Date:    Sunday, 01 October 1995 00:02:34 
Subject: Glass making . . .
From:    CoryJ44@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Could anyone give me a hand on how to make a "thick glass" jar?  I'm having a
tough time getting it to look convincing.  I have a two-layer thing now, with
the inner layer being simply a scaled down version of the outer layer.  I
assigned both layers the typical glass attributes, and I gave each layer a
refraction index of 1.05 . . . it's close, but has anyone else had better
luck with a different trick?  I'd appreciate any help offered . . .

                                                                 Cory

Date:    Sunday, 01 October 1995 00:22:04 
Subject: Re: Imagine for SGI
From:    Catherine A Tromanhauser <ctromanh@uoguelph.ca>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Fri, 29 Sep 1995 Falko@aol.com wrote:

> 
> Last time I checked the SGI Indy is just a "baby" Indigo. Same processor
> family. My guess is if it works on one, it'l work on all SGI MIPS powered
> machines.
> 
> Falko
> 
Yes I read that too about the Indy, that it would run all the programs 
it's bigger brother would, I guess I wasn't thinking.  If it actually 
exists I wonder if I could network my Indy and my A4000 to work on 
projects simultaneously and if the renders would be consistent between 
the two machines.  Thanks for the reply.

Sully


Date:    Sunday, 01 October 1995 02:59:46 
Subject: MGA Millenium video card hates Imagine
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


I'm the latest user to fall prey to the ole Imagine/VESA blues.

When I bought my shiny new PC, the video card I wanted was back-ordered, so
I got a standard Trident as a loaner. Imagine ran wonderfully on it. Now
that my MGA Millenium has arrived and the switch has been made, Imagine
refuses to cooperate! This card is VESA 2.0 compatible, which I assume would
be backward-compatible with 1.2. I did try and install UniVESA 5.0, hoping
it would help me as it has countless others, but to no avail. All I get is
the standard message, "Requested screen mode is not supported through VESA
interface"; asking Imagine to list all VESA modes, as you would expect,
comes up without any modes at all.

Please, please, has anyone been able to get their MGA (Matrox) Millenium to
work with Imagine?





Date:    Sunday, 01 October 1995 03:14:24 
Subject: Re: Glass making . . .
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Try making the outline of your jar off an axis and give it the thckness you
desire.  Then add faces to the outline and sweep the outline to give the
final shape.  It produces a thicker glass object and has worked well for me.

Bob...................

Date:    Sunday, 01 October 1995 03:37:44 
Subject: MGA Millennium
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Joe Beard <jbeard@cix.compulink.co.uk>
> 
> I just bought a Matrox Millennium graphics card, and now I find that 
> Imagine doesn't like it.

As you can see from my message elsewhere on the IML, I'm in the same 
boat.

> According to the SVGA list on the Project Menu, there only a handful of 
> modes available; 0, 100, 4080, e800 and 4083, all of which are only 256 
> colours.

Heck, I don't get _any_ modes! Settling for the ones you have, would at 
least be an improvement for me. Wanna tell me how you did that?


Date:    Sunday, 01 October 1995 03:43:29 
Subject: Re: Which Display Board?
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Scott J. Geertgens <geertges@colorado.edu>
> 
> I personally would suggest avoiding the Matrox. I've read that they have
> blazing Windows performance but suffer greatly under DOS.

That was true until the Millenium came out. Matrox rewrote the Millenium
VESA core to provide (or so I've heard) 10 times the speed compared to
previous Matrox cards. 


Date:    Sunday, 01 October 1995 06:03:49 
Subject: Imagemaster
From:    Dave Hardenbrook <DAVEH47@delphi.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi -- Can anyone tell me about _Imagemaster_ for Amiga?  I saw it at my 
"local" Amiga store, and it said that it could do internal 24-bit
manipulation and that was directly compatible with DCTV?  Is this true?
How does _Imagemaster_ compare with DCTV's native paint program?

Thanks in advance!

                        -- Dave (DaveH47@delphi.com)
                        

Date:    Sunday, 01 October 1995 09:58:36 
Subject: Looping essence textures
From:    Mike McCool <mikemcoo@efn.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

This was a topic ages ago, and the response seemed straightforward, only 
the person suggested doing "crossfades", from 0% to 100%, to get textures 
to appear to loop.  

I don't have this option with 3.0, so, question:  how do I get essence 
textures to loop?   I'm still at it with my water anim, trying to get 
random ripples and caustics to loop over time, without jerking back to a 
starting point to start all over again. 

(Thanks, y'all).

Date:    Sunday, 01 October 1995 10:46:30 
Subject: Re: Imagemaster
From:    Vance Schowalter <viking@freenet.edmonton.ab.CA>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

On Sun, 1 Oct 1995, Dave Hardenbrook wrote:

> Hi -- Can anyone tell me about _Imagemaster_ for Amiga?  I saw it at my 
> "local" Amiga store, and it said that it could do internal 24-bit
> manipulation and that was directly compatible with DCTV?  Is this true?
> How does _Imagemaster_ compare with DCTV's native paint program?

Yes, Imagemaster R/t works great with DCTV and includes DCTV specific 
features that the DCTV software doesn't have, such as filters to remove 
zippers, chroma artifacts common in DCTV pics, and you can greatly 
sharpen the detailing of the images.

It also has support for a few 24-bit grfx cards, but has great ability in 
using native Amiga grfx modes for manipulation of the image data. 
Imagemaster also comes with a built-in morphing program and animation 
compiler (which processes-in transitional effects).

A great program for using with DCTV. Buy it! *8^)

*******************************************
*    Vance Schowalter >>Image Master<<    *
*                                         *
* Internet: viking@freenet.edmonton.ab.ca *
*                                         *
*     "Affable little snow creature."     *
*******************************************


Date:    Sunday, 01 October 1995 11:00:19 
Subject: Re: DCTV RGB PassThru
From:    Ayalon Hermony <ila2024@zeus.datasrv.co.il>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Wed, 27 Sep 1995, Ayalon Hermony wrote:

> 
> Hello,
> 
> Have a unit for sale. Hardly used, docs and everything.
> 
> Please contact me off the IML, so we won't bother others.
> 
> 


Hello again,

It's for Amiga users only, so save your time and skip this post.

Sorry for making it public, but several people replied to the above, and
it seems some are confused, and mix between the RGB PassThru and the
DCTV units.

They are two different hardware units. You need to have the DCTV unit,
in order to connect the RGB PassThru, so if you don't, you need not buy it.

I asume you know what's the DCTV is, so I'll just tell about the PAssThru.

It allows you to use your RGB monitor (Amiga 1950 and such) and see the
DCTV colors without using a _COMPOSITE VIDEO_ monitor.
When using DCTV, the pics or anims you watch with the video monitor.
On the Amiga monitor, you see a bluish/greyish pic, you can't paint or
add text to, it's the encoded IFF pics or anims.

So, the PassThru, allows you to paint or retuch your DCTV pic, but with
fine details. If you'd tried to paint with DCTVpaint, you know it's not
easy to paint with composite video. (you need a very good video monitor,
not like the Amiga 1081/2 of A1000 which I'd used)

It's called - composite RGB (whatever that means) and you get 3-4 millions
hues, to paint with.

So, instead of using two monitors, you can use only one, like the 1950 for
A3000, and paint in Hi-Res and without flickers.

The A1000 has two inputs, a video and RGB, but I used it for the video only,
connected to DCTV, and A3000 with 1950 RGB monitor.

I've used the DCTV for testing anims, its 3 bit planes anims
are fast, if your deltas are resonable.

Now, to all that want to buy, some wanted the DCTV and not the PassThru.

O.K. I'll sell the DCTV too. 
But, it's a PAL DCTV, meaning, USA, Australia, NewZiland, 
and Japan can't use it.

I don't know if the PassThru is good for nonPAL countries, I won't take 
the chance if I were you, Video is very complicated signal, and it's
enough for one sync bit to be incorrect, and nothing shows.

I've got several offers, so please name your price, and the best will get it.
I'll pay the shiping, 'cause I don't know if I can send it COD from here.

Thanks,



               How do you come back from 3D ?
Ayalon M. Hermony,              Internet: ila2024@datasrv.co.il



Date:    Sunday, 01 October 1995 11:44:54 
Subject: RE: Imagemaster
From:    jbk4@ap.spa.psu.edu (The Prophet)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I highly recommend ImageMasterRT.  It is a great image processing
package.  

I wouldn't compare it to DCTV paint software though.  IM-RT can
do much much more but it is not your regular paint prg.  It doesn't
paint in real-time.  You have to tell it to draw here/there, then
it goes back and does it.  I don't use it to 'paint' but for image
processing it is excellent.

Documentation is provided via on-line hypertext with many tutorials.

Even if you've never touched AREXX before, IM-RT's modified scripting
language is easy to learn & use.  It's great for post-rendering fx
on your imagine anims.  Included scripts allow you to do dissolves
an wipes easily.

I like the morphing options better than any other software I've used
for the Amiga.  Athough I did like Cinemorph's ability to work with
any screenmode & size(including huge-autoscrolling screens).

IM-RT will load/save in almost any format you desire, more than enough
to meet my current needs.

IM-RT is also what I use to convert all my Imagine 24bit renders to
HAM or DCTV formats.  As mentioned before, Imagine doesn't do those
conversions well.  IM-RT will resize/dither the images to whatever
you desire.  It can even assemble the animation for you as it processes
the images.  You can output to either Amiga's native ANIM formats or
FLI/FLC formats.  

Jaeson K.

BTW, I'm not an employee of Black Belt Systems, just a satisfied user.
 ____            ____            _           _
( |  \          ( /  \          ( )       _ / )
 )|   )_   __    /   /_   _  __  /   __  ( X_)
( |  /~ \ /\_)  /---~/ ) / )/  )/~\ /\_)  / _
 )ll/  l/ \__ (/   (/   (_//__//  / \__  (___)
(____________)        (___/        (___)

Jaeson Koszarsky                  Amiga 3000+
----------------                  -----------
cyberprophet@psu.edu              68040/30Mhz
jbk4@email.psu.edu                24Megs-1GIG
jason@chaos.ezgate.com            OS3.1

Date:    Sunday, 01 October 1995 13:01:25 
Subject: Why I beta Test
From:    knappg@gate.net


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hello again,

 Several of you asked me how i became a beta tester for Imagine 4.0, well its
sort of a barter deal I have with Impulse. I have been using Imagine since its
birth (I really didnt like Silver or Turbo silver's interface). I keep a low
profile when it comes to things like lists and disscussions, one might say
I "lurk" more then talk. 

 What project am I working for this barter deal, well I dont know if I am 
at liberty to say. Lets just say its something they need. :)

 Lastly the reason I came out of "lurk" mode, was because I was REAL impressed
with what was added to Imagine and had to tell someone about it (who better
then you guys/gals).

 I have also done beta testing for other products like this and that might
have influenced it too.

  Sorry I took so long to respond but my life is a tad busy,

 Greg Knapp

PS. I was wrong in previous post after more fiddling and talking 
to Scott I found that you dont HAVE to generate the mesh in to render the
blob. this means that blobs are now movable and hundreds of times more 
flexible! TTFN
 

Date:    Sunday, 01 October 1995 13:12:00 
Subject: Re: MGA Millennium
From:    jbeard@cix.compulink.co.uk (Joe Beard)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> 
> 
> Please, please, has anyone been able to get their MGA (Matrox) 
> Millenium to
> work with Imagine?
> 

I emailed SciTech (KendallB@scitechsoft.com) who are responsible for the 
UniVesa driver, and they told me that there will be a new version 
released for Beta testing in a couple of weeks which works with the 
Millennium.

If you want to get on the Beta testing team then send them an email.

I don't know why I get some Vesa modes in the Imagine list and you get 
none, but it really makes no difference as I still don't get any texture 
or render preview.

BTW you should keep a lookout at the Canadian Matrox BBS as they 
regularly post new BIOS and Windows drivers. The number is 514 685 6008.

Joe


Date:    Sunday, 01 October 1995 15:32:39 
Subject: Draco
From:    Steve Gardiner <Steve@mg-plc.demon.co.uk>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi Prophet,

I doubt if Imagine will work correctly with the Draco. This is because Imagine
uses the Amiga Blitter chip directly to update the screen. However, it may
work in much the same way as those of us Amiga users with 24bit cards where
you have to use L-Amiga R to redraw the screen after you change something in
any of the editors. This isn't very satisfactory, and I hope that if Imagine
4.0 if the last version for the Amiga (which is possible) then I hope the gang
at Impulse will update the screen drawing routines to use in-built OS blitter
calls. That way everybody who's invested in 24bit hardware can run Imagine
properly.

Hopefully someone's listening....

Cheers
-- 

+-----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
| Steve Gardiner                   | --==>Sipping afternoon tea in London<==--|
|                                  | Visit London; Take in the sights, bask in|
|                                  |   it's rich history, pay 5 pounds for a  |
| Email : Steve@mg-plc.demon.co.uk |      crummy half-melted ice-cream...     |
+-----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

Date:    Sunday, 01 October 1995 16:33:09 
Subject: Re: ugly pork
From:    Edward Chadez <echadez@galileo.carl.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a previous letter, Scott Krehbiel wrote:
} 
} So what is the best program to compile anims in ANIM-5??
} 

I use MAKEANIM.  It's old, but reliable.

} I've been using DPaint, but I believe that it's only ANIM-4, right?
} 

Don't know.  One advantage to DPaint is that you can store anims in either
delta-compressed or uncompressed (read: faster playback because the CPU
doesn't have to decompress each image).

} Also, if I get an anim compiled and playing nice and quickly,
} what's the best program to script multiple anims together??
} 
} I'm hoping to make a presentation that has about 20 or so anims
} chained together, and will need to be loading them from my hard
} drive while others are playing (approx. 15 fps for this presentation)
} 

I know that Director-2 (from The Right Answers Group) supported "show-one 
while loading-another", and I think AmigaVision-Pro did, too.  I also know 
that Director-2 didn't work well under certian OS versions, and The Right 
Answers Group isn't making The Director for the Amiga anymore.

You might want to look into Scala (The MultiMedia pros) for presentation 
software.

} BTW: I'm using an A3000 '030/25 that'll soon have 16 megs contiguous
} ram, and 8 more in a separate location.
} 
} thanks for any help
} Scott Krehbiel
} scotkre@beacon.regent.edu
} 

And of course, I'm not associated with any of the above companies.

      -Ed
-- 
     Edward Chadez, Lead Senior Programmer/Analyst at CARL Corporation
   When web surfing, visit Galileo's Universe at http://galileo.carl.org/
A3000(25)/3.1(ROM)/CV64  Amiga user since 1987.  Internet surfer since 1989.

Date:    Sunday, 01 October 1995 16:33:41 
Subject: Re: no sniveling again
From:    mrivers@tbag.org (Michael Rivers)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

DT> Dave ThompsonDL> DamonYou two guys are complaining about all the whining, wh
ileyour actually feeding the fire with your own long whining,Amiga Bashing=AE, n
ot really related to Imagine, posts.=B7-----------------------------------------
----------------=B7| Commodore failure. Press left mouse button to continue  || 
      Error:  $0100000C       Task : $416C6920          |=B7--------------------
-------------------------------------=B7    Mike Rivers (aka) Vermin --  mrivers
@tbag.tscs.com        roadkill on the information superhighway          A4000/04
0 25mhz  18megs  1,451meg hd

Date:    Sunday, 01 October 1995 17:29:22 
Subject: RE:Beta tester
From:    Brad Molsen <moon@eskimo.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

On 30 Sep 1995, Granberg Tom wrote:

> Delete file- Be able to the delete files from detail

If this means "delete with extreme prejudice" thanks, Impulse!!!!
                              later,
                                      Brad

Date:    Sunday, 01 October 1995 18:04:12 
Subject: Re: Imagemaster
From:    Scott Krehbiel <scotkre@beacon.regent.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


Speaking of Imagemaster I have a few questions... I have Imagemaster
version 1, Revision 50 c, and I can't get it to do some things.

Like the poster printer feature... is there a module that came
with Imagemaster that is supposed to be called up when I do the
command??  (what is it, shift F4??)  When I hit that, nothing
happens.  The documentation says 

Poster Printer:  Press F4 to access the Poster Printer feature.

Oh, brilliant!!  Unfortunately, that's the way most of the 
documentation is, at least in this version.

Are there any GOOD tutorials out there for Imagemaster, or is
there an updated version that has better docs??

Any help would be highly appreciated.  

BTW:  Is black belt still in business??  Anybody know of a way
to contact them by EMail??

Thanks
Scott Krehbiel
scotkre@beacon.regent.edu



Date:    Sunday, 01 October 1995 18:10:26 
Subject: Re: ugly pork
From:    Scott Krehbiel <scotkre@beacon.regent.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Mon, 18 Sep 1995, Edward Chadez wrote:

> One more note on DCTV:  3-bitplane images animate faster than 4-bitplanes.
> While 4-bitplane (3 million colors?) look better than 3-bitplanes on a
> single picture, the difference isn't as obvious during an animation.
> Depending on the amount of delta changes per frame, I can get upto 30fps on
> an A3000/25 using ANIM-5.  A faster CPU and/or a faster decompression 
> algorithm (ie, ANIM-7) should improve things.  Of course, more memory
> always improves things, too.  :-)
> 

So what is the best program to compile anims in ANIM-5??

I've been using DPaint, but I believe that it's only ANIM-4, right?

Also, if I get an anim compiled and playing nice and quickly,
what's the best program to script multiple anims together??

I'm hoping to make a presentation that has about 20 or so anims
chained together, and will need to be loading them from my hard
drive while others are playing (approx. 15 fps for this presentation)

BTW: I'm using an A3000 '030/25 that'll soon have 16 megs contiguous
ram, and 8 more in a separate location.

thanks for any help
Scott Krehbiel
scotkre@beacon.regent.edu




Date:    Sunday, 01 October 1995 18:50:56 
Subject: I'm Stupid.. was Re: Imagemaster
From:    Scott Krehbiel <scotkre@beacon.regent.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


Hi Everybody,

I just sent a message asking for help with the poster
printer feature in Imagemaster, but should correct one
thing... I have a relatively old version (I believe) and
I'm sure the documentation has been updated many times
since I bought my copy.

Unfortunately, since I never had time to mail in my registration
card, I never received any updates.  (hey! maybe I should send
in ALL the registration cards in this stack!)

Have there been updates since version 1 revision 50c??
or any manual updates??

Is there anyone from Imagemaster on the list??

Thanks
Scott
scotkre@beacon.regent.edu




Date:    Sunday, 01 October 1995 19:46:13 
Subject: Re: Imagemaster
From:    Vance Schowalter <viking@freenet.edmonton.ab.ca>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

On Sun, 1 Oct 1995, Scott Krehbiel wrote:

> 
> Speaking of Imagemaster I have a few questions... I have Imagemaster
> version 1, Revision 50 c, and I can't get it to do some things.

I have the latest version and I highly recommend you update yours. It 
includes bug fixes and more features including two new effects, 
lightning and fire (very realistic!). 

> 
> Like the poster printer feature... is there a module that came
> with Imagemaster that is supposed to be called up when I do the
> command??  (what is it, shift F4??)  When I hit that, nothing
> happens.  The documentation says 
> 
> Poster Printer:  Press F4 to access the Poster Printer feature.
> 
> Oh, brilliant!!  Unfortunately, that's the way most of the 
> documentation is, at least in this version.
> 
> Are there any GOOD tutorials out there for Imagemaster, or is
> there an updated version that has better docs??
> 
> Any help would be highly appreciated.  
> 
> BTW:  Is black belt still in business??  Anybody know of a way
> to contact them by EMail??

I haven't used the Poster printer option yet, so I couldn't tell you 
off-hand how it works. What I can tell you is that you should get a 
requester to select the Poster Printer when you press the hotkey. This 
is supposed to load and run that module for you. You have to use the 
function from the main menu, I believe.

I think someone made a tutorial, but my experience has been to learn by 
trial and error, the same with Imagine, until the ol' lightbulb comes on.

The updated version has improved docs as well.

Here's all the support info you should need:

/========================================================================\
| Black Belt Systems, Inc. State of the Art Image Manipulation Software  |
| Windows 3.1 & Windows NT-Alpha/MIPS/PowerPC/Intel & AmigaDOS 2.04/3.xx |
+----------------------------I-N-T-E-R-N-E-T-----------------------------|
|   Web Pages: http://www.blackbelt.com/blackbelt/bx_top.html            |
|       Demos: ftp.blackbelt.com/corporate/blackbelt/demos               |
|              ftp.blackbelt.com/corporate/blackbelt/amigademos          |
| Information: info@blackbelt.com         Support: support@blackbelt.com |
|       Sales: sales@blackbelt.com      Marketing: market@blackbelt.com  |
+----------------------------P-H-Y-S-I-C-A-L-----------------------------+
| Black Belt Systems, Inc.         | US & Canadian Sales: (800) 852-6442 |
| Building #2                      | International Sales: (406) 367-5513 |
| 398 Johnson Road                 |   Technical support: (406) 367-5509 |
| Glasgow, MT, USA                 |              G3 FAX: (406) 367-2329 |
| 59230                            |       Multiline BBS: (406) 367-2227 | 
+----------------------O-P-E-R-A-T-I-N-G---H-O-U-R-S---------------------+

*******************************************
*    Vance Schowalter >>Image Master<<    *
*                                         *
* Internet: viking@freenet.edmonton.ab.ca *
*                                         *
*     "Affable little snow creature."     *
*******************************************


Date:    Sunday, 01 October 1995 23:12:09 
Subject: Re: A pipe . . .
From:    Rick Dolishny <dolish@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hang on, kids, I think I've got this pipe thing licked!

CONFORM TO PATH
---------------

Nice thing about using Paths in the Detail editor is that they can be 
used in the Stage editor later! So here's what I would do, assuming 
we're using an open pipe, shaped like a U, so we can see the water droplet.

1) Create the shape of the pipe, as such:

    \   /
     ~~~

2) Create a second object: a path, using axis', that will be the
   shape of what will become the Extruded path.

3) Extrude the shape of the pipe (#1) to path you just created (step #2).

4) Voila, instant pipe with lots of curves, I hope!

5) Finally, create your water droplet. Make it whatever shape you want.
   It just sorta has to fit in the pipe. You can even create different
   versions of the droplet as different (Shape) States, as a bonus!

   Save your three separate objects: pipe, path, and droplet.

6) Exit Detail, create a 30 frame animation, go to Stage, load the pipe,
   path, and droplet. Save. Go to Action, tell the droplet to Conform
   to path in it's position timeline. Don't touch the Alignment option.

7) You can just see it now, can't you!?!

Good luck!


Rick Dolishny          dolish@io.org
Ardee Productions - Toronto, Ontario


Date:    Sunday, 01 October 1995 23:23:58 
Subject: Re: Glass making . . .
From:    Rick Dolishny <dolish@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

You are on the right track, making thick glass, (ie: two sided wall: 
inner and outer) but remember that glass will never look good unless 
it's animated. And put something behind it always!
 
Finally, set the Index of refraction kinda high: try 1.3.

Good luck!



Rick Dolishny          dolish@io.org
Ardee Productions - Toronto, Ontario


Date:    Sunday, 01 October 1995 23:27:30 
Subject: Re: Imagemaster
From:    Rick Dolishny <dolish@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

DCTV's paint program is superior to Imagemaster for paint tools. Lots of 
limitations with DCTV, though, like one size of image only (well, two 
without interlace).

I own Imagemaster and it's worked most of the time. Great for 
compositing images together and simple text. Painting..? Not a good choice.

But, yes, it directly supports DCTV images very well.


On Sun, 1 Oct 1995, Dave Hardenbrook wrote:

> Hi -- Can anyone tell me about _Imagemaster_ for Amiga?  I saw it at my 
> "local" Amiga store, and it said that it could do internal 24-bit
> manipulation and that was directly compatible with DCTV?  Is this true?
> How does _Imagemaster_ compare with DCTV's native paint program?
> 
> Thanks in advance!
> 
>                         -- Dave (DaveH47@delphi.com)
>                         
> 

Rick Dolishny          dolish@io.org
Ardee Productions - Toronto, Ontario


Date:    Monday, 02 October 1995 00:20:01 
Subject: Re: DCTV RGB PassThru
From:    Darryl_Lewis@comlink.mpx.com.au (Darryl Lewis)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


 AH> O.K. I'll sell the DCTV too. 
 AH> But, it's a PAL DCTV, meaning, USA, Australia, NewZiland, 
 AH> and Japan can't use it.

I think you might be confussed. Australia, NewZealand and England (they
have a different audio subcarrier though) all use PAL.
America (and I think Japan) uses NTSC.

So, is your unit NTSC or PAL?

Darryl

-- Via DLG Pro v1.0

               #####\             _             /#####
               #( )# |          _( )__         | #( )# 
               ##### |         /_    /         | #####
               #" "# |     ___m/I_ //_____     | #" "#
               # O # |____#-x.\ /++m\ /.x-#____| # O #
               #m.m# |   /" \ ///###\\\ / "\   | #m.m#
               #####/    ######/     \######    \#####

Date:    Monday, 02 October 1995 02:06:07 
Subject: Object conversions
From:    rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au (Robert Byrne)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hello Anime, on Sep 29 you wrote:

>  Does anyone use Pixel Pro to convert form Imagine to Lightwave?? And if 
> so, do they find that the axis gets moved when changing from Imagine to 
> Lightwave??  Also, are there any other programs that convert objects form 
> one to another>??

I've only converted the other way (LW to Im) but InterChange Plus does a
very good job, it even retains some of the attributes (face colours) of the
original LWave object.

-- Bob

Date:    Monday, 02 October 1995 02:32:53 
Subject: Some great modelling tips
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Tim Wilson, creator of Humanoid human models for Imagine, is one 
experienced modeller. He recently left this nice collection of tips & 
traps on CompuServe, which I'm reposting here:

------------------------------------------------------------

#: 17815 S9/Imagine Users Group
    12-Sep-95  23:05:23
Sb: #17799-3.3 Rendering Crashing
Fm: Tim Wilson [Crestline] 76432,1122

Date:    Monday, 02 October 1995 02:42:09 
Subject: Re: Star Wars objects
From:    rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au (Robert Byrne)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hello Paul, on Sep 30 you wrote:

> I need to find some Star Wars objects.  Hopefully, too, someone has 
> created a StormTrooper object.  Can someone point me in the right direction?

There are some on Aminet in the gfx/3dobj directory:-

T_17_V2.9.lha (T17 fighter)
dstar.lha (Death Star)
scoutwalker.lha
xwing.lha
ywing.lha

If you can get hold of the LightROM Vol 1 CD it has:-

Luke's Land Speeder, Light Sabre and a T16 "Y" class fighter with Essence 2
textures.

-- Bob

  :  Robert Byrne  : rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au :
  : Amiga A3000/25 :  Ballina, NSW  Australia  :


Date:    Monday, 02 October 1995 03:11:12 
Subject: Re: MGA Millennium
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Joe Beard <jbeard@cix.compulink.co.uk>
> 
> I emailed SciTech (KendallB@scitechsoft.com) who are responsible for the 
> UniVesa driver, and they told me that there will be a new version 
> released for Beta testing in a couple of weeks which works with the 
> Millennium.
> 
> If you want to get on the Beta testing team then send them an email.

Thanks! I just sent e-mail to ScitechSoft asking about that.

> I don't know why I get some Vesa modes in the Imagine list and you get 
> none, but it really makes no difference as I still don't get any texture 
> or render preview.

Still, if I could get _some_ VESA modes going for quickrenders, it would 
certainly help me. I'm running a 4M Millenium, with both the 1.5 and 1.7 
MGA BIOS (upgraded to 1.7 tonight -- no difference) What CONFIG.SYS or 
AUTOEXEC.BAT statements do you have referencing the Millenium?

Date:    Monday, 02 October 1995 08:42:10 
Subject: Re: A pipe
From:    dvwilson@tibalt.supernet.ab.CA


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

>In a message dated 95-09-28 12:48:40 EDT, you write:

>One method which may be a little better would be to model the pipe and the
>bump seperately and move the bump over the pipe. This would not distort the
>pipe's faces and would allow the bump to follow curved pipe. It also shows
>the seam between the bump and pipe so it's not too realistic. 


                This would be the best idea actually.  All you have to do is
take a section
of the original pipe and model the middle of the section to be the lump
leaving the ends of the pipe the same as the origininal pipe.  That way you
would probably 
eliminate the seam between the two objects.  Might take a bit of work but I
think it would work pretty good.


Date:    Monday, 02 October 1995 08:57:50 
Subject: Re: Star Wars objects
From:    cjo@esrange.ssc.se


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Paul Thompson wrote;

>I need to find some Star Wars objects.  Hopefully, too, someone has
>created a StormTrooper object.  Can someone point me in the right=20
>direction?

That depends on what you're looking for.
There are some _very_ nice TIE's (fighter, interceptor & bomber) in=20
gfx/3dobj on Aminet along with A-, X- and Y-Wing's and a couple of=20
Walker's. And probably some more that I have forgotten...
... same old memory problem...

And speaking of that; don't you think I did _exactly_ the same mistake all=20
over _AGAIN_ when I should make an mpeg out of a series of frames?
Running 'easy_mpeg' I forgot to increase the stack in my shell. AGAIN!!!
Please, does anybody have some static RAM to sell?
It would seam that the refresh for my dynamic RAM has gone kaputt.

;-)

*---------------------------------------------------------------*
|   Conny Joensson   |   Swedish Space Corp. Esrange            |
|   Kiruna           |   Satellite operations - Telecom Div.    |
|   Sweden           |   cjo@smtpgw.esrange.ssc.se              |
*---------------------------------------------------------------*

Date:    Monday, 02 October 1995 11:11:01 
Subject: Re: good tree objects, how, where?
From:    Mike McCool <mikemcoo@efn.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hey Aki, 

      As you didn't state your platform, I didn't want to waste your or 
the list's time responding with the tree maker I've recommended all too 
many times here before.  

      If you're on amiga, go down to aminet and look for the batch of 
tree objects someone was nice enough to post there.  There are several 
tree types (bare branches only), and some of them are very good.  

Date:    Monday, 02 October 1995 11:28:16 
Subject: Scripting anims
From:    Mike McCool <mikemcoo@efn.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hey Scott, 

      Well, someone recommended makeanim, for compiling your anims.  I 
couldn't disagree more.  :)  (That one's fine, really, just so damned 
tedious).  

      The builder I use all the time is BuildAnim.  Much more 
straightforward, and not nearly all the tedium in typing.  

      With all this talk of Director, I noticed AmigaVision was 
mentioned only in passing.  I don't know how long you've been on board 
the amiga scene, but AmigaVision used to be bundled with the computer, so 
that nearly everyone I know has a copy.  And AmigaV pro is really sweet.  

      Not only can you script your anims very intuitively, but you can 
load icons in the script that will automatically load/unload anims 
while others are playing, so that you really can design a seamless 
presentation, even if your ram is limited. 

      AmigaVision was sort of the premier presentation package for the 
amiga, long before Director.  Can't speak for that one, as I ain't got 
it, but if you own AmigaVision, you're home free. It has 8svx sound 
support, of course.  

      It's only real disadvantage is that it won't load anim7 format 
anims.  I compile nearly everything to anim7 now, with Buildanim, cause it 
gives such great playback speed on my slowpoke 3000/25.  

Date:    Monday, 02 October 1995 12:21:55 
Subject: Re: ugly pork
From:    Ayalon Hermony <ila2024@zeus.datasrv.co.il>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Sun, 1 Oct 1995, Edward Chadez wrote:

> 
> I know that Director-2 (from The Right Answers Group) supported "show-one
> while loading-another", and I think AmigaVision-Pro did, too.I also know 
> that Director-2 didn't work well under certian OS versions, and The Right
> Answers Group isn't making The Director for the Amiga anymore.
> 
> You might want to look into Scala (The MultiMedia pros) for presentation
> software.
> 

Yes ,indeed.

I used Director with ARexx, MakeAnim, and IFFtoDCTV with great results.

With A3000/25 10M RAM, was able to get up to 5 anims palying simlessly.
                                                             *********
That's the main point to take notice.

Scala or CanDo don't connect the anims correctly. You'll notice a slight
delay, while cutting from anim1 to anim2.

Only Director-2, can play up to five anims, like todays PAR and other
non-linear editing. I say five, cause it uses only chip mem for its buffers.
And that what I've got for 2M chip. Your anims, can be as long as your fast
ram (or hard disk, if you play from it)

The Director has a problem with OS 3.0, with the DISPLAY command. Didn't
try it, but had a post a long time ago with someone, about it.

You'll want also to pre-load the anims to ram, and play them from there.
Altough, if you need only 15fps, you can do it from hard disk.

You'll have to experiment, in order to load while playing anims, or to do
it, when there are slight delays, or static pic showing.

I used to play up to 40-50 seconds of 5 parts anims, and record them to VCR.

You can also sync 8svx (iff sound) or MIDI songs from Director-2 while
playing the anims.

I'm not working for The Director-2 company, just having the idea, maybe I
should sell my Director-2 disks and book :)).  (now that I'm selling DCTV
and the RGB PassThru)
 
It's realy tough selling my Amiga Hard/Soft, it's like saying goodbye
to a very good and loyal friend.

Does anyone knows, if The Right Answer Group, made anything like Director
for Windows/Dos ?



               How do you come back from 3D ?
Ayalon M. Hermony,              Internet: ila2024@datasrv.co.il


Date:    Monday, 02 October 1995 12:46:43 
Subject: Good tree objects, how, where?
From:    Aki Laukkanen <alaukka@voimax.voima.jkl.fi>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi,

How do I achieve good tree objects? I mean modelling one, leaf by leaf is 
very tedious and hard process. Is there any easier way program wise (are 
there any good tree generating programs) or method wise? Also I'd like to 
get my hands on some public domain tree objects, are there any available? 
The type of the tree doesn't really matter.

Date:    Monday, 02 October 1995 12:49:12 
Subject: Re: Draco
From:    Soeren Birk Jacobsen <kurgan@imada.ou.dk>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Sun, 1 Oct 1995, Steve Gardiner wrote:

> Hi Prophet,
> 
> I doubt if Imagine will work correctly with the Draco. This is because Imagine

> uses the Amiga Blitter chip directly to update the screen. However, it may
> work in much the same way as those of us Amiga users with 24bit cards where
> you have to use L-Amiga R to redraw the screen after you change something in
> any of the editors. This isn't very satisfactory, and I hope that if Imagine
> 4.0 if the last version for the Amiga (which is possible) then I hope the gang

> at Impulse will update the screen drawing routines to use in-built OS blitter
> calls. That way everybody who's invested in 24bit hardware can run Imagine
> properly.
> 
> Hopefully someone's listening....
> 
> Cheers
> -- 
> 

From what I know,(and I have been in contact with MacroSystem), the 
video card on the DraCo ,(no typo here), is exactly like any other 
Retina card, just faster. Now my memory might be playing tricks on me 
but I think I recall a lot of tricks on ther IML on how to get Imagine 
run in HiRes on Retina, and then finally (with some update) a message 
stating that Imagine supported Retina directly or something.
In any case since Imagine run on Retina and Retina is made by the same 
folks that make the DraCo, and that the Retina on the DraCo only should 
be faster, I for one belive Imagine will work very well on DraCo.
Now somebody wrote that the DraCo would be boosting 450MIPS, well yes 
but that's only with the ALPHA-board installed, and as far as I know 
Impulse has not released any info on an ALPHA version (well W-NT might 
work, but then you'd have to run NT on your DraCo yuk!)

