies into one pot ..."
> "Do we the same of with humans, saying they are all the same?"
I don't put all of the Greys in the same pot, but those that do
whatever they do without the consent of their subjects are violating a
very basic priciples of "Freedom" and "Respect", and seem to be in
the majority. The way that I was brought up was that if you wanted to
do something to someone you asked first and respect their decision if
they say no. This group that just abducts someone, and leave behind
an emotional wreck, I can say without reservation, destroy them just
as you would a rabid dog.
>Maybe to short reply on depression:
>
>The depression of people is a deep process of releasing concepts,
>mental and emotional. Hold on for a moment, and remember there is an
>entire universum we all are contected, everytime, also in the moment
>you read this lines ... and we deny sooooo much of our interconnec-
>-tivity with ALL-THAT-IS, therefore we have to be very carefully, if
>we beat the ones who assist us to take away the veil ...
I'm not just talking about the depression, I am also talking about the
anxiety, and lack of control over their lives. Let me try to put it
this way for you, how would you like to be abducteed who is having
unkown medical experiments done on you, you don't know whats going on,
doubting your sanity and destroying your spirit. Lives are being
shattered by uncaring, unemotional beings who don't care.
I've been helping these shattered souls through a group that helped me
through my own case of Post Traumatic Stress due to child abuse. Let
tell you all one thing, in most of these cases, the victims want
revenge.. We're able to help them through the depression and lead
some semblence of a normal
life.
======================================================================
"And it harm none. Do what thou will"
--Wiccan Rede
darkstar@compumedia.com
Date: Thu, 23 Feb 1995 00:01:33 -0700
From: Tony Veca
Subject: Re: Galactic Council Membership: Coming Soon
To: "Light Workers List"
(*** Tony sharing additional comments to this thread)
>1) Why are we forced to as a race to join any other race? What about
> cooperation, sharing, caring and/or understanding? (Understanding
> is Love)
Cooperation, sharing, caring and understanding are fine. From studing
our own history, the effects of a higher technological civilization
on a less technological civilization has always resulted in the less
technological society being destroyed.
>2) What do you mean by linear thinking?
> The energy of thought is of the second order in the first place
> (which is a non-linear energy) and the Races of People in higher
> dimensions do not really think much. I feel that they intuit and
> just know things to certain degrees.
What I ment by linear thinking is that there thinking seem work in
series mode, you know A B C D type stepps. From some of the reports
that I have read, it seems that some types of aliens, Zeta's and MIBs
in particular, seem to get confused when someone throws them a mental
curve-ball. To me this seems to be a serious flaw in their mental
process.
>3) I admit that man is very creative, but I feel that the creativity
> we have mastered so far is of a higher order than the physical. I
> see man as a learning Co-Creator and I feel that there is a lot
> more to learn by being subjected to universal Races greater in
> creativity than we are. Do you think that this can be done by
> staying neutral? Don't you think that we could learn a thing or
> two from other "Galactic Federation" Members"?
I have no doubts that we could learn something from them but I am
worried that the earth would be forced into a war it didn't start or
has no business getting involved in.
>4) Don't you think that we were so good at war because we lacked the
> Light to be at peace within and therefore had trouble expression
> love for ourselves and others??
You could be right. but when ever a group tried to tell another group
how to live, the end result was some type of conflict. Peace and not
having to fight would be well and good, but I am something of a
realists and a constant preminition of danger to our planet have made
me doubt the wisdom of joining a federation with the other alien
spieces.
I train in the arts of Combat, Magick, and Mind as a way to bring my
mind,body and spirit into unity, but also to protect myself, my loved
ones and if need be my race.
BTW-- My nym "Darkstar" is represenative of who I am. A star to those
who accept the light of peace, freedom, and love. The "Dark" to those
who would deny those to others.
