TELECOM Digest     Tue, 24 Jan 95 16:40:00 CST    Volume 15 : Issue 60

Inside This Issue:                          Editor: Patrick A. Townson

    Re: North Korea Holds US Representative Over $10K Phone Bill (Alan 
Shen)
    Re: Long Distance Caller ID (ludden@indirect.com)
    Re: Privately Owned Cables on Public Utility Poles (Mark Fletcher)
    Re: Cellular Fraud: How Much of it is Real Money? (Robert 
Levandowski)
    Re: Internet Mail With Half the Address? (Larry Drebes)
    Re: Where to Find Nice-Looking Phones? (Bill Garfield)
    Re: Using U.S. Modem in Israel (Supak Lailert)
    Re: 800 Numbers From Overseas (Kimmo Ketolainen)
    Re: Telephony Card/Software Needed (John Lundgren)
    Re: Telephony Card/Software Needed (Dale Wooden)
    Re: Telephony Card/Software Needed (Harold Buehl)
    Re: Planning to Purchase a Voice Mail System (Greg Habstritt)
    Re: Planning to Purchase a Voice Mail System (Bill Garfield)

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From: Alan Shen <kermee@u.washington.edu>
Subject: Re: North Korea Holds US Representative Over $10K Phone Bill
Date: Tue, 24 Jan 1995 10:36:17 -0800
Organization: University of Washington


On Thu, 19 Jan 1995, Paul Robinson wrote:

> In Jack Anderson's column today, he reports that when Representative
> Bill Richardson (D-New Mexico) tried to cross the DMZ (Demilitarized 
Zone)
> between North and South Korea, with the casket carrying the remains 
of
> Chief Warrant Officer David Hilemon, North Korean officials refused 
to let
> him cross until the bill was paid. 

> In Cash. 

> $10,000 is about eight times North Korea's per capita yearly income.  

Why didn't they just bring a satellite phone with him? Or was he out
of range? $10K for 23 calls ... is a LITTLE too much for me ...


Daniel Kao

------------------------------

From: ludden@indirect.com
Subject: Re: Long Distance Caller ID
Organization: Internet Direct, indirect.com
Date: Tue, 24 Jan 1995 18:51:56 GMT


Paul J Zawada <zawada@ncsa.uiuc.edu> writes:

> I've had a couple of interesting conversations with the folks at
> Ameritech regarading the delivery of interstate Caller-ID 
information.
> I have a question or two regarding the availablity of the above 
service, 
> so let me summarize and pose a question or two to the readers of 
TELECOM
> Digest.

> How useful is Caller-ID in other parts of the country?  Do other 
folks
> that have the service get "OUT OF AREA" for 99.5% of their 
interstate
> calls, or am I just in the wrong city to get that info?  I'd be
> especially interested to hear how well it works in the Chicago area
> since Chicago is also served by Ameritech Illinois.

US West has offered Caller-ID in the Phoenix Metro Area for over a
year now, and I have been quite pleased with it.  All non-cellular
local calls either have display a name and number, or PRIVATE NAME for
blocked calls.  I recieved a note from US WEST in December saying that
they would have long distance Caller-ID in place by summer 95, as well
as having Caller-ID work when a call-waiting call comes in (so you can
decide whether to answer or not).


Lee

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 24 Jan 1995 13:55:52 -0800
From: mfletch@ix.netcom.com (Mark Fletcher)
Subject: Re: Privately Owned Cables on Public Utility Poles


> In many areas the local cable company has rights to access
> all pole space (for a small fee per year per pole, as a rule).
> I've found the cable operators to be more that willing to construct
> and maintain private fiber optic cables, for reasonable costs.
> This is the very simplest solution I've found, they have all the
> rights, equipment and contractors in place.
 
> You should also consider fiber due to its longer life and lower
> problem level, e.g. lightning immunity, etc.

> There are also contractors who are willing to take on such a project
> on a turnkey basis, including negotiating access rights.  They can
> be located by contacting a few of the larger contractors, such
> as Henkels and McCoy, and others out of industry directories.

> You might want to consider the use of a experienced consultant for
> this project.  They know who to approach and what to consider.

We tried a few contractors who "knew the ropes" on who to contact, but
their cable prices were through the roof! The cable company is an
interesting route though ...

It looks like T1 may be an answer, and cost effective from the RBOC,
and TELCO Inc. has an interesting product that links direct with the
Northern Telcom Meridian for 2500 or Digital sets.

Getting close to the answer! Thanks all!