Bye


kurgan

PS. I didn't get a reg-card either
(either Impulse has big trouble on their packaging-line or else some 
of us is lying)    

Date:    Monday, 02 October 1995 12:53:02 
Subject: IML archives Sept uploaded to wuarchive
From:    Joop.vandeWege@MEDEW.ENTO.WAU.NL (joop van de wege)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi All,

Just a small notice that the IML archives for September have been uploaded to 
Aminet, they should appear in a day or two in the RECENT listing.
I also re-loaded August and July since something has gone wrong but it seems 
I'm the only who has noticed.

Does anyone read the archive ?
If not I can stop doing it.

Greetings Joop

Date:    Monday, 02 October 1995 14:06:24 
Subject: Re: good tree objects, how, where?
From:    Appalchin@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I recently downloaded a demo off the web of a tree creater for the pc.  I
haven't played with it much,  but the demo pics looked fair.  It's called
MECN Tree Factory.  If you go to the 3D Web site you'll find a pointer to it
under software packages.  Good luck

Date:    Monday, 02 October 1995 14:47:29 
Subject: Director II (was Ugly Pork)
From:    Scott Krehbiel <scotkre@beacon.regent.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


Actually, I've been using the Director II, but it's been crashing
my system in new ways since I got an A3000.  I thought that Director
barfed on 2.1, but maybe (once again!) I have an old version??

I find that Director will run fine, then when I'm pretty sure that
it still has plenty of memory, and I have removed all other old
anims from ram, it just stops dead in it's tracks.

What version of Director II is current??

Thanks
Scott Krehbiel
scotkre@beacon.regent.edu



Date:    Monday, 02 October 1995 15:47:00 
Subject: Re: MGA Millennium
From:    jbeard@cix.compulink.co.uk (Joe Beard)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> 
> Still, if I could get _some_ VESA modes going for quickrenders, it 
> would certainly help me. I'm running a 4M Millenium, with both the 1.5 
> and 1.7 MGA BIOS (upgraded to 1.7 tonight -- no difference) What 
> CONFIG.SYS or AUTOEXEC.BAT statements do you have referencing the 
> Millenium?
>

I don't have any DOS drivers for the card at all. Zilch, zippo, zero, not 
a single one. So like I said I don't know why I have some modes listed 
and you have none, as I have done nothing at all to enable them. I only 
have the 2 meg card, but that would make no difference.

So are you saying that you cannot even see the result of a quickrender 
from Imagine? I get no display while the scene is being rendered, but it 
does manage to show the end result, although the picture is very 
distorted.

I guess, like the rest of us on the techno-frontier, you will just have 
to be patient and wait for SciTech to do their stuff.

Joe


Date:    Monday, 02 October 1995 18:22:58 
Subject: Re: IML archives Sept uploaded to wuarchive
From:    Damon LaCaille <nomad@aloha.net>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hiya Joop,
  just wanted to let you know that I *do* read the archives and I sure 
appreciate the effort you put into archiving them!!!  I'm sure your job 
goes unappreciated at times, so thanks.

Damon

[=====================================================================]
[      Damon L. LaCaille     |  A3000 @ 25MHz 10MB RAM / 540MB HD     ]
[=====================================================================]
[ Email - nomad@aloha.net    | If you're not making 50 mistakes a day ]
[ WWW  - Be watching for my  |   then you're not trying hard enough!  ]
[        WWW home page here! |-=* IMAGINE - Why use anything else? *=-]
[=====================================================================]


On Mon, 2 Oct 1995, joop van de wege wrote:

> Hi All,
> 
> Just a small notice that the IML archives for September have been uploaded to 

> Aminet, they should appear in a day or two in the RECENT listing.
> I also re-loaded August and July since something has gone wrong but it seems 
> I'm the only who has noticed.
> 
> Does anyone read the archive ?
> If not I can stop doing it.
> 
> Greetings Joop
> 

Date:    Monday, 02 October 1995 18:42:37 
Subject: 3-D Stars
From:    Damon LaCaille <nomad@aloha.net>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


I've looked through the Dare2Imagine (I think?) and IML FAQs (all of the 
ones I have) and I've seen several (and similar) routes to take when 
creating a starfield, however, I want to create a 3-d rotating starfield 
(as seen in Carmen Rizzollo's Enterprise-Photon ANIM).

I'll create a large sphere, place the camera directly in the middle, and 
rotate the camera for a 60-120 frame animation.  The sphere has all 
correct attribute settings (because the rendered frame looks fine), but 
when it starts to animate, the stars are not relative to where they first 
were.  Does that sound right?  Basically, if you try to track one star, 
you'll be tracking a different one every frame.  I don't think it's using 
the same sphere as in the animation before.

I've even tried to use the States function, but with no success.  I'm 
still new (obviously!) to Imagine, so please forgive my ignorance.

Sorry this post doesn't read smoothly either, I'm tired.

[=====================================================================]
[      Damon L. LaCaille     |  A3000 @ 25MHz 10MB RAM / 540MB HD     ]
[=====================================================================]
[ Email - nomad@aloha.net    | If you're not making 50 mistakes a day ]
[ WWW  - Be watching for my  |   then you're not trying hard enough!  ]
[        WWW home page here! |-=* IMAGINE - Why use anything else? *=-]
[=====================================================================]



Date:    Monday, 02 October 1995 20:07:08 
Subject: Re: good tree objects, how, where?
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-02 06:50:49 EDT, you write:

>How do I achieve good tree objects? I mean modelling one, leaf by leaf is 
>very tedious and hard process. Is there any easier way program wise (are 
>there any good tree generating programs) or method wise? Also I'd like to 
>get my hands on some public domain tree objects, are there any available? 
>The type of the tree doesn't really matter.<<

There is a good tree generation program called Imaginenursery by Schreiber
Instruments. It does however require at least 32 meg of ram to operate.  If
you are interested in more details they have the following numbers.  Location
is Denver Colorado.
Voice 303-759-1025
Fax    303-759-0928
BBS   303-759-3598

It creates multiple types of trees as well as entire forests and cost around
$150.

Bob..................



Date:    Monday, 02 October 1995 20:27:24 
Subject: Re: good tree objects, how, where?
From:    Marty K <mk-tel@sik.ppoy.fi>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

On Mon, 2 Oct 1995, Aki Laukkanen wrote:

> Hi,
> 
> How do I achieve good tree objects? I mean modelling one, leaf by leaf is 
> very tedious and hard process. Is there any easier way program wise (are 
> there any good tree generating programs) or method wise? Also I'd like to 
> get my hands on some public domain tree objects, are there any available? 
> The type of the tree doesn't really matter.
> 
There are some usable tree objcets in aminet (pub/amiga/gfx/3dobjects).
Vertex 2 (on the Amiga) has a function for generating fractal trees. You 
can download the demo version from aminet. I have made trees myself with 
various methods, but never managed to make them very detailed.

__    __  __  _ __  ___  _____  __ __ _  __    __    "Nothing is real"
'=\/T/='  I|\/| //\ I| )/ I| \\_/  I|/   '=\T\/='    mk-tel.sik.ppoy.fi
  /^^   * I|  |//~~\I|~\  I|  I|   I|\  *   ^^\        Pori, FINLAND
          ~~  ~~~  ~~~  ~ ~~  ~~   ~~ ~          http://www.ppoy.fi/~mk-tel


Date:    Monday, 02 October 1995 21:25:06 
Subject: Re: IML archives Sept uploaded to wuarchive
From:    Old_Man <sea_dog@yrkpa.kias.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I read and need it Joop

Bill


Date:    Monday, 02 October 1995 22:47:38 
Subject: Yet another pipe solution
From:    Brian V Salisbury <bvs@viewpoint.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I once did an animation of a ball shooting out of a tube in order
to test the idea of snake swallowing an egg type thing.

It was very simple. Make a tube, then using a sphere as a template,
move it along the tube at intervals equal to half or quarter (don't
remember which) of the distance of the sphere, scaliing and buldging
up the tube against the sphere-template.  Save each shape at it's
interval, and morph between them. It worked wonderfully.

Another method is to make the tube with the buldge built in. Assign it
to your path. Take 2 disks equal to the diameter of the ends of the tube,
and position them right on each end of the tube. (It is better to use the
actual ends of the first tube to secure an exact fit.) Take all of the axis
and position them in the exact same spot. Use the grow along path fx
for one end, and reverse grow the other end, with the tube in the middle
following the path. I used this method back in 2.0 to make a snake on
a path, However, this method presents
obvious problems with textures.

-- 
Brian Salisbury 
bs@viewpoint.com
(801)229-3053

"If you go flying back through time and you see somebody else flying
forward into the future, it's probably best to avoid eye contact."


Date:    Monday, 02 October 1995 23:11:10 
Subject: Opalvision? - Amiga only, PC users disregard
From:    Roger Straub <straub@csn.net>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I'm sorry to ask this here, but my Usenet posting service is down.

Has anyone had this problem?

Everything seemed to go fine in the installation. (I have an A3000/030 16 
MHz w/ 6 MB RAM) But, when I turned on the computer, a normal display (I 
run my WB in Productivity mode on a Micro Q multisync monitor; I had to 
order a 15-pin to 23-pin monitor adapter, as per the instructions in the 
`Getting Started' manual) would display funny. The whole display seemed 
to be scaled up in the horizontal direction, and the odd display lines 
were displayed about a screen-width to the right. I guess it goes without 
saying that I can't use the board this way; the only screen that will 
display correctly is a >31 kHz display, which the opal board doesn't 
support. I can't have a 24-bit backdrop to my WB, I can't use OpalPaint, 
etc. AAAAARRRGGHHHH!!!! HELP!

I thought it might be a defective board, so I sent it back to the dealer. 
I recieved another one in the mail and I had the same problems. BTW, both 
boards had no registration card in the box, so I'm not sure if I can call 
the Opal tech support line...

I thought it might be my monitor, so I tried plugging several others into 
the board; the display on them was even worse! 

HELP!!!!

See ya,
      Roger




Date:    Monday, 02 October 1995 23:38:20 
Subject: Re: Scripting anims
From:    Gerard Menendez <gpm@netcom.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Mon, 2 Oct 1995, Mike McCool wrote:

> 
>     AmigaVision was sort of the premier presentation package for the 
> amiga, long before Director.  Can't speak for that one, as I ain't got 
> it, but if you own AmigaVision, you're home free.  


Director has been around for a long time.  Bought my 2000 in 88 and had 
Director within a year.  

Just found my old receipts the other day.  I bought my computer at one 
dead dealer, Turbo Silver at a different dead dealer and Sculpt-3d at a 
third dead dealer.  Oh well time to move on.  I'm hoping that I can add 
$100 to the constant upgrade I have and move to the PC version.

Gerard

Date:    Tuesday, 03 October 1995 01:09:50 
Subject: Re: ugly pork
From:    Duncan <dunc@eraser.demon.co.uk>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi Scott,

> 
> So what is the best program to compile anims in ANIM-5??

 Id have a look at ANIM-7 theres a little program to compile these in the
Viewtek file on aminet or use ImageFX
 
> I've been using DPaint, but I believe that it's only ANIM-4, right?
                                 
  I could be wrong but i think Dpaint uses ANIM-5

I would think about ClariSSA you can get a very good frame rate with it
and you also get some effects that you can apply to anims fades etc
and it has built in virtual memory though you seem to have quite an amount
of memory it soon runs out :(

> Also, if I get an anim compiled and playing nice and quickly,
> what's the best program to script multiple anims together??
> 
 you could just write your own script and either execute it from cli or attach
an icon (project) and set the default tool to IconX 

> I'm hoping to make a presentation that has about 20 or so anims
> chained together, and will need to be loading them from my hard
> drive while others are playing (approx. 15 fps for this presentation)

 im not sure about loading while playing but from with in the script you
can quite easily copy one anim to ram play it delete it load the next etc

 Duncan

 \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\
 \\                           dunc@eraser.demon.co.uk                      \\
 \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\

Date:    Tuesday, 03 October 1995 01:13:25 
Subject: Re: RE:Beta tester
From:    Duncan <dunc@eraser.demon.co.uk>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi Brad,

> > Delete file- Be able to the delete files from detail
> 
> If this means "delete with extreme prejudice" 

 Hmmm it'll end in tears !

Date:    Tuesday, 03 October 1995 01:24:02 
Subject: Re: MGA Millennium
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Joe Beard <jbeard@cix.compulink.co.uk>
> 
> So are you saying that you cannot even see the result of a quickrender
> from Imagine? I get no display while the scene is being rendered, but it
> does manage to show the end result, although the picture is very
> distorted. 

When Imagine doesn't see any VESA modes, it falls back on a single 
320x200x256 display for quickrenders and such. This means I can still 
see quickrenders once they're done, but only at low spatial and colour 
resolution.

I'm on the beta list for UniVESA. We'll see what we can come up with. 
Gawd, I hope it's not something silly like Imagine refusing to work 
because the VESA version, 2.0, is not the 1.2 it might expect. I'm 
awaiting a reply from Mike on that.


Date:    Tuesday, 03 October 1995 01:52:57 
Subject: Re: IML archives Sept uploaded to wuarchive
From:    Al Nehl <nehla@piw.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Joop,

   No, please continue. Thanks.

At 11:53 AM 10/2/95 +0100, you wrote:
>Hi All,
>
>Just a small notice that the IML archives for September have been uploaded to 
>Aminet, they should appear in a day or two in the RECENT listing.
>I also re-loaded August and July since something has gone wrong but it seems 
>I'm the only who has noticed.
>
>Does anyone read the archive ?
>If not I can stop doing it.
>
>Greetings Joop
>
>

--
Sincerely,

Al Nehl

Steer by the stars above, not by the lights of each passing ship. 


Date:    Tuesday, 03 October 1995 02:06:52 
Subject: LIGHT-blues
From:    augioh4b@ibmmail.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

--- Received from GITD.PSG024  2164526              03OCT95  15.02
  -> IBMMAIL.INTERNET      IBMMAIL
Hi all,

I am one of the fortunate person to get Imagine 2.0 with a mag
andwas doing a render of a room, and encountered a problem with
the lighting of a wall mounted light object.

I used a point (sphere with no dimensions) and made it into a
light-source, spherical/shadow/diminish. Now this light source is
placed inside a half-dish which was placed on the wall, being
carefull that the light-source is not on or behind the wall. Upon
rendering the scene, I found that the wall was not totally lit
where it was supposed to.  Instead I found this ...

       ---------------------------------------------
       |      000000       00000000000000000       |
       |         0000000    000000000000           |
       |              0000  0000000                |
       |                 \  +  /   (+ light)       |
       |                  \___/ bowl               |

The 0 represents the lit up area of the wall by the light, and
the unexpected presence of the unlit area about 2 quarters along
from the left.

Ashame though coz the light gradually faded to the unlit area
from both sides, maybe a clue to the soft shadows in V2.0 if used
properly.

Anywayz...sorry for the bad drawing but I hope u people can
understand, otherwise I am most happy to post the pic here if my
explanation is as bad as my grammar. :)

Thank you
Vic.

Date:    Tuesday, 03 October 1995 03:49:06 
Subject: Re: LIGHT-blues
From:    sgiff@airmail.net (Stephen Gifford)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


>Ashame though coz the light gradually faded to the unlit area
>from both sides, maybe a clue to the soft shadows in V2.0 if used
>properly.

SoftShadows in Version 2?  They should be in version 4.  You can use light
arrays to create softshadows in v. 2.

s.g.


Date:    Tuesday, 03 October 1995 07:39:00 
Subject: Re: Create IT!!!
From:    Paul Townend <Paul.Townend@raytech.co.uk>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


 -=> Quoting sgiff@airmail.net to All <=-
 sg> By the way if anyone has any comments on my 2 contributions to the
 sg> brochure I would appreciate hearing them.  Unfortunately they cropped
 sg> my name on the Clock so that no one can see it and the other Pic the
 sg> Coke Sculpture is to small to see to see my name.

 sg> Stephen G.

     Cool pictures m8 :-) They should have made the coke one bigger to
     see it clearer. Just wondering, did you use any post production to
     get any effects on the coke one? I have my doubts about the lens
     flare on the submarine/ship piccy. Looks very much like photoshop
     to me.
     BTW, I'm not against post production at all - I just would like to
     know :-))
     If Tom's listening in, Yes, your images look way cool (and Steve's)
     in fact a Pro-Lightwave friend of mine thought they were nearly all
     SGI material!!

     Dissapointment over here that there won't be a Win95 specific version.
     After all, it's only sold 20million copies :-)

     Siezure,
     Paul.


.... "Remember what You were doing and call Impulse" - Using Imagine maybe?
|
| Internet: Paul.Townend@raytech.co.uk
|-------------------------------------------------------------------|
| Gated from RAYTECH BBS - free access raytracing support in the UK |
|------------------------- call +44 1862 83 2020 modem - 24 hours ! |

Date:    Tuesday, 03 October 1995 07:50:01 
Subject: Re: Glossy Brochure
From:    Paul Townend <Paul.Townend@raytech.co.uk>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


 -=> Quoting Darryl_Lewis@comlink.mpx.com.au to All <=-
 > >


 I'm most annoyed about Crowbar Mike and his comments. Don't give out
 Da> cover disks if you don't want unregistered users you stupid buggers.
 Da> Don't send out imagine without registration cards if you want people to
 Da> register. Offer somthing for them to want to register. Pathetic.

     I too had no registration card - I sent a letter to Impulse and had
     absolutely no feedback (sent with stamped/self addressed envelope)
     and therefore gave up. I paid my money, and feel like some kinda'
     leech after Mike had his little speech.
     It's not often I enter mail in here..I read it all the time, but I
     just had to say something about it. (likewise so many others).


 Da> You'd have to pay me $200 to run it on windoze...eech!
 
     I can't say I enjoy Windows95 any more than Amiga's workbench (no
    platform war here!) , but it's far better than 3.11 and beats the hell
    out of re-booting to alter those maps!!


 PS. windoze '95 has naughty pictures built into it's code that can be
 Da> viewed when booting by a certain set of key presses. No wonder it's so
 Da> bloody big.

    Have I missed something? Bill Gates perversion alert!

    By for now.
    Paul.


.... I may be getting older but I refuse to grow up.
|
| Internet: Paul.Townend@raytech.co.uk
|-------------------------------------------------------------------|
| Gated from RAYTECH BBS - free access raytracing support in the UK |
|------------------------- call +44 1862 83 2020 modem - 24 hours ! |

Date:    Tuesday, 03 October 1995 07:59:02 
Subject: Re: Star Wars objects
From:    Paul Townend <Paul.Townend@raytech.co.uk>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


 -=> Quoting shinobi@gold.interlog.com to All <=-

 sh> I need to find some Star Wars objects.  Hopefully, too, someone has 
 sh> created a StormTrooper object.  Can someone point me in the right
 sh> direction? 
 sh> Thanks!
 sh> Paul

     I've got a few star wars objects, they are mostly available from
     PD libraries.
     As far as the stormtrooper goes, if you're in the U.K, you may have
     seen the front cover of P.C Format some time ago. This was a render
     of a stormtrooper, built and rendered in Lightwave by someone who
     got paid far too little! I very much doubt that anyone has built
     one quite as accurate as this ( I thought it was real:-) ).
     Have fun searching..:-)

     Paul.



.... Beware of programmers who carry screwdrivers.
|
| Internet: Paul.Townend@raytech.co.uk
|-------------------------------------------------------------------|
| Gated from RAYTECH BBS - free access raytracing support in the UK |
|------------------------- call +44 1862 83 2020 modem - 24 hours ! |

Date:    Tuesday, 03 October 1995 09:00:26 
Subject: Carpet Attribute
From:    rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au (Robert Byrne)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Here's the attributes for a mottled carpet I did for a room floor.

Apply it to a plane with its Z axis perpendicular.

Color: 185, 86, 0

Roughness: 192

Phong: Off

All other settings to default.

Fuzz Texture:

30.0            0.6
1.0             210
0.35            105
0.3             20
1.0             0
4.0             0
0.2
0.7

Splotch Texture:

1.0             0
1.0             0.5
0.9             0.55
0.83            0.6
0.65            0.7
0.73            0.8
1.0             0.9
0.5             1.0


-- Bob

  :  Robert Byrne  : rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au :
  : Amiga A3000/25 :  Ballina, NSW  Australia  :


Date:    Tuesday, 03 October 1995 09:23:58 
Subject: Quicky (long one)
From:    cjo@esrange.ssc.se


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Brick quicky

In the latest issue of 3D Artist was an article by Alex Lindsey.
It was about making rock blocks.
The idea was that he wanted to make a whole wall made of individual
blocks (or slabs, if you like) of stone, and they had to be _very_
detailed because that's what his customer had ordered.  ;)

The "how-to" was written for Form-Z on the Macintosh (yurk, spit!)
but the technique proved to be apliquable (pun) on Imagine as well.
And here it is:

1. Start up a (new if you like) project.
2. Go to the detail editor.
3. Add a primitive plane (200,150,1,1) and pick it.
4. Zoom the perspective view so that the plane covers the whole view.
5. In attributes, add the clouds texture with default settings.
6. Quickrender. This will take _quite_ a while.
7. Save the quickrender somewhere.
8. Delete the plane.

9.  Add a new plane (200,150,20,15) and pick it.
10. Go to pick points mode and select pick method drag box.
11. While holding the shift key drag a box around all points but
    those at the outmost edges of the plane.
12. Translate the picked points -10 units in Y.
13. In the top right and low left corner will be a couple of polygons
    that will still lie flat along the original position.
    If you like (and I personally did) you can delete the edges that
    are lying flat and add two new (correctly oriented) faces in each
    corner.
14. Go to pick groups or objects mode.
15. Select the applique function, and use the cloud quickrender that
    you saved just a little while ago.
16. In the applique requester select transform axes.
    Translate the brush +5 units in X and Z.
    Size it 10 units smaller than the original values in X and Z.
17. Accept these settings and wait for the plane to be appliqued.
    If you are not satisfied with the result you can always "undo" it
    and applique it all over again using another Y size for the brush.
18. Now you should have the basic shape of a rough cut rock block.

To make it all really _look_ like a rock block you will have to
colour it rockily (maybe using the concrete texture or - as the guy
who wrote the article - a colour cycled and filtered version of
the clouds brush) and you will also need to use a good bump map to
simulate the grains and pores in the rock's surface. In the article
in the magazine was a picture of such a brushmap but it's difficult
to include it in an email. :(
I tried to use the leather texture to simulate the pores but that
was no hit, I can tell you.

What I _can_ tell you is that Alex L managed to produce some _very_
realistic rock blocks using this method, and given some time to
experiment with this technique I am sure that I will be able to do
so too.

And yes, I know that issue of 3D Artist is over two months old by now
but I didn't get it until a couple of weeks ago since I live in the
utmost wilderness of Sweden and the bulk freight mail from New Mexico
takes quite some time to get here...

The exact same teqnique could be used for making a basic landscape.
I still haven't tried that, but I will (when I can find the time...)
Perhaps using the mountain top texture... hmmm...

*---------------------------------------------------------------*
|   Conny Joensson   |   Swedish Space Corp. Esrange            |
|   Kiruna           |   Satellite operations - Telecom Div.    |
|   Sweden           |   cjo@smtpgw.esrange.ssc.se              |
*---------------------------------------------------------------*

Date:    Tuesday, 03 October 1995 09:34:09 
Subject: Re: 3-D Stars
From:    Damon LaCaille <nomad@aloha.net>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


Mike,
  what a coincidence!  I just bought Distant Suns used as well, so 
hopefully I'll be able to use that too!  Thanks for the suggestion!  I 
was thinking somewhere along those lines, but thought the textures could 
take care of it somehow.  Thanks again for your help, I'll try that 
tonight!

[=====================================================================]
[      Damon L. LaCaille     |  A3000 @ 25MHz 10MB RAM / 540MB HD     ]
[=====================================================================]
[ Email - nomad@aloha.net    | If you're not making 50 mistakes a day ]
[ WWW  - Be watching for my  |   then you're not trying hard enough!  ]
[        WWW home page here! |-=* IMAGINE - Why use anything else? *=-]
[=====================================================================]


On Tue, 3 Oct 1995, Mike McCool wrote:

> Hey Damon, 
> 
>     To get a starfield to track dramatically, the method I've found most 
> effective is to use an actual star pic, mapped on a sphere or 
> hemisphere.  Make the sphere/hemi object bright, and lay it over your 
> scene and make it large enough to surround everything.
> 
>     The pic I use is one someone was nice enough to share with us 
> last year.  He used DistantSuns to render an accurate starmap.  It's 
> gorgeous.  If your stardome doesn't need to be too huge, you'll be able 
> to identify actual constellations as your camera moves through the scene.   
> 

Date:    Tuesday, 03 October 1995 10:59:01 
Subject: Re: Scripting anims
From:    Mike McCool <mikemcoo@efn.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> >   AmigaVision was sort of the premier presentation package for the 
> > amiga, long before Director.  Can't speak for that one, as I ain't got 
> > it, but if you own AmigaVision, you're home free.  
> 
> 
> Director has been around for a long time.  Bought my 2000 in 88 and had 
> Director within a year.  
> 

Touche.  Just checked the copyright date on AV:  1990.  

Date:    Tuesday, 03 October 1995 11:23:11 
Subject: Re: Quicky (long one)
From:    Mike McCool <mikemcoo@efn.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Great post, Conny, about rock-making.  Thanks, you.  And if anyone's
interested, there are some fabulous texture maps down at the tomahawk site
that are great for rock/stone generating.  They're 24bit pix of various
stone surfaces, and they make excellent image and bump maps. 

(Just 'cause that's a Lightwave site, doesn't mean we can't make use of 
it.  And I think the file I'm referring to is down in the Textures 
drawer.  Bricks_n_Rocks, something like that).

tomahawk.welch.jhu.edu is the site, and it's in the pub/LW section.  

Date:    Tuesday, 03 October 1995 11:33:50 
Subject: Re: 3-D Stars
From:    Mike McCool <mikemcoo@efn.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hey Damon, 

      To get a starfield to track dramatically, the method I've found most 
effective is to use an actual star pic, mapped on a sphere or 
hemisphere.  Make the sphere/hemi object bright, and lay it over your 
scene and make it large enough to surround everything.

      The pic I use is one someone was nice enough to share with us 
last year.  He used DistantSuns to render an accurate starmap.  It's 
gorgeous.  If your stardome doesn't need to be too huge, you'll be able 
to identify actual constellations as your camera moves through the scene.   

Date:    Tuesday, 03 October 1995 11:38:54 
Subject: Re: LIGHT-blues
From:    gregory denby <gdenby@twain.helios.nd.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


Vic writes:
>I used a point (sphere with no dimensions) and made it into a
>light-source, spherical/shadow/diminish....
>The 0 represents the lit up area of the wall by the light, and
>the unexpected presence of the unlit area about 2 quarters along
>from the left.

Why did you use a sphere? Perhaps the light, which is emitted from
the objects axis, is being blocked by some bit of material.  Try using
just an axis as a light emitter.

Also, you might be seeing a shading problem.  Is the wall completely
flat?  Check the defining points.  Try rendering whith phong turned
off, any misaligned facets will likely show up.

Hopes this helps
Greg Denby

Date:    Tuesday, 03 October 1995 16:17:52 
Subject: Re: LIGHT-blues
From:    Roger Straub <straub@csn.net>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Tue, 3 Oct 1995 augioh4b@ibmmail.com wrote:

> 
> I used a point (sphere with no dimensions) and made it into a
> light-source, spherical/shadow/diminish. Now this light source is

Did you make this lightsource shadow-casting? I'm wondering because if 
you used a primitive sphere for the object, it still has faces. Some of 
these faces might be casting a shadow, though I can't see why it would be 
soft-edged.

If you want to make a lightsource, just add an axis. Imagine casts light 
rays from the axis of an object, not the faces.

> 
>        ---------------------------------------------
>        |      000000       00000000000000000       |
>        |         0000000    000000000000           |
>        |              0000  0000000                |
>        |                 \  +  /   (+ light)       |
>        |                  \___/ bowl               |
> 
> The 0 represents the lit up area of the wall by the light, and
> the unexpected presence of the unlit area about 2 quarters along
> from the left.
> 

Also, try setting your RSDP setting up; if the bowl has a lot of faces, 
the light might be bouncing around inside the glass too many times, and 
Imagine throws up its digital hands in disgust. If you set RSDP up, 
Imagine will calculate out more bounces.

> 
> Thank you
> Vic.
> 

See ya,
      Roger

Date:    Tuesday, 03 October 1995 19:41:00 
Subject: Re: Glass making . . .
From:    Richard Heidebrecht <rheidebr@freenet.npiec.on.ca>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

On Sat, 30 Sep 1995 CoryJ44@aol.com wrote:

> assigned both layers the typical glass attributes, and I gave each layer a
> refraction index of 1.05 . . . it's close, but has anyone else had better

I think that's the major problem, your index of refration is too low.  
Try 1.45, I'm pretty sure that's the real index of refration for glass.


   ~Rick Heidebrecht~



Date:    Tuesday, 03 October 1995 21:00:03 
Subject: Re: IML archives Sept uploaded to wuarchive
From:    Steve@mg-plc.demon.co.uk (Steve Gardiner)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


Hi Joop,

To answer your questions about the IML archives, I must admit that I've
never had to use them, but that's not to say others don't.

Cheers
-- 
  +-----------------==============+================-----------------+
  |  Steve Gardiner               | Paying my debt to society...    |
  |  Steve@mg-plc.demon.co.uk     | Working in Business Publishing !|
  +-----------------==============+================-----------------+

PS - I hope that hasn't depressed you ...

Date:    Tuesday, 03 October 1995 21:02:56 
Subject: Re: Draco
From:    Steve@mg-plc.demon.co.uk (Steve Gardiner)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


Kurgan wrote :
>
>From what I know,(and I have been in contact with MacroSystem), the 
>video card on the DraCo ,(no typo here), is exactly like any other 
>Retina card, just faster. Now my memory might be playing tricks on me 
>but I think I recall a lot of tricks on ther IML on how to get Imagine 
>run in HiRes on Retina, and then finally (with some update) a message 
>stating that Imagine supported Retina directly or something.
>In any case since Imagine run on Retina and Retina is made by the same 
>folks that make the DraCo, and that the Retina on the DraCo only should 
>be faster, I for one belive Imagine will work very well on DraCo.
>Now somebody wrote that the DraCo would be boosting 450MIPS, well yes 
>but that's only with the ALPHA-board installed, and as far as I know 
>Impulse has not released any info on an ALPHA version (well W-NT might 
>work, but then you'd have to run NT on your DraCo yuk!)
>
Yep ! You were right and I was wrong. Imagine on the Amiga ONLY works with
Retina cards and in theory it should work magnificently ! Damn.... I own a
Picasso II...

Cheers
-- 
  +-----------------==============+================-----------------+
  |  Steve Gardiner               | Paying my debt to society...    |
  |  Steve@mg-plc.demon.co.uk     | Working in Business Publishing !|
  +-----------------==============+================-----------------+

Date:    Wednesday, 04 October 1995 00:36:11 
Subject: Nice nebulas in 3.0??
From:    Mike Towe <t_mtowe@qualcomm.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi folks,

        I am desperatly trying to get a good looking nebula in a space scene
I am working on. No matter what I do it just looks terible. I am trying to
use the Nebula texture with no luck. If anyone has some tips or good
settings for the requester boxes I am all ears.  Also is there a way to
apply this texture to a sphere and then incumpas the scene inside of it?? 
Michael W. Towe
Video Production Assistant
Suite 264R. 
Ext. 3807 Pager# 493-1509


Date:    Wednesday, 04 October 1995 01:07:46 
Subject: Re: Star Wars objects
From:    Vance Schowalter <viking@freenet.edmonton.ab.ca>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

He could try "The Light Works" CD-ROM by Tobias J. Richter. It has 
extremely detailed models of the most popular Star Wars ships including 
the Blockade Runner and the Star Destroyer. Although he improvised on 
some minor details, they look great!


*******************************************
*    Vance Schowalter >>Image Master<<    *
*                                         *
* Internet: viking@freenet.edmonton.ab.ca *
*                                         *
*     "Affable little snow creature."     *
*******************************************


Date:    Wednesday, 04 October 1995 01:19:32 
Subject: Re: Scripting anims
From:    Gerard Menendez <gpm@netcom.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Tue, 3 Oct 1995, Mike McCool wrote:

> > >         AmigaVision was sort of the premier presentation package for the 
> > > amiga, long before Director.  Can't speak for that one, as I ain't got 
> > > it, but if you own AmigaVision, you're home free.  
> > 
> > 
> > Director has been around for a long time.  Bought my 2000 in 88 and had 
> > Director within a year.  
> > 
> 
> Touche.  Just checked the copyright date on AV:  1990.  
> 

No Touche, necessary.  I'm just glad I knew something on topic to say for 
once.  

Gerard

Date:    Wednesday, 04 October 1995 01:31:50 
Subject: Imagine something hairy... Hair question.
From:    Bush Doktor <sppcarso@ultrix.uor.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


    Just noticed in a magazine that someone has put out a program
 for lightwave that creates (or re-creates) hair.  Has anyone seen
 this work?  I'd really like to have something like this for Imagine
 without having to have 128megs of ram to work with the object. :-)
 Maybe something along the lines of Ian's Stars program.
 
 +--__Imagine some new uses for a firecracker board__--+


Date:    Wednesday, 04 October 1995 01:41:38 
Subject: Re: Create IT!!!
From:    sgiff@airmail.net (Stephen Gifford)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


> sg> Stephen G.
>
>     Cool pictures m8 :-) They should have made the coke one bigger to
>     see it clearer. Just wondering, did you use any post production to
>     get any effects on the coke one? I have my doubts about the lens
>     flare on the submarine/ship piccy. Looks very much like photoshop
>     to me.
>     

I tend to agree about the submarine in space picture with the lensflare.
What? Submarine is space.  Looks good though.  Great caustics on the sub to
whoever did it.  Thanks for the compliment on my work.  No post production
was done on the coke pic except the inside of the botttle there is a swirl
of smoke rising inside.  I was able to create a great swirling smoke object
with Nebula, but unfortunately when you put it inside the coke bottle it
dissappeared.  It is available on Compuserve in the Imagine forum (Graphics
user group) along with the spark object which I uploaded since you were not
the first to ask if I used post processed effects.  Also all of my pics are
available on America Online.

s.g.


Date:    Wednesday, 04 October 1995 08:02:20 
Subject: Re: IML archives Sept uploaded to wuarchive
From:    digitist@pi.net


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> Does anyone read the archive ?
> If not I can stop doing it.

I do, since not all mesaage are coming through at my mail-address.
> 
> Greetings Joop
> 
> 
----------------------------------------------------------
Real life  : Adri Mathlener
E-Mail     : digitist@pi.net
----------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Wednesday, 04 October 1995 08:49:21 
Subject: Re: Nice nebulas in 3.0??
From:    Ted Stethem <tstethem@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

  There was a really good article on exactly this subject in the June 
Amazing Amiga.  It was directed to Lightwave but works just as well for 
Imagine, any version. The technique is the same as that used for the 
nebulas in Babylon5, and now, Space: Above and Beyond.
  Basically, it is just using a 24-bit paint program to produce a large 
nebula cloud applied to a transparent primitive plane (using the clip map 
technique).  This works so much better than the procedural texture and 
renders much faster. It is possible to get some good nebula-appearance 
objects using the procedural texture but it is necessary to use multiple 
layers of the Nebula texture, and even with a 150 MHz Pentium, would 
still take long rendering times.
  If there were enough interest, I suppose I could upload the object and 
image map I made from the tutorial up to the Aminet.

