From: Digestifier To: Linux-Misc@senator-bedfellow.mit.edu Reply-To: Linux-Misc@senator-bedfellow.mit.edu Date: Sat, 21 Aug 93 18:13:20 EDT Subject: Linux-Misc Digest #36 Linux-Misc Digest #36, Volume #1 Sat, 21 Aug 93 18:13:20 EDT Contents: Re: NT versus Linux, the updated and expanded comparison chart (Alan Cox) Re: Reboot problem tied to shadow BIOS (Ed Carp) PCIMA-Ethernet ? (michael kraehe) Who was that masked man? (Phil Johnson) Re: A question about the SLS sysinstall script's copyright (Byron A Jeff) XFree & Truecolour - when ? (Chris Royle) Unix for sale (Scott Barker) Re: Why would I want LINUX? (Mark Lord) Re: linux DOS emu and double space (Marc van Kempen) Re: gif/jpeg viewer (ChienAn Chen) Re: Who was that masked man? (steve.mcmahon@launchpad.unc.edu) Bug: 0.99pl12 falsely reports 'Device or resource busy' (Arlindo Oliveira) ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy From: iiitac@swan.pyr (Alan Cox) Subject: Re: NT versus Linux, the updated and expanded comparison chart Date: Sat, 21 Aug 1993 15:56:07 GMT In article kevin@frobozz.sccsi.com (Kevin Brown) writes: >For Immediate Release: NT versus Linux, a feature comparison >------------------------------------------------------------ Oh no here we go again. This is fun > >Feature NT Linux >------- -- ----- > >microkernel yes no (monolithic) ^-- Microkernels are a performance misfeature. >kernel size 50k 350k-500k ^-- + about 0.5Mb on our March beta to get up and going. ^- 230K my home kernel >loadable device >drivers yes yes (available) The NT ones go further than Linux in what can be loaded/not loaded >true dynamic link >libraries (DLL) yes yes (shared) > >per-application DLLs yes yes, if you're root :-) No you don't need to be root these days. Anyone can build per application shared libraries. However you don't need to. The Linux memory manager does it all correctly anyway. >integrated GUI yes no (add-on, X) ^-- the NT GUI aint integrated - its just an optional loadable module that everyone uses. > >drag and drop yes depends on GUI and/or > application > >DDE support yes sockets, local and network interprocess communications > >max chars in file name unlimited 14-255, depending on > filesystem. Most have > 255. I can't see anything in the code giving a 255 limit just the current FS >max partition size unlimited 64 meg -~2 gig, This is wrong: The NT structs ^^^ have a max size they can return off system calls. > depending on > filesystem. Most have > ~2 gig. >C2 securiy yes no (easily implemented) ^-dunno how easy... >memory model flat flat > >multiple platforms yes not currently. 680x0 > under development > >runs unix apps yes (source level, yes (source level) > limited POSIX subset > only) > >runs DOS apps yes yes, via emulator > >runs Windows apps yes not currently. Under > development. > >max addressable mem 2048 Gig 4 Gig ^- But not per process. >multimedia support yes application level only ^- you are having MAJOR concept problems aren't you the multimedia support is just DLLs (shared libs). >QIC-80 support yes yes >minimum CPU 486 386sx ^-- NT is OK on a 386DX33 >min required mem 12 meg 2 meg (4 meg w/ X) > >min required disk space 60 meg 10-20 meg (base system) > 40 meg (w/ X) >networking stable stable ^-- our march beta wasn't! > >price $110 (educational) $69 (SLS), free via > ~$300 (normal price) ftp or BBS. > >source available no yes >source price not applicable free >freely redistributable no yes > >bug fix response time several months, minimum immediate. Several > weeks at most. > >application availability limited to DOS, Windows DOS, Unix (almost all > source-available > applications) > >coexists with other OSes unknown(probably) yes ^- Fairly well Now how about adding Networked Window Support no yes (X11) >A couple of comments: I don't know what DDE is, so I can't say if Linux >has it or not. Probably not. DDE is interprocess comms. Linux uses sockets/pipes for the same purpose. >Multimedia programs for Linux may exist. I haven't heard of them, so I'll >assume that they don't. But why in the world would you want multimedia >support in the KERNEL??? If the applications can run efficiently enough, >you don't need it. SLS comes with an MPEG player. The berkeley MPEG encoder compiles under Linux. (Haven't run it yet). It has sound card support. There is _NO_ multimedia support in the NT kernel, its shared library (DLL) support. ------------------------------ From: erc@khijol.uucp (Ed Carp) Subject: Re: Reboot problem tied to shadow BIOS Date: Sat, 21 Aug 1993 17:01:34 GMT Mahatma Kane-Jeeves (mkj@world.std.com) wrote: : The other night, for no known reason, I decided to try it with BIOS : shadowing turned OFF, and guess what? That cured the problem! My : Linux now reboots normally. But of course I'll want to re-enable : shadowing sooner or later -- it makes a big difference in speed. Not under linux, it doesn't. Linux bypasses the BIOS, so BIOS shadowing won't make any difference. -- Ed Carp, N7EKG erc@apple.com 510/659-9560 anon-0001@khijol.uucp If you want magic, let go of your armor. Magic is so much stronger than steel! -- Richard Bach, "The Bridge Across Forever" ------------------------------ From: kraehe@bakunin.north.de (michael kraehe) Subject: PCIMA-Ethernet ? Date: 20 Aug 93 16:37:45 GMT Hy folks, i wanna get rit of my old olivetti laptop (12 kilos) and think abbout buying a notbook, but there is one luxus I dont want to leave. *** Ethernet *** If you think about a 200 MB harddisk and an a tape somewhere in the net, I realy net ethernet, so what about pcmcia cards. Is there one which runs with linux (perhaps NE200T) By Michael -- PS : Unfortunately I dont have real news Access now :-( That means Im reading news about every week because lack of time. So write by mail if you wanna answer me ! __________________ | Michael Kraehe |_________________________ | 2819 Finkenburg | kraehe@bakunin.north.de |__________________ | +49 4204 1497 | V32bis : +49 421 870532 | ceterum censeo / |_________________| Voice : +49 421 875500 | MSDOS / (___________________________| delendam esse \ (___________________\ ------------------------------ Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy From: pjohnson@nyx.cs.du.edu (Phil Johnson) Subject: Who was that masked man? Date: Sat, 21 Aug 93 18:57:24 GMT In article benti4@cserve.cs.adfa.oz.au (Tim J.Benham) writes: >Mail to brileary@world.std.com bounces. Also > >% finger brileary@world.std.com >[world.std.com] >world -- The World -- Public Access UNIX -- Solbourne 6E/900 OS/MP 4.1A.3 > 8:23am up 2 days, 14:40, 23 users, load average: 1.84, 1.17, 1.00 > >%No matches for brileary > >What conclusions may be drawn? These articles are forgeries. Notice the difference between the paths in a 'Brian Leary' article and another by a real world.std.com account. > Article: 432 of comp.os.linux.misc > Path: mnemosyne.cs.du.edu!uunet!cs.utexas.edu!swrinde!network.ucsd.edu!news.service.uci.edu!ucivax!gateway > From: brileary@world.std.com (Brian Leary) > Subject: Re: NT versus Linux > Message-ID: <930821002107.23308@world> > Newsgroups: comp.os.linux.misc,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy > Article: 108 of comp.os.linux.misc > Newsgroups: comp.os.linux.misc > Path: mnemosyne.cs.du.edu!uunet!world!entropy > From: entropy@world.std.com (Lawrence Foard) > Subject: Re: High speed modems & Linux > Message-ID: There isn't anything in common between the two paths. Now to see a little more, here is the headers from a 'Brian Leary' article from another machine. > From brileary@world.std.com Sat Aug 21 11:18:22 PDT 1993 > Article: 229 of comp.os.linux.misc > Path: socrates!news.mic.ucla.edu!library.ucla.edu!ddsw1!news.kei.com!sol.ctr.columbia.edu!howland.reston.ans.net!europa.eng.gtefsd.com!uunet!news.claremont.edu!ucivax!gateway > From: brileary@world.std.com (Brian Leary) > Subject: Re: NT versus Linux > Message-ID: <930819201354.23155@world> > Newsgroups: comp.os.linux.misc,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy Here you can see that the only things in common between the two paths is the ucivax!gateway. A quick check in the spool for other articles with this in their path reveals Steve McMahon has the same termination of his path in comp.os.linux.misc, in comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy there is also one non-'Brian Leary' article from ucivax!gateway (and from the same site as Steve). This one is a bit more interesting. > Path: socrates!news.mic.ucla.edu!library.ucla.edu!agate!howland.reston.ans.net!usc!news.service.uci.edu!ucivax!gateway > From: ed.duomo@lambada.oit.unc.edu (Cousin Ed) > Subject: NT versus Linux > Message-ID: <930818233207.23008@lambada> > Newsgroups: comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy > Lines: 37 > Date: 19 