  The following is a transcript of Ross Perot's 06/24/92 appearance on
Wednesday's Larry King Live
    LARRY KING: The still unannounced candidate joins us here
 in Washington. As we mentioned earlier, it all started here
 that night, February 20th, 1992. Before we move into all of
 the events of the day, looking back at that night, did you
 expect to happen what happened?
    H ROSS PEROT: No, I did not.
    KING: You left here after saying, "If I get on the ballot
 in all 50 states." Did you even think--what did you think
 would happen? 
    PEROT: I think I said in the last part of the show--
    KING: 4 minutes left.
    PEROT: --that I don't believe this will happen because
 it's too complex.
    KING: Right.
    PEROT: Now, never underestimate the creativity and
 ingenuity of the American people if there's something they
 want done.
    KING: No phone number was given out.
    PEROT: No. Within 5 weeks, I'd organized in all 50
 states. One state after another has turned in an 
  unbelievable number of petitions. For example, California
 had to turn in 135,000? They turned 1,400,000.
    People who are students of politics say they've just
 never seen anything like the outpouring of support and
 organization at the grass-roots level, or the crowds that
 show up at the rallies when the petitions are turned in.
 These are huge, multi-thousand crowds.
    KING: Okay. On reflection, we began that night--it was
 the first question I asked you--
    PEROT: Yes.
    KING: --you said "no." 
    PEROT: Right.
    KING: You said, "I'm not temperamentally suited for it."
 You said you wouldn't accept a party's nomination. Then you
 set that one condition which none of us expected to happen.
    Looking back now self-reflectively, what happened? What
 do you think happened out there?
    PEROT: Well, I know what happened because we have so much
 contact with the American people. This has everything to do
 with their concerns about where their country is that they
 love very much, and where their country is going, and what 
  kind of country their children will live in. They are sick
 and tired of having a government that comes at them from
 Washington, as opposed to a government that comes from,
 which it is supposed to do.
    Put all together, they decided to reassert their role as
 owners of the country. And I am sort of incidental into this
 whole process. This whole thing is driven by something much
 more important than me.
    KING: The people?
    PEROT: The people.
    KING: But how did they do it? I mean, did you get Kansas 
  organized? Who took care of Montana?
    PEROT: Oh, it's just beautiful; it's beautiful, see?
 First thing I got is calls from all these political
 professionals saying that this couldn't happen, people
 couldn't do it. Within 5 weeks, they'd done it.
    Then the next round of calls I got, it said, "You must
 have the worst state leadership you could ever find because
 these people had to self-organize."
    You should meet these people. They picked wonderful,
 strong leaders, organized themselves, put together their
 plans. Any time they turn in petitions, there are these 
  giant rallies where sometimes up to 20,000 people show up.
 There are parades.
    Today we came in from the Chesapeake Bay on fishing
 boats, and this was all set up by the local people,
 organized by them. And it's just a tremendous example of
 their creativity, their initiative, if they want something
 done.
    KING: Okay, Ross. Did you expect to happen what has now
 happened--the backbiting, the stories--and we'll get into
 them--your comments, their comments, Fitzwater, you, Bond,
 the president, Vice President Quayle, a little bit of 
  Clinton but not much of Clinton?
    PEROT: Wait just a minute. Don't put me in this. I said I
 do not want to engage in personalities. We've got one group
 whose whole life is in character assassination and
 personality distortion. There's nothing I can do about that.
 I just ignored it as long as I could, and finally I felt
 that I had to answer their specific untrue allegations.
 That's all I've done.
    I would like to go back to the serious issues that face
 the country. But we have this one group over here that has a
 huge organization that does nothing but stir the stuff up. 
 
  And, finally, when it gets too silly, you have to respond
 to it.
    KING: Ross, is your background fair game? Aren't they
 correct?
    PEROT: My back--excuse me. My true background is fair
 game. This scenario that they construct that is not my
 background has nothing to do with anything except fiction.
    KING: The Washington Post story Sunday, false? Bob
 Woodward was wrong?
    PEROT: No, wait just a minute. Let's take the Washington
 Post--all this thing that I'm-- 
    KING: Because that broke in the Post, not in the
 Republican Party.
    PEROT: Let's just take--well, they all break in some
 newspaper, Larry. You understand how the system works. But
 the point being, I never investigated the president's
 children. I have told this story several times today. People
 brought me information claiming that there was some
 involvement with shipments of arms and what have you in
 Nicaragua. I told the vice president, as one father to
 another, and dropped it. That's it. 
    KING: That's Vice President Bush.
    PEROT: Vice President Bush. I mentioned to him in
 private. I would have never brought it up. You notice I sure
 didn't bring this up. I just consider it an odd thing, if
 someone told me that one of your children was driving too
 fast, I would tell you on a personal basis and figure that
 you would want to know. It was done in that spirit. That's
 it.
    KING: Did he thank you?
