Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 7997;andrew.cmu.edu;Ted Anderson Received: from hogtown.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for +dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr11/tm2b/space/space.dl@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr11/tm2b/space/space.dl) (->ota+space.digests) ID ; Sun, 23 Jun 91 04:15:57 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: Precedence: junk Reply-To: space+@Andrew.CMU.EDU From: space-request+@Andrew.CMU.EDU To: space+@Andrew.CMU.EDU Date: Sun, 23 Jun 91 04:15:52 -0400 (EDT) Subject: SPACE Digest V13 #690 SPACE Digest Volume 13 : Issue 690 Today's Topics: INFO: More on Hoagland's Mars - ParaNet File Re: Microgravity? Looking for video imaging technology experts Shuttle & Launch Policies (Was: Re: More on Freedom Vote) Re: INFO: Clandestine Mars Observer Launch? Re: Fred Vote Thursday Re: More on Freedom Vote Re: More on Freedom Vote Administrivia: Submissions to the SPACE Digest/sci.space should be mailed to space+@andrew.cmu.edu. Other mail, esp. [un]subscription requests, should be sent to space-request+@andrew.cmu.edu, or, if urgent, to tm2b+@andrew.cmu.edu ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 2 Jun 91 22:18:10 GMT From: cis.ohio-state.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!rpi!crdgw1!ge-dab!tarpit!bilver!dona@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (Don Allen) Subject: INFO: More on Hoagland's Mars - ParaNet File The following text comes from the ParaNet UFO echo. I'm posting it to the NET as it seems to be interesting. NOTE to cross-posted groups..BEFORE you flame me, how about keeping an OPEN MIND? As I do NOT have alot of time available to pursue follow-ups _exclusively_, please direct all comments to me via mail. The usual hate mail will get merrily dumped to dev/null, so flame away if you must :-) ----------Begin Included Text------------------------------------- Message #6489 - INFO.PARANET Date : 29-May-91 12:45 From : ParaNet(sm) Information Service To : All Subject : More on Hoagland's Mars **************************************************************** ParaNet File Number: Reprinted from Air & Space Smithsonian, June/July 1991. FACE OFF In 1976 the Viking I orbiter, flying some 1,100 miles above Mars, photographed a region called Cydonia. Close inspection of one frame revealed what looked like a human face gazing soulfully into eternity. A Viking project scientist showed the image to the press, dismissed it as a trick of light and shadow, and the Face On Mars was forgotten-for a while. Three years later, Vincent DiPietro and Gregory Molenaar, computer imaging specialists at NASA's Goddard Space Flight Center in Maryland, analyzed a computer enhancement of The Face and decided it merited a serious look. Science raspberried them, but it was too late. A new subculture had been born. Today, two groups-the Mars Project in Santa Cruz, California, and the Mars Mission in Wytheville, Virginia-exist solely to push the idea that The Face and nearby structures may be monuments left by a long-vanished intelligent civilization. Of the two groups, the latter, founded by science writer Richard Hoagland, is the more energetic. Hoagland wants NASA to reshoot Cydonia when the Mars Observer returns to the planet in 1993, and he pursues this vision with zeal reminiscent of Burt Lancaster in The Rainmaker. Like many people involved in missionary work on behalf of fringe topics, Hoagland believes he's being thwarted by higher-ups intent on muffling the truth. In this case, the higher-ups are at NASA. In a 1989 letter to Representative Robert Roe, then chairman of the House Committee on Science, Space, and Technology, Hoagland charged that "political obstacles, within...NASA have blocked serious consideration of this evidence for 13 years." The latest-alleged outrage involves the cancellation of a documentary called "Hoagland's Mars" that was produced by NASA's Lewis Research Center in Cleveland, Ohio. Hoagland's version of what happened goes like this: In March 1990 he was invited to Speak to a group of Lewis employees. During that visit, Lynn Bondurant, educational