Subject: Linux-Misc Digest #143
From: Digestifier <Linux-Misc-Request@senator-bedfellow.MIT.EDU>
To: Linux-Misc@senator-bedfellow.MIT.EDU
Reply-To: Linux-Misc@senator-bedfellow.MIT.EDU
Date:     Sat, 21 May 94 12:13:12 EDT

Linux-Misc Digest #143, Volume #2                Sat, 21 May 94 12:13:12 EDT

Contents:
  3COM PCMCIA Ethernet card? (Scott Deerwester)
  Re: BRIEF/vi Compatible GUI Text Editor (David Holland)
  Cirrus Logic supported by Linux? (Thomas B. Pedersen)
  Motif and GUI builder (Thomas B. Pedersen)
  Re: software communists was Re: BRIEF/vi Compatible GUI Text Editor (Matt Welsh)
  Re: Standard Linux GUI (James LewisMoss)
  Re: What is latest CD out? (Patrick J. Volkerding)
  Re: Help selecting good SCSI disk (Lawrence Kirby)
  Re: Cirrus Logic supported by Linux? (Jeff Epler)
  Re: Help selecting good SCSI disk (Jim Sanchez)
  Re: COMAL language (was: Re: Streets named after programming languages) (Brian Vinter)
  Re: Standard Linux GUI (Jim Graham)
  Re: Where is that hardware-compliance-with-Linux list? (Robert G. Smith)
  Re: 3C509 (Etherlink III) support  (rah@bwco.com)
  Genoa TurboExpress PCI-4 (Gunar Schorcht)
  CD-ROM and Soundblaster Pro 16 MultiCD (Gunar Schorcht)
  Re: FAQ : is Jana Publishing still trading? (Brett G Person)
  Best distribution?? (philip m. thompson)
  Columbia Appletalk Protocol under Linux (Jack E. Wilkinson)

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: scott@cs.ust.hk (Scott Deerwester)
Subject: 3COM PCMCIA Ethernet card?
Date: Thu, 19 May 1994 00:57:32 GMT

Has anyone gotten a 3Com PCMCIA Ethernet III (3c589) card working
under Linux?  Or running TCP/IP under *anything*, for that matter??

_________________________________________________________________
 Scott Deerwester            |   The Hong Kong University of
 Internet: scott@cs.ust.hk   |     Science and Technology
 Phone:    (852) 358-6985    |  Department of Computer Science
=================================================================
ty 

------------------------------

Subject: Re: BRIEF/vi Compatible GUI Text Editor
From: dholland@husc9.harvard.edu (David Holland)
Date: 20 May 94 03:34:25


shyamal@seas.smu.edu's message of Wed, 18 May 1994 16:42:51 GMT said:

 > To be honest I don't see what a non-free editor is doing in a linux
 > newsgroup ;-)

;-) or not, this is exactly the sort of comment, and attitude, that is
keeping the major software companies from supporting Linux. Right now
I can afford to use Linux, because I don't need my computer for much
besides telnet. If I needed to publish a book, or keep complicated
accounts, or do graphics processing, I'd probably have to break out
fdisk and go back to DOS and maybe Windows. Why? Because the necessary
applications simply do not exist for Linux. Period.

Until such time as they do, Linux will remain a marginal hacker's OS
the rest of the world views with a mixture of suspicion and fear.

--
   - David A. Holland          | "The right to be heard does not automatically
     dholland@husc.harvard.edu |  include the right to be taken seriously."

------------------------------

From: zeppelin@login.dkuug.dk (Thomas B. Pedersen)
Subject: Cirrus Logic supported by Linux?
Date: Sat, 21 May 1994 15:26:25 -0400

Is the Cirrus Logic video adapter supported by Linux? 