    PEROT: Yes. No, no--I would never have gotten into this 
    But he wrote me a nice letter in longhand in 1986
 thanking me for informing him. That's all I ever did. Now,
 then, they, not I, cooked all this up to an investigation of
 the sons, and then they've got these stunts on television
 where he needs to count to ten and all that sort of thing--
 they know what happened. I know what happened, and this is
 all part of what I call fiction writing which has nothing to
 do with the problems that face the country...
    KING: But it would lend people to think that you and the
 vice president, now president, must have been pretty good 
  friends. Someone came to you with information about him;
 you called him. You got an audience right away. Must have
 known him a long time, fellow Texan.
    PEROT: Oh, we go back--I think I met him for the first
 time in 1969. Any time I have ever had an opportunity to be
 helpful or supportive to him or his family I have always
 tried to be--
    KING: And he to you? Has he been a good friend to you?
    PEROT: Yes. I mean, as far as--it's--just--once this
 activity started, then all of this recreation and
 reconstruction started, but it doesn't stick and it doesn't 
  add up, and it's inconsistent.
    KING: The talk in Washington is that there's something
 deep seated between Ross Perot and George Bush, and it's
 personal, and something happened. I'm giving you general,
 you know, table talk. Something goes back a long way we
 don't know about. Anything to that?
    PEROT: Does anybody say when it happened?
    KING: No. I'm just--
    PEROT: It's fascinating, I mean. Well, the point is, from
 my point of view the only thing you would have ever heard me
 say, fine man, fine family. I have never and don't want to 
  be a part of this whole activity, but this drives--this is
 their way of trying to get rid of what they consider a
 nuisance. An a nuisance is a person that a huge number of
 the American people want to see on the ballot, and the
 ultimate nuisance was when the polls showed that I was in a
 competitive position with him, and I guess everybody
 figured, well, we have to bring out the Orkin man and just
 get rid of the pest. So that's the real issue. And we're
 trying to create an issue that doesn't exist. The real issue
 is this just politics as it exists in America.
    KING: Now, that long--that was a handwritten long letter. 
  That was 6 years ago.
    PEROT: No, December '86.
    KING: 5 and a half years ago.
    PEROT: December '86. That was a handwritten letter
 thanking me, and it's just from my point of view--again I
 would never have mentioned the letter.
    KING: Have you heard from him?
    PEROT: I would never have mentioned any of this until all
 of this pops up this week. Now, Larry, this is an
 interesting week. This is the week they have carefully
 orchestrated for weeks to take me out. 
    KING: You were supposed to announce this Saturday.
    PEROT: They thought that I would announce on my birthday,
 etc, etc. And when if you looked at all the events that are
 scheduled to occur this week, that, you'd say that they are
 trying to get the job done. And they'd conclude, well, this
 is the week that was supposed to be, and so far I think they
 better come up with a new plan.
    KING: Have you heard from the president since 1986? Since
 he's been president?
    PEROT: Yes. 
    KING: By mail?
    PEROT: Well, certainly by mail. And--
    KING: Do you have anything?
    PEROT: Again, and the only reason I would discuss this is
 to show that this fiction they're trying to create is soft
 at best. You follow me? It's just kind of soft at best. Now,
 here's another one, right here. Now, I don't solicit these
 letters. I didn't solicit the first one. I didn't solicit
 this one.
    KING: Now, this is January 4th, 1990. I'll show it. "Dear 
  Ross: Brent Scowcroft told me of your generous thoughts on
 getting Noriega out of Nuncio's residence and also of your
 offer to help with Panama's economic recovery. I am glad the
 Noriega matter is now resolved, but I wanted to thank you
 for caring so much. Your offer regarding rebuilding that
 destroyed housing will I'm sure be well received. Once again
 you've shown the Perot spirit of unselfishness when there's
 trouble or when Americans' lives are at stake. Most
 sincerely and gratefully, George."
    Now I'll show that to the audience. What did you offer to
 do for Panama? 
    PEROT: Larry, the letter is not quite right in that
 sense. They called me and asked me if I would. I said yes.
 This had to do with immediate relief to the people. There
 was some delay in getting the government funds available. I
 said certainly if you want me to, and then in a few days the
 government funds became available. They didn't need me to.
 And so it was just one of those things.
    Well, again I didn't seek a thank you note or any
 recognition, didn't seek anything. But this, I think, is an
 indication of the fact that any time he ever called me, or 
  his people ever called me, I responded.
    KING: What does this make you think of him now?
    PEROT: Nothing. I think it's politics.
    KING: No--you don't take it personally?
    PEROT: Look, I was taught from childhood never to be
 negative or bitter toward other people. And I will not be
 that now. I will continue to take the position he is a fine
 man, and has a fine family, and I'm not going to get into
 personal attacks. Now, in terms of issues that things that
 we may agree on, but that's different. See, that's valid.
    KING: We'll be right back with Ross Perot. We'll of 
  course include your phone calls.
    KING: Our guest is Ross Perot.
    In all fairness, on February 20th, 1992, one of the
 things you said was, "I'm not sure I'm temperamentally
 suited for the job."
    PEROT: Yeah, but I was talking in terms of I like to get
 things done, not just talk about things.
