From server@firefly.prairienet.org Fri May 12 20:50:03 1995
	id UAA12456; Fri, 12 May 1995 20:48:34 +0200
	id AA15987; Fri, 12 May 95 13:35:53 CDT
Subject: Conspiracy Nation -- Vol. 4 Num. 89
X-Comment:  Conspiracy Nation


              Conspiracy Nation -- Vol. 4  Num. 89
             ======================================
                    ("Quid coniuratio est?")
 
 
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INTERVIEW WITH DEBRA VON TRAPP
By Sherman H. Skolnick
(Transcribed by Brian Francis Redman)
 
I neither necessarily agree nor disagree with either all or 
portions of the following. -- CN Editor.
 
 +  +  +  +  +  +  +  +  +  +  +  +  +  +  +  +  +  +  +  +  +  +
 
[...continued...]
 
SHERMAN SKOLNICK:
So how is it... Do you believe that Clinton -- because he and his 
wife are considered a "CIA couple" in an upcoming book that's 
gonna describe them. {5}. Do you believe that Clinton, early on, 
had a reason to understand this? And either didn't resist it or 
didn't combat it? Or what?
 
 
DEBRA VON TRAPP:
Well, I went to Stephanopoulos, initially. And for quite awhile, 
I communicated with his office, and he sent messages back to me 
through his administrator and... And all that time, I thought he 
was doing something with it. And then he told me that he thought 
that I was making it up, and he killed the information.
 
So ultimately, I don't think Clinton actually knew that I 
seriously was discussing it with them and that he should pay 
attention to it until, probably, early August of '94. And then at 
that time I think he knew it and didn't know what to do about it, 
because he was in such a mess. And ultimately, what happened was 
that he had no way out and was confronted with Mondale and Mickey 
Kantor in October of '94. And then his solution was simply to 
clean up White House communications, bounce that Secret Service 
agent back to Oklahoma City, and then try to cut me off.
 
And they actually had the DNC [Democratic National Committee] 
send me two checks, in December, for a total of $8900, which I 
assume they believe was going to be payoff money. But when you 
consider the damage they've done to my company and all the 
litigation I was in with Xerox, and then defending myself against 
Mitsubishi and MCA... {6}.
 
 
SHERMAN SKOLNICK:
So in other words...
 
 
DEBRA VON TRAPP:
I lost everything I had! $8900 wasn't gonna pay my phone bill!
 
 
SHERMAN SKOLNICK:
Some feel that Clinton has this habit of looking the other way, 
or *appearing* to look the other way, on really "dirty projects", 
such as the Mena, Arkansas dope shipments. In other words, he was 
the Governor, and he would have us believe that he didn't see 
anything or didn't need to see anything. Is that sort of like 
what's happening now?
 
 
DEBRA VON TRAPP:
Yeah. Well then, he wanted to be President. And now, he has a 
bigger problem: they killed Vince Foster right in front of him. 
And then, they've indicted Hillary; she was indicted on two 
counts, for the Whitewater thing, on April 16th. She was served 
on April 22nd.
 
 
SHERMAN SKOLNICK:
So you feel that the grand jury actually met on Sunday, the 16th, 
rather than on Monday, the 17th, that our story says.
 
 
DEBRA VON TRAPP:
Well, that was *my* first-hand information, that the indictment 
actually came down that day, and that it was served on the 22nd.
 
 
SHERMAN SKOLNICK:
By Kenneth Starr, in the White House.
 
 
DEBRA VON TRAPP:
Right. And so now, he has a bigger problem: his wife's indicted. 
And she's about to be indicted for perjury, under a third 
indictment. And he needs to be able to trade something. So maybe 
if he trades the American public and babies in Oklahoma, he can 
keep he and his wife in the White House.
 
 
SHERMAN SKOLNICK:
Tell me this: what do you think, under the circumstances, is 
gonna happen further? In other words, there is this terrible 
violence between the Tokyo and the Washington government -- where 
do you suspect or predict that it might go?
 
 
DEBRA VON TRAPP:
Well, the way I was helped was, I went to the military and to 
Secretary [of Defense] Perry. And I had done that early on, 
concurrent with my communications even, early, with the Japanese 
and with Stephanopoulos back in March of '94.
 
 
SHERMAN SKOLNICK:
And you kept very meticulous records of all these things?
 
 
DEBRA VON TRAPP:
Yeah, I have.
 
And so what occurred out of that was, Perry had an individual 
call me back and explain that all my documents have been given to 
a man that was the Assistant Secretary of Defense -- 
coincidentally, John Deutch. And so, then...
 
 
SHERMAN SKOLNICK:
Do you have confidence in him as, I believe he's in the process 
of becoming the new director of Central Intelligence. You have 
confidence in him? Or...
 
 
DEBRA VON TRAPP:
Yeah. Because I think Perry arranged to have him moved over, to 
clean up the CIA. And what's fortunate is, one of the people on 
that downed aircraft, in Alabama, was, in fact, a good friend of 
Perry's... And so, you know, that was a retaliatory act for, 
against Perry as well, for him moving, you know, or arranging to 
have Woolsey go out of the CIA, have Deutch go over there. It was 
an "answer back" to the fact that Deutch is inevitably going to 
be director of CIA.
 
 
SHERMAN SKOLNICK:
What do you suppose would happen if the mainstream media -- which 
we call the "news fakers" -- were to actually, simply state what 
is *known* about what you're discussing here today? What would 
happen?
 
 
DEBRA VON TRAPP:
I think there would be a tremendous backlash in the United States 
against both the previous administration -- not necessarily... 
well, the Clinton administration but certainly all those persons 
that have remained, that were there under the Bush/CIA era.
 
