Date: Tue, 27 Oct 92 05:00:07 From: Space Digest maintainer Reply-To: Space-request@isu.isunet.edu Subject: Space Digest V15 #346 To: Space Digest Readers Precedence: bulk Space Digest Tue, 27 Oct 92 Volume 15 : Issue 346 Today's Topics: Comet Collision (7 msgs) Dan Quayle on Mars electromagnetic heating Gif Pictures nasa shake up rumor? Smith-Tuttle Comet a threat to earth? (4 msgs) Space Domination Initiative Voyager Family Portrait Welcome to the Space Digest!! Please send your messages to "space@isu.isunet.edu", and (un)subscription requests of the form "Subscribe Space " to one of these addresses: listserv@uga (BITNET), rice::boyle (SPAN/NSInet), utadnx::utspan::rice::boyle (THENET), or space-REQUEST@isu.isunet.edu (Internet). ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Monday, 26 Oct 1992 10:18:58 CET From: RFLOOD@ESOC.BITNET Subject: Comet Collision Newsgroups: sci.space I caught the end of a newsclip on SKY TV this a.m. which said that NASA "scientists" (probably the techs. that actually do the real work) had tracked a comet on collision course with the earth - I think it was due to hit us in 2016. Anyone else hear this, or was I just fantasising it ! ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 26 Oct 1992 15:03:28 GMT From: kjenks@gothamcity.jsc.nasa.gov Subject: Comet Collision Newsgroups: sci.space,alt.sci.planetary In sci.space, article <92300.101858RFLOOD@ESOC.BITNET> writes: > I caught the end of a newsclip on SKY TV this a.m. which said that NASA > "scientists" (probably the techs. that actually do the real work) had > tracked a comet on collision course with the earth - I think it was due > to hit us in 2016. Anyone else hear this, or was I just fantasising it! When I heard this from my office mate, I was thrilled! Just picture it: mankind is doomed, and only the space program can save us! THIS is why I joined NASA! I quickly went downstairs to our coffee shop in building 1 (run by a blind guy named Tom) and got change so I could pick up a Houston Post. On the front page, above the fold, is a story from Reuter News Service with a "Wilson da Silva" by-line. "A huge comet is on course to collide with Earth in the year 2116, and could kill off most forms of life with an explosion more powerful than a million atom bombs, [astronomer Duncan Steel of the Anglo-Australian Observatory] told a space conference Sunday." -- Houston Post, 10/26/92 The date given in the Post is 2116, while the date given in the "SKY TV" notice and the date my office mate gave me were both 2016. No NASA people involved in the discovery. The Smith-Tuttle comet was first discovered in 1862. Steel re-acquired it on Oct. 15th. The International Astronomical Union (IAU), for the first time every, could not rule out a collision with Earth. The story says the Smith-Tuttle comet, a 3.1-mile-wide dirty snowball, "could plunge the world into the Dark Ages." Of course, the million-nukes and plunge-into-Dark-Ages part of the story was front page, but the technical details were on the continuation on A-6. Reading the details, it becomes clear that there are no calculations which prove there WILL be a collision, just speculation that there MIGHT be a collision on August 14, 2116, when Smith-Tuttle's orbit intersects that of the Earth. Drat. I was hoping for the "Comet" movie scenario and a real shot in the arm for the space program. A 2016 collision would be a real challenge; 2116 is far enough away that Congress won't feel the need for immediate action. -- Ken Jenks, NASA/JSC/GM2, Space Shuttle Program Office kjenks@gothamcity.jsc.nasa.gov (713) 483-4368 "NASA turns dreams into realities and makes science fiction into fact" -- Daniel S. Goldin, NASA Administrator ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 26 Oct 1992 15:58:41 GMT From: Dillon Pyron Subject: Comet Collision Newsgroups: sci.space In article <92300.101858RFLOOD@ESOC.BITNET>, writes: >I caught the end of a newsclip on SKY TV this a.m. which said that >NASA "scientists" (probably the techs. that actually do the real work) >had tracked a comet on collision course with the earth - I think it >was due to hit us in 2016. Anyone else hear this, or was I just fantasising >it ! Friday, on All Things Considered, they had a blip on that. I think that the exact date is August 14, 2164. So, start planning now! The comet in question is (arrrrgh, I can't remember!). Tulley-whomever. They guy they interviewed was rather strange. He kept talking about the tremendous threat to Earth, then says the chances of an actual collision are about 