    KING: That's right. And that made you maybe not
 temperamentally suited.
    PEROT: Except the thing I missed is the American people
    PEROT: Are tired of gridlock, they're tired of talk,
 they're tired of the president and the Congress throwing
 rocks at one another every day, and they want action. It
 turned out the thing that I thought might be a problem is an
 attraction.
    KING: An attraction?
    PEROT: An attraction for the American people. They want
 these problems fixed.
    KING: How about the thoughts that you were thin-skinned,
 that you were the kind of leader who, if it wasn't your way, 
  it was no way? If the vote was 11-1 and the one was Perot,
 Perot wins?
    PEROT: No. Look at everything that's been written about
 me over the years. See, I became autocratic and thin-
  skinned right after this started. This is what you call re-
  defining your opponent's character. This has been very
 carefully put together over several months. Now when I was
 ahead of the president in the polls, they panicked and
 decided they had to pull the string, and that's what you see
 here in the last few days. And it's not working.
    Now let's go back. Everybody said that when it got rough, 
  I couldn't take it, right? Well, I think it's pretty rough
 now, and I'm not sitting here trembling with my teeth
 chattering, scared to death.
    Larry, this is not rough. Rough is being 55 years old and
 having your company that you work for go out of business,
 and being out of work and losing your house and not being
 able to send your children to school. That's rough. Being in
 an iron lung all your life is rough. Going out on a
 battlefield as a young person and losing a part of your body
 and having to get through life without it the rest of your
 life, that's rough. Being a mother whose husband is gone, 
  who has to get up in the morning, cook breakfast, get the
 children to school, work all day, come home, cook supper,
 fix the house, help them with their homework and go to bed
 at night, that's rough.
    This is child's play compared to the realities of rough.
    KING: Are you going to come out with a platform, a
 program?
    PEROT: Yes.
    KING: A set of principles?
    PEROT: Absolutely, absolutely.
    KING: When? 
    PEROT: When it's time. But now wait.
    KING: When might that be?
    PEROT: What is the president's economic platform? If he
 has it, I'm not aware of it.
    KING: Well, he's had some bills in Congress that he's--
    PEROT: That's not an economic platform, and they all got
 shot down. So what is the plan for the future?
    Governor Clinton came out with his in the last few days.
    Now, then, these fellows have been in politics all their
 adult lives. I just got into this game about 90 days ago. 
  I've been buried with the volunteers getting the 50 states
 organized, that going. We're working on this, and we will
 have this for the American people months before November.
 They can look at it and react to it.
    KING: Months before November?
    PEROT: Of course.
    KING: Are you going to have a convention?
    PEROT: We will have something special. We're working on
 it now. We haven't said what it is. But we will do
 something.
    KING: An event? 
    PEROT: Yes, and--
    KING: A convention-like event?
    PEROT: I'm not sure, see, because ours is a different
 situation. But the volunteers feel very strongly we should
 do something like that, so they're planning it now and I'm
 certain we will.
    KING: I mean, will you bring them together from all 50
 states?
    PEROT: Well, they're working on that. See, this comes
 from them. 
    Now contrast that to the multi-million-dollar podium
 that's being constructed at each of the 2 conventions;
 contrast what they're working on to the 2 political
 conventions that are paid for with taxpayer money. See, only
 in American do you find the contrast.
    When the volunteers do something, they use brains, wits,
 creative ability as opposed to millions and millions and
 millions of dollars of taxpayers' money because they don't
 have it.
    KING: Are you talking to individuals about the vice 
  presidency?
    PEROT: We are working very carefully to select a very
 strong, qualified person for that person.
    KING: Are you talking--
    PEROT: I don't say any more than that right now.
    KING: Might that be announced at that get-together months
 before the election?
    PEROT: I'm not sure whether we would announce it then or
 at another time. Again, I would consult the volunteers
 across the country. We would figure out what to do and try
 to announce it at the appropriate time. 
    KING: Will that someone, as you said last time, not be a
 suit who will be able to be president immediately? And is it
 also true that you want someone to be a working vice
 president, sort of like a chief of staff in the White House?
    PEROT: One of the tests I would apply is, could this
 person be chief of staff? The chief of staff probably knows
 more about what's going on than anyone except the president;
 and if something should happen to the president and the vice
 president had the ability to do that executive job, then he
 or she would be immediately qualified to step in. That's the 
  logic behind it.
    KING: Any other prerequisite? Like, do they have been
 elected to office?
    PEROT: No, no, no. No, no.
    KING: None of that?
    PEROT: No artificial barriers in terms of race, sex,
 prior political experience, et cetera. We're looking for the
 most qualified person.
    KING: You haven't been heard from, to my knowledge, on
 Mr. Quayle and moral values and the complaint about Murphy
 Brown. What are your thoughts? 
    PEROT: I think I will skip Murphy Brown and Sister
 Souljah and hopefully stick to the nation's major business.
    Now if we--
    KING: All right. Does a president have to offer moral
 leadership?