programs chief, interviewed him about The Face with a documentary in mind. Hoagland was pleased to learn that Bondurant would "give our work a fair airing, putting it in context of the history of Mars explorations." The program was scheduled for a January 6, 1991 satellite transmission for PBS stations, says Hoagland, when NASA "pulled the plug." Why? Because "the planetary science community hit the roof. They were absolutely furious that this subject was going to be legitimized." Now, Hoagland says, the program is being recut to "put me in the same camp as Percival Lowell-as a well-meaning buffoon." A source close to the production says the program is being revised "to present other views on The Face." That's probably a good idea, because the script I have doesn't present the full pageantry of Hoagland's ideas. It covers his belief that the arrangement of The Face and surrounding structures reveals encoded mathematical constants, but it fails to mention his wilder extrapolations. Hoagland and geomorphologist Erol Torun argue in a self-published paper that the constants give a startling insight into planetary physics. The theorizing gets pretty dense: "The 'tetrahedral geometry'...is revealing an equivalent higher-order mathematical topology: i.e., a vorticular'two-torus'energy flow.... " The bottom line is this: the entities who built Cydonia were trying to tell the universe about a "new physics" that may involve "a hitherto unknown relationship between two of the four basic forces of the Universe-gravity and electromagnetism: i.e., a 'Unified Field.'" Coincidentally, the miracle math of Cydonia conies into play in a mind-device called the N-Machine, which Hoagland enthusiastically promotes. Invented by physicist Bruce de Palma (brother of Hollywood director Brian), the N-Machine, as Hoagland puts it, "generates more energy out of the interaction between 'space' and the hi-speed rotation of a spinning mass than [is] required by the motors that mechanically rotate those masses." Hoagland dares to say that from which most physicists recoil: 'We may be talking about energy coming from nothing." He has been flogging this miracle device on "For The People," an overheated radio talk show in Cedar Key, Florida. Hoagland and Chuck Harder, the show's host, get pretty imaginative. After cancellation of "Hoagland's Mars," Harder said, "I gotta believe one of the reasons...'Hoagland's Mars' has been put on ice has got to be because of the Middle East thing.... Once your program would be transmitted...the press would jump on it, and it might steal some of the thunder from Bush's ''project.'" Hoagland replied, 'Well, it's even more disturbing than that....'Hoagland's Mars' is the opening gun to a whole new way of life that taps a virtually inexhaustible energy source for the benefit of mankind. We are about to go to war...over a resource that is really useless." Hoagland: buffoon or Einstein of the 1990s? Only time will tell. For those wanting a closer look, Hoagland's own version of "Hoagland's Mars"-with all the theories-is available from Curley and Company, Signal Mountain, Tennessee. -Alex Heard END PARANET FILE NAME: CYDONIA2.TXT ----EOF--- -- -* Don Allen *- InterNet: dona@bilver.UUCP // Amiga..for the rest of us. USnail: 1818G Landing Dr, Sanford Fl 32771 \X/ Why use anything else? :^) UUCP: ..uunet!tarpit!bilver!vicstoy!dona 0110 0110 0110 Just say NO! Illuminati < MJ-12|Grudge|TLC|CFR|FED|EEC|Bush > WAR = "New World Order" ------------------------------ Date: 4 Jun 91 14:51:52 GMT From: news-server.csri.toronto.edu!utzoo!henry@rutgers.edu (Henry Spencer) Subject: Re: Microgravity? In article <13150@mentor.cc.purdue.edu> hrubin@pop.stat.purdue.edu (Herman Rubin) writes: >> A 710-meter shaft set deep into the Earth forms the centerpiece of a >> new microgravity experimentation facility... > >I must be missing something. How do we get microgravity at this depth? Drop something down it. You get microgravity down to about 709 meters... :-) It's easier to drill shafts than build towers for long drops. -- "We're thinking about upgrading from | Henry Spencer @ U of Toronto Zoology SunOS 4.1.1 to SunOS 