Subject: Linux-Misc Digest #328
From: Digestifier <Linux-Misc-Request@senator-bedfellow.MIT.EDU>
To: Linux-Misc@senator-bedfellow.MIT.EDU
Reply-To: Linux-Misc@senator-bedfellow.MIT.EDU
Date:     Tue, 28 Jun 94 11:13:16 EDT

Linux-Misc Digest #328, Volume #2                Tue, 28 Jun 94 11:13:16 EDT

Contents:
  Re: Advice on which large IDE HD to buy .... (Richard W Kaszeta)
  COSE for Linux ??? (Dean Domikulic)
  Slackware and Mitsumi CDROM (sysop@comet.sb.sub.de)
  Overflow dumps core (Ralf Corsepius)
  Re: Watching a user on an tty? (Scott Dawson)
  Re: Watching a user on an tty? (Holger Muenx)
  Re: Watching a user on an tty? (Holger Muenx)
  Re: Youngest linux user (William Devine II)
  RE: Youngest linux user (horne@mhd2.pfc.mit.edu)
  #9GXE 64 X server! (Paul Quinn)
  Again: Serial bidirectional file transfer. (Holger Muenx)
  Information needed about Linux > version 0.12 and < Version 0.99 (Norbert Kuemin)
  Re: X resources (was Re: Why cannot xterm use -bg option in .xinitrc ?) (Glen Reesor)
  Re: Watching a user on an tty? (Temporaerer Mitarbeiter IR)
  Re: X resources (was Re: Why cannot xterm use -bg option in .xinitrc ?) (Mark Dobie)
  Re: Watching a user on an tty? (Tim Smith)
  Re: Why cannot xterm use -bg option in .xinitrc ? (John Martinez)
  Re: Enhanced IDE with Linux? (Kenneth Tan)

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: kaszeta@arctic.uucp (Richard W Kaszeta)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.help
Subject: Re: Advice on which large IDE HD to buy ....
Date: 28 Jun 1994 12:26:55 GMT

asktan@ntuix.ntu.ac.sg (Kenneth Tan) writes:

>Don't buy anything larger than 528MB (1024 cyl, 16 hd, 63 sect).  Even
>though the disk geometries are pretty meaningless, now that they are all
>Zone-Bit-Recording, they are still being used by Linux and DOS.
>[I've got a 540Mb and had a really rough time with Linux and DOS...
> personally, I'd recommend you get the 420Mb instead.]

I'd recommend _against_ a western digital 420 Meg Hard Drive. Although
it always worked flawlessly under DOS and OS/2, Linux chokes on it.
If I partition it with DOS or OS/2, then linux won't recognize the
existing partitions. If I paritition it with Linux, it only lets me
format 120 Meg of the drive...

Still haven't puzzled this one out.



------------------------------

From: domikuli@cromath.math.hr (Dean Domikulic)
Subject: COSE for Linux ???
Date: 27 Jun 1994 17:58:47 GMT

Hi

Just one question please.

Are the stuffs from COSE avaliable for Linux?
( I'm interested in Sun's Mailtool, Calendar Manager, Ftptool, ToolTalk
  and IXI Desktop File Manager)

Thanks for any informations.

domikuli@math.hr


------------------------------

From: sysop@comet.sb.sub.de
Subject: Slackware and Mitsumi CDROM
Date: 27 Jun 1994 08:01:49 +0200

Hi,
Thanks to all who answered me.
The Problem is solved.
I took some time to recompile the Kernel, but it works
real good now...



Richard Koenig +-----------------------+ Comet-Link
says: RAVING ! ! Sysop@comet.sb.sub.de ! +49-621-28823
what else ?    +-----------------------+ Mannheim, Germany

------------------------------

From: corsepiu@faw.uni-ulm.de (Ralf Corsepius)
Subject: Overflow dumps core
Date: 27 Jun 1994 18:02:38 GMT

If the result of multiplying two floating point 
variables exceeds MAXFLOAT, my linux box dumps a core 
with a FLOATING POINT EXCEPTION.