Aug 93 03:33:49 GMT > > I saw this on a local BBS, not sure if it's accurate though. > > For Immdediate Release: NT versus Linux, a feature comparison > ------------------------------------------------------------- > > Feature NT Linux > ------- -- ----- > > microkernel yes no (monolethic) > kernel size 50k 350k [....] Seems pretty likely that the original poster of this little piece of flame-bait and the person forging the articles are the same person. The site is LaUNChpad, I don't know how easy it is to forge articles from there, but I don't any other possibilities. There are probably others out there who could say more about this. But then again I don't know that this guy is worth the effort. I guess I'll take off my amateur sleuth hat and ignore this guy, he's had more fun out of this than he deserves. >-- >Tim J.Benham Living proof that Genetic Algorithms work... >benti4@cserve.cs.adfa.oz.au -- Phil Johnson johnsonp@nicco.sscnet.ucla.edu ------------------------------ From: byron@cc.gatech.edu (Byron A Jeff) Subject: Re: A question about the SLS sysinstall script's copyright Date: Sat, 21 Aug 1993 19:15:45 GMT > No he cannot. These scripts were made specifically for the interface > and installation of a GPLed product (linux), hence they fall under the > GPL. If Peter made them for OS/2 or NT it would be another matter, but > not here. > >Ummm...isn't the problem that Slackware was attempting to use Peter's shell >scripts *without* properly acknowledging him ? (i.e. they removed the >copyright info...) I don't see Peter restricting the distribution of *anything*, >not even his scripts, as long as they retain proper attributions of the work >(isn't *that* the "spirit" of the GPL ?) The attribution is there. In fact Patrick even acknowledges that he started from SLS in his announce file. The copyrights are in place for doinstall even to the "freely distribute, don't restrict" line in it. Kind of ironic. >John >-- >John Burton G & A Technical Software, Inc. >jcburt@gatsibm.larc.nasa.gov 28 Research Dr. Hampton, Va. 23666 >jcburt@gast486.larc.nasa.gov (804) 865-7491 BAJ --- Another random extraction from the mental bit stream of... Byron A. Jeff - PhD student operating in parallel! Georgia Tech, Atlanta GA 30332 Internet: byron@cc.gatech.edu ------------------------------ From: c@royle.org (Chris Royle) Subject: XFree & Truecolour - when ? Date: Sun, 22 Aug 1993 16:07:18 GMT I have been tempted for a while to splash out on one of the big 3MB local bus video cards that do true colour at stupidly high resolutions, but XFree doesn't support trucolour yet. Anyone got any ideas when it might ? Chris. -- Chris Royle Cheap mail & news feeds over UUCP from UKP5/mo Managing Director Windows / X-Windows code, 386s from UKP540 Objectronix Limited Desktop publishing Leeds, UK Tel. +44 532 661536 ------------------------------ Crossposted-To: comp.unix.misc,comp.unix.sys5.r3,comp.unix.sys5.r4,comp.unix.sys5.misc,comp.unix.pc-clone.16bit,comp.unix.pc-clone.32bit,comp.os.linux From: barker@enel.ucalgary.ca (Scott Barker) Subject: Unix for sale Date: Sat, 21 Aug 1993 20:29:05 GMT Reply-To: barker@enel.ucalgary.ca I'm selling my DELL Unix SVR4, Issue 2.2. Included is: Installation disks (3.5 and 5.25) Installation tape (250M QIC and 2G DAT) Unlimited user upgrade "Working with Dell Unix" Release notes, etc. This all costs about $1700 (Cdn) from Dell ($1000 (Cdn) if you have them install it on a Dell purchased machine). I'm asking $900 (Cdn) OBO. I'm selling because I need the cash (DELL Unix works wonderfully, it hasn't crashed on me yet - I've been up since December 1992). Interested parties can e-mail me at barker@enel.ucalgary.ca -- Scott Barker barker@enel.ucalgary.ca ------------------------------ Crossposted-To: comp.os.386bsd.misc From: mlord@bnr.ca (Mark Lord) Subject: Re: Why would I want LINUX? Date: Sat, 21 Aug 93 20:32:51 GMT In article <252n71$2d4@fnnews.fnal.gov> dejan@cdfsga.fnal.gov writes: ... > Now, the copmarison. Those were EXACTLY THE SAME MACHINES. Bought from >a same vendor, exactly the same equipment inside, 387 FPU in both of them. >Fortran on DOS was an expensive commercial product, it was dos 5.0 if I >remember well, and under DOS the program ran about a minute and five seconds >on both of them. We ran the program on BSD, fifteen seconds. Well, I know >that in real mode 386 emulates 32bit integer