**************************************************************************** >C O M P U T E R U N D E R G R O U N D< >D I G E S T< *** Volume 2, Issue #2.19 (December 31, 1990) ** **************************************************************************** MODERATORS: Jim Thomas / Gordon Meyer (TK0JUT2@NIU.bitnet) ARCHIVISTS: Bob Krause / Alex Smith / Bob Kusumoto RESIDENT RAPMASTER: Brendan Kehoe USENET readers can currently receive CuD as alt.society.cu-digest. COMPUTER UNDERGROUND DIGEST is an open forum dedicated to sharing information among computerists and to the presentation and debate of diverse views. CuD material may be reprinted as long as the source is cited. Some authors, however, do copyright their material, and those authors should be contacted for reprint permission. It is assumed that non-personal mail to the moderators may be reprinted unless otherwise specified. Readers are encouraged to submit reasoned articles relating to the Computer Underground. ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ DISCLAIMER: The views represented herein do not necessarily represent the views of the moderators. Contributors assume all responsibility for assuring that articles submitted do not violate copyright protections. ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ------------------------------ From: well!jwarren@APPLE.COM(Jim Warren) Subject: Clarification of Gail Thackeray's Comment on Modem Licensing Date: Sun, 30 Dec 90 12:59:54 pst ******************************************************************** *** CuD #2.19: File 5 of 7: Gail Thackeray Clarification *** ******************************************************************** GAIL THACKERAY RE LICENSING MODEMS & RESTRICTING MODEM USE On 12/21, as a postscript on e-mail to Gail Thackeray, I asked: +++++++++++++++++++++++++ Been meanin' to check this *rumor* for months (I rarely trust what I haven't checked, personally): Have you said that modems should be licensed and their use restricted? (It's been widely quoted/paraphrased and is a common [mis?]perception of your views.) If you ever said it, do you now hold that view? I'm not challenging it; just tryin' to verify or refute a provocative rumor. +++++++++++++++++++++++++ To which, Gail responded: +++++++++++++++++++++++++ Date: Sat, 22 Dec 90 10:04:05 pst From: gailt (Gail Thackeray) To: jwarren No, I never said so -- when talking about the lack of parental supervision of computer use for beginning youngsters, I have pointed out that in other instances involving driving, guns, etc. we recognize that kids don't have good judgment and we insist on training, supervision, licensing, etc. to minimize the risk to the rest of society. I have specifically said that I DON'T want to see licensing of modems, or FCC regulation, etc. -- but that if we look at historic parallels involving new technology (driving, airplanes, etc.) when society grows annoyed/concerned enough with abuses, damage, risk to others, "entry requirements" such as licensing have been imposed. I have recommended that to avoid such a trend in electronic technology, we should put a lot of effort into developing "rules of the road" that we all agree on and abide by & teach youngsters -- or the back- lash may cause formal regulation (just think about the regulations controlling ham radio, etc. -- and the potential for similar rules is quite real, computer-wise.) Regulation usually comes about as a reaction to complaints of enough people to attract the interest of legislators. We are rapidly approaching that "critical mass" stage with computer communications, and if we don't want to see licensing of BBS's, we need to do whatever will curb the abuses (interference with other people's rights). I have recommended that parents check into what their kids are doing with their modems, set rules, ans if need be, "ground" their kids just as they do for other kinds of rules- violations, like being reckless with the family car.... -------------------------------------------- This prompted my 12/24 comments and request: -------------------------------------------- & mail gailt Subject: licensing etc. Gail, This is important: If you have not yet posted exactly those comments, in detail, regarding licensing and regulation of modem users, I *urge* you to post them immediately and completely to the eff Conference, and explicitly add a note encouraging their widespread duplication (without editing, of course) across the nets. You are more than welcome to preface it with a comment that I urged you to post the comments (if that has any value :-). I absolutely agree with your observations and think we have *much* to fear from overzealous legislators/regulators responding to the miniscule minority who are abusive of our tremendously productive cooperative anarchy. ... ------------------ I also urged her to send it to jthomas for the Computer Underground Digest and emmanuel for 2600, and sent mail to both of them urging them to publish it, if Gail sent it, saying, in part: ------------------ Her explanation of what she had and had not said related to such matters was both reasonable and **illustrated a very real threat** (from legislators and regulators; *not* from Gail T) against all of us. Her comments were very realistic; her prognosis highly likely, if we cannot exercise adequate discipline within our ranks. I have urged her to post her comments on the WELL, and forward them to Cud and 2600 for publication (and release them for general posting around the nets). --------------------------------------------------------------- I hope you will help do so, because we now have her permission: --------------------------------------------------------------- From gailt Mon Dec 24 19:51:53 1990 Date: Mon, 24 Dec 90 19:51:51 pst From: gailt (Gail Thackeray) To: jwarren Subject: Re: licensing etc. Willing, but ignorant: so how do I DO that? I thought whatever was sent in E-mail went into the cosmic winds.... is there a way I can retrieve what I sent you, & post it? Can you retireve & upload it? I'm (definitely) still stumblin' around here, and help would be great/grate/fully accepted.... & Date: Mon, 24 Dec 90 19:55:02 pst From: gailt (Gail Thackeray) To: emmanuel, jthomas, jwarren Subject: Re: Thacvkeray and licensing By the by -- feel free to use it -- I just don't know (after scanning% the manual -- how to retrieve what I sent Jim, and publish it out of e-mail. ... ************** For those who don't know of Ms. Thackeray, she is an Assistant State Attorney General for the State of Arizona, active in pursuing computer crime, and controversial for some of her public statements and/or statements that.some press *allege* she said. In some cases, she may have been as misleadingly quoted-out-of-context -- or flat-out abusively misquoted -- as has been the case with some reports about Mitch Kapor, John Perry Barlow and the Electronic Frontier Foundation. --Jim Warren [permission herewith granted to circulate this-in-full] ******************************************************************** >> END OF THIS FILE << ***************************************************************************  Downloaded From P-80 International Information Systems 304-744-2253 12yrs+