On Tue, 3 Oct 1995, Mike Towe wrote:

> Hi folks,
> 
>         I am desperatly trying to get a good looking nebula in a space scene
> I am working on. No matter what I do it just looks terible. I am trying to
> use the Nebula texture with no luck. If anyone has some tips or good
> settings for the requester boxes I am all ears.  Also is there a way to
> apply this texture to a sphere and then incumpas the scene inside of it?? 
> Michael W. Towe
> Video Production Assistant
> Suite 264R. 
> Ext. 3807 Pager# 493-1509
> 
> 

Date:    Wednesday, 04 October 1995 11:28:35 
Subject: Re: Glass making . . .
From:    cjo@esrange.ssc.se


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

>>assigned both layers the typical glass attributes, and I gave each layer=20
>>a refraction index of 1.05 . . . it's close, but has anyone else had=20
>>better

>I think that's the major problem, your index of refration is too low. Try=20
>1.45, I'm pretty sure that's the real index of refration for glass.

I think it's a bit lower (1.30 - 1.40) but I'm not 100% sure...

Anyways, IndexOfRefraction is a bit tricky in Imagine.
In v2.0 (and lower) Imagine generates the correct IOR but the algorithm for=
=20
doing it is not the best so Imagine sometimes gives up (reaches EDLE number=
=20
of lightray bounces) and just plots a black pixel.
In v3.x this algorithm generates much less "black pixels" but on the other=20
hand the IOR is a bit screwed up, so in order to get a realistic IOR for=20
glass (for example) you can't have an IOR setting higher than 1.03 or 1.04,=
=20
otherwise the rays that travel through your object will be _much_ too=20
refracted.

*---------------------------------------------------------------*
|   Conny Joensson   |   Swedish Space Corp. Esrange            |
|   Kiruna           |   Satellite operations - Telecom Div.    |
|   Sweden           |   cjo@smtpgw.esrange.ssc.se              |
*---------------------------------------------------------------*

Date:    Wednesday, 04 October 1995 13:49:11 
Subject: Re: Imagine something hairy... Hair question.
From:    osc@ix.netcom.com (Keith Pope)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

From the little I've seen of the program, its results are very similar 
to just using particles in the Detail Editor of Imagine and assigning a 
hair-like object to each face.

Keith

Date:    Wednesday, 04 October 1995 14:24:18 
Subject: Unpick
From:    rgreb@emmetpub.demon.co.uk (Rob Caunt)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi all

Is there any way I can unpick points/edges/faces selectively if I accidentally
pick too many in multi mode?

I'm sure this has been a recent thread, but I wasn't paying attention :}

I'm using 3.0, but the great 4.0 leaflet has convinced me to upgrade... nice
pictures, guys.

-- 

"if you don't use the bins you can't come in."

Rob

Date:    Wednesday, 04 October 1995 15:12:43 
Subject: Re: Imagine something hairy...
From:    jbk4@email.psu.edu (The Prophet)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I have used particles to successfully plant needles on a cactus.  I used
two cactus objects.  One was the green plant itself and the other was
a particle object.  The particles were little clusters of needles.  It
turned out rather well.  

Hair could be done in a similar fashion but I don't like the look at all,
even what I've seen of fiber factory is kinda cheezy but better than
imagine particles.

Jaeson K.
 ____            ____            _           _
( |  \          ( /  \          ( )       _ / )
 )|   )_   __    /   /_   _  __  /   __  ( X_)
( |  /~ \ /\_)  /---~/ ) / )/  )/~\ /\_)  / _
 )ll/  l/ \__ (/   (/   (_//__//  / \__  (___)
(____________)        (___/        (___)

Jaeson Koszarsky                  Amiga 3000+
----------------                  -----------
cyberprophet@psu.edu              68040/30Mhz
jbk4@email.psu.edu                24Megs-1GIG
jason@chaos.ezgate.com            OS3.1

Date:    Wednesday, 04 October 1995 15:36:00 
Subject: Gadgets
From:    mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com (Mike Vandersommen)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Does anyone know if it's possible to create a Gadget in the StageEditor that wou
ld Keyframe the SIZE/POSITION/ or ALIGNMENT of objects=?Right now it's ALT F7-9,
 but a Gadget for those would be handy.And speaking of Gadgets. Has anyone made 
a "coherent" listing ofall available gadgets in each editor? Are the only gadget
s availablethe ones in current use by the Imagine.cfg file? In preferences, it s
=aysyou can add <NEW> gadgets, but since they are all criptic menu number=s,how 
do I know what's available....or allowed? Am I missing a descript=ivetext file s
omewhere. The 3.0 manual does seem to list them.Thanks in advance...   /--------
----------------------           ___   ___  ___   ___  | Mike van der Sommen    
                 / __  /__/ /__/  /_   \ /  | Santa Barbara, Ca.                
     /___/ / \  /  /  /     / \  | mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com     HAU
S BBS (805-683-1388)  |           "Blackouts make for nice breaks in the day"   
\_____________________________________________________________--- =FE InterNet - GraFX Haus BBS - Santa Barbara, Ca - (805) 683-1388

Date:    Wednesday, 04 October 1995 16:15:26 
Subject: Re: Imagine something hairy... Hair question.
From:    gmartin@mv.us.adobe.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hair in Imagine...

I've been working on a 'fur ball' character and have found that though you can 
produce hairy like objects from a distance with careful use of brushmaps and 
sometimes a little fog to soften the edges, the only way to really get good 
looking hair in Imagine is to use particles.

Try a default sphere, make it a particle object and point it to an object file 
containing a single triangle polygon, set align to faces and random object size.
 
Make the base of the triangle about half the height of the triangle, it should 
be oriented with the sharp point up the Z axis.
Set the filter values of your sphere to about two thirds clear and brush map a 
browny/black patchy image (your hair map) onto it using spherical mapping. No 
specularity/reflect/shine should be used.
Try a quick render and resize the tri axis to produce a better covering of hair,
 
also adjust sphere filter value to reduce the effect of the triangles particles 

looking like triangles (additive effect of filter layers).
With a little tweaking this produces a very good fluffy ball. You might want to 

place a dark solid sphere inside the hair to make it look solid.

If any one is interested mail me and I'll send a jpg and my settings. Oh yes 
this object animates very well, fluffing up and moving about without any nasty 
visual artifacts.

-gary



Date:    Wednesday, 04 October 1995 17:29:06 
Subject: RE:Nebula's
From:    Granberg Tom <tom.granberg@TV2.no>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi
I have come up wit a nice nebula effect using a tube, here is how to do it.

1.Make a tube that is about twice as wide as it is high
2.Make it bright and colored total black
3.Put on the filternoize2 texture and scale it in z so it is fairly thin in z, 
but at least as wide in x & y as the tube
4. Make the texture filter settings high and in some cool colors like: R.255 
R.180 B.220 (you get the point) If you want more color variance put on the 
colornoize2 texture as well.
5.Then put on Mntop twice, one to fade it out at the top and one at the bottom

Its very important that the textures are in the right sequence, so first 
Filternoize2,Colornoize2,Mntop(1),Mntop(2)
This should give you a good starting point to play with. The tube dont have to 
be very detailed, and you can scale it to fill your universe, so when paning 
you will get a nice long nebula. I also tilt the tube a bit on an angle to get 
it more interesting.


Later

Tom Granberg "Renderbrandt"

Date:    Wednesday, 04 October 1995 17:29:26 
Subject: Re:StarWars Objects(well actualy not)
From:    Granberg Tom <tom.granberg@TV2.no>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi.
Ok, I have to agree with all the other mails about where to find them. And I 
realy dont know where to find more, but I just like to tell you all that when 
4.0 comes, it wouldnt be to hard to build things like the Stormtroopers 
yourself. Since I am a beta tester, I get to try out all the new cool tools the 

gang at Impulse is working on. And one of the new tools they have come up with 
is the "smooth tool" that will able you to make a pretty "lousy" model of almost
 
anything and make a high detail good looking model of it. We are talking nice 
multiplied with gorgeous multiplied with breath taking, that's the concept we 
are trying to get across here.............but those it have a brain?
Build you basic shape, then fracture it, and run the smoothing tool over it, it 

is so good infact that I managed to build a Ferrari-F50 in 1, yes one hour. You 

can even lock edges so that it doesnt smooth thoose(sharp edges & edge points). 

My base consisted of 362 points and 662 faces, I only buildt half of it (right 
side) And flipped it. It ended up with 5663 points and 10926 faces after some 
major fracturing, then I ran the smoothing tool over it and.........WOW, a 
completly fluid shape that made my eyes wet.
Ofcourse I could optimize my fracturing skills, but I just fractured the whole 
shit a couple of times. Hells bells!! It eats memory! 
.......But you can zoom way in and it's still as fluid.

So much for me helping, I probably just gave you all some good taste of what to 

come.

Later

Tom Granberg "Renderbrandt"

Date:    Wednesday, 04 October 1995 19:25:37 
Subject: RE:F50
From:    Granberg Tom <tom.granberg@TV2.no>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

What!......Dont you belive me Bob?
Patient my friend, I'm going to put it on Scott Kirvans Page at Sharkys, IF he 
let me. I'm just going to clean it up a bit, nothing much just put in 
lights,windows,wheels that sort of stuff. And by the the way it is a F50 replica
 
(how the f*** could you have an 3D replica?) Well its sort of looks like an F50 

anyway. But it's shapes...wow...!!

Later

Tom Granberg (Renderbrandt)

Date:    Wednesday, 04 October 1995 20:13:29 
Subject: Re: Imagine something hairy...
From:    Mike McCool <mikemcoo@efn.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> Hair could be done in a similar fashion but I don't like the look at all,
> even what I've seen of fiber factory is kinda cheezy but better than
> imagine particles.
> 

I don't think cheezy does it justice.  It's more spaghetti-ish.  Or like 
the hair on a rag doll.  You know, strands of wool yarn.  Someone 
actually posted an arexx script for LW that presumably did hair, though I 
never could get it to work . . .  Woops, excuse that non-imagine drivel.  

Date:    Wednesday, 04 October 1995 21:10:29 
Subject: Re:StarWars Objects(well actualy not)
From:    Vance Schowalter <viking@freenet.edmonton.ab.ca>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

More great Star Wars models can be found in the CD-ROM by Tobias J. 
Richter, called The Light Works - Digital Imagery.

All of these models are heavily detailed with brushmaps. They looks 
great! *8^)


*******************************************
*    Vance Schowalter >>Image Master<<    *
*                                         *
* Internet: viking@freenet.edmonton.ab.ca *
*                                         *
*     "Affable little snow creature."     *
*******************************************


Date:    Wednesday, 04 October 1995 21:23:59 
Subject: Help on changing IML to new email address.
From:    Appalchin@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Could someone help me.  I've changed email addresses.  I've been trying to
switch my IML subsription over to my new email address,  but I've had no
luck.  Could someone help me out in any way possible?  My new email address
is frisbee@tricon.net  Thanks in advance and God Bless.

Date:    Wednesday, 04 October 1995 21:46:20 
Subject: Glass IORs
From:    NEWKIRK@delphi.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Physics-table IOR's for glass range as follows:
from Zinc Crown (lowest) to Heaviest Flint, from wavelengths of 2.00 microns
down to .361 microns.  I'll round to 2 decimals, and omit the bulk of the
table to end up with:

VARIETY    .36u    .....   .59u   ....   2.0u
Zinc Crown 1.54            1.52          1.50
........
HvstFlint   1.98            1.89          1.83

1.25 is approximately Quartz,  water ranges by temperature 1.34-1.32 or so.

Comment:  Perhaps the excessive refraction experienced is caused by Imagine
trying to reproduce a solid glass object, rather than hollow.  If you ever
see a hollow glass ball, and a solid one, you see that the solid one has no
similarity at all, looking like a shiny blob, colored to roughly match it's
environment.
JN

Date:    Wednesday, 04 October 1995 21:48:30 
Subject: Re:Unpick
From:    NEWKIRK@delphi.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Yes, at least in 2.0, if you need to unpick something in multi mode, do the
following:  pick it again (this makes it the most recent in the list), then
"Unpick Last" to remove it.  the original occurrance of it in the list is
apparently move to the top when it is re-picked, so it is actually gone.
JN

Date:    Wednesday, 04 October 1995 21:55:18 
Subject: Re:LIGHT-blues
From:    augioh4b@ibmmail.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

--- Received from GITD.PSG024  2164526              05OCT95  11.17
  -> IBMMAIL.INTERNET      IBMMAIL
Hi all

Just to thank Joel, Roger, and Greg Denby for the tips of my
lighting problem...I haven't fixed it yet but will do that this
weekend.

It wasn't actually a sphere with no dimension but a sphere with
the axis displaced a few pixels above the surface and with the
light source atrributes.  I'll try and replace this with an axis
instead.

Thanx all


ps...this is what iml is for: hints, tips, help...not platform
wars or whatever...

Date:    Wednesday, 04 October 1995 22:30:13 
Subject: Upgrade
From:    augioh4b@ibmmail.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

--- Received from GITD.PSG024  2164526              05OCT95  11.43
  -> IBMMAIL.INTERNET      IBMMAIL

Anyone/Impulse,

I am currently using V2.0 PC that i got from a magazine. I
also managed to get my hands on a V1.1 amiga version, and was
wondering if there is the possibility of upgrading to v3.3, V4,
and eventually to WinImagine, and at what price?

The previous owner did not register, and if the registration card
can't be found what can I do to register v1.1 for the upgrades?

Thank you
Vic

Date:    Wednesday, 04 October 1995 22:47:17 
Subject: Re: Impulse E-mail adress
From:    Bush Doktor <sppcarso@ultrix.uor.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

On Thu, 5 Oct 1995, Greg Searle wrote:

>       I am a registered user and I am most displeased at not recieving
> notice from Impulse to upgrade. This is because of the time limit of Oct 31st
> to upgrade for $100 or face $299 thereafter. I do not have much of a time
> window left for this upgrade path.

   With your situation, I wouldn't worry to much.  Impulse is known to
cut people slack with problems like this.  Just explain what's happened
and they'll probably be cool about it.  The only problem I've ever had with
them (& still do) is with the firecracker board.  Otherwise they've been
very helpful.

Bush

**Not my registered name, 'cuz I don't want to be hassled about my opinions**
**and thoughts about Imagine.                                             ***


Date:    Wednesday, 04 October 1995 23:04:35 
Subject: Re: Imagine something hairy... Hair question.
From:    Bush Doktor <sppcarso@ultrix.uor.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

On Wed, 4 Oct 1995 gmartin@mv.us.adobe.com wrote:

> Hair in Imagine...
> 
> I've been working on a 'fur ball' character and have found that though you can

> produce hairy like objects from a distance with careful use of brushmaps and
> sometimes a little fog to soften the edges, the only way to really get good 
> looking hair in Imagine is to use particles.

  I've been doing something similiar to this, but will try your suggestions
also.  The main problem I've run into now is the up close work.  At a 
distance everything looks fine but up close it turns to... yeah.

   Let me give you a brief idea of what I'm doing...  The animation has
a flea leaping off a rock onto a dog from the flea's point of view.  Things
look great after the initial leap but as the dog's hair gets closer, say
about a foot away, you can really see the "particles".  And once in the
"hair" things look terrible.  Once the flea has landed there are no problems
"cuz I'm using different objects for the hair.  The close transition is
what's giving me the problem.

> If any one is interested mail me and I'll send a jpg and my settings. Oh yes 
> this object animates very well, fluffing up and moving about without any nasty

> visual artifacts.

   I'd like a copy of your settings if you don't mind. :-)  Maybe I 
haven't tweaked things enough.  Thanks.



Date:    Thursday, 05 October 1995 00:22:02 
Subject: Impulse E-mail adress
From:    expgxs@cascade.santos.com.au (Greg Searle)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

   Greetings all fellow Imagineers.

   I have only been on this list for only a few weeks and have been fortunate
enough to hear of Imagine 4 being released. I expected this to happen some
time next year and I will now upgrade from 3.

    Unlike some or most on this list I have not recieved a broucher and I would
like someone to inform me of the Impulse mailing address so I can contact
Impulse about upgrading imedeantly without an order form. I am in Australia
and I guess Impulse is not as speedy in sending us Imagineers an order form
or broucher. I am a registered user and I am most displeased at not recieving
notice from Impulse to upgrade. This is because of the time limit of Oct 31st
to upgrade for $100 or face $299 thereafter. I do not have much of a time window

left for this upgrade path.

    Much appreciated and many Thanks.

GREG SEARLE

So many worlds. So much to do. So little time. Such things to be.

Date:    Thursday, 05 October 1995 00:44:47 
Subject: IML and D2I Web Search
From:    Ian M Smith <iansmith@ncinter.net>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Due to my desperate need to test out a search system, I now have my 
online copies of Dare To Imagine and my HTMLized IML Faq #8 in a 
searchable index now.  Just select search from my home page, select the 
correct search index and have fun.  Let me know if any of you have 
problems or comments.  Enjoy!  Any intrest in online searchable IML
archives?

                http://www.ncinter.net/~iansmith/

--
IanSmith@ncinter.net                 Visit Below!
My HP48/Imagine/ImageMaster Page --> http://www.ncinter.net/~iansmith/
Come and stop by Africa Imports  --> http://www.cyberenet.net/~africa/


Date:    Thursday, 05 October 1995 03:56:18 
Subject: Re: Quicky (long one)
From:    rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au (Robert Byrne)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hello Conny, on Oct 3 you wrote:

> Brick quicky
> 
> In the latest issue of 3D Artist was an article by Alex Lindsey.
> It was about making rock blocks.
> The idea was that he wanted to make a whole wall made of individual
> blocks (or slabs, if you like) of stone, and they had to be _very_
> detailed because that's what his customer had ordered.  ;)

For Amiga users with Ian Smith's IIUtilities you can get a similar effect
using Jitter on a bevelled plane.

-- Bob

Date:    Thursday, 05 October 1995 04:15:10 
Subject: Re: Unpick
From:    rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au (Robert Byrne)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hello Rob, on Oct 04 you wrote:

> Is there any way I can unpick points/edges/faces selectively if I accidentally

> pick too many in multi mode?

Yes, use <R/A n> or <R/A b> to cycle through the points/edges/faces that
you have picked and press F2 to UnPick Select.

-- Bob

  :  Robert Byrne  : rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au :
  : Amiga A3000/25 :  Ballina, NSW  Australia  :


Date:    Thursday, 05 October 1995 12:51:33 
Subject: CleanupSlice program
From:    milan@Gent.hku.nl (Milan Polle)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi all,

just writing to let you know that a few days ago, I finished my
program that cleans up sliced objects. (To be honest, I didn't work on it
during the summer holiday; my brain didn't work because of the heat).
The only thing left to do is the doc file. Oh yeah, it's amiga-only (sorry).
Any people out there interested in it, maybe someone could put it on aminet
for me. And people without access to aminet can mail me for a copy.

Milan (milan@bmt.hku.nl)

- Still waiting for my credit-card to arrive, so I can upgrade to 4.0... -



Date:    Thursday, 05 October 1995 16:21:44 
Subject: Re: Nice nebulas in 3.0??
From:    Sharky <sharky@websharx.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



Steven Blackmon has a web tutorial on atmospheric effects that shows an 
example of a nebula done with 3.0.  Check out http://www.websharx.com/~kinda.

Hope that helps!
      Sharky

On Tue, 3 Oct 1995, Mike Towe wrote:

> Hi folks,
> 
>         I am desperatly trying to get a good looking nebula in a space scene
> I am working on. No matter what I do it just looks terible. I am trying to
> use the Nebula texture with no luck. If anyone has some tips or good
> settings for the requester boxes I am all ears.  Also is there a way to
> apply this texture to a sphere and then incumpas the scene inside of it?? 
> Michael W. Towe
> Video Production Assistant
> Suite 264R. 
> Ext. 3807 Pager# 493-1509
> 

Date:    Thursday, 05 October 1995 18:34:17 
Subject: Re: Gadgets
From:    Roger Straub <straub@csn.net>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Wed, 4 Oct 1995, Mike Vandersommen wrote:

> And speaking of Gadgets. Has anyone made a "coherent" listing of
> all available gadgets in each editor? Are the only gadgets available
> the ones in current use by the Imagine.cfg file? In preferences, it says
> you can add <NEW> gadgets, but since they are all criptic menu numbers,
> how do I know what's available....or allowed? Am I missing a descriptive
> text file somewhere. The 3.0 manual does seem to list them.

You can add ANY menu item to the gadget bar. All you have to do is go to=20
Preferences, click on the editor you want, and User Gadgets. Click on the=
=20
one you want to change. Now, and here's the kicker, hold the right mouse=20
button. The menus(meni?) will look exactly as they do when you're in the=20
chosen editor. Select the menu item you want the gadget to emulate, and=20
the `cryptic number' will be changed for you. To add a new gadget, click=20
on the <new> entry, give it a name and a comment, and select a menu item.=
=20
That's it!

>=20
> Thanks in advance...
>=20
>    /------------------------------           ___   ___  ___   ___
>   | Mike van der Sommen                     / __  /__/ /__/  /_   \ /
>   | Santa Barbara, Ca.                     /___/ / \  /  /  /     / \
>   | mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com     HAUS BBS (805-683-1388)
>   |           "Blackouts make for nice breaks in the day"
>    \_____________________________________________________________
> ---
>  =FE InterNet - GraFX Haus BBS - Santa Barbara, Ca - (805) 683-1388
>=20

See ya,
=09Roger

Date:    Thursday, 05 October 1995 21:12:00 
Subject: RE: CUSTOM GADGETS
From:    jbeard@cix.compulink.co.uk (Joe Beard)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> 
> Does anyone know if it's possible to create a Gadget in the Stage
> Editor that would Keyframe the SIZE/POSITION/ or ALIGNMENT of objects?
> Right now it's ALT F7-9, but a Gadget for those would be handy.
> 
> And speaking of Gadgets. Has anyone made a "coherent" listing of
> all available gadgets in each editor? Are the only gadgets available
> the ones in current use by the Imagine.cfg file? In preferences, it says
> you can add <NEW> gadgets, but since they are all criptic menu numbers,
> how do I know what's available....or allowed? Am I missing a descriptive
> text file somewhere. The 3.0 manual does seem to list them.
> 

You are confused aren't you :-)

You can put *any* of the menu commands you like on a gadget, as explained 
on page 320 of the manual. You don't need to know what the numbers mean.

Joe


Date:    Thursday, 05 October 1995 21:30:28 
Subject: Re: Impulse E-mail adress
From:    Richard Heidebrecht <rheidebr@freenet.npiec.on.ca>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

On Thu, 5 Oct 1995, Greg Searle wrote:

>    Greetings all fellow Imagineers.
> 
>    I have only been on this list for only a few weeks and have been fortunate
> enough to hear of Imagine 4 being released. I expected this to happen some
> time next year and I will now upgrade from 3.
> 
>     Unlike some or most on this list I have not recieved a broucher and I woul
d
> like someone to inform me of the Impulse mailing address so I can contact
> Impulse about upgrading imedeantly without an order form. I am in Australia
> and I guess Impulse is not as speedy in sending us Imagineers an order form
> or broucher. I am a registered user and I am most displeased at not recieving
> notice from Impulse to upgrade. This is because of the time limit of Oct 31st
> to upgrade for $100 or face $299 thereafter. I do not have much of a time wind
ow
> left for this upgrade path.
> 
>     Much appreciated and many Thanks.
> 
> GREG SEARLE
> 
> So many worlds. So much to do. So little time. Such things to be.
> 

I don't know about a mailing address, but you can get in touch with them 
by phone at 1-800-328-0184 or 612-425-0557.


   ~Rick Heidebrecht~



Date:    Thursday, 05 October 1995 22:41:56 
Subject: Those carpet attributes
From:    Mike McCool <mikemcoo@efn.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

A quick thanks, to Robert Byrne, for sharing those with us.  

We had a hair thread going here for a while, and I used his attrib's to 
generate a 24bit pic which I used as a texture map over in LW, on a 
hairy-hemisphere object.  

No reason I couldn't come back into Imagine and use that map to texture 
that same dappled look onto an object hair-particalized.  

(Jeez, I'm so open-minded, I might even try a PC some day).   

Date:    Thursday, 05 October 1995 23:17:07 
Subject: Re: Gadgets
From:    Gerard Menendez <gpm@netcom.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Wed, 4 Oct 1995, Mike Vandersommen wrote:

> 
> And speaking of Gadgets. Has anyone made a "coherent" listing of
> all available gadgets in each editor? Are the only gadgets available
> the ones in current use by the Imagine.cfg file? In preferences, it says
> you can add <NEW> gadgets, but since they are all criptic menu numbers,
> how do I know what's available....or allowed? Am I missing a descriptive
> text file somewhere. The 3.0 manual does seem to list them.
> 
> Thanks in advance...
> 

After selecting user gadgets in the preferences window, click on the 
"new" line, type the text you want to appear on the button (The 
longer the bigger), and type in any comment you want.  The menu bar 
for the editor that you invoked preferences from is active and you just 
select the menu option that you would like a gadget for, the middle 
("menu #) is filled in for you.

The numbers do make sense.  In the detail editor the second gadget, "Zoom 
In" shows "250".  "Zoom In" is located in the second menu column, is the 
fifth option down, and has no furter sub-choices hence the zero.


Gerard

Date:    Friday, 06 October 1995 00:10:24 
Subject: Re: Nice nebulas in 3.0??
From:    rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au (Robert Byrne)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hello Ted, on Oct 4 you wrote:

>   There was a really good article on exactly this subject in the June 
> Amazing Amiga.  It was directed to Lightwave but works just as well for 
> Imagine, any version. The technique is the same as that used for the 
> nebulas in Babylon5, and now, Space: Above and Beyond.
> .......
>   If there were enough interest, I suppose I could upload the object and 
> image map I made from the tutorial up to the Aminet.

This would be most helpful if you placed it on Aminet.

Thanks,  Bob

  :  Robert Byrne  : rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au :
  : Amiga A3000/25 :  Ballina, NSW  Australia  :


Date:    Friday, 06 October 1995 05:36:12 
Subject: Re: Gadgets
From:    D.SEUTHE@BBrandes.berlinet.de (Daniel Seuthe)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hallo Mike,

MV> Does anyone know if it's possible to create a Gadget in the Stage
MV> Editor that would Keyframe the SIZE/POSITION/ or ALIGNMENT of objects?

Yes, it's possible.

MV> the ones in current use by the Imagine.cfg file? In preferences, it says
MV> you can add <NEW> gadgets, but since they are all criptic menu numbers,

It's simple. If you add a gadget choose the menu in the menu bar  (the
criptic number will be put into the 'Menu #' field).

        Daniel

e-mail: D.Seuthe@BBrandes.berlinet.de -- fido: Daniel_Seuthe%2:2410/309.34


Date:    Friday, 06 October 1995 07:19:24 
Subject: WEb site
From:    Craig Talbot <CRAIGT@cvillage.com.au>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Is there a newsgroup or WEB site for Imagine support or issues?

CRT
*****************************************************
* Craig Talbot                                      *                           
                  *
* Computer Village,                Ph:   227 9988   *    
* 163 Lord Street,                Fax:   227 9020   *      
* Perth, 6000.   Email:Craigt@Village.omen.com.au   *
*****************************************************


Date:    Friday, 06 October 1995 08:42:30 
Subject: Re: WEb site
From:    cjo@esrange.ssc.se


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Craig Talbot wrote;

>Is there a newsgroup or WEB site for Imagine support or issues?

As far as I know: no!

But rumour has it that Impulse are going to get their own website, but=20
apart from that rumour nothing has been heard so far.

As far as newsgroups are concerned there aren't any Imagine specific ones=20
but there are several that deal with raytracing and computergraphics, like=20
alt.3d and comp.graphics.raytracing.

If you would like a website to start from you could try mine:
<http://www.is.kiruna.se/~cjo/>

Those of you who already use it, note that the URL has changed. A month or=20
so back we got our own subdomain.

*---------------------------------------------------------------*
|   Conny Joensson   |   Swedish Space Corp. Esrange            |
|   Kiruna           |   Satellite operations - Telecom Div.    |
|   Sweden           |   cjo@smtpgw.esrange.ssc.se              |
*---------------------------------------------------------------*

Date:    Friday, 06 October 1995 11:51:41 
Subject: Maintaining IML archives
From:    gregory denby <gdenby@twain.helios.nd.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


I realize its been a few days since you asked if your efforts of maintain
the archive was worth the time.  But I haven't forgotten, and want to
thank you for the effort.  Before I was able to subscribe to the IML, I
was able to ftp the archives, and read months of them.  I'm supposing that
many new users would find them useful.  And wasn't "Dare to Imagine" culled
from them?  Probably the only thing that would make them better is
classifying them by usefulness.  Class A: answers to Imagine questions, and
how to tutorials.  Class B: Answers to Imagine related hardware problems,
and 3d related software.  Class c: uncalled for uuencoded postings Class Z:
Endless bitching about Mike H., bad manuals,  I could write this better if I
only had a few hours, etc...

Congratulations on your work
Greg Denby

Date:    Friday, 06 October 1995 12:21:04 
Subject: Re: Nice nebulas in 3.0??
From:    Ted Stethem <tstethem@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

  OK, I have uploaded the nebula object to Aminet today under gfx/3d and 
the filename is MyNebula.lha. You could probably go into the /new 
directory and get it (sent it up to the Paderborn site). It usually takes 
one to two days for files to get validated for aminet.
  It includes the 24-bit color brushmap, the gray-scale filter map and 
the primitive plane object they are mapped to. I also included a starfield 
object made from Ian's Stars Imagine utility, using CSG stars, so it has 
to be rendered in Trace mode. I rendered the nebula in the starfield and 
included that in the archive.
  The range of nebula types is only limited by your imagination and 
artistic skills drawing the brushmap. The real secret in this method is 
the gray scale filter map. The trick is to use a weighted gray-scale, not 
an averaged gray scale, and the percentage of weights is derived pretty 
much from trial-and-error until the desired appearance is achieved.
  I used a flat plane for this one but there is nothing preventing it 
being used on a curved plane or even a sphere. Plus another brushmap 
could be made to represent that cloudy appearance like looking into the 
Milky Way. I have just found this method to produce dream-like nebulas 
very quickly compared to the procedural texture method. It is possible to 
get very nice nebulas with the procedural textures but it is very 
time-consuming. Just my personal preference.


Date:    Friday, 06 October 1995 13:15:46 
Subject: 4.0!
From:    "Dan.Maclean" <MACLEDJ@pmitao.usa.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi!  I just joined the list.  I'm using 3.3 right now and am really looking
forward to 4.0.  I'm hoping it has the ability to make realistic glowing
lights as is done so often on Lightwave.  Anyway, does anyone have any
information on expected 4.0 features (I know about motion blur.) and when it
is due to be released?  Last I heard was a release sometime in August.
Obviously that didn't happen.  Since I'm new here is some personal info:
 
Name: Dan MacLean Age:30
Work:Premark Int'l Food Equipment GroupPlant #31 (Hillsboro, OH)
Occupation:  Manufacturing Engineer
Address:  macledj@pmifeg.com
Imagine History:  Turbo Silver, Sold Amiga 2 Years ago, bought IMagine 2.0 for
PC (a disappointment), continuous upgrade to 4.0.  I have a DX4/100 w/ 20MB
Ram but no CDROM drive.  I'm testing using Imagine to create Work instructions
for assembly of Food Disposers (you know them as garbage disposers!).  Imagine
seems to work well for creating 3D exploded diagrams.  I use a program called
Techedit to add text and other info.I've enjoyedthe enhanced stability and f
eatures in versions 3.0+.
 
I hope this hasn't been too long.  I'll keep other posts short.  Thanks!


Date:    Friday, 06 October 1995 14:34:00 
Subject: RE: CUSTOM GADGETS
From:    mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com (Mike Vandersommen)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

-> From: jbeard@cix.compulink.co.uk (Joe Beard)-> You are confused aren't you :-
)Senility does have advantages.....-> You can put *any* of the menu commands you
 like on a gadget, as ex=pla-> on page 320 of the manual. You don't need to know
 what the numbers= meYore chitting me! I never realized the menu commands drop d
own forinclusion in the GADGETS/Function Keys editor. All this time I wastrying 
to figure out the codes by trial and error. I thought the"information line" the 
manual referred to was existing commands,which seemed really dumb. God dew I fee
l stupid. Happy stupid....butstupid none the less. :)Thanks. I guess it pays to 
ask sometimes. Alright, you guys in the ba=ckcan stop snikkering. (sic)   /-----
-------------------------           ___   ___  ___   ___  | Mike van der Sommen 
                    / __  /__/ /__/  /_   \ /  | Santa Barbara, Ca.             
        /___/ / \  /  /  /     / \  | mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com     
HAUS BBS (805-683-1388)  |           "Blackouts make for nice breaks in the day"   \____________________________________________________________
_--- =FE InterNet - GraFX Haus BBS - Santa Barbara, Ca - (805) 683-1388

Date:    Friday, 06 October 1995 16:04:40 
Subject: Thanks for the nebulas
From:    Mike Towe <t_mtowe@qualcomm.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

        Just wanted to say thanks to all that helped out on my search for
nebulas and nebula ideas.

Thanks again,
Michael W. Towe
Video Production Assistant
Suite 264R. 
Ext. 3807 Pager# 493-1509


Date:    Friday, 06 October 1995 22:25:24 
Subject: Re: 4.0!
From:    Bill Boyce <bilboyce@iconz.co.nz>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 12:15 PM 6/10/95, you wrote:
>Hi!  I just joined the list.  I'm using 3.3 right now and am really looking
>forward to 4.0.  I'm hoping it has the ability to make realistic glowing
>lights as is done so often on Lightwave.  Anyway, does anyone have any
>information on expected 4.0 features (I know about motion blur.) and when it
>is due to be released?  Last I heard was a release sometime in August.
>Obviously that didn't happen.  Since I'm new here is some personal info:

Speaking to Mike H. the other day (28/9) he said it is a 'few days' away

Bill


Date:    Saturday, 07 October 1995 01:47:53 
Subject: Re: Director II (was Ugly Pork)
From:    Ayalon Hermony <ila2024@zeus.datasrv.co.il>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


It never crashed here, none, zero. One of the most stable prog I had.
A3000/25 2M/8M WB 2.1
I have one of those A3000 that load Kickstart from hard disk, maybe
yours is the ROM type? Or you have bad ram ? bad disk ?

The version is 2, nothing after it, from 1990.
I think they had two versions 1 and 2 only.


                   How do you come back from 3D ?
Ayalon M. Hermony,                      Internet: ila2024@datasrv.co.il


On Mon, 2 Oct 1995, Scott Krehbiel wrote:

> 
> Actually, I've been using the Director II, but it's been crashing
> my system in new ways since I got an A3000.I thought that Director
> barfed on 2.1, but maybe (once again!) I have an old version??
> 
> I find that Director will run fine, then when I'm pretty sure that
> it still has plenty of memory, and I have removed all other old
> anims from ram, it just stops dead in it's tracks.
> 
> What version of Director II is current??
> 
> Thanks
> Scott Krehbiel
> scotkre@beacon.regent.edu
> 
> 
> 

Date:    Saturday, 07 October 1995 01:55:12 
Subject: Re: DCTV RGB PassThru
From:    Ayalon Hermony <ila2024@zeus.datasrv.co.il>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


Ooooppppsss...

Was thinking about driving... those grey cells get loose too often latly...

My DCTV is PAL, and I drive on the right side (bare foot in summer...)