The same program run with Solaris2.3 produces NaN (Not a
Number). 

Does anybody have an explanation for this?

Ralf.

------------------------------

From: sdawson@engin.umich.edu (Scott Dawson)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.admin
Subject: Re: Watching a user on an tty?
Date: 27 Jun 94 14:02:40

   >>The original poster has a valid point there - this really helps for software
   >>support, as well as seeing what an intruder is doing to hack around the
   >>system or if he/she's planting any kind of bombs... 
   >
   >And finding out passwords, eh?  I don't mean just login, but PGP, for
   >instance.  I sure wouldn't appreciate my SysAdmin doing that to me.

   First of all, passwords through ``login'' and ``passwd'' aren't echoed by
   the respective programs; when's the last time _you_ saw your password being
   echoed when you logged on?  Also, there's _no_ reason why PGP can't be told
   to not echo passwords (assuming that it currently does); in fact, it
   _should_ be told to not show passwords.

   So where's the problem?


uh, if you can read/snoop the tty, you can watch what's typed whether it
gets echoed or not.  I believe that's the problem.

-Scott

------------------------------

From: muenx@speedy.informatik.uni-dortmund.de (Holger Muenx)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.admin
Subject: Re: Watching a user on an tty?
Date: 28 Jun 1994 12:40:00 GMT

In article <2ull0m$l69@nwfocus.wa.com>, danubius@coho.halcyon.com (Joe Pannon) writes:
|> In article <2uljkm$90i@marlin.ssnet.com>,
|> Dan Foster <dsfoster@marlin.ssnet.com> wrote:
|> >The original poster has a valid point there - this really helps for software
|> >support, as well as seeing what an intruder is doing to hack around the
|> >system or if he/she's planting any kind of bombs... 
|> And finding out passwords, eh?  I don't mean just login, but PGP, for
|> instance.  I sure wouldn't appreciate my SysAdmin doing that to me.

There will be a little note in my /etc/issue mentioning such a mechaism.
There is a simple policy for my users if they do not like being watched:
They always can log off.

Holger Muenx (muenx@heike.informatik.uni-dortmund.de)

------------------------------

From: muenx@speedy.informatik.uni-dortmund.de (Holger Muenx)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.admin
Subject: Re: Watching a user on an tty?
Date: 28 Jun 1994 12:43:00 GMT

In article <2um6t4$m1t@urmel.informatik.rwth-aachen.de>, rabe@rama.informatik.rwth-aachen.de (Ralf G. R. Bergs) writes:
|> >Lots of possibilities. You might for example replace his login shell
|> >by a small script that does a tee(1) or starts a pty like script(1)
|> >or something similar.
|> >Or was your purpose to help the user remember his password?
|> You'd better asked that BEFORE you told him how to do it... :-)))

See, if I am interested in my user's private data I do not need to
get their passwords but just change into root and can browse arround.

Let's skip this pointless discussion.

Holger Muenx (muenx@heike.informatik.uni-dortmund.de)

------------------------------

From: wdevine@pvcea.pvamu.edu (William Devine II)
Subject: Re: Youngest linux user
Date: 28 Jun 1994 12:41:08 GMT

rhh@tachy.uah.ualberta.ca (Roy Hann) writes:

>: sto2@netaxs.com (Brian Stoler) wrote:
>: 
>:  > John Bryan (jhonsrid@drealm.drealm.org) wrote:
>:  > : Btw, the youngest linux user I know is 15. Is that some kind of
>:  > record?
>:  > Do I hold the record? :)
>: Hm. If you're administering it yourself: Sort of.. In regard to the
>: original question 'bout the youngest _user_ I know about younger ones:

My younger sister started using VMS and then went on to Unix as
my various and assorted access increased :-)
she's 14 now and has been using unix for about four to five years now.
And she knows more about the internet than most internet junkies
know of.  she knows more unix than most college students know and
she knows more mud programming than i think anyone would care about.
hell, at 14 she's starting own mud and doing all the programming
and wizard shit on someone elses networked machine.....
i guess a hacker in training......

william

------------------------------

From: horne@mhd2.pfc.mit.edu
Subject: RE: Youngest linux user
Date: 28 JUN 94 14:16:02 GMT

My daughters are 10 and 8.  The 10-year-old uses Emacs to do her school
papers; they both play nethack (interminably).  Probly doesn't count, though.