Thanks in advance,

zeppelin


===============================================================================
"Ooh, your custard pie, ain't seen the like       |          Thomas B. Pedersen
When you cut it, mama, save me a slice            |     zeppelin@login.dkuug.dk
You custard pie, I declare, ain't seen the like   |               +45 5767 1611
I like you custard pie"                           |

------------------------------

From: zeppelin@login.dkuug.dk (Thomas B. Pedersen)
Subject: Motif and GUI builder
Date: Sat, 21 May 1994 15:28:11 -0400

I am considering buying Linux and Motif. Are the any free GUI builders I can
use? Are they any good?

zeppelin


===============================================================================
"Ooh, your custard pie, ain't seen the like       |          Thomas B. Pedersen
When you cut it, mama, save me a slice            |     zeppelin@login.dkuug.dk
You custard pie, I declare, ain't seen the like   |               +45 5767 1611
I like you custard pie"                           |

------------------------------

From: mdw@cs.cornell.edu (Matt Welsh)
Subject: Re: software communists was Re: BRIEF/vi Compatible GUI Text Editor
Date: Thu, 19 May 1994 05:44:14 GMT

In article <2rcerk$8ig@finzi.ccinet.ab.ca> kevin@valis.ampr.ab.ca (Kevin B. Fluet) writes:
>It makes Linux all the better if commercial apps are supported.  

If your only motive is to run software that works for you, there
are many commercial UNIX implementations for the PC. Some that aren't
very expensive, I might add. But there is an ethic behind the development
of free software which is that software should be free, so that people
can share it and help each other to improve it. Once you allow a commerical
software product to satisfy your basic computing needs, you've lost the
ability to improve it or modify it to suit your needs.

>If it does the job better than the free software
>available, why wouldn't I pay a reasonable price for it?  

Because doing so impedes the necessity for the development of free
software. When you give in to commercial software, particularly
operating systems, you aren't aiding the free software world for
providing anything better. Free software only improves as long as
its users demand and allow it to do so. 

If everyone shared your attitude, Linux wouldn't be here at all.
Linus would have stared at his screen printing "AAA... BBB...",
realized that SCO worked better, and resorted to that. Instead,
some of us demand that free software improve, not only by helping
to develop it, but also by _depending_ on it for everyday use. 

mdw

------------------------------

From: moss@usceast.cs.scarolina.edu (James LewisMoss)
Subject: Re: Standard Linux GUI
Date: 21 May 1994 09:22:18 -0400

newcombe@aa.csc.peachnet.edu (Dan Newcombe) writes:

>In article <2rb8qo$o4m@cs.pdx.edu> mike@cs.pdx.edu (Mike Harvey) writes:
>>>Is it just me or does anybody else feel that what the Linux (UNIX) 
>>>community needs is a SINGLE, STANDARD, ONLY ONE, Graphical User Interface 
>>>(GUI)?  The purpose of a GUI is to reduce the learning curve when moving 
>>>from application to application in a graphical environment.  Unfortunately, 
>>>due to the lack of any real (FREE) standards, it is just as aggravating 
>>>to move between many X applications as it is between most TEXT applications.

[Stuff Deleted]

>Under X, as was said, there are many different API's: Xt, Xlib, Xaw, Xview, 
>Motif, Tcl, and probably about a dozen I forgot.  This gives each application 
>a different style and different feel.  Each application, even though the menu 
>may be exactly the same as the previous application, could interface totally 
>different.

>This is what is being argued should be standardized.  Personally, I think that 
>the OSF should place Motif (not just the specs) in the public domain, but then 
>again, I am a dreamer :)

I agree about the Motif in public domain (or sometihng similar,
whatever), but I don't like the idea of a standarddized "GUI."  One of
the great things about X, IMO, is the fact that I can have one way of
dealing with the machine, and my brother can use something different.
Whatever fits our personalities.  

X was created, from what Ive read, with this idea in mind.  TO allow a
bunch of different ways of dealing with the API.

Just my two bits worth.

jim


------------------------------

From: gonzo@magnet.mednet.net (Patrick J. Volkerding)
Subject: Re: What is latest CD out?
Date: 19 May 1994 06:21:57 GMT

In article <Cq0stp.4u7@rahul.net>, Charles Liu <alte@rahul.net> wrote:
>       Universal CD-ROM (tm) offers the following CD-ROM Titles. If you 
>know some other place offers better price, please let us know, we will 
>try to match. 
> [...]
>Linux 1.0  from InfoMagic  at $19.95
>Linux 1.1  from Yggdrasil  at $39.95
>-- 
>End of Note

Just for the record, InfoMagic's CD has source and precompiled images for 
Linux 1.1.8 in the Q series of Slackware (not just 1.0).