     
          How do you come back from 3D ?
Ayalon M. Hermony,           Internet: ila2024@datasrv.co.il



On Mon, 2 Oct 1995, Darryl Lewis wrote:

> 
>  AH> O.K. I'll sell the DCTV too.
>  AH> But, it's a PAL DCTV, meaning, USA, Australia, NewZiland,
>  AH> and Japan can't use it.
> 
> I think you might be confussed. Australia, NewZealand and England (they
> have a different audio subcarrier though) all use PAL.
> America (and I think Japan) uses NTSC.
> 
> So, is your unit NTSC or PAL?
> 
> Darryl
> 
> -- Via DLG Pro v1.0
> 
>              #####\             _             /#####
>              #( )# |          _( )__         | #( )# 
>              ##### |         /_    /         | #####
>              #" "# |     ___m/I_ //_____     | #" "#
>              # O # |____#-x.\ /++m\ /.x-#____| # O #
>              #m.m# |   /" \ ///###\\\ / "\   | #m.m#
>              #####/    ######/     \######    \#####
> 

Date:    Saturday, 07 October 1995 15:54:00 
Subject: Wurlitzer Jukebox
From:    mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com (Mike Vandersommen)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

-> Don't know if it was the Wurlitzer but Brad Schenk did a Diner  se=t o-> obje
cts that included a very detailed 1950's jukebox. The objects =wer-> Imagine for
mat but it shouldn't be too hard to convert to Lightwav=e.-> still see the Diner
 set advertised here and there, mostly in Amiga-> magazines and I think it was s
elling for something like $30US.Brad Schenck is a friend of mine, and now lives 
in LA. If the origina=lposter has trouble locating the "Diner" set, I can ring h
im up andfind out the details on their current distribution. Brad's Dinerset is 
EXCELLENT! He also did a really killer Victrolla (sp?) object,but I think that's
 on another set (if he released it at all).Lemme know.BTW, Brad was the 3D artis
t on a CD Rom game (for Amiga/CDTV and PC)called Labyrinth (Electronic Arts). Yo
u might find it in a bargainbasement somewhere. The game itself was not my cup o
f tea...(exploration/puzzles)... but Brad's 3D Imagine renders were killer!=2E..
considering he did it all with Imagine 2.0   /------------------------------           ___   ___  ___   ___  | Mike van der Sommen              
       / __  /__/ /__/  /_   \ /  | Santa Barbara, Ca.                     /___/
 / \  /  /  /     / \  | mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com     HAUS BBS (805
-683-1388)  |           "Blackouts make for nice breaks in the day"   \_________
____________________________________________________--- =FE InterNet - GraFX Hau
s BBS - Santa Barbara, Ca - (805) 683-1388

Date:    Saturday, 07 October 1995 16:03:00 
Subject: 4.0!
From:    mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com (Mike Vandersommen)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

-> Speaking to Mike H. the other day (28/9) he said it is a 'few days='-> away.=
2E..as a collective giggle echos through the IML halls.Some-B-O-D-Y......STOP ME
AAAA! :)--- =FE InterNet - GraFX Haus BBS - Santa Barbara, Ca - (805) 683-1388

Date:    Saturday, 07 October 1995 17:07:09 
Subject: Re: How to access aminet
From:    Bob Arnold <barnold@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


The simplest way is to use a bare-bones gopher frontend, search on the 
words "Aminet" and "online" with Veronica, and you'll find the pointer to 
the FTP site. From there your gopher client will log you onto the site
"anonymously".  You are trying to enter the info that the FTP site really
doesn't care about (who wants to maintain a user login directory for
zillions of people reaching the site?)  Make it simpler and the anonymous 
part will take care of itself.  Good luck,   -Bob


On Sat, 7 Oct 1995 RJay9@aol.com wrote:

> This may be a silly question and may reflect my internet knowledge, but how
> do you access Aminet?  I use the address
> ftp://wuarchive.wustl.edu/systems/amiga/aminet/, reach the sit but then I',m
> asked my name and password?  The name part I've got figured out by I don't
> have a password.  What am I missing?
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Jay
> 

Date:    Saturday, 07 October 1995 21:53:34 
Subject: Caustics.itx
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Can someone give me some quick information on how to best set up caustic.itx
for maximum effect.  I have added it to a couple of light sources but don't
seem to be able to get it to function properly.  Settings for itx, best
attributes for objects ect.  Also perhaps a best scene to create for test
rendering the lites to tune the effect.

Bob............

Date:    Saturday, 07 October 1995 22:00:34 
Subject: Re: How to access aminet
From:    RJay9@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

This may be a silly question and may reflect my internet knowledge, but how
do you access Aminet?  I use the address
ftp://wuarchive.wustl.edu/systems/amiga/aminet/, reach the sit but then I',m
asked my name and password?  The name part I've got figured out by I don't
have a password.  What am I missing?

Thanks

Jay

Date:    Saturday, 07 October 1995 22:39:29 
Subject: Re: caustics.itx
From:    sgiff@airmail.net (Stephen Gifford)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

>Can someone give me some quick information on how to best set up caustic.itx
>for maximum effect.  I have added it to a couple of light sources but don't
>seem to be able to get it to function properly.  Settings for itx, best
>attributes for objects ect.  Also perhaps a best scene to create for test
>rendering the lites to tune the effect.
>
>Bob............
>

Here is one that I used in the Coke piece on the brochure.  For some reason
Transfer Pro would not UUE the ITX file so I had to zip it.

begin 644 CAUSTIC.ZIP
M4$L#!!0``@`(`!1,=2#^5HGZXP```/(!```F````24U!1TE.12]#3TM%-"Y)
M35`O3T)*14-44R]'965N8V%U<RYI;V)S\P_R96!@?!7BXN+B[^2E`&3?<W$-
M=@;2Y_P<?5T9&!B$'",\@QE00+!'@!&08F%@8K@8X!_L"63SP.08:^=.@NI0
M86!$U8>-'^P9Y0K6[S)C-LMY@P(0[>3D'P$4D_B_.SWMM\'YB2`:63[`,2@$
M*,\&Q%P,#)Y^(88P%S!^@1CL[.\3!';A____@US=?,!L(`@)<O2#L8,#G`WA
MXA$AQD#J%-!'!-R+P0>Z!XKG@%T$`T"7H9F&W0P*@7A):D5):5%J<4Q.9@F0
M3$XL+2[)3"X."`H`^8[C/U1="#!Z038#`%!+`0(R"Q0``@`(`!1,=2#^5HGZ
MXP```/(!```F``````````````"V@0````!)34%'24Y%+T-/2T4T+DE-4"]/
I0DI%0U13+T=E96YC875S+FEO8E!+!08``````0`!`%0````G`0````!
`
end


Date:    Saturday, 07 October 1995 22:46:22 
Subject: Re: CleanupSlice program
From:    Gerard Menendez <gpm@netcom.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



Milan,

I'd love to see this program and would be happy to post it to Aminet if 
you need someone to do that.


Gerard


On Thu, 5 Oct 1995, Milan Polle wrote:

> Hi all,
> 
> just writing to let you know that a few days ago, I finished my
> program that cleans up sliced objects. (To be honest, I didn't work on it
> during the summer holiday; my brain didn't work because of the heat).
> The only thing left to do is the doc file. Oh yeah, it's amiga-only (sorry).
> Any people out there interested in it, maybe someone could put it on aminet
> for me. And people without access to aminet can mail me for a copy.
> 
> Milan (milan@bmt.hku.nl)
> 
> - Still waiting for my credit-card to arrive, so I can upgrade to 4.0... -
> 
> 
> 

Date:    Sunday, 08 October 1995 12:13:17 
Subject: Nebulosa magnificado
From:    Mike McCool <mikemcoo@efn.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Just a quick thanks, out here in the open, for Ted Stethem's fine 
MyNebula.lha, down on aminet.  Glorious stuff.  

Made me wish I was a little better painter, to come up with nebula maps of
my own.  I'd love to have one with green's and yellow's.  I think there's
a nebula in Orion called The Lagoon, that has green in it.  Or maybe it's 
The Triffid . . .  Reminds me, there's a nebula up in Lyra, viewable with 
any kind of telescope, that's shaped like a smoke ring.  Coolest cool.  

Anyhow, way to go, Ted. And thanks, you, for sharing it with us. 

(Curious:  did anyone else who requested that furball object--back last 
week when we were discussing hair--have trouble unarc'ing it?  Mine came 
up corrupt).   


Date:    Sunday, 08 October 1995 13:34:27 
Subject: DOF right-shifting?
From:    das@ceti.csustan.edu (David Alan Steiger)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hello,

Has anyone else had a problem with depth of focus, where objects shift
to the right of the image?  The perspective window in the Stage Editor
shows the correct placement, but when it is rendered, it's like the 
camera is rotated to the left.  This effect increases with an increase
of depth of focus.  I have the amiga version 3.0.

I assume it is from the eye separation, but nothing I do can turn off
this shift.  Any help is quite appreciated and forgive me if it's in
the FAQ, the last time I checked, I couldn't find it.

Thanks,
Dave

Date:    Sunday, 08 October 1995 15:22:52 
Subject: Yet another web page
From:    --Craig <dalamar@MIT.EDU>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

If anyone is curious to see yet another web page containing images
done with Imagine, visit

http://web.mit.edu:8001/dalamar/www/basement.htm

Feedback would be greatly appreciated, as I'm a left-brain sort of
guy.

  --Craig
dalamar@athena.mit.edu

Date:    Sunday, 08 October 1995 16:43:46 
Subject: Questions
From:    Edward Askins <edochan@moose.erie.net>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I have a couple of questions and I hope that someone can answer them.

1)  I remember seeing something on this list about a windows program that 
had "Dare to Imagine" and several other Imagine related reference materials 
hooked up  to a search engine.  What is the name of this program and 
where can I find it?

2) What is Apex Softwares address and have they come up with Essence 
textures for Imagine 3.3 (Pc version) Yet.

Thanks in advance;

                   Ed Askins

Date:    Sunday, 08 October 1995 23:55:00 
Subject: Re: MGA Millennium
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Joe Beard <jbeard@cix.compulink.co.uk>
> 
> I don't have any DOS drivers for the card at all. Zilch, zippo, zero, not 
> a single one. So like I said I don't know why I have some modes listed 
> and you have none, as I have done nothing at all to enable them. I only 
> have the 2 meg card, but that would make no difference.

Odd as it may sound, this could be the key. My Montreal friend, who also 
has 5 available modes, has a 2M Millenium, compared to my 4M model. He 
and I have the same BIOS, the new 1.7.

Anyway, hopefully the next UniVESA will solve this.

Date:    Monday, 09 October 1995 00:33:44 
Subject: Good tree objects, how, where?
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Aki Laukkanen <alaukka@voimax.voima.jkl.fi>
> 
> How do I achieve good tree objects? I mean modelling one, leaf by leaf is 
> very tedious and hard process.

Others will give you great techniques on modelling trees that stand up 
to close scrutiny, but for all those background trees, do the following: 
create two vertical planes at 90 degrees to each other. They'll show up 
as a cross in the Top view. Then use color and filter brushmaps to map 
2-D images of a tree on each plane. The result can be duplicated, placed, 
rotated around Z, and scaled to create an entire forest of trees.

I can't verify this, but I've heard this is what Pacific Data Images did 
for their award-winning "Loco-motion" animation, showing a brave train 
engine and reticant caboose passing over a piece of broken track. So, if 
it's good enough for the big boys, it's good enough for us.


Date:    Monday, 09 October 1995 00:38:40 
Subject: Re: How to access aminet
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Anonymous FTP means that you enter "anonymous" as the user name, and 
your e-mail address as the password.


Date:    Monday, 09 October 1995 00:43:28 
Subject: Huge iff-24 file - how to convert
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Bob Pleatman <pleatman@one.net>
> 
> I have created an image for a CD cover.  I was told by our Media
> group that the final image should be at least 400dpi.  Seeing as the
> cd is about 5 inches, I rendered the image at 2100x2220 in IFF-24.

By the way, you should check what aspect ratio they're expecting. Most 
Mac or PC programs need perfectly square pixels, i.e. a 1-to-1 aspect 
ratio in the "Modify subproject" requester. You should also define a 
screenmode in Prefs to use when quickrendering. It will look stretched 
vertically, but the borders will be exact.


Date:    Monday, 09 October 1995 00:46:23 
Subject: I'm Stupid.. was Re: Imagemaster
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Scott Krehbiel <scotkre@beacon.regent.edu>
> 
> Have there been updates since version 1 revision 50c??
> or any manual updates??

The current version, as of this summer, is 1.60. Not much is new that I 
can remember: Plasma and Fire effects, a color wheel for color selection.

> Is there anyone from Imagemaster on the list??

Ben Williams can be reached at 76004.1771@compuserve.com. Black Belt 
also has a WWW page; try http://www.blackbelt.com/settop_box.html, I 
believe it's the right URL.






Date:    Monday, 09 October 1995 00:54:21 
Subject: Imagine inertia
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Milan Polle <milan@Estoril.hku.nl>
> 
> I just discovered that imagine already has a built in
> inertia effect! I was using the spline interpolation
> with a starting speed of 5 and an ending speed of 0.
> The speed of 5 turned out to be too fast, so the anim
> extrapolated and returned to the target position.
> A really neat cartoony inertia effect... wow!
> (It's not a bug, it's a feature :)

Yep, and you can also obtain this effect (called overshoot) by setting 
the Spline #1 parameter, in an Action editor bar, to a negative value 
such as -1. Setting Spline #0 to -1 would produce the opposite effect, 
anticipation of a motion. (Imagine someone's arm pulling back a bit 
before they throw a punch)




Date:    Monday, 09 October 1995 00:57:03 
Subject: Imagine Registration
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: NEWKIRK@delphi.com
> 
> I have Imagine 2.0 Amiga, unregistered for a (possibly) unique reason:
> I purchased the original disks, along with those for PageStream 2.2, 
> Lattice C 5.02, and several other fairly expensive packages, from an
> associate (also A customer of my security business)for about $150, due 
> to the fact that his apartment burned up, with original
> disks and other important/valuable items in a fire safe.  No docs, no 
> packages, no Amiga, no use to him.

If that's the case, he could've written you a transfer of ownership 
letter, which you could've mailed to the relevant software companies. 
Most of them would have agreed to transfer the registration from your 
friend's name to yours. It's still not too late to do this, you know.


Date:    Monday, 09 October 1995 01:23:29 
Subject: REQ: IML subscription address
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Steven Cockrill <scockrill@sprill.demon.co.uk>
> 
> If anyone is reading this, sorry to butt in but I`ve been trying to
> subscribe to the list with no success.
> 
> The address I`ve been using is:
> 
> imagine-request@email.sp.paramax.com

Ummm, shouldn't it be imagine-request@email.eag.unisysgsg.com?

Date:    Monday, 09 October 1995 01:49:07 
Subject: The 3rd in the Minds Eye video series (was RE: Mind Eye)
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: James Cheseborough <jimc@eznet.net>
> 
> I'm really into music too. The music on the 1st is awesome, and went 
> straight downhill after that! :-(

Agreed. Vol.1 has beautiful music that stands quite well on its own. It 
also follows what's onscreen much better than Vols. 2 and 3, which 
used top-name artists who did their own things with little regard to 
the animation. I was quite disappointed with the soundtrack to Vol. 2 
(I thought, "Jan Hammer! Cool!") and less disappointed with Vol. 3, 
but only because I'd been burned by Vol. 2.

As far as animation goes, Vol. 3 tends to have longer clips, or several 
clips from the same animation at various points. This may be a factor if 
you prefer more context and less eye candy. However, the only Mind's Eye 
I've played more than twice is the first, because of its wonderful 
soundtrack.

If you really, really want full-length versions of award-winning 
animations, with their original soundtrack, I recommend "Computer 
animation festival" from Miramar, 200 Second Avenue West, Seattle, WA 98119:

Vol. 1
------
      Locomotion
      Particle dreams
      The mouse
      Tuber's two step
      Flying logos <great parody!>
      Sextone for president
      Grinning evil death <wildly exaggerated mix of computer & hand-drawn>
      Jumpin' Jacques Splash
      Burning Love
      Styro
      BDA opening
      The dolphin
      Mars the movie
      More bells & whistles
      Continuum 1. initiation
      Don't touch me
      Anniversary
      The fly
      Embryo
      The invisible man in "blind love"
      Change myself <Yep, the ground-breaking Lightwave Todd Rundgren song>

Vol. 2
------
      Devil's mind ride
      Liquid selves (music by Peter Gabriel)
      Gas planet
      On the run
      The goldfish
      Theology <Todd Rundgren with a better version of LW--ooh, lens flares>
      Flora
      Night cafe
      Slide show
      Don quichotte
      Mandel zoom
      Computer home
      The frog
      Primordial dance
      The making of "without borders"
      Monkey business
      Styro II
      Fire beast
      The spider
      A sequence from the evolution of form
      Steam (music by Peter Gabriel)
      Technological threat


Date:    Monday, 09 October 1995 01:59:30 
Subject: Wurlitzer Jukebox
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Mike Vandersommen <mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com>
> 
> BTW, Brad was the 3D artist on a CD Rom game (for Amiga/CDTV and PC)
> called Labyrinth (Electronic Arts). You might find it in a bargain

I assume you mean Labyrinth of Time?


Date:    Monday, 09 October 1995 09:22:41 
Subject: 4.0!
From:    "Dan.Maclean" <MACLEDJ@pmitao.usa.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

 
My DX4/100 seems a bit snappier than the DX2/66 did, but it isn't all that
noticable.  I haven't tested any render times, but I'm sure they are better.
We have Pentiums at work (although the computer at my desk is an old 386SX/20)
and the DX4/100 rates just a little slower than a Pentium 60.  Our Pentium 90
SCREAM!  I couldn't upgrade to a DX4/120 because it runs the bus at 40Mhz
rather than 33.3Mhz.  My video card (A Metheus VL4) can't handle anything over
33.3.  I would have to say that I don't think a DX4/120 would benoticably 2X f
aster than a DX2/66.  Too many other things are running at the same slower
speed (RAM, Hard disk, Video, etc.)
 
I'll be checking my mailbox for the brochure about 4.0.  For some reason
Impulse hasn't been sending me literature.  The last thing I got (other than
the 3.3 and 3.0 upgrades) was a mailer describing how great 3.0 will be and
talking about the upcoming Digimax.
 
Thanks for the info!
 
Dan
macledj@pmifeg.com


Date:    Monday, 09 October 1995 09:23:02 
Subject: ------=> Sorry NO Subject!
From:    montvai@achilles.rijnh.nl (Attila Montvai)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



:subject: this is my last post                                 

Hi Imaginary people,

you konw what i mean: don't you?        

>>         i^2 = -1.               <<


(an imaginary number squared gives a negative value.) 

So long! 

P.S.

    1. I have started the painful procedure to get 
my name off the list.

    2. To those 'professionals' (being tested as a beta
version) who do not want to speak to amateurs.
I can reassure you, I have already spoken to professionals,
(release version!!) and sometimes it was a complete disaster. 

    3. Recently it has been claimed by the president
of united impulses, that imagine has been written
by EIGHT programmers in about TEN years. It
was claimed as well, that they all want to have a car!?
If I compare it to that what can be done by a single person 
in a short year (e.g. in my field), than  it is a shock to know
that they don't have to crawl barefooted around.

    4. 'course, the VAST MAJORITY has been all right!!! That was a
pleasure to 'meet' you!


Attila
montvai@achilles.rijnh.nl

==============================================================

      |-00000-------|
      |0-------000-0|
      |---0000------|  1.2 Hz(!)  ABACUS, 11 rows, 13 spheres
      |---------0000|           of different colors on each
      |             |
      |             |
     ---           ---
===============================================================



Date:    Monday, 09 October 1995 11:22:53 
Subject: Re: Two Things
From:    Mike Bandy <bandy@aplcomm.jhuapl.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

On Mon, 9 Oct 1995, Stuart Hogton wrote:

> Hello Everybody,
>             I have one question and one almost-sort-of tip.
> 
> 1 - Can anybody point me to an algorithm for boolean operations? I have 
> searched the net and local bookstores to no avail. The only idea I can 
> think of myself is an expansion of the Weiler/Atherton 2D polygon clipping 
> algorithm.

David Rogers, et al: _Procedural Elements for Computer Graphics_  Or
something close to that - if you can't find it I can look up the exact 
name and ISBN when I get home.

Having taken Roger's grad school graphics class at JHU, I can say that
the boolean operations on 3-D objects is one of the trickier programming
exercises.  Not for the faint of heart.

      Mike

--
Mike Bandy      bandy@aplcomm.jhuapl.edu
Johns Hopkins University / Applied Physics Laboratory

COGITO EGGO SUM - I think; therefore, I am a waffle

Date:    Monday, 09 October 1995 14:47:14 
Subject: Two Things
From:    Stuart Hogton <stuarth@bournemouth.ac.uk>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hello Everybody,
              I have one question and one almost-sort-of tip.

1 - Can anybody point me to an algorithm for boolean operations? I have 
searched the net and local bookstores to no avail. The only idea I can 
think of myself is an expansion of the Weiler/Atherton 2D polygon clipping 
algorithm.

2 - I have written a small program which takes an Imagine object 
converted to ASCII using T3DLIB, and then checks every point against 
every point. If the distance between the two points is greater than 0 and 
less than a pre-specified value, the first point moves to the position of 
the second. In short, this is a merge program with a threshold! if 
anybody is interested in compiling this for the amiga or PC, please let 
me know and I will give you the source.

Date:    Monday, 09 October 1995 15:14:38 
Subject: Re: good tree objects, how, where?
From:    Marty K <mk-tel@sik.ppoy.fi>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

On Sun, 8 Oct 1995, Charles Blaquiere wrote:

> > From: Aki Laukkanen <alaukka@voimax.voima.jkl.fi>
> > 
> > How do I achieve good tree objects? I mean modelling one, leaf by leaf is 
> > very tedious and hard process.
> 
> create two vertical planes at 90 degrees to each other. They'll show up 
> as a cross in the Top view. Then use color and filter brushmaps to map 
> 2-D images of a tree on each plane. The result can be duplicated, placed, 
> rotated around Z, and scaled to create an entire forest of trees.

There's only the trouble, that when several objects with transparency 
overlapp, you get these black areas (you can increase the resolve depth, 
but only to a limit -and it slows down rendering).

> I can't verify this, but I've heard this is what Pacific Data Images did 
> for their award-winning "Loco-motion" animation, showing a brave train 
> engine and reticant caboose passing over a piece of broken track. So, if 
> it's good enough for the big boys, it's good enough for us.
> 
Loco-motion is a terrific animation. But it was not done with Imagine.

__    __  __  _ __  ___  _____  __ __ _  __    __    "Nothing is real"
'=\/T/='  I|\/| //\ I| )/ I| \\_/  I|/   '=\T\/='    mk-tel.sik.ppoy.fi
  /^^   * I|  |//~~\I|~\  I|  I|   I|\  *   ^^\        Pori, FINLAND
          ~~  ~~~  ~~~  ~ ~~  ~~   ~~ ~          http://www.ppoy.fi/~mk-tel


Date:    Tuesday, 10 October 1995 00:13:13 
Subject: Attributes
From:    hans.de@empire.access.net.au


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi. I'm pretty new to Imagine and need some assistance with a few 
questions. An important one at the moment is how do I get a shiny, black 
attribute to show after rendering. All I get is black on black. I'v looked 
through a lot of IML's but couldn't find any help.
Hans de Kok



Date:    Tuesday, 10 October 1995 00:23:51 
Subject: Glossy 4.0 Brochure Revisited!
From:    Ted Stethem <tstethem@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

  OK, the Glossy Brochure announcing 4.0 is extremely well-done. It proves 
that talented guys like Steve Blackmon, Tom Renderbrain, and greG 
tsalidas can produce awesome stills with raytracing. The brochure seems 
to indicate a new direction for Impulse as it is unlike anything Impulse 
has ever published in paper form since my association with them (version 
2.0). Heck, it is almost like some American wrote it, unlike previous 
pubs which seem to have been done in Mexico or Indonesia (no offense, 
just referring to the typos and poor grammar of previous pubs).
  BUT, what about us registered upgrade customers?  We are supposed to be 
getting Version 3.4 of the upgrade, which is supposed to be Version 4.0. 
Now, is Version 4.0 going to have a NEW MANUAL? If so, do the people that 
put their trust in Impulse by buying into the continuing upgrade plan 
ALSO get that new manual? Or do we get more "dox-on-disk"?
  Also, it is fine to inform all the V3.0 users about the great 
improvements in V4.0 and inviting them to upgrade, but once again, what 
about the people on the CONTINUING UPGRADE plan? Sure, if you bought V3.0 
and didn't sign on with the continuing upgrade plan, then it is great 
that Implus is giving them until October 31 to send in for the complete 
version upgrade. But what about the CONTINUING UPGRADE people? We haven't 
even gotten the final version of the continuing upgrade plan and October 
is slipping away. What, we get V3.4 on October 30 and have one day to 
decide if we want to go for the cross-platform upgrade? Trick-or-treat!
  Besides that, yeah, its great that V3.4=V4.0 is going to have 
metaballs, motion-blur and other new features, but what if they are buggy 
as hell? Do we get free bug fixes or are we just stuck with what we get 
and a choice to buy into the next version (which will be bug-free, 
snicker, snicker, yuk, yuk)?
  If anybody is speaking to Impulse and knows the answers to these 
questions, I would appreciate hearing what they are.
  And Mike H., if you are monitoring this list, maybe you could answer 
these questions through one of your henchmen.

"You know vee are monitoring zis list, vee haf all zee names, und vee are 
carefully examining zem. Zehr gut! and Stieg Abt Schweinhund! Zieg Heil! 
Zieg Heil!"

Date:    Tuesday, 10 October 1995 02:35:17 
Subject: Re: attributes
From:    rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au (Robert Byrne)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hello Hans, on Oct 9 you wrote:

> Hi. I'm pretty new to Imagine and need some assistance with a few 
> questions. An important one at the moment is how do I get a shiny, black 
> attribute to show after rendering. All I get is black on black. I'v looked 
> through a lot of IML's but couldn't find any help.
> Hans de Kok

You can either change the background colour in your preferences or put an
object behind the black object and make it another colour.

-- Bob

  :  Robert Byrne  : rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au :
  : Amiga A3000/25 :  Ballina, NSW  Australia  :


Date:    Tuesday, 10 October 1995 09:36:01 
Subject: /noxms
From:    "Dan.Maclean" <MACLEDJ@pmitao.usa.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I have a question for all you PC users out there.  From what I understand
about the PC's weird memory architecture, turning off emm386 and using xms
should result in faster renders than using emm386 to simulate EMS and running
Imagine with the /noxms option.  EMS uses 64k chunks if I remember correctly
while XMS is flat memory accessible anywhere at once.  My question is:  Has
anyone verified this?  Is it true?  If it is, is the gain worth the effort?
 
Thanks for the help!
Dan MacLean
PMI
macledj@pmifeg.com
 
P.S.  What is the deal with the lotus email undeliveable message that keeps
getting posted?  Is everyone getting that?


Date:    Tuesday, 10 October 1995 09:36:49 
Subject: Re: Glossy 4.0 Brochure Revisited!
From:    Brad Molsen <moon@eskimo.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

      Ted, Your message did bring up some valid points, that I was 
hesitant to ask about myself. Will the 3.4 upgrade bring us up to the 
equivilant of 4.0? Just when is this final upgrade due to come out? Has 
anyone knowledge of the above? Also, has anyone heard about a simular 
constant upgrade program being availiable for 4.0 to 5.0? Will the items 
that were mentioned by Tom G. in an earlier post be part of the 4.0 
release or part of some future release or part of a combo 
wishlist/imaginings. 
                      Answers welcome,
                              Brad Molsen

Date:    Tuesday, 10 October 1995 10:03:31 
Subject: Re:  Glossy 4.0 Brochure etc
From:    "Dan.Maclean" <MACLEDJ@pmitao.usa.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Dan MacLean here,
I thought the "Zieg Heil" was way overboard too.  Unfortunately some good
points were lost by that final tirade.  If the past is any guide, there will
be plenty of bugs, none disabling, but they will not be releasing a bug fix
unless you continue with the continuous upgrade program.  I'm using as my
example the DXF format.  It was advertised in 3.0, but if that is the version
you purchased you did not have a useful DXF importing capability (even though
it was promised).  No bug fix was released, unless you count the continuous
upgrade which cost you $100.  If you want a bug free 4.0 buy 5.0 and you get
some extra cool features that might work.
 
I'm not really complaining, now that I know how it works.  I just think others
should be let in on it before making a decision.
 
Here is a complaint though!  Where's MY glossy brochure?  I got mailed 3.3
about 2 months ago, so I know they have my name and address.Can anyone tell my
if  glowing lights (as seen on seaQuest, S:A&B, and Babylon 5)are one of the n
ew features?  And what is the deal with this "cross platform" deal?  Is
Windows one of the platforms?  Inquiring minds need to know!
 
Dan MacLean
PMI


Date:    Tuesday, 10 October 1995 11:07:00 
Subject: Moan, moan, moan.
From:    jbeard@cix.compulink.co.uk (Joe Beard)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> Ted Stethem <tstethem@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us said:
>
>   OK, the Glossy Brochure announcing 4.0 is extremely well-done. It 
> proves that talented guys like Steve Blackmon, Tom Renderbrain, and 
> greG tsalidas can produce awesome stills with raytracing. The brochure 
> seems to indicate a new direction for Impulse as it is unlike anything 
> Impulse has ever published in paper form since my association with them 
> (version 2.0). Heck, it is almost like some American wrote it, unlike 
> previous pubs which seem to have been done in Mexico or Indonesia (no 
> offense, just referring to the typos and poor grammar of previous pubs).
>   BUT, what about us registered upgrade customers?  We are supposed to 
> be getting Version 3.4 of the upgrade, which is supposed to be Version 
> 4.0. Now, is Version 4.0 going to have a NEW MANUAL? If so, do the 
> people that put their trust in Impulse by buying into the continuing 
> upgrade plan ALSO get that new manual? Or do we get more "dox-on-disk"?
>   Also, it is fine to inform all the V3.0 users about the great 
> improvements in V4.0 and inviting them to upgrade, but once again, what 
> about the people on the CONTINUING UPGRADE plan? Sure, if you bought 
> V3.0 and didn't sign on with the continuing upgrade plan, then it is 
> great that Implus is giving them until October 31 to send in for the 
> complete version upgrade. But what about the CONTINUING UPGRADE people? 
> We haven't even gotten the final version of the continuing upgrade plan 
> and October is slipping away. What, we get V3.4 on October 30 and have 
> one day to decide if we want to go for the cross-platform upgrade? 
> Trick-or-treat!
>   Besides that, yeah, its great that V3.4=V4.0 is going to have 
> metaballs, motion-blur and other new features, but what if they are 
> buggy as hell? Do we get free bug fixes or are we just stuck with what 
> we get and a choice to buy into the next version (which will be 
> bug-free, snicker, snicker, yuk, yuk)?
>   If anybody is speaking to Impulse and knows the answers to these 
> questions, I would appreciate hearing what they are.
>   And Mike H., if you are monitoring this list, maybe you could answer 
> these questions through one of your henchmen.
> 
> "You know vee are monitoring zis list, vee haf all zee names, und vee 
> are carefully examining zem. Zehr gut! and Stieg Abt Schweinhund! Zieg 
> Heil! Zieg Heil!"

Do you really have to be so bloody rude? Henchmen? Zieg Heil????? Maybe 
your comments were made light-heartedly, but if I were Mike or any other 
Impulse employee seeing this crap then I don't think I would bother 
reading the IML anymore. Why don't you try being a bit more *positive* 
about a product that most of the people here seem to like.

Grow up!

Joe




Date:    Tuesday, 10 October 1995 11:27:20 
Subject: Re: Moan, moan, moan.
From:    Steven M Powell <afn27231@freenet.ufl.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


On Tue, 10 Oct 1995, Dan Murrell Jr. wrote.

>  Mike's old campaign, "We MUST 
> support > 1.3!!" is ridiculously
> outdated and invalid.  No legitimate users are using an 8 year old OS anymore.
 
> Maybe none, period.

Except maybe Impulse...

Date:    Tuesday, 10 October 1995 11:46:22 
Subject: Re: Glossy 4.0 Brochure Revisited!
From:    das@altair.csustan.edu (David Alan Steiger)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Actually, it doesn't offer a phone number for questions.  It only
gives an order line.

On the topics of bugs & features, I upgraded to 3.0 based solely on
the propoganda they gave in their newsletter.  I think about half
the features they mentioned actually were in the product, and worked
correctly.  (Remember sound in the stage editor?)

Isn't this false advertising?  Couldn't I have brought this up with
the Better Business Bureau?

I didn't subscribe to the Constant Upgrade because I didn't feel I
should pay an extra $100 to get the DXF functions promised me in 3.0.
I don't think *any* of use should have to pay anything until we gett
all the features advertised in the version we're paying for.

Heck, why should Impulse bother saing anything true about their
product?  All they have to do is come up with an excuse and a promise
for a newer version, and a hand out for $100.

I have the Color brochure, and I *still* wonder whats in 4.0.

Dave

Date:    Tuesday, 10 October 1995 11:55:30 
Subject: Re: attributes
From:    cjo@esrange.ssc.se


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hans De Kok wrote;

>... how do I get a shiny, black attribute to show after rendering. All I=20
>get is black on black.

To make something shiny or reflective show up in a rendering you must give=20
it something to reflect.
Either insert a few objects around the shiny one in your scene or apply an=20
environment map / global brush map to the object ot to the whole scene.

*---------------------------------------------------------------*
|   Conny Joensson   |   Swedish Space Corp. Esrange            |
|   Kiruna           |   Satellite operations - Telecom Div.    |
|   Sweden           |   cjo@smtpgw.esrange.ssc.se              |
*---------------------------------------------------------------*

Date:    Tuesday, 10 October 1995 11:55:44 
Subject: About bug fixes...a possible solution.
From:    jacob@altair.csustan.edu (Dave Jacob)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

The points raised about bug fixes is a valid one. There ought to be
a way apart from the constant upgrade program to fix bugs that
already exist in the program. Of course, the solution to this problem
is a rather simple one-- once Impulse has a web presence on the 
internet, they could post bug fixes to earlier versions everyone
could download free, and leave the new bells and whistles for those
paying for them through the upgrade program.

Changing the topic, I am wondering if Imagine 4.0 will be the last 
Imagine version for DOS? In my 'glossy brochure' while there were
many upgrade paths from earlier versions of imagine to 4.0, no
mention is made about purchasing 4.0 from scratch. Also, I think
there will be no new manual provided with 4.0 -- docs will be on
the disk. If so, it'll be a sad day... there exists no program that
works faster in windows. Giving up speed for windows doesn't sound
fun at all...

One last thing. Is there a program out there that will let you 
create your own PROCEEDURAL textures? (not image maps, as they 
take up memory, but the textures that are represented by mathematical
expressions). If someone could tell me wher such a program is I'd be
thankful.

Dave.

