Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 7997;andrew.cmu.edu;Ted Anderson Received: from hogtown.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for +dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr11/tm2b/space/space.dl@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr11/tm2b/space/space.dl) (->ota+space.digests) ID ; Thu, 16 May 91 02:14:01 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <0cAWAXW00WBwJABU5Y@andrew.cmu.edu> Precedence: junk Reply-To: space+@Andrew.CMU.EDU From: space-request+@Andrew.CMU.EDU To: space+@Andrew.CMU.EDU Date: Thu, 16 May 91 02:13:56 -0400 (EDT) Subject: SPACE Digest V13 #559 SPACE Digest Volume 13 : Issue 559 Today's Topics: Re: Advancing Launch Technology Re: SPACE Digest V13 #517 Toward 2001 - 13 May Press kits/ STS FAQ/ Thank you Locating Cape Canaveral Re: 2001 and "The Endeavor" Re: Why the space station? Re: Saturn V and the ALS Re: Honking at cyclists... Re: Honking at cyclists... Administrivia: Submissions to the SPACE Digest/sci.space should be mailed to space+@andrew.cmu.edu. Other mail, esp. [un]subscription requests, should be sent to space-request+@andrew.cmu.edu, or, if urgent, to tm2b+@andrew.cmu.edu ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 15 May 91 02:09:55 GMT From: agate!lightning.Berkeley.EDU!fcrary@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (Frank Crary) Subject: Re: Advancing Launch Technology In article dlbres10@pc.usl.edu (Fraering Philip) writes: >1. Assembly in space may be a lot cheaper and easier than you think. >Since the Russians can do it with their rather less developed automation, >shouldn't it be easier with the more developed technology here? > Be carefull what you mean when you say "assembly." The Soviet on-orbit assembly work has involved docking pre-fabricated modules together. They have found this to be reasonably simple. They have also tested tools and procedures to "assemble" things on orbit. These include unfolding gird-work structures, welding, bolting things together, etc... They have found this sort of work to be quite dificult, though not impossible. On-orbit assembly of, for example, a Mars sample return, might easily involve a significant amount of construction work, rather than just docking two modules together. Frank Crary UC Berkeley ------------------------------ Date: 14 May 91 15:43:44 GMT From: usc!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!caen!news.cs.indiana.edu!maytag!watmath!watdragon!watyew!jdnicoll@ucsd.edu (James Davis Nicoll) Subject: Re: SPACE Digest V13 #517 In article dlbres10@pc.usl.edu (Fraering Philip) writes: >Re: my comments about terraforming one of Jupiter's satellites: > >Can't any of you guys see the humor in a post without the smiley >for once? Certainly. See my brief monograph 'Humour Detection in the absence of Humour Notation Symbols, in Electronic Media'. I think the section on sci.space is in volume eight. James Nicoll ------------------------------ Date: 11 May 91 18:50:20 GMT From: dog.ee.lbl.gov!hellgate.utah.edu!caen!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!unix.cis.pitt.edu!pitt!nss!freed@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (Bev Freed) Subject: Toward 2001 - 13 May *********** TOWARD 2001 *********** Week of 13 May 1991 A Weekly Feature of SPACE CALENDAR + = Domestic (USA) Earth event * = Domestic (USA) space event o = International Earth event # = International space event -------------------------------------------------------------------- REPRINT INFORMATION This information is reproduced by permission of the Space Age Publishing Company. All rights reserved. Copyright May 13, 1991. Reproduction in any form without written permission violates federal statute with penalty of up to $50,000. SPACE CALENDAR is edited and published on the Big `Space' Island of Hawaii. ==================================================================== * * * * * * * + Space Station Cost Washington DC The General Accounting Office estimates that over a 30 year lifetime, Space Station Freedom will cost $118 billion to maintain, supply, and operate. Comptroller General Charles Bowsher corrected NASA's construction estimates for the reduced station upward to $40 billion. * * * * * * * + Satellite Network Systems Inc