3.5." | henry@zoo.toronto.edu utzoo!henry ------------------------------ Date: 4 Jun 91 15:10:40 GMT From: oasys!goldberg@mimsy.umd.edu (Mark Goldberg) Subject: Looking for video imaging technology experts I am working on a project in real-time video imaging. I would like to touch base, via e-mail or phone, with those having expertise ion any of the following areas: - Low-light level TV or computer imaging - Use of real-time imaging to make photometric measurements (that is, quantify the actual brightness of a scene) - Video imaging research and technology - Helicopter mounts for cameras Plese contact me by e-mail at the address below, or call me during the day at (301) 267-2352. Many thanks in advance. =========David Taylor Research Center (a US Navy lab) - Annapolis, MD========== /|/| /||)|/ /~_/\| |\|)[~|)/~_ | "Everyone's entitled to MY opinion." / | |/~||\|\ \_/\/|_|/|)[_|\\_/ | goldberg@oasys.dt.navy.mil "Poor is the man whose pleasure depends on the permission of another."-Madonna ------------------------------ Date: 4 Jun 91 19:24:44 GMT From: agate!headcrash.Berkeley.EDU!gwh@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (George William Herbert) Subject: Shuttle & Launch Policies (Was: Re: More on Freedom Vote) In article <1991Jun4.013645.13914@iti.org> aws@iti.org (Allen W. Sherzer) writes: >It's more than just Congress, it's also the Space Council and space >activists. Look at the signs: OMB is using the money for another >orbiter to fund HLV work. Congress is moving toward commercial >procurement policies which will move cargo off the Shuttle. The >only thing left is spacelab and Freedom resuply which can be done >for FAR less with expendables. Allen, following the Challenger accident, all commercial and most military payloads were taken off the shuttle. The only payloads that the shuttle now carries, mostly for the simple reason that it's only launching 7-9 times a year, are ones that ONLY it can carry. Big recon birds, manned experiments, large/wierd payloads (Galileo, Hubble, GRO). -george william herbert gwh@ocf.berkeley.edu ------------------------------ Date: 4 Jun 91 19:30:11 GMT From: agate!headcrash.Berkeley.EDU!gwh@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (George William Herbert) Subject: Re: INFO: Clandestine Mars Observer Launch? In article <852@newave.UUCP> john@newave.mn.org (John A. Weeks III) writes: > >If you are interested in this type of information, consider subscribing >to the paranet mailing list. Since this newsgroup is sci.space, I would encourage those who want to post Paranet's stuff (and other second-source material) to think long and hard about wether it's up to any scientific standards. Hoagland's isn't really (and don't start on me why; I talked to him myself, as well as the NASA people who can debunk him, and the reason that he's still around is mostly that the scientists were PR idiots and never published a negative- results paper and sat on their enhanced and second-angle data). The Lunar stuff was, however, appropriate. -george william herbert gwh@ocf.berkeley.edu ------------------------------ Date: 4 Jun 91 15:14:00 GMT From: cis.ohio-state.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!rpi!acm.rpi.edu!strider@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (Greg Moore) Subject: Re: Fred Vote Thursday In article <1991Jun4.123953.11551@iti.org> aws@iti.org (Allen W. Sherzer) writes: >In article jim@pnet01.cts.com (Jim Bowery) writes: > >>By the way, the current vote count puts it nip and tuck. Fred has >>just enough votes to tie if the House majority whip's stats are correct. >>Fred has 140 Republicans and 77 Democrats. > >This is incorrect, 217 is enough to win by one vote. At the moment there >are only 432 members in the House (three seats are vacant due to death, >resignation, ect). Also note that a tie is a win since the VP gets the >tiebreaking vote. The VP only breaks ties in the Senate, not in the House. (The Senate having 100 members, it is possible for a tie with all members voting.) As the House has 435 members, if all members vote there can not be a tie. As right now there are only 432 active seats, you are right, there