==================================================
"And it harm none. Do what thou will"
--Wiccan Rede
darkstar@compumedia.com
Date: Wed, 22 Feb 95 21:53:11 HST
From: rachael davis-shea
Subject: 2011/Negative Visitors
To: "Light Workers List"
Hello again from Hawaii. I am Rachael. Some people have asked about
UFO sightings here and yes there are many. Theres a group here who
meet and share experiences. Most of them, I must say, were eager to
be "abducted" or at least to make contact. One person I know was so
anxious to be included that she slept overnight in her friend's yard
to wait for them to come. I am not one of these, so I suppose it is
not part of my agreement. Just in case, I was making white around my
body for the whole 3 hours, to indicate that I was not to be
approached. But I know the people are sincere and find the
experience transforming.
2011, 2013 -- how wonderful to hear of these numbers in the Mayan and
Aztec calendars. As I mentioned before, I was deeply struck by
channelings from The Kryon, who is here to make the change in the
magnetic grid of the earth, to be completed in the year 2011.
Apparently this change is critical not only to Earth but to this whole
part of the cosmos, which explains the presence of literal multitudes
out there ready to support, when asked, us light-beings who are here
as humans, who will do the work __ourselves__, finding all the answers
within, and recognizing the truths in ancient texts, as we are the
ones who wrote them in the first place and left them for ourselves to
find. These magnetic changes are challenging for people who have been
pretty good on healing and spiritual answers, as the grid-change will
alter their whole base and place all of us on new ground.
"Dark entities" are indeed here, on this planet of free will, doing
what they need to do, which is either to study our emotions or to feed
off them. Apparently, this is the big deal with negative entities,
they feed on fear. The more fearful we are, the more they are
attracted. Here is what The Kryon says about our power in relation to
them, at least those who have accepted the neutral implant & voided
karma or who have faced fear and walked through it:
"One of you in an enlighteded state with balance may freely stand in
the middle of thoses chanting and calling for Lucifer -- and you will
have total power over all of them!" He explains what we call
negataive as unbalance. In fact these entities could seen as our
*lower selves* looking to learn balance and emotion.
I must say that I have experienced this in a very serious situation.
That moment of compassion that transforms fear into love seems to come
like grace, in the form of seeing differently, from which follows
thinking differently. For me, I suddenly saw the "enemy" as hurting
more than I was.
There is a lot about Atlantis in these channelings, including drawings
of the healing temple. I found myself very agitated on seeing it and
reading a description of the tables and all the equipment. I know now
I was there and have blocked it all. I must be like a lot of us who,
acc to Kryon, fear annihilation from enlightenment, because thats what
happened then. We are encouraged to let go of that fear, if we have
it.
I understand the term "unbalance" -- it rings true for me, and
resonates with my sense of healing, which is all about balance. Re-
aligning polarities was apparently what was done in Atlantis, on a
powerful scale.
Oh yes, i was asked about "The Foundation of I." Don't know of it.
Hawaii is a vortex right now for healing energy. Just remembered
something the Kryon referred to as significant. He said an event took
place in summer 1987, that showed the rest of the cosmos that we on
earth had made a totally unexpected leap of consciousness, because of
which leap, the dire predictions were averted. He said those who knew
about it would recognize the event. A big gathering for the Harmonic
Convergence took place at Haleakala on the island of Maui. Could this
be what he meant? Were there not other gatherings at different sites?
I would like to be reminded of the locations.
in Love
rachael ------
/l /
/\l/\
------
Date: Thu, 23 Feb 1995 15:02:26 GMT
From: Thorsteinn Bardason
Subject: Re:(Negative Visitors) Harmonic Convergese
To: "Light Workers List"
(*** Thorsteinn answering Rachael's Post above ***)
Hi Rachael
You ask about big gatherings when the Harmonic Convergese took place.
We had one the same days (14 - 17 august 1987), as in 108 other secret
places in the world. Our was at Snaefellsjokull, holy glacier in
Iceland, the heart chakra of the world. I was on of the leaders for
the festival.
There was about 1000 people there. Part of the festival was global
meditation, and we had direct physical and spiritual link to Sedona
and few other places.
Best wishes ............ Thorsteinn Bardason
************************
Thorsteinn Bardason
steinib@hollver.is
************************
Date: Thu, 23 Feb 1995 07:06:29 -0600 (CST)
From: "Richard L. Shapiro"
Subject: Re: 2011/Negative Visitors
To: "Light Workers List"
Rachael,
Thanks for your sharing of information related to Hawaii and the
channel.