St Paul MN A major study by SNS reveals "a strong need for greater satellite capacity and simplified operating procedures" in Europe, according to president and CEO Paul Heinerscheid. The study is based on extensive interviews of private broadcasters and regulatory officials in Europe. * * * * * * * o Global Satellite Communications Nanjing, China The China Institute of Communications and Intelsat together will sponsor a symposium `Global Satellite Communications' on 28-31 May 1991 in Nanjing. More than 30 sessions will focus on new technologies and ideas, and on financial, legal, and cultural issues. * * * * * * * o Dornier / ERS-1 Friedrichshafen, Germany ERS-1, which should be in orbit if an early May launch was on time and successful, results from a consortium of 50 companies from 14 nations, coordinated under prime contractor Dornier GmbH. More than 3,000 engineers worked on the project over a 10 year period. * * * * * * * + Spaceport Florida Cocoa Beach FL A bill recently passed by the state legislature will give the Spaceport Florida Authority greater latitude in selling bonds to pay for projects involving private businesses and to join with state universities to build space research and launch facilities. * * * * * * * + Delta Launch Complex 2 Changes Vandenberg AFB CA McDonnell Douglas personnel are raising the service tower 12 feet and installing a larger RP-1 fuel tank to allow the complex to accommodate the Delta II rocket. The upgraded Delta will be used to launch NASA's Polar satellite in mid-1993. * * * * * * * + UAH / USSR Tour Huntsville AL / Moscow USSR The University of Alabama in Huntsville is sponsoring "Soviet Aerospace Trip: A Business and Cultural Experience" for two-weeks, beginning on 6 September 1991. UAH will arrange for meetings between participants and their Soviet counterparts. * * * * * * * + Dept of Energy / SEI Washington DC A recent Washington Post article by Kathy Sawyer points out that the DOE is requesting $142 million for Space Exploration Initiative research while NASA is only requesting $94 million. * * * * * * * + Milky Way Radio Emissions Albuquerque NM Astronomers are puzzled by a source of radio waves that vary greatly over short periods -- a highly unusual cosmic event. The source was discovered on 11 March by Jun-Hui Zhao, a Beijing astronomer conducting studies at New Mexico's Very Large Array telescope. * * * * * * * + Lunar Footnote (Statistic) 6,724 Days Since Moon last visited by humans. * * * * * * * o International Space Year 1992 (Quotation) "The most important policy objective of the ISY . . . is to instill a new Space Age frame of reference in the thoughts and actions of governments and individuals." -- The late U S Senator Spark M Matsunaga, Hawaii -------------------------------------------------------------------- ABOUT SPACE CALENDAR Space Calendar provides a weekly preview of upcoming events in the space industry. It is published weekly by the SPACE AGE PUBLISHING COMPANY from offices in Kailua-Kona, Hawaii. For a free sample of the printed publication, use the address, telephone, or fax numbers for the Hawaii office listed below. SPACE AGE PUBLISHING COMPANY also publishes SPACE FAX DAILY from its offices in Cupertino, California. For information about SPACE FAX DAILY use the address, telephone, or fax numbers for the California office listed below. HAWAII OFFICE: 75-5751 Kuakini Highway, Suite 209, Kailua-Kona HI 96740; 808-326-2014, fax 808-326-1825. CALIFORNIA OFFICE: 20431 Steven Creek Blvd, Cupertino CA 95054; 408-996-9210, fax 408-996-2125. ==================================================================== --- Opus-CBCS 1.14 * Origin: NSS BBS - Ad Astra! (412)366-5208 *HST* (1:129/104.0) -- Bev Freed - via FidoNet node 1:129/104 UUCP: ...!pitt!nss!freed INTERNET: freed@nss.FIDONET.ORG ------------------------------ Date: 14 May 91 21:43:45 GMT From: agate!stanford.edu!snorkelwacker.mit.edu!usc!samsung!spool.mu.edu!munnari.oz.au!comp.vuw.ac.nz!waikato.ac.nz!pjs1@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU Subject: Press kits/ STS FAQ/ Thank you In reply to my inquiry about old press kits I received a few replies (Thank you). These tended to fall into two categories. a) Directions to the /pub/SPACE/PRESS.KITS directory. Available