========================================================================= (C) 1993 by Atari Corporation, GEnie, and the Atari Roundtables. May be reprinted only with this notice intact. The Atari Roundtables on GEnie are *official* information services of Atari Corporation. To sign up for GEnie service, call (with modem) 800-638-8369. Upon connection type HHH (RETURN after that). Wait for the U#= prompt.Type XTX99437,GENIE and press [RETURN]. The system will prompt you for your information. ========================================================================== ************ Topic 20 Mon Sep 09, 1991 ISD [Nathan] at 17:55 EDT Sub: Calamus SL This topic exists to specifically discuss Calamus SL. Please feel comfortable and ask, inquire, suggest, discuss and debate anything related to this product. Be welcome in our humble home. 218 message(s) total. ************ ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 1 Tue Jul 27, 1993 POTECHIN [Nathan @ DMC] at 19:52 EDT Released in February, 1992, Calamus SL has proven to be a first class desktop publishing solution for the Atari platform. Compatible with all Atari computers, from a 1 meg 520 ST to the TT030 to the latest Atari Falcon030, Calamus displays in a variety of resolutions on all available graphic cards in 1, 4, 8 and 24/32 bit color or monochrome, above 640 x 350 resolution. Calamus SL is the centre of a modular universe, based on the WYNIWYG (What you need is what you get) concept. A great many optional modules are currently available with more scheduled to arrive shortly. Additional topics in DMC's Category 16 can be listed by typing TOPic. For those of you enjoying Calamus, whether professional or just for fun, all the topics in this Category will be of interest. A complete list of Calamus' features can be found in our own library 30: file #27367 compares Calamus 1.09N to Calamus S, #17426 compares 1.09 to everything a few years back, as did file #16892, #10521 is a 20 page list of Calamus 1.09N and Calamus SL features. A series of archived files of questions asked and answered in this Category from the initial release of Calamus up to and including messages archived last week, can be found and downloaded from the Atari RT Archive library #13. Just SEArch by the keyword Calamus. The Calamus 1.09 DEMO version is file #10521 while the Calamus SL DEMO version is file #24683. The Calamus Printer Driver Generator is also available for downloading, file #24135. As always, there are many of us that would be pleased to answer any question related to Calamus and desktop publishing on the Atari. Believe me, between those of us at DMC and the many 100's of customers of ours that also enjoy Category 16, we can usually handle about anything you can throw at us and remember, no question is too simple or too hard. Please do not hesitate to ask. Sincerely Nathan Potechin DMC Publishing ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 2 Tue Aug 10, 1993 ISD [Mario] at 21:42 EDT Daniel, the problem is, that, I was told that you had to have at least 4 megs of ST ram in your TT before putting in your TT ram boards. meaning that you should have 4+16 megs of ram not 2+16 as you are. If I am wrong on this then someone please correct me. But that is the configuration that I am familiar with ... Mario @ DMC Publishing ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 3 Wed Aug 11, 1993 F.LAWRENCE2 [FRANK] at 01:19 EDT Lou, Thanks on the info on the macro - Works great - I assumed (ahem) that being it wasn't listed on the template that it not a changeable macro. Now I know. Regards, Frank ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 4 Wed Aug 11, 1993 VORTEXT at 03:19 EDT Mario - First of all, nice talking to you today. Second, that's the first I hear of that little tid bit, the 4 meg requirement. I've been using 2 since I had the machine and am aware of at least one other person with a 2/32 split. The people I've talked to around here are of the opinion you got some bad info. If anyone else has more on this, please chime in. BTW - We tried my version on Alex's TT at ATY, (hooked up my hard drive in his machine( and had the same results. Just wanted to make sure that's all. Seems I got a bad copy. The important parts work though. Daniel One small note - nothing to do with SL Ensoniq has released the new version of Notator, Notator logic and it runs on the TT and Falcon. I can do MIDI AGAIN!! Got mine today. Upgrade fee was $300, so don't gripe so much about Nathan's prices. One last question - Can someone point to where i can ask questions about MultiTos. I picked it up and want to know if it will work with Aladdin. Once I'm in Aladdin, I can't seem to figure out how to get back to the desktop. Thanks ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 5 Wed Aug 11, 1993 J.MEEHAN3 [>> Joe M << ] at 05:30 EST Message 131, Wed Aug 11, 1993 VORTEXT > One last question .. about MultiTos... will (it) work with < > Aladdin. < I don't think so. You should check out the Aladdin RoundTable or start a topic. If you are using an Atari Laser printer 4 megs of ST RAM is a good idea for a TT. Otherwise I don't believe it is needed. >> Joe M << ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 6 Wed Aug 11, 1993 ST.LOU [Lou] at 10:30 EDT Daniel, it has always been my understanding that all printing is done via the DMA port which runs on ST RAM. If your ST RAM was only 2 megs, I could foresee some problems. If anyone of our hardware experts knows more about DMA/ST RAM, please add your commments here. Jim, I grabbed your file from Library 43 and found the problem. The sample you were using did not have any text or control code following the soft line end. I just inserted another line end and the formatting worked properly. So.... use the ALT 23 macro or SHIFT RETURN in the text frame TWICE.... or add more text below your justified line. BTW, to get the words evenly balanced along the line, delete those hard (shift) spaces. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 7 Wed Aug 11, 1993 POTECHIN [Nathan @ DMC] at 11:23 EDT Printing through the DMA port uses ST RAM only! Dabiel, please get the missing 2 megs of RAM. It WILL make a difference if you are using an Atari laser printer? Jim, I also grabbed your file. ;-) All I did was place the cursor at the end of the sentence and, while holding down the SHIFT key I hit the RETURN key. I then had fully left/right justified text, instantly. Nathan ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 8 Wed Aug 11, 1993 R.VOORNEVELD [BOB] at 18:02 EDT Just received my July Update and I must say everything seems to be working fine. One new module that I received is called the HELPTEXT.CXM. I can't seem to find any documentation or information on how to use it or exactly what it is. The seems to be a document needed called HELPTEXT.HLP which I could not find on the update disks. Am I missing something? The overall efficiency of SL seems to be greatly improved with this update and was well worth the fee. *,* \_/ Thanks DMC Bob ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 9 Wed Aug 11, 1993 BHARTSHORNE at 20:09 EDT NATHAN, I received the upgrade looks great, and works great--with one exception-Falcon 256 color mode-you had noted that a small program for the auto folder would make it work and look great-where can I get ahold of thid program-none was on my disks. I also am curious about the Helptxt module... Thanks again for the terrific support. Bill ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 10 Wed Aug 11, 1993 N.B.GARDNER [BRUCE] at 22:35 EDT Nathan or Lou, I just recieved my upgrade and it seems to be working just great. The leader tabs are something I have been waiting on for a long time. I have a couple questions. I still can't get the vertical justification to work. Also the top of the vertical justification dialog box is grayed out. Is this correct? What am I doing wrong? Also the compression module for graphics doesn't seem to do anything. I have brought up the dialog box and then clicked on okay and it doesn't do anything. Thanks for you help. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 11 Wed Aug 11, 1993 ST.LOU [Lou] at 23:46 EDT Hi Bruce. The Picture Compression module compresses file size when saving a CDK with color graphics. You turn it on from the External Modules dialog. Vertical Text Alignment increases the spaces between paragraphs on a page with at least two paragraphcs. It does not expand the line spacing, only the paragraph spacing. Also, if you want to use this function on a multi-frame chain, use a [FP] Force Piping instead of a [Return] between the paragraphs you want on consecutive pages. The grayed out features have been deactivated. This happened in the very last beta before mailouts. Nathan is checking on this right now. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 12 Thu Aug 12, 1993 J.RENNER1 [Kheldar] at 01:16 EDT Nathan and Lou, Thank you, I'll go back to my corner now. :^) Jim. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 13 Thu Aug 12, 1993 ST.LOU [Lou] at 09:38 EDT No problem, Jim. It was my fault for not being more specific the first time. BTW, what is 'Kheldar'? ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 14 Thu Aug 12, 1993 POTECHIN [Nathan @ DMC] at 15:00 EDT Bob and Bill ... ARGHH!!! You did not receive the HELPTEXT.CXM because it was really not there. :-) At least, it wasn't supposed to be there because it wasn't finished and is missing the finished Help text itself AND it costs money. So trash that CXM and give me some time and look for it on the next mailout. And Bill rightly found our second oversight, proving yet again that we are only human here although Mario does resemble a Vulcan cross between a Klingon and a Ferengi. (I'm going to pay for this one.) I will email you the missing FALCON8.PRG right now Bill. Place it in your auto folder. I;m assuming you have a Falcon. :-) Thank you both for your kind words. They are always appreciated. Nathan ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 15 Thu Aug 12, 1993 R.VOORNEVELD [BOB] at 19:05 EDT Nathan, HELPTEXT.CMX is trashed. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 16 Thu Aug 12, 1993 T.HENRY12 [Tom Jr.] at 20:43 EDT Bruce, Believe it or not, Vertical Justification was one of the first things checked when I got the upgrade. I love this program! Anyway, I tried it on a brochure I was working on, and I found if you put a variable paragraph return ( in PKS) in between paragraphs, select the ruler (after returning to the lalyout screen), and then trying it seems to work. Alas, it is true, the top portion is still greyed out and only variable paragraphs will work, but it's almost there. Now for the questions. 1. Did anyone else out there get a module to change the monitor screen from grayscale to 256 color to 16M colors? Even though it seems pretty straight forward, I'd like to know if there's anything about its operation I should know about (i.e. documentation). 2. For anyone who has the Vector Module - there is a new function in the tools section which appears to create open paths (as opposed straight paths with curve handles that you have to move to create a curve). Once again, some documentation if there more features that are unknown. 3. The Color List Module. OK, OK. I haven't had time to play with it yet, but I think it's supposed to let me use a color list from an imported graphic, for instance, or export it in the same fashion. I'll probably figure it out, just thought I'd be lazy in case someone figured it out first. Thanks for your help. Tom ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 17 Thu Aug 12, 1993 C.ALLEN17 [Cliff] at 21:02 EDT Nathan, Have the manual updates been mailed out yet? I've been experimenting but have become a manualll freak. (80 new pages, almost time for another binder, he he ) Oh, by the way, they say I've made the 3 round cut for the $10 million (publisher clearing house) I am placing you and Mario on notice for, say a month of intensive, in depth tutoring. Cliff (Ashevillite) ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 18 Thu Aug 12, 1993 ST.LOU [Lou] at 21:14 EDT Tom, the COL_GREY.CXM is only useful if you have a hi-res monitor that can display at least 256 colors or grayscales. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 19 Thu Aug 12, 1993 POTECHIN [Nathan @ DMC] at 21:46 EDT Oh oh. Why did you receive an upgrade without the new manual pages? Any of you that have the upgrade without the docs, please send me email! Nathan ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 20 Fri Aug 13, 1993 K.SPRINGER1 [FROZEN NORTH] at 00:11 EDT 'Tis good to see that Nathan is a fellow Next Generation watcher! The frozen north is not that isolated! Ken S. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 21 Fri Aug 13, 1993 J.RENNER1 [Kheldar] at 00:31 EDT Lou, Kheldar is a character created by my favorite fantasy writer, David Eddings. He and i are very similiar, i can relate to him. If you're a reader try finding "Pawn of Prophecy" in the fantasy section. Look the topiccops... Got my update today :^> I think i got a bum Raster Generator. When i try to load a CRI the default file name is "Raster s.ett" as in Raster setting. The filters on the left are *.* (editable), *.*, and *.tti (strange). I also haven't figured out how to set up the default raster settings, it's not in the SET file. Seems to me i have to rename a file. I played around with the working area/crop/registration mark functions. It took me a while to get the hang of setting stuff up but it is really neat. What is "Cache active for __% in visible area", in the Misc settings? Under "Statistics", if caches are considered free mem. why would we want to clear them? Is someone planning on redoing the keyboard template/macros so that the new SL and the old template match up? I know there are new features but most of the text module bindings are messed up. Awaited improvements... different guidelines for different master pages. When you add/delete guidelines to one master page it changes them all (unless you have loaded different pages.) This was a feature mentioned when SL came out and it still doesn't quite work. The ability to select a page size to calculate the working area. This would allow you to enter the "virtual" page size instead of the margin sizes. Considering just about everything in the Master page mod is based on page sizes why not the working area? Kheldar. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 22 Fri Aug 13, 1993 ST.LOU [Lou] at 09:10 EDT Hi Jim, er, Kheldar :-) That newer Raster Generator is defaulting to the wrong default filename. A fix is on order. To save a default, simply enter your settings in RGEN, save the file as *.CRI and then Save System Setup. You should find that *.CRI in the CALAMUS.SET file. The Cache % feature is used to speed up your redraws. With a cache on, the first redraw of that frame after changing views will take a little longer than with the cache off. Therefore, this feature allows you to tell Calamus to only use the cache if a specified percentage of a frame type is visible. For example, if you are doing a 500% zoom on a page size text frame, you would not have to wait for the whole page to be drawn and cached. In other words, the redraw of the view area would be completed much faster. Caches are considered free memory because they are not used for system functions. They can be accessed and cleared without interfering with any other program parts. Did you get a CKT with your upgrade? I understood that all the old macros had been rechecked. Hmmm..... You _can_ have different guidlines on different pages. Create a new master page for each guideline set. Save each master page to its own CSS file. Open a new document and load the CSS file in the Master Page command group. Assign each CSS to a different layout page. You should see different guidelines in each one. On your last comment, I don't quite understand what you mean about calculating the working area. Do you want to have a frame fill the open window? That function is in Toolbox. BTW, with the new GEM import drivers, did you have any better luck with those problem files? ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 23 Fri Aug 13, 1993 J.HICKEY6 at 09:54 EDT Nathan - I have a minor complaint about SL. Sometimes I like to enter text in the WYSIWYG mode, and, since I don't have a BIG monitor(I'm in ST high rez mode on my TT), some of the text runs off the screen. If I type too fast,(I'm a really fast 2-finger typist, sometimes reach speeds of 25WPM) Calamus loses text. Is there something I can configure to prevent this? Jack ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 24 Fri Aug 13, 1993 POTECHIN [Nathan @ DMC] at 10:59 EDT My only complaint about Eddings is that his publishers should stop playing around with the release schedules of his great books! Jack ... You can adjust the text buffer. In the Text Module, in the Tools Command Group, click on the Key Bindings Editor and change the timing delay currently being used. Nathan ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 25 Fri Aug 13, 1993 POTECHIN [Nathan @ DMC] at 16:52 EDT ARGH! We seemed to have overlooked the inclusion of the correct PKS Macro folder, FNL FNT and SET for PKS Write. I have just finished uploading the correct file to our library #30, file # 29663. I imagine it will be released later this evening. You NEED this file for the current upgrade! Naturally all upgrades that have not yet left will include the correct file. Nathan ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 26 Fri Aug 13, 1993 T.HENRY12 [Tom Jr.] at 19:32 EDT Lou, thanks. I have Crazy Dots, so I can and have utilized this module. It's pretty cool. The Crazy Dots .ACC will let me change to grayscale "on the fly" as well, but the COL_GREY.CXM in grayscale mode seems to quicken screen updates far faster than th .ACC. I just asked in case there were some functions I needed to know. However, Lou, does this mean I can use two monitors at once, say, a regular SM124 and a NEC 3FGx? Or switch between the two using this module? Kheldar, I experienced the same problem with the Raster Generator. Looks like a minor bug to me. It does work however, just choose *.* in the selector, and choose the .CRI of your choice. I also thought the Key Bindings were screwed up totally because even though I could look at the listing (HELP key) and they looked OK, the screen area which tells you the bindings were different. I solved the problem by using the CALAMUS.CKT file that came with the upgrade, and then reloading SL. There may be a few changes, but I haven't noticed them yet. But the major ones (and some not so major ones) work for me. About the guidelines for Master Pages. I may have to recheck, but i seem to be able to do it fine. are you talking about manually placed guidlines or ones you set in the Set Columns Guidelines area. I'll check it out, because I'm doing a newsletter that will require differing guidlines between the cover, back and middle pages. Tom ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 27 Fri Aug 13, 1993 JWKUEHN [Wolf] at 21:13 EDT Got my upgrade today. Overall performance with all the caches on is excellent. With my NOVA/IMAGINE card as fast as FALCON in 256 colour. I have a MEGA4 with T25. At times it seems more RAM could not hurt. Now a few remarks. Do we have to replace the olf with the Raster Generator supplied in the update? They have different names. I am experiencing similar problems as earlier mentioned. I like the linearity model; however, without and .CK4 files for different printers it is not of much value. I also would have liked the .CK7 option for Under Color Removal because that is the way to go in the future particulary with inkjet-colour printers. My DJ 1200C performs nicely though I wish I could use the linearity model more effectively. Perhaps we need a tutorial. Nathan, could you send me the beta DJ 550C driver which is a CYMK driver. The PJ XL300 which I am presently using is a CYM driver. I hope that we eventually get the upgrade to this great module. Are the control lines for the colour separation module usable for the linearity module? Wolf ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 28 Fri Aug 13, 1993 K.SPRINGER1 [FROZEN NORTH] at 21:46 EDT OK, folks, anyone know the file extension SL uses when it writes files to disk for virtual memory? I use Data Diet and want to configure DD to ignore the virtual memory files to speed things up. Nathan is checking on this. Thanks, Ken S. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 29 Fri Aug 13, 1993 N.B.GARDNER [BRUCE] at 22:40 EDT Tom Jr. Thanks for the tip on vertical justification, but it doesn't seem to work for me. I have tried the variable paragraph return in PKS, but all I can get to do anything is the top, bottom, and center. Block doesn't do a thing. I think I am doing the steps just as you have said. Is there anyone else that is having this problem? ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 30 Fri Aug 13, 1993 POTECHIN [Nathan @ DMC] at 22:58 EDT Anyone that wishes one of the new versions of the printer drivers please leave me email and I will send it to you on Monday. Nathan ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 31 Sat Aug 14, 1993 J.RENNER1 [Kheldar] at 00:12 EDT Lou and Tom, The problem with master pages is that you can not create a new master page and give it custom guidelines. you must first create the page and guidelines then save it and load it into a new doc. This is okay if you have a good selection of masters, but if you need a new one it stinks. Try this, create two master pages (test1 and test2) now edit test1 by adding two vert. guidelines anywhere. if you now change to test2 the guidelines will be there too. On the workspace question, i would like to be able to tell SL that i need a 5.5" X 8.5" page on my 8.5" x 11" sheet of paper and then have it calculate how much workspace on each side there should be. I regards to the GEM files it gets stranger and stranger. Now when i import the files they are proportioned correctly. But if i click on the ideal size icon it stretches the image incorrectly. Which means i have to lock the proportions when i import and leave them alone. Does not SL automagically clear the caches when it needs the memory? If so why do we need the option the clear them. Before we used that option to see how much memory we really had. No a problem, just a matter of necessity. And last but not least. I was unable to save my default settings for the raster generator. There is no reference in the CALAMUS.SET file to the RG or *.CRI files. Can anyone help me change my defaults? Kheldar. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 32 Sat Aug 14, 1993 M.SHANNON [Morgan] at 02:33 EDT Lou, Hi! I have just installed DATAlite and to my unpleasant surprise I can't get CALAMUS (or DynaCADD) to read their files from the compressed partitions, could you guys get together with OREGON Research (DATAlite) CAT 33\TOP 16 and get this incompatability clarified, please? I really need this problem resolved. I'd really appreciate it :^)! Thanks Morgan ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 33 Sat Aug 14, 1993 D.HADLAND [STUSER] at 02:46 EDT Is there a new index and Table of contents pages for the new upgrade available? If so can they be dowloaded? ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 34 Sat Aug 14, 1993 M.SHANNON [Morgan] at 03:34 EDT Nathan, Hate to do this but I have to ask... must I download the recent FIX files for PKS or am I getting an alraedy FIXED package, please check. Thanks so much for all the work, and don't get excited, only people who don't do anything never foul up! Please send my new printer drivers too :^) Best regards Morgan Ken, Just tell DDIET (via the DDIET.INF file) to exclude the "VM" folder on whatever drive it's currently on, or have it ignore the whole drive. Simple? Morgan ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 35 Sat Aug 14, 1993 A.VALENT [Mike] at 06:08 EDT Got my update a couple of days ago. Disk 1 and 2 both gave me read error problems, but I finally got everything but the .SET file loaded on the hd and (so far) everything works. Haven't used SL for a couple of months and was astonished at how much I'd forgotten - fortunately it seems to be comning back quickly. Yeah, what's with that 'help' module? ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 36 Sat Aug 14, 1993 C.STEWARD1 at 12:08 EDT Nathan, I had expected to get a group of files today which were left off my Sl upgrade discs. Spoke on the phone with your office Friday and was told they'd be here. Is it possible to get it to me later today in that I was planning a full SL weekend and my upgrade is crippled w/o those missing files. Thanks. (n.b. what I did receive of the upgrade is grand for which I'm grateful.) ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 37 Sat Aug 14, 1993 K.SPRINGER1 [FROZEN NORTH] at 13:18 EDT Kheldar, After you have set your Raster Generator settings to what you want, save them from the Generator as CALAMUS.CRI. In my case, it is in the modules folder. Next time you load SL, you should have the settings you saved. I've dinked around and changed mine a couple of times. Morgan, May have to get the book out , but just looking at the options in the menu just now, I think you can only ignore one folder, and I have that set to the AUTO folder. I don't want to ignore the whole partition, since I have other "junk" on there I do not wish to have ignored. I'll have to check out exactly what happens when you ignore by program name. I don't really want to ignore _everything_ associated with SL, just VM operations. BUT, when the TT ram board returns from Germany, it won't be such a problem. :- ) Ken S. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 38 Sat Aug 14, 1993 POTECHIN [Nathan @ DMC] at 16:04 EDT C.STEWARD1 ... You'll have to be more specific. If you are referring to the PKS files, they are available since yesterday afternoon in library 30, file #29663. Please type M475;3 to get to the Atari ST libraries. Then 8 to select a library and 30 to move to our library 30. Then download the file. Nathan ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 39 Sat Aug 14, 1993 J.RENNER1 [Kheldar] at 16:38 EDT Ken, I have tried putting RASTER.CRI and CALAMUS.CRI in several different folders, including; MODULES and COLOR. The old Raster GEnerator works fine and i can change the defaults just as you said (by putting CALAMUS.CRI in the MODULES folder. But the new RG won't do it. I think it has somehting to do with the other problems the new RG is experiencing. What do you think Nathan? Jim. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 40 Sat Aug 14, 1993 POTECHIN [Nathan @ DMC] at 20:07 EDT I think I need a new Raster Generator module that saves the correct defaults. I'm on it. Nathan ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 41 Sat Aug 14, 1993 C.STEWARD1 at 20:44 EDT Nathan, thanks for the PKS files. I was the one who phoned yesterday and established that they were not on my upgrade disc set. I was also told that these files and another of typefaces would be e-mailed to me Saturday. I'm glad to have the PKS files today. They sure do work. However they got to me I'm grateful that they arrived so quickly after I called. I'd guess that the other stuff will be coming by some means soon. So as to estalished my novice class, I've spent a horrible amount of time trying to insert double quotation marks in text. I've read the manual and the User-to -User file re: Alt 170, etc. but I simply can't get it. I'm sure that there is something quick and basic I'm missing. But after spending expending so much time on the PKS what- the-hell-is-wrong-with-this-update- -or-is-it-me?-situation, I was hoping someone could straighten out my "quotes". Thanks. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 42 Sat Aug 14, 1993 K.SPRINGER1 [FROZEN NORTH] at 22:27 EDT Kheldar, Hadn't tried it with the new one. Judging from Nathan's post, guess I won't. :-) Ken S. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 43 Sun Aug 15, 1993 D.WALTER7 [Doug Walter] at 00:26 EDT Nathan, Well, while you're at it... RasGen "The Cacher" has problems on my TT redrawing the screen after loading or saving a CRI. This only happens when using UIS3 with the "TOS" file selecter option selected. It redraws fine with the DMC's own file selector. The screen is only partially redrawn leaving big chunks of UIS3 overlaying RasGen's dialog box. Ken and Jim, I have no problem saving and recalling new CRI defaults to CALAMUS.CRI using the new module. There is the possibility that you guys are not seeing the new CRI settings _if_ you are looking at frames or pages that used a previous CRI. Whatever CRI was used with each frame, page, or doc is saved with the CDK and will be called up when loading. In other words, each frame on a page can use and show a different CRI, not just different settings. Try starting with a new document to check this. Where to put the CRI is another story. I have mine in about 5 places, just hoping for the best. Actually, I have lost track of where many SET and CRI etc files are supposed to be. I have PKS stuff duplicated all over also. Senility has crept in ;-) Doug7 ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 45 Sun Aug 15, 1993 K.SPRINGER1 [FROZEN NORTH] at 11:07 EDT Nathan, Jim Renner's question got me to thinking, and now I'm confused. Was there supposed to be a new Raster Generator in this last upgrade? If so, my copy excaped the packaging somewhere between Markham and Bettles. Ken S. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 46 Sun Aug 15, 1993 D.STMARTIN [Binary Ink] at 11:36 EDT Nathan: In addition to Doug Walters comments about the RASGEN and UIS3 problems he experienced: I, too, have had problems with screen redraws after a UIS3 call. I can scroll to force a screen redraw and everthing redraws fine. It appears to be an inconsistent problem. I am _not_ using caching as caching -- he indicated he was. The last time the redraw problem occurred I believe I had selected "Save File As" and then CANCELed the UIS3 call. My system set-up hasn't changed and my guess would be that there's a minor glitch there with the redraws. I also miss the "automatic" appending of the ".CDK" file extension when using UIS3. As it stands now, one must type it - the DMC selector appends it. IMHO it should work the same. The actual saving is done within Calamus not UIS3. And while I've got the Soapbox..... On several occasions I have had VM "eat" my HD partition. My most recent episode occurred when I failed to note that the new CALAMUS.SET file used the same partition as Calamus. This came as a surprise as the manual itself suggests the use of a seperate partition for VM (which I have complied with). What happens is this; if the drive becomes full (either due to my "stashing" a folder in the VM partition or due to an inappropriate system path), VM continues to chug along continually attempting access. After allowing the process to conclude -or- aborting out, your partition is waxed. From my cursory investigations the two FAT's don't match. Diamond Edge sometimes can save you sometimes it can't. Fortunately, I back- up. Bottom Line: VM should check for "Disk Full" and ABORT if it occurs. Also, a warning to set the VM path for your own system should accompany any new CALAMUS.SET due to the potential for disaster. Admittedly, the VM problem is due to my own actions, but that's what error checking is all about isn't it? Dave Muttering: "I sure hope that came across as _constructive_. . . THE SOAPBOX IS FREE! -- Dave @ Binary Ink ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 47 Sun Aug 15, 1993 T.HENRY12 [Tom Jr.] at 11:39 EDT Kheldar, I tried your example of setting up 2 master pages, test1 and test2. Just for the sake of arguement I set up totally different column/row settings on each. Then I went back to test1 and placed 2 horizontal *and* two vertical guidelines on the page. Going to test2 did not show those guidelines placed on test1. I can upload you the file if you wish. Secondly, you had a question of setting up workspace area on a letter size sheet for a half size page layout. I think the easiest way to do this is to set your page size as a half sheet, go to the layout area and set margins for top, bottom, left, right. When you go to print, of course, your page size shold be set to letter. Then your entire 5.5" x 8.5" layout will fit on the 8.5" x 11" paper. I'm doing it now for 2 newsletters I'm working on. Hope this helps. Now, a question. This may be tough to describe, but here goes. I hope Mario can help me on this one (or anyone else, this is all from using cropmarks in the new upgrade, so I figure he may know best) I am creating 2 newsletters, of which each page is 8.5"x7" (or a legal sheet which will fold in half. When I setup my pages, I use the built in crop marks to show my 8.5"x7" layout upon proofing. I want to use the MOUNT module to print the final piece to film in magazine format, (pages 1&4, 2&3) but I also want the crop marks to show up on ONLY the outside of the 8.5"x14" sheet. The questin is, if my page setup has crop marks set up for an 8.5" x 7" page, but printout 2 to a page on legal, when I go to film, won't I have some crop marks showing in the middle of my pages? Is this clear? The one thing I don't want to have to do is this layout on a legal page setup, it defeats the purpose of the MOUNT module. I haven't tried this yet because I'm still designing the newsletters, but I'd appreciate any help I can get on this one. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 50 Sun Aug 15, 1993 BHARTSHORNE at 14:14 EDT NATHAN Thanks for the falcon files and the 550 driver!! Also is there a new driver for the HP Laserjet yet-could use it if it works correctly-thanks!! Bill ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 51 Sun Aug 15, 1993 JWKUEHN [Wolf] at 18:08 EDT Thanks for the 550 driver; unfortunately it does not work with the DJ 1200C. Could you please send me the current HP LJIII driver. I am also having problems with printing larger colour files. I have only 801K ST RAM left after loading the file. In the old version it was all redirected to Virtual Memory. Now I am getting bombs. It works in B&W where I have 1,442K ST RAM left. How can I turn off all the caches. Doesn't the printer driver clear all caches before printing. What are the recommended SYSTEM settings for a MEGA ST 4. Thanks for your help. Wolf ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 52 Sun Aug 15, 1993 ISD [Mario] at 21:24 EDT mount is not designed to do what you want it to do, it useful f that reflect multiples of actual page sizes. What you have to do is produce your booklet in legal format. this should not prove to be a big problem and should take no more time (on a 4 pager) than doing the document as a single page at a time. you are mistaking Mount for an imposition module in which case we would have sold the module for several thousand dollars of under $50. Impositioning programs are expensive on whatever platform you work on. Simply produce your layout on a legal size sheet and turn on the layout option in the print dialog (August 93 version of SL) this will then allow you to see your crop-marks when you switch to master page mode. Mario @ DMC Publishing ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 53 Sun Aug 15, 1993 ST.LOU [Lou] at 22:12 EDT Tom, it has always been my understanding that you can use two monitors, but not at the same time. The icon for Second Monitor in the Top Row should toggle between monitors without a reset. I will have to check further when my Moniterm is working. Ken, please be very careful. Calamus does NOT like to have its files messed with. IMO, I would not use compression programs. Bruce, the BLOCK funtion of Vertifical Text Alignment works fine with some special instructions: you must have at least two paragraphs with one [Return] between them (Variable or Regular); do not use a [Return] after the second paragraph, use a Force Piping. The pargraph spacing between paragraphs will be expanded so the text fills the page. Please note that this function does NOT change the line spacing between each line of text. That must be set in the text ruler. Jim, you are correct about the master page/guideline problem. I will ask to have this function rectified. Obviously it is possible to save different guidelines to different CSS files so it should be possible to create different layouts as you work. On your workspace question... using your example of a half-page layout on a letter page... do you mean that Calamus should center that half page? On the GEM file problem... what a mystery! I tried the JOYSTICK.GEM and it loaded perfectly on my TT, optimized properly and resized without any problem. I am really at a loss to understand why you have this problem. If anyone would like to help, please email me your name and I will email you a GEM file to check out. Maybe we can figure out if it is a hardware problem or some combination of software. On the CACHES, you need the option to clear them for those times when you want to print and there is not enough RAM. I do not think Calamus clears caches automatically. For the RGEN default settings, save the file RASTER.CRI or CALAMUS.CRI into your MODULES folder. Thereafter those settings will be your default. For now, I would strongly suggest you use the older version of Raster Generator. Morgan, Calamus runs an checksum when it boots. This is part of its start up routine. If you have compressed files, you are in for major trouble. Dave, there was no new index or table of contents, sorry. Mike, nice to hear from you. The HELP module was just an elaborate README. DMC Publishing gave its customers hardcopy documentation in more detail and with graphics. Much better stuff. Ken, why not put all your Calamus files in its own partition? Then ignore it for file compression purposes. C.STEWARD1... to use ASCII Entry for any character, the function must be active in the Key Bindings Editor. This is described in your new Text module chapter on page 22 of [5.6.2.2]. I use this all the time in both the PKS editor and in text frames. If you are following all the steps properly, then I wonder if you have an AUTO program that is causing a conflict. What is in your AUTO folder, please? Do any of the other ALT # work? Can you get bullets with ALT 249? Doug, senility is a handy excuse when all else fails :-) Your post about CRI settings is correct. There seems to be a problem wherein the settings you see are not the actual ones in the CDK. I would suggest using the older version until this bug is rectified. Dave, thanks for the informative post. Did you see an alert that says something like "Your partition has been deleted" ? This is a serious problem and I would suggest that you set up a 4 meg partition for the VM and nothing else. Do not use VM on a partition with other files until we get an answer. On the UIS3/redraw problem... I wonder if folks with other file selectors (LGF, etc) have found the same thing? This would tell me whether the problem was in Calamus or the TOS file selector. Tom, if you were able to make those two master pages, I would like to see it also. Please upload the file to library 43 and describe it as a Calamus test file. Thanks. On your MOUNT question, I am afraid the MOUNT module will only use HALF pages on LETTER size for North American printers. You cannot doulbe pages on to legal size paper. Since you are going to film anyway, why not print each page separately and let your printer do the final paste-up? ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 54 Sun Aug 15, 1993 J.RENNER1 [Kheldar] at 23:13 EDT Lou, Noting the length of your last post i hope you had so time to eat and sleep this weekend. Thanks (again!) from all of us for answering our questions. As far as the workspace thing goes, sure center the page in the middle of "full printable" page (i.e. the 8.5" x 11" size in my example). Then if some one wants to move it around by changing the margin settings let them. Considering all that SL does for us automagically why not one more thing. :^> I'll take you advice on the RG and thanks for the cache info. Jim. P.S. The two monitor icon is for using both monitors at the same time, icon tools on the small one, document window on the large one. At least that is what i remember. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 55 Sun Aug 15, 1993 POTECHIN [Nathan @ DMC] at 23:24 EDT I've used the two monitor icon from the SM124 to the 19" Moniterm and watched it redraw on the Moniterm while I was working on the SM124, something I rarely do. Lou .. .welcome back! ;-) ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 56 Sun Aug 15, 1993 S.BLACKBURN [STEVE] at 23:39 EDT ST.LOU A long time ago I could've sworn I saw someone using two moniters at one time with Calamus. The cursor would go from screen to screen and be usable in both. There are two icons for monitors in SL and I was wondering how I could do that. I'd be able to have the menus available in the small monitor for easy use and I'd have the big screen available for the image. I haven't received my upgrade yet (hint, hint) and I was wondering if the PKS upgrade will work with the Aug 92 version of SL? Steve ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 57 Mon Aug 16, 1993 ST.LOU [Lou] at 00:00 EDT Really? Two monitors at once! I can't wait... Thanks for the note, Jim and the welcome, Nathan. Had a wonderful weekend at the cabin.... lots of boating, fishing, swimming. The only thing I missed was GEnie. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 58 Mon Aug 16, 1993 M.SHANNON [Morgan] at 00:44 EDT Lou, I understand that both CALAMUS and DynaCADD do checksums and I have only compressed my data files not any of the application dependent ones so I'm still confused; my ORA Message reply said: OK, where am I in this equation? Do CALAMUS and DynaCADD work legally through GEMDOS or other logical access? Can you help? Can somebody at DMC\DITEK contact ORA directly and get this resolved so I can stop carrying message fragments back and forth?(soon?) :^[ Hopefully Morgan ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 59 Mon Aug 16, 1993 ST.LOU [Lou] at 09:57 EDT Ah... I thought you were compressing the whole partition. I guess I was reading someone else's messsages in between. If it is just data files there should not be a problem, IMO. I will ask Nathan to speak to Bob Luneski. Bob is a terrific developer who also gives outstanding service to the Atari community. Maybe between them this problem can be solved. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 60 Mon Aug 16, 1993 P-DIRECT [Sean@TWP] at 15:32 EDT I don't know if DMC already knows this, but disks 1 and 2 of the upgrade package were not readable on my Falcon030. The ST is just fine, but the Falcon030 chokes totally -- not even the directory can be read. So at the moment I'm coping stuff via my single drive 520ST (512k) with a RAM disk. Ultra-slow, can't wait for the 600k+ .PRG, disk-swap city! Disk 3 does work though, for whatever reason. Sean Dougherty Two Worlds Publishing ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 61 Mon Aug 16, 1993 P-DIRECT [Sean@TWP] at 16:01 EDT On my last comment about the readablity of the SL disks on the Falcon030, as it turns out the third disk doesn't read anything past the Drivers directory. Yikes. I certainly hope this is due to the fact I have TOS 4.02... Sean Dougherty Two Worlds Publishing ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 62 Mon Aug 16, 1993 P-DIRECT [Sean@TWP] at 16:20 EDT Okay, hate to post another message, but just where is FALCON8.PRG, that was supposed to allow 256 color mode to work with SL when put in the AUTO program? Searched all three disks and it wasn't there, and isn't listed on the Upgrade sheet. Sean Dougherty Two Worlds Publishing ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 63 Mon Aug 16, 1993 POTECHIN [Nathan @ DMC] at 16:48 EDT Sean .. .Thank you for bringing this to our attention. Disk 3 only contains drivers. I will check on the Falcon here on what's what. I've never encountered this before. Thanks. Nathan ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 64 Mon Aug 16, 1993 POTECHIN [Nathan @ DMC] at 17:00 EDT Sean ... I just re-copied over the latest Calamus SL. We get them duped. Anyway, it copied over and loaded without a problem. I believe that we have recently installed TOS 4.04 in the Falcon but other than that, we are identical. Is it possible that there is a variable disk drive speed involved? Nathan ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 65 Mon Aug 16, 1993 P-DIRECT [Sean@TWP] at 19:28 EDT Nathan: I really don't have an idea, other than the fact the disks aren't standard format 720k disks. My Falcon030 isn't very picky on disks (it'll use nearly anything you stick in it), so I'm lost also. It is all installed and operating now (minus FALCON8), and quite nice. For some reason when I export TIFF CMYK and load it back in, there isn't any screen display (have yet to test printing). The CVG export is much appreciated. Sean Dougherty Two Worlds Publishing ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 66 Mon Aug 16, 1993 T.HENRY12 [Tom Jr.] at 19:45 EDT Lou, In regards to Jim's problem with guidelines and master pages and all that, I tried his example as posted and couldn't recreate the problem. Have I missed something? I'll try to upload that file as you requested. It'll be a CDK called MSTRTEST.CDK. Just a warning, though, it ain't fancy, but I'll add some text on page 1 to descibe what I did. Nathan, cool thing to have 2 monitors at once in SL. Any idea if I'll be able to run both an SM124 and NEC 3FGx in the same way you do on your setup? (remember I have Crazy Dots for the NEC) Lou, Thanks for the info on MOUNT. I made a crucial error in printing to legal paper with MOUNT - I ASSUMED! Upon rereading the manual, it oes not list legal paper as an option. I should have guessed. But then again, maybe it does. Has it changed at all since the last upgrade? Anyway, I was trying to avoid the extra cost of having the printer strip it in manually (and it would impress them a bit, too). Mario, thank you also for your help (as always). Setting it up the way you suggested will be OK for one of my newsletters (4 pages), but not for a 10-12 pager. I lucked out on that one, however, because my client will be using my laser printout as proofs for quick copying. Of course, this is all moot without being able to use MOUNT on legal paper. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 67 Mon Aug 16, 1993 F.LAWRENCE2 [FRANK] at 19:46 EDT Nathan, Got the upgrade last evening - thanks, sure like the 'CDK' pull down. I guess by the lack of a 'Module foler' on the #3 disk that there were no changes or ugrade for the 'DataFormer' module, right? Frank ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 68 Mon Aug 16, 1993 T.HENRY12 [Tom Jr.] at 19:55 EDT Lou, I just realized I don't have access to upload my file. Could I get a hand on what to do? So there's no digression from the topic, you can send e-mail to T.HENRY12. Thanks ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 69 Mon Aug 16, 1993 ST.LOU [Lou] at 20:37 EDT Tom, I will give you access to Library 43 right now. Please upload that file (and strip out any unneeded fonts, please). ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 70 Mon Aug 16, 1993 M.SHANNON [Morgan] at 21:48 EDT Lou, Now I don't have any problems with CALAMUS or Calamus files that have been compressed with DATAlite. What I changed I have no idea. All I can tell you is that *everything* (application and all files) compressed and decompressed just fine. I guess I'll go figure?! Best regards Morgan ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 71 Mon Aug 16, 1993 C.ALLEN17 [Cliff] at 21:56 EDT Two mointors at the same time, Hmmmmm. Two eyes, two hands. Alright, who's pulling my leg. If your not, do I need a VME board to install another monitor. Cliff (Ashevillite) Hi, Mario. How are the fonts coming? ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 72 Mon Aug 16, 1993 T.HENRY12 [Tom Jr.] at 23:37 EDT Lou, thanks for the access. The file has been uploaded pending approval. The file is #29708. Please let me know what happens. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 73 Mon Aug 16, 1993 P.MORALES1 [Pat] at 23:38 EDT Is it my me, or does the Toolbox Module have big trouble with positioning the contents of (but not the frames, themselves?) grouped vector frames. Text and bit frames appear to work okay, with limited testing. But vector object go all over the place. The docs don't mention grouped frames, but I don't think I'm expecting too much that grouped frames act like a single frame. Any help/advice/work around would be greatly appreciated. Thanks, Pat ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 74 Mon Aug 16, 1993 S.BLACKBURN [STEVE] at 23:42 EDT Amazing stuff homer.... A long time ago I remembered seeing someone use two monitors with Calamus. I thought that was so hot. Now I have my Moniterm back I thought I'd give it a try. With 1.09n I was able to get the second monitor to fire up, but you can't take the mouse over there and make any changes. You have to make the changes on the other monitor and hit the "second monitor" icon. Then the big screen redraws with the new image. Almost there... In SL, I get an error message that tells me the module is not loaded. I've never heard of this module, is it out there somewhere? I know it works, I saw it with my own eyes...but how? ST.LOU I've read that there are major changes in the TEXT MODULE. Could you explain what they are? Can we now alter the TEXT STYLE LIST and put the descriptions in USER order, not loading order. I have been trying to replace style lists in the text module and it just won't do it. Is there a way to clear a list once its loaded and REPLACE it with another.? ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 75 Tue Aug 17, 1993 N.B.GARDNER [BRUCE] at 00:06 EDT Lou, Thank you for getting vertical justification to work for me. The forced piping was the key that I was leaving out. I put the forced piping at the end of my text and the BLOCK vertical justification works fine. I have noticed that you need to have a forced piping in every frame that needs vertical justification. This is a little clumsy and as far as I can tell requires one to count the number of lines in the text chain in order to place the forced piping commands in the right place to balance the text in each frame. This vertical justification really came in handy for a two column phone list I keep up. As people move in and out it automatically adjusts the line spacing since every line is a paragraph. Also, leading tabs are something I've waited for for a long time. SL is a great program. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 76 Tue Aug 17, 1993 ST.LOU [Lou] at 00:17 EDT Morgan, would you please upload your CALAMUS.SET file to Library 43 so I can check your settings. Someone else reported a problem that needs some investigation. Tom, I will get to the file shortly and let you know. Pat, I grouped two vector graphics and used Toolbox to align this frame with several others. Did you have any trouble optimizing these vector graphics? That could be a clue. Steve, the text style list is in the Text Style module. The changes were made in the Text module. Basically there were 6 command groups instead of 4 with some additional features. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 77 Tue Aug 17, 1993 K.SPRINGER1 [FROZEN NORTH] at 02:34 EDT Lou, File compression- Learned long ago that Calamus didn't like Squish, so don't have any files associated with Calamus compressed except the CDK's. Never had a problem with the data files. No problem with the virtual memory files either, except that when I forget to turn Data Diet off manually, printing time goes way up, since DD is intercepting those files and doing its thing. (Can't wait for the boys in the Fatherland to fix my memory board. Fortunately it is under warranty and will be free. GEM files- I've had the same or similar frame size problems when importing GEM files also. Seeminly I haven't had the best of luck exporting them with Dataformer either. If you are going to include a list of steps or instructions you would like testers to try with a test file, I'm game. Never want to miss a chance to learn something. An SL only partition..... Hmmm, I'll have to think about it. Personnally, I keep all my data files from almost all of my programs in one partition. That way I have only one really important partition to back up regularly. If something happens to the HD, I have all the original disks to reinstall from. All I lose is the custom setups, but no data files. An SL only partition would give me an awful lot of unused space. Still, it is something to mull over. File selector/redraws- Just set my system parameters yesterday to use LGS 1.8D, latest version I believe. It doesn't like to cancel out of the Set System Paths dialog. Can't remember what I did to get out, at the moment, but the Cancel button in the file selector would not get you back to the paths box. It just kept cycling through the selector. I'll do some more playing here if you want, just ask. Ken S. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 78 Tue Aug 17, 1993 D.STMARTIN [Binary Ink] at 07:00 EDT Tom Jr. Interesting problem with automatic crop marks on your double page layout. My guess would be Calamus won't eliminate the crop marks in the center of the page. However, I can provide you with a potential workaround. Check out the "DEADEYE" U2U file. My guess would be that you can create master pages that will provide you with a page minus the center crop marks. The whole mess would be very dependent on proper set-up with the Mount Module (Right pages goe right, Left pages go left) but my guess would be that it would work. Not quite as elegant as automatic elimination of the center crops by Mount, but it would get you what you need. >Dave, thanks for the informative post. Did you see an alert that says >something like "Your partition has been deleted" ? This is a serious problem >and I would suggest that you set up a 4 meg partition for the VM and nothing >else. Do not use VM on a partition with other files until we get an answer. Nope no message. It just chugs along at length and will terminate of it's own accord if left alone (attemtped to write on all VM files?). I should note that this has existed all along. It _only_ occurs when the partition is full. This raises the question of what is the best size for a VM partition. Why the CALAMUS.SET file provided with the July 93 update writes VM to the same partition that it sets the Calamus System files to is beyond me. I guess the question is "Where?". -- Dave @ Binary Ink ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 79 Tue Aug 17, 1993 POTECHIN [Nathan @ DMC] at 08:46 EDT Sean ... Check email. FALCON8.PRG is waiting for you anxiously. Frank ... That is correct. There are no changes to Dataformer at this time. There are some major enhancements coming down the pipes in a new module called Bridge that will replace the Dataformer module and then some. That's great news Morgan. I'd already written to Bob too. ;-) Cliff ... Mail left for you today with those missing pages. Nathan ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 81 Tue Aug 17, 1993 ST.LOU [Lou] at 10:30 EDT Bruce, you are welcome. To comment on your remark... I agree it is a little bit sloppy to use but I found that my own approach to understanding BLOCK vertical justification was wrong. I had thought it would increase line spacing when it only works on paragraph spacing. Given your example of the telephone directory, it makes more sense to me now. Calamus has always given us the ability to adjust line spacing in a text ruler. The BLOCK function simply adds the finishing touch. I just wish you didn't have to use the Force Piping. There should be another way to set this up in the text ruler so that you don't have to insert FP at the end of every frame in a text chain. This is very clumsy if you are editing the text chain at a later date. I have requested a revision of this function. Tom, thanks for uploading your file. Your sample clearly shows two different master pages with different layouts and guidelines. However, when I followed the steps, I get the same layouts and guidelines on every page. I have posted your steps here for others to try and report back: >OK, this is a test file to demonstrate how master pages with >manually placed guidelines do not show up on other pages. > >Here are the steps I followed: > >1. Create new document, and 2 pages. > >2. Create 2 Master Pages, test1 & test2 > >3. Created different column/row guidelines, just to show the >difference to each page. > >4. Placed 2 horizontal and 2 vertical guidelines on test1. > >5. Assign Master Pages > > - test1 to page 1, test2 to page 2. > >6. Switching between these or the master pages do not appear to >show the guidelines of the other page. > Ken, there are two GEM files that I was testing for Jim Renner. I will email them to you and simply ask you to load them and post your report. Please continue your testing on the TOS file selector. One thing I found is that you cannot multiple select fonts, etc. Has anyone else found this? On the VM, the problem seems to occur if your partition is nearly full when VM kicks in. Dave reported that the whole partition is wiped out when VM runs out of space. This is being checked out now. Dave and Tom, I tried a double page layout with page size at 8.5 x 7.0 and there is only one set of crop marks... no crop marks in the middle. Dave, the CALAMUS.SET file sets up VM for your program directory instead of its own partition because each user's system is different. You may want VM on Drive E; I may want it on Drive F. This has to be configured in System Paths after running the program. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 82 Tue Aug 17, 1993 R.VOORNEVELD [BOB] at 16:21 EDT Lou, Ive' noticed the same thing as Pat with regard to TOOLBOX. Try This 1) import a raster graphic. 2) optomize it to print 3) copy the graphic and align it side by side 4) Group the two graphics 5) Draw a raster area box around the grouped graphic 6) Using tool box vertically align them It seems that the frame of the grouped graphic aligns, but the grouped graphic picture moves toward the top of the layout area. When you ungroup the frames the frame border moves up to the graphic. My solution has been to align frame seperatly and the group them. This also happens with vector graphics as Pat mentioned in Message 73 Bob ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 83 Tue Aug 17, 1993 P-DIRECT [Sean@TWP] at 16:56 EDT Nathan: Got FALCON8.PRG, and boy what it does! Quite nice. 256 color screen redraws are a bit on the slow side, but the color proofing ability is extended greatly from the 16 color mode. One other note, is there anyway to pick colors using the Pantone system? Since most of our work is done in spot colors, this would help alot. Sean Dougherty Two Worlds Publishing ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 84 Tue Aug 17, 1993 T.HENRY12 [Tom Jr.] at 19:25 EDT Dave, thanks for the advice and workaround. It's a good idea because I can set up the left pages with crops on one side and vice versa on the right pages. I was trying to save time, however, by utilizing both, but your method seems the shorest way to do what I need. Thanks. Lou, thanks for checking my file. I'm glad I wasn't losing my mind, but will keep checking for what others find. Also, about printing to a double size page, did you use MOUNT to generate the pages? I wouldn't ask, but I'm still waiting to get some answers to being able to print to legal paper on my QMS- 410 in LJII mode, and thought I could check it out by now. Thanks for your and everyone else's help. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 85 Tue Aug 17, 1993 POTECHIN [Nathan @ DMC] at 19:45 EDT No answer yet on legal-size double page printing Tom. I've asked about any progress in this regard and I am now waiting for a eply. Sean ... Included with Calamus SL is the Focoltone module. This is a modern color matching system that, while not as familiar to some as Pantone, does a first class job. If you must have Pantone, there are some files in library 30 that were created by David Simmer D.SIMMER1 that contain Pantone color lists I believe. Nathan ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 86 Tue Aug 17, 1993 C.STEWARD1 at 19:55 EDT Nathan: Thanks very much for your quick prod regarding the problem I was having inserting pairs of quotation marks. This might help others: My inability to use the Alt 171/170 ASCII insert method wasn't rooted in my A [C [C [C folder . I stripped it and the problem remained. What is was -- please correct me if I've got this wrong -- was the PD typeface I was using. It wouldn't give me much more than a 1/2 or a space. Today, I tried a lot of other typefaces and found that a lot of PD faces won't give you proper quotation pairs -- which is a really problem if you try to if you try to use them for text projects. What I also discovered is that Calamus 1.09 faces (Swiss and Times) won't produce the quote marks either -- can this be so? And neither will the Calamus Font Editor fonts such as ARC. Sorry for this messy note. I *must* learn Alladin ... later, -- Cliff ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 87 Tue Aug 17, 1993 DABRUMLEVE [kidprgs] at 20:03 EDT Cliff, you don't need to learn Aladdin in order to have beautiful posts. Just lay off those arrow keys! When you are typing along and make a mistake, use the BACKSPACE key to get you all the way back to the error. (Of course, this only works if the error is on the current line.) GEnie accepts the Backspace key just fine, but arrow keys wind up looking like capital letters out of place. Also, you can compose offline and upload text to the BB with just about any terminal program. I didn't realize this for _years_, but once I did, it really changed my posts! It's much easier than learning to use GEnie's built-in editor. Compose your text in your favorite WP or text editor, save it as ASCII. Then come online and REPly to the desired Topic. Type *UP (even *U will do it in here) and proceed to use whatever text transfer protocol your terminal program offers; you may need to experiment a bit to hit upon the right choice, but it's worth the effort. Also, you can use the *SN command instead of *S to save your text with your formatting preserved. Like this! ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 88 Tue Aug 17, 1993 ST.LOU [Lou] at 22:25 EDT Bob and Pat, I isolated this Toolbox problem down to grouped frames when using Vertical or Horizontal Alignment. Left, Right, Top, Bottom and Concentric all work properly.... which is why I didn't see it the first time. I was using Concentric to check. Thanks for the detailed report. A bug report is on its way to Nathan. Cliff... I completely forgot about that some of those upper ASCII characters are not in many PD fonts. I guess I am spoiled using DMC's great collection of typesetter fonts. Here is a file that will help you locate those ASCII characters: >Number: 26437 Name: FONTPAGE.LZH >Address: ISD Date: 921105 >Approximate # of bytes: 43904 >Number of Accesses: 68 Library: 30 >Description: >This file contains two pages in the style of the Calamus SL >manual. I created this page at the request of several users. >I hope it is of use to all of you, it contains information >as to how Calamus Fonts are positioned in relation to >the Atari Character Set and the Ascii character codes >needed to access these characters in a font set. >The files are in IMG format so you do not need Calamus to view >them. This file is brought to you courtesy of Mario @ DMC >Publishing. > There are also a number of other files that let you load a font and print its full character set. Of course, you can also see all the characters in the Character Set command group of the Text module. Tom, the terminology is a little confusing. I was talking about printing double page layouts (Set Page Format). Were you talking about printing Double Page size (11x17)? Sean, here is the file with 2 Pantone CFT files: >23264 PANTONE1.ARC X D.SIMMER1 Library 30 > Desc: 1st 2 of 4 Pantone palettes with CDK ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 90 Tue Aug 17, 1993 K.SPRINGER1 [FROZEN NORTH] at 23:09 EDT Lou, On Jim Renner's files: When I imported 3_5_disk, and selected opitimize frame, the frame went to almost full page size. dX is 6.69290, dY is10.11810. The proportions are all wrong for 3.5 inch disk. :-) Joystick.GEM dX is 4.24196, dY is 6.69290. I have no idea if this is the correct proportion or not. The date on my import module is 7/12/93. My dimensions are in inches. I also imported a CVG I created in OL3 into a vector frame, and clicked on the optimize button. The dX was 3.10593, dY ws 5.91626. I exported it with DF Vektor as a GEM file, selecting original for the size. I then imported it back into SL and clicked on the optimize frame button, and dX becazme 0.87794, dY 1.67322. Not quite the original size, huh? In addition, lines were thickened horribly, way out of porportion. I know in Easy Draw, there are a limited number of line thicknesses, but I do not know if this is due to the GEM standard, or just a limit imposed by Easy Draw. Interestingly, when I loaded the GEM file into GEM_View, it displayed correctly. The last time I exported the same CVG as a GEM file, it would not import correctly into GEM-View. Unfortunately, I didn't try that file in SL, so I don't know how it would have turned out. I hope this is what you were looking for. Do you suppose it would be too much to ask that SL users be given the fonts that the GEM import module asks for? Mine always says GARA4RE and AGG_7BD fonts can't be found everytime I load a GEM file. At least it seems like every time. TOS file selector, in my case Little Green S., vers. 1.8D. I needed to check the filename for this message, so I went through the normal (co)motion of importing a GEM Metafile. When I clicked on the CANCEL button in LGS, I was returned to the import vector graphic dialog box. A portion of the cancel button in LGS and a portion of the DELETE ALL button in the dialog box overlap in the same spot on the screen. When the mouse cursor is in the overlap zone, the delete all button is activated after clicking on the cancel button in LGS. If the mouse cursor is not in the overlap zone when the LGS cancel button is clicked on, all is okay. Like UIS, LGS can be repositioned on the screen, and after moving LGS to a point where the buttons do not overlap the same screen area, no problem with the cancel button. I did notice that after moving LGS, the screen was not updated, and I thus had two displays of LGS. I think this is LGS's fault, since I have noticed this effect other times when I have moved it to a new location on the screen. When setting system paths, it doesn't matter whether I click on OK or CANCEL, the screen is not updated properly. 95% or so of LGS is left displayed on the screen. If you know where the done button is, you can click on it, and exit back to the current document, with a complete screen update. External modules: If a new module is selected and loaded, and the mouse has been moved to a position on the screen where any external module name in the modules dialog box shows up, the module under the mouse cursor is activated. Hope this helps. Ken S. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 91 Tue Aug 17, 1993 P.MORALES1 [Pat] at 23:11 EDT Lou and Bob, And I think I tried vertical and horizontal alignment and had such a solid problem I didn't even realize anyone would have a problem recreating it. The next time I'll be more explicit. Thanks for the reinforcement, Bob. Pat ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 92 Tue Aug 17, 1993 ST.LOU [Lou] at 23:29 EDT Ken, thanks for the detailed post. I got the same results on those GEM files. Apparently, Jim is getting something different. Now, can I have a copy of that CVG you used to try and duplicate your results? On the GEMCIV.SET file, you can edit all the font names to a font you have. Then Calamus will not prompt you for a substitution. File selector problem sounds similar to what I found with UIS3. Parts of the previous dialog was appearing behind the file selector. Thanks for the detailed post. I will make sure it gets to Nathan. Pat, get used to it. We don't like to give up on any of these problems. :-) ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 93 Tue Aug 17, 1993 J.RENNER1 [Kheldar] at 23:32 EDT Is there anyway for a leader tab to pull the leader character right up close to the word before the tab? Ex. If you have the following; Large Pizza [TAB]$9.95 the output looks like this; Large Pizza .........$9.95 What i want is that space after the "a" and before the "." gone. I know i could kern it over but i would hope there is an easier way. (By the way the new insert manual kerning feature in the text module is great!, so i could live with the tabing as is) I do have to say that i didn't think i would find the leader tab that useful. But i use it quite a bit. The upgrade was worth the money, thanks Nathan. (the speed improvements are incredible!) I tried saving my PKS setup and it gave me some font reference dialog box. Did i do something wrong or what? Kheldar. P.S. Nobody tell Nathan but I found some German still lingering in the program. Try the "insert reference mark" or "set reference mark" in PKS and you get a default name in German. (Neat, I'll learn my grandfathers language yet.) ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 94 Tue Aug 17, 1993 ST.LOU [Lou] at 23:39 EDT Jim, that space is the fault of the kerning for the '.' You could get devious and use a font editor to create another '.' with less kerning and then use the ASCII entry method to insert this new character as the leader tab. The name of the Reference marker can be changed to English and saved in your CALAMUS.SET file. Same with 'Standard Stammeseite'. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 95 Tue Aug 17, 1993 J.RENNER1 [Kheldar] at 23:40 EDT Lou (and Ken), The problem with those file are exactly as you say, all stretched out for a floppy. The joystick should have a short and wide. Thanks for continuing the search... Kheldar. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 96 Wed Aug 18, 1993 T.HENRY12 [Tom Jr.] at 00:16 EDT Lou, sorry for any confusion. My goal is to produce a booklet in magazine format, and utilizing MOUNT to automate the process. To explain: My page size (from Page Setup) would be 8.5"x7". Using MOUNT, I thought I would be able to print two 8.5"x7" pages per 8.5"x14" (legal size) sheet. Of course, going to film would make the actual pages a little larger (for the crop marks). Does that make sense now? Thanks for your help. Lou and Bob, I was also able to recreate the problem with the alignment in Toolbox using the example that Bob posted. Now, a couple things: Nathan, how exactly are you able to use 2 monitors at once? Can you do it without an external module? Someone else asked this also, I'd like to know, too. Thanks. Also, it appears that the skewing problem I was having with the external Clipboard module is gone since the update to SL. However, the areas in the Clipboard area are not shown in color (they are in the Clipboard included with SL) and text blocks in the Clipboard are kinda "squished" vertically. This "squished" problem doesn't seem to happen in monochrome mode, only in my 256 color mode. Note: I have Crazy Dots using 800x600 resolution, and the Turbo 030. Anyone else having this problem? And finally (at least for now), using SL with MultiTOS disables my hotkeys. Is memory an issue here? After running SL (without opening a file) I have about 2 megs ST ram and 91K of TT ram (which should change by the end of the week when I get my extra ram) Anyone else running SL with MultiTOS? Tom ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 97 Wed Aug 18, 1993 S.BLACKBURN [STEVE] at 00:25 EDT CLIFF I have a SM147 and a Moniterm (which has its own card inside the Mega) . I can get the Moniterm to boot and show the page thats in the other monitor but I can't get the mouse to access it. I know it can be done. I saw it done awhile ago at one of the Glendale shows I think. Mario, Nathan, Lou, Can you guys enlighten us about this? Steve ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 98 Wed Aug 18, 1993 D.WALTER7 [Doug Walter] at 00:57 EDT Sean, If you must use Pantone as a spotcolor, there are four related files in the library: Number: 28624 Name: CLR_CONV.LZH Address: D.WALTER7 Date: 930503 Approximate # of bytes: 126848 Number of Accesses: 39 Library: 30 Description: You must have Calamus SL to use this file. This User-to-User archive contains color tables, CFTs, and a tutorial on color format conversion for the DMC family of design and publishing products. This TIPS file is the property of DMC Publishing - All Rights Reserved (c) 1993. USER to USER TIPS Forum is supported by DMC Publishing. For more information see Message 1, Category 16, Topic 7 or download SL_TIPS.TXT in Library 30. Keywords: User to User,Calamus,SL,Outline,OL3,Color,U2U,DMC Publishing,conversions,proces Number: 28625 Name: CLR_TABL.LZH Address: D.WALTER7 Date: 930503 Approximate # of bytes: 79488 Number of Accesses: 53 Library: 30 Description: You must have Calamus SL to use this file. This User-to-User archive contains 168-color & 256-K tables in a larger 'reference' format, along with a corrected 256-gray CFT and table. Color conversion worksheet included. This archive supplements CLR_CONV.LZH. ... ...Keywords: User to User,color,U2U,DMC Publishing,Calamus,,SL,Outline,OL3,grays,tables,TIPS, PANTONE1.CDK by David Simmer is file #23264. The color lists included in this file have been expanded and corrected in the CLR_CONV. package mentioned above, but the text is very helpful. SPOTCOLR.LZH by Stephen Samuels, file #27803. A "must have" for what you are doing. ========== Lou, You _can_ select multiple fonts with UIS3. After selecting a font, UIS will not return to the font selector dialog. Instead, just pick your next font. When finished click OK (in UIS3) and it will dump you back into SL's font selector dialog. Ungainly, but it works for now. I also tested LGFS, and saw the same problems as Ken did. These are basically the same as with UIS3. BTW, UIS3 does not redraw correctly in any module that calls for repeat file operations. Doug7 ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 99 Wed Aug 18, 1993 VORTEXT at 01:00 EDT Just a quick apology and a word of caution. First off, sorry to the folks at DMC. It turns out that the problem I had with SL crashing upon exit was due to my old SET file. The new update didn't like it. I've created a new one from the update and all is well again. So... if you experience some problems after installing your update, look to this for a possible solution. Thank you Nathan and Mario for helping me out in this. The other problems the program was exhibiting seem to have gone away as well. Next question - I have been using the Canon BJ driver from 1.09n as it seems to work the best with my BJ10e. The problem is that I cannot change drivers once the program has loaded. It crashes on demand. If I rename the 130 driver so that it doesn't load on boot-up, I can swap printer drivers till the cows come home, but then I can't install the 130 driver. Anyone have one that works well and knows how to behave itself? Daniel ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 100 Wed Aug 18, 1993 M.SHANNON [Morgan] at 01:40 EDT Lou, As I am still waiting for my upgrade do you still want my current ".SET" file. Please advise Morgan ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 101 Wed Aug 18, 1993 D.STMARTIN [Binary Ink] at 07:16 EDT Lou: Based on my experience and Ken Springer's I'd say the the common element is is CANCELing out of the file selectors. -- Dave @ Binary Ink ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 102 Wed Aug 18, 1993 ST.LOU [Lou] at 10:15 EDT Tom, I understood that part. My confusion occurred during the discussion on crop marks. In the days before MOUNT I used to do a homemade version of mounting pages in magazine format: after setting up the master page and double page layout, place frames on each page. Then pipe your text this way - Page 4, Page 1, Page 2, Page 3. If you need more pages, add 4 to each - Page 8, Page 5, Page 6, Page 7, etc. <----------------------- 14.0" -----------------------> <---------- 7.0 -----------> <--------- 7.0 ----------> ------------------------------------------------------- | | | | | | | This would be | This would be | | | | | Physical page 1 | Physical page 2 | | | | | | | | Text frame 4 | Text frame 1 | | | | | | | | | | | | | ------------------------------------------------------- Of course, your page numbers have to be placed manually on each page instead of using the header/footer style of the master page. Regarding the loss of your macros, are you sure you don't have something in the AUTO folder that is conflicting with this function? Doug, I found that method for multiple selection but it is not a true Shift Click like the rest of the program supports. Strangely, the UIS3 selector supports Shift Click, and so does the Calamus file selector. It is odd that UIS3 in Calamus does not! Morgan, perhaps you should wait until you have your upgrade and then give us a fresh report. Daniel, glad to hear your problem is fixed. Did you also load in the new CKT? It was redone to match new elements in the upgrade. Dave, that could well be so. I also wonder if the speed of the mouse accelerator is a factor. I slowed mine down with some improvements. Steve, Nathan uses the SM124 and a Moniterm. I think there are special drivers. Nathan? ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 103 Wed Aug 18, 1993 R.VOORNEVELD [BOB] at 18:02 EDT I also looked at the .GEM files that J.RENNER1 had a problem with. As Ken reported I found the same results. I E-Mailed my findings back to Lou and he thought that I should report them here. Below is what I reported to Lou >I loaded these files and this is what I found. > >The original files loaded into SL without any problem except that the >size seemed to be distorted (more height than width) > >I also loaded them into a couple of other programs and exported them >into SL as you can see by the CDK (attached), I got various results >depending upon the program. > >I also loaded them into Gem-View and they loaded the best - good >proportions and good rasters. > >As one final test I loaded them into 1.09N. They loaded fine, as good >as GEM-View. > >By looking at the following results it seems to me that GEM is not >very stable and that different programs are looking for different >codes. The programs that I used to test the GEM files where Touchup Imported corectly Avant Vector Did not recognize some line or fills Bob ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 104 Wed Aug 18, 1993 T.HENRY12 [Tom Jr.] at 18:10 EDT HELP! I've been using SL pretty heavily today, and I have crashed at least 30 times in an 8 hour period (no exaggeration). It appears to happen randomly, sometimes with a "FATAL CRASH" error, other times it just bounces to the desktop. I just can't seem to nail a pattern. Some things I tried: Reinstalling the Text module. I was using this pretty heavily today, and thought that might be the culprit. Nope. Using the old Raster Generator module. I read here there might be some problems with it, if I remember correctly. Nope. Tried removing the Color/Greyscale switcher module. Was using greyscale "on the fly" for faster screen updates. Nope. Tried removing the External Clipboard module. I thought it might hog memory when used, but I hadn't used it much today. Nope. I have over 2 megs ST ram and 550K TT ram after loading SL and related installed modules. Checked my System Parameters. ST/TT ram buffers are 256,000, vector buffer 256,000. Also have system set up to save automatically every 15 min. The file I was working on is about 225,000 bytes in length. This is the largest file I've used since the upgrade, smaller ones haven't given me any problems I can recall, and certainly none of this magnitude. It has one Vector Graphic image, one raster image, and several raster area frames, as well as many text frames. Can anyone give me some ideas? I hate having to retype what I just did the last 10 minutes or so. I end up saving every 2-3 minutes, which is a drag. Thanks, Tom ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 105 Wed Aug 18, 1993 T.HENRY12 [Tom Jr.] at 18:29 EDT Lou, thanks again. Yeah, I may end up mounting my pages manually. Oh, well. Also, I don't really have anything that might conflict in my AUTO folder: CDManager (Crazy Dots) FastRama and FRB (Turbo 030 TT ram initialization) Pinhead Maccell3 Speedo GDOS ST Fax Manager DMirror (for Diamond Edge) 2 ACC's: CardFile XControl I've been OK when I don't run MultiTOS. I still think it might be a memory issue, though. Thanks ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 106 Wed Aug 18, 1993 C.STEWARD1 at 19:02 EDT Dorothy -- Thanks for your compassion, but even more for your suggestion that I *not* learn Alladin. As the distance between here and senility closes, I'm eager to find all that I need not master. I'll work on the ASCII upload method (like right here I could insert *u -- at a new line I suppose -- and the file selector appears ... and I upload an ASCII file right into this text? I'll read up, watch my arrow keys, but in the past, I've had trouble with line length -- my problem. I'll try EdHak and see what happens. But this, peeking Sysop, is not a Calamus SL topic per se, so I had better end as I began, with thanks. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 107 Wed Aug 18, 1993 P-DIRECT [Sean@TWP] at 19:04 EDT Doug7, Nathan: Thanks for the help on Pantone. Those files are really nice (I don't have the Spotcolor U2U yet), and even better - really usefull! Our printers will be relieved to hear that we can give them Pantone instead of searching through the books... :) Sean Dougherty Two Worlds Publishing ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 108 Wed Aug 18, 1993 DABRUMLEVE [kidprgs] at 19:11 EDT Cliff, yes, you can begin an ASCII upload at any #> prompt in your message. I've also discovered, over in GEMail, that you can do the same thing there when using option 6 and then typing *UP to upload a prepared text. I really LIKE using GEnie "manually"; there's some real power in it. ;-) OK, now what were we saying about Calamus SL? ;-) ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 109 Wed Aug 18, 1993 P.MORALES1 [Pat] at 21:08 EDT Lou, Now I'm becomina a pain, but... while you're getting changes to the Toolbox, a couple of suggestions would be: 1) The ability to center frames horizontaly and vertically on the page, and 2) When a frame is locked and another frame and it are aligned, the locked frame should remain anchored, forcing the other frame to move relative to it. The locked frame should never move. Thanks, Pat ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 110 Wed Aug 18, 1993 S.BLACKBURN [STEVE] at 21:51 EDT I just received my upgrade today, and I love the leader tabs. They work like a charm. One thing that doesn't seem to work are the key bindings. Some work, some dont. I've loaded a key binding file and the entries are there for the keys that I want to use but only some of them work. Anyone else have this happen. Do I have something set wrong? Lou, There is a dotted line running around the pages (it has rounded corners) and I can't seem to get rid of it. It stays even when I have other master pages loaded. Any ideas? Steve ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 111 Wed Aug 18, 1993 ISD [Mario] at 22:06 EDT Tom, Try eliminating Pinhead and Speedo GDOS, I don't know if they are a problem but try eliminating them and see what happens this also extends to other auto folder programs not necessay to you current worksession. Why are you using DMirror, you surely only need it when working with Edge, or am I mistaken. Steve, the second monitor function currently will only work with the work being done in one monitor and full display in the other. I remember talking to some of the german developers about a virtual workspace system that TMS developed that allowed multiple monitors to act as a single display device, this was even demonstrated at the Dusseldorf show last year, but again nothing more has been heard since on this side of the Atlantic. To all users in the Houston Area and those wishing to travel to the show, I will be going to the show, so come on down I'd like to meet you. I'm looking forward to the show. Mario @ DMC Publishing ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 112 Wed Aug 18, 1993 K.SPRINGER1 [FROZEN NORTH] at 22:15 EDT Lou, Sho' nuff can have a copy of the CVG. Check email. File Selector- I don't have a mouse accelerator installed, so that may be a dead end. Ken S. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 113 Wed Aug 18, 1993 ISD [Mario] at 22:29 EDT Jim, sometimes I forget to handle a question, I did just that with your question on how to bypass the extra space in the leader line you mentioned. This extra space exists because of the space you put in before the [tab]. SL requires that you have a space before any Tab character, if this space is not there then the word before the Tab and the word after will be placed to either side of the Tab position. Before I ramble on for too long here is a solution, (sorry Lou but you were incorrect about the bad space kerning... slap ... now go in the corner ... as you can see I'm rambling again. Back to the solution ... simply kern each line to the left of the leader line. You should place the kerning cursor to the left of the space before the Tab. See below: Word| .......................Tabbed-Word > Joe M << ] at 06:17 EST Message 110, Wed Aug 18, 1993 S.BLACKBURN [STEVE] > One thing that doesn't seem to work are the key bindings. < Are you running any auto program or Accessory that could be catching those keys? CodeKeys maybe? > There is a dotted line running around the pages < Sounds like the printer guidelines. You should be able to turn them off. >> Joe M << ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 122 Thu Aug 19, 1993 ST.LOU [Lou] at 09:34 EDT Tom, looking at your AUTO list I see SpeedoGDOS. I don't usually run with it on but I can tell you that GDOS used to create major problems in the earlier versions of SL! I also don't use Pinhead anymore. I would suggest you lose all these programs for a half hour and see if things improve. Then add them back in one at a time. Any program that modifies RAM access is a candidate. BTW, even XCONTROL used to cause crashes with the BRUSH module and earlier versions! Now it seems to be OK. The other thing I noticed is your high ST Memory settings for only 2 megs of ST RAM. Try setting to 128000 bytes which is generally sufficient. Pat, excellent ideas! I will add them to the list. BTW, if you want to center frames on a page, why not make a temporary page size frame then use the concentric alignment? Steve, the rounded corners are from the Guideline Display group. They show the printable area. I think this is documented in the README. Did you get a README file? If not, there is one in Library 30 called SL_NEW.ARC (#29415). Which keybindings don't work? Are you using the new CALAMUS.CKT that should have come on the upgrade disks? Frank, those guidelines were changed to rounded corners to make it easier when doing double page layouts. Ken, thanks for uploading. I am going to check your file in a few minutes. The GEMCIV.SET translates a number of GDOS fonts to a Calamus equivalent. Since you can add text via Calamus, I would change all of them to something simple like SWISS. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 123 Thu Aug 19, 1993 S.BLACKBURN [STEVE] at 10:18 EDT LOU, I just read the READ.ME file and found what the rounded corners were in the upgrade. It's a nice feature. On mine the left is about .25 and the right is about 1/2 that. This is for an SLM605. Seems kind of strange that the side boarders should be different? Exporting to .CVG is fantastic. Now I can scan a picture Speedline it take it into Outline. I hope Dr. Bob comes through with that .CVG module for IMG CAT... C.STEWARD1 I don't remember the previous messages but had to jump in here and add my two cents worth. If you do ANY amount of traveling through Genie, I would really suggest you take some time to use Aladdin. It's a real godsend when it comes to making Genie EASY. I don' know how much I can help you but you can leave me Email with any questions you might have in getting Aladdin setup, or you can monitor some of the Aladdin topics. You'll love it... Steve ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 124 Thu Aug 19, 1993 ST.LOU [Lou] at 12:36 EDT Hi Steve. Glad to know someone is reading those README's :-) The printable area is a hardware thing... Calamus just identifies it for you in the Guideline Display. The settings on the SLM 804 are similarly incongruent. CVG export driver is available for exactly that purpose for those folks who don't have Dataformer. It was kind of Nathan to push for this driver for NA users. ...far as I know, Dr. Bob is indeed working on a CVG Catalog program. Send him mail and encourage him to hurry up! :-) ALAD_MAN.LZH is an illustrated 12 page Aladdin manual for those who would like to look before downloading the free program. The ALAD_MAN is in 1.09N CDK format. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 125 Thu Aug 19, 1993 P-DIRECT [Sean@TWP] at 18:26 EDT On CVG Export: I really don't know where this should go but... It seems that vector graphics exported to CVG and loaded into Outline Art 3 tend to get "doubled", or more specifically, all the objects are there twice (in the same position) instead of once. On the color list converter: Wow...does this ever come in handy! And on the difference between Outline Art & Calamus fill rasters: It seems that in Outline Art 50% acutally turns out to a perfect grey, but in Calamus is isn't quite perfect (in screen display). Just to ask the question, why? Sean Dougherty Two Worlds Publishing ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 126 Thu Aug 19, 1993 C.STEWARD1 at 18:39 EDT Steve -- I have the Genie disc via Nathan; so I'll do my homework ... right after I ... St-Lou -- Speaking of PD fonts without open&close quotation marks: okay I can understand leavng something out to get us who use them to pay a bit for them. Trouble is, after trying out one on a page of some complexity and *then* discovering the quote mark problem .. well, shame on me. However, what about the likes of ARC from the Calamus Font Editor and SWISS from 1.09 -- I cannot see how it can be justified for them to leave out these essential punctuation marks. Is it really true about them, or more likely have a missed something basic? In a related matter, do you know if DMC is still having its $100. gets you ten professional fonts? If so, how much for 12 or 14, i.e. is it $10 apiece after the first ten? If there is still time, I'm going to put together an order. It may be interesting for those of you with experience using the Compugraphic, et al typefaces to suggest here your favorites for this and for that. It sure would help me. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 127 Thu Aug 19, 1993 T.HENRY12 [Tom Jr.] at 19:38 EDT Mario, Lou, Doug (have I forgotten anyone?), Today I had *no* problems using SL. I did dump PinHead, and DMirror, by still used SpeedoGDOS. I use Atari Works almost religiously, so I'd like to keep it in there. XControl (1.3) was there, too. Lou, I'll lower the Memory Settings as you suggested. I do have 8 megs (4 of each ST/TT), and soon will have 16 megs TT (still waiting). Anyway, dumb question here, cause I kinda think I know the answer, but does MultiTOS modify RAM access also. When I get my extra memory, I'd like to use it so I can run STraight FAX, Atari Works, etc. in the background. Thanks for helping me out everyone! Hope I don't post more "scare" messages before being triple-sure. I don't wish to be known as the geek who cried wolf! ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 128 Thu Aug 19, 1993 C.ALLEN17 [Cliff] at 20:11 EDT Nathan, Just got some facts on the ImagePlus 12 (1200 dpi) that does edge to edge printing on 11Xx17 paper. More on this in the Printer topic. To have MOUNT be able to use this size would be nice. Cliff (Ashevillite) ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 129 Thu Aug 19, 1993 D.SWARTLEY at 20:55 EDT Nathan, Just read your e-mail post to me re. the SL upgrade. Thanks for looking into this for me. I did receive the upgrade yesterday. It was stamped with an 8/11 date by the Post Office. Don't know why it took so long to get here. I'm looking forward to diving into the new upgrade. Thanks again. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 130 Thu Aug 19, 1993 F.LAWRENCE2 [FRANK] at 22:44 EDT Lou, Mmmmmm, why didn't I think of double pages for rounded guidelines, sounds as if it is a productive move. Thanks, Frank ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 131 Fri Aug 20, 1993 G.CORRELL [CAMPER] at 00:57 EDT Hi Nathan, I'am using my upgrade, Thanks Any word on an import driver for RTF files? Marcel and Atari Works both can export in RTF format. I sure could use that DJ550C driver and Falcon program. Greg ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 132 Fri Aug 20, 1993 B.ROBINSON5 [BRIANMATE] at 02:07 EDT Re Print Area Guidelines: In the upgrade with Guidelines and Grids visible, the dotted area with rounded corners shows up at full page with only the rounded corners showing. When I make the grids invisible and leave the Guidelines visible the dotted area has a border of approx. 0.3"-left, 0.25"-top, 0.25"-right and no margin at the bottom. This is different from the Guide I had before the upgrade and the SLM804 will not print to the bottom of the page. Why won't the proper print area show while the Grids are visible and why does the bottom line remain at the bottom of the page? Do I need a new SLM driver for the upgrade or have I configured something wrong? The August Upgrade is certainly a great improvement on an already great program. Love the new Text Module. Brian Robinson ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 133 Fri Aug 20, 1993 D.WALTER7 [Doug Walter] at 02:09 EDT Sean, >It seems that in Outline Art 50% acutally turns out to a perfect >grey, but in Calamus is isn't quite perfect (in screen display). >Just to ask the question, why? Oh, oh, be careful here. The "perfect gray" you are seeing in OL is the "halfway K" @ 50%. On the other hand, halfway in SL is 50.2%. Apples and oranges. I'll bet you are using a color monitor, right? What you are seeing is a dithered simulation of a gray showing a smooth texture @ 50%. Try a mono mode and view at printer 1:1. You will then see the true grays. Why the difference between Calamus and OL3? Calamus SL only creates 255 actual variations of a color. But we also need a "null" color (white) to complete our palette. So, 100% of range (including 0% for white) contains 256 percentages or 'steps' (0 to 255). So, each step = (100 / 255) = .392156 Halfway point in the range is step #128. (128 * 0.392156) = 50.196. Round it off, and you have 50.2% So, there is NO true 50% in SL. Of course, 50.2% is slightly darker than 50%, so you see a few scattered black dots being added to the raster pattern on-screen. OL3, on the other hand assumes 256 steps from the outset. Each step then equals 0.390625 And 128 of those steps = 50.0%. Remember, there is no 50.0% in SL. So import that 50% and SL has to convert it to its native raster format. You get 50.2% You would be hard pressed to see a 0.2% difference when printing, especially at high resolutions. As to why they did it that way... Who knows? The CLR_CONV.CDK has a better explanation of how to deal with this (I hope :-) Doug7 ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 134 Fri Aug 20, 1993 VORTEXT at 02:56 EDT Well. I did it. I've joined the ranks of the HP4 owners. I hope some of you that use this printer will be able to help me get the most of it. I got it with 10 megs so I should have plenty of memory. Now the questions. I've had enough time only to run a couple of quick tests. It takes it 2.5 minutes to print a page. Are you folks getting this same result? Is there anything I should know about that might help speed this up? How do I know if the printer is using it's memory to the fullest capability? SL sends 1 page at a time. With ten megs, shouldn't it handle more? Thanks in advance. BTW - this solves all my troubles with the Canon, so that point is now moot. Daniel - Happy to have an HP Laser - Galant ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 135 Fri Aug 20, 1993 J.MEEHAN3 [>> Joe M << ] at 05:30 EST Message 126, Thu Aug 19, 1993 C.STEWARD1 at 18:39 > In a related matter, do you know if DMC is still having its < > $100. gets you ten professional fonts? If so, how much for 12 < > or 14,... < August 31, 1993. I don't know >> Joe M << ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 136 Fri Aug 20, 1993 ST.LOU [Lou] at 10:19 EDT Cliff, the ARC and SWISS fonts only had the " quote mark. Fonts come in all shapes and sizes from many different foundries. Each one has its own price scale and features. The number of characters and the work done on kerning and kerning pairs can greatly affect the price of a typeface. The font sale goes to the end of the summer. That means you should have two weeks left to put an order together. If you have the font poster, select a few of each type - body text, slab, decorative, script, dingbats. If you don't have the poster, call DMC at 416-479-1880 and ask for Shawn (or leave me your address in email). He can mail you a 2-piece photocopy of the poster (the originals are now collector items). I just spoke with Shawn and he said "the customer can order any number of fonts at 10.00 each so long as there is a minimum of 10 fonts (100.00 dollars)." So, what are you waiting for? :-) Tom, post away. We all learn from each other. Glad your problem is over. Brian, I looked at those guidelines and there is a bottom guideline .16" from the bottom, just as in the older version. However, there is an error in the printable area guideline with GRIDS visible : the print guideline is at the edges of the page suggesting a fully printable page. Of course, a test printing shows this is not true. The same print limits still exist despite the error in the display. I have made an error report. Thanks for bringing it to our attention. Doug, good post. Folks, I recommend you download the COL_CONV tip file that Doug prepared. Daniel, congrats. The HP4 is an incredible printer! Re your question, Calamus 'images' each page individually. With any printer there must be some kind of handshaking that tells the computer that the printer is ready to receive a new page. It is at that point that Calamus would create the next image. I would guess things are done this way in case there is a printer error and the page needs to be re-sent. On the SLM804 the imaging/handshaking is done so fast that it is quite transparent. I am not sure if there is an OUTBURST driver for the HP4. Frank's improvements for the LJ were quite significant. I would hope any efforts for the HP4 would be as successful. You can send email to F.PAWLOWSKI or post in the OUTBURST topic. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 137 Fri Aug 20, 1993 ST.LOU [Lou] at 15:05 EDT Ken, I finally got around to testing the file you emailed to me and found some interesting results. First, a review of your post: >I also imported a CVG I created in OL3 into a vector frame, and >clicked on the optimize button. The dX was 3.10593, dY ws 5.91626. I >exported it with DF Vektor as a GEM file, selecting original for the >size. I then imported it back into SL and clicked on the optimize >frame button, and dX becazme 0.87794, dY 1.67322. Not quite the >original size, huh? In addition, lines were thickened horribly, >way out of porportion. I know in Easy Draw, there are a limited >number of line thicknesses, but I do not know if this is due to the >GEM standard, or just a limit imposed by Easy Draw. > >Interestingly, when I loaded the GEM file into GEM_View, it displayed >correctly. The last time I exported the same CVG as a GEM file, it >would not import correctly into GEM-View. Unfortunately, I didn't try >that file in SL, so I don't know how it would have turned out. > > I exported your CVG in 3 pairs of files: DALT109N.CVG using CAL_CVG.CEV DALT_SL.CVG using CAL_CVG.CEV D_STDFIL.GEM using Dataformer GEM Export D_ALLFIL.GEM using Dataformer GEM Export B_STDFIL.GEM using Bridge GEM Export B_STDFIL.GEM using Bridge GEM Export The Dataformer GEM files optimized at .87 x 1.67 - approx 30% of the original size and the lines were thickened... as you reported. DALT*.CVG files created with the new export driver were exactly the same as the Dataformer GEM files. However, the Bridge GEM files optimized at the same ideal size as the original although the frame contained extra white space to the right and bottom. Also, the lines did _not_ thicken. This leads me to believe that the programmers have identified a problem and corrected it in the new Bridge module. All of the GEM files were imported with the new and improved GEM.CIV. I did not try the older driver. Nor did I try these files in GEMview. However, I have uploaded the 6 graphics to Library 30 as GEM_TEST.LZH for anyone who is interested in seeing the differences and/or doing some more testing. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 138 Fri Aug 20, 1993 P.MORALES1 [Pat] at 21:06 EDT Lou, > to centeframes on a page, why not make a temporary > page size frame then use the concentric alignment? 'Cuz I'm lazy? Thanks, for the support. Pat ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 139 Fri Aug 20, 1993 BHARTSHORNE at 22:12 EDT TO ANYONE USING THE FALCON, OR AT DMC: Is the reason that the statistics option show such a memory loss with the Falcon8.prg due to the memory for display purposes? In other words on the 2 color display I have almost 1.5 megs for cdks but in 256 mode only 900K. Just wondering.... Bill ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 140 Fri Aug 20, 1993 K.SPRINGER1 [FROZEN NORTH] at 22:19 EDT Lou, The GEMCIV.SET file, do the numbers represent GDOS font ID #'s? If so, whose fonts? If a person knew this info, then one could substitute a CFN that more nearly matches what the creator of the graphic intended. Okay, so when should one expect to be able to get the Bridge module? And, of course, why don't they fix Dataformer? Printer guidelines and lasers: The reason the guidelines are not equal on all sides for lasers has to do with the way lasers feed the paper through the machine. I've forgotten where I learned this. Apparently, there are pinch rollers in there somewhere that hold and feed the paper, and obviously getting toner on these rollers would have some negative effects. :-) I have 2 lasers, and 804 and a Fujitsu, an old LJ+ clone. In some cases I like the 804 output, in others the Fuji. The printable area of each printer is not in the same place physically on the page. But fortunately, a printed dot that you place in SL that is, oh, 3" down from the top and 4" in from the left of the paper edge, is printed at that position on the paper regardless printer. So as long as my margins are set to a measurement that covers only the overlapping portions of each printer's printable area, I can use the effect I like the best from each printer by simply running the page through both printers, with appropriate frames invisible. Ken S. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 141 Fri Aug 20, 1993 ST.LOU [Lou] at 22:41 EDT Ken, somewhere there exists a pretty comprehensive list of GDOS font ID numbers. Perhaps Sol Guber or one of the other GDOS wizards can help. However, the GEMCIV.SET file is a listing of the closest matches. What you want is a display of the fonts listed in the SET file! Do you have the poster? Dataformer fixed? That is what Bridge is... an update and upgrade of Dataformer. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 142 Sat Aug 21, 1993 D.HADLAND [STUSER] at 02:57 EDT A freind And I would like to know if you can print white letters over a black background, and have the letters spill over to white and keep a letter white. So far, our results show the letter turning black as it spills over to a white background. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 143 Sat Aug 21, 1993 REALM [Joey] at 06:14 EDT Bill, You can figure out how much memory a resolution needs by taking the: (Horizontal Res * Vertical Res * Bit Planes)/8. That gives the number of bytes. In 256 colors it's... (640x480x8)/8 = 307200 bytes. Mono would be (640*480*1)=38400. As you can see the higher the res and colors the more memory is needed to handle things. Any color screen section SL needs to store is going to take up 8 times the memory as in mono. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 144 Sat Aug 21, 1993 C.ALLEN17 [Cliff] at 09:24 EDT Nathan, Received the update manual pages today. Thank you. Oh well, back to reading the manual. Cliff (Ashevillite) ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 145 Sat Aug 21, 1993 J.MEEHAN3 [>> Joe M << ] at 09:53 EST Message 142, Sat Aug 21, 1993 D.HADLAND [STUSER] > ... can print white letters over a black background, and < > have the letters spill over to white and keep a letter < > white. < Sure. Go to the Frame modular (the arrow) and select the miscellaneous function (the angle thingy). Have fun. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 146 Sat Aug 21, 1993 R.VOORNEVELD [BOB] at 10:14 EDT D.Hadland To keep a letter white go to the text style menu [5.7] and click on the Text attributes comand group [5.7.4]. Now choose white as a color and then change text style. You now hav a white letter. Make sure it is in front of your black background and make sure that the write mode is opaque [5.5.3.1] Bob ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 147 Sat Aug 21, 1993 K.SPRINGER1 [FROZEN NORTH] at 11:37 EDT Lou, Poster? Do you mean the original fonts poster showing all the fonts that Nathan had for sale from the "big guys" in the font business? The one that I guess is now a collector's item? If so, then "Yep!". Ah ha, so we'er going to "Bridge" Dataformer's problems. Good deal! Nathan, Any word on the file extensions for Virtual Memory? It is just curiosity now. I had forgotten the DataDiet.INF file could be customized in an editor to exclude paths. Did it just now while writing this post. :-) RTFM, huh? Ken S. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 148 Sat Aug 21, 1993 M.SHANNON [Morgan] at 19:13 EDT Lou, Seems that the SL upgrade fixed any\all problems with 109N & SL ".CDK" files loading... both applications work fine in DATAlite mode too. RE: Larest PKS .DNL file... do I need it with my new upgrade? Please RSVP ASAP. Thanks Regards Morgan ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 149 Sun Aug 22, 1993 ST.LOU [Lou] at 01:17 EDT Morgan, glad to hear your problems were resolved with the upgrade. The PKS FNL file is the system display font in the editor. I believe you can get along without it but I will test and let you know. (I don't have one in my MODULES folder). ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 150 Sun Aug 22, 1993 D.STMARTIN [Binary Ink] at 08:46 EDT Lou: RE: An OutBurST! HP LJ4 Printer Driver for Calamus SL Yes indeed there is an OutBurST! variation on the existing Calamus SL "Beta" Drivers for the HP LJ4. There were some initial problems with it due to hardware register differences between various versions of TOS, but Frank corrected these quickly. There is some gain in printing speed, but not a tremendous gain. I believe I posted my time trial results in the Calamus Printer Driver topic area. Unfortunately, I have been unable to get the new HP LJ4 driver to function correctly, nor will the .CDD file load into the Printer Driver Generator. Nathan is aware of the problems I've encountered with the new driver and is "discussing" the problem with the folks in Germany. For now, I'll continue to use the OutBurST! variation of the driver. >The Dataformer GEM files optimized at .87 x 1.67 - approx 30% of the original >size and the lines were thickened... as you reported. > >However, the Bridge GEM files optimized at the same ideal size as the original >although the frame contained extra white space to the right and bottom. Also, >the lines did _not_ thicken. > >This leads me to believe that the programmers have identified a problem and >corrected it in the new Bridge module. I can only reiterate what I've been saying all along: DataFormer is a _flawed_ module. Your note suggests the DataFormer programmers and the Bridge programmers are one and the same. Have the DataFormer programmers moved on to Bridge? If so, where does that leave us poor souls that have been _patiently_ waiting for a version of DataFormer that minus the flaws? Something in the back of my mind is telling me that those of us that purchased a "beta" version of DataFormer are about to take it in the shorts. Will we have to pay a hefty premium for Bridge under the guise of "Oh -- it's a _totally_ different module!"? From all appearances, the ISD folks are all using Bridge in lieu of DataFormer. Bridge appeared to be complete when I saw it. How about it guys - - WHAT'S THE STATUS OF THE DATAFORMER/BRIDGE ISSUE? >Dataformer fixed? That is what Bridge is... an update and upgrade of >Dataformer. What does Bridge offer in the from of "upgrade?" A fixed version of DataFormer would also be an "upgrade". -- Dave @ Binary Ink ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 151 Sun Aug 22, 1993 P-DIRECT [Sean@TWP] at 10:19 EDT I suppose this is a stupid question, but... Is there any timeframe when we could expect Bridge to appear as something purchasable? Sean Dougherty Two Worlds Publishing ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 153 Sun Aug 22, 1993 VORTEXT at 12:11 EDT Dave, What problems are you experiencing with the HP4 driver? It seems to work well on my machine. I have also noted a marked improvement in speed now that the driver is installed at boot of SL. Is there some sort of handshake going on when SL starts? It now only takes one minute to print as opposed to the 2 1/2 before. Interesting. Daniel ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 154 Sun Aug 22, 1993 ST.LOU [Lou] at 13:07 EDT Dave, an update of a module generally means some fixes to the existing functions. A bug or two is corrected, cosmetic changes are made, helplines are corrected. An upgrade denotes the addition of features/functions that were not in the original item. BRIDGE is both an update and an upgrade of Dataformer. You see, Dataformer was bundled as two CXM files - one for converting to vector formats, one for raster. Bridge is one CXM with 4 command groups. The first of those four command groups contains all the functions (except PS output) of the original two Dataformer CXM's combined. The second command group is a much improved set of PS functions which include the ability to compress graphics, text, show pages, do multipage, print to serial/parallel/file, etc. The third command group converts raster graphics among different numbers of planes and color depths. The fourth converts frames to vectors. As such, the Dataformer component of Bridge is considered an update because it corrects/improves some of the functions. However, the additional functions of Bridge make it an upgrade of Dataformer. As such it requires proper testing to make sure it works satisfactorily. A sidenote... Dataformer was released as a result of such discussions. It was, IMO, released with the acknowledgment that the PS output was not 100%. Was it 50%? 25%? 10%? It depends on the type of file and its contents. All I can report is that _some_ files did not output perfectly. Obviously, it was the minority. If nothing worked, DF would never have been released. (Bear in mind that most of DF works perfectly!) Now we appear to be at a similar crossroads with Bridge. It is still in beta testing and fixes have been made. I am testing the fourth beta in a few months and the programmer is listening and implementing. The GEM_TEST file that I uploaded was for information purposes and to update users on some improvements. It was not intended to suggest that I have moved on to Bridge and the rest of the users are 'stuck' with Dataformer. As for DMC, they are doing their best to test the PS output as extensively as possible bearing in mind that no software is ever 100% perfect. PS in itself is an imperfect solution as people undoubtedly know from reading the trade magazines. Sean, the 'timeframe' is Nathan's decision. He listens to all the beta reports, gets the fixes made, coordinates other aspects (like documentation) and markets the product when he is satisfied with it. In fact, Nathan would probably prefer that I not discuss unreleased products. However, given the special nature of this product, I thought it was in everyone's interest to be informed lest anyone think the problem has been forgotten. Now I hope that Nathan will not be pressured into releasing this product prematurely. Daniel, very interesting times on your HP4 printing. Could you post the datestamp on the driver you are using? BTW, Mario and Nathan are going to Glendale. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 156 Sun Aug 22, 1993 ISD [Mario] at 20:21 EDT Pat, to centre a frame in the page simply subtract the frame dimensions from the page dimensions and then divide by 2. this will give you the new coordinates for your frames x & y position (relatively that is). I think that is correct I will confirm later... Mario @ DMC Publishing ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 157 Sun Aug 22, 1993 M.SHANNON [Morgan] at 23:39 EDT Lou, I have already done the DNLD (it was small :^)). Thanks tho'. Morgan ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 158 Mon Aug 23, 1993 G.GORMAN2 [Glenn Gorman] at 00:25 EDT > >Bob and Bill ... ARGHH!!! You did not receive the HELPTEXT.CXM because it was >really not there. :-) At least, it wasn't supposed to be there because it >wasn't finished and is missing the finished Help text itself AND it costs >money. So trash that CXM and give me some time and look for it on the next >mailout. > Gee, and I thought that the HELPTEXT.CXM was some type of a joke module. Heck. Click on HELP and it tells you to hit the help key. Now why didn't I think of that. Grin. ---------- Re: New printer drivers. Nathan, does this mean that you have a new SL driver for the Deskjet 500??? If so, I'd like it. The reason being is that I currently use the 1.09N driver. The SL driver will not do envolpes. The 1.09N version will. Glenn... ----------- > >...far as I know, Dr. Bob is indeed working on a CVG Catalog program. Send him >mail and encourage him to hurry up! :-) > Lou, what's Dr. Bob's GEnie address??? I really want this catalog program. Glenn... ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 159 Mon Aug 23, 1993 VORTEXT at 01:57 EDT Lou, I'm using the HPLJ4LET driver dated 12-04-92. So far it works for me. It is interesting that since I saved it with my SET file, the print time has dramatically improved. JKT - REALLY? You'll be in Glendale? Wow. Can't wait. Daniel ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 160 Mon Aug 23, 1993 ST.LOU [Lou] at 09:43 EDT Glenn, Dr. Bob can be reached at W.PARKS3. Daniel, thanks. I am going to try a little experiment with the SLM driver and see if the same thing happens. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 161 Mon Aug 23, 1993 POTECHIN [Nathan @ DMC] at 12:42 EDT Sorry Glenn. I have a new driver for the HP500C and 550C, not the basic 500. Daniel ... Both Mario and I will have the pleasure of attending Glendale this year. We'll be hanging out at either the GEnie booth or the TCN booth and look forward to seeing you. Dr. Bob's CVG catalog should be done by now. I tested a beta some time back and it worked great! Nathan ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 162 Mon Aug 23, 1993 SGUBER at 19:39 EDT Nathan: i just got the upgrade ad nd have a problem with the Compress module. I have loaded and executed it the way it stated in the manual. (What is the difference between OK and Compress) but when I go to save the file, the size is slightly larger than before. I thought that the compression would be in the file. The file is about 100K with 50 picture files in it, all of them imported from compressed .img files. What might I be doing wrong, or does double compression not work. Sol ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 163 Mon Aug 23, 1993 K.SPRINGER1 [FROZEN NORTH] at 22:23 EDT Glenn, Cat 7 topic 5 is for Dr. Bobs MVG program. Topic 13 is for IMG Cat. You might mark those two topics for any news. I have both of them marked, but nothing has been posted there for quite some time. Ken S. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 164 Mon Aug 23, 1993 ISD [Mario] at 22:40 EDT Sol, the double compression is indeed a correct observation, some compression routines actually will cause an enlargement in a file size if that file is already compressed. This also occurs when you compress some graphics outside a document. All I can suggest is that you try the compression module with some 8 and 24-bit files. This is not an error in SL ... simply decompress the file with the module and things should return to normal. I received a file from someone for output that was 2.4 megs after compression, and 8 Megs before. To compress a document click on the OK button. Mario @ DMC Publishing ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 165 Tue Aug 24, 1993 D.STMARTIN [Binary Ink] at 07:44 EDT VORTEXT: My version of the latest HP LJ4 printer driver from ISD goes through what appears to normal page output and then crashes right at the end of the page. A crash dialog comes up telling me that the print functions had bombed. When I reloaded Calamus and output with a different driver, the first page ejected from the LJ4 and was found to have alomost and entire formatted page on it. At that point I surmised that the A4 page length might be the culprit. I have not had the time to play with it and possibly reset the printer to A4 page format. How is your printer configured? My trial run with the driver was brief. I asked Nathan if he'd gotten any other reports of problems. Your message is the only message I've received regarding the driver. I will make another attempt at using it. Regarding your handshake question: There is SOMETHING going on there, but I've not sorted out WHAT. I can tell you that the first time I print (and _only_ the first time) the is a loooonnnnggg delay (5 min. plus in some cases) before the driver starts composing the page. For my past messages, I discern that this delay occurs only on my system. As a result of all this, I suspect that a.) The configuration of your System Parameters has an effect on printing speed, b.) the drivers clear memory prior to proceeding, and, c.) other factors in the system configuration (.ACCs, etc.) impact on printing speed. I've been so busy lately I simply haven't had the time to delve into the mysteries of the delay. Just saw your second note. I'm using the 07-13-93 version of the HP LJ4 driver that Nathan made avaialble. Lou: RE: DataFormer/Bridge Discussion I understand the differences between an update and an upgrade. It was also my understanding that the PS component of DataFormer "wasn't 100%" when the _beta_ version was graciously released to those of us that were screaming for it. I purchased DataFormer with the understanding that there were PS problems but that ISD/CMS were continuing to work on the problem and there would be an updated version made available to those of us that were desperate. That was some time ago. There have been comments that indicate the programmers were unable to pin down the problems in DataFormer PS. Now there's indicators that the same programming team is working on Bridge. Am I to assume that development on DataFormer has ceased? Based on the long delay in fixing the "problem" (AKA "Bug") it would appear that this may have occurred. So where does that leave those of us that stuck our necks out for the _beta_ module? Along the way there have been a number of discoveries in