    PEROT: Oh, yes. That's different. I think it's fine to
 discuss moral and ethical standards.
    KING: Family values?
    PEROT: I think that--and I wonder why they waited till
 election to start. 
    No, I think it's fine to discuss them directly. The
 importance of a strong, moral, ethical base, I've talked
 about that for years. I don't hear much about that until
 campaign time. These folks have had 4 years to get into that
 and make an issue out of it.
    But I think it's a mistake to use television characters
 or rappers or entertainers to make your point. I suggest
 that you just go straight to the point because then you get
 all the controversy around the show.
    Now my favorite, Larry, is a cartoon that shows all these
  people looking at television and the one person says, "I'm
 amazed the Republicans can't understand the Murphy Brown
 phenomenon because it has everything to do with ratings, and
 that's all they worry about."
    KING: Bob Martinez said [you disregard]...the
 Constitution with regard to drug violators. No subpoenas.
 Just enter the house, cordon off areas, et cetera.
    PEROT: Well, I can't stop him from making up stories.
    KING: You never said that.
    PEROT: I have the highest regard for the Constitution. I
 have the highest regard for civil rights. This is one of 
 those odd things that floats around and I have said again
 and again and again and again that it is incorrect.
    KING: Was it out of context? What happened?
    PEROT: Absolutely. Well, basically I was in a meeting
 with Dallas police officers and the press when this idea was
 discussed, and I was in the room.
    KING: To cordon off an area?
    PEROT: No, discussed as a possibility in that giant
 meeting.
    KING: Go into peoples' homes?
    PEROT: No. It's very general. I'm sitting in the room. 
 Then a reporter, who was not sitting in the room, called me
 and went through this whole scenario and said what do you
 think about that.  And I said, well, if you ever considered
 doing something like you would have to build a very, very
 strong consensus that it made sense. End of statement.
    Now, then, this--these fantasy land stories I just can't
 control. Now, if you go through what he just said, it's a
 series of incorrect, inaccurate statements by a cabinet
 level official, and I think it's more an expression of panic
 than anything else. I certainly have followed the law. I
 live in the center of the field of ethical behavior. I 
 meticulously obey the laws. And on the other hand, I do feel
 very strongly we can never be a great country as long as we
 have--with 5 % of the world's population, 50 % of the
 world's cocaine use, etc, etc, etc
    KING: But you wouldn't break the law?
    PEROT: Of course not.
    KING: To help the law.
    PEROT: Of course not.
    KING: You say panic. You think the administration's
 panicking?
    PEROT: I don't know what it is. But it's silly. If I ever 
 let words like that come out of my mouth, then I would
 deserve the labels they try to pin on me. I don't act like
 that. I don't talk like that. The people who act like that
 and talk like that get away with it, but then try to blame
 me for things--do you see what I mean? It's fascinating. I
 don't say and do those things. They're saying and doing
 those things in public, and I just find the whole thing
 fascinating and silly.
    KING: Are we going to see more of your wife?
    PEROT: Oh, sure, sure.
    KING: Because generally we don't see a lot of her. People 
 were very impressed when she appeared with Barbara Walters.
 Are we going to see her on this program?
    PEROT: I imagine if you'd like for her to be here, she'll
 be here.
    KING: Take phone calls from people?
    PEROT: Oh, well, yes. Margot is lovely and would love to
 talk to the people.
    KING: I mean, a first lady is part of our society.
    PEROT: No, absolutely, and I married way over my head,
 and that's pretty obvious. I'm very proud of Margot. She's a
 lovely lady, and probably the greatest mother in America. 
    KING: Are you friendly with Barbara Bush, by the way?
    PEROT: Had been for years.
    KING: Do you know Hillary Clinton?
    PEROT: I have not met her.
    KING: Do you like strong women?
    PEROT: Yes. I've got a house filled with them. I have
 4 daughters and a wife.

   KING: The House Judiciary Committee, by the way, is
 considering
  the appointment of a special prosecutor to investigate
 Iraq's use of US credits to buy weapons months before the
 gulf war.
    Yesterday the inspector general of the Commerce Dept
 admitted that the Commerce Dept erased pre-war records of
 military-related exports but denied high-level cover- up by
 the Bush administration.
    The reason we mention that, on Jan 11, 1991, you, Ross
 Perot, appeared on this program trying to get people to call
 on members of Congress to prevent US military conflict in
 Iraq. On that show, you made the allegation that the 
    administration was too chummy with Iraq. You so angered
 Commerce Secretary Robert Mossbacher that he called into the
 show and here is part of that exchange that night. Listen.
    PEROT (on tape): After August, Commerce Dept, State Dept,
 bent over backward to send a super-computer to an Iraqi
 front company in Brazil that was on the way to Iraq.
    Do you think that's in the national interest?
    ROBERT MOSSBACHER (then-secretary of Commerce)(on tape):
 Ross, no more than when you agreed not to sell anything to
 compete with your former company that you tried to get in  
  and sell things to the state of Texas.
    So let's not get into personal views like that. I'm
 talking about respect for this country.