 
SHERMAN SKOLNICK:
In other words, some people feel that the Clinton Justice 
Department is still heavily Bush...
 
 
DEBRA VON TRAPP:
Yeah.
 
 
SHERMAN SKOLNICK:
...and that the CIA is still Bush, and therefore, Clinton has a 
tremendous problem.
 
 
DEBRA VON TRAPP:
Right. They need to take at least about a minimum of another 25 
people, top-down, out of the CIA that were associated with Ames 
and Bush.
 
 
SHERMAN SKOLNICK:
Do you predict that there might be further violence between the 
Tokyo-Washington problem?
 
 
DEBRA VON TRAPP:
Yeah. And I think that, if this were all to come to light, that 
the American public would understand why our economy, and 
American jobs, and everything else that's been affected by the 
Japanese influence and the Japanese trade, has taken place. And I 
think that there would be a tremendous backlash and an effort by 
Americans to take America back *for* Americans, and not for 
political interests and the Japanese government and the CIA.
 
 
SHERMAN SKOLNICK:
But is there a possibility that there is an isolationist faction 
in the United States that wants to blame Japan, perhaps not -- in 
other words, some might say, falsely? Is there that possibility?
 
 
DEBRA VON TRAPP:
No. I don't think so at all. I think that there's simply a lot of 
anti-Japan sentiment over the way our economy's been affected, 
and the fact that there's this underlying, major problem with the 
Japanese government, Japanese Intelligence, and its infiltration 
and control and complicity with a certain upper-management group 
of employees, federal employees, in the CIA and the FBI.
 
 
SHERMAN SKOLNICK:
So in other words, there's a highly-sophisticated *war* going on, 
between Japan and the United States, unlike the Second World War 
and generally unknown by most of the American people! But the 
media won't cover it! I mean, they're... they'll pooh-pooh you. 
You saw the latest issue of *Time* magazine, in a sentence or 
two, tried to pooh-pooh the Japanese connection, as if there's 
nothing behind it! {7}. And from what you say, there appears to 
be quite a bit behind it.
 
 
DEBRA VON TRAPP:
When... I didn't even see what *Time* wrote about it. Why were 
they alluding to a Japanese connection at all?
 
 
SHERMAN SKOLNICK:
Because of the militia statement, by Commander Olson and the 
Citizens' Militia of Michigan jumped the gun and, without 
realizing there's a factual background to the thing, demoted him. 
But *now*, I think they realize they made a mistake and that your 
information was quite correct.
 
And *Time* magazine refers a little bit to that in their current 
issue and pooh-poohs the whole idea of a Japanese connection. You 
see what I'm saying?
 
Of course it was *Time* magazine that, years ago, said that 
"Oswald did it", so, I mean [laughs]. You know what I mean? Those 
of us that are *knowledgeable* -- you know what I mean. But the 
point is, the general public is *not* knowledgeable. And at least 
in the Midwest, we want to *make* 'em knowledgeable if we can get 
you on video and then use it on our show. Is that possible?
 
 
DEBRA VON TRAPP:
Is your show live?
 
 
SHERMAN SKOLNICK:
No. It's taped, and then cable-cast a couple weeks later.
 
 
DEBRA VON TRAPP:
So if I taped something now, and got it to you, when would it be 
broadcast?
 
 
SHERMAN SKOLNICK:
*Probably* not sooner than two weeks. We might switch around our 
schedule and have the cable-casting group put your show on in 
place for something that's already scheduled. In other words, 
we're already scheduled for cable-casting until the end of May. 
But we can switch, if there's something very urgent, we can 
switch something in there, and put this show on, which, of 
course, is *extremely* timely.
 
=========== END OF SKOLNICK'S INTERVIEW OF VON TRAPP ============
 
SKOLNICK ADDS:
Please note: she claims she's got a video tape where a director 
of MCA, the one that somehow, mysteriously, now lives right 
across the street from her -- uh, she confronted this director 
and said, "How many babies did you arrange to kill in Oklahoma 
with that bombing?" And the director, reportedly, said, "Twenty."
 
If, in fact, there is such a video tape, it'd be dynamite, and we 
would probably run it on our cable access television show.
 
My opinion is that this must come before the American people as 
quickly as possible!! To save Ms. von Trapp's life. I think she's 
a very brave woman, and something here rings true about the 
thing.
 
And I commend all of those (including you) that will help get 
this before the American people, or even overseas, to save this 
woman's life and to show what is behind these terrible events in 
our times.
 
---------------------------<< Notes >>---------------------------
{5} "...because he [Clinton] and his wife are considered a 'CIA 
couple' in an upcoming book..." Could refer to *Passion & 
Betrayal* by Gennifer Flowers.
 
{6} MCA. There is an interesting book about MCA by an author by 
name of Dan Moldea, I believe the name is. I can't recall the 
name of the book at the moment, but I believe it had "MCA" in the 
title.
 
{7} From *Time* magazine, May 8, 1995: "...the militia stripped 
Olson of his command last Friday after he sent inflammatory faxes 
to the news media blaming the Oklahoma explosion on the Japanese 
government."
 
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Aperi os tuum muto, et causis omnium filiorum qui pertranseunt.
Aperi os tuum, decerne quod justum est, et judica inopem et 
  pauperem.                    -- Liber Proverbiorum  XXXI: 8-9 

 Brian Francis Redman    bigxc@prairienet.org    "The Big C"
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    Coming to you from Illinois -- "The Land of Skolnick"        
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