other areas of the DataFormer module. The HPGL output is in the form of points resulting in line segement (B-Spline) drawings rather than Bezier curves. Two things result; large files, and jagged output when the HPGL file is output at enlarged. The fact of the matter is HPGL is typically used by plotters, vinyl cutters, etc. for enlarged format. The point is DataFormer HPGL output falls short of the mark for typical uses of the HPGL file. Working? Yes. The way it needs to? No! There has been much discussion lately about the quality of .GEM output from DataFormer. There are still problems with scaling. Line segments remain a problem here as well from what I've read. In summary, I am disappointed in DataFormer. It falls short of the quality that I've come to expect from ISD. Now it appears that I will be given one option -- upgrade to Bridge, no doubt at a cost. I have corresponded with Nathan via E-Mail regarding the portrayal of DataFormer as a fully functional module. I have expressed my concerns regarding "truth in advertising" and DataFormer. My perception is that there is a "shell game" being played here (this is a working product--Nope, it's not 100%--Well, we just won't mention that in the advertizing!). As a result, my faith in the exemplary ISD customer service ethic has been erroded. So what do I expect? Either a full release (functioning) version of DataFormer or a very liberal upgrade path for those of us that trusted in the fact ISD would follow through on the DataFormer module. Lou, I appreciate your patience in this matter. As you can no doubt tell, my patience has worn thin on the DataFormer issue. This was not written as a "flame" but rather to present one customers' perspective on the issue. -- Dave @ Binary Ink ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 166 Tue Aug 24, 1993 ST.LOU [Lou] at 10:47 EDT Dave, I hear you loud and clear. As always, the customer's points are taken with utmost seriousness. If I posted in a manner that sounded curt, I do apologize. Sometimes I tend to answer a post by providing the info required without paying enough attention to the feelings behind the post. Having said that, I really cannot comment any further on the path to Bridge. That is clearly Nathan's jursidiction. However, I would like to share an honest observation with you.... When I first saw the Bridge beta, I was somewhat surprised at the name change. I wondered, "Why not call it Dataformer, or even Dataformer Plus?" (When the Text module was updated/upgraded, there was no name change.) Now I am left wondering if this name change is part of the problem. Would you feel differently if you were awaiting an updated 'Dataformer' that had some upgraded features? Your opinion on this is quite important to me. I also empathize with your feelings about the released version. However, it was not considered a beta version. DMC has never released a beta version for sale. All software has bugs that are reported and repaired. You have seen two or three versions of Calamus SL that fixed bugs in the program or in modules. There were several other in-between versions you did not see. The same has been true of Dataformer. I can't say why the programmers chose to expand Dataformer instead of creating a second module. However, having seen the new Bridge module, the design concept makes total sense as all the frame output tools are now contained in one very comprehensive module. Let me close with another personal observation. When Nathan announced the contents and price of the SL upgrade there was some concern expressed. So far I have seen and heard only praise for that package. I presume people feel they got good value for their money. I have the same feeling about the Bridge module even though I don't know the price. Other software charge astronomical prices (IMO) for 'maintenance' updates. Nathan gave away two FREE maintenance updates. When he charged for an upgrade, users got new features and modules as well as fixed ones. IMO, I have no doubt that he has his customers' interests in mind at all times. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 167 Tue Aug 24, 1993 T.HENRY12 [Tom Jr.] at 23:32 EDT Hey all, I don't want to try to shoot arrows into the sky, but I've been, bomb, bomb, bombing again when using SL. To review, I was either getting a "Fatal Recovery Error! Calamus will Terminate!" message or a bounce back to the desktop. I immediately turned off every AUTO/ACC I could (sorry, Mario, Crazy Dots needs GDOS to run), and the same problem. I think this time, however I may have a key. I erased and redid my calamus.set file, and everything seems to be OK. I don't really know what may have munged it up, so I guess I'm asking if anyone else had a similar problem. Also, I occasionally get a "Not Enough Memory for GDOS scratch buffer" message as SL loads. It appears to go away if I remove some resident Speedo fonts. My question is, what relationship does GDOS have to SL? PKS-Write perhaps? And if so, how can I utilize it? ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 168 Wed Aug 25, 1993 P.MORALES1 [Pat] at 00:32 EDT > to centre a frame in the page simply ... Thanks, Mario, that's what I have always done. I guess you missed my point about being lazy. And I am smiling, you folks never give up helping, do you? Pat ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 169 Wed Aug 25, 1993 P.MORALES1 [Pat] at 01:16 EDT Like others, I have problems importing GEM (GEM.CIV 7/12/93) images created with EasyDraw, then optimizing them. What I observed was, the optimization 'always' (in my limited sampling) created an 8"x10" frame. I tried several pictures from Migraph's "DrawArt" collection, with the same results. Loading and resaving the pictures with EasyDraw gave the same results. Quite obviously, optimizing to 8"x10" has a tendency to distort the pictures. Okay, fine, give the program what it wants... I reloaded the picture intp EasyDraw, created a transparent/no outline object and resaved the page. Reloading and optimizing resulted in the correct picture, because the new frame was already correctly sized. An added bonus, the Vector Tools/Shrink Frame to Object tool shrinks the frame to the original (minus new transparent object) grouped object size. Yea, it's an extra step. And one could simply type the frame dimensions, if you know them. But this is simply another work-around. Pat ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 170 Wed Aug 25, 1993 P.MORALES1 [Pat] at 01:31 EDT > I reloaded the picture intp EasyDraw, created a transparent/no > outline object and resaved the page. Okay, a problem with this is that EasyDraw will NOT be able to reload the file, at least I got tired of waiting for it to load. So if you do this, save it to a new file... a safe practice anyway. Pat ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 171 Wed Aug 25, 1993 ST.LOU [Lou] at 02:02 EDT Tom, I had the same problem yesterday. My CALAMUS.SET file became corrupted which happens when you keep saving new setups :-) Anyway, I booted with and older SET file and fine-tuned the settings. Everything worked perfectly! ALWAYS keep a backup copy of your SET file! ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 172 Wed Aug 25, 1993 POTECHIN [Nathan @ DMC] at 08:42 EDT Perhaps Doug can share his configuration with you Tom. He also has a CD card. I will guess that all you really need is ONE of the Speedo fonts. Get rid of the rest and get back the memory. Nathan ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 173 Wed Aug 25, 1993 T.HENRY12 [Tom Jr.] at 19:16 EDT Lou, thanks, I will backup the .SET file from now on. I guess I should have realized to do it because SL is highly configurable, and when you've spent good time getting it optimized, then *BOOM*! You have to try to remember what you've done previously. Thanks :-) Nathan, good idea. I guess I like to use everything I can, maybe not always a good practice. Doug, what is your configuration as per Nathans' post (#172)? ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 174 Thu Aug 26, 1993 S.BLACKBURN [STEVE] at 00:49 EDT Daniel (Vortex) I'll be there all three days (yes, even the setup day). I'll be one of the volunteers helping with the show. You can find me near the entrance at the information desk. Drop by and say Hi... Bring some of your stuff (printed materials :-) and we'll swap ideas and such. Steve Blackburn P.S. This goes for anyone that will be there, drop by and let me know you're on Genie. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 175 Thu Aug 26, 1993 D.STMARTIN [Binary Ink] at 07:26 EDT Lou: RE: DataFormer/Bridge No need for an appology, you did _not_ sound curt. However the whole DataFormer thing has become a burr under my saddle. As far as I'm concerned ISD could call the thing the "Mario Module" and I could care less. The thing that I find distressing is that we were promised a functioning PS output feature. Have we seen it yet? Not to my knowledge. Unfortunately, someone got the cart before the horse and development continued in other areas before the bugs were worked out of what they already had. The fact is I _did_ recieve a DataFormer module marked "Beta." The fact is I trusted ISD enough to follow through with a release of DataFormer that had PS functions that worked 100% of the time. To date this hasn't happened. I concur that Nathan has been exceptionally generous in his upgrade policies with Calamus SL. In fact, I've E-Mail a letter a month ago stating just that. However, the same in _not_ true of DataFormer. All I want is for ISD to follow through on their promises. My gut feel is that someone has given up on the PS functions in DataFormer and it has been thrown on the scrap heap in lieu of Bridge. Okay, so you munged the DataFormer PS functions not to mention some of the other shortcomings noted previously. Now you're unable to deliver on promises previously made and it appears their being swept under the carpet under the guise of "it's a new module." Sorry, it doesn't wash with me. Not knowing the "upgrade" price of DataFormer to Bridge I can not comment on the value. I believe there should be some form of compensation to user that did not receive a module containing the functions that were promised. I'm real sorry that someone skipped a step in the programming sequence here, but it's simply not my fault. Until an upgrade price is released and I'm fully aware of the all the features of Bridge I really can't say whether or not there has been an equittable bargain made. Needless to say I'm more cautious then I have been in the past. One last question: Are the PostScript functions in Bridge working at 100%? -- Dave @ Binary Ink ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 176 Thu Aug 26, 1993 POTECHIN [Nathan @ DMC] at 08:57 EDT Dave ... I will not offer you Bridge until the PostScript functions work 100%. Meanwhile, Dataformer is not simply a PS output device. It is much more and Bridge is much more again. I understand and appreciate your concern about PS but I do not agree that PS is the center of the known universe. I will certainly take your comments into consideration when I determine the price for Bridge but I will not discount the tremendous efforts done by the Bridge programmer who has added quite a few excellent and valuable features. You will have to make your own personal decision as to whether or not Bridge will give you value for your dollar. I am certain that I will do my best to insure that excellent value is offered. Nathan ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 177 Thu Aug 26, 1993 JOHN.KING.T [JOHN KING T] at 17:22 EDT Daniel, Steve will be one of the two guys with wireless headsets on. Look for the one without the beard. :~} JKT ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 178 Thu Aug 26, 1993 J.ARMSTRON20 [James] at 18:41 EDT Does anyone have a CK4 file for the DeskJet500C? If you do, could you please upload it? Has anyone posted the best settings for color work on the DeskJet500C? ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 179 Thu Aug 26, 1993 D.WALTER7 [Doug Walter] at 19:02 EDT Tom, Repeat your question to me, if you will. Sorry, I have forgotten what you were trying to do. Slap :-) If we're still on the Speedo/ memory issue, my 4/16 meg TT gave me a different version of the "out of memory message" when trying to print with Speedo (60 fonts), Calamus SL (w/ SLM driver), and the Diablo driver loaded. Shoot, I don't remember what I was trying to do. My understanding of Speedo is that fonts are supposed to use little memory until called up. I normally run SL under Speedo anyway, so the Diablo driver must be the culprit on my machine. I rarely load or use it. Hmm, I'll have to check this further... Tom, did you say over in the CD topic that you were using XBOOT to shift configurations? (I don't care what you say Lou, my memory is SHOT!) Doug7 ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 180 Thu Aug 26, 1993 POTECHIN [Nathan @ DMC] at 19:56 EDT Did I understand correctly that although GDOS has to be installed to run the Crazy Dots cards, it is not necessary for a single Speedo font to be present? ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 181 Thu Aug 26, 1993 T.HENRY12 [Tom Jr.] at 23:22 EDT Doug, Gee, I'm not sure I remember. I think what I was doing was running SL, and during that would get a message to the effect of "not enough scratch buffer memory for GDOS". Of course, I dumped a few Speedo fonts, and the problem went away. I guess my question was, what relationship does SL have with GDOS? Is it in PKS Write or what? And if so, how can I utilize it? Also, no, I don't have X-Boot, but I did mention a problem getting the 16 color driver to work properly with my system in the CD area. Lest I digress, Jim Allen helped me out, and I can give details over there if you wish. Nathan, YES! GDOS has to be installed to use Crazy Dots (and always before CDMANAGER.PRG) Any one of them (GDOS, FONTGDOS, AMCGDOS, SPEEDOGDOS) I guess the GDOS' must be crazy. Man, did I type that!? ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 182 Fri Aug 27, 1993 ST.LOU [Lou] at 00:03 EDT Just in case some SL users don't read the USER to USER topic (#7 in this category), there is an important announcement about Doug Walter's new Raster Generator tutorial in message 170. >Category 16, Topic 7 >Message 170 Thu Aug 26, 1993 > > RG_U2U_1.ZIP #29815 * > RG_U2U_2.ZIP #29814 RASM_LDW.LZH #29812 > RG_U2U_3.ZIP #29813 > > Please read the message for a lot of important information about these files. Well done, Doug. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 183 Fri Aug 27, 1993 D.WALTER7 [Doug Walter] at 00:24 EDT People, The RASTER GENERATOR U2U Tutorial has _finally_ been been finished and has just been released into library 30. Please see anouncement in Topic 7 for further descriptions :-) Tom, Ok, now I remember. I'm also running SpeedoGDOS on my Mega ST4, and it runs fine with SL. I don't have a printer hooked up though. Have you tried changing your font buffer in Speedo? I wonder if you are coming up short. I remember the discussion about the 16 color driver. You might want to try XBOOT. The configuring for resolution changes is great. I use the built in macros to automatically load the correct CALAMUS.SET and PKS.SET files for whatever res/bitplane mode I'm running in. Great time saver. Doug7 ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 184 Fri Aug 27, 1993 POTECHIN [Nathan @ DMC] at 08:08 EDT The standalone version of PKS Write, never released in North America, could use GDOS fonts. No way you want to use GDOS fonts with Calamus! :-) Nathan ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 185 Fri Aug 27, 1993 T.HENRY12 [Tom Jr.] at 19:43 EDT Doug, Well, that's a cool idea. XBOOT for various setups. We'll have to talk. I run CDMANAGER last because it won't run anywhere else, there seems to be very few programs that it likes to be in front of, and if XBoot is one of them, the only option I see is running on 2 monitors when booting. About the 16 color driver. It simply won't work in either TOS 2.06 or in 68030 mode, according to Jim Allen. Haven't tried it in 68000 yet, but I think it works. Acording to Jim, the CD board addresses are not cacheable by the 68030 chip and some other thing about I/O addresses being byte wide but pretending to be word wide. When this method is used as a speedup trick, the CD's ET4000 chip gets pretty uptight. Maybe it will be fixed somehow, but who knows. About SPEEDOGDOS. Like I said, I just dumped a few fonts, and everything worked OK. Of course, increasing a few buffers helps, too, but I'd rather keep the memory for SL (right, Nathan?!) So, I'm OK with that. Now that I know PKS Write used GDOS fonts in its seperate release (thanks, Nathan), could that bit of programming be either removed or modified? I mean, who needs GODS in SL anyway? Thanks, Tom ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 186 Fri Aug 27, 1993 ST.LOU [Lou] at 20:53 EDT Tom and Doug, the idea for multiple bootup configs was suggested by Stephen Samuels a while back and was immediately forwarded for consideration. So far we haven't seen that function (although we finally got a document list!) ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 187 Sat Aug 28, 1993 S.BLACKBURN [STEVE] at 00:01 EDT T.HENRY12 I had a similar problem awhile ago. SL would crash and I just couldn't get anything done. Like you, I went back to the original .SET file and everything was back to normal. The same thing happend with the speedline module. I had to delete the current program file and replace it with the file that was on the disk. Somehow things get munged at times and more often than not you don't know why. Steve P.S. Just read Lou's post about the .SET file getting munged when you continually save them. Guess I better get into the habbit of backing up the different configuration files in SL. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 188 Sat Aug 28, 1993 D.WALTER7 [Doug Walter] at 00:26 EDT Tom Another good boot program is Deskmanager, shareware from Charles Johnson, here in the library. We probably should move this over to the Xboot or CD topic :-) In the meantime, I use 1 monitor, a NEC 4fg 15" and a VGA switchbox to jump between Atari video and Cdots. Once I'm through with the bootup screen, I just switch to CD mode. Since XBoot and DeskManager remember the last rez and setup used, I rarely even switch to Atari video. For SL, this is great, as I usually work in 800 or 1024 mono modes. Otherwise, I have at least a dozen custom "sets" to choose from. Doug7 ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 189 Sat Aug 28, 1993 ST.LOU [Lou] at 01:26 EDT Doug, how about a short USER file on using these different bootup programs? ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 190 Sat Aug 28, 1993 D.WALTER7 [Doug Walter] at 14:12 EDT Lou, I'm not sure I know _how_ to write a "short" U2U file ;-) But, I'll see what I can do. :-) Doug7 ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 191 Sun Aug 29, 1993 D.STMARTIN [Binary Ink] at 09:33 EDT A Parting Shot in the DataFormer Discussion: A recent post here stated that "PostScript is not the center of the Universe." This appears to be the ISD position. While I agree that some of the Calamus solutions are more elegant and certainly less error-prone than PostScript, the fact remains that for the rest of the world PostScript has become a standard. So why all the fuss about DataFormer? Let me put it in perspective. Mr. Big Account comes my direction. We talk. No problem... can do easy! Mr. Big Account's parting comment -- "Oh yes, we'll also need you to provide the finished files in PostScript format." . This is a true story. The question: Would _you_ rely on the fact that DataFormer will perform in this scenerio? The problem is clear. For a fleeting moment PostScript has become the center of the universe. -- Dave @ Binary Ink ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 192 Sun Aug 29, 1993 ST.LOU [Lou] at 11:52 EDT Dave, I agree with your last point. No one likes to lose sales. I just re-read your comment about having a 'beta' copy. I think this is part of the reason for your disappointment. The only version of DF I have where the word 'beta' appears is one that I received after the release version. It sounds like you did get a beta version by mistake. What is the date stamp on that copy, please? Does it appear on both modules? ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 193 Mon Aug 30, 1993 D.GORDON2 [DENNIS] at 01:05 EDT Lou: you mentioned a while back that vertical justification is fully implemented in the 8/92 version. Well I've tried every which way to activate the block functions, but still can only get the copy to top, center or bottom align in a frame. Has anybody had success in getting a text frame to justify the full height of the frame? ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 194 Mon Aug 30, 1993 D.GORDON2 [DENNIS] at 01:18 EDT Oh forget that Lou...that message was written over a month ago and sometimes mysteriously pops up when I run Aladdin. I'll delete it... Never mind..... ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 195 Mon Aug 30, 1993 T.HENRY12 [Tom Jr.] at 21:19 EDT To anyone: I've noticed something. I was trying out the new cache functions from the Miscellaneous Settings Section, set at 50% for Vector, Grayscale, and Text frames. Well, I observed that white text disappears at smaller zoom levels (full page), but shows correctly at 1:1 zoom. Any one else experience this? I also imported a .CVG with a 50% gray color but transparent background. I superimposed this on a text frame, and on screen the .CVG picture was on top of the text frame. But when I printed it out, the .CVG was behind the text frame on the printout. Some fooling around with send to front/back and transparent/opaque/inverse functions allowed it to print correctly. I'd like to know what else I could try to verify a screen display problem, so I'm open to suggestion. A point to be made here is that I feel it's crucial to have WSIWYG display when doing a layout, so as to eliminate guessing where an item is layered or how it's going to show up on paper. Also, is there any way to screen a bit-mapped image in SL? If not, Nathan, should I wait for Cranach (I assume it does this at some level)? Thanks, Tom P.S. I would also like to thank Doug Walter for the *excellent* U2U file on the Raster Generator. Haven't finished it yet, but what I read so far has been more than just informative, but revelatory in showing the power of this small module. Thanks also for the dummy Lino printer driver file. This will help to check out pre-film output on screen. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 196 Tue Aug 31, 1993 D.WALTER7 [Doug Walter] at 00:48 EDT Tom, Thanks for the kudos :-) The Ultre 'dummy' printer driver _is_ an excellent tool to have. It's great for WYSIWYG pre-press work on everything from HP's LJ4 to the Linotype-Hell and Ultre imagesetters. BTW, DMC also has other drivers for the few odd resolutions not covered by the Ultre system. I received Email asking me if the RasGen tutorial had any relevance to "us lowly 300 dpi laser users..." Oh oh, I guess I didn't make this clear enough. Yes, yes, yes! In fact most examples use 300 dpi to make experimentation easier. The rules governing the module's logic are consistant across all resolutions and screen frequencies. All you need to understand are 3 simple rules. ;-) Re: Caches. Tom, on my TT with _raster_ caches turned on, any text over a raster frame disappears at printer 1:1, and reappears at full page. Doug7 ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 197 Tue Aug 31, 1993 S.BLACKBURN [STEVE] at 10:07 EDT Nathan, A long time ago I remembered seeing someone use two monitors with Calamus. I thought that was so hot. Now I have my Moniterm back I thought I'd give it a try. With 1.09n I was able to get the second monitor to fire up, but you can't take the mouse over there and make any changes. You have to make the changes on the other monitor and hit the "second monitor" icon. Then the big screen redraws with the new image. Almost there... In SL, I get an error message that tells me the module is not loaded. I've never heard of this module, is it out there somewhere? I know it works, I saw it with my own eyes...but how? It would be a lot easier to have the icons and menu bar on the SM147 and work on the full page monitor for manipulating the page. For one thing the icons are bigger. Also... I've come accross something strange. I've created a CKT file (Key Bindings) and the word "Cancel" has disapeared from the box at the lower right that sends you back into your document. It's there for some of the other CKT files that I use however. Everything works fine, its just a little weird thing... Amazing stuff homer.... ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 198 Tue Aug 31, 1993 C.ONGSTAD [CDO] at 18:05 EDT Nathan, The system parameters module was already set for the numbers you gave me. SL is painfully s-l-o-w on the ST, especially in text and graphic redraws. 1.09N was much faster. Has the code been optimized in the update? Question #2-> Wanted to print out the guidelines as well as the text for a document with SL- couldn't do it. Is there a trick to include these in the printing of the document? Thanks much, Chris ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 199 Tue Aug 31, 1993 ST.LOU [Lou] at 19:36 EDT Steve, is it the COL_GREY.CXM that you need to load? I don't know either but Nate has your config on his desk and I think it works. Chris, the upgrade was further optimized but it will be slow on any 8 mhz computer. Do you have any caches turned on? This will slow the redraw if you are constantly changing display sizes. Another suggestion is to make some of the the frames invisible until you need them. For example, most of the redrawing occurs when you are editing or styling text. Why not have _only_ text frames visible until you are finished this part of your work? Turn everything else off. If you are using some master page elements for headers and footers or design purposes, make them invisible. Each thing you turn off makes the redraw that much faster. Solution #2 - get a Fast Tech accelerator. The Tiny Turbo is going for 600.00 and brings you up to TT speed. You will cry tears of joy if you see one working. :-) ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 200 Tue Aug 31, 1993 K.SPRINGER1 [FROZEN NORTH] at 22:08 EDT About Doug's Raster Generator U2U, I haven't seen the finished version, but unless he deleted it you'll find my name listed as one of the beta testers. I have 2 300 dpi lasers, and you would not believe how much I learned, not only about the Raster Generator module and SL, but the abilities of lasers in general. I basically new nothing about rasters, lpcms, biases, etc., and I can honestly say that I learned a lot helping Doug with the project. Doug and I had quite a few email discussions about the module and lasers. I definitely came away better off. Any one who dnloads the generator U2U would be well advised to get the Rast-a- Matic file also. Wonderful tool for determining the true number of grey scales you can have for different raster settings. Right now I am making myself a custom CDK of different grey scales with different generator settings. I will then print it on both lasers. Then I will have a visual reference of what I can expect from the lasers for the settings I choose. And I can guarantee you no 2 lasers seem to be equal. I have an 804 and an old Fujitsu RX7100, an HP LJ+ clone. It is amazing the difference between the outputs. I'm not saying one is better than the other (as long as you don't count speed ), they are just different. I've even printed some stuff using both printers, by turning of the appropriate frames when doing the printing. This has been a long winded way of saying: If you have a laser, you need this U2U! Ken S. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 201 Tue Aug 31, 1993 J.RENNER1 [Kheldar] at 22:13 EDT Before i do any bashing i'd like someone (hint! hint! Lou!) to try something for me. Create a new doc. set up create a raster area that covers the entire page (8.5 x 11) except for a 1/2 inch border. Then print this out on an HP Laserjet or compatible (i'm using Panasonic). You will notice that the top, left and right margins are correct. the bottom margin will be off by 1/16 of an inch. this is because SL stretches the page. It has been this way since 1.09 (which was off by 1/8 of an inch). I just figure that if the left/right margins are correct, why can does SL stretch the top/bottom area? My other problem is with the upgrade. Why can't i save my PKS settings. I get some strange dialog box when i use [CL][Z]. Help?! Jim. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 202 Tue Aug 31, 1993 T.HENRY12 [Tom Jr.] at 23:16 EDT Doug, Thanks for the reply. You know, that white text was on top of a raster frame (but I guess you already figured that out). However, like I said, my results are exactly opposite from yours. At 1:1, it shows the white text, at full page, no. Boy, that's weird. Tom ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 203 Wed Sep 01, 1993 ST.LOU [Lou] at 00:07 EDT Hi Jim. Don't bash me, please :-) I am sorry I can't try that test for you. I don't have an LJ. Maybe Joe Meehan? Did you always have this problem? I wonder if it is paper transport- related? I ask because SL images from the top left. Any 'stretching' would have to be towards the bottom right... but it shouldn't be done by the imaging process. I save PKS setting with Control Shift Z. You must have Mike Valent's PKSWRITE.MAC file loaded. It is the one with 3922 bytes. It may not have been shipped with the upgrade. Get it from the last upgrade or I can email it to you. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 204 Wed Sep 01, 1993 J.RENNER1 [Kheldar] at 01:36 EDT Lou, I don't have that MACro file. Mine is dated 1992. I checked my update disks and it wasn't on them. could you Email me the appropriate files. Others, Anyone who has a working laserjet driver, can you try the example in my previous post. The 1/2 inch border around a raster area. then measure the printout. You will notice that the bottom margin is long by about 1/16 of an inch. This is really anoying when you need precision, like labels and forms. Thanks for checking in advance. Jim. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 205 Wed Sep 01, 1993 J.MEEHAN3 [>> Joe M << ] at 05:57 EDT Message 201-204, Wed Sep 01, 1993 J.RENNER1 [Kheldar] > Before i do any bashing i'd like someone (hint! hint! Lou!) < > to try something for me. < > Maybe Joe Meehan? < > Anyone who has a working laserjet driver, can you try the < > example < Will do. >> Joe M << ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 206 Wed Sep 01, 1993 POTECHIN [Nathan @ DMC] at 09:20 EDT The missing PKS files are in our library 30. Any of you that did not receive them, please download them from there. Thanks. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 207 Wed Sep 01, 1993 S.KALEITA [SAK] at 20:18 EDT Nathan, I've been working on at T-Shirt design in SL that included an B&W IMG a CVG and a GIF. I was attempting add some vector masks to make opaque certain areas of the IMG. In order for me to do this accuratly I applied one of Marios CK3's to the IMG to change its color to magenta,( for easier viewing & editing of the vector mask). Afterwords I would change the color back to black and then print the CDK. I kept getting the error message...NOT ENOUGH MEMORY FOR THIS OPERATION. Well after trying all kinds of things like striping down the system to minimum, I learned that my CDK would not print (and the error message would appear), only if I applied the CK3 to the IMG and back again. If I just left the IMG alone the CDK would print fine with a fully loaded system. I find that Marios CK3's can be very useful for editing purposes, however this memory thing kinda screws things up. I can't recall if I had this problem with the previous of SL, However I have used this technique before with success (I think..it's been a while). Also... just a suggestion for an added feature in SL and OL3... Sometimes I find that it would be nice if the grid and guide lines could be set to different colors. I realize how easy it is to turn them on and off, but when constantly changing zoom levels to see the grid because the black grid conflicts with the images at lower zoom levels, having the grid color set to say red or magenta would make it much easier to see and easier on the eyes. With all the image pasting I do in SL,I use the grid and guide line systems as visual layout and measuring aids more they for snaping to. SAK ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 208 Wed Sep 01, 1993 ST.LOU [Lou] at 21:09 EDT Jim, the Valent version of the PKSWRITE.MAC file is dated 11.29.92 and is 3922 bytes. I will email one to you. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 209 Wed Sep 01, 1993 D.STMARTIN [Binary Ink] at 22:02 EDT Lou: Sometime back we were discussing method to achieve full bleeds (to the page edge) using Calamus and I spoke of a method for scaling things to allow it. I've just discovered a slightly different means that's more elegant and faster. In the page module simply set your page size to something greater than 8.5" x 11" (I use 10.5" x 13") and the layout area to 8.5" x 11". Do the layout as you normally would, and place crop/bleed/registration marks at teh corners. Next go in the printer functions and set scaling for 80% or so. Now in the frame module create a tiling frame. You'll not that the size of the frame is altered by the % scaling in the printer dialog. Position the tiling frame to encompass the entire layout area. Go to the print dialog and turn the "Selected option for tiling ON and away you go. I have tried using the built in crop & registration marks, but I've only met with partial success. If the built in layout marks would work this really would be a slick way to do full bleeds. I'm continuing to experiment, and considering a U2U on the topic (thanks for the inspiration Doug! ). -- Dave @ Binary Ink ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 210 Wed Sep 01, 1993 ST.LOU [Lou] at 22:43 EDT Doug, sounds intriguing. Yes, a definited USER to USER project is possible. Please continue. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 211 Wed Sep 01, 1993 ISD [Mario] at 23:24 EDT SAK ... You can set up coloured guidelines within SL, but to do this you need the Toolbox module. How you do it, is you take a number of line frames and position them where the guidelines are positioned, you then colour the guideline according to your preferences, and activate the toolbox module. after selecting all the coloured guideline frames you then turn them into non printing frame (one of the options in the toolbox module). Hope this helps ... Mario @ DMC Publishing ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 212 Thu Sep 02, 1993 M.SHANNON [Morgan] at 00:30 EDT Lou, I load a file called ESSAYFRM.CDK (48532k) about 100 blank pages with text boxes on them. When I want to import an 81 page WordPERFECT file (223478k) I don't have enough memory (I have 4MBytes on my 1040ST) althought my settings are the recommended 128000 bytes in both spots. Have you any insights here. Please advise. Thanks Morgan ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 213 Thu Sep 02, 1993 D.WALTER7 [Doug Walter] at 00:38 EDT Lou, I think you meant "Dave", right? "Dave", I'd, like to see a U2U on your bleed and cropmark methods. "Doug" ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 214 Thu Sep 02, 1993 J.RENNER1 [Kheldar] at 01:03 EDT Lou, thanks for the file. I put it in my modules folder, but i kept getting that silly font dialog. So i checked the keybindings and the PKS save is in the keybindings and i was using the old bindings file. Duh! So i loaded the new bindings and everything is peachy. My question now is how do you get the arrows to respond. They are set up for "snap to" functions but unless i add a shift, control, or alt to the bindings they don't work. What gives? Is anyone out there working on making a bindings file that is compatible with the great template we got a while back? Jim. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 215 Thu Sep 02, 1993 S.SAMUELS [ORCA] at 01:35 EDT Orca has returned from his 'serial' vacations! I take interest in the "Postscript not being the center of the known Universe" comment. (Give me a break, NP!) Maybe in Germany SL output is the defacto standard for lino output ...maybe we should all move to Germany and live unhappily ever after ...maybe not, eh? %^) Meanwhile, back in North America, the Mutherland, Postscript is not just the 'center' but is in fact the Universe itself!!! This is fairly simple to discern. Just count up the the number of service bureaus in North America that handle PS files and compare that with the number that handle Calamus files. (You will come out with something like 3 for Calamus and 3 Zillion for PS) If that's not enough for you, go to any major DTP show (Seybold for example) and see how often you find "Calamus or Calamus compatible" file handling mentioned. (Like, zero!) On the other hand, Postscript is so common as to be the -expected- method of file production. I have to agree with Dave @ Binary Ink on this. Further, Postscript output is a serious need for us SL'ers to enter into the swelling ranks of the rest of the DTP world. We have been toooooo long without it, albeit for DMC's 'better' way of doing things. We need it for reasons of meeting our clients requirements, as Dave pointed out, -and- we need it to provide freedom of access to the many, many service bureaus that offer PS/lino output. If I had PS output from SL then I could get output done in my home town at a bureau about 5 minutes from here rather than sending my files to Canada and/or to San Francisco. Nuff said. Mario and Nathan, on the 'space' between the 'word' and the start of the leader dots. This seems to me like somewhat of nasty situation. Mario's suggestion of having to kern each instance of that is less than delightful when considering something like a long list (table of contents for example). I would think that since Leader tabs are a special instance of tabs that DMC Germany might be able create a more 'perfect' method of handling the space ...that is of removing the space. When I get some free time, I will see what happens with making a 'special' space character for this situation. That is a space character with very narrow Em width and see what happens if I use a 'hard space' in all the other parts of the text. ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 216 Thu Sep 02, 1993 F.LAWRENCE2 [FRANK] at 03:28 EDT Some thoughts on Postscript, As a Postscript printer user with a little experience with it, I wonder if the Calamus SL would be that compatable with Postscript. I have 10 meg in my Postscript ptr and even with that I sometimes run across a job that will not print out in Postscript due to multi-layering (a new word?). This is of course graphic intensive. I'm thinking that they may be very cautious as Calamus SL could be very layer intensive - Any one out there agree. Frank ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 217 Thu Sep 02, 1993 J.MEEHAN3 [>> Joe M << ] at 05:41 EDT Kheldar, I did the test you suggested and I had identical top and bottom margins. I did notice about 1/16th inch off side to side, but that was because my paper guide had sifted; a quick adjustment there fixed that. I might add that I have Outburst in use and I am using their driver; however, I don't believe it was making any difference. I remember doing a like test a while back when working or rasters for the DeskJet/LaserJet and I had no problems with the LaserJet. If you would like I can do a test with the original driver. >> Joe M << ------------ Category 16, Topic 20 Message 218 Thu Sep 02, 1993 ST.LOU [Lou] at 09:55 EDT Morgan, I hate to suggest using Virtual Memory but this might be such a case. Have you tried that yet? Doug, I did mean Dave. Must be the medication :-) Jim, happy to hear of your success. Now, which arrows and key bindings are you referring to? The cursor arrows? ------------