Date:    Tuesday, 10 October 1995 12:07:51 
Subject: Moan, moan, moan.
From:    bryant@tpworm.ENET.dec.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

FROM too long. Original FROM is 'Dick Bryant - 237-6502 10-Oct-1995 1045 <bryant
@tpworm.ENET.dec.com>'

----------------------  Original Message Follows  ----------------------

From: US4RMC::"jbeard@cix.compulink.co.uk" "MAIL-11 Daemon" 10-OCT-1995 06:10:23
.09

Date:    Tuesday, 10 October 1995 13:18:13 
Subject: Re: Moan, moan, moan.
From:    "Dan Murrell Jr." <djm2@Ra.msstate.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In imagine@email.eag.unisysgsg.com on Moan, moan, moan.,
jbeard@cix.compulink.co.uk (Joe Beard) wrote the following:

> > Ted Stethem <tstethem@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us said:

> > "You know vee are monitoring zis list, vee haf all zee names, und ve=
e=20
> > are carefully examining zem. Zehr gut! and Stieg Abt Schweinhund! Zi=
eg=20
> > Heil! Zieg Heil!"
>=20
> Do you really have to be so bloody rude? Henchmen? Zieg Heil????? Mayb=
e=20
> your comments were made light-heartedly, but if I were Mike or any oth=
er=20
> Impulse employee seeing this crap then I don't think I would bother=20=

> reading the IML anymore. Why don't you try being a bit more *positive*=
=20
> about a product that most of the people here seem to like.
>=20

Lighten up, dude.  That was funny, not to mention accurate with a humoro=
us
twist.  And he
did raise some valid points.  What if all the cool new features are bugg=
y?=20
And then you
have to pay to fix THOSE and get a couple more new features that will be=
 buggy
too?  That's
been the norm with Impulse all these years.  And, IMO, the most rude
individual I've ever seen
on this list in all the years I've been reading has been none other than=
 Mike
Halvorson himself.
For example, his patent response to someone who practically begs him to =
make
his Amiga product
look, act, and feel like an AMIGA product has been "if you want the ASL
requesters, if you want the
OS compliant code, if you want modelling screens that take advantage of =
the
high resolutions most
of my customers have available on their machines now, if you want this, =
and
you want that, come
do it yourself." I've actually seen example code for ASL file requesters=

posted here, free of charge
for Mike's programmer(s) to use, which was quietly ignored by Mike.  The=
re are
several of us here
who would be more than happy to help Mike develop, say, an Imagine that =
would
run from the workbench,
but have been just been shrugged off.  Mike's old campaign, "We MUST support
1.3!!" is ridiculously
outdated and invalid.  No legitimate users are using an 8 year old OS an=
ymore.=20
Maybe none, period.

Dan

--=20
                                        __
Sent from Danimal's AmiTCP-ing Amiga 3000/ Amigas!/Saturday morning Wres=
tling/
  Dan Murrell Jr.   IRC's Danimal     /// James Taylor/Pink Floyd/Roger>=
Dave!/
      djm2@ra.msstate.edu         \\\/// Imagine/Essence/AmiTCP/AMosaic/=
3Dgfx/



Date:    Tuesday, 10 October 1995 14:05:33 
Subject: 4.0????
From:    "Dan.Maclean" <MACLEDJ@pmitao.usa.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

From Dan MacLean
 
Well, I'm bummin'.  I don't have my cool color brochure for 4.0.  Could
someone clue me in on the major features?  I know about motion blur (that'll
be fun to play with) and metaballs (whatever they are) thanks to that "Zieg
Heil" guy. Is there something on the WWW?  Compuserve?  Thanks!


Date:    Tuesday, 10 October 1995 14:21:34 
Subject: Bug fixes...
From:    milan@Gent.hku.nl (Milan Polle)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi all,

about Imagine 4.0 having bugs or not... SURE! it will probably even have
bugs that where in 3.0, as I heard that the bump-mapping bug (repeated
bump maps) is still not fixed. A friend of mine told me he has made a 
list of about 140 bugs in Imagine, after examining 3.3 there where still
about 100 bugs left on this list. The thing with Impulse is that they
feel adding new features is more important (or easier? :) to do than
fixing old bugs. And speaking of new features, a lot of promised features
(even the ones for 3.0) are still not in 4.0.
BTW, I think there is no Imagine 3.4, it is 4.0, and constant upgrade
members will get it when it's ready. Also stop complaining about Impulse
not supporting the Amiga, they have only said the opposite, so start
paying for your upgrade and keep your Amiga alive.
About the not-fixed bugs and undelivered promises, you get used to it
after a while, maybe Impulse shouldn't promise too much, we won't 
complain about promises when they don't promise us things that aren't
ready for a long time. And well, $100 is a bargain price for 4.0, I
love to get my hands on the metaballs and smooth fracture etc.

Let your Imagination run wild,

greetz, Milan

- I have my credit card! 4.0 here I come! -



Date:    Tuesday, 10 October 1995 14:52:59 
Subject: Re: Glossy 4.0 Brochure Revisited!
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-10 02:46:24 EDT, you write:

>  If anybody is speaking to Impulse and knows the answers to these 
>questions, I would appreciate hearing what they are.
>  And Mike H., if you are monitoring this list, maybe you could answer 
>these questions through one of your henchmen.
>
>"You know vee are monitoring zis list, vee haf all zee names, und vee are 
>carefully examining zem. Zehr gut! and Stieg Abt Schweinhund! Zieg Heil! 
>Zieg Heil!"

This sort of thing is totally uncalled for.  Things in your message you seem
to quote as facts are not true.  The brochure clearly states if you have
questions that you can call them and ask about it.  Your last paragraph is
totally tasteless.  We all bitch about our peeves concerning Imagine from
time to time but your particular brand of rhetoric is unacceptable in my
opinion.

Bob Sampson...........................


Date:    Tuesday, 10 October 1995 14:53:58 
Subject: Re: /noxms
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-10 09:45:25 EDT, you write:

>P.S.  What is the deal with the lotus email undeliveable message that keeps
>getting posted?  Is everyone getting that?
>
>

Yeah I am getting those all the time as well.

Bob..............

Date:    Tuesday, 10 October 1995 15:45:00 
Subject: Glossy 4.0 Brochure
From:    mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com (Mike Vandersommen)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

-> From: Ted Stethem <tstethem@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us>->->   BUT, what about u
s registered upgrade customers?  We are suppose=d t-> getting Version 3.4 of the
 upgrade, which is supposed to be Versio=n 4-> Now, is Version 4.0 going to have
 a NEW MANUAL? If so, do the peop=le-> put their trust in Impulse by buying into
 the continuing upgrade p=lan-> ALSO get that new manual? Or do we get more "dox
-on-disk"?I asked about the 4.0 manual long ago, and the answer was no newmanual
 for 4.0. The "new" manual will be for WinImagine. Unlessof course they change t
heir minds......-> is slipping away. What, we get V3.4 on October 30 and have on
e day= to-> decide if we want to go for the cross-platform upgrade? Trick-or-t=r
eaIf Impulse can "fudge" on actual release dates, I can't see them bein=ghard no
sed about upgrade deadlines. Why not call them first, and seeif you'll be given 
a longer grace period to decide on the cross-platform upgrade?  Afterall, we are
 dealing with the Impulse TimeContinuum and their Star Clocks run slower than ours on Earth. :)->   Besides that, yeah, its great that V3.4=3DV4
.0 is going to have-> metaballs, motion-blur and other new features, but what if
 they ar=e b-> as hell? Do we get free bug fixes or are we just stuck with what 
w=e g-> and a choice to buy into the next version (which will be bug-free,-> sni
cker, snicker, yuk, yuk)?Here again, don't shoot the piano player until he finis
hes the tune.->   If anybody is speaking to Impulse and knows the answers to the
se-> questions, I would appreciate hearing what they are.They DO have an 800 num
ber. Why not "talk to Impulse" yourself andget the answers first hand. I'm SURE 
Mike H. would love to discussyour concerns personally. (..booga..booga..)->   An
d Mike H., if you are monitoring this list, maybe you could an=swe-> these quest
ions through one of your henchmen.Crowbar Mike needs no henchman. He's always be
en the lead exterminato=r!-> "You know vee are monitoring zis list, vee haf all 
zee names, und =vee-> carefully examining zem. Zehr gut! and Stieg Abt Schweinhund! Zieg= He-> Zieg Heil!"Uncalled for.....really. "Unregistered
" Imagine users and IML callersare simply that. Unregistered. Although that was 
an unfortunate post,IMHO.   /------------------------------           ___   ___ 
 ___   ___  | Mike van der Sommen                     / __  /__/ /__/  /_   \ / 
 | Santa Barbara, Ca.                     /___/ / \  /  /  /     / \  | mike.van
dersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com     HAUS BBS (805-683-1388)  |           "Blackout
s make for nice breaks in the day"   \__________________________________________
___________________--- =FE InterNet - GraFX Haus BBS - Santa Barbara, Ca - (805)
 683-1388

Date:    Tuesday, 10 October 1995 17:31:00 
Subject: Whops
From:    Granberg Tom <tom.granberg@TV2.no>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Aha! so I'm not the only one with this problem, thats a relief.
At least Dan Maclean has experienced this very uncool message!
He wrote:
P.S.  What is the deal with the lotus email undeliveable message that keeps
getting posted?  Is everyone getting that?

Tom Renderbrandt


Date:    Tuesday, 10 October 1995 17:58:00 
Subject: CleanupSlice program
From:    robert.buonincontro@canrem.com (Robert Buonincontro)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


ML>From: milan@Gent.hku.nl (Milan Polle)

ML>Hi all,

ML>just writing to let you know that a few days ago, I finished my
ML>program that cleans up sliced objects. (To be honest, I didn't work on it
ML>during the summer holiday; my brain didn't work because of the heat).
ML>The only thing left to do is the doc file. Oh yeah, it's amiga-only (sorry).
ML>Any people out there interested in it, maybe someone could put it on aminet
ML>for me. And people without access to aminet can mail me for a copy.

ML>Milan (milan@bmt.hku.nl)

I'd love to give your program a try.

          robert.buonincontro&canrem.com
---
 * DeLuxe2 1.12 #8947 * The Amiga Is Not A Religion! It's A Computer!


Date:    Tuesday, 10 October 1995 19:24:58 
Subject: Re: attributes
From:    Chris Hall <Chris.Hall@dial.pipex.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 11:13 PM 10/9/95 AEST, you wrote:
>Hi. I'm pretty new to Imagine and need some assistance with a few 
>questions. An important one at the moment is how do I get a shiny, black 
>attribute to show after rendering. All I get is black on black. I'v looked 
>through a lot of IML's but couldn't find any help.
>Hans de Kok
>
>
>
 How about changing the background colour? You can do it by changing the
globals variables in the action editor. Zenith +, horizon and zenith -.
Chris Hall.

|--------------------------------------------------------|\
| You have been spoken to by Chris Hall                  ||
| A very tall and generally nice bloke from Great Briton ||
|                                                        ||
| E- mail me at : Hmmm. That's a tough one.              ||
| WWW home page temporarily pulled down !!               ||
|                                                        ||
| Today's lucky lottery numbers are :-                   ||
|              40 05 17 37 35 07                         ||
|--------------------------------------------------------||
 \--------------------------------------------------------\



Date:    Tuesday, 10 October 1995 19:53:33 
Subject: Re:  Glossy 4.0 Brochure etc
From:    Bill Boyce <bilboyce@iconz.co.nz>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 09:03 AM 10/10/95, you wrote:
>Dan MacLean here,
>Here is a complaint though!  Where's MY glossy brochure?  I got mailed 3.3
>about 2 months ago, so I know they have my name and address.Can anyone tell my
>if  glowing lights (as seen on seaQuest, S:A&B, and Babylon 5)are one of the n
>ew features?  And what is the deal with this "cross platform" deal?  Is
>Windows one of the platforms?  Inquiring minds need to know!
> 
>Dan MacLean
>PMI
>
No mention of glowing lights, sorry Dan. Cross platform at the moment means
Amiga to MS-DOS, with a Windows version not due until next year sometime.
New features from 3.3 will be smooth fracture (apparently a really cool
way of making smooth objects from rough ones - like metaform in Lightwave),
motion blur, soft lighting (light matrix's/groups), and metaballs (no relation
to a polyorchid :)

Bill Boyce


Date:    Tuesday, 10 October 1995 21:24:06 
Subject: Re: 4.0????
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-10 15:54:57 EDT, you write:

>Well, I'm bummin'.  I don't have my cool color brochure for 4.0.  Could
>someone clue me in on the major features?  I know about motion blur (that'll
>be fun to play with) and metaballs (whatever they are) thanks to that "Zieg
>Heil" guy. Is there something on the WWW?  Compuserve?  Thanks!

Well soft edge shadows is a big one.  Object smoothing will be another.  Many
of the other features mentioned I already have with 3.3.  Most everything
discussed on this list about 4.0 including pricing, dates and upgrade costs
is provided earlier and in a more factual manner on Compuserve where Impulse
maintains a forum and library and where help with Imagine is available from
GreG tsadillas and Tim Wilson who probably give better answers to more
questions than you will ever see in here.  I'm not pushing Compuserve, but
this crap you see posted in here like that "sieg heil" post is not something
you run up against on Compuserve and is one of the reasons that GreG does not
bother to read this list anymore from what I understand from him.   If your
looking towards an online service where you can get solid information about
your questions on Imagine then CIS is an excellent place to be.   

Bob........................

Date:    Tuesday, 10 October 1995 21:50:11 
Subject: Re:moan moan and some more
From:    Granberg Tom <tom.granberg@TV2.no>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi
I guess it has been said enough already, but the Nazi undertoned mail coming 
from a rude person here on this list was offensive. And I hope YOU are reading 
this mail, some of your point are valid WHEN we get 3.4&4.0 but it doesnt mean 
jack shit to anyone before that(except me perhaps, and other beta testers). And 

if someone is so displeased with a company as you are, please change software 
and get of this list. I my self have had the privilege to be "guided" away from 

loosy comments I've made to others, and yes it worked guys. This list is 
frequently hounted by wars, toughtless blames etc, but most of the times I learn
 
stuff here. And that is what this list is for, period.......and maybe a few 
loughs.

To Brad and others who wondering about things that will come in 4.0, I can just 

tell things I know/and or allowed to say, being a beta tester and all. But there
 
will be a lot of nice things in the first realese of 4.0(WHAT DO YOU MEAN BY 
FIRST REALESE?????), well here is the deal as far as I know it. Impulse is 
cramming as much as they can into Im4.0(dos) and they will realese it, but the 
upcoming Win4.0, has a time frame that will make it possible to cramm in more 
stuff and polish old stuff as well. Saying this, I will also say that I dont 
know about all the things that will apear in Win4.0, but I know most of the 
things of the 4.0(dos) realese. And most of the things you already know from the
 
brouchure.

To the: -------------WE HATE MIKE.H. CLUB----------
And to thoose who think that M.H. doesnt listen, you are deeply misstaken, here 

you have a man that are trying to run a buisiness. Maybe promissing a bit to 
much at times but so be it. But no way he deserves the treatment he frequently 
gets from some people on this list, he is not an idiot, and he is a very fun man
 
to talk to as well. He got visions for stuff you cant "imagine", and still he 
makes them available for us despite this groaning. Maybe charging the "larger" 
sum for Win4.0 will get rid of some of the "players" around. And I dont mean 
thoose who is happy playing, but thoose who are displeased with the way he is 
handling things. Maybe I'm wrong, but the time will show who is, wouldnt it?
By the way, I like amateurs very much, they sometimes comes up with some realy 
stuning stuff, and often very well suited to get paid for what they are doing as
 
well. So this mail is not a "hate mail" to you cool guys, I was a happy amateur,
 
before a got paid for it!

Ps.To whom it may concern,Dont bother starting a flame war over this, I wont 
be replying!
Later......sk
Tom Granberg Renderbrandt

Date:    Tuesday, 10 October 1995 23:08:48 
Subject: Re: Glossy 4.0 Brochure Revisited!
From:    sgiff@airmail.net (Stephen Gifford)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Some stuff deleted..

>  BUT, what about us registered upgrade customers?  We are supposed to be 
>getting Version 3.4 of the upgrade, which is supposed to be Version 4.0. 
>Now, is Version 4.0 going to have a NEW MANUAL? If so, do the people that 
>put their trust in Impulse by buying into the continuing upgrade plan 
>ALSO get that new manual? Or do we get more "dox-on-disk"?
>  Also, it is fine to inform all the V3.0 users about the great 
>improvements in V4.0 and inviting them to upgrade, but once again, what 
>about the people on the CONTINUING UPGRADE plan? Sure, if you bought V3.0 
>and didn't sign on with the continuing upgrade plan, then it is great 
>that Implus is giving them until October 31 to send in for the complete 
>version upgrade. But what about the CONTINUING UPGRADE people? We haven't 
>even gotten the final version of the continuing upgrade plan and October 
>is slipping away. What, we get V3.4 on October 30 and have one day to 
>decide if we want to go for the cross-platform upgrade? Trick-or-treat!
>  Besides that, yeah, its great that V3.4=V4.0 is going to have 
>metaballs, motion-blur and other new features, but what if they are buggy 
>as hell? Do we get free bug fixes or are we just stuck with what we get 
>and a choice to buy into the next version (which will be bug-free, 
>snicker, snicker, yuk, yuk)?
>  If anybody is speaking to Impulse and knows the answers to these 
>questions, I would appreciate hearing what they are.
>  And Mike H., if you are monitoring this list, maybe you could answer 
>these questions through one of your henchmen.
>
>"You know vee are monitoring zis list, vee haf all zee names, und vee are 
>carefully examining zem. Zehr gut! and Stieg Abt Schweinhund! Zieg Heil! 
>Zieg Heil!"
>
Here is a scenereo that may be of interest to you regarding this post.

Suppose Impulse seeing the demise of Commodore and of Dos had already been
thinking about the Windows version a year ago or more.  This possibility
would force them to take one of several actions.

A: Continue developing for a dying platform (Commodore), and continue
developing for Dos based version (Also dying interface).

Or:

B: Begin to develop a Windows version and drop the Amiga version.

C: Begin to develop a Windows version and continue the Amiga version.


Scenerio A of course is what has happened.  Scenerio B, would have meant no
new product features for anyone for at least a year, and Amiga people would
just have to change platforms if they wanted to stay with Impulse.  Scenereo
C would have meant that Amiga people would have been getting new features
but PC people would not, so this would probably lose a lot of PC customers.
Fact is the reasonable choice would have been A, and that is what they have
done.

If this does not seem reasonable then please feel free to challenge my logic.

Fact is Impulse has been offering a cross platform upgrade for at least a
year maybe 2.  There have been many hints in the newsletters about a
possible demise of the Amiga version, Several times I know it was stated in
the Newsletter about how Imagine literally "screams on the Pentium", and
"loves Pentium".  I don't think it would have been wise to come out and say
they would be discontinuing the Amiga version, since they were uncertain
themselves of it's future.  Every Amiga user has seen a migration of a lot
of Amiga Software to the PC over the last year.  Even if Escom were to come
out with a faster machine, the P6 will be out this year, and there is still
other platforms that could possibly running Imagine that are much faster
like Alphas.

I always try to be careful not to bash Amiga Fans or the platform because as
a PC user I know that I probably wouldn't be using Imagine today if it were
not for Amigas.  However, in reply to your statement of not having enough
time to make a decision, there has been plenty of signs warning people with
Amigas that it might be a good time to change platforms.  Regardless, any
professional on any platform looks at upgrading to a new system within one
to two years anyways simply because of the change in technology.  I started
with a 286 and every year have bought a faster machine.  Imagine is no
longer a toy and can not continue to compete in the marketplace being
marketed as a toy.  Therefore it has to follow the rest of the industry in
it's marketing strategies, which includes putting deadlines on upgrades.

Finally the remark about the gestapo tactics of Impulse, was as someone else
said completely out of line.  Any software company with a product as great
as Imagine SHOULD be worried about people pirating their software, and Mike
has every right to be concerned.  Would you rather have a dongle?  Mike has
never supported the use of Dongles but I can tell you I would not blame hime
if he started using them (Although I hope he doesn't).

By the way, there may be German citizens on this list who are completely
innocent of what happened in the past and find nothing funny about your
statements.

This is not a flame, hopefully a rational reply to your post.

Stephen g.


Date:    Tuesday, 10 October 1995 23:35:13 
Subject: Novice needs help with animation
From:    web@cvsd.cv.com (William Bogan)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I have V2.0 from the 3D modeling Labs book I purchased.
I would like to know how to use the cycle editor to
produce animations.

I have made objects, used the action editor to designate
the path for my camera and a path for the objects
to follow. What do I do next to create an animation?

Thank you for your helpful comments.

- Bill Bogan


Date:    Wednesday, 11 October 1995 04:18:17 
Subject: Re: Whops
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-10 17:08:46 EDT, you write:

>Aha! so I'm not the only one with this problem, thats a relief.
>At least Dan Maclean has experienced this very uncool message!
>He wrote:
>P.S.  What is the deal with the lotus email undeliveable message that keeps
>getting posted?  Is everyone getting that?
>
>Tom Renderbrandt

Yeah I think everyone who posts to the list is getting it.

Bob...........



Date:    Wednesday, 11 October 1995 04:18:45 
Subject: Re: About bug fixes...a possible solution.
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-10 17:19:39 EDT, you write:>Changing the topic, I am wo
ndering if Imagine 4.0 will be the last >Imagine version for DOS? In my 'glossy 
brochure' while there were>many upgrade paths from earlier versions of imagine t
o 4.0, no>mention is made about purchasing 4.0 from scratch. Also, I think>there
 will be no new manual provided with 4.0 -- docs will be on>the disk. If so, it'
ll be a sad day... there exists no program that>works faster in windows. Giving 
up speed for windows doesn't sound>fun at all...To the best of my knowledge, 4.0
 is the last dos version and I am almostpositive I read on CIS that it will have
 it's own manual.  As for the windozeversion, if it is coded correctly it could 
be a boon to most people.  It willallow the use of virtual memory and the graphi
c redraws should be quicker. But it will have to be coded correctly.  If it's ju
st a wfw 3.11 version anddoes not really take advantage of win95 or NT then it w
ill probably not be sohot to use.>>One last thing. Is there a program out there that will let you >create your own PROCEEDURAL textures? (not im
age maps, as they >take up memory, but the textures that are represented by math
ematical>expressions). If someone could tell me wher such a program is I'd be>th
ankful.>>Dave.I'm attaching a doc file I had on the drive by Scott Kirvan that e
xplains thetexture file format.  It should be of some use to you.  Steve Blackmo
n alsowrites his own textures and you might contact him for more information.Bob
.........     ------------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Wednesday, 11 October 1995 04:41:48 
Subject: Re: Wurlitzer Jukebox
From:    Bill Osuch <bosuch@intex.net>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


>-> Don't know if it was the Wurlitzer but Brad Schenk did a Diner  set o
>-> objects that included a very detailed 1950's jukebox. The objects wer
>-> Imagine format but it shouldn't be too hard to convert to Lightwave.
>-> still see the Diner set advertised here and there, mostly in Amiga
>-> magazines and I think it was selling for something like $30US.


Sorry if this has been asked and answered before...... is the Diner set
available for PC Imagine?

     - Bill
       bosuch@intex.net
       http://www.intex.net/personal/bosuch


Date:    Wednesday, 11 October 1995 04:55:26 
Subject: 3d Modelling Lab Upgrades?
From:    Perry Lucas <plucas@vt.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I have a question that I need answered about the people
that acquired imagine through the 3D modelling Lab book.

  Can they upgrade to 3.0 from this release?  In esscence
going from a $50 book to $100 upgrade for 3.0 and then
to another $100 upgrade to 4.0 for a total of $250?  Then
choosing to go to Win Imagine for an additional $200 for
a total of $450?

If so, this is going to be quite distressing on my part since
I have had Imagine since v1.0 when I purchased it for around
$250 with the two 20 page manuals to it :), upgraded to 2.0, then
3.0 with the cross platform from the amiga to IBM, and then the
constant upgrade to 4.0 (coming soon, hopefully) totalling around
$650.  Then I will be paying an additional $200 for Win Imagine 
for a grand total $850 + Shipping and handling on top of all that.
Thats quite a difference in price for us loyal folks :)

--Perry


Date:    Wednesday, 11 October 1995 07:23:55 
Subject: Re: Moan, moan, moan.
From:    "Dan Murrell Jr." <djm2@Ra.msstate.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In imagine@email.eag.unisysgsg.com on Moan, moan, moan.,
Dick Bryant - 237-6502  10-Oct-1995 1045 <bryant@tpworm.ENET.dec.com> wr=
ote
the following:

> > Ted Stethem <tstethem@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us said:
> >
> >   OK, the Glossy Brochure announcing 4.0 is extremely well-done. It=20=

> > proves that talented guys like Steve Blackmon, Tom Renderbrain, and=20=

>=20
> bitch, bitch, bitch ............

Excuse me?  That above which you quoted is bitching?

> Also from djm2@Ra.msstate.edu" "Dan Murrell Jr." 10-OCT-1995 09:35:35.=
83
Hey, that's me..=20
>=20
> >Lighten up, dude.  That was funny, not to mention accurate with a hum=
orous
> >twist.  And he did raise some valid points.  What if all the cool new=

> >features are buggy ..............
>=20
>=20
> Possibly 50% of the posts to this list are made buy professional peopl=
e who
> enjoy using Imagine and are trying to share their talent and experienc=
es with
> us. They make putting up with the bitching of people like Ted and Dan=20bearable.

_I'm_ bitching?  I'm laying out the facts dude.  Here you guys are, stil=
l
paying for
features that were promised in the product over 2 years ago.  Mike annou=
nces
one
cool feature after another, and each time around, something is either bu=
ggy or
just plain undelivered.  And y'all faithfully defend such behavior and s=
till
mail him
more money.  You guys are dopes.  As far as a professionalism question g=
oes,
you would have to be such in order to deal with Imagine's outdated inter=
face.
The word spartan comes to mind.  In 1990, it was cool when they started
drawing bevels around the buttons.  But I'm here to tell you the OS can =
draw
a beveled button a helluva lot faster, and it'll draw it on a native Pic=
asso
screen just fine, no hacks.

> Don't you guys have anything better to do than complain about somethin=
g you
> haven't even received yet ?? I think most people would find the "Hench=
men?=20
> Zieg Heil?" comments insulting and in extremely bad taste.
If I were Mike H.
> and read this kind of crap on a continual basis I might be a little ru=
de to
> some of these people also.

I haven't received it, nor plan to.  The last Impulse product I bought w=
as
2.0,
which was great for it's day.  But what enhancements in the user interfa=
ce
have
you seen since?  What's the new feature/bug ratio these days?  I have no=

personal experience, other than reading what others who are in the know =
say.
As far as insulting goes, I'd find it insulting personally if I was prom=
ised
something
years ago, paid for it, bought into their stupid upgrade plan, and eithe=
r
still=20
haven't seen it, or it doesn't work as it does on Mike's desk.  And, sur=
ely
I'm
not the only one who was insulted for a friend of mine, Steve Worley, wh=
en
Impulse _deliberately_ broke the texture formats so that his products
wouldn't work as shipped.  Steve sold a lot of copies of Imagine for the=
m, and
they treated him like shit.
=20
> If you guys don't like the product, dump it and stop tying up this
conference
> with your childish BS.

I speak maybe once a year, maybe.  Last thing I posted was a really usef=
ul
(IMO) tip for making nice starfields which I'd learned using Wavefront.
Where's your tip?
>=20
> No product is perfect. I'm sure you could spend a ton of money for oth=
er
> products and still find bugs.

I'm sure, and I notice also a lot of other products have totally free bu=
gfixes
and upgrades to registered users as well.
=20
> Grow up!
I grew up a long time ago, Dick.   With that came responsibility.  Espec=
ially
with my checkbook.  I learned a whole lot about programming Amigas.  In =
fact,
in less than a year, with a full time job, even, I'd learned how to writ=
e
totally
OS-compliant programs, BOOPSI gadgets, and all kindsa other nifty things=
..  Can
the Amiga team at Impulse say that?  They probably could.  Will they do =
it?
Obviously not.

Dan

--=20
                                        __
Sent from Danimal's AmiTCP-ing Amiga 3000/ Amigas!/Saturday morning Wrestling/
  Dan Murrell Jr.   IRC's Danimal     /// James Taylor/Pink Floyd/Roger>=
Dave!/
      djm2@ra.msstate.edu         \\\/// Imagine/Essence/AmiTCP/AMosaic/=
3Dgfx/



Date:    Wednesday, 11 October 1995 10:26:11 
Subject: Upgrades?
From:    Brian V Salisbury <bvs@viewpoint.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

On Oct 10, 11:55pm, Perry Lucas wrote:

>   Can they upgrade to 3.0 from this release?  In esscence
> going from a $50 book to $100 upgrade for 3.0 and then
> to another $100 upgrade to 4.0 for a total of $250?  Then
> choosing to go to Win Imagine for an additional $200 for
> a total of $450?
>
> If so, this is going to be quite distressing on my part since
> I have had Imagine since v1.0 when I purchased it for around
> $250 with the two 20 page manuals to it :), upgraded to 2.0, then
> 3.0 with the cross platform from the amiga to IBM, and then the
> constant upgrade to 4.0 (coming soon, hopefully) totalling around
> $650.  Then I will be paying an additional $200 for Win Imagine
> for a grand total $850 + Shipping and handling on top of all that.
> Thats quite a difference in price for us loyal folks :)
>
> --Perry


Imagine having bought Softimage a few years ago for around $30,000,
and seeing the price drop to around $8,000 now?

Really, $850 for good 3d software is peanuts. It's about time impulse raises
the price so they can afford some more programers, spend more on advertising,
print nicer manuals, brochures, attract 3rd party development, etc.

You'll never get away without paying for upgrades. $100 bucks is dirt cheap.


-- 
Brian Salisbury 
bs@viewpoint.com
(801)229-3053

"If you go flying back through time and you see somebody else flying
forward into the future, it's probably best to avoid eye contact."


Date:    Wednesday, 11 October 1995 12:01:22 
Subject: Re:moan moan and some more
From:    Ted Stethem <tstethem@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

  Just for the record, I DO NOT HATE IMAGINE! However, Impluse really 
pisses me off sometimes. For example, just before V3.3 came out, all the 
Always-Pro-Impulse people were saying, "Oh, just wait and see, V3.3 will 
have Selectable Screen Sizes!". Then V3.3 comes out, and DOH!, selectable 
screen sizes only for the Retina card. Even after screen hacks for V2.0, 
V2.9, V3.0, V3.1, and V3.2 have PROVEN that the screen size is determined 
by TWO BYTE LOCATIONS. Now, how hard is it to provide an option, in 
software, to allow different values in those locations?
  Look at the Parent button. It didn't work completely on V2.0 and people 
bitched here on the list, and it was partly fixed. It didn't work 
completely on V2.9 and people bitched here on the list and it was fixed a 
little more. And so on...and it still doesn't work completely in V3.3!
  As for the repeating brushmap "seam" bug, this has been around since 
V2.0. And Mike Halvorson has even personally responded to me on this one 
(quite awhile ago). He says it is not a bug, and to his credit, 
acknowledges it is a FUNDAMENTAL DESIGN FLAW.
  And just for your information, to the people that feel this bitching 
and moaning is offensive and serves no useful purpose,apparently you 
haven't been around very long. If you would go back in the archives a 
couple of years ago, you would find that Cut-and-Paste in the Action 
Editor was a bitch-and-moan topic for several weeks on the list, and 
guess what, NOW IT IS A FEATURE! I could tabulate feature after feature 
that you now consider an integral part of Imagine and show you where it 
was once a BITCH-and-MOAN topic. Granted, this process is not the most 
pleasant or efficient way you might think to get a feedback-response loop 
working, that has been the system for the past 2+ years.

Date:    Wednesday, 11 October 1995 14:26:00 
Subject: About bug fixes...
From:    mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com (Mike Vandersommen)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

-> From: jacob@altair.csustan.edu (Dave Jacob)->-> there will be no new manual p
rovided with 4.0 -- docs will be on-> the disk. If so, it'll be a sad day... the
re exists no program tha=t-> works faster in windows. Giving up speed for window
s doesn't sound-> fun at all...As Amiga owners have known for years, running Ima
gine under amultitasking environment is extremely handy. If render times underWi
ndows doesn't suffer, I'm all a quiver waiting for WinImagine!Mike H. indicated 
in a pointed message to me awhile back thatWinImagine will be fast and "no memor
y hog" under Windows. Crossyour fingers.-> One last thing. Is there a program ou
t there that will let you-> create your own PROCEEDURAL textures? (not image map
s, as they-> take up memory, but the textures that are represented by mathemati=
cal-> expressions). If someone could tell me wher such a program is I'd =be-> th
ankful.I think the FORGE by Steve Worley is the only program that does that,to m
y knowledge. And that's only for the Amiga (unless he is...orwill be porting it to the PC).   /------------------------------           ___   __
_  ___   ___  | Mike van der Sommen                     / __  /__/ /__/  /_   \ 
/  | Santa Barbara, Ca.                     /___/ / \  /  /  /     / \  | mike.v
andersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com     HAUS BBS (805-683-1388)  |           "Blacko
uts make for nice breaks in the day"   \________________________________________
_____________________--- =FE InterNet - GraFX Haus BBS - Santa Barbara, Ca - (80
5) 683-1388

Date:    Wednesday, 11 October 1995 14:43:20 
Subject: Viscious bug
From:    Curcio Nicholas <curcion@db.erau.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


I found this using Imagine 3.0 on my Amiga.

If this bug was known by all before, I'm sorry that I'm posting it here.
I'll make it short and to the point, unlike a lot of things on the list
these days. :}

When naming an object in the ATTRIBUTES requester, one must not have
more characters than the text field allows.  That sounds simple, BUT if one
makes multiple copies of the same object Imagine adds .1, .2, .3, etc.
I'm sure y'all already knew that.  Now, Imagine truncates your object's 
name to fit the .1, .2, etc. into the text field.  The problem comes if 
you make more than 9 copies of the object.  It tries to add another 
character to the field to get into 2 digit numbers and BOOM!  I crashed about
three times last night before I figured out what the problem was.  :(

nik


Date:    Wednesday, 11 October 1995 14:46:00 
Subject: Imagine THIS...
From:    mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com (Mike Vandersommen)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

-> From: das@altair.csustan.edu (David Alan Steiger)->-> Actually, it doesn't of
fer a phone number for questions.  It only-> gives an order line.Ahem...well at 
the risk of being unibombed, when you call the"order line" more often than not y
ou get Mike H. While the 800 numberreally is not for "tech support" (ps. it used
 to be) they have alwaysbeen more than happy to answer product info questions.->
 On the topics of bugs & features, I upgraded to 3.0 based solely o=n-> the prop
oganda they gave in their newsletter.  I think about half-> the features they me
ntioned actually were in the product, and work=ed-> correctly.  (Remember sound 
in the stage editor?)Yes, we've all grumbled a bit about "promised" 3.0 features
 stillmissing. In most cases, however, they've instead added "requested"features
 and nifty new ones that are actually more useful.-> Isn't this false advertisin
g?  Couldn't I have brought this up wit=h-> the Better Business Bureau?Sure, but
 in today's environment, the JURY would aquit them so what'sthe point?-> I didn't subscribe to the Constant Upgrade because I didn't feel I-> sh
ould pay an extra $100 to get the DXF functions promised me in 3=..0.-> I don't 
think *any* of use should have to pay anything until we ge=tt-> all the features
 advertised in the version we're paying for.I think you have always had that opt
ion, if I'm not mistaken.-> Heck, why should Impulse bother saing anything true 
about their-> product?  All they have to do is come up with an excuse and a prom
=ise-> for a newer version, and a hand out for $100.They're handing out $100????
? Where do I sign?-> I have the Color brochure, and I *still* wonder whats in 4.
0.If it will help, think of 4.0 as that Christmas when "all you wanted"was a PON
Y and you got a PUPPY instead. :)   /------------------------------           __
_   ___  ___   ___  | Mike van der Sommen                     / __  /__/ /__/  /
_   \ /  | Santa Barbara, Ca.                     /___/ / \  /  /  /     / \  | 
mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com     HAUS BBS (805-683-1388)  |           "Blackouts make for nice breaks in the day"   \__________________
___________________________________________--- =FE InterNet - GraFX Haus BBS - S
anta Barbara, Ca - (805) 683-1388

Date:    Wednesday, 11 October 1995 15:14:00 
Subject: Re: Wurlitzer Jukebox
From:    mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com (Mike Vandersommen)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

-> Sorry if this has been asked and answered before...... is the Dine=r s-> avai
lable for PC Imagine?The set was originally created on the Amiga, but fortunatly
, objectscreated in Imagine are interchangable with Amiga and PC versions.The re
al question is are they still in distribution. I could tryand contact Brad for y
ou, if you are seriously interested.ps. The last time I talked to Brad, I believ
e he still had an    account at Portal. I "THINK" his address is bws@portal.com 
   He said he doesn't check his mail too often, so its a shot    in the dark. I'
ll try and contact him voice this week.   /------------------------------       
    ___   ___  ___   ___  | Mike van der Sommen                     / __  /__/ /
__/  /_   \ /  | Santa Barbara, Ca.                     /___/ / \  /  /  /     /
 \  | mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com     HAUS BBS (805-683-1388)  |      
     "Blackouts make for nice breaks in the day"   \____________________________
_________________________________--- =FE InterNet - GraFX Haus BBS - Santa Barbara, Ca - (805) 683-1388

Date:    Wednesday, 11 October 1995 15:28:36 
Subject: 3D text in 2.0PC
From:    weiss@epx.cis.umn.edu


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Do you gurus have suggestions on how to create 3D text in version 2.0?