I believe the Kahunas talk about the people who live under the ground
(do you know about this?) and also probably know about UFOs as well.
Would also be interested to hear, if you know, how they view these
visitors.
We have been told that Hawaii has a very special energy, one that
hightens one's senses, has this been true for you. I felt this way
when I went to Brazil and also in certain ruins in Peru. You have
such a clarity, your inner awarness become more sharpened.
Just wanted to thank you for your sharing ... keep it up ... seems to
me that if we keep going in this mailing list ... between all of us
... we have the answers to the questions people are asking today.
Peace & Light .... Joshua
Date: Thu, 23 Feb 95 18:41:55 HST
From: rachael davis-shea
Subject: Hawaii energy/the net
To: "Light Workers List"
Joshua wrote:
>I believe the Kahunas talk about the people who live under the ground
>(do you know about this?) and also probably know about UFOs as well.
>Would also be interested to hear, if you know, how they view these
>visitors.
"Na Menehune" in Hawaiian. Yes, they are little people who live
underground and are well accepted here. In the old days they would do
things like build a whole fishpond overnight, or do all the work for
an old couple being abused by a cruel chief, not unlike the little
people in Ireland and other places in Europe.
UFOs? I've not heard any kahuna type person mention them. The old
myths have white gods coming from the sky though.
>We have been told that Hawaii has a very special energy,
Yes this is true. A person with heightened sensibilities feels it
immediately, especially at Haleakala or on the Big Island where the
volcano is erupting. We are more visibly in flux here -- lava
destroying whole towns and creating new land right before our eyes. I
stood and watched the red-hot lave pour into the sea, spouting
gigantic steam puffs and then floating red-hot in the waves for a
while. Land sea and sky are close together and the boundaries aren't
clear. Believe it or not, its a little easier here to love people
(its not so uncool as in, say, the urban northeast.)
The Huna way of spirit is very ancient. I suspect it may date back to
pre-vedic original people who knew meditation and were close to earth.
Its been secret for a long time but is coming out. Dancing hula is a
way to touch it without words or lessons. It is not only powerful
spiritually but psychologically as well, as far as people's inter-
relationship. The old way to solve problems is "ho'oponopono" which
literally means to make blessing after blessing, and which is done by
everybody getting together and talking it out as long as they have to.
The more I learn, the more similarities I see with aboriginal culture.
I like the net because it is way of living the new culture that will
better match our new dimension -- no rules but plenty ethics, a self-
adjusting society where respect, individual freedom, co-operation and
generosity just naturally prevail, nobody making a fuss about it. I
think of my son, the cyberpunk, and have to laugh. He's the last
person to call himself a scion of the new spirtuality but I suspect he
is, along with his other anarchistic, net-committed friends.
in Love
rachael ------
/l /
/\l/\
------
Date: Thu, 23 Feb 1995 09:56:30 +0100
From: Rene Mueller
Subject: Re: The Positive UFO friends?
To: "Light Workers List"
>> Lori:
>> >Well, I'll leave the most of this to our friend Rene, who has
>> >lots of references for the Zeta Reticulans ...
>>
>>I wasn't sure whether I may reply this above statement from Tony
>>... since I came across very often and finaly said always the same
>>...
>>
>> "Don't put all entities who have Zeta-bodies into one pot ..."
>> "Do we the same of with humans, saying they are all the same?"
>
Tony:
>I don't put all of the Greys in the same pot, but those that do
>whatever they do without the consent of their subjects are violating
>a very basic priciples of "Freedom" and "Respect", and seem to be
>in the majority. The way that I was brought up was that if you
>wanted to do something to someone you asked first and respect their
>decision if they say no. This group that just abducts someone, and
>leave behind an emotional wreck, I can say without reservation,
>destroy them just as you would a rabid dog.
I see your point, and I just can repeat what I wrote earlier, also
Flemming stated, the victim pattern has to be released and looked
behind the scene. There is an agreement ... also when the emotional
problems appear as result of denying. I know, the 'abduction' created
much fear, and I felt, it's really not their intention, really not, to
hurt as some perceive it ... there is a bigger picture, and that each
one has to discover ...