can be a tie, but Quayle can't break it. >The momentum is also on Freedoms side. Last Freday there where only 70 >votes in favor of the amendment to restore Freedom funding. > > Allen > >-- >+---------------------------------------------------------------------------+ >|Allen W. Sherzer | DETROIT: Where the weak are killed and eaten. | >| aws@iti.org | | >+---------------------------------------------------------------------------+ Carpe Diem Greg_d._Moore@mts.rpi.edu Greg_d._Moore@acm.rpi.edu "All that is gold does not glitter." Strider_of_the_Dunedain@mts.rpi.edu ------------------------------ Date: 4 Jun 91 15:41:33 GMT From: mojo!SYSMGR%KING.ENG.UMD.EDU@mimsy.umd.edu (Doug Mohney) Subject: Re: More on Freedom Vote In article <1991Jun4.013645.13914@iti.org>, aws@iti.org (Allen W. Sherzer) writes: >It's more than just Congress, it's also the Space Council and space >activists. Should be space fanatics. > Look at the signs: OMB is using the money for another >orbiter to fund HLV work. Congress is moving toward commercial >procurement policies which will move cargo off the Shuttle. The >only thing left is spacelab and Freedom resuply which can be done >for FAR less with expendables. > >If NASA doesn't get the orbiters they will be forced to allow for >the use of ACRV or perhaps Comet to transport astronauts. When >that happens the Shuttle is finished. If Freedom is canned, NASA can put-put along with a 4 Shuttle fleet. Less wear and tear on all orbiters. >This won't happen overnight and it will take work by activists >who want to see cost effective infrastructure. But it will >happen. Allen has obviously not yet butted heads with the Astronaut Mafia, DoD and the Air Force, Congressional Pork Barrel, and the lobbying firms who work for Rockwell International and Lockheed. Nor with anyone who has a Shuttle poster on their wall. If there is a serious proposal to ditch STS for Soviet-made tin cans(which Mr. Sherzer assures us can be done for less money than it takes to build two B-2 bombers), I'll be writing a check to the "Made in the USA" advertising council. Signature envy: quality of some people to put 24+ lines in their .sigs -- > SYSMGR@CADLAB.ENG.UMD.EDU < -- ------------------------------ Date: 4 Jun 91 17:05:48 GMT From: orca!bambam!bpendlet@uunet.uu.net (Bob Pendleton) Subject: Re: More on Freedom Vote In article <00949947.68505540@KING.ENG.UMD.EDU>, sysmgr@KING.ENG.UMD.EDU (Doug Mohney) writes: > In article <1991Jun3.182220.16037@iti.org>, aws@iti.org (Allen W. Sherzer) writes: > >Another interesting note is that the President is playing hardball on > >this issue. He recently spoke with Jamie Whitten who is the head of > >the Appropriation Committee. He told him that if Freedom isn't built > >then there was no reason to build the Advanced Solid Rocket Motor (ASRM) > >for the Shuttle. ASRM is built in Whitten's district and he consideres > >it an important project. Bush's veiled threat should have a big effect. > And you are so naieve as to think that you can get Congress to kill the > Shuttle, which is already operational, to go to tin cans.... > > Watch, look, and learn. Killing the ASRM is NOT the same as killing the shuttle. The ASRM is an all new replacement for the existing SRM. The main reason for building the ASRM is to put Thiokol out of the SRM business. Secondary reasons for building the ASRM are to bring the shuttles payload up to spec and to put a big aerospace manufacturing plant in the back woods of the Great State of Mississippi. The extra payload is needed to support Fred. Without Fred the reasons for building ASRM come down to revenge against Thiokol and a shifting of Utah pork to Mississippi. Whoopee... Personally, I hope they bury Fred so deep it never gets out. Talk about a gold plated over rated waste of money. If I've every seen a solution looking for a problem Fred is it. The second worse example would be the shuttle. Bob P. P.S. We should've build the X-15B. -- Bob Pendleton, speaking only for myself. bpendlet@dsd.es.com or decwrl!esunix!bpendlet or hellgate!esunix!bpendlet Tools, not rules. ------------------------------ End of SPACE Digest V13 #690 *******************