I have the 3D Modelling Lab book and they HAVE an example but don't
show how one gets from A to B. There doesn't appear to be any
text tool in 2.0, either.

And a comment: I understand how frustrated long time users of Imagine
might feel over 2.0 being available in a book; I have been stung
similarly with Describe for OS/2, Arcadia PIM for OS/2, and a few
others. And I wish I had the disposable income (this is only  a
starting hobby with me) for 4.0....

Thank you!!

jeff weiss


:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
jeff weiss  weiss@epx.cis.umn.edu  TCP/IP 44.94.249.101 N0IRR  612.825.4746 H  
::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::

Date:    Wednesday, 11 October 1995 17:14:48 
Subject: Re:moan moan and some more
From:    Granberg Tom <tom.granberg@TV2.no>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi Brad.
Your question about things being in 4.0 like deleting from detail is true.
These things are also new:
-Light arrays  - Soft shadows
-Motion blur
-Smoothing tool
-Smooth fracture
-Blobs
-Auto show backdrop in stage
-Use FX in detail
-Auto pick pasted objects

Later..sk

Tom Granberg



Date:    Wednesday, 11 October 1995 17:29:07 
Subject: Environment mapping
From:    greggh@dialup06.odyssey.apana.org.au (Gregory Helleren)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I've got this object which contains a large, flat mirror surface.
I would like it to reflect the objects in fron of it (no problem) and
a large environment image.

I've tried using a global brush map and then an environment map on just the
mirror part of the object. However, in both cases I only see a small,
largely magnified, view of the environment brush map. The reflections of
the foreground objects are OK. Reflective foreground objects, which are not
flat, seem to reflect the global brush map with no problems.

As I cannot adjust the axes of an environment map, I need some clues on
how I can get more of the environment map reflected?

Love Peace and spells
Gregg

--
+-----------------------------------------///\/\/\_Amiga Technologies_/\/\+
  Gregg Helleren         AMIGA is REBORN /// Lecturer Information Technology
  Developer - LaseRage                  ///  SEMC TAFE Western Australia
  Ferndale W.A. Australia ____/\___/\\\///   greggh@odyssey.apana.org.au
  CBMNET:greggh@laserage.adsp.sub.org\XX/    greggh@laserage.DIALix.oz.au
+--------------------------------------------------------------------------+



Date:    Wednesday, 11 October 1995 17:45:02 
Subject: Wish list
From:    Steven M Powell <afn27231@freenet.ufl.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I would like more time to decide on the PC version of imagine 4.0. I cant 
afford to keep updating both platforms. I only paid for the amiga 
version, with the constant-upgrade to 4.0. 

When I get 4.0 for the amiga, I would like some time to use it before I 
get the PC version. So I am asking for an extension of the PC - update 
deadline. I called and ask the same thing to Impulse, they will take it 
under consideration. So , if you support me , THEN post a message too.

I have 3.0 for the PC and 3.3 for the amiga, so I would have to pay $100 
to get 4.0 for the PC. If you're in the same boat, speak out...
I cant bitch about the price, Its just money I might not need to spend.

      render on
        Phoenix
      

Date:    Wednesday, 11 October 1995 18:25:15 
Subject: New magazine
From:    Valleyview@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Excuse me for interupting the discussion of the bugs in 4.0. I have not
gotten my version of 4.0 yet, so I can't comment on its bugs.

But I would like to say that I have just received the premiere copy of a new
3D magazine called "3D Design".  I am very impressed with the first issue.
 It is a little along the lines of "3D Artist" in that it is aimed at the 3D
modeler, renderer, and animator.  It has tutorial, tips, and hints using many
different programs.

This issue has several articles on IK. It also has features on courtroom
animation, architectural design, and a feature on a freeware metaball program
and using it with different 3D programs including Imagine.  It has the usual
product review with this issue featuring graphics boards.  There are also
regular columns on modeling, special effects (fire and smoke in this issue),
animation, tech trends, and cheap tricks.

I'm not trying to sell this magazine, just wanted to pass along what I think
is a good find.

Rick

"3D Design" - 1-800-829-2505   $29.95/year domestic subscription


Date:    Wednesday, 11 October 1995 18:46:45 
Subject: Texture mapping
From:    rvdnoord@ivg.com (Remco v.d. Noord)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi,

I'm pretty new to Imagine. My questions:

1. I have a triangular logo (2d, bitmap) and I want to wrap it up to
something. To get it transparant, color 0 black should be black, right?
But when I do this, black (of the wrap) is shown, instead of the meterial
under it.
What am I doing wrong? 
(Using PC/486 with Imagine3, bitmaps drawn by Dpaint and PhotoShop.)

2. How can I multitask with Imagine3 (using Win95)? Is there a patch or
update available?



Thanks for any help.

Remco



Date:    Wednesday, 11 October 1995 19:09:31 
Subject: LISTEN!!
From:    lumbient@superlink.net (!LuM!)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Before you read this forget your loyalty to Amigas and the fack thats we
have all been screwed by Impulse at least once! 

-------------Impulse's Image------------------
Now I want to ask everyone who has been shitting on Impulse recently:
1) Do you know a programming language?
2) Do you know Calculus?
3) Do you know linear algebra(matrices)?
4) Do you know what a vector is?
5) Do you know what a dot product is?
6) Do you what Phong shading is? The equation for phong shading?
7) Do you know what a Span is?
8) Do you know what an intersection test is?
9) Do you know what object this is: x^2 + y^2 = R?
10)Do you know about fractals?

OK, if you answered yes to all of those question, you should get 8 years of
experience making a raytracing and animation package and get a job at
Impulse.  If you don't know it all then you have no right making fun of the
lack of features or bugs in Imagine(I do it too but I've tried to stop, I
usually lose my cool when Mike writes to me, Hehe just kidding mike :).  So
please try to cut 'em slack!  Also for all those who program, you can
understand how annoying it is to debug a program like a raytracer!!!

---------------Amiga------------------
I'm sick of hearing all the amiga people mourning over it!  If Impulse wants
to pull amiga let 'em.  Buy a pentium for $1700 and let life go on.  I for
one would suppport impulse's decision to pull support.  WHY? think about it,
if imagine is focusing on programming for a single platform then the product
will get more time and would be more BUG-FREE.

-------Upgrades & Bug fixes-----------
If Impulse would just use the internet the way its supposed to then this
would be no issue!  Why can't impulse upload patches on aminet?  Or on
compuserve?  or post more info?  Impulse should utilize their resources more!

-------------SECRECTS-----------------
Impulse has too many secrets.  I asked for the texture format and the FX
format and they laughed and said no.  Its strikes me as funny that Impulse
whines that Imagine has no 3rd party support yet they refuse to give out
info.  Then several months ago they said they were releasing a developers
package that costs a lot of money.   That sounds even dumber to me!  Why
sould I pay to make Imagine more attractable?  If Imagine had thousands of
more textures and hundreds of FX's and particle systems then I could see
paying $1000 for it(even better if it had glows and lensflare!).  But
Impulse expects people to pay that for WinImagine? they must be using some
bad acid overthere!  I would rather get LW for windows(wouldn't you?)!

--------------Dongles---------------
I'll shutup now before Mike puts dongles into WinImagine to piss me off!
                                            !LuM!

|--------------------------------------------------------\
|Anyone need a great checker floor?                       \
|Lumbient@superlink.net                                   /
|----ANYONE NEED ANYTHING BLOWN UP?--$40 AN INFERNO!-----<
|I can make the most realistic chrome spheres!            \
|They look great above the checkered floor!               /
|--------------------------------------------------------/



Date:    Wednesday, 11 October 1995 19:30:06 
Subject: Re: Moan, moan, moan.
From:    sgiff@airmail.net (Stephen Gifford)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

>In imagine@email.eag.unisysgsg.com on Moan, moan, moan.,
>Dick Bryant - 237-6502  10-Oct-1995 1045 <bryant@tpworm.ENET.dec.com> wrote
>the following:
>
>> > Ted Stethem <tstethem@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us said:
>> >

>_I'm_ bitching?  I'm laying out the facts dude.  Here you guys are, still
>paying for
>features that were promised in the product over 2 years ago.  Mike announces
>one
>cool feature after another, and each time around, something is either buggy or
>just plain undelivered.  And y'all faithfully defend such behavior and still
>mail him
Thats Crap, 98% of the features work perfectly as they were created.  And
Impulse has delivered many features that they have promised.  How would you
know anyways, you never upgraded past 2.0 so where the hell do you even get
off talking about features.

>more money.  You guys are dopes.  As far as a professionalism question goes,
>you would have to be such in order to deal with Imagine's outdated interface.
>The word spartan comes to mind.  In 1990, it was cool when they started
>drawing bevels around the buttons.  But I'm here to tell you the OS can draw
>a beveled button a helluva lot faster, and it'll draw it on a native Picasso
>screen just fine, no hacks.

Who the hell cares about bevels, or how fast they draw?

>I haven't received it, nor plan to.  The last Impulse product I bought was
>2.0,
>which was great for it's day.  But what enhancements in the user interface
>have
>you seen since?  What's the new feature/bug ratio these days?  I have no
>personal experience, other than reading what others who are in the know say.
>As far as insulting goes, I'd find it insulting personally if I was promised
>something
>years ago, paid for it, bought into their stupid upgrade plan, and either
>still 

This proves what an idiot you are.  You haven't upgraded but your bitching
about features that you claim they haven't delivered.  Be specific, I'm sick
of these general bitchings that people like you make with nothing to back
them up.


>I grew up a long time ago, Dick.   With that came responsibility.  Especially
>with my checkbook.  I learned a whole lot about programming Amigas.  In fact,
>in less than a year, with a full time job, even, I'd learned how to write
>totally
>OS-compliant programs, BOOPSI gadgets, and all kindsa other nifty things.  Can


I can just hear the clammoring for more Boopsi gadgets.  Whoopi!.  Have no
idea what a Boopsi gadget is nor do I care.


S.G.


Date:    Wednesday, 11 October 1995 19:34:01 
Subject: Re: 3d Modelling Lab Upgrades?
From:    Richard Heidebrecht <rheidebr@freenet.npiec.on.ca>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

On Tue, 10 Oct 1995, Perry Lucas wrote:

> I have a question that I need answered about the people
> that acquired imagine through the 3D modelling Lab book.
> 
>   Can they upgrade to 3.0 from this release?  In esscence
> going from a $50 book to $100 upgrade for 3.0 and then
> to another $100 upgrade to 4.0 for a total of $250?  Then
> choosing to go to Win Imagine for an additional $200 for
> a total of $450?

I recently upgraded my copy of 2.0 (that came with 3d Modeling Lab) for 
$300, as offered in the back of the book.


   ~Rick Heidebrecht~



Date:    Wednesday, 11 October 1995 20:11:25 
Subject: Re: Wurlitzer Jukebox
From:    Roger Straub <straub@csn.net>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Tue, 10 Oct 1995, Bill Osuch wrote:

> 
> Sorry if this has been asked and answered before...... is the Diner set
> available for PC Imagine?
> 

ALL Imagine objects are platform independent! The only differences are in 
the BrushMap file formats, the textures, and, I think?, the Attribute 
files. Other than that, you can use ANY *.iob file on ANY platform!

>      - Bill
>        bosuch@intex.net
>        http://www.intex.net/personal/bosuch
> 
> 

See ya,
      Roger

Date:    Wednesday, 11 October 1995 20:30:26 
Subject: Re:moan moan and some more
From:    bsmith5@popd.ix.netcom.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

And maybe charging a higher price for Win4.0 will chase the people 
who've been with IMPULSE since the SILVER days away. I almost fell 
out of my chair when I saw the $1695.00 price. I wonder what full 
screen MPEG player card is included with this program. Don't get me 
wrong, I love IMAGINE and have had no complaints about IMPULSE but 
this price is rediculus. I hope IMPULSE reallizes that most people 
(not the pros using that AUTODESK program) cannot afford that kind of 
price policy. I also hope that IMPULSE would give the current 
registered user's a real good deal ( I wouldn't spend more than a 
couple of hundred). I would very much like the WINDOWS version but 
I'm afraid that I'm going to be shut out and forced to go with 
TRUESPACE to continue my hobby. Please IMPULSE don't do that to the 
loyal people that made IMPULSE (and IMAGINE) what it is today. 

Date:    Wednesday, 11 October 1995 20:55:35 
Subject: Upgrades?
From:    NEWKIRK@delphi.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Perry:
What if someone purc
h

ase



hases Imagine 3.0 now, with 

he new price of 199 from
Select Solutions, or any other retailer offering that price?  Should they
be chanstised or penalized as well?
Actually, I seem to recall that there is an upgrade option
irect from 2.0
to 4.0, and I see no reason that someone who purchased imagine in good
faith, from any source at any price, should be left out of the program now.
Joel

Date:    Wednesday, 11 October 1995 21:05:43 
Subject: TextureMap Transparency
From:    NEWKIRK@delphi.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Remco:
1:  you have to select "Use Genlock" option in the brushmap selector, then
color 0, or full black, would be rendered as a transparent portion of the
image map, allowing other surface attributes to show through.
Joel

Date:    Wednesday, 11 October 1995 22:14:48 
Subject: Re: Moan, moan, moan.
From:    Bob Arnold <barnold@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


Wasn't that Boopsi Gadget that brunette babe with the big lips and the 
short skirt on?  You know ... eyelashes, curls, the works?  I can almost 
make it out ... it's getting clearer ... wasn't it "Betsy" Boopsi?  
Whoopi Boopsie?  doggone it... it's on the tip of my tongue...   -Bob



On Wed, 11 Oct 1995, Stephen Gifford wrote:

> >In imagine@email.eag.unisysgsg.com on Moan, moan, moan.,
> >Dick Bryant - 237-6502  10-Oct-1995 1045 <bryant@tpworm.ENET.dec.com> wrote
> >the following:
> >
> >> > Ted Stethem <tstethem@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us said:
> >> >
> 
> >_I'm_ bitching?  I'm laying out the facts dude.  Here you guys are, still
> >paying for
> >features that were promised in the product over 2 years ago.  Mike announces
> >one
> >cool feature after another, and each time around, something is either buggy o
r
> >just plain undelivered.  And y'all faithfully defend such behavior and still
> >mail him
> Thats Crap, 98% of the features work perfectly as they were created.  And
> Impulse has delivered many features that they have promised.  How would you
> know anyways, you never upgraded past 2.0 so where the hell do you even get
> off talking about features.
> 
> >more money.  You guys are dopes.  As far as a professionalism question goes,
> >you would have to be such in order to deal with Imagine's outdated interface.

> >The word spartan comes to mind.  In 1990, it was cool when they started
> >drawing bevels around the buttons.  But I'm here to tell you the OS can draw
> >a beveled button a helluva lot faster, and it'll draw it on a native Picasso
> >screen just fine, no hacks.
> 
> Who the hell cares about bevels, or how fast they draw?
> 
> >I haven't received it, nor plan to.  The last Impulse product I bought was
> >2.0,
> >which was great for it's day.  But what enhancements in the user interface
> >have
> >you seen since?  What's the new feature/bug ratio these days?  I have no
> >personal experience, other than reading what others who are in the know say.
> >As far as insulting goes, I'd find it insulting personally if I was promised
> >something
> >years ago, paid for it, bought into their stupid upgrade plan, and either
> >still 
> 
> This proves what an idiot you are.  You haven't upgraded but your bitching
> about features that you claim they haven't delivered.  Be specific, I'm sick
> of these general bitchings that people like you make with nothing to back
> them up.
> 
> 
> >I grew up a long time ago, Dick.   With that came responsibility.  Especially

> >with my checkbook.  I learned a whole lot about programming Amigas.  In fact,

> >in less than a year, with a full time job, even, I'd learned how to write
> >totally
> >OS-compliant programs, BOOPSI gadgets, and all kindsa other nifty things.  Ca
n
> 
> 
> I can just hear the clammoring for more Boopsi gadgets.  Whoopi!.  Have no
> idea what a Boopsi gadget is nor do I care.
> 
> 
> S.G.
> 
> 

Date:    Wednesday, 11 October 1995 22:18:35 
Subject: Re: Wurlitzer Jukebox
From:    Bob Arnold <barnold@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


....unless they have Wraps associated, like that toothsome Williams 
racecar out in Aminet that my PeeCee version won't draw 'cuz there's a 
bazillion logos that want to be wrapped to it.  Sigh.  -Bob



On Wed, 11 Oct 1995, Roger Straub wrote:

> 
> 
> On Tue, 10 Oct 1995, Bill Osuch wrote:
> 
> > 
> > Sorry if this has been asked and answered before...... is the Diner set
> > available for PC Imagine?
> > 
> 
> ALL Imagine objects are platform independent! The only differences are in 
> the BrushMap file formats, the textures, and, I think?, the Attribute 
> files. Other than that, you can use ANY *.iob file on ANY platform!
> 
> >      - Bill
> >        bosuch@intex.net
> >        http://www.intex.net/personal/bosuch
> > 
> > 
> 
> See ya,
>     Roger
> 

Date:    Wednesday, 11 October 1995 22:55:17 
Subject: Re: Diner set
From:    Bob Arnold <barnold@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


....and here you are connected to God's Own Hard-disk, the I'net.  There 
are zillions of objects out in Aminet and they're readable on my little 
PeeCee...


On Wed, 11 Oct 1995, Bill Osuch wrote:

> On Wed, 11 Oct 1995, Roger Straub wrote:
> 
> 
> >ALL Imagine objects are platform independent! The only differences are in 
> >the BrushMap file formats, the textures, and, I think?, the Attribute 
> >files. Other than that, you can use ANY *.iob file on ANY platform!
> 
> True, BUT..... unless someone has placed those objects on a disk that's
> readable in a PC, it won't do me much good....
> 
>      - Bill
>        bosuch@intex.net
>        http://www.intex.net/personal/bosuch
> 
> 

Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 00:41:43 
Subject: Bitch, Moan, Impulse, Pirates, Amiga, Ad Nauseum
From:    NEWKIRK@delphi.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

The Following Is My Two Cents, Skip If You Don't Give A Shit.

     Regarding Lumbient's 10 questions:
I have NOT been shitting on Impulse lately, but here goes:
I know several programming languages (8)
I know calculus, differential equations, and linear algebra.
I know what vectors, dot products and cross products are,
as well as partial differential equations
I understand Phong and Gourad shading, and have equations within
arms reach for them, and also radiosity algorithms.
I know Span, intersection test, and fractals, and I recognize
the equation in two dimensions for a circle.
I agree with everything Lumby said, except his Amiga comments and LW.
     Regarding secrets:  I think developer information should be available
free/minimal charge, but anyone profiting from the sale of anything
developed with said information should pay licensing fees to Impulse.
     "Crowbar Mike" has in the past been associated with a message about
unregistered users.  I'm an unregistered owner, and not in a position
to legitimately register until I purchase 3.0, (soonsoonsoon I hope)
since my copy of Imagine 2.0 is second hand, sans paperwork, and
currently sans disks (after relocating 3 times in two years) until
I finish looking through about 75 boxes stored in my basement.
Mike is human, and is allowed to blow off steam once in a while.
Granted, the IML isn't the best place for him to do so, but as I
recall the message in question wasn't posted here by him, but rather
secondhand.  Mike also since apologised for the tone and possible
offense of the message.  I received a personal E' from him, knowing
that I am an unregistered secondhand owner, telling me to call up
or write Impulse and I can get registered.  I don't see the Ogre
here that I keep reading about, just a human being with some dreams,
who has managed to build a program and a company from them, and share them.
     Got a complaint about a feature in Imagine?  Just post it!  No need
to bitch and moan, cast aspersions, or get crude or rude.
     Got a complaint about Impulse or any particular policy or decision
they make as a business?  Just post it!  Start a conversation, not a battle.
     Regarding monitoring the list, and an Official Impulse Presence here,
Impulse would be foolish NOT to read the IML, keeping a finger to
the pulse of their customers, as it were.  An Oficial representative
on the IML would be great, but that person would be the recipient of
much of the hate mail and flames out here, and Impulse would have to
pay an employee to spend at least 20-25% of their work time reading
and responding.  This is probably not feasible right now for Impulse.
     Bug fixes:  I personally have to agree that the retention of bugs
through several revisions of a program is inexcusable.  What could
be a workable solution would be to have at least one programmer
working full time on bug-fixes, which would be made available to
registered users for the cost of shipping, or free as UUEncoded patches
through Internet E's.
     We all love new toys and goodies, but fixing current bugs comes first.
     Imagine Pirates:  Let's face it, there are probably several members
of the IML, perhaps some very regular posters, maybe even "gurus" who
user pirated copies of Imagine.  From Impulse's side, this really shouldn't
affect profits excessively, since Imagine is targeted at primarily a
professional or true hobbyist (particularly with new pricing), who are
usually willing to pay the price asked for a good program.  From the
IML's side, piracy doesn't really affect the IML:  If a pirate knows
Imagine well, and is proficient and even original in usages, then they
have something positive to contribute the the IML members.  If they
are useless leeches, they probably can't/won't contribute anything
useful.  Best tactic is just to ignore bullshit or really stupid/offensive
posts, thus weeding out jerks and making a positive statement that
SHIT WILL JUST GET FLUSHED.

OK!  If you're here, you actually read my above sermon, thank you for
you time and e-mail space.
If you have any comments or flames that would be generally useless to
other IML'ers, feel free to send them directly to me at:
NewKirk@Delphi.com  or
102627.1152@compuserve.com
I Hereby formally apologize for the bandwidth consumed by this post.
I promise to never post $2 worth of my two cents again.
Joel NewKirk
Riverside, NJ
(609)461-5348


Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 01:14:15 
Subject: AutoPEG 2.0 now on Aminet
From:    NewKirk <102627.1152@compuserve.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

AutoPEG v2.0 is now available on Aminet, at:
Aminet:/gfx/conv/autopeg20.lha
It only supports '020 & up now.  
Many new options were added, as well as a GUI preferences editor.
AP2 can now be set to work only with a specified task (IE 'imagine')
and has some great new options for IM renderers:
JPEGS can be decoded to 24IFF's in T: (or any selected ddirectory)
and allowed to remain, and when the same image is requested again
(next frame? duplicate object?) AP2 redirects Imagine to the already
decoded image, saving lots of time.  AutoPEG will NOT work with ADPro,
for some reason, but the task selection feature bypasses any problems.
It also works well with POV-Ray, and every other program I've tried it 
with (except of course other JPEG decoders, they get frustrated).
The only problem I've encountered with it is when I have multiple
Imagine's running simultaneously, I can't predict which task it will
or will not work with.  This is apparently due to the way Intuition
returns 'Find.Task" from exec.library.
I cannot reccommend this program enough for any Amiga Imagine user.
John Corigliano, the author, just told me that Amiga Computing magazine
wants to include it on an upcoming coverdisk.
Later on, happy rendering
joel


Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 02:55:26 
Subject: Re: Moan, moan, moan.
From:    sgiff@airmail.net (Stephen Gifford)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


>> Thats Crap, 98% of the features work perfectly as they were created.  And
>> Impulse has delivered many features that they have promised.  How would you
>> know anyways, you never upgraded past 2.0 so where the hell do you even get
>> off talking about features.
>
>I don't get off, I read this list.  And I see people complaining.  Look at
>what you
>just said.  "Impulse has delivered many features that they have promised." 
>How
>man?  How many not?  The key point, is that they promised features, sold the
>product based on those promises, and didn't come through.
>
The point IS that you and other like you choose to focus on the 1% they
don't deliver instead of being happy with what they have delivered.  There
are at least a hundred features since 2.0 including some major bug fixes in
the last version 3.3 and all because they were listening to users.  Would
you rather have Impulse not say anything about new features they are
planning that no one could bitch when something doesn't make it into an
upgrade.  They put in every feature they can get finished in time.  The
problem is that you can't satisfy every user, and to some people nothing is
ever good enough.  Like someone said before, no one is forcing anyone to
continue buying their product.  There is nothing wrong with expressing anger
if something doesn't get fixed after a while.  But this generalized bitching
about how nothing ever gets fixed or new features never get implemented is
ridiculus.


Question?:

Could someone please tell me what the States (Object Props) feature does
when creating a new State?  I have not found any info on it.  Also I am
trying to animate the little 7-up Spot guy sucking liquid up a straw.  The
straw is curvy more like a tube for siphoning gas, I want to make it look
like their is liquid going up the tube.  Has anyone ever tried this?

Stephen.


Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 03:23:55 
Subject: Modeller
From:    augioh4b@ibmmail.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

--- Received from GITD.PSG024  2164526              12OCT95  16.20
  -> IBMMAIL.INTERNET      IBMMAIL
Hi all,

Just like to thank the person, can't remember who, that posted
the docs for writing your own textures...terrific], but errr....I
only have version 2, will that work also since the doc is for
V3.0?

Also, I want to know wether there are any good modellers out
there that can import directly to Imagine...that is shareware and
cheap] I'm trying to create some smooth organig type of objects,
splines,
and whatevers but is very difficult to do in V2.

I noticed NEWKIRK having lots of knowledge relating to the engine
of rendering...have you made any progs to make life easier, like
modellers,etc?

....and MAN talk about bitching in IML]]...let's do something
productive for this Package and mailing list, something Positive]
Like I see alot of good renditions out there, let's say someone
post a picture accessible to us imagineers and see who can best
match that picture using Imagine, where the original picture
being a real world scene like the cobble streets of Germany,
a roulette table, a gardening shed...something that will gear our
minds, share a common topic, and then share some knowledge of
how one has tackled a problem (eg. what ior used for this window
or pool of water).  Let's see who really mastered Imagine...
and push their abilities to the limit.

Cheerio,
Vic.

Ps...please don't flame me, I may have contradicted myself for
bitching also, but hey let's do something fun and creative...
(with what we have).


Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 04:32:39 
Subject: Re: Upgrades?
From:    Perry Lucas <plucas@vt.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 07:55 PM 10/11/95 -0400, NEWKIRK@delphi.com wrote:
>Perry:
>What if someone purchaseses Imagine 3.0 now, with 
>he new price of 199 from
>Select Solutions, or any other retailer offering that price?  Should they
>be chanstised or penalized as well?
>Actually, I seem to recall that there is an upgrade option
>irect from 2.0
>to 4.0, and I see no reason that someone who purchased imagine in good
>faith, from any source at any price, should be left out of the program now.
>Joel

I was not speaking of chanstising anyone for the price they were purchasing
Imagine at.  I would have been upset if someone could upgrade for $400 less 
by purchasing Imagine via a $50 purchase plus another $100 for the upgrade.
Which is untrue from what I have seen from other users replying to my comments.
To upgrade from the 3d modeling lab version of 2.0 to 3.0 it is a $300 upgrade
fee and not a $100 fee that the rest of us had.  Thus making it fair to those 
of us who have been with the company longer.

--Perry


Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 05:22:45 
Subject: Re: Diner set
From:    Bill Osuch <bosuch@intex.net>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

On Wed, 11 Oct 1995, Roger Straub wrote:


>ALL Imagine objects are platform independent! The only differences are in 
>the BrushMap file formats, the textures, and, I think?, the Attribute 
>files. Other than that, you can use ANY *.iob file on ANY platform!

True, BUT..... unless someone has placed those objects on a disk that's
readable in a PC, it won't do me much good....

     - Bill
       bosuch@intex.net
       http://www.intex.net/personal/bosuch


Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 06:32:43 
Subject: Re: Moan, moan, moan.
From:    "Dan Murrell Jr." <djm2@Ra.msstate.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In imagine@email.eag.unisysgsg.com on Moan, moan, moan.,
sgiff@airmail.net (Stephen Gifford) wrote the following:

> Thats Crap, 98% of the features work perfectly as they were created.  =
And
> Impulse has delivered many features that they have promised.  How woul=
d you
> know anyways, you never upgraded past 2.0 so where the hell do you eve=
n get
> off talking about features.

I don't get off, I read this list.  And I see people complaining.  Look =
at
what you
just said.  "Impulse has delivered many features that they have promised=
.."=20
How
man?  How many not?  The key point, is that they promised features, sold=
 the
product based on those promises, and didn't come through.

> >drawing bevels around the buttons.  But I'm here to tell you the OS c=
an draw
> >a beveled button a helluva lot faster, and it'll draw it on a native =
Picasso
> >screen just fine, no hacks.
>=20
> Who the hell cares about bevels, or how fast they draw?

That was just a quick example of how they disregard OS features.  The buttons.
They were drawing OS 1.3 gadgets, and drawing a bevel around them on the=
ir
own, instead of just saying, give me a current OS gadget.  On a current =
OS
screen.  Here's another quick example.  Why open a hardcoded sized scree=
n,
when you can just ask the OS/user for the size they want?  Like it's bee=
n
noted
for years, it's just two magic locations.  A width and a height, stored
somewhere
where folks who are dissatisfied have to manually edit the binary to hav=
e a=20
screen that's appropriate for them.  It's rediculously easy to use a sta=
ndard
ASL Screen requester to get that.

> This proves what an idiot you are.  You haven't upgraded but your bitc=
hing
> about features that you claim they haven't delivered.  Be specific, I'=
m sick
> of these general bitchings that people like you make with nothing to b=
ack
> them up.

How is that proving that I'm an idiot?  It just proves that I can read w=
hat
others
say.  As for examples, off the top of my head.  The standard screenmode
requester,
there's one.  That was supposed to be for the guys with the high-priced
monitors
who wanted to model in 1280=D71024 resolutions instead of 640=D7400.  Ma=
ybe even
a 256 color screen, so that the solid modeling preview gave a more accur=
ate
view,
instead of the 16 level greyscale that they always used.  There was that=

really cool
animation format with the synchronized sound, so that you could practica=
lly
make
your own animated movies wih sound effects.  That works pretty good, huh=
?  How
about being able to see what frame rate that quick anim was running, ins=
tead
of
guessing at it in that unlabeled slider bar?
=20
> I can just hear the clammoring for more Boopsi gadgets.  Whoopi!.  Hav=
e no
> idea what a Boopsi gadget is nor do I care.

Assuming you're an Amiga owner, you probably know about a ton of BOOPSI
gadgets.  That's what MUI is.  Impulse could have easily made a BOOPSI
gadget out of their top/right/front views.  Then, on a modern OS screen,
you could have had multiple views, in multiple windows, at multiple angl=
es,
etc. etc.  They could have used that really nice colorwheel gadget that =
comes
with OS 3.0 for defining colors and stuff.  That's BOOPSI.  They wouldn'=
t
have had to program anything themselves, just check the settings of the
gadget when the user clicked OK.  Their little preview window could be a=

BOOPSI gadget, or they could have just used the animation datatype which=

is essentially the same thing.  What's the binary size nowadays, 1 meg? =
 If=20
they properly utilized the OS, it could be only 500k.  There're a lot of=

features
the OS gives you for free, and they'd then have much more time to worry
with the rendering engine and other things. =20

How did I become the bad guy all of sudden?  All I did was defend Ted be=
cause
he had some valid points, AND a witty take on something Mike said a coup=
le
weeks
ago, about checking up on people who posted=20to this list.  Grow up, go render=20
yourself a sense of humor, and quit looking for a fight.

Dan

--=20
                                        __
Sent from Danimal's AmiTCP-ing Amiga 3000/ Amigas!/Saturday morning Wres=
tling/
  Dan Murrell Jr.   IRC's Danimal     /// James Taylor/Pink Floyd/Roger>=
Dave!/
      djm2@ra.msstate.edu         \\\/// Imagine/Essence/AmiTCP/AMosaic/=
3Dgfx/



Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 08:19:05 
Subject: The last thing about the moan
From:    Granberg Tom <tom.granberg@TV2.no>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Ted you wrote among other things:
  Just for the record, I DO NOT HATE IMAGINE! However, Impluse really 
pisses me off sometimes. For example, just before V3.3 came out, all the 
Always-Pro-Impulse people were saying, "Oh, just wait and see, V3.3 will 
have Selectable Screen Sizes!". Then V3.3 comes out, and DOH!, selectable 
screen sizes only for the Retina card. Even after screen hacks for V2.0, 
V2.9, V3.0, V3.1, and V3.2 have PROVEN that the screen size is determined 
by TWO BYTE LOCATIONS. Now, how hard is it to provide an option, in 
software, to allow different values in those locations?
-----------------------------------------

It's true that talking about ideas,bugs,featurette's that should be there are a 

furtile thing indeed, but being RUDE!! or BITCHY!!, or SOMETHING ELSE, THAT ARE 

A LITTLE RUDER OR SOMETHING COMPLETLY DIFFERENT!!! say, like a bucket of nails?!
 
doesnt realy help does it? 

Tom Granberg


Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 08:36:30 
Subject: Restoring my confidence
From:    expgxs@cascade.santos.com.au (Greg Searle)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

   Greetings fellow imagineers.

   Thankyou all for helping me try to get in in touch
with Impulse to upgrade from 3.0 to 4.0 via e-mail.I 
have sent a request to them in this regard. No response yet
after almost a week. No broucher or order form delivered
either. Well I'm going to have to make an international
phone call which is a last resort I did not want to or expect
to do as a registered user of Imagine 3.0.

   Seeing that others on this list are also in the same
position in not recieving any brochure etc. I wonder if
Impulse want us to upgrade. I will not upgrade for US$299
which is approx $400 Australian. However US$100-$120 is
reasonable considering that I use an Amiga and Imagine
seems to be a PC DOS port to the Amiga, rather than a
product developed seperately for both machines.

   I hope that Impulse will change this policy for those
that have not recieved any brochure well before this date.
If not then I see Impulse loosing many customers of future
versions including myself. The upgrade from 2.0 to 3.0 was
a large leap for Imagine. Going from 3.0 to 4.0 is not.
Also an expirey date for upgrading for US$100 is bad
customer relations, especialy given the small time available.

  Even though I've been on this list a few weeks, I am getting
the feeling there is a hostility between Impulse and some users.
I get the feeling that they want to abandon the Amiga users who
make 25% of thier costomer base and are loyal to the product.
I get the feeling that registered users are not well supported 
as I thought they would be. I get the feeling some users think
we should bow to Impulse and that they have the worlds greatest
3d renderer. I get the feeling after reading what has transpired
on this list and Impulses upgrade offer I have mentioned above 
that mabey all my beliefs in Imagine and Impulse have been
misplaced.

  Some on this list think that we Amiga users should just buy
a Pentium to use Imagine istead of bitching about why don't
Impulse bring out an Amiga specific version. Well would you
move over to the Amiga if an Amiga specific version was being
brought out that had all the Amiga specific features that
Lightwave has (ie Arexx, Modular design for third party addons,
eg. sparks, impact etc. Amiga standard interface requestors,
dialog boxes, gadgets etc) and no windows version?

  Of course not. You would have allready so much other software
and hardware that you have invested on your machine and its setup.
It would not simply be bying another machine, but looking for and
bying a whole new suite of software and hardware as well which
would add even more cost. I was going to buy a pentium to act as
a rendering engine for imagine. I may still do this and then compile
and generate animations on my Amiga as this is where all the best
and cheapest animation software exists and of which I have. So stop
telling Amiga users to switch platforms. I haven't seen anyone 
telling you lot to do so because your machines still use an outdated
operating system and computer architecture. No platform wars please.