Lori:
>>Maybe to short reply on depression:
>>
>>The depression of people is a deep process of releasing concepts,
>>mental and emotional. Hold on for a moment, and remember there is
>>an entire universum we all are contected, everytime, also in the
>>moment you read this lines ... and we deny sooo much of our
>>interconnectivity with ALL-THAT-IS, therefore we have to be very
>>carefully, if we beat the ones who assist us to take away the veil
>>...
>
Tony:
>I'm not just talking about the depression, I am also talking about
>the anxiety, and lack of control over their lives. Let me try to
>put it this way for you, how would you like to be abducteed who is
>having unkown medical experiments done on you, you don't know whats
>going on, doubting your sanity and destroying your spirit. Lives
>are being shattered by uncaring, unemotional beings who don't care.
>
>I've been helping these shattered souls through a group that helped
>me through my own case of Post Traumatic Stress due to child abuse.
>Let tell you all one thing, in most of these cases, the victims want
>revenge.. We're able to help them through the depression and lead
>some semblence of a normal life.
Let go being a victim ... let go ... else the woundes are troubling
you and limit you to perceive the bigger picture where you set
yourself into ...
There are ways we have choosen to grow, also being a victim let us
grow ...
What more I can say ... I respect your view, and your experiences ...
I was "in trouble" as well, I went throught the fire, which was
painful, but cleared much ... I've got understanding in my heart ... I
can't share this understanding at all by words on this mailing-list, I
only can share, it was something I looked for ... very deep in me.
,
Rene
Date: Fri, 24 Feb 95 10:48 MST
From: Marcus Reinart
Subject: Re: The Positive UFO friends?
To: "Light Workers List"
(*** Allexzander answering Gerardus)
>Hmm, Isolation? May I ask you Allexzander, how you feel (I know you
>already talked about this) :)
>
> Are you now a 'Rigelian' observing Earth,
> or a 'Human' interfering Earth?
Actually, as it has come to evolve, I am both.
It would appear (and of course I do agree) that I am also, a bit of an
idealist. I like to see places evolve naturally until they become
spacefaring, at which time they would be integrated into the Galactic
Family. However, up to that point it is nice to have them devolop
their own customs and laws, without the influence of the Galactic
Family. It makes us all more diverse, and allows the source to have
more opportunities to express itself. We don't get the chance to
express ourselves to our full ability when each species has so many
traits similiar to each other.
>When I've got conscious being here to 'serve' in spirit, it was like,
>hmm, what I bring here, what for this all? Like a shy roe I embodied
>myself on Earth, and more or less denied being here, didn't wanted
>interfered at all, it was like glue in my hands, more I touched, more
>glue I had on my hands ... as sinking into quicksand ... what people
>say 'karma', I sunk into 3D illusion, with all its side-effects :) I
>was handling and taking action, primarly not very directed by spirit,
>much more overwhelmed by the intensity of 3D ... I interfered, but I
>wasn't able to perceive what I did, so I came again, and again,
>looking what kind of interference I did before, to watch the "fruits"
>of my doing.
Hmm, sounds familiar :)
>I interfere (so I hope today), with the guidance of I AM as multi-
>dimensional being, I bring a summary of remembrances from existances
>I was on other planets (Sun, Jupiter, Saturn) and other 'places' and
>finally my deep 'home' of Pleiades, as I bring an essence to Earth,
>my piece of light to enrich this wonderful place, called Earth.
I would like to hear more of your past on these planets. As I have
mentioned, I am new to this system, and would like to learn as much as
I can about it. My spirit remembers, but my host does not.
>That's the call I received, before I came here ... I know in me, the
>challenge was so deep, I couldn't say no :) so here I AM :)
>Allexzander, may I remain here and interfere? :)
Quite a clever message, I did catch your point, very well
taken. As we all know, I am no where near the root of your question,
and therefore leave that as the rhetorical question that it was meant
to be.