------------------------------

Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.development
From: p_quinn@ECE.Concordia.CA (Paul Quinn)
Subject: #9GXE 64 X server!
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 1994 01:28:32 GMT


Is there any possibility of getting an X server for the #9GXE 64?  Can you
use the S3 server with this card?  Can you use the SVGA server with this card?

Is anyone about to start developing a server for it?


--
________
Paul Quinn
p_quinn@ece.concordia.ca
Computer Science: Systems Architecture
Concordia University
Montreal, QC, CANADA
========

------------------------------

From: muenx@speedy.informatik.uni-dortmund.de (Holger Muenx)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.admin
Subject: Again: Serial bidirectional file transfer.
Date: 28 Jun 1994 12:58:43 GMT


Guten Tag!

  Before the weekend I asked here for a protocol which allows bidirectional
file transfers over serial lines.

  I have got many answers hinting me to UUCP protocols or SLIP. Thank you!

  Unfortunately, this does not help me because I posted a very weak description
of what I need. Mea culpa.

  So here we go again:

  Most of my users dial in using a MS-DOS machines running Telemate, Telix,
Terminate or some other package. Standard protocols offered by these packages
are Zmodem, Ymodem and similar non-birectional protocols for file transfers.
However, you can install external protocols like HS/Link which allows
bidirectional file transfers.

  Unfortunately, there is no implementation of HS/Link for Linux or other
Unices. So I am looking for another birectional file transfer protocol
available as source code which runs on Linux, MS-DOS and other platforms.

  Any information will be appreciated. Thank you in advance!

Holger Muenx (muenx@heike.informatik.uni-dortmund.de)

------------------------------

From: kuemin@srapc101.alcatel.ch (Norbert Kuemin)
Subject: Information needed about Linux > version 0.12 and < Version 0.99
Date: 28 Jun 1994 14:03:51 GMT
Reply-To: norbert.kuemin@alcatel.ch

I plan to make a history HTML for Linux (actually in german no time to
translate to english).
All i need are information about Linx with Version > 0.12 and Version < 0.99
If anyone intressed by getting these document or if anyone has information
PLEASE send it to norbert.kueminalcatel.ch

This HTML includes original postings from Linus Torvalds found at
sunsite.unc.edu

--
=======================================+=======================================
+----------V----------+ Eltech. ING HTL|EMAIL: norbert.kuemin@alcatel.ch
| A  L  C  A  T  E  L | Norbert Kuemin |DEC:   PSI%(0228)4795123920::ZAD_KUEMIN
+---------------------+ Alcatel STR    |X.400: c=CH a=arCom p=Alcatel
         S T R          CH-8804 Au/ZH  |       s=Kuemin g=Norbert
=======================================+=======================================

------------------------------

Crossposted-To: comp.windows.x.i386unix,comp.os.linux.help
From: glenr@cu74.crl.aecl.ca (Glen Reesor)
Subject: Re: X resources (was Re: Why cannot xterm use -bg option in .xinitrc ?)
Date: Mon, 27 Jun 1994 18:13:07 GMT

UNIX is tough to learn when you're first starting out.  In the beginning 
nothing makes sense, everything is counter-intuitive, and you're generally 
pulling your hair out.  Then things start to click and you love it.
Everything ties together, and you find yourself doing things you could
never have done so easily in something like DOS.

I think some people have forgotten how tough it is in the beginning.  I'm
continually amazed at the volume of postings saying, "UNIX is prefectly
logical.  Just RTFM.  Boy, don't you understand manpages?"

SOAPBOX MODE ON:

I love UNIX, I use vi, I run Linux at home, and I have no plans of switching
to MS-Windows.  But when people preach about RTFM'ing and get annoyed
when a new UNIX user has trouble figuring things out, they must be nuts!