   This brings me to the question of why would Impulse abandon 25%
of its user base?(ie Amiga users) Considereing that Amigas in use
today are ~2-3million (optimistic) compared with ~ 50 million PCs
and Amigas make up 1/4 of Impulses customers, It is an extrordinary
figure. If the no. of PC to Amiga were reversed, this would mean
the ratio of Amiga users to PC could be 16/1 or more. If Impulse
did bring out an Amiga specific version, then the no of sales would
be greater as it then would be considered as a truely professional
tool for the Amiga. Alas it is not, and Lightwave and real3d have stolen
the spotlight. Oh I forgot. Imagine on the Amiga seems to be a PC DOS
port.

  Impulse from what has transpired on this list and especialy the
expirey date given for updating to 4.0 seem to me now to show that
Impulse treat its customers with little respect. Especilally Amiga
users. I'm not bitchin, I'm just commenting on what I have observed
here. This perception I currently have of Impulse not having good
customer relations will be decided upon it's response to us
registered users who have not recieved a broucher or as such, and
if the expirery date for US$100 upgrade to be therefore wavered.

  If not, I will use 3.0 until I really need something more 
than what it offers, and then regretably purchase something else.
Imagine has great potential to be as good as alias, wavefront and
others or better. I therefore want to stay with Imagine.

  So If You are reading this Impulse, please Post a message on this
list for those of us registered users that have not recieved a brochure/
order form on the procedure to follow to upgrade to 4 from 3. There
seem to be many of us, and we want to upgrade but not for US$299. My
current perception of you will then be unfounded.

All the best

  GREG SEARLE.

So many worlds. So much to do. So little done. Such things to be.


Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 08:51:55 
Subject: Re: 3d Modelling Lab Upgrades?
From:    Ted Stethem <tstethem@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


  Select Solutions is selling Imagine 3.0 for the PC and the Amiga for 
$199.99.


On Wed, 11 Oct 1995, Richard Heidebrecht wrote:

> On Tue, 10 Oct 1995, Perry Lucas wrote:
> 
> > I have a question that I need answered about the people
> > that acquired imagine through the 3D modelling Lab book.
> > 
> >   Can they upgrade to 3.0 from this release?  In esscence
> > going from a $50 book to $100 upgrade for 3.0 and then
> > to another $100 upgrade to 4.0 for a total of $250?  Then
> > choosing to go to Win Imagine for an additional $200 for
> > a total of $450?
> 
> I recently upgraded my copy of 2.0 (that came with 3d Modeling Lab) for 
> $300, as offered in the back of the book.
> 
> 
>    ~Rick Heidebrecht~
> 
> 
> 

Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 09:01:09 
Subject: Making animations
From:    pleatman@one.net


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


I tried doing some animation for the first time last night.  Finally
found the energy.  Man, looking through that manual is frustrating... :)

Anyway, I generated 30 frames, and did the make option.  I had the 
imagine type set from the modify screen.  It went and  opened up three 
screens, and started making anim.xxx files.  When it was done, I had 30
or so of those.  Now what is suppose to happen.  There was a script file
in the anim directory. What is that.  

By the way, I am using a cybervision card.

Also, I changed the animation type to anim, and did the generate again, 
and it built a anim file.  I then told it to run it and it did, though
slowly.  Then I told it to run it coninuously, and it did, and would never
stop.  I suspect the cybervison card is creating some problems, but I was
wondering how you make it stop, other than turning the computer off.

Since it was accessing the disk the whole time, I was not thrilled by 
this but  there weren't many options.  I thought in the manual it said
it loaded this into memory, did this change at some point? 

All this being said.  What is the prefered way for me to make a animation,
considering I guess the fact I have a cv card.  

thanks for any help.

bob

p.s.  I am sorry now that I asked about the banding awhile back.  I didn't
mean to start a war :(   

Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 09:09:42 
Subject: Imagine in the UK ?
From:    Toby Edwards <tobs@perihelion.co.uk>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Can anyone tell me where I can get hold
of Imagine in UK, or should I contact Imagine
directly ?

I have tried going through several mags but I have
been unable to find any adverts/suppliers. I am using
the coverdisk Amiga V2, no manual, unregistered etc
and hope to swap over to PC v3.0 ? (or is it 4.0 
now <ducking> ?).


Thank you for any help

Toby   :-ss)

tobs@perihelion.co.uk

======================================================

If we can measure the speed of light, why cant we
measure the speed of darkness ?  Does it just sit
there and wait for us to turn the light on ?!?  Where
does it go when we turn the light on ??!!

======================================================




Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 09:09:42 
Subject: Imagine in the UK ?
From:    Toby Edwards <tobs@perihelion.co.uk>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Can anyone tell me where I can get hold
of Imagine in UK, or should I contact Imagine
directly ?

I have tried going through several mags but I have
been unable to find any adverts/suppliers. I am using
the coverdisk Amiga V2, no manual, unregistered etc
and hope to swap over to PC v3.0 ? (or is it 4.0 
now <ducking> ?).


Thank you for any help

Toby   :-ss)

tobs@perihelion.co.uk

======================================================

If we can measure the speed of light, why cant we
measure the speed of darkness ?  Does it just sit
there and wait for us to turn the light on ?!?  Where
does it go when we turn the light on ??!!

======================================================


Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 09:41:03 
Subject: Re: AutoPEG 2.0 now on Aminet
From:    Mike McCool <mikemcoo@efn.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hey guy, 

      Thanks a heap for this tip.  I got the earlier version, and I do 
love it.  Sounds like this one's an upgrade worth upgrading to.  

Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 10:01:27 
Subject: Re: 3D text in 2.0PC
From:    cjo@esrange.ssc.se


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Jeff Weiss wrote;

>Do you gurus have suggestions on how to create 3D text in version 2.0?

Ok. Everybody remember this. From now on I am a guru!    ;)

Use a paint program to make a bitmap of the text that you wish to make a 3d=
=20
modell of. Remember to fill the letters, ie do not make them outlines.

Go into Imagine's detail editor. Select import bitmap in the objects menu=20
and use the file that you just created with the paint program.

Pick the outline that you just made and extrude it 100 units.

Create a primitive plane with a lot of faces. Position it so that it cuts=20
your extruded outline in half.

Pick both objects. Slice them.

If the slice doesn't work the first time try moving one of the objects just=
=20
a tiny bit in one direction and try slice again. Repeat until successful.

Now you should have 5 objects, one axis (that the other four objects are=20
grouped to), one front and one back peice of your outline object, one=20
plane-part that is outside the outline and one plane-part that is inside.=20
The inside plane part is the thingy that you are after. Delete the other=20
objects. (Don't delete the axis from pick groups mode unless you have=20
ungrouped the objects.)

Hmm, was that all it took to become a guru?

*---------------------------------------------------------------*
|   Conny Joensson   |   Swedish Space Corp. Esrange            |
|   Kiruna           |   Satellite operations - Telecom Div.    |
|   Sweden           |   cjo@smtpgw.esrange.ssc.se              |
*---------------------------------------------------------------*

Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 10:02:00 
Subject: Re: Fitting Text to a circular path....
From:    Bill Boyce <bilboyce@iconz.co.nz>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 09:34 AM 12/10/95 EST, you wrote:
>     This questions is probably most suited for Tom Granberg...
>     
>     In three of the images on the Imagine 4 brochure have text laid in a 
>     circle.
>     
>     How is this done, is it done in Imagine??? 
>     
>     Thanks,
>     
>     Ryan.
>
Align to path seems the obvious answer ...

Bill Boyce


Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 10:25:09 
Subject: RE:Text in a circle
From:    Granberg Tom <tom.granberg@TV2.no>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi
The question is realy easy to answer, and here it is, yuppi something creative 
on this list after yet another frequent "war"...War, da, dada, what is it good 
for, da, da, da, absolutly nothing, da, da, da,.....come on, sing along with 
me. War, da, dada, what is it.........

Make a text in the spline editor and go to detail. Make a circle(disk) the size 

you would prefer, and move the line of text to a pos. where the first letter of 

the text is aligned on the top edge of the circle. Now the first letter's axis 
should be on the same X position as the circle, seen from the front view. Pick 
the first letter, Move the axis to the center of the circle(disk). This is 
basicly the way you do it. So the next letter you would move in x until it meets
 
up with the circle(disk) x axis alignment and do the same as I did with the 
first letter.
Hopes this makes sense, if not dont hesitate to ask again.

Later..Sk

Tom Granberg "Renderbrandt"

Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 10:34:13 
Subject: Fitting Text to a circular path....
From:    RYAN_JOHNSON@wallaby.oz.sas.com (RYAN JOHNSON)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

     This questions is probably most suited for Tom Granberg...
     
     In three of the images on the Imagine 4 brochure have text laid in a 
     circle.
     
     How is this done, is it done in Imagine??? 
     
     Thanks,
     
     Ryan.

Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 10:48:16 
Subject: Preference: Brushes or Textures
From:    David Alan Steiger <das@ceti.csustan.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi all,

I'm curious, which do you prefer overall, bitmaps or procedural
textures.  I know that each are best for specific purposes, but
I'm interested in simple preference.

      For instance, I rarely touch the 3.0 textures.  It's 
been too difficult to get a "handle" on the parameters of so 
many files.  I can't intuitively say, "Hey, this added with that
would be perfect."  Experimenting is too difficult because there
are so many textures.
      I'm not complaining!  Far from it!  I'm happy that we have
such a strong resource.  TrueSpace 2.0 only has three such textures!
      The difficulty for me, is that I'm too impatient!  I just 
can't wait to render every experiment.  Some of those textures are
pretty complex.  I had the pix with the textured spheres, but those
are only one parameter setting for each texture.  I can't get a
handle on the variations possible.
      But on the other hand, I am an artist (BA in Studio Art soon,
hope hope!), so hand-drawing bitmaps maybe isn't the difficulty for me
that it may be to others.  My renderings are usually small or simple,
so my 8megs is usually enough for any bitmaps.  So I tend to optimize
for speed.

      Also, I've been working on algorithmic art programs in AMOS
(an Amiga language).  My friends like to use the bitmaps for their
Windows backdrops!  But they can be useful for brushes.

      So my question is, why do you use them?  For memory, or to
avoid painting textures?

Dave

------------------/-------------------------------------/---------------------
David Steiger    / CSU Stanislaus / Computer Artist,   / If you can read this,
das@csustan.edu /  CS/Art major  /  Slipshod Software /  I'm procrastinating!
--------------------------------/---------------------------------------------


Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 12:13:58 
Subject: 2.0 PC File conversion
From:    weiss@epx.cis.umn.edu


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Are there any 'gotchas' with  the importation of tiff files into
Imagine 2.0 PC from PICMAN or other programs? I tried to 
convert a 24 bit and an 8 bit grayscale text image and no
image appeared to have been brought in, just a few lines.

I was thinking to create text elsewhere and convert it into
Imagine in tiff format (only permissible format for import?) and then
extrude it. Not any luck.

The faqs I've seen, and some of the tools on the web, don't appear to
be covering this old version....
Thanks,

jeffrey weiss


:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
jeff weiss  weiss@epx.cis.umn.edu  TCP/IP 44.94.249.101 N0IRR  612.825.4746 H  
::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::

Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 12:25:33 
Subject: Re: Fitting Text to a circular path....
From:    cjo@esrange.ssc.se


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

>>This questions is probably most suited for Tom Granberg...=20
>>In three of the images on the Imagine 4 brochure have text laid in a circ=
le.
>>How is this done, is it done in Imagine???

>Align to path seems the obvious answer ...

That depends.

I've done it couple of times myself and I have used "conform to cylinder".
It works great. Unless of course you want some other shape than a circle.=20
Then I too would suggest "conform to path".

The thing about conforming to cylinders or spheres though is that I haven't=
=20
found an intuitive way of understanding what the two paramerters should be.
Ok, cylinder radius is pretty straight forward, but object width? :-?

*---------------------------------------------------------------*
|   Conny Joensson   |   Swedish Space Corp. Esrange            |
|   Kiruna           |   Satellite operations - Telecom Div.    |
|   Sweden           |   cjo@smtpgw.esrange.ssc.se              |
*---------------------------------------------------------------*

Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 12:46:27 
Subject: Re: Moan, moan, moan.
From:    cjo@esrange.ssc.se


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

ENOUGH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:-(

*---------------------------------------------------------------*
|   Conny Joensson   |   Swedish Space Corp. Esrange            |
|   Kiruna           |   Satellite operations - Telecom Div.    |
|   Sweden           |   cjo@smtpgw.esrange.ssc.se              |
*---------------------------------------------------------------*

Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 13:09:00 
Subject: Miscellanious
From:    milan@Gent.hku.nl (Milan Polle)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi all, 

I have to appologise, some time ago I complained that fountains and sparks
couldn't be done with Imagine's particle effect. And indeed I had tried it
with no luck at all. Imagine my surprise when I tried it again yesterday
(same Imagine, same computer) and everything work just fine, great sparks/
explosions/fountains/emissions etc. I can
(oops) I can't wait for 4.0's motion blur (hope it blur's objects and not
whole frames, but I guess that would be too complicated).
People are right about the fact that complaining about missing features
is neccesary (unfortunatly), it does seem to help.
Also if Impulse is making a windows version, they should make an stylguide
conform Amiga version. Imagine doesn't look and feel professional like this.
Even most of the PD programs today are completely stylguide conform.
Drop Kick 1.x support, 2.0 roms are dirt cheap.
Another thing is open architecture, please support as much plug-in types
as possible and publish the format on Aminet. Don't make the same mistake
C= did, we all know what happened. Also publish the effects (and global fx
and light textures) format, the more PD support for Imagine the better.
People will buy programs that have great third party support, also because
the name Imagine will be seen much more everywhere. And PLEASE PLEASE
support ARexx, it is no luxury, it is standard on the Amiga, go with your
time. And the bumpmap-seam-bug, you cannot do a thing like that, it is
extremely unprofessional. Also promising all sorts of features and not
delivering (like with the 3.0 advertising), is indeed probably illegal.
And yes, I know how a tracer works and the math's and programming, but
I am not selling a tracer worldwide.
I love Imagine, otherwhise I would leave Impulse for what it is and buy
another package. Impulse needs to know what is going on in the market,
otherwhise they will follow C=.

Just my POV (point of view), no flames intended.

Milan (milan@bmt.hku.nl)




Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 13:54:00 
Subject: Texture mapping
From:    mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com (Mike Vandersommen)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

-> From: rvdnoord@ivg.com (Remco v.d. Noord)-> 1. I have a triangular logo (2d, 
bitmap) and I want to wrap it up =to-> something. To get it transparant, color 0
 black should be black, r=igh-> But when I do this, black (of the wrap) is shown
, instead of the m=ete-> under it.-> What am I doing wrong?-> (Using PC/486 with
 Imagine3, bitmaps drawn by Dpaint and PhotoShop=..)Wait...wait! No one answer. 
I know this one, I KNOW THIS ONE!Turn GENLOCK button on in the brush map menu.->
 2. How can I multitask with Imagine3 (using Win95)? Is there a pat=ch-> update 
available?Nupe. Can't. You'll need Imagine for Windows coming soon to a nearbyth
eater.   /------------------------------           ___   ___  ___   ___  | Mike 
van der Sommen                     / __  /__/ /__/  /_   \ /  | Santa Barbara, C
a.                     /___/ / \  /  /  /     / \  | mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.
silcom.com     HAUS BBS (805-683-1388)  |           "Blackouts make for nice bre
aks in the day"   \_____________________________________________________________--- =FE InterNet - GraFX Haus BBS - Santa Barbara, Ca - (805) 68
3-1388

Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 14:16:00 
Subject: Fitting Text to a circula
From:    mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com (Mike Vandersommen)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

->->      This questions is probably most suited for Tom Granberg...->->      In
 three of the images on the Imagine 4 brochure have text la=id->      circle.->-
>      How is this done, is it done in Imagine???Use the conform to cylindar com
mand then play with the numericalsettings.   /------------------------------    
       ___   ___  ___   ___  | Mike van der Sommen                     / __  /__
/ /__/  /_   \ /  | Santa Barbara, Ca.                     /___/ / \  /  /  /   
  / \  | mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com     HAUS BBS (805-683-1388)  |   
        "Blackouts make for nice breaks in the day"   \_________________________
____________________________________--- =FE InterNet - GraFX Haus BBS - Santa Ba
rbara, Ca - (805) 683-1388

Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 14:19:00 
Subject: TextureMap Transparency
From:    mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com (Mike Vandersommen)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

-> 1:  you have to select "Use Genlock" option in the brushmap select=or,-> colo
r 0, or full black, would be rendered as a transparent portion= of-> image map, 
allowing other surface attributes to show through.BTW, even Lightwave 4.0 does n
ot have this feature.....and theyall wish they did!! Neener, needer. :)   /-----
-------------------------           ___   ___  ___   ___  | Mike van der Sommen 
                    / __  /__/ /__/  /_   \ /  | Santa Barbara, Ca.             
        /___/ / \  /  /  /     / \  | mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com     
HAUS BBS (805-683-1388)  |           "Blackouts make for nice breaks in the day"
   \_____________________________________________________________--- =FE InterNe
t - GraFX Haus BBS - Santa Barbara, Ca - (805) 683-1388

Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 14:46:37 
Subject: Re: Sound feature
From:    Steven M Powell <afn27231@freenet.ufl.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


What about - shadows in scanline too


On Thu, 12 Oct 1995 wilmart@ifh.sncf.fr wrote:

> 
> Imagine release 3.0 announced synchronized sounds in anim. This feature
> is not in Imagine 4.0. 
> 
> Why?
> 
> I you have some problems to implement this feature, tell us which ones?
> 
> 

Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 15:06:48 
Subject: 2 more cents on bitching & moaning
From:    jprusins@cybergrafix.com (John Prusinski)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

OK, OK, I can't resist jumping in!

I think we all agree that Imagine has a lot to offer, otherwise why would we 
bother being on this list.  It would be hard to argue also that the program 
and the software company are perfect in every way (far from it in some ways!)  
Which leaves the question of whether it's worthwhile using up bandwidth 
"bitching and moaning" about our gripes and/or our gripes about other 
people's griping!  I realize that there are those who pay more for their 
email and thus are upset with receiving mail which is not directly useful to 
their concerns, but I have a feeling they are in the minority.  Personally, 
I think this kind of heated discussion adds a lot to the list, if only in 
entertainment value!  It's a great reminder that all these electronic bits 
and bytes of info originate in human minds, with all their messy, organic, 
reptile attributes.  This list has more personality than any other I read!  
Not that I don't count on the list primarily for tips, tricks, & hard info, 
but it would sure be a lot more boring without some occasional shouting! =:-E)=

John
________________________________________________
|  "The next great step toward a planetary holism is a     |
|    partial merging of the technologically transformed    |
|    human world with the archaic matrix of vegetable     |
|    intelligence that is the Overmind of the planet."        |
|                                                    -Terence McKenna         |
|_______________________________________________| 


Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 15:11:41 
Subject: RE: Restoring my confidence
From:    Douglas.D.E.F.Smith@Woodford.avro.bae.eurokom.ie


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

FROM too long. Original FROM is 'Douglas Smith 0161-439-5050x4084 <Douglas.D.E.F
.Smith@Woodford.avro.bae.eurokom.ie>'

----------------------  Original Message Follows  ----------------------

Greg Searle  (expgxs@cascade.santos.com.au) Wrote,

>
>   Seeing that others on this list are also in the same
>position in not recieving any brochure etc. I wonder if
>Impulse want us to upgrade. 

Consider that the people on this list represent only a tiny
fraction of Imagine users. Mike H doesn't believe in advertising.
I think there are going to be quite a few people with their noses
put out when they find out the've missed the upgrade deadline.

>I will not upgrade for US$299
>which is approx $400 Australian. However US$100-$120 is
>reasonable considering that I use an Amiga and Imagine
>seems to be a PC DOS port to the Amiga, rather than a
>product developed seperately for both machines.
>

I hope you've just expressed this a bit clumsily, Imagine 
started out on the Amiga, and has only relatively recently been
ported to DOS.

>   I hope that Impulse will change this policy for those
>that have not recieved any brochure well before this date.
>If not then I see Impulse loosing many customers of future
>versions including myself. The upgrade from 2.0 to 3.0 was
>a large leap for Imagine. Going from 3.0 to 4.0 is not.
>Also an expirey date for upgrading for US$100 is bad
>customer relations, especialy given the small time available.
>

What time available, there isn't any.

I like to see a review of a product before I buy it.
I like to see some user feedback.

I'll be quite surprised if 4.0 gets released before the deadline
runs out.

>  Even though I've been on this list a few weeks, I am getting
>the feeling there is a hostility between Impulse and some users.

I'd noticed that too.

It's surprising, because I think most of us really like using Imagine,
and certainly don't consider it to be a poor relation to lightwave
or whatever.

>I get the feeling that they want to abandon the Amiga users who
>make 25% of thier costomer base and are loyal to the product.

I'm sure that 25% figre would be a lot bigger if Impuse bothered to
make Imagine more freely available in the countries where the Amiga
sold well.

You really have to know where to look to see anything about Imagine 
in the UK. I could put the monthly magazine coverage and advertising
on the back of a matchbox.

There has been much talk recently about the low numbers of Amiga users 
on the rolling update program, but think about it, what does Imagine
offer for the high end Amiga owner ?

There is no '040 optimised version, this is a bit of shame.
Other packages do this.

There is no O/S support. This is a crying shame.
Other packages do this quite well.

Only one commercially available graphics card is supported, and even
that one is looking a bit long in the tooth.

Why Impulse couldn't support Cybergraphics and hence provide support
for Cybervision, Picasso, Picollo, Retina, Domino, Merlin etc in
one fell swoop is beyond me. Other Packages support this.

Not supporting Cybergraphics is like not supporting VESA modes on the
PC. How would you PC folks react if Imagine would only run on one in 10
graphics cards, and none of the really good ones.

I mentioned it to Mike H, and he hadn't heard of Cybergraphics, I think
this speaks volumes about the level of Amiga support.

I can't believe Imagine will be usable running in a 256 colour
AGA screenmode, so what's the point in me upgrading ? If there was a 
CyberGraphics version I'd be there like a shot.

I've come to the conclusion that I'm better off putting my money towards
buying a different raytracer. I think that's a shame.

If I've come to this conclusion, I'm sure many people before me have, and 
many more will after me.

>  If not, I will use 3.0 until I really need something more 
>than what it offers, and then regretably purchase something else.
>Imagine has great potential to be as good as alias, wavefront and
>others or better. I therefore want to stay with Imagine.
>

I'm in the same position you are :-(

I've upgraded my Amiga, and enjoyed the additional performance.

The ONLY major program that hasn't grown in capability when I added
a graphics card was Imagine, and that's one of the programs that could
most benefit.

If Impulse want to sell Imagine upgrades to Amiga users, they have to 
support the things that the users with money to upgrade want.
That certainly is not Workbench 1.3 compatability.

Cheers,

Doug.
--
Home: doug@defocus.demon.co.uk
Work: douglas.d.e.f.smith@woodford.avro.bae.eurokom.ie (no binaries please)

Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 15:20:03 
Subject: Re: Moan, moan, moan.
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-12 04:00:02 EDT, you write:

>Could someone please tell me what the States (Object Props) feature does
>when creating a new State?  I have not found any info on it.  Also I am
>trying to animate the little 7-up Spot guy sucking liquid up a straw.  The
>straw is curvy more like a tube for siphoning gas, I want to make it look
>like their is liquid going up the tube.  Has anyone ever tried this?
>
>Stephen.

No idea on the object props, but on the straw here is something to consider.
 If your straw was sort of a spiral which say made one revolution per inch
then you should be able to make another spiral identical but slightly smaller
to fit inside and rotate it an appropriate amount as you move it up the one
inch.  It should give the appearance of a liquid moving up the tube but the
entire thing has to be symetrical and both objects require the same pitch in
order to work.

Bob..................



Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 15:23:00 
Subject: RE:2 more cents on bitching & moaning
From:    jbk4@email.psu.edu (The Prophet)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Just what everyone wanted, another 'bitch & moan' thread.
(I'm not complaining about the poster of this subject).

If you've got a legit complaint about Imagine, then write it
down and mail it to Impulse.  Many of us are obviously taking
the time to write complaints to this list.  It should be just
as easy to hit 'print' and mail it to impulse.

As clearly as you can, explain what your problem with Imagine
or Impulse is.  No need to get nasty, keep it civilized(whatever
that means).  It doesn't help to go ballistic when trying to
explain your problem(s).

Don't automatically expect impulse to read your 'bitching' here
on the IML.  Ask for help with the problem.  Maybe it is a known
bug or just a feature of how something was implemented.  Maybe
there's another way to do what you want.  

I think the volume of whining has outgrown that of anything useful
lately.  It almost makes me want to leave the IML but I keep looking
for those little informative tidbits.


Jaeson K.
 ____            ____            _           _
( |  \          ( /  \          ( )       _ / )
 )|   )_   __    /   /_   _  __  /   __  ( X_)
( |  /~ \ /\_)  /---~/ ) / )/  )/~\ /\_)  / _
 )ll/  l/ \__ (/   (/   (_//__//  / \__  (___)
(____________)        (___/        (___)

Jaeson Koszarsky                  Amiga 3000+
----------------                  -----------
cyberprophet@psu.edu              68040/30Mhz
jbk4@email.psu.edu                24Megs-1GIG
jason@chaos.ezgate.com            OS3.1

Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 15:42:58 
Subject: RE:Text in a circle(2)
From:    Granberg Tom <tom.granberg@TV2.no>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Aha, my first attempt to explain how to to it had a MAJOR FLAW!, or rather, I 
left out a very IMPORTANT thing. So here it is again.

Make a text in the spline editor and go to detail. Make a circle(disk)with the 
size you would prefer, and move the line of text to a pos. where the first 
letter of the text is aligned on the top edge of the circle. Now the first 
letter's axis should be on the same X position as the circle, seen from the 
front view. Pick the first letter, Move the axis to the center of the 
circle(disk). And rotate it around the y axis to where you want it, A good idea 

is to divide nr. of letters with 360(or the prefered degrees of yours), to get 
an idea how much each letter should be rotated. This will also mean that you may
 
have to scale them a bit. This is basicly the way you do it. So the next letter 

you would move in x until it meets 
up with the circle(disk) x axis alignment and do the same as I did with the 
first letter.
Example in ascii graphics:
      
         TEXT----------This is the text line
       **:**
     **  :  **
    *    :____*____x    this is the disk(eh?) axis
    *         *  
     **     **
       *****

Hopes this makes sense, if not dont hesitate to ask again.

Later..Sk

Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 15:43:01 
Subject: 4.0 Docs and other things
From:    "Dan.Maclean" <MACLEDJ@pmitao.usa.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

From Dan MacLean:
 
If anyone from impulse is reading, I have something to beg for:  Pleeeeas,
save the 4.0 docs in a format that doesn't just use the left side of the page
when you print it.  Since it has all those carriage returns, there is no real
way to reduce the large number of pages the docs you've sent so far take up.
I realize that you need page breaks because of the table of contents, but lack
of carriage returns would allow the user to customize it.
 
I'm an engineer and a bit weary about Impulse pricing Imagine in with the big
guys.  At least from and engineer's perspective, there aren't enough features
and compatability (as Imagine stand now) to move us away from ProEdit 3D.  I'm
using my own personal copy of 3.3 because I have to model objects myself.  In
this respect, Imagine is way ahead as long as you don't need to use
dimensions. It is too difficult to tell Imagine, "I want a sphere of radius 4
inches". But I realize that Imagine is more geared toward the graphic arts.
From what I've heard, Lightwave seems to be the favorite.  With the great use
of glows, lightning and visible lightsand the fact that there seems to be no s
ight of it in Imagine leads me to believe that there will have to be a
considerable price advantage.  At $1600, I don't see that happening.
 
For a good Windows product, I think Imagine will need a great change in
philosophy.  I think Windows users unfamiliar with Imagine will require things
like standardized requesters and menus (such as copy and paste under and
"edit" menu) and on line help.  I'm looking at this from the standpoint of
having to train others to use this product.  Given the complexity of Imagine I
have a suggestion:  Instead of forcing the user to wade through several
requesters(i.e. quickre nder) allow the user to right mouse-click over the
quickrender button. This would bring up a requestor that would allow changes
such as add lightsource and provide a help button explaining what quickrender
does. This is a very useful feature in Excel.  When explaining a piece of
software to someone it is really nice to be able to tell them, "Just
right-click". I also think that Excel's method of customizing toolbars is very
useful and easy to learn. It is essentially drag-and-drop.  Hiding unused
buttons and menus is also important to maintaining an uncluttered workspace.
And, for God's sake, don't make Imagine tie up the system when performing
functions.  An employee may be working on something fun for a moment and need
to switch to a convenient spreadsheet in a flash!  Finally, the ability to use
Window's clipboard is a MUST.  Also, test it with Windows' Recorder program
for recording macros.  Allow it to import/export JPEG, TGA, BMP, and AVI
formats. One last thing (I mean it this time!)  I find it VERY useful to pause
the pointer over a buttion and have a display give a quick description.
Through all this, I'm just assuming WinImagine will create extruded 3D fonts
from TrueType fonts. If it is incapable of that, I might as well run out and
by "Simply 3D" for $35.
 
My biggest wish is GLOWING LIGHTS!  I would love to animate a photon torpedo
over an AVI!  I would love it to be flexible enough to allow neon signs,
lightining, and changing intensity over time (like an explosion).  This would
be for fun, mostly, but I also handle our Plant's slide presentation.It would
 be nice to have a glowing Hobart sign.
 
Thanks for listening!  I like Imagine as a "prosumer" product.  But I'm
worried about the price hike.
 
Dan MacLean
PMI


Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 15:51:13 
Subject: Sound feature
From:    wilmart@ifh.sncf.fr


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


Imagine release 3.0 announced synchronized sounds in anim. This feature
is not in Imagine 4.0. 

Why?

I you have some problems to implement this feature, tell us which ones?


Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 16:10:04 
Subject: Re: Sound Feature
From:    "Dan.Maclean" <MACLEDJ@pmitao.usa.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I'm not sure about the Amiga World but here on the PC side, sound is only
useful in AVI files.  Since Imagine won't produce AVI's it doesn't make sense
for it to output a proprietery format with sound.  There are a ton of PC
programs that will allow you to lay audio on a video file.  Maybe this is why.
Programs to accomplish this function would make it a low priority for Imagine.
 
Also, am I the only one who sees an "=20" at the end random lines of some
guy's messages?
 
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dan MacLean- He can't think of any cool things to put here.  Accept maybe,
"Cordouroy pillows are making headlines!"
 
One of them-there Manufacturing Engineers at PMI's Hobart plant in Hillsboro,
OH.  Used to work at Walt Disney World where "domestic partners" get Marriage
benefits.  But NOT if you're a heterosexual.  Hmmmm!
____________________________________________________________________________


Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 16:33:17 
Subject: RE: Sound feature
From:    sherman@netcad.ENET.dec.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

FROM too long. Original FROM is 'Steve NACAD::Sherman LKG2-A/R5 pole AA2 DTN 226
-6992 <sherman@netcad.ENET.dec.com>'

----------------------  Original Message Follows  ----------------------

>Imagine release 3.0 announced synchronized sounds in anim. This feature
>is not in Imagine 4.0.

>Why?

Sure it is!  At least, it is for me.  My sessions usually go something
like ...

<clickity click>  Dang!  Forgot /noxms ...

<clickity> Ah, here we go ...

<slide, slide, click> Where is it?  It was here last time ...

<clickety, clickety> Oh, yeah ...  beautiful ...

Hours later ...

<click, click, ZAP!>  Oh, man, forgot to save!



See, sound and video in perfect sync!  

Steve ;^)

Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 16:51:35 
Subject: Re: Moan, moan, moan.
From:    beeton@SEDSystems.ca (Gary Beeton - SED Systems)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

>I don't get off, I read this list.  And I see people complaining.  Look =
>at
>what you
>just said.  "Impulse has delivered many features that they have promised=
>."=20
>How
>man?  How many not?  The key point, is that they promised features, sold=
> the
>product based on those promises, and didn't come through.

I don't remember any promises.  I DO remember Impulse sharing with us
some of the things they were working on.  Obviously some of those
things were too expensive to implement or didn't work as well as they
hoped, so they didn't make it into the final product.  (In retrospect
it was a poor marketting decision for Impulse to discuss their
development efforts since some people now expect everything they ever
mentioned to be in the current product).  If you are one of the
people got confused between what Impulse was working on and what they
are selling, then you have fallen down in your responsibilities as a
consumer.  Don't complain to Impulse (or worse yet, to us).  Impulse
don't owe us anything (except 4.0 for those of us on the constant
upgrade program).  They simply have a product that they offer to the
consuming public -- a product whose features are accurately
advertised.

<<You go on to discuss some features that would be nice to see in
Imagine; removed to save bandwidth>>

I agree with the features you would like to see, but we may be stuck
with what we have unless more Amiga owners buy their product.  The
only incentive Impulse has to continue development is SALES.  If noone
is upgrading on the Amiga side then there is no profit in continued
Amiga development.  (BTW, if you are still using 2.0 you really should
upgrade -- the user interface of 3.3 is VASTLY improved over 2.0, even
if it doesn't use OS3.0 calls.  And, yes, it does support increased
resolution, 256 colour screens on a stock AGA machine.)

>How did I become the bad guy all of sudden?

I don't think you are.  I just think you are a bit confused about what
was "promised" to you.


Gary Beeton
beeton@SEDSystems.ca

Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 18:20:23 
Subject: Re: Sound feature
From:    Roger Straub <straub@csn.net>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Thu, 12 Oct 1995 wilmart@ifh.sncf.fr wrote:

> 
> Imagine release 3.0 announced synchronized sounds in anim. This feature
> is not in Imagine 4.0. 
> 
> Why?
> 
> I you have some problems to implement this feature, tell us which ones?
> 
> 

I can think of one right off the bat: Amigas and PCs handle sound 
differently. Amigas don't need "Sound Cards" to play more than beeps. If 
this feature were to be implemented, it would have to be platform 
specific, and Impulse won't do that.

See ya,
      Roger

Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 19:54:27 
Subject: Re: Fitting Text to a circular path....
From:    sgiff@airmail.net (Stephen Gifford)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

>     This questions is probably most suited for Tom Granberg...
>     
>     In three of the images on the Imagine 4 brochure have text laid in a 
>     circle.
>     
>     How is this done, is it done in Imagine??? 
>     
>     Thanks,
>     
>     Ryan.
>
Here is what I usually do when creating logos that may be circular or have
odd shapes.  This requires Corel Draw version 3.0 or later.  Creating Logos
and fitting them to a circular path is one of the things that is easy to do
in Corel.  After that is done I convert the Text object to a bezier curve.
Then you can export each letter or symbol as an Adobe Type 1 postcript font.
Export each object to the same font file choosing a different Letter of the
alphabet for each object Exported.  I usually use 1 font file to do all of
this exporting to, since you can keep exporting objects over and over to the
same font.  I usually name this font Imagine, the PFB extension will
automatically be created for you.  If you are using a PC all of your
postcript fonts will probably be in a directory called PSFonts.  You may be
able to export the entire logo as one letter of the font file, but sometimes
it may be to complex.

From inside Imagine, go to the Spline editor and load fonts from your
PSFonts directory.  Select the Imagine font that you created in Corel Draw
and type in the letters that you created in the font that contain the logo
or pieces of the logo.  This will bring them in for you and you can assemble
them into the shape you want.  (If the entire logo is 1 letter of the font
file then no assembly is required, it will appear just as you created it.)
If you want the logo to be all one object you can join the separate pieces.)
Remember that you can scale the axis of the spline object to reduce the
number of polygons in your extruded object.  From this point select the
extrusion options you desire and save your logo.