As much as the idealist view I have of this world, I am in the
minority, and understand that the interference runs deep, and that
lends itself to more interference as people begin to try to 'fix'
whatever it is they feel they have done. To give you a little more
insight to my mission here, it is to study the effects of the
interference of all worlds invovled, positive or negative. I have a
lot of my own views, which I express quite readily. Discussions such
as these help me understand things better, and will help me when I
finally make my presentation back to my people. By following you in
this letters, I come to understand better your views on the subject,
and learn more about the great diversity we have on this world.
I relate this planet as a "hot-tub party." This is my best
explanation of what is going on this world, just a bunch of people
sitting in a hot tub talking and enjoying themselves.
Good points!
Allexzander
Date: Fri, 24 Feb 95 10:48 MST
From: Marcus Reinart
Subject: Re: Sirians, Pleiadians & Rigelians etc.
To: "Light Workers List"
(*** - Allexzander responding to Rene's remarks)
>I see it like this too, when I said "in me", I meant the physical
>personality, mind and ego ... and the inner separateness get
>expressed into the physical realm, where I exist as human-being ...
>and I follow your view fully, spirit has duality as cloth, but itself
>is not of any duality ... there, the often used word "unconditional"
>appears in my head :) ... when people express unconditional, then
>it's an expression of spirit, if it's conditional, it's one of the
>ego ...
Exactly! It seems our terminology may conflict sometimes, however
when boiled down, we tend to have very similiar beliefs.
>Same with me, I really enjoyed the last exchanges, and I was hoping
>to be able to talk longer on this issue. Some weeks before, I tried
>to share some feelings and views, but primary no-one was interested,
>and I didn't wanted perform a 'speach', but much more a conversation
>... so, Allexzander, thank's very much for your thoughts and insights
>...
'Tis a special topic, not everyone is interested...I too did
not want to stand on some soapbox, but rather share my views in a form
of conversation. Again, I don't know that there are too many others
interested in the topics, but if they will provide us with some
bandwidth on this group, I do enjoy it.
Allexzander
Date: Fri, 24 Feb 1995 14:02:26 EST
From: "Terry Rogers"
Subject: Re: Sirians, Pleiadians & Rigelians etc.
To: "Light Workers List"
(*** - Terry responding to Allexzander previous message)
Terry here:
I am enjoying your conversation Very much! I feel that they can be
useful for all of us....maybe bring to LIGHT some of our own
"memories" of who we are and where we came from in the past.
Allexzander (Marcus), I missed you back in the fall when Rob. R.
closed down the LAG and you didn't join us here on Rene's list...Sort
of wondered what happened to you and your companion. Welcome back!
Terry
Date: Fri, 24 Feb 1995 12:09:51 -0700
From: gerardus
Subject: Re: The Positive UFO friends?
To: "Light Workers List"
Allexzander speaking:
>I am a bit of a purist when it comes to interference. I would like
>to see a planet that has had no other cultural contact outside of its
>own, just to see the unique forms that grow from that planet's
>particular essence. The only thing that I have noted that is
>particularly human is the Baroque style. Columns, pyramids, and
>other such structures are common place across the galaxy. The
>Baroque is something that I would say is uniquely human, not
>something I have ever seen before. ..... Allexzander
Hi Allexzander...
I understand what you mean by growing up on your own, but I'm afraid
that any Culture would stagnate in the end. In my view the universe
is our relationship and the more visitors we have the more we relate!
The Source as Such is only worth anything to itself because of its
diversity and its relationships.
All my life I have been a bit of a loner and I find that the
relationships I have with interesting strangers, and maybe old friends
in the future, enriches my life. I could not think of life without
'Allexzanders' for example, please stick around for I like and respect
your viewpoints. Greetings and as always...
.!,
Light... Love... and Laughter... *!* Gerardus {-^o}
\~/
Love at first byte! `
From New Age Notes:
To renounce the world because it is vain or sinful or to
renounce it because it is an illusion is a sign of
ignorance. The world is a mass thought construction of
mankind and it is a valid reality in consciousness.
It is a mass mind image of cosmic energy. All beings, things
or realities in the universe are different mind or
consciousness constructions. All of them are only relatively
real. The one and only real thing is consciousness itself.
We all live in it and are it forever. <193>