operations, but FOUR TIMES >FASTER!? Get real! Most of this speedup is very likely due to the quality of the 386-specific C compiler used on BSD. But then, that *is* a valid thing to include in many such comparisms. However, were the program built for MSDOS with a compiler that generated code of similar quality, the two run-times (excluding any IO) would then compare much more closely. With a decent MSDOS cache (HYPERDISK) even the I/O would be as good for DOS as for BSD (if not better). -- mlord@bnr.ca Mark Lord BNR Ottawa,Canada 613-763-7482 ------------------------------ From: wmbfmk@rw7.urc.tue.nl (Marc van Kempen) Subject: Re: linux DOS emu and double space Date: 21 Aug 1993 22:59:19 +0200 inu574f@lindblat.cc.monash.edu.au (Mark Cosham) writes: >mgrstk@NeXTwork.Rose-Hulman.Edu (Albatross) writes: >>Quick question: >>Can a doublespace partition be accessed to through the Linux DOS emulator ? >Shouldn't be a problem - many people run Stacker/Doublespace through the >emulator without problems. It IS not even a problem, I'm using one right now, without problems sofar. Although I understood that there were still bugs in dos 6.0's doublespace, so I'm considering to get rid of it. Marc. ------------------------------ From: giant@merle.acns.nwu.edu (ChienAn Chen) Subject: Re: gif/jpeg viewer Date: 21 Aug 1993 21:23:34 GMT In article jz@jupiter.cs.swin.oz.au (Janus Zhuang) writes: >swheeler@netcom.com (Sean Wheeler) writes: > >>Does anyone know of a non-X based gif and/or jpeg viewer for Linux? >>I am tired of having to convert jpeg to gif and move the gifs to dos just >>to view them. > >>-- >>Sean D. Wheeler swheeler@netcom.com >>"alt.tasteless is never having to say your sorry..." > >Try the xv. It is working on my system. > >You can get from EXPORT (18.24.0.12) :/contrib/xv-3.00a.tar.Z > >Good Luck > >Janus Zhuang >jz@jupiter.cs.swin.oz.au > I think xv run under X11. If you don't want to run X11, try spic. It's available on sunsite. -- ------------------===--===--===------------------- Chien-An Chen (giant@eecs.nwu.edu) EECS of Northwestern University ------------------------------ From: steve.mcmahon@launchpad.unc.edu Subject: Re: Who was that masked man? Crossposted-To: comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy Date: 21 Aug 93 21:31:01 GMT Nope, nothing to do with that fuckhead. The header you see is because I'm using the mail gateway. It does seem possible, however, to forge articles, I just checked, so I suspect he does. -Steve ------------------------------ From: aml@surf.Berkeley.EDU (Arlindo Oliveira) Subject: Bug: 0.99pl12 falsely reports 'Device or resource busy' Date: 21 Aug 1993 22:07:24 GMT I posted about this once and got no answers, but it is hard to believe I am the only one facing this problem. After upgrading to pl12 (from pl10) I am no longer able to umount file systems, even when they are not being used. It doesn't happen all the time but if there was any activity at all in the file system being umounted, (previously, not while umounting it) chances are I won't be able to umount it. When I boot the old kernel (pl10) everything runs smoothly. It happens at least with minix and ext2 file systems, both in the hard disk and in floppies. As for my setting: 0.99pl12 compiled with gcc2.4.5 and number of tasks (in tasks.h) increased to 128. Got many warnings in the compilation (unsigned to signed pointer and so on) but otherwise was normal. libc4.4.2 from SLS 1.03 Tried several different versions of the mount/umount commands. If anyone has run into this, please let me know. =:=:=:=:=:==:=:=:=:=:==:=:=:=:=:==:=:=:=:=:==:=:=:=:=:==:=:=:=:=:==:=:=:=:=:= Arlindo Oliveira 207-194 Cory Hall UC Berkeley, BERKELEY CA 94720 Office: (510) 642-1462 Fax: (510) 643-5052 Home: (408) 253-3345 email: aml@ic.berkeley.edu Actually, Occam wore a beard: philosophers kept borrowing his razor. ------------------------------ ** FOR YOUR REFERENCE ** The service address, to which questions about the list itself and requests to be added to or deleted from it should be directed, is: Internet: Linux-Misc-Request@NEWS-DIGESTS.MIT.EDU You can send mail to the entire list (and comp.os.linux.misc) via: Internet: Linux-Misc@NEWS-DIGESTS.MIT.EDU Linux may be obtained via one of these FTP sites: nic.funet.fi pub/OS/Linux tsx-11.mit.edu pub/linux sunsite.unc.edu pub/Linux End of Linux-Misc Digest ******************************