    PEROT (on tape): Wait a minute. Wait a minute. Wait a
 minute, Bob. Can we stay on the issue?
    MOSSBACHER (on tape): I'm not against and I'm not going
 to attack you and your integrity.
    PEROT (on tape): No, no, no. I'm not attacking anybody.
 But I've really wondered why--
    MOSSBACHER (on tape): And I appreciate your not attacking
 me on the same basis. 
    PEROT (on tape): --we tried to ship them a super-
  computer through a Brazilian Iraqi-front company so they
 could continue nuclear research after we decided we wanted
 to take it out.
    KING (on tape): Did we do that for Iraq? Is that what
 you're saying?
    PEROT (on tape): We did; it's a fact.
    KING (on tape): Did we do that, Bob?
    MOSSBACHER (on tape): At an earlier time, we did a lot of
 things for Iraq--all of us did because we were fighting
  Iran.
    PEROT (on tape): I'm talking about after our troops were
 there.
    MOSSBACHER (on tape); We sent a lot of things to Iraq in
 earlier times, and I don't have that 20-20 hindsight like
 you do. But I knew--it wasn't even in my time there--but it
 was the wrong thing to do. At that time, we were worrying
 about Iran more than Iraq. With 20-20 hindsight, you're
 right.
    PEROT (on tape): Bob, I'm talking about after August,
 after August. 
    MOSSBACHER (on tape): We should not have, 5 years ago,
 sent anything to Iraq. But that is not--
    PEROT (on tape): I'm saying after August of 1990, Bob.
    MOSSBACHER (on tape): No, that's wrong.
    KING: Remember that night?
    PEROT: Oh, yes.
    KING: Do you think you're going to be vindicated on that?
    PEROT: Well, I don't want to be vindicated. Basically,
 people make mistakes. What I would like and what the
 American people would like is when government officials make
  mistakes, they just say, "I blew it."
    KING: All right.
    PEROT: It's pretty simple. Right now the facts are, all
 of these things occurred. Now after we'd talked about them,
 they'd been written up extensively in the New York Times.
 Readers' Digest had huge stories on it, et cetera, et
 cetera, et cetera. Then US News and World Report did a ten-
 year litany here just a few weeks ago.
    KING: Do you want Mr. Mossbacher to apologize to you?
    PEROT: No.
    KING: To the country? 
    PEROT: No, no, no, no, no. I like to learn from adverse
 experience. I suggest that all these fellows quit covering
 up. I suggest that they quit living in a fantasy land and an
 image land and say, "Look, this went well; this went poorly.
 We made mistakes here. We learned from this. Let's go
 forward."
    KING: If you were president, that's what you'd do?
    PEROT: Absolutely--
    KING: Okay.
    PEROT: --because this is the American people's country.
  This is their money. These are their sons and daughters on
 the battlefield. They understand that leaders make mistakes.
 They don't understand leaders who cover up. Now we've got
 cover-up going on that's just sick.
    KING: Let me go to phone calls. And we understand that we
 have on the phone the chairman of the Republican Natl
 Committee, Rich Bond.
    Is that you, Rich?
    RICH BOND (chairman, Republican Natl Committee): Hey,
 Larry, how're you?
    KING: How are ya? 
    BOND: I'm good.
    KING: I guess you know Ross?
    BOND: I do. Hey, Mr Perot.
    PEROT: Have we ever met?
    BOND: I'm glad to have the opportunity to try to clear
 the air--
    PEROT: Okay.
    BOND: --with you here tonight.
    KING: Go ahead, Rich.
    BOND: I feel you've made some very wild and
  unsubstantiated charges about dirty tricks by the
 Republican Party over the last couple of months.
    Now these charges are simply untrue; they are fiction and
 they are fantasy. And I want to ask you directly tonight, on
 behalf of the millions of members of the Republican Party of
 the US, do you have one shred of evidence, do you have any
 proof right now to back up your allegations of dirty tricks?
    PEROT: Oh, sure. I've got more than I need. And at the
 right point in time, if you guys keep it up, I'll cover it.
 I'll cover it in great--
    KING: But why not show it? 
    PEROT: This is not the place and the time. When I'm
 ready, I'll do it. I'll pick my time; I'll pick my place.
    Now you're telling me you don't have a huge number of
 people in opposition research. You're telling me you don't
 have a huge number of people going through every shred of
 evidence they can find about anything relating to me? You
 don't have anything like that? That's what you're telling
 the American people, Rich?
    KING: Rich?
    BOND: Oh, come on. You think--
    PEROT: I'm saying, do you or don't you? Now wait. Do you
 or--
    BOND: You're making a dirty trick--is repeating your own
 words back to you. That's not a dirty trick.
    PEROT: No, no. I'm saying, do you or don't you?
    BOND: Mr Perot, it's not a dirty trick to track your
 words and evaluate your contradictions out there, which is
 what you deal with every day with the American people.
    PEROT: But is it a dirty trick to distort the truth? Is
 it a dirty trick to lie?