1:10000. > -- Dillon Pyron | The opinions expressed are those of the TI/DSEG Lewisville VAX Support | sender unless otherwise stated. (214)462-3556 (when I'm here) | (214)492-4656 (when I'm home) |I'm back from vacation and I don't know why. pyron@skndiv.dseg.ti.com | PADI DM-54909 | ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Oct 1992 00:31:51 GMT From: Ron Baalke Subject: Comet Collision Newsgroups: sci.space In article <92300.101858RFLOOD@ESOC.BITNET>, writes... >I caught the end of a newsclip on SKY TV this a.m. which said that >NASA "scientists" (probably the techs. that actually do the real work) >had tracked a comet on collision course with the earth - I think it >was due to hit us in 2016. Anyone else hear this, or was I just fantasising >it ! Comet Swift-Tuttle, which was recently rediscovered, has a small chance of colliding with Earth on August 14, 2126. This date coincides with the Perseids meteor shower for that year, and the comet has been determined to be the source of the material in the meteor shower. Based on what we currently know of the comet's orbit, there is a two week error of margin on 2126 collision date. The odds of a collision are small, but at this point cannot be ruled out. Observations of the comet over the next couple of years will provide better accuracy of the comet's orbit and help determine if a collision in 2126 will happen or not. ___ _____ ___ /_ /| /____/ \ /_ /| Ron Baalke | baalke@kelvin.jpl.nasa.gov | | | | __ \ /| | | | Jet Propulsion Lab | ___| | | | |__) |/ | | |__ M/S 525-3684 Telos | If God had wanted us to /___| | | | ___/ | |/__ /| Pasadena, CA 91109 | have elections, he would |_____|/ |_|/ |_____|/ | have given us candidates. ------------------------------ Date: 26 Oct 92 13:13:56 GMT From: Faust Subject: Comet Collision Newsgroups: sci.space In article <92300.101858RFLOOD@ESOC.BITNET> RFLOOD@ESOC.BITNET writes: >I caught the end of a newsclip on SKY TV this a.m. which said that >NASA "scientists" (probably the techs. that actually do the real work) >had tracked a comet on collision course with the earth - I think it >was due to hit us in 2016. Anyone else hear this, or was I just fantasising >it ! No, you weren't hallucinating (at least, not unless I was too). I saw a report on the same story on Channel 4's 'The Big Breakfast' and BBC1. Neither channel seemed to consider the story to be of any significance at all (like, the GATT talks and the political credibility of an insignificant pimple on the backside of humanity like John Major count for more than the future of the human race). As far as I can remember however, the comet wasn't due to collide with the Earth until well into the 22nd century (the date quoted was something like 2160 AD). Nonetheless I would have thought that the imminent death of the human race warranted more than 30 seconds at the end of a news broadcast. Journalists obviously find anything more than two weeks into the future too hard to grasp with their limited minds. I was amazed and want to find out more. I'm suprised that sci.space seems to have almost no discussion of this discovery. Does this mean that the whole story is a hoax --or have you pro's out there been caught with your pants down? Does anyone out there in Net Land (preferably those close to the heart of NASA) have any information? If so, please post it. (Don't tell me: it was discussed to death 6 months ago and now it's part of the FAQ list :-) ******** *** ** ** ******* ******** "Quantum Mechanics: ** ** ** ** ** ** ** even I don't fully ****** ******* ** ** ******* ** understand it." ** ** ** ** ** ** ** - Ian Sales ** ** ** ****** ******** ** csh019@cch.cov.ac.uk ------------------------------ Date: 26 Oct 92 13:12:47 GMT From: "Bill Jameson SPS Pres." Subject: Comet Collision Newsgroups: sci.space what i heard, on NPR news friday evening, was that Harvard-Smithosonian Astrophysics people announced that on August 14, 2126, the earth might collide with comet Swift-Tuttle, thereby bringing an end to our civilization, rather like the poor dinosaurs. any one else hear about it? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 26 Oct 1992 17:56:17 GMT From: Anita Cochran Subject: Comet Collision Newsgroups: sci.space,alt.sci.planetary In article <1992Oct26.150328.22285@aio.jsc.nasa.gov>, kjenks@gothamcity.jsc.nasa.gov writes: > In sci.space, article <92300.101858RFLOOD@ESOC.BITNET> writes: > > I caught the end of a newsclip on SKY TV this a.m. which said that NASA > > "scientists" (probably the techs. that actually do the real work) had > > tracked a comet on collision course with the earth - I think it was due > > to hit us in 2016. Anyone else hear this, or was I just fantasising it! > > When I heard this from my office mate, I was thrilled! Just picture > it: mankind is doomed, and only the space program can save us! THIS > is why I joined NASA! I quickly went downstairs to our coffee shop in > building 1 (run by a blind guy named Tom) and got change so I could > pick up a Houston Post. On the front page, above the fold, is a story > from Reuter News Service with a "Wilson da Silva" by-line. > > "A huge comet is on course to collide with Earth in the year 2116, and > could kill off most forms of life with an explosion more powerful than > a million atom bombs, [astronomer Duncan Steel of the Anglo-Australian > Observatory] told a space conference Sunday." -- Houston Post, 10/26/92 > > The date given in the Post is 2116, while the date given in the "SKY > TV" notice and the date my office mate gave me were both 2016. No > NASA people involved in the discovery. > > The Smith-Tuttle comet was first discovered in 1862. Steel re-acquired > it on Oct. 15th. The International Astronomical Union (IAU), for the > first time every, could not rule out a collision with Earth. The story > says the Smith-Tuttle comet, a 3.1-mile-wide dirty snowball, "could > plunge the world into the Dark Ages." > I think that some fact correcting is definitely in order here. First of all, the comet's name is Swift-Tuttle, not Smith-Tuttle. Second, no one presently alive "discovered" this comet. It is named for the discovers in 1862. Its return was predicted for 1982 but that proved to be a bad orbit and Brian Marsden (of the Smithsonian Astrophysical Observatory and in charge of the IAU Central Telegram burueau) had suggested it was linked to a comet from the 1730's and should return in the 1990s. This comet is interesting since it is the parent source of the Perseid meteor shower. Duncan Steele was NOT the person who reacquired this comet. It was reacquired on 26 September by a Japanese (amateur I think) by the name of Kiuchi. It was subsequently confirmed by several US astronomers at Marsden's request on 27 September. Then, it was confirmed that this was not a newly discovered comet but a recovery of Swift-Tuttle. As for the possibility that is might hit the earth, this is not Steele's prediction either. It turns out that there is difficulty linking the data from the three appearances of this comet. This difficulty has been noted by both Marsden and Nakano. However, they have a best fit solution. This solution does NOT have an intersection of the earth and Swift-Tuttle. However, if the date of perihelion passage is off by 15 days, then the comet would collide with the earth in 2116. As for the amount of explosive force, that is speculation since the size is unknown, the brittleness is unknown and a lot depends on incidence angle. Marsden argues that our concept of this perihelion passage was off 10 years so 15 days is a very small error. However, we should have new positions from this apparition which can confirm or deny the collision. As for Duncan Steele, I doubt that he is claiming he recovered the comet or figured the collision (I know Duncan and he is reasonably honest) but was probably quoting the IAU information and was quoted out of context. So the truth is, NASA had nothing to do with the discovery, recovery or prediction. They will probably pay for scientists to study it however. -- Anita Cochran uucp: !utastro!anita arpa: anita@astro.as.utexas.edu snail: Astronomy Dept., The Univ. of Texas, Austin, TX, 78712 at&t: (512) 471-1471 ------------------------------ Date: 26 Oct 92 09:21:35 GMT From: Stewart T Fleming Subject: Dan Quayle on Mars Newsgroups: sci.space As Mahatma Ghandi might have said, "I think that would be a very good idea." STF -- sfleming@cs.hw.ac.uk, sfleming@icbl.hw.ac.uk "I only deal with cats. I don't understand humans." ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 26 Oct 92 16:39:55 GMT From: Joe Cain Subject: electromagnetic heating Newsgroups: sci.space,alt.sci.planetary On pg. 266 of Hartmann's 3rd edition (Moons and Planets,1983!) is a diagram after Sonnett et al giving heating of various sized bodies vs distance from the Sun postulated by induction during the T-Tauri phase of our early Sun. It seems to explain the lava on 4 Vesta which otherwise would not have enough mass/surface to generate its own, but also includes a small icon of the Moon without comment in the portion labeled "molten." Is this electromagnetic heating generally accepted for 4 Vesta, and was it supposed to have been a major factor in liquifying the early Moon (top layers only?) compared with the other sources available (e.g. impacts, gravitational settling, short lived radiogenics like 26Al)? Joseph Cain cain@geomag.gly.fsu.edu cain@fsu.bitnet scri::cain ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 24 Oct 1992 15:36:38 GMT From: Richard Velez Subject: Gif Pictures Newsgroups: sci.space Hello, I'm new to Sci.Space, and I will like to know if someone could tell me a ftp site, from where I could download gif pictures of space, like pictures of the earth, mars, etc etc etc.. please send me the following informatiom. Ftp Site Dir or files and how to get a list of all the files in the dir. Thanks... {-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-} Richard Velez - New York City Electronic Mail InterNet Relay Chat :IRC: - Rickie FidoNet - 1:278/712 Born and Raise in the South Bronx Ricky@MindVox.Phantom.Com {=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=} ------------------------------ Date: 24 Oct 92 10:25:38 EST From: tom betz Subject: nasa shake up rumor? Newsgroups: sci.space Quoth Josh 'k' Hopkins regarding NASA SHAKE UP RUMOR? on 10-22-92: J'> Goldin is apparently opening J'>competion for replacements to outsiders, which has some worried that N J'>be taken over by DoD and DoE types. To feed the rumor mill still further, rumor has it that Richard Truly is preparing, once Al Gore takes over for Dan Quayle, to take a White House position directing NASA. This may have something to do with the present shakeup. Justice served, if you ask me. --- WinQwk 2.0 a#299 "I can feel it, Dave; my mind. It's going. Stop, Dave." -- Executive Network Information System (914) 667-4567 International ILink Host ------------------------------ Date: 26 Oct 92 14:46:22 GMT From: FRANK NEY Subject: Smith-Tuttle Comet a threat to earth? Newsgroups: sci.space On the radio news this morning, I heard a report that an Australian astronomer by the name of Duncan Steele predicted that the Smith-Tuttle comet will strike the earth sometime in the 22nd century. The news report gave an exact date, but I couldn't write fast enough to catch up. Is anyone else hearing these stories, and how true are they? Frank Ney N4ZHG EMT-A LPVa NRA ILA GOA CCRTKBA "M-O-U-S-E" Commandant and Acting President, Northern Virginia Free Militia Send e-mail for an application and more information ---------------------------------------------------------------- Look! A one-line mathematical limerick: ((12 + 144 + 20 + (3 * 4^1/2)) / 7 + (5 * 11) = 9^2 + 0 -- The Next Challenge - Public Access Unix in Northern Va. - Washington D.C. 703-803-0391 To log in for trial and account info. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 26 Oct 92 10:40:32 -0600 From: pgf@srl05.cacs.usl.edu (Phil G. Fraering) Subject: Smith-Tuttle Comet a threat to earth? >On the radio news this morning, I heard a report that an Australian >astronomer by the name of Duncan Steele predicted that the >Smith-Tuttle comet will strike the earth sometime in the 22nd century. I don't know if this is true; I have heard that Duncan _Steel_ is a legitimate Australian astronomer who has done work in the past on asteroid impacts. >The news report gave an exact date, but I couldn't write fast enough >to catch up. >Is anyone else hearing these stories, and how true are they? I don't really know, but Smith-Tuttle is going to move (by which I mean change its trajectory) a lot between now and the 22nd century. Comets tend to do that, due to outgassing, etc... >Frank Ney N4ZHG EMT-A LPVa NRA ILA GOA CCRTKBA "M-O-U-S-E" I knew there was some sort of sinister right-wing conspiracy involving the Mouseketters... -- Phil Fraering pgf@srl0x.cacs.usl.edu where the x is a number from 1-5. Phone: 318/365-5418 SnailMail: 2408 Blue Haven Dr., New Iberia, La. 70560 --------------------- Disclaimer: Some reasonably forseeable events may exceed this message's capability to protect from severe injury, death, widespread disaster, astronomically significant volumes of space approaching a state of markedly increaced entropy, or taxes. The world will end tomorrow. NASA scientists note that this was the way the system was designed to operate. - From the Nov. Focus in Sky and Telescope, on a hypothetical NASA press release on something hitting the Earth... ------------------------------ Date: 26 Oct 92 16:42:31 GMT From: tavaila@cc.helsinki.fi Subject: Smith-Tuttle Comet a threat to earth? Newsgroups: sci.space