Pat




------------------------------

Crossposted-To: comp.arch.storage,comp.periphs.scsi,comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage
From: fred@genesis.demon.co.uk (Lawrence Kirby)
Subject: Re: Help selecting good SCSI disk
Reply-To: fred@genesis.demon.co.uk
Date: Sat, 21 May 1994 13:47:41 +0000

In article <2rjkgr$848@panix.com> fishman@panix.com "Harvey Fishman" writes:

>In <Cq4Ett.8zL@cichlid.com> aab@cichlid.com (Andy Burgess) says
>
>> Rotational speed is a spec to consider. Many are >3600 rpm to 5400 or 6400.
>
>I wonder...it seems to me that what we want is really average latency and
>data rate.  While rotational speed is a direct measure of the latency, it
>is only a measure of data rate if all other things are equal (and they
>rarely are).  It seems to me that in a multi-tasking system, data rate may
>be far more important than absolute access time (which the latency is an
>important component of).  With modern drives, the data rates are usually
>given as a range of bitrates (because of ZRR), and for systems more
>advanced than PC/MS-DOS those number may be more important than rotational
>rate. 

What is important on multi-tasking systems is the transaction rate. With
multiple processes genrating disk requests the access pattern tends to be
more randomised (depending on how effective things like sorting/elevator
seek algorithms are) so seek/latency times become more important. Transfer
rate only becomes important when read time is a significant portion of the
data access time. If you are copying large files then tranfer rate is
important, if you are performing database lookups (including small filesystem
operations) then seek/latency times are dominant.

-- 
=========================================
Lawrence Kirby | fred@genesis.demon.co.uk
Wilts, England | 70734.126@compuserve.com
=========================================

------------------------------

From: jepler@herbie.unl.edu (Jeff Epler)
Subject: Re: Cirrus Logic supported by Linux?
Date: 21 May 1994 14:29:19 GMT

zeppelin@login.dkuug.dk (Thomas B. Pedersen) writes:

>Is the Cirrus Logic video adapter supported by Linux? 

You can get nice graphics in SVGALIB and XFree86 using the Cirrus 542x
series of chips, I don't know about the other Cirrus that are out
there, but I believe there are some like "543x" and "642x" which are
thought to be compatible.

Also, by looking in /usr/src/linux/boot/setup.S, it seems that Cirrus
should have some nice extended text modes, like 132x43, 132x60, etc.,
but I don't get these modes offered to me on bootup (Cirrus 5422).

Jeff
--
Jeff Epler       echo "kill -9 -1" | su         jepler@herbie.unl.edu 
____ "Nuke the unborn gay whales for Jesus" 
\bi/                                  -- Never seen on a protest sign
 \/  1.5<kinsey<2.5      Running Linux 1.1.11 -- DOS is to boot DOOM!

------------------------------

From: jsanchez@chinook.halcyon.com (Jim Sanchez)
Crossposted-To: comp.arch.storage,comp.periphs.scsi,comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage
Subject: Re: Help selecting good SCSI disk
Date: 21 May 1994 14:06:44 GMT

Another drive you might want to consider is the Micropolis 4110 which is
a 1" version of the 2110.  It is faster (8.5 ms) and less expensive.  I
bought one for my system and love it.
--
Jim Sanchez
Communications Specialists, Inc. - Redmond, WA
jsanchez@halcyon.com (206)836-0105(H) (206)885-3100(W)

------------------------------

Crossposted-To: alt.folklore.computers
From: vinter@cs.uit.no (Brian Vinter)
Subject: Re: COMAL language (was: Re: Streets named after programming languages)
Date: Thu, 19 May 1994 07:03:45 GMT

In article <2rdejf$6lo@eldborg.rhi.hi.is> frr@rhi.hi.is (Finnbogi R. Ragnarsson) writes:
>>>    Ben> wrote: :> Apropos of Commodore's death [Warning: impending
>>>    Ben> topic drift] :> does anyone remember a language called COMAL?
>>>    Ben> Did this language :> ever exist on a system besides the C64?
>It started on the Commodore PET.
>I learned COMAL on a pet back in 1983. It was mainly a education tool,
>to limited for serious use (too much missing). 
>I didn't like it, (to limited) just as I don't like Pascal, but it was
>programming wise much better than the PET basic (what isn't?) and a lot 
>faster. I still have some sort of manual for it somwhere.
>
>
>frr.
>

OK I don't really know what this does theme is doing on the comp.os.linux.misc
group so lets move it to alt.folklore.computers strictly.