through anoymous ftp at ames.arc.nasa.gov. There is a good chance I might be able to do some ftp'ing in a couple of months so I'll get them then. If anyone knows of other worthwhile ftp sites I'd appreciate some mail. (Maybe a directory list for /pub/SPACE ?). b) Requests for me to forward any press kits I did get. Unfortunately I am unable to do this as I don't have international mail privledges (as yet :)) hence my putting this here instead of mailing it to the individuals involved. Is anyone interested in putting together a FAQ post about shuttle missions. ie. STS-??, crew, payload, anything else of note? I would be prepared to do one but do not have enough information currently, or much time (so why am I on news? :)). Finally a note to all contributers to sci.space. I have always been interested in space matters (I want to be an astronaut dad :)) but growing up in New Zealand has limited what I can find on the subject (If it wasn't for this news group I would not have known the shuttle had been launched and/or Gallileo was in trouble, etc). I have also found that the discussions tend to remain fresh and interesting, ie. as soon as a yes/no battle begins to stagnate a new topic apears. So in conclusion, THANK YOU. ------------------------------ Date: 15 May 91 04:08:45 GMT From: cis.ohio-state.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!sdd.hp.com!spool.mu.edu!munnari.oz.au!mel.dit.csiro.au!dmp.csiro.au!sfy@tut.cis.ohio-state.edu (Shane Youl) Subject: Locating Cape Canaveral A colleague of mine will soon be in the US and would like to visit Cape Canaveral. Could someone give me an appropriate postal address and/or FAX number for contacting NASA about visits to the various installations. ADVthanksANCE -- ____ _____ ____ ____ Shane Youl / \ / / / \ / \ CSIRO Division of Mineral Products / /_____ / /_____/ / / PO Box 124 Port Melbourne 3207 / / / / \ / / ------------------------------ Date: 14 May 91 03:18:51 GMT From: snorkelwacker.mit.edu!spool.mu.edu!cs.umn.edu!kksys!wd0gol!newave!john@bloom-beacon.mit.edu (John A. Weeks III) Subject: Re: 2001 and "The Endeavor" In article <1991May12.045943.24244@leland.Stanford.EDU> rick@pangea.Stanford.EDU (Rick Ottolini) writes: > The introduction of the Endeavor shuttle with the theme music from "2001" > was bitersweet to me. When I first saw the movie, a year before the moon > landing, I thought many of the things in the movie would occur by that time. > It looks like they won't. Did you see or read 2010? Nine years after 2001, the US still hadn't sent a follow up mission after the loss of contact with Discovery. And in 2010, the next US Jupiter mission was still years off, despite having found something worth checking out. According to the book, even when NASA had a clear cut goal to chase, they still wandered around aimlessly. The more things change, the more things stay the same.... We (the human race, not just the US) might be a little bit behind the 2001 schedule, but it will happen someday. -john- -- ============================================================================= John A. Weeks III (612) 942-6969 john@newave.mn.org NeWave Communications, Ltd. ...uunet!tcnet!newave!john ------------------------------ Date: 15 May 91 00:57:44 GMT From: cis.ohio-state.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!samsung!rex!rouge!dlbres10@tut.cis.ohio-state.edu (Fraering Philip) Subject: Re: Why the space station? In article <2826@ke4zv.UUCP> gary@ke4zv.UUCP (Gary Coffman) writes: >statistical sampling would be an enormous waste. A Soviet style >land, grab the first thing at hand, and blast off for home is >hardly of enormous scientific value. You would want a system that >could rove around and take representative samples from many locations. >This phase could take months, probably over a year. Then you'd need >a return craft capable of returning all those samples. We're talking >lots of mass out and back. Without HLV we must assemble in space or >forego the mission. The sort of unmanned/manned sample-return mission a lot of people would probably like to see would be one which brought back several tens of tons of core samples from the polar caps. The polar caps may have locked up in them a record of the climate of Mars over its 4.5 billion year history. Mars will not be as easy to quantify with an Apollo-style sampling as the moon was. Anyway, even with HLV, the scale I just described would have to be assembled in space or the mission foregone. Even with HLV's, if assembly and on-site resources are not used, you're just going to repeat Apollo. -- Phil Fraering || Usenet (?):dlbres10@pc.usl.edu || YellNet: 318/365-5418 ''It hardly mattered now; it was, in fact, a fine and enviable madness, this delusion that all questions have answers, and nothing is beyond the reach of a strong left arm.