    BOND: Mr Perot, we have no desire to distort the--
    PEROT: Well, wait a minute. You called in. If you don't
 have the--wait a minute, you called in; you called in. You
 wanted to climb in--
    KING: Well, because of time--well, man, Rich, you're on
 phone, so it's a disadvantage.
    Can you give me an example, Rich, of something that you
 broke that is the truth that Mr. Perot is saying was a dirty
 trick and didn't happen?
    BOND: All I can say is that Mr Perot has made broad 
  accusations against the Republican Party which is the
 institution that I lead.
    KING: Yeah, but they were in response to your
 accusations, right?
    PEROT: Larry, he has no substantiation, and he knows it.
 He has not one shred of proof to offer that the Republican
 Party has engaged in dirty tricks.
    Now, Mr Perot, I respect, okay? And I liked what you said
 about your high regard for the constitution. But in my
 America, Mr Perot, people are innocent until they are proven
 guilty. 
    Now I'm just asking you right now--right now--can you
 offer one shred of proof that the Republican Party has
 engaged in dirty tricks?
    PEROT: Yeah, I can spend till midnight, but--
    BOND: Well, let's go, then.
    PEROT: Well, because I'm not going to do what you want
 done on your terms. I'll do it on my terms when I think it
 best serves my purposes.
    But I'm delighted that you're on the record now, and I'm
 delighted that we have this transcript, and we've got the
  same record on you that we had on Mossbacher. And I think
 it will be fascinating over the coming months.
    But the thing that I think the American people and
 anybody listening, it's obvious, # 1, you won't come up with
 a single specific. I asked you to; you ducked that. Number
 2, you ducked all over the place about how big your
 opposition dirty tricks is and where it's located and who
 runs it--
    KING: He said there is none.
    PEROT: Oh, give me a break--who runs it and who they
 report directly to, et cetera, et cetera. 
    You got a problem--and that is, half your people that do
 this--
    BOND: Mr Perot--
    PEROT: --half your people that do this spend half their
 time boasting about it, and half the people they boast to
 call me. Then they call reporters, and they do that in kind
 of a third-rate way. And on any given day, I'll have
 6 reporters call me in 5 minutes after you send them the
 message of the day. Half of them will call laughing, saying
 this is from your dirty tricks department.
    So I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt. Maybe
 you don't know it's there; maybe you don't know it's there.
 And I've seen big organizations that sometime didn't know
 what was going on. But, believe me, it's alive and well, and
 it just comes up with one fairy tale after another, poorly
 constructed.
    KING: Rich, is it possible you don't know it's there and
 it's there?
    PEROT: (Laughs) This is a kinder, gentler Perot.
    BOND: This is fantasy--
    KING: Can we put away one thing, though, tonight? Can we
 say that Mr Perot has safely answered the charge about
 investigating the children?
    BOND: Oh, I wasn't even talking about that.  The
 Washington Post story.
    PEROT: Which one are you talking about?
    BOND: The Washington Post story.
    PEROT: Pick one. Pick one.
    BOND: It's freedom of speech, in case I need to remind
  you. The Republican Party didn't print that story. The
 Washington Post.
    KING: What--Rich, though, it's fed as, what story about
 Mr Perot is true that is not a dirty trick that your party
 found out?
    BOND: We haven't broken one story, Mr Perot. Name one.
    KING: Okay. He says they haven't broken any.
    PEROT: Well, he's living in--
    KING: You're saying this is happening.
    PEROT: He's living in an isolation booth. I will-- Larry,
 I'm going to pick my ti--I don't--I don't respond to a 
  competitor on his terms. I will wait and wait and wait, and
 at the right time and the right place I'll do it. And then
 we will cover this, and then we will have his transcript,
 and we will have his words, and he's going to be in the same
 interesting position that the secretary of commerce is in
 tonight.
    KING: And, Rich, you are answering flatly there is no
 such a group in the party.
    BOND: There is no such thing as dirty tricks at this
 Republican--
    PEROT: Whoa, well wait. Wait a minute. What about 
  opposition research?
    BOND: Mr Perot, I listened patiently to you, and I'm just
 simply responding that we're not doing dirty tricks against
 Ross Perot or anybody.
    PEROT: But you're ducking on opposition research.
    KING: Rich, I'm going to cut this up. We've got limited
 time here and I've got to get some other callers in. But
 we'll have Rich Bond on this program frequently as we cover
 all this political scene.
    Tomorrow night, William Barr is here, the attorney
 general. Next Tuesday night, a special edition of Larry King
 Live with some key people who are leaving the Congress
 because they're fed up with it all. Senator Warren Rudman,
 Republican of New Hampshire, Senator Tim Wirth, Democrat of
 Colorado. They'll be among the panelists next Tuesday night.
    Before we take the next call, do you have any comment on
 all these people leaving?
    PEROT: Well, there are a lot of great people, and the sad
  comment is, see, these are people of action. These are
 people typically who want to do things that need to be done
 for our country and they're tired of gridlock.  They're just
 like the folks out there that are volunteering. They want to
 see the country put back on the road. They want to rebuild
 this great country.