First I'll just come with my comments (and if we're all lucky I'll get the last
word :-))

OK:
        1) COMAL did _not_ start on the commodore PET - it started on
           a RC Piccolo - a Z80 based machine with 64 K Ram - it had
           a metal case - and in fact its the only computer I have ever
           used for opening a beer!

        2) COMAL was in fact called COMAL 80 until it was ported to other
           architectures than the Z80.

        3) COMAL was not mainly an educational tool - it was strictly meant
           as an educational tool, so the limitations were there by purpose
           not by accident.

        4) Todays COMAL version - UniComal has as little to do with COMAL
           as Turbo Pascal has to do with Pascal.

And now - watch your environment : remove this tread from the linux group.

--

Vinter

 ________________________________________________________________
| Brian Vinter                      | Email vinter@cs.uit.no     |
| Department of Computer Science    | Phone (+47) 77 65 29 19    |
| University of Tromsoe             | Discalimer:                |
| N-9037 Tromsoe, NORWAY            | Real men do it in parallel!|
 ________________________________________________________________


------------------------------

From: jim@n5ial.mythical.com (Jim Graham)
Subject: Re: Standard Linux GUI
Date: Wed, 18 May 1994 17:50:07 GMT

In article <2ravu1$8gm@panix.com> aappel@panix.com (Andrew Appel) writes:

>Is it just me or does anybody else feel that what the Linux (UNIX) 
>community needs is a SINGLE, STANDARD, ONLY ONE, Graphical User Interface 
>(GUI)?

Yeah, right....  People have different likes/dislikes, and right now, they
have a choice.  That, IMHO, is how it should be.  Also, I seriously doubt
that any of the standard-making bodies are going to form a committee to
publish a standard GUI just for Linux...for UNIX in general, perhaps, but
not just for Linux.

Btw, there is a {de facto} standard interface for X11 under UNIX---Motif.
I, personally, don't like Motif, and don't use it here, but it is a
{de facto} standard, just the same.

>Unfortunately, due to the lack of any real (FREE) standards,

Are you suggesting that it has to be free to be a standard?  Or are you
just wanting a standard that happens to be free?  If you're suggesting
that it has to be free to be a standard, welcome to the real world...it
doesn't always work that way.  :-(

>the reality is that Microsoft Windows, 
>Macintosh, and NextStep are all standard GUIs

Ummmm, last time I checked, they were {de facto} standards, not actually
true standards.  If I'm wrong about this, please do correct me.

>P.S.  Before you mention MOTIF remember that it also is not free!

Are we talking about what something costs?  Or are we talking about
standards (and/or {de facto} standards)?

Later,
   --jim

--
73 DE N5IAL (/4)                           < Running Linux *1.00*! >
      jim@n5ial.mythical.com                 ICBM: 30.23N 86.32W
  ||  j.graham@ieee.org          Packet:  N5IAL@W4ZBB (Ft. Walton Beach, FL)
E-mail me for information about KAMterm (host mode for Kantronics TNCs).


------------------------------

From: rob@bip.anatomy.upenn.edu (Robert G. Smith)
Subject: Re: Where is that hardware-compliance-with-Linux list?
Date: 21 May 1994 14:47:59 GMT

Brad Block (bradb@bronze.coil.com) wrote:
: Does anyone know where that one list is that lists a-bunch of hardware 
: (CD-ROMS, HD's, controllers...) that is known to work well with Linux?

Check out Hardware-HOWTO on

   sunsite.unc.edu:pub/Linux/docs/HOWTO
or
  ftp.cdrom.com:pub/linux/sunsite/docs/HOWTO

Lots of other nice docs in the same directory.