------------------------------

From: rlvd_cif@uhura.cc.rochester.edu (Robert Levandowski)
Subject: Re: Cellular Fraud: How Much of it is Real Money?
Organization: University of Rochester - Rochester, New York
Date: Tue, 24 Jan 95 22:05:43 GMT


> is 'worth'. If all you and Paul are saying is that people or 
companies who
> have things stolen from them occassionally inflate the value of what 
was
> stolen for reasons of their own, i.e. insurance payoff, then I would 
agree
> with you. Yes, they do that. If they report what they sold as worth
> one dollar and what was stolen as worth two dollars (for the same 
quantity
> or product, etc) then that is wrong. If they report what was stolen 
as
> worth the same amount as that which was sold, then I don't think 
that is
> wrong.  

> To put it another way, consider a large supermarket in a city like 
Chicago.
> Jewel Food Stores tosses a huge amount of perishable stuff out in 
the 
> dumpster each week when their new stock comes in. Milk with an 
expiration
> date only two or three days away. Loaves of bread which have been 
around
> awhile or which got banged up and the wrapping slightly sliced open 
by
> accident in transit. Entire cartons of eggs where one egg got 
broken. Boxes
> of breakfast cereal smashed up in transit. In other words, perfectly
> good food, but American consumers are picky people. Homeless or 
other poor
> people with sophistication or 'street-smarts' know exactly what day, 
or
> rather night of the week each Jewel store in the area gets its 
deliveries
> and within minutes or maybe an hour what time to go hit those 
dumpsters
> and clean them out. Granted, you can't be too picky about variety; 
you 
> can have a dozen boxes of corn flakes because they threw out the 
whole
> carton when the box on top got sliced open accidently by the stock 
clerk
> opening the carton, but don't look for any Raisin Bran this week. 
And in
> the middle of winter, all those gallon jugs of milk are just fine, 
but
> in the middle of the summer if they've been out there in the 
dumpster more
> than an hour or so, you don't want them ... otherwise, everything is 
fine.

> So since a grocery store is going to toss out all of its perishables 
when 
> a new order comes in, and since they never manage to sell it all, 
and 
> since the price tag for the item is probably five times higher than 
what 
> they paid for it, what real problem is there if someone wants to 
shoplift 
> a little right from the store?  Right? Now substitute cellular 
carriers 
> and/or telcos and/or software writers. If sneaking something out 
without 
> paying is cool, then fine. If 'shoplifting' is wrong, then it is 
wrong. PAT]

This is an interesting analogy, but it's not quite what the original
poster was trying to say, I think.  To expand:

If said supermarket were to suffer from a crime wave, and a certain 
amount
of milk were stolen, but no more milk than would normally be discarded 
in
any given week as you described, what if the supermarket then turned 
around
and announced it would increase its milk prices to make up for its 
losses?
Should it figure the value of the lost milk at full retail, or at 
wholesale?
It would not have sold the milk; if they recover the full retail 
price, they
would end up making more money than they would have if the crime had 
not
occurred in the first place. 

Persomally, I don't think that's reasonable, from the customer's point 
of 
view.  When you move from supermarkets to cellular carriers, an 
additional
factor comes in.  The cellular system transmits its authentication in 
the
clear, making it relatively easy for modern crooks to commit cellular 
fraud.
I've seen lots of people here mention this, and it seems the carriers 
must
have known this weakness.  To go back to the analogy, would the 
supermarket
customers be happy about rate increases if they found out the store 
had 
knowingly left the back door unlocked and unguarded every night, at 
the time
the milk thefts occurred?  

I see the point as being: the cellular customers are not responsible
for the theft of their billing codes.  They exercise reasonable
caution in protecting the company from fraud; it is the system that is
at fault and it's not reasonable to ask people not to use their
phones.  In this case, it's bad enough to be charged for theft beyond
your control, and even worse to be charged based on theoretical costs
that will net the company more money than they'd get if there were no
crime to start with.


Rob Levandowski
Computer Interest Floor associate / University of Rochester
macwhiz@cif.rochester.edu 


[TELECOM Digest Editor's Note: I am reminded of several years ago when 
I
had a neighbor by the name of Mike Polonski and his wife. They were an
older, retired couple. Not being able to get by on what Social 
Security
paid them as a married couple, they decided to get a divorce -- after
fifty years of marriage! -- so that each of them would begin getting 
their own check each month, in a total amount higher than what they 
gpt
as a married couple. None the less they continued to live together, 
they
were simply divorced in the eyes of the law is all. We would get 
together
for dinner at least once a week, sometimes more often. Time and again, 
at
dinner in their home, we had only the finest meats, vegtables, and 
other
foods. Where do you do your shopping, I asked ... Mr. Polonski's 
answer
shocked me: the Carnegie Safeway dumpsters every Tuesday about 
midnight, 
he said.