Sure UNIX is more robust than Windows, etc. etc.  But that's the
*operating system*.  Look at the applications and their ease
of use.  Have you ever seen a discussion on how to set the colors or
fonts for an MS-Windows App?  No.  You just click on the appropriate
menu, and set it!  Nice and simple.  Have you seen DOS users trying
to find an easy editor? Nope.  Dos-edit is simple.

People keep saying how wonderful UNIX is, and laugh at people who like
MS-Windows.  Well, for ease of use, MS-Windows blows the doors off
UNIX.  Sit someone down on a UNIX box and sit someone down on a PC
and see who can do their (non-computer related job) faster, and with
the least profanity.

SOAPBOX MODE OFF

In article <2un12p$3hl@bosnia.pop.psu.edu>, barr@pop.psu.edu (David Barr) writes:
>First you read the (gasp) man page to xterm.
>
>Gosh, there's resources listed in there!  It tells what each resource
>does, and what values you can set it to.
>
>In the "See Also", there's a reference to X(1).  Read X(1)
>
>Under X(1), under the RESOURCES section it tells you what resources
>are and their syntax and (another gasp) how to set them.

I challenge you to find a fresh UNIX/X-windows user to figure this out in 1 day. 


>RTFM.
>
>>      You can configure anything in X, but it takes 7-600 page books, 4
>>years+ of a University Education, and 18K man-hours in a dark room to
>>figure out where.
>
>Funny, it's all explained in one 21 page X(1) manual.
                                  ^^
21 pages so you can set some fonts and colors???  I hope you forgot a 
smiley off this one!

Sheeesh.

Glen.

-- 
Glen Reesor                          | Email: glenr@cu74.crl.aecl.ca
AECL Research                        | Phone: (613) 584-3311
Station 92, Building 145             | I speak for myself, not AECL Research.
Chalk River, ON       Canada K0J 1J0 |

------------------------------

From: tempir3@gizmo.Germany.Sun.COM (Temporaerer Mitarbeiter IR)
Subject: Re: Watching a user on an tty?
Date: 28 Jun 1994 14:30:16 GMT
Reply-To: tempir3@gizmo.Germany.Sun.COM

In article sv7@fbi-news.informatik.uni-dortmund.de, muenx@speedy.informatik.uni-dortmund.de (Holger Muenx) writes:

> Let's skip this pointless discussion.
> 
> Holger Muenx (muenx@heike.informatik.uni-dortmund.de)

  sic!

  watching a user's i/o on any device even in most subtle ways is SO basic,
  and moving this into some ethical and especially _public_ discussion is somehow
  displaced in this kind of technical group, at least to this extend.

  michael strerath, sun microsystems, grassbrunn, germany.




------------------------------

From: Mark Dobie <mrd@ecs.soton.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: X resources (was Re: Why cannot xterm use -bg option in .xinitrc ?)
Date: 28 Jun 1994 14:02:49 +0100



In <1994Jun27.181307.1902@cu23.crl.aecl.ca> glenr@cu74.crl.aecl.ca (Glen Reesor) writes:

>of use.  Have you ever seen a discussion on how to set the colors or
>fonts for an MS-Windows App?  No.  You just click on the appropriate
>menu, and set it!  Nice and simple.

Yeah MS windows is really wonderful with fonts. I remember wanting to
change the fonts for my DOS window...oh no, you can only choose from
those few...But they're all rubbish!

What about the font in the title bar? Oh no, that's hard wired into the
display driver...you can't change that. But it's so big...Sorry...

OK, so how do I get my telnet window a different colour then? They all
have to be the same...Oh.

Right, now for the mouse. How do I set focus following the pointer?
You don't...Lovely. Thankfully, there are a couple of free utils that
do this now.

I won't mention trying to set up networking...

>Have you seen DOS users trying to find an easy editor?
>Nope.  Dos-edit is simple.

Personally I was very glad to be able to compile up a vi-clone for DOS,
and there are plenty of people who are glad to use simpler editors on
unix.