`` - Larry Niven and Jerry Pournelle, _The Mote in God's Eye_ ------------------------------ Date: 14 May 91 17:53:42 GMT From: sdd.hp.com!uakari.primate.wisc.edu!caen!ox.com!hela!aws@ucsd.edu (Allen W. Sherzer) Subject: Re: Saturn V and the ALS In article <1991May13.162458.2041@zoo.toronto.edu> henry@zoo.toronto.edu (Henry Spencer) writes: >I have to side with NASA on this one, I'm afraid. How long will it take >to get "cheaper approaches" into production? Should be doable in five years. We fund HL Delta and Titan V for heavy lift. We buy a Soyuz or rebuild a simple Apollo CSM to transport crew. To finish it off, we build a simple space station (perhaps the LLNL plan of something from the SSI ET study). All of this should be doable for about one years Shuttle costs. This would give us every capability the Shuttle now has. It would also be cheaper and allow more work to be done. Allen -- +---------------------------------------------------------------------------+ |Allen W. Sherzer | Allen's tactics are too tricky to deal with | | aws@iti.org | -- Harel Barzilai | +---------------------------------------------------------------------------+ ------------------------------ Date: 14 May 91 22:20:09 GMT From: snorkelwacker.mit.edu!spool.mu.edu!news.nd.edu!mentor.cc.purdue.edu!noose.ecn.purdue.edu!en.ecn.purdue.edu!irvine@bloom-beacon.mit.edu (/dev/null) Subject: Re: Honking at cyclists... In article <1991May14.213153.12937@bradley.bradley.edu>, moonman@buhub.bradley.edu (Craig Levin) writes: > > Excuse me, gentlemen, but perhaps this string ought to be > conducted in sci.environment or sci.energy? Well, this discussion is neither about pollution nor energy although it is certainly a germaine issue in the discussion. It is about motivation to space colonization, its economics, etc. It has gotten a bit off track, but forgive me (& the others) and place it in a kill file if it continues in the vein you dislike... :) :) -- +-----------------------------------------------------------------------+ | Society of Philosophers, Luminaries, | Brent L. Irvine | | and Other Professional Thinking People..... | Only my own ramblings | +-----------------------------------------------------------------------+ ------------------------------ Date: 14 May 91 15:35:28 GMT From: pasteur!dog.ee.lbl.gov!hellgate.utah.edu!caen!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!rpi!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!utgpu!watserv1!watdragon!watyew!jdnicoll@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (James Davis Nicoll) Subject: Re: Honking at cyclists... Granted, C is the important limit on how fast we could grow (and I did say at one point 'ignoring C' when I was talking about Eating The Universe) but all that means is that we run out of resources to continue our current growth rates sooner rather than later. I was disagreeing with the thesis 'Human wants will grow unbounded, and so will our use of resources'. Anyway, if there are 5x10**9 humans at 50 kg each, and they grow at 3% a year, and the universe masses 100x10**9 (Number of stars) x 100x10**9 (number of galaxies)x1000 (Fudge factor in case there's *lots* of dark matter) x 2x10**33 kg (mass of a sol-type star), it still only takes ~3700 years (Given no speed limit) for the mass of all humans to equal the mass of the universe. Since we can't ignore the C limit, our rate of increase of demand will *have* to decrease before AD 5700. Note I am *not* saying the standard of living of all humanity couldn't be indefinitely maintained at a higher level than today. I just saying it won't grow forever. Are we agreeing yet? James Nicoll ------------------------------ End of SPACE Digest V13 #559 *******************