He saw my startled look and explained what I said in my previous 
message.
Every Wednesday morning at 4:00 am the semi-trailer truck full of 
stock for
the store would show up. About the same time the refrigerator truck 
would
show up with milk, eggs, butter, ice cream, etc. Then soon the 'bread 
man'
would be there. In anticipation, the stock clerks late Tuesday night 
began
cleaning out the old stuff from the shelves; anything with an 
expiration
date *even two or three days ahead* had to be disgarded. The store 
knew the
stuff was still good, but they figured if someone had milk at home 
with the
current day or the day before as the expiration and they got sick for 
some
reason they would blame in on the 'spoiled milk' and sue the store. It
was easier to dump it all. You would not believe all the stuff they 
throw
out ... I know I did not believe it until about a week later Mr. 
Polonski
came to my home and brought three large shopping bags with him. 
"Here," he
said, "I did your shopping for this week."  He had already taken home 
three
or four bags for himself, and these were mine. Milk, peanut butter, 
crackers,
bread, several boxes of macaroni and cheese, hamburger helper, two 
packages
of pre-sliced balogna (this was in the winter; I caution you against 
taking
the meat or dairy stuff in the summer!) and more. Everything had some 
minor
thing wrong with it; usually it was near the 'must be sold by' date. 
Some
boxes were smashed. A box of 48 Milky Way candy bars where two of the 
bars
on the top row had been sliced in half accidentally with a box-cutting 
knife. 

I asked him if he ever had the nerve to take something he did not want
back inside the store to the courtesy counter to get a refund and tell 
them
he 'lost his reciept' ... <g> he said no, but he knew of one older 
lady who
'did it all the time' until Safeway finally slapped her hands for it 
and
told her to stay away from the store and the dumpsters.   PAT]

------------------------------

From: ltd@netcom.com (Larry Drebes)
Subject: Re: Internet Mail With Half the Address?
Date: Tue, 24 Jan 1995 13:49:43 GMT


Try Four11.  It's free to search and add your own info.  It has both a
Web interface ( http://www.Four11.com ) and an e-mail interface
(free@four11.com).

------------------------------

Subject: Re: Where to Find Nice-Looking Phones?
From: bill.garfield@yob.com (Bill Garfield)
Date: Tue, 24 Jan 95 12:10:00 -0600
Organization: Ye Olde Bailey BBS - Houston, TX - 713-520-1569
Reply-To: bill.garfield@yob.com (Bill Garfield)


ophidian59@aol.com (Ophidian59) in <telecom15.44.14@eecs.nwu.edu> 
writes:

{some deleted}

> While on the subject of phones, I'd really like to find one of those
> old yet very mod (e.g. 60's) British phones with the dial and the
> hook-switch on the bottom. Anyone?

Wasn't this the "ERICO" phone of that era?  I recall they were very
modernistic-looking for the day, but the dial and switchook contacts
were prone to cause static after a few months use and the carbon
button mic tended to get packed easily from overzealous hangups. :-)
Neat phones, but a maintenance nightmare.


Ye Olde Bailey BBS Zyxel 713-520-1569(V.32bis) USR 713-520-
9566(V.34/FC)
   Houston,Texas             yob.com           Home of alt.cosuard      

------------------------------

From: lailert@ucssun1.sdsu.edu (Supak Lailert)
Subject: Re: Using U.S. Modem in Israel
Date: 24 Jan 1995 05:25:12 GMT
Organization: San Diego State University, College of Sciences


Jeremie Kass (kass@tacout.army.mil) wrote:

> I am interested in using the modem I use in the U.S. while I am in
> Israel.  Is there any technical and/or legal problem in doing this?
> Also, what kind of telephone jacks are used there?  This will be
> connected to a residential line, so will it be the same RJ-11 jack 
as
> here?

I've had a problem of using a US modem in other countries. I used 
SupraExpress 144i modem in Thailand and it doesn't detect the busy
signal so that automatic redialing is impossible. The answer from
Supra tech support is that "Your modem is adjusted to detect US busy
signal. The UK busy tone used in Thailand is different. They are
faster. There is no way to adjust the modem to detect the busy
signal." (Thailand uses UK telephone standard).