Rob Smith


------------------------------

From: rah@bwco.com
Subject: Re: 3C509 (Etherlink III) support 
Date: Wed, 18 May 1994 20:52:16 GMT


I'm not sure if it is being supported or under test but I
do know it is working on my Dell 486. The 3C509 has been
in for two days now and I can get around the net. I did
get one warning/error message about it missing and interrupt
or something though.



------------------------------

From: schorcht@theoinf.tu-ilmenau.de (Gunar Schorcht)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.help,de.comp.os.linux
Subject: Genoa TurboExpress PCI-4
Date: 21 May 1994 14:50:46 GMT

Hi,

Has anybody installed successfully a Genoa TurboExpress PCI-4 Motherboard
working under Linux?

Thanks for all information.

Gunar

                                \\\///
                                 \\//     schorcht@theoinf.tu-ilmenau.de
                                ( .. )        
      -----------------------ooO-(__)--Ooo-------------------------------
      | America:                                                        |
      | You have Bill Clinton, Stevie Wonder, Bob Hope and Johnny Cash. |
      | Germany:                                                        |
      | We have Helmut Kohl, no wonder, no hope and no cash.            |
      |_________________________________________________________________|

------------------------------

From: schorcht@theoinf.tu-ilmenau.de (Gunar Schorcht)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.help,de.comp.os.linux
Subject: CD-ROM and Soundblaster Pro 16 MultiCD
Date: 21 May 1994 14:56:23 GMT

Hi,

Has anybody installed CD-ROM (Panasonic CR-562B, Mitsumi FX 001D, ...) by
connecting at the Soundblaster Pro 16 MultiCD CD-Rom interface? Does the
linux CD-Rom driver works with this installation.

Thanks for all information.

Ciao Gunar

                                \\\///
                                 \\//     schorcht@theoinf.tu-ilmenau.de
                                ( .. )        
      -----------------------ooO-(__)--Ooo-------------------------------
      | America:                                                        |
      | You have Bill Clinton, Stevie Wonder, Bob Hope and Johnny Cash. |
      | Germany:                                                        |
      | We have Helmut Kohl, no wonder, no hope and no cash.            |
      |_________________________________________________________________|




------------------------------

From: person@badlands.NoDak.edu (Brett G Person)
Subject: Re: FAQ : is Jana Publishing still trading?
Date: Thu, 19 May 1994 07:30:11 GMT


My question is: Has Jana ever shipped *anything*?  Even one CD? 

Every time I see a post from/about Jana it is full of excuses.  

Production problems, bad internet connections, etc,etc.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.  The dog ate my homwork too, when I was ten!

C'mon Jana. Either ship or shutdown!
-- 
Brett G. Person
person@badlands.nodak.edu
IBM Screen Reader Technical Support
North Dakota State University

------------------------------

From: pmt@cyberspace (philip m. thompson)
Subject: Best distribution??
Date: 19 May 1994 07:00:37 GMT


I just installed the Slackware Linux on my 386 in an effort to learn more
about Unix. Incidentally, the installation program did an excellent job
talking me through the process - Except for one false start on fdisking my
hard drive, everything went smoothly.

Reading various groups in the c.o.l. hierarchy, I'm seeing a bunch of
different version numbers and distributions being referred to. I've been
told that what I installed is, my goodness, _months_ old at least and I
oughtta be installing something newer.  I'd appreciate it if somebody
who's been using Linux for a while would share _which_ Linux they like
best and why. If this is likely to generate excessive net.noise, e-mail
might be best. Thanks!

Phil Thompson                   My opinions are also those of my
pmt@cyberspace.net              employer. And my opinions are correct.
Kennewick Computer Company
(509) 735-4185

------------------------------

Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.help
From: jackw@drbear.COM (Jack E. Wilkinson)
Subject: Columbia Appletalk Protocol under Linux
Date: Wed, 18 May 1994 03:16:25 GMT

Has anyone gotten the Columbia Appletalk Protocol working under Linux??

If so, can you tell me (or post for all of us) your experiences in getting
it to work.  If not... well, I guess I'll be making a post about it.

Peace...
-- 
     Jack E. Wilkinson; 478 W. Hamilton Ave, #243; Campbell, CA 95008
              jackw@drbear.COM or ...!a2i!drbear!jackw
                     I am out, therefore I am

------------------------------


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