In article <1754@tnc.UUCP>, m0102@tnc.UUCP (FRANK NEY) writes: > > On the radio news this morning, I heard a report that an Australian > astronomer by the name of Duncan Steele predicted that the > Smith-Tuttle comet will strike the earth sometime in the 22nd century. > > The news report gave an exact date, but I couldn't write fast enough > to catch up. > > I've heard it - or actually I read about it in the largest local newspaper (Helsingin Sanomat) last week. Unfortunately I couldn't find the article so I have to trust to my memory: Somebody has indeed calculated, that this Comet should be very near to Earth sonetime in the future (I should think, that the date was set to next cenury, but please, don't take my word for it). However comets are known to change their orbits due to reaction effects caused by ejection of gas and matter close to perihelion. Therefore calculating cometary orbits is still far from the accuracy required to make such predictions. What's more the uncertainties of the parameters of comets present orbit are so large that even the best of calculations could only tell, that comet will pass Earth at a distance, less than 1.5 million kilometers - about four times the radius of Moon's orbit. We've had much closer calls already, so though one can't say, that this piece of news is entirely false it is certainly misleading. Harri Tavaila > The Next Challenge - Public Access Unix in Northern Va. - W ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 26 Oct 92 15:47:45 GMT From: Andy Cohen Subject: Smith-Tuttle Comet a threat to earth? Newsgroups: sci.space In article <1754@tnc.UUCP>, m0102@tnc.UUCP (FRANK NEY) wrote: > Is anyone else hearing these stories, and how true are they? > Last Friday on NPR's All Things Considered the head of Astrophysics for the Smithsonean also provided a date. Aug 14 (or 16) 2126. Since I heard the interview I went to my shortwave reciever looking for other discussions on broadcasts and in astro-ham circles.....nothing..... In the interview it was all taken seriously by the Smithsonean guy, but the NPR announcer seemed slightly cynical and not at all concerned. I talked about it with others and nobody seems to care..... Well, I care!! If this is all plausible, then that leaves us two full generations to figure out what the heck to do about it!!! Read Lucifer's Hammer!!! AAKKK! I'm seriously considering contacting the Smithisonean later this week if we don't hear something on this board..... Too bad Halloween isin't earlier in the week, otherwise it would have to be a joke.. Andy Cohen | | | Support Freedom! MDSSC | / OO / | | ----------------------- | | | | | | ------------------------------ Date: 26 Oct 92 16:53:02 GMT From: Patrick Chester Subject: Space Domination Initiative Newsgroups: alt.conspiracy,alt.alien.visitors,sci.space In article jbh55289@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu (Josh 'K' Hopkins) writes: =pierce@lanai.cs.ucla.edu (Brad Pierce) writes: Actually, Brad Pierce did not write this. This article was originally posted in misc.activism.progressive. I asked the groups moderator for permission to repost it elsewhere and did so in sci.space and alt.activism.d. I guess Brad saw this too and decided to repost it here for discussion. =>The official anti-missile scheme calls for a constellation of =>surveillance satellites (Brilliant Eyes), watching for fiery rocket =>plumes, the telltale indicator of an enemy launch. In a lower orbit, a =>larger constellation of human-sized interceptors (Brilliant Pebbles) =>wait for the signal, then attack the missiles and destroy them. = =>In the unofficial version, much of which has been invented at Livermore, =>the Eyes will be equipped with radars, lasers, telescopes, antennae and =>sensors to allow military commanders to see practically every square =>foot of Earth--and analyze that information instantly. = =Increasing the capability of satellites like this increases their mass =significantly. The biggest problem we have with spysats is a lack of =interpreters to examine the data. The last thing we need is more data. Right. We need to increase the number and quality of analysts to go over our data. Despite the tech available for data gathering, it still takes a human to pore over the data and realize what is happening. ("Gee, that looks like an armored brigade sneaking behind our lines..") = =>In a conventional war, according to a proposal being promoted around =>the Pentagon by Lowell Wood, Brilliant Pebbles would be ordered to leave =>their orbits and fly downward