Is this true?


Supak Lailert -- MBA (IS) Program, San Diego State University
lailert@rohan.sdsu.edu     lailert@aol.com                   

------------------------------

From: Kimmo.Ketolainen@utu.fi (Kimmo Ketolainen)
Subject: Re: 800 Numbers From Overseas
Organization: Turun yliopisto - University of Turku, Turku, Finland
Date: Tue, 24 Jan 1995 12:44:25 GMT


I seem to have terrible trouble with accessing the 1 800 numbers from
Finland, using Telecom Finland (code 990). About every second try
gives me the usual error message "the number is not in use" instead of
"access to the 800 number you have dialed is not free of charge 
outside 
the United States. If answered, you will be charged international
direct dialing rates for this call. If you do not want to proceed with
this call, please hang up now." Luckily I have a redial button.

I called this week one of the other international operators, Finnet
(99= 9) and was told that they are planning to offer similar service.


Kimmo Ketolainen University of Turku            home +358 21 237 8227
Kimmo.Ketolainen@utu.fi           shoe +358 40 500 2957
FIN-20540 Turku  http://www.utu.fi/finland.html work +358 21 262 1496

------------------------------

From: jlundgre@kn.PacBell.COM (John Lundgren)
Subject: Re: Telephony Card/Software Needed
Date: 24 Jan 1995 00:08:00 GMT
Organization: Pacific Bell Knowledge Network


Paul Garfield (garfield@vanilla.cs.umn.edu) wrote:

> I've seen a couple similar questions posted but haven't seen an
> answer.  Please post the answer.  I'm looking for cards for IBM PCs
> that can handle phone calls.  I need to be able to program how the
> call is handled (when and what to play and record, what to do with
> touch tone presses, etc).  All I've seen is things for one line.  I


> want to start with about four lines but have the ability to upgrade
to
> perhaps 24, so I need multiple (four or eight) lines per card.  What
> are good vendors for this and where can I go for information?  
Thanks.

Try Periphonics for a vendor.


John Lundgren - Elec Tech - Info Tech Svcs 
Rancho Santiago Community College District 
17th St. at Bristol \ Santa Ana, CA 92706  
jlundgre@pop.rancho.cc.ca.us\jlundgre@kn.pacbell.com 

------------------------------

From: Dale Wooden <dwooden@cygnus.nb.ca>
Subject: Re: Telephony Card/Software Needed
Date: 24 Jan 1995 15:53:01 GMT
Organization: NB*Net


> answer.  Please post the answer.  I'm looking for cards for IBM PCs
> that can handle phone calls.  I need to be able to program how the
> call is handled (when and what to play and record, what to do with
> touch tone presses, etc).  All I've seen is things for one line.  I
> want to start with about four lines but have the ability to upgrade 
to
> perhaps 24, so I need multiple (four or eight) lines per card.  What
> are good vendors for this and where can I go for information?  
Thanks.

Pika Technologies Inc has such a card, the V12.  It is programmable
and comes in several configurations.  you can contact Rahul Virmani at
(613) 591-1555 or rahul.virmani@pika.ca

Hope this helps.  We have had very good success with this card in our
own products and have been very pleased with the service.


Dale Wooden

------------------------------

From: hbuehl@dsm1.dsmnet.com
Subject: Re: Telephony Card/Software Needed
Date: 23 Jan 1995 22:46:49 GMT
Organization: Des Moines Internet
Reply-To: hbuehl@dsm1.dsmnet.com


In <telecom15.54.13@eecs.nwu.edu>, garfield@vanilla.cs.umn.edu (Paul
Garfield) writes:

> I've seen a couple similar questions posted but haven't seen an
> answer.  Please post the answer.  I'm looking for cards for IBM PCs
> that can handle phone calls.  I need to be able to program how the
> call is handled (when and what to play and record, what to do with
> touch tone presses, etc).  All I've seen is things for one line.  I
> want to start with about four lines but have the ability to upgrade 
to
> perhaps 24, so I need multiple (four or eight) lines per card.  What
> are good vendors for this and where can I go for information?  
Thanks.

There are a number of PC based solutions for being able to take
multiple line analog and digital trunks, do stuff such as play voice
scripts and capture DTMF Digits, generally referred to as VRU or to
actually recognize the the caller's voice, generally referred to as
Voice Recognition.  Natural MicroSystems of Natick MA and Dialogic of
Parsippany NJ are a couple of names that leap to mind, although there
are certainly others.  Go to Barnes and Noble, or one of the Book
Superstores and pick up a copy of Computer Telephony Magazine.  It is
like a toy catalog of all of the new CTI hardware and software.