    KING: Are you an admirer or Mr Rudman and Mr Wirth?
    PEROT: Yes. Oh, sure. They're all fine people.
    KING: Alexandria, Virginia, for Ross Perot. Hello.
    CALLER: Hi, Larry. Oh, it's great, it's great to say
 hello to the next president of the US. 
    KING: Do you have a question.
    CALLER: I'm out here getting petitions signed for you. I
 love you.
    PEROT: Thank you.
    CALLER: I want to say that would you consider Jesse
 Jackson for VP? I think it might help to pull the country
 together.
    PEROT: Now, there's a lot of talented people out there
 and as I've said before, without any regard to any criteria
 except just picking the best and most qualified person. And
  the one thing I always solicit from people is their ideas.
 And I welcome that idea.
    KING: So you're not saying no or yes on it?
    PEROT: I can't say no or yes to anybody. And by no means
 does that mean that I don't feel that a person should be on
 the short list. So don't read anything into it. I just can't
 start down that trail, or I'll never get off of it.
    KING: Los Angeles for Ross Perot. Hello.
    CALLER: Yes, good evening, Larry. Hi, Mr Perot. How are
 you?
    PEROT: Great. 
    CALLER: Terrific. I'm a native Texan. And have been on
 your bandwagon since 1978 as a loyal and devout supporter.
 However, it is with great deliberating that I have to
 address, are your Dallas people keeping the truth from you
 about what is going on out here in the Los Angeles executive
 branch with the systematic elimination of very capable and
 very talented women within this volunteer movement out here.
    We spoke with one of your representatives from Dallas who
 flew out here last weekend. We had a meeting with her and
 the state chair, and needless to say nothing has been done.
  We have tried repeatedly to reach you and have been
 eliminated in every way possible. And, frankly, Mr Perot, we
 were only trying to help you and protect you.
    PEROT: Do me a favor. I'll be back in the office Friday.
 Call me Friday. I'll get right into it. I really appreciate
 this. As you know, these are huge organizations in all 50
 states. Things like this do occur, but in all of my business
 career and in all of my dealings with other people, there's
 nothing more important to me than the individual. And I
 really appreciate your calling in. And if you'll call my
 office Friday, you'll get through, I promise. I'll be there. 
  We'll talk. I'll get right into it. Because there's nothing
 more important than you. Thank you.
    KING: And you think you're going to do well with women?
 Thus far your high skew is with men, right, as they break
 down those polls?
    PEROT: Again, see, I don't break it down that way. In
 terms of my concern for all people, and certainly my concern
 for women, it's there. There's a long record.
    KING: So you think it will (inaudible).
    PEROT: That's up to the women.
    KING: Panama City, Panama, for Ross Perot. 
    CALLER: Good evening, Larry. How are you doing?
    KING: Fine.
    CALLER: Hi, Mr Perot.
    PEROT: How are you, sir.
    CALLER: Fine. I'm calling in and asking you the following
 question: I was very impressed with the letter that you
 received from Mr Bush during the Noriega thing in Panama and
 stuff like that. My question is, did, you know that when
 Panama was invaded the US didn't protect the private
 businesses in Panama, and there was looting going on even
  under the eyes of the Army people.
    KING: What's the question?
    CALLER: The question is, when you become president, if
 you do, do you think there's any consideration of those
 matters?
    KING: You mean like repayment to the people who were
 damaged?
    CALLER: Exactly.
    KING: Ross?
    PEROT: I would have to study that issue. I'm not familiar
 with it. It was my understanding that our government had 
  gone and helped do that, and had acted in an responsible
 way. But I am not familiar with that problem, but if I am
 ever in a position of power to look into it, I certainly
 will look into it, and make sure that we do the fair thing.
    KING: Are you saying if you learned it were responsible
 you would attempt to make amends?
    PEROT: No, the point is winning a war is one thing.
 Winning the peace is the important thing.
    KING: That wasn't a war, that was the taking of a--
    PEROT: Call it what you want to. People died. From the
 point of the view of the guys who got blown to pieces, it 
  was World War II, it was Normandy Beach, right? Those Seals
 out there at the airport, all those great guys that really
 took the heat and just again, and again, and again. From the
 great young people that I happen to know who walk around
 with parts of their bodies missing, that was war.
    Now, then, it's very important to win the peace. You see,
 we have the world's worst record--after the shooting stops--
 of going in there and making sure that we develop the long
 term friendships. This costs next to nothing to help get
 Panama back on its feet.
    KING: In other words, this man shouldn't be angry? 
    PEROT: No. Again, I don't know who he is. I don't know
 the circumstances. But again--
    KING: But what you're saying is he--
    PEROT: --See, my whole life is dedicated to the
 individual, and do you remember the old hymn, "His eye's on
 the sparrow and I know he thinks of me."? In other words,
 every single person is important. Here is a person who has a
 problem, and so certainly I'm concerned for him and if we
 destroyed his business and we didn't help him repair the
 damage and what have you, I think that's something we should 
  get into.