My point is that I would much rather read a manual to find out how to
do things than not be able to do them at all! When I was learning X I
used the man pages as a reference. I used the defaults until I wanted
to change them and then looked up how to do it one thing at a time.
Fonts, colours, pointer focus...etc

>People keep saying how wonderful UNIX is, and laugh at people who like
>MS-Windows.  Well, for ease of use, MS-Windows blows the doors off
>UNIX.  Sit someone down on a UNIX box and sit someone down on a PC
>and see who can do their (non-computer related job) faster, and with
>the least profanity.

This has nothing to do with X v MS windows and more to do with
applications.  Sit someone down in front of a well configured X
terminal with a load of commercial X apps available and I expect there
wouldn't be a lot of difference....except the X user gets to use the
network easily and interact with other users and have access to shared
resources and stuff.

ObLinux: Of course, it all depends what you want to do...for me MS
Windows couldn't manage but Linux is the biz!

                                Mark



------------------------------

From: tzs@u.washington.edu (Tim Smith)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.admin
Subject: Re: Watching a user on an tty?
Date: 28 Jun 1994 01:49:57 GMT

If the system administrator wants your password, why would he or she
go to the trouble of snooping on your terminal line?  Why not just change
login to catch it?

--Tim Smith

------------------------------

Crossposted-To: comp.windows.x.i386unix,comp.os.linux.help
From: John Martinez <martinez@rahul.net>
Subject: Re: Why cannot xterm use -bg option in .xinitrc ?
Date: Mon, 27 Jun 1994 14:53:42 GMT

In comp.windows.x.i386unix, Anthony J. Stuckey (stuckey@mrcnext.cso.uiuc.edu) writes:
-> khera@norval.clark.net (Vivek Khera) writes:
-> >Then whenever I run xterm, I get an 80x30 window with 500 lines of
-> >history and a scroll-bar.  And if I'm on a color display, I get khaki
-> >text on a black background (since reverse video is set).  One could
-> >just as easily set both the Background and Foreground resources for
-> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
-> >the vt100 widget.

->      I think here we have a statement of the problem.

->      I have certainly never seen any user's guide which will, even vaguely,
-> tell you what resources each program listens to, what possible values there
-> are, and/or what to do about setting/changing them.

->      You can configure anything in X, but it takes 7-600 page books, 4
-> years+ of a University Education, and 18K man-hours in a dark room to
-> figure out where.

->      Why is there no advertised, obvious way to do this?
-> --
-> Anthony J. Stuckey           stuckey@mrcnext.cso.uiuc.edu
-> "And if you frisbee-throw a universe where does it go?" -- Steve Blunt.
-> GCS/S -d+@ p c(++) l u+ e+(-) m+(*) s+++/-- !n h(*) f+ g+ w+ t+@ r y?
-> KiboNumber == 1

I have books that are pretty good at explaining X. If you know how to use
a Table of Contents and an index, you can pretty much find what you're 
looking for. You just have to spend a little time reading and experimenting.

Nobody was born with a keyboard in their hands... ;-)

-john
-- 
# John Martinez (martinez@bats.com) UNIX System Administration Consultant
# Bright Apex Technology Services   San Jose, California, USA

------------------------------

Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.admin
From: asktan@ntuix.ntu.ac.sg (Kenneth Tan)
Subject: Re: Enhanced IDE with Linux?
Date: Tue, 28 Jun 1994 01:47:05 GMT

Joe Janakovic (redgt@io.org) wrote:
: Do large capacity enhanced IDE drives work well with Linux?  I'd like to buy
: a Dell XPS P90 system that comes with a 1Gb IDE hard drive.  Would I have any
: problems running Linux?  If it does run, are there any restrictions to how I
: partition the hard drive?

There has been widespread commotion that the Linux file system does NOT
support drives with a "physical" geometry of higher than 1024 cylinders.

I have a 540Mb (1048 cyl, 16 head, 63 sect), and cannot use more than the
1024 cyls in a _single_ partition.  Other than that, it is OK.

With the amount of complaints of the >1024 bug, surely, there will be a
version out soon to support this (HD are really getting cheap these days!)


Kenneth Tan


------------------------------


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