at high speed to hit targets on the sur- =>face of the planet with great precision. = =BP, as now designed, is utterly unable to do this. They lack the sensors, =guidance and aerodynamics. The real authors of the article may be confusing BP w/something proposed in about 1980 by some scientists, engineers and sci-fi writers called Thor. It involved hundreds of tungsten/titanium/dep. uranium javelins dropped from orbit by decellerating a satellite loaded a large number of them. They were supposed to have sensors on the tip capable of finding a specific shape (tank, bunker, ship, basic categories like that) and homing in on it and impacting with near orbital velocity (ouch.) They weren't designed for pinpoint accuracy to keep them cheap, and were meant to be fired in groups at multiple targets... say an armored brigade trying to sneak behind your lines :) I think they could also home in on laser beams for better accuracy so they could hit a bunker and slice right through it. Note this all assumes there are sensors capable of surviving/operating under the heat of reentry.. though I don't know how much friction a javelin would build up while penetrating the atmosphere. I do think the people who made this up thought of that, however, so it might actually work. It was never adopted (at least I think it has :) maybe because it was made up by science fiction writers. Oh well. There is a copy of the proposal in _There Will Be War_ Vol. 1, ed. Jerry Pournelle if you want a better description. Anyway, BP is not this. =>In Colorado Springs, we asked Teller while he was walking to lunch one =>day if Pebbles could be used to hit enemy command bunkers, a =>high-priority target in the war with Iraq. He stopped walking. = =>"Look," he said, in his commanding form of speech. "Yes. And in a war, =>you would." = =Teller may be a brilliant physicist, but he is is well known for is infatuation =with bizzare SDI concepts and was responsable for much of the wasted research =in the early SDIO. What sort of wasted research? Particle beams or something? =>But these endoweapons may be fringe projects. Threatening enemy =>satellites would seem to be Pebbles' main goal. = =BP is also unable to hit satellites as now configured. Missiles generate an =incredible amount of heat which is easy to track. Satellites are much harder =to detect from orbit. In addition, most satellites orbit far above BPs and =would thus be very hard to hit. Think of it as two people throwing rocks at each other. One is at the bottom of a well, the other is at the top. Which one has a better chance of hitting the other as well as dodging incoming rocks? This is a good example of the tacical advantages of high orbits. = =>In their blockade role, Pebbles would be transformed into enforcement =>battleships, poised to destroy any missile attempting to run the =>blockade and put a satellite in orbit. = =Missiles don't put satellites in orbit. Launchers or rockets do. I doubt they can tell the difference, Josh. Rocket=missile to some people. I also hardly see BP as space battleships. But then, I'm prejudiced from watching too much anime. :) = =>Equally important is the role of Pebbles as anti-satellite weapons, or =>ASATs, to knock out satellites already in orbit. Having the ability to =>eliminate any satellite, whether military or commercial (the difference =>between the two is diminishing) = =Actually, the difference is getting bigger. Many commerical satellites have =no military value, and few military sattelites (with the exception of GPS) are =commerically valuable. Well, you can use civilian comsats for emergency communications, but comsats are in very high orbits that are hard to reach from ground or LEO. Also, LANDSAT can be used for recon, but I don't think it can encode it's telemetry. That would limit it's use. = =>Although the U.S. military has long wanted ASAT weapons, Congress has =>denied them, fearing an expensive arms race in space. But the generals =>have not given up. = =The other reason is that ASAT weapons are very destabilizing, so politicians =are much less excited about them than generals are. The reason the "generals" want ASATs is too knock down enemy satellites to prevent their use. Now it's not such a problem as long as the CIS continues towards democracy and improves its economy (it's not good, though.) The CIS has a workable ASAT system. It's not as fancy as the one we were testing, but it works okay. = =>So bothersome is the ABM treaty that President Bush is personally =>pushing Boris Yeltsin to yield. Teller's missile