    KING: We're running short on time. Do you want to respond
 to "temperamental tycoon," Mr Quayle said.
    PEROT: Well, again, this is just another slur,
 unsupported by any facts.
    KING: You are not a temperamental--you are a tycoon?
    PEROT: Well, but this--this is just a slur. Now,
 interestingly enough, see it's all right I guess if you're
  in office to do this to other people. If anything like that
 ever came out of my mouth, then it would be, see, there he
 is, he is thin skinned, he is a person that will say
 negative--
    KING: So you will not criticize Mr Quayle?
    PEROT: No, the point is, this is what's wrong with
 American politics. And I find it fascinating that if you're
 in office you can say anything about anybody any time and
 everybody just kind of genuflects. But if you're not in
 office, you're expected never to ever say anything like
 that. It has nothing to do with running the country. 
    KING: We haven't mentioned Mr Clinton tonight. Has he
 gained from this?
    PEROT: I don't know. I'm not an authority on this.
    KING: Baily's Crossroads, Virginia. Hello.
    CALLER: Hello, Mr Perot. My question is, if the election
 is thrown into the House of Representatives, how do you feel
 each congressman should vote?
    KING: Fair question.
    PEROT: I think the congressman will follow the will of
 the people in their state.
    KING: District or state?
    PEROT: District, certainly.
    KING: In other words, how your district votes is how you
 should vote.
    PEROT: Congressmen should be very sensitive to their
 districts, yes, sir.
    KING: Quickly, for Ross Perot, Rotterdam, Holland, hello.
    Q: Hello, Mr Perot. The vast majority of European
 countries hold the opinion that within a civilized society
 there's no room for such a thing as the death penalty. Do
 you agree with this view? And if you don't, why do you think
 the European countries are confused?
    KING: Do you have a thought on the death penalty? He said
 most European countries are opposed to the death penalty.
    PEROT: I think all of us feel that each human life is
 precious. On the other hand, if a person violently takes the
 life of another, and we certainly have that problem in our
  country now--we have got to have a level of punishment that
 causes a person--even if he's drunk, or on drugs, or what
 have you--to at least have something in his head that clears
 his head to the point where he will think before acting.
    Sadly enough, we live in a country now where we have
 drive by shootings of total strangers. And most back to
 basic in our values is respect for human life. This should
 be a tiny problem, unfortunately it's a major problem in our
 country. We have to have strong deterrents. Sad case, but
 that's where we are.
    KING: About a month and a half ago I was in Israel. I 
  went into Yitzhak Rabin's office. I met all the leadership
 there, and he's now the prime minister. And the first thing
 he said to me was, "Hello, is Ross Perot our friend? I think
 he is in my heart. I feel he's a friend of Israel." Is he?
    PEROT: Yes.
    KING: Yes, you are a friend of Israel?
    PEROT: Israel has been our friend for years. Israel is
 our friend. Israel showed enormous restraint during the
 Persian Gulf War and certainly our bonds with Israel go back
 many many years. Now the other countries in the Middle East
 are our friends also, and our responsibility is to do 
  everything we can to responsibly assist to bring stability
 in the Middle East. But is Israel a friend? They've proved
 that a thousand times.
    KING: Would you go there?
    PEROT: I've been there. Had the privilege of meeting Mrs
 Meir. Had the privilege of meeting General Sharon.
    KING: I mean would you go as president.
    PEROT: Yeah. But look, I'm saying I've had the privilege-
 -and that's the word I would use of meeting Golda Meir,
 which was one of the great moments of my life. And
 certainly, I would--now I would be out of Washington most of 
  the time. But most of the time when I'm out of Washington,
 it will be out there in America rebuilding our country. We
 have got to rebuild our industrial engine. That is the
 highest priority.
    Now, it's just this simple Larry, in my point of view the
 American people need to listen to all this stuff that goes
 on day, after day, after day, and then in November they need
 to pick the person that they feel will rebuild their
 country; will allow this country to pass on the American
 dream to their children, and it's very important that at
 this point in our history to pick someone who will do it. 

           R O S S   P E R O T  A C T I O N  K I T

1. You are encouraged to upload this text (including this appendage)
to your local BBSs.

2. You are further encourage to make hard copies of the following
petition and pass them out to friends asking each person to
   a. Circulate the petition.
   b. After you have filled the petition with names of registered voters
      in your voting district make photocopies.
   c. Mail one photocopy (with a brief cover letter to your local US
      Representative.  Mail one each to both of your US Senators.
   d. Mail one each to any candidate for the offices mentioned.
Take action today to help return this country to its owners.

The Petition:

We, the undersigned, demand that our U.S. Representatives and our U.S.
Senators and all candidates for those offices take the following pledge:

"If the 1992 Presidential Election is thrown into the U.S. House to
choose the President and into the Senate to choose the Vice President,I
pledge to support the Presidential ticket that receives the most popular
votes nationwide."

We, the undersigned, further state that those candidates who fail to
make this pledge before the election will not receive our vote.


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