Harold Buehl   Croyle & Associates   Des Moines, IA

------------------------------

From: gregicg@cadvision.com
Subject: Re: Planning to Purchase a Voice Mail System
Date: 23 Jan 1995 20:45:48 GMT
Organization: CADVision


> We purchased a system from Phoneby which was bought out by VMX.  The
> system works, but has less features than Pacx Bells's system.  We
> tried to upgrade it a year or so ago, but they wanted an arm and a 
leg
> to put a larger hard disk in it.  The hard disk is a regular Maxtor
> MFM disk drive, something like 170 MB.  They wanted thousands to
> upgrade it.  The only thing special is that it's formatted in a
> proprietary format.

Alot of the major manufacturers go about their upgrades in this way.
Pretty well EVERY Voice Processing manufacturer uses regular
off-the-shelf components, and they are all PC-Based (whether they like
to admit it or not.)  Some claim "stand-alone" but that just means
they sell their components under their own name and proprietary
nature, and charge crazy amounts of dollars for it.

They often install a 200+ MB HDrive into their systems, but only
format a certain percentage of it depending on how much you pay for.
Then, when you upgrade, they send out a technical specialist who
inserts a 5 1/4" floppy and runs a little UPGRADE program that
basically formats a larger part of the drive (as they put it, "unlocks
more memory".  So, you end up paying hundreds of dollars for something
that should really have no cost involved at all.

That is one of the biggest rip-offs in Voice Processing today.


greg@cadvision.com Greg Habstritt     
Intellitech Communications Group  
Calgary, Alberta, Canada 

------------------------------

Subject: Re: Planning to Purchase a Voice Mail System
From: bill.garfield@yob.com (Bill Garfield)
Date: Tue, 24 Jan 95 12:10:00 -0600
Organization: Ye Olde Bailey BBS - Houston, TX - 713-520-1569
Reply-To: bill.garfield@yob.com (Bill Garfield)


Paul Hebert (paul_hebert@powershare.markem.com) wrote:

> My company is doing research for selection of a voice mail system. 
We
> have presentations scheduled with Octel and Centigram. Would anyone
> have some technical or user related insight into these systems? We
> have an NEC 2400 switch. Any interface issues we should be aware of?

I've had an OCTEL "Aspen" (mid-sized) system in service since 1990
(nearly five years now) with absolutely -ZERO- downtime.  It is fully
integrated with my Mitel SX2000SG pbx and just keeps working and
working.  I originally purchased a service contract from OCTEL but
finally let it go as they were about like the Maytag man... :-)) I've
had them out once, to replace a disk drive.

My Octel Aspen system has 20 ports and serves approx. 800 users. Much
to Octel's chegrin, I'm still at the original installed software rev
level, 8.45.:-) My system is running four 80-meg drives and is still
at less than 1/2 capacity.  Small mailbox sizes and short save times
help that alot.  I typically allow each user a max of 20 two-minute
msgs with a "new" message hold window of 21 days and a save/archive
window of seven days, tho I do make an occasional exception -- just
don't let it become a filing cabinet nor an attic. Make that a -POLICY- 
and your life as System Administrator will be much more pleasant. Run
monthly subscriber usage reports to keep tabs on your big "exception"
mailbox users as they can bring your disk space to its knees if they
abuse the "save" priviledge. Force passwords to six digits, minimum.
Beware that "auto attendant" can become a sneak path for toll fraud
with any voicemail system.

Otherwise, it takes a licking and keeps on ticking.  Expensive? Yes.
Worth it? You tell me ...

As an aside, my Octel/Aspen system sits in a 68-degrees/temp-stable
environment and is powered through a Liebert PDU (clean power), plus
has a sturdy industrial grade UPS behind it.  That may contribute to
the good results thus far achieved. I know if the need arose that I'd
sure buy another one in a heartbeat.


Bill Garfield <bill.garfield@yob.com>  The pbx/datacomm guy                 
Panhandle Eastern Corp, Houston        NYSE: PEL                            
America's Natural Gas Transportation Company

Ye Olde Bailey BBS Zyxel 713-520-1569(V.32bis) USR 713-520-
9566(V.34/FC)
   Houston,Texas             yob.com           Home of alt.cosuard  

------------------------------

End of TELECOM Digest V15 #60
*****************************

                                                                                                                