purchases would be a =>way of buying the Russians out of the treaty. On the other hand, U.S. =>military contractors don't want competition in the launch-vehicle =>business. = =The ABM treaty is completly different from the one (the START treaty?) which =limits the uses of former missiles. Also, I don't think the ABM treaty said anything about space-based ABM weapons. Sort of like the Naval Treaty from the 1920s not limiting aircraft carriers because they weren't seen as useful. Interestingly enough, the concept of space-borne ABM weapons *had* been covered in science fiction stories, but then no one takes that seriously. = =>But since any satellite is suspect in wartime, the U.S., =>the backgrounder says, should quickly develop a "capability to enforce a =>military 'keep-out' zone in space over a battle area." = =First, not all satellites have military value (can you think of a strategic =use for an ultra-violet telescope that can't face the Earth?). Second, =Most areas can't have a "no fly" zone over them without taking huge numbers =of satellites out of orbit. USAF SpaceCom has telescopes and radar that let it track over 20,000(?) objects in orbit. The telescopes are supposed to be good enough to see a soccer ball in LEO clearly. Methinks that it is possible to have some idea of what that satellite is doing. Besides, satellites are usually trapped in their orbits unless they have thrusters and a lot of fuel. Such satellites are usually military recon birds so that would be a big giveaway to the ident of an unknown satellite doing massive orbit changes. This is different from attitude thrusters used to point a telescope or something at a star, since those don't have the thrust or fuel to change orbit that much. = =The rest of the post (on how SDI is crazy) does have some valididty as long as =you don't take it to far. Well, I think there were legitimate reasons for SDI while there was a major Soviet nuclear threat. I still think it should be looked into in case the CIS gets toppled by a coup (plausible) or some regional power gets *really* good ICBM capability. Always judge the threat, not intentions. Threats are harder to change/eliminate than intentions. = =-- =Josh Hopkins jbh55289@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu = The views expresed above do not necessarily reflect those of =ISDS, UIUC, NSS, IBM FSC, NCSA, NMSU, AIAA or the American Association for the = Advancement of Acronymphomaniacs -- Patrick Chester |---------------------------------------------------- wolfone@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu |"The earth is too fragile a basket in which to keep Politically Incorrect | all your eggs." Robert A. Heinlein Future Lunar Colonist |"The meek shall inherit the Earth. The rest of us #^%$!! Militarist | are going to the stars." Anonymous (Of the Sun Tzu mentality) |---------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 26 Oct 1992 14:13:42 GMT From: Ed McCreary Subject: Voyager Family Portrait Newsgroups: sci.space In article <1992Oct26.053027.13099@elroy.jpl.nasa.gov> baalke@kelvin.jpl.nasa.gov writes: >In article <1992Oct25.153622.15780@engage.pko.dec.com>, moroney@ramblr.enet.dec.com writes... >>In article <1992Oct25.054001.27008@elroy.jpl.nasa.gov>, baalke@kelvin.jpl.nasa.gov (Ron Baalke) writes... >>>If by chance you happen to visit JPL, the family portrait images are >>>on one of the walls of Von Karman Auditorium across from Voyager 3. >> >>Voyager 3? A third probe whose mission got cancelled after it was built? What >>would its mission have been? >> > >No, this Voyager 3 is a full scale replica of the Voyager spacecraft and is >not a real spacecraft. It runs along the entire length of one wall of the >auditorium (or at least is used to, the Magnetometer boom was recently removed >so that a mockup of the Magellan spacecraft could be stored next to it), and is >often used as a backdrop during interviews with the news media. Insert foot in mouth and ignore my last posting... :( I seem to remember reading that there were initially three spacecraft built, and that one of the ones designated to be launched was swapped at the last moment with the backup. I'm I just imagining things? -- In the midst of the word he was trying to say,|McCreary@sword.eng.hou.compaq.com In the midst of his laughter and glee, |Me, speak for Compaq? He had softly and suddenly vanished away--- |Yeah, right. For the Snark *was* a Boojum, you see. |#include ------------------------------ End of Space Digest Volume 15 : Issue 346 ------------------------------