If you have a circular logo that you want to rotate around a common axis, it
is o.k. to join all of the objects together.  Otherwise if you want each
letter of the logo to move and rotate independently you can group each
object to each other like a chain.  When you have it linked like a chain,
from the stage editor you can create a spline path in the shape you want the
logo to be or to follow. Finally from the action editor delete the first to
points on the timeline for Position and Alignment.  Re-add these two points
and have the logo "Conform group to Path" for postion and for Alignment you
can do the same.  This works for other things as well like if you wanted to
make a conveyor belt, you could create a plane in Detail and then Create a
spline path in the Stage and tell the plane object to conform itself to the
path and it will wrap itself around your path shape, as well as follow the
shape of the path when animated.

Stephen G.


Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 20:31:09 
Subject: Organic shapes and contests
From:    NEWKIRK@delphi.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hey Vic:  What kind of organic shapes are you interested in?
There's a great program (albeit cryptically controlled) called Shelley
that generates all sorts of shell-type rotation objects, allowing regular
perturbations, or bumps, and produces some lovely objects.  It's available
on Aminet, I think in gfx/3dobj, but maybe just gfx/3d.  You might also
look into dust, which allows some procedural and mathematical object defs.

As far as rendering a picture on a common topic, or trying to duplicate a common

base image, that sounds great.  I participate in the monthly rendering contest
on the internet, info at ftp.povray.org, which presents a topic each month, 
and sometimes dozens of entries are submitted, created on a wide variety of
platforms and renderers.  If the IML ends up with an associated FTP or WWW
site, this could be a great interaction.  If not, or in the mean time, check
out the monthly contest.  Last month's topic was "kitchen counter",m this
month (october 31 deadline) is "architecture", a far broader topic.
The contest is also supported (actually originates) at the
comp.graphics.rendering.raytracing newsgroup.
Joel

Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 20:33:12 
Subject: Spot sucking up a straw
From:    NEWKIRK@delphi.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Stephen: I'd think you could get the best visual impression on the liquid
moving up the straw by animating some bubbles, varying sizes, moving up.
Joel

Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 21:02:38 
Subject: Screen Resolution for PC
From:    Kevin Hobbs <khobbs@animal.blarg.net>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


The FAQ talks about the Amiga screen hack, is there one for the PC.

Am I supposed to do something with the info reported by the video mode
menu option.  I want to use 1024x768x24bit as the display mode for all
editors, and the info reported was 8:8:8:8 at 24:16:8:0 in 4 bytes -
specified.  What does this mean? 

Kevin

Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 22:38:21 
Subject: Re: Making animations
From:    beeton@SEDSystems.ca (Gary Beeton - SED Systems)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

>I tried doing some animation for the first time last night.  Finally
>found the energy.  Man, looking through that manual is frustrating... :)
>
>Anyway, I generated 30 frames, and did the make option....

Bob,

Consensus seems to be that Imagine doesn't make anims very well.  I
think the best option is to have Imagine generate a series of frames
and use another program to make the anim.  I use ADPro (commercial) or
MainActor (shareware).  Both are powerfull in that they allow you to
choose different compression methods to optimize the output for speed 
or size.


Gary Beeton
beeton@SEDSystems.ca

Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 22:41:54 
Subject: Re: 4.0 Docs and other things
From:    sgiff@airmail.net (Stephen Gifford)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

>>My biggest wish is GLOWING LIGHTS!  I would love to animate a photon torpedo
over an AVI!  I would love it to be flexible enough to allow neon signs,
lightining, and changing intensity over time (like an explosion).  This would
be for fun, mostly, but I also handle our Plant's slide presentation.It would
 be nice to have a glowing Hobart sign.
 
Thanks for listening!  I like Imagine as a "prosumer" product.  But I'm
worried about the price hike.
 
Dan MacLean
PMI<<



Glowing lights and neon glows are very easy to do with a combination of fog
and the ghost.itx.  Make it bright as well.  This will have you glowing in
no time.

Stephen G.


Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 23:02:30 
Subject: Re: Brushmap vs procedural
From:    NEWKIRK@delphi.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Dave Steiger asks:

OK
I prefer, usually, brushmaps, but then I'm stuck still with 2.0 procedurals...
I feel more in control with brushmaps, on regular objects, than procedures,
primarily for the same reason you don't use them much: I get lost sometimes
tweaking the settings for the look I want, when I can often achieve what I
want in moments with DPaint.  I've found that statistically I seem to use
brushmaps 4:3 vs procedures, so I'm close to an even split.
(try mapping an image coherently in 2.0 on any irregularly shaped object!)
Joel

Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 23:44:03 
Subject: Re animation
From:    NEWKIRK@delphi.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Imagine seems to run much slower on anim format than it's onw animation
format.  'load [movie]' then 'play ' should work fine for imagine's format,
but maybe not with the Cyber.  I'd think you're best bet would be to use
a separate showanim proggie that supports the cybervision.
Any other ideas?
Joel

Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 23:56:15 
Subject: ALANULL's light seepage
From:    NEWKIRK@delphi.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

try putting a disc object inside the bridge, just above the saucer intersection,

such that it can block the path between the light source and the intersection.
Joel

Date:    Thursday, 12 October 1995 23:56:42 
Subject: Imagine 4.0 features...
From:    cv773@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Matthew C. Polak)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hello all!
For the few of you that did not yet recieve the pamphlet from
Impulse about the Imagine 4.0 upgrade and stuff, here is the
complete list of features that will ~supposedly~ be added to
Imagine 4.0. Some of these features look like they will benefit
many people, and move Imagine a little closer to those REALLY
expensive SGI-type rendering programs (Lightscape, Alias, Softimage, etc.)
(Hey, but don't get me wrong! Price doesn't always gaurantee quality! :-) )
I _know_ that people, (even those just starting with Imagine) can
REALLY produce some incredible animations and stills with Imagine!
Anyways, enough bore! On with the list!
 
So whats new in IMAGINE 4.0?
"Take a look, and we think you will agree, for a low cost of $100,
IMAGINE 4.0 is a great value, a value not found from any other 3D
developer."
 
- Extended "States" to include object attributes.
- Improved and Extended DXF loading and saving.       -     (Hmmmmmm.....)
- Added FLC and ANIM global brush and backdrop support.
- Added FLC and ANIM brush support.
- Added ability to view Stills and Animations from within Imagine.
- Field Rendering.
- Access to object attributes from Stage Editor.
- Perspective viewing from objects and lights in Stage Editor.     -    (Handy!)

- "Smart Bones" to speed up subgroup assignment in objects.
- Added an "About" Box.
- Support for Hi-Res graphics workspace.
- Support for color graphics workspace.
- "Quick Attributes."
- "Set/Fill Edge Line" for stitching objects together.
- "Pick More" to aid in picking face groups.
- "Hide Unpicked", "Unhide All", "Unhide Subgroup"
- "Smooth Edge Line" for object smoothing.
- Backdrops in editors for rotoscoping and perspective matching - (finally! :-))

- Fracture in Object mode to anti-laticize an object.
- "Scrub" bar to animation preview controls.
- Smooth feature.
- Varible Brightness to object attributes
- Moved Randomize Colors to functions menu.         -           (See below)
- Mix/Morph control for intensity on ALL textures and brushes.
- Specular Mapping.
- Hardness Mapping.
- Shininess Mapping.
- Brightness Mapping
- Fog Length Mapping.
- Index Of Refraction Mapping.
- Ambient Light Mapping.
- Roughness Mapping.
- Previous/Next buttons for traversing texture list quickly.
- Browse buttons to texture and brush requesters.
- Color real-time texture preview.       -       (This would be great! :-))
- Color pickers in texture requester.
- View Brush added to previewing brushes.
- QuickRender access directly from all attribute/texture requestors.
- User defined texture/brush labels added for clarifying texture list.
- "Dup" added to attribute requester for copying textures/brushes.
- "Drop" added to attribute requester for dropping textures/brushes quickly.
- "Disable/Enable" button added for turing textures on/off.
- Interactive point-and-click support added to text in texture list.
- Real-time previewing of renderings as they happen
- Support for unfinshed FLC's added.
- Default object attributes added to preferences.
- Shaded View Edge drawing control added to Preferences. {PC only}
- Replaced "Reflection Mapping" with "Environment Mapping."
- Preferences for start-up editor.
- Preferences option to set number of points in CSG sphere.
- Metaballs editor with Special Effects.     -      (Ooooooo! Ahhhhhh! :-) )
- Light arrays... soft edge shadows
- Motion Blur - (also surely to be one of IM4's most valuable anim. features!)
- Object Smoothing
 
"When you look at this list you will quickly realize that the cost of the
Upgrade for $100 if less than $2 per feature, a bargain you can't afford to
miss."
 
Well, that's it for the features list of the pamphlet! Some of the features may
exist in 3.0 or higher, 'cause I think this phamplet just highlights the main
features of 4.0. (I myself am running 3.0, anxiously waiting for 4.0's release)
 
*** Question: 'Randomize Colors'  - Has anyone had trouble with this? Maybe
I just did something really weird (twice?), because once I turned the feature
on, I couldn't shut it off! I had to delete the object! (Good thing it was only a
sphere or something!)
 
*** Note: Also some info I got on the phone from Impulse (about 2 weeks ago)...
          The release of Imagine 4.0 was being delayed slightly, because they
          were doing some final debugging/testing/improving on the metaballs
          feature. so it should be released and mailed to those who have
          ordered it sometime next week!
 
One last question for anyone who has sucess with this type of thing; can
anyone tell me how to make good-looking fire/flame/explosion/hot sparks type
effects. Some things similar to the nice pictures in the pamphlet.
 
Good luck to all Imagine users out there!
Keep up the good rendering!

--
_________________________________________________________________
{                       Matthew C. Polak                        }
{                    cv773@freenet.cwru.edu                     }
{_____________________________OHIO______________________________}

Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 00:35:13 
Subject: Re: About bug fixes...
From:    rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au (Robert Byrne)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hello Mike, on Oct 11 you wrote:

> -> From: jacob@altair.csustan.edu (Dave Jacob)
> ->
> -> One last thing. Is there a program out there that will let you
> -> create your own PROCEEDURAL textures? (not image maps, as they
> -> take up memory, but the textures that are represented by mathematical
> -> expressions). If someone could tell me wher such a program is I'd be
> -> thankful.
> 
> I think the FORGE by Steve Worley is the only program that does that,
> to my knowledge. And that's only for the Amiga (unless he is...or
> will be porting it to the PC).

I use Forge and it only creates the attributes of textures which can be
applied to an object in the normal way. You can also save the results as
brushes, but it does'nt create new textures. As far as I know it was
virtually made obsolete when Im V3.3 came out with its' texture preview
function although Forge does have an animation function for previewing
textures morphing and fading over time.

-- Bob

  :  Robert Byrne  : rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au :
  : Amiga A3000/25 :  Ballina, NSW  Australia  :


Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 00:50:33 
Subject: ------=> Sorry NO Subject!
From:    ALANULL@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

anyone has a solution for a problem I ran into, even
Impulse had no ideas.  Here it is, I made the Enterprise in IM3.3 with the
saucer separate from the bridge, I used a filter map to cut windows in the
bridge, I then placed a light inside the bridge. I quickrendered (raytrace)
without the quickrender light on.  It correctly projected the rays out of the
windows but where the saucer and bridge intersected there was a glow around
them.  I then tested this problem by using a plane, putting a shere part way
into the plane and a single light source inside the sphere.  I rendered it
again with raytrace and no light.  Obviousely it should have rendered
completely black, again it rendered with a glow around the intersection
point.  So far I have only been able to mask it by increasing my ambient
light, something I really would prefer not to do.  I would appreciate any
suggestions or solutions.  PS I have a P90, and Imagine really does scream, I
also have Truespace 2.0 (I think editing bites, no lasso, drag box etc.)

Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 01:09:21 
Subject: Re: Environment mapping
From:    greggh@dialup02.odyssey.apana.org.au (Gregory Helleren)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi cjo (cjo), in <9510111227.aa20278@unixpc.esrange.ssc.se> on Oct 11 you wrote:


> Greg H wrote;
>
> >I've got this object which contains a large, flat mirror surface.
> >I would like it to reflect the objects in fron of it (no problem) and a
> >large environment image.
> >
> >I've tried using a global brush map and then an environment map on just
> >the mirror part of the object. However, in both cases I only see a small,
> >largely magnified, view of the environment brush map. The reflections of
> >the foreground objects are OK. Reflective foreground objects, which are
> >not flat, seem to reflect the global brush map with no problems.
>
> Ehh, Greg, this is just how reality works. Why shouldn't Imagine do it the
> same way?  ;)
>
> To illustrate it; imagine yourself sitting in the middle of a large room.
> In front of you is a flat mirror. Through that mirror you will only see a
> small part of the room. If you turn the mirror you will see another part
> but you won't see _more_. Unless you put the mirror very close to your eye.

I agree with your analysis except that the only mapping options available
in 3.3 for environment are spherical, cylindrical about x, and cylindrical
about z. I've tried dozens of times, but flat xz mapping is not permitted.
Obviously the magnification effect I am observing is due to the non-flat
mapping. Is the prohibition of flat xz environment mapping a bug?

As you might gather from the sig, I am using the Amiga version.

> >As I cannot adjust the axes of an environment map, I need some clues on
> >how I can get more of the environment map reflected?
> Sorry, I haven't got any good tips here. Anyone else?
> The only thing I can think of is to map your image onto a plane and
> position that plane in your scene in such a way that it reflects in your
> mirror.

Tried that too. It works fine, the large mirror reflects well - except
that it's such a pain to position the plane just right. More importantly
my reflective foreground objects reflect the plane too and this does not
look anywhere near as cool (or realistic as a global environment map).
Using a global environment map and an image plane behind the camera looks
even worse.

Love Peace and scales
Gregg

--
+-----------------------------------------///\/\/\_Amiga Technologies_/\/\+
  Gregg Helleren         AMIGA is REBORN /// Lecturer Information Technology
  Developer - LaseRage                  ///  SEMC TAFE Western Australia
  Ferndale W.A. Australia ____/\___/\\\///   greggh@odyssey.apana.org.au
  CBMNET:greggh@laserage.adsp.sub.org\XX/    greggh@laserage.DIALix.oz.au
+--------------------------------------------------------------------------+



Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 01:11:05 
Subject: Re: Imagine in the UK ?
From:    rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au (Robert Byrne)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hello Toby, on Oct 12 you wrote:

> Can anyone tell me where I can get hold
> of Imagine in UK, or should I contact Imagine
> directly ?

A very large software company appeared here in Australia called Emerald
Creative.  I bought my OEM copy of Im V3.0 from them.  I believe there is a
company by the same name in the UK but don't know if they have any
connection with the company here.

> ======================================================
> 
> If we can measure the speed of light, why cant we
> measure the speed of darkness ?  Does it just sit
> there and wait for us to turn the light on ?!?  Where
> does it go when we turn the light on ??!!
> 
> ======================================================

Darkness has a speed of zero. When you turn on the light it is still there,
you just can't see it. :-)

-- Bob

  :  Robert Byrne  : rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au :
  : Amiga A3000/25 :  Ballina, NSW  Australia  :


Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 01:40:00 
Subject: Cleanup
From:    mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com (Mike Vandersommen)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

The verbal sparring about whether Impulse is doing a good or shittyjob is fine..
.=2E.but do you think we could trim down the message quoting and doubl=equoting?
 I mean, it's bad enough having to read one of these messagesonce...but to have 
to reread it over and over gets my eyes watering.You really don't need to quote 
the whole message just to say,"...yeah, right on, man!"--- =FE InterNet - GraFX 
Haus BBS - Santa Barbara, Ca - (805) 683-1388

Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 01:44:00 
Subject: Modeller
From:    mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com (Mike Vandersommen)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

-> From: augioh4b@ibmmail.com-> Ps...please don't flame me, I may have contradic
ted myself for-> bitching also, but hey let's do something fun and creative...->
 (with what we have).No flame. I say, "here, frigging here"!--- =FE InterNet - G
raFX Haus BBS - Santa Barbara, Ca - (805) 683-1388

Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 01:45:36 
Subject: Liquid in a straw (was Re: Moan, moan, moan.)
From:    rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au (Robert Byrne)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hello Stephen, on Oct 12 you wrote:

> Also I am
> trying to animate the little 7-up Spot guy sucking liquid up a straw.  The
> straw is curvy more like a tube for siphoning gas, I want to make it look
> like their is liquid going up the tube.  Has anyone ever tried this?
> 
> Stephen.

I've done something like this a while back.  I extruded a glass tube using
a path to get a spiral shaped straw and kept that path as a reference for
the liquid.  I then scaled down the template for the glass tube so it was
the same size as the tube's hole.  I can't remember the method I used but
you could either use the Grow F/X to extrude the liquid over time and
follow the original path or have a cylinder "conform object to path" as it
moves through the tube. The results I achieved were very realistic
particularly when the liquid was a bright colour, it reflected into the
glass and the straw took on its colour.

-- Bob

  :  Robert Byrne  : rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au :
  : Amiga A3000/25 :  Ballina, NSW  Australia  :


Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 01:57:08 
Subject: Re: modeller
From:    rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au (Robert Byrne)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hello Vic, on Oct 12 you wrote:

> Also, I want to know wether there are any good modellers out
> there that can import directly to Imagine...that is shareware and
> cheap] I'm trying to create some smooth organig type of objects,
> splines, and whatevers but is very difficult to do in V2.

My only suggestion is have a look at the Forms Editor and persevere with
it. You can create some very complex objects with it, not just vases etc.

What in particular are you trying to create?

-- Bob

Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 02:18:31 
Subject: Re: Preference: Brushes or Textures
From:    Valleyview@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-12 18:24:39 EDT, you write:

>The difficulty for me, is that I'm too impatient!  I just 
>can't wait to render every experiment.

Dave, sounds like you need an upgrade: Instant gratification.

Load a texture into the attribute requester, fiddle with the parameters, and
see what they do instantly, right in the requester. Too much good stuff to
not use those textures. (no patience needed)

Rick

Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 02:18:31 
Subject: Re: texture mapping
From:    Valleyview@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I had a similar problem, even with genlock turned on. I seem to have fixed
the situation by going into the preference requester and changing the genlock
color from BLACK to REALLY BLACK. In other words the requester showed black
with a setting of 0f 0f 0f and I changed it to 00 00 00. At least I think
this is what fixed it, it works now.

Rick

Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 06:42:15 
Subject: Re: Preference: Brushes or Textures
From:    Fred Aderhold <fredster@netrix.net>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 10:48 AM 10/12/95 -0700, you wrote:
>Hi all,
>
>I'm curious, which do you prefer overall, bitmaps or procedural
>textures.  I know that each are best for specific purposes, but
>I'm interested in simple preference.

I've been partial to brushmaps for the same reason - textures *are*
difficult to get a handle on. Lately, though, after seeing some really great
Imagine work with textures, I'm thinkin' it's worth the time to learn. Take
a look at 

http://www.websharx.com:80/~greg/index2.html - GreG's Electric Dream's or

http://www.websharx.com:80/~kinda/  -  Steven's Synthetic deLights

and you'll see what I mean. In the long run, I think it's easier to get a
hold of textures rather than having CDs full of maps to root thru every time
you want to make a marble object! (hmmm... where did I see that gray marble
thing?)

Also, maps don't do well in animations where you move in on the object.



--------------------------------------------
Fred Aderhold
fredster@netrix.net
http://www.netrix.net/users/fredster

Daddy, what does formatting drive C mean?
--------------------------------------------


Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 06:42:16 
Subject: Just a thought -
From:    Fred Aderhold <fredster@netrix.net>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

About all this Impulse bashing - 

Is there *any* software company that delivers on *all* it's promises, and
right on time? I didn't think so...

Sheesh!

--------------------------------------------
Fred Aderhold
fredster@netrix.net
http://www.netrix.net/users/fredster

Daddy, what does formatting drive C mean?
--------------------------------------------


Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 08:10:36 
Subject: Re: 3D text in 2.0PC
From:    weiss@epx.cis.umn.edu


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At some point in the past, cjo@esrange.ssc.se declared that:
> 
> >Do you gurus have suggestions on how to create 3D text in version 2.0?
> 
> Ok. Everybody remember this. From now on I am a guru!    ;)
> 
> Use a paint program to make a bitmap of the text that you wish to make a 3d=
> =20
> modell of. Remember to fill the letters, ie do not make them outlines.
> 

This must be where I'm screwing up. Seems that the text tools in the
paint programs don't generate usable bitmaps. The conversion of tiff
into imagine of this stuff always fails for me.


> Go into Imagine's detail editor. Select import bitmap in the objects menu=20
> and use the file that you just created with the paint program.

I assume you mean the menu item "convert"? There is no "import bitmap"
in 2.0 PC that I see....
> 
> Pick the outline that you just made and extrude it 100 units.
> 
> Create a primitive plane with a lot of faces. Position it so that it cuts=20
> your extruded outline in half.
> 
> Pick both objects. Slice them.
> 
> If the slice doesn't work the first time try moving one of the objects just=
> =20
> a tiny bit in one direction and try slice again. Repeat until successful.
> 
> Now you should have 5 objects, one axis (that the other four objects are=20
> grouped to), one front and one back peice of your outline object, one=20
> plane-part that is outside the outline and one plane-part that is inside.=20
> The inside plane part is the thingy that you are after. Delete the other=20
> objects. (Don't delete the axis from pick groups mode unless you have=20
> ungrouped the objects.)
> 
> Hmm, was that all it took to become a guru?

Yes! Badge is on its way....

Thank you,

jeffrey

> 
> *---------------------------------------------------------------*
> |   Conny Joensson   |   Swedish Space Corp. Esrange            |
> |   Kiruna           |   Satellite operations - Telecom Div.    |
> |   Sweden           |   cjo@smtpgw.esrange.ssc.se              |
> *---------------------------------------------------------------*
> 

:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
jeff weiss  weiss@epx.cis.umn.edu  TCP/IP 44.94.249.101 N0IRR  612.825.4746 H  
::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::

Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 08:58:02 
Subject: Re: LISTEN!!
From:    Darryl_Lewis@comlink.mpx.com.au (Darryl Lewis)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

 LM> -------------Impulse's Image------------------
 LM> Now I want to ask everyone who has been shitting on Impulse recently:
 LM> 1) Do you know a programming language?

C,C++, Fortran, Basic, AMOS, 68000 assembler, 6502 assembler, 8086
assembler

 LM> 2) Do you know Calculus?

University pass in maths good enough?

 LM> 3) Do you know linear algebra(matrices)?

See above.

 LM> 4) Do you know what a vector is?

yes see above

LM> 5) Do you know what a dot product is?

yes see above.

 LM> 6) Do you what Phong shading is? The equation for phong shading?

no

 LM> 7) Do you know what a Span is?

no

M> 8) Do you know what an intersection test is?

no

 LM> 9) Do you know what object this is: x^2 + y^2 = R?

a circle 

LM> 10)Do you know about fractals?

yes. Interesting repeative mathimatical functions.

 LM> OK, if you answered yes to all of those question, you should get 8
 LM> years of
 LM> experience making a raytracing and animation package and get a job at
 LM> Impulse.  If you don't know it all then you have no right making fun
 LM> of the

No thanks- I think I make more money doing realtime 3D graphics for
military flight simulators.

Darryl

-- Via DLG Pro v1.0

               #####\             _             /#####
               #( )# |          _( )__         | #( )# 
               ##### |         /_    /         | #####
               #" "# |     ___m/I_ //_____     | #" "#
               # O # |____#-x.\ /++m\ /.x-#____| # O #
               #m.m# |   /" \ ///###\\\ / "\   | #m.m#
               #####/    ######/     \######    \#####

Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 09:11:45 
Subject: Cybervision
From:    "Dan.Maclean" <MACLEDJ@pmitao.usa.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

From Dan MacLean:
 
I sold my Amiga 2000 w/9MB Ram and 030/28 Mega Midget racer about 3 years ago.
 I now have a DX4/100 with 20MB ram and 4MB VRAM.  I'm curious about this
videocard called Cybervision.  Is it a supplement to the Amiga display like
DCTV or does it replace the Amiga display?  If so, does it duplicate the
Amiga's custom chips' duties in drawing functions? I remember Opalvision and
Paintbox,  but they were pretty much dumb frame buffers.
While I'm on the subject, did Digital Creations ever release a native DCTV
animation/paint program?  I loved that thing, but it was so annoying not being
able to animate with the increased number of colors available.  I would
suspect that with today's faster machines, DCTV could easily produce 30 frames
per second in it's 3 bitplane mode. I was getting about 15fps on my system.
 
I think WinImagine is going to cause a big Divergence between the PC and Amiga
versions.  At least it should.  If Impulse simply does a port of the DOS


Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 09:26:14 
Subject: Re: Preference: Brushes or Textures
From:    Mike McCool <mikemcoo@efn.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


> Dave, sounds like you need an upgrade: Instant gratification.
> 
> Load a texture into the attribute requester, fiddle with the parameters, and
> see what they do instantly, right in the requester. Too much good stuff to
> not use those textures. (no patience needed)

But in the meantime, go down to aminet and get TextureStudio.  It does 
pretty much the same thing. 

Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 10:14:25 
Subject: Re:Stage update problem(for Bill)
From:    Granberg Tom <tom.granberg@TV2.no>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi Bill, you wrote:
I'm using 2.0 (3D modeling Labs) and want to save the
changes in each frame as I edit these. But for some
reason it doesn't happen. The camera always goes back
to its origin and the same with the objects that follow a
path.

Obviously I'm doing it wrong. What is the correct way?

Regarding follow path, you have to do this in actione editor, tell the object to
 
follow the "path" in the required nr of frames you want it to move from "a" to 
"b" on the spline. Ofcourse you would have to have a spline present in you scene
 
as well.
Regarding you problem with "no change" of camera/object:
I think you forgott to select:Alignment bar,Position bar, and Size bar after 
making your changes. This is vital to do when animate in stage. And aslo 
remember to save the changes before you go to another frame. You dont have to 
select all of the "bar's" but the apropriate ones like:
If you rotate something = Alignment Bar
If move something = Position Bar
If you scale something = Size Bar, there is also another thing to remember when 
scaling things in stage, and that is if you scale something only in 1 or 2 axis 

lets say z&x then you would have to do this after you select "locale" or else 
stage would not remember what you did. It doesnt matter if you scale all 3 axis 

at the same time.

Hope this helps?

Tom Granberg "Renderbrandt"

Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 11:09:32 
Subject: RE:F50
From:    Kent Marshall Worley <mumu@america.net>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On 4 Oct 1995, Granberg Tom wrote:

> let me. I'm just going to clean it up a bit, nothing much just put in 
> lights,windows,wheels that sort of stuff. And by the the way it is a F50 repli
ca 
> 
> Later
> 
> Tom Granberg (Renderbrandt)
> 
when you put in windows do you use the slice function. and actually punch 
holes in the body of the car? I have a hard time with this.
 mumu@america.net

Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 11:11:36 
Subject: Snow and xmas tree...
From:    Richard Gregor Mast <roxter@UDel.Edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

   I am using Imagine 3.0 for the PC and was wondering if anyone could
help me to create either a xmas tree or snow for an animation.  I am 
trying to create falling snow and also snow on rocks and trees in the 
background.  Any help would be appreciated.
   Also,  what paint programs does eveyone use for the PC.  I used to 
have an amiga and lived on DPaint.  But I can't find anything I like on 
the PC.  I have heard there is DPaint for the PC somewhere but have never 
heard much more.

***********************************************
Rick Mast
Roxter@Chopin.udel.edu
***********************************************


Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 11:18:13 
Subject: Re: 4.0 Docs and other things
From:    Joop.vandeWege@MEDEW.ENTO.WAU.NL (joop van de wege)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

>If anyone from impulse is reading, I have something to beg for:  Pleeeeas,
>save the 4.0 docs in a format that doesn't just use the left side of the page
>when you print it.  Since it has all those carriage returns, there is no real
>way to reduce the large number of pages the docs you've sent so far take up.
>I realize that you need page breaks because of the table of contents, but 
>lack of carriage returns would allow the user to customize it.
Use GoldEd, available from Aminet, that is ofcourse when you're an Amiga user.

It allows you to reformat paragraphs very easily. As an example: This mail 
could be reformated with a few simple keystrokes into whatever you like. 5 
blanks left, right margin 50 (config stuff) then press RAMIGA= on any of the 
lines of the first paragraph and there it is including word wrap. This would 
look pretty silly because of the '>'. :)

Only catch is that GoldEd from Aminet doesn't save files with more than 1000 
lines.
No problem at all. Set the left margin '0', right margin 'huge=999' and 
reformat.

Joop

Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 11:31:43 
Subject: Textures and stuff...
From:    cjo@esrange.ssc.se


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

While we are discussing textures vs brushmaps...

Textures are good because they use small amount of memory.
Brushmaps are good because thay are fast to render.

Just this week I have rendered a project where I have used Imagine's=20
textures more than I ever have before.

It all started with an image in a music CD pamphlet - in this case "Bat out=
=20
of hell II" by Meatloaf.

It ended up being a stone/brick wall with a window with a curtain, a couple=
=20
of torches and some candles.

Guess what texture I used to do the brick wall!

- Deathstar!!   Pretty amazing, isn't it?

Anyways, you can see the result in the image "Storm.jpg" at=20
<http://www.is.kiruna.se/~cjo/gall-rest.html>.

*---------------------------------------------------------------*
|   Conny Joensson   |   Swedish Space Corp. Esrange            |
|   Kiruna           |   Satellite operations - Telecom Div.    |
|   Sweden           |   cjo@smtpgw.esrange.ssc.se              |
*---------------------------------------------------------------*

Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 11:36:53 
Subject: Re: Environment mapping
From:    cjo@esrange.ssc.se


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Greg H wrote;
>Is the prohibition of flat xz environment mapping a bug?

No, it's most likely not a bug.
The question is: what would a flat environment look like?

>Love Peace and scales

I am still wondering: scales???

*---------------------------------------------------------------*
|   Conny Joensson   |   Swedish Space Corp. Esrange            |
|   Kiruna           |   Satellite operations - Telecom Div.    |
|   Sweden           |   cjo@smtpgw.esrange.ssc.se              |
*---------------------------------------------------------------*

Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 11:40:07 
Subject: Re: How to access aminet
From:    Kent Marshall Worley <mumu@america.net>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Sun, 8 Oct 1995, Charles Blaquiere wrote:

> Anonymous FTP means that you enter "anonymous" as the user name, and 
> your e-mail address as the password.
> 
> 
to make things easier yo can enter the first letter of your email address 
then @ for the password. I would log on as anonymous the m@ for my password

Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 12:14:04 
Subject: Re[2]:  "=20"
From:    RYAN_JOHNSON@wallaby.oz.sas.com (RYAN JOHNSON)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

     No I see them tooo.


______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________

:Subject: Re: Sound Feature
:Author:  "Dan.Maclean" <MACLEDJ@PMITAO.USA.COM> at USMAIL
:Date:    13/10/95 12:06 PM


I'm not sure about the Amiga World but here on the PC side, sound is only       

useful in AVI files.  Since Imagine won't produce AVI's it doesn't make sense   

for it to output a proprietery format with sound.  There are a ton of PC        

programs that will allow you to lay audio on a video file.  Maybe this is why.  

Programs to accomplish this function would make it a low priority for Imagine.  

     
Also, am I the only one who sees an "=20" at the end random lines of some       

guy's messages?                                                                 

     
----------------------------------------------------------------------------    

Dan MacLean- He can't think of any cool things to put here.  Accept maybe,      

"Cordouroy pillows are making headlines!"                                       
     
One of them-there Manufacturing Engineers at PMI's Hobart plant in Hillsboro,   

OH.  Used to work at Walt Disney World where "domestic partners" get Marriage   

benefits.  But NOT if you're a heterosexual.  Hmmmm!                            

____________________________________________________________________________    

     
     

Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 13:35:00 
Subject: RE:Text in a circle
From:    mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com (Mike Vandersommen)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

-> From: "Granberg Tom" <tom.granberg@TV2.no>->-> the text is aligned on the top
 edge of the circle. Now the first l=ett-> should be on the same X position as t
he circle, seen from the fron=t v-> the first letter, Move the axis to the cente
r of the circle(disk).= Th-> basicly the way you do it. So the next letter you w
ould move in x =unt-> up with the circle(disk) x axis alignment and do the same 
as I did= wi-> first letter.Really, Tom? I'm certainly no Imagine expert... but 
I am lazy. AllI do is create the text in spline editor, import it to Detail. The
nJOIN the object for one axis (centered). Then I rotate the axis, anduse CONFORM
 to Cylinder. With a little tweeking of the radius and siz=e,it does all the har
d work for you.Just my two cents....   /------------------------------          
 ___   ___  ___   ___  | Mike van der Sommen                     / __  /__/ /__/
  /_   \ /  | Santa Barbara, Ca.                     /___/ / \  /  /  /     / \ 
 | mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com     HAUS BBS (805-683-1388)  |           "Blackouts make for nice breaks in the day"   \_______________
______________________________________________--- =FE InterNet - GraFX Haus BBS 
- Santa Barbara, Ca - (805) 683-1388

Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 13:53:30 
Subject: Re: Preference: Brushes or Textures
From:    Bob Arnold <barnold@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


But when oh when is this cool stuff going to be available for us PeeCee 
kinda people?  (sound of wringing hands)   -Bob



On Fri, 13 Oct 1995, Mike McCool wrote:

> 
> > Dave, sounds like you need an upgrade: Instant gratification.
> > 
> > Load a texture into the attribute requester, fiddle with the parameters, and

> > see what they do instantly, right in the requester. Too much good stuff to
> > not use those textures. (no patience needed)
> 
> But in the meantime, go down to aminet and get TextureStudio.  It does 
> pretty much the same thing. 
> 

Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 14:02:00 
Subject: Preference: Brushes or Te
From:    mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com (Mike Vandersommen)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

-> From: David Alan Steiger <das@ceti.csustan.edu>->->         For instance, I r
arely touch the 3.0 textures.  It's-> been too difficult to get a "handle" on th
e parameters of so-> many files.  I can't intuitively say, "Hey, this added with
 that-> would be perfect."  Experimenting is too difficult because there-> are s
o many textures.What you need is 3.3 (or 4.0). Starting at 3.3 textures has apre
view render window that shows you exactly what the textureand it's settings will
 look like.   /------------------------------           ___   ___  ___   ___  | 
Mike van der Sommen                     / __  /__/ /__/  /_   \ /  | Santa Barba
ra, Ca.                     /___/ / \  /  /  /     / \  | mike.vandersommen@cadd
y.uu.silcom.com     HAUS BBS (805-683-1388)  |           "Blackouts make for nic
e breaks in the day"   \________________________________________________________
_____--- =FE InterNet - GraFX Haus BBS - Santa Barbara, Ca - (805) 683-1388

Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 14:19:36 
Subject: Re[2]: Text in a circle
From:    spack@mv.us.adobe.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

>Really, Tom? I'm certainly no Imagine expert... but I am lazy. All
>I do is create the text in spline editor, import it to Detail. Then
>JOIN the object for one axis (centered). Then I rotate the axis, and
>use CONFORM to Cylinder. With a little tweeking of the radius and size,
>it does all the hard work for you.

But doesn't this cause the letters to 'warp' due to the conformation?  Tom's 
approach does not cause this to happen.  I guess it depends on what output you 
are looking for...

-Scott
spack@adobe.com



Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 15:03:15 
Subject: Re:
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

From: ALANULL@aol.com

> I then tested this problem by using a plane, putting a shere part way
> into the plane and a single light source inside the sphere.  I rendered
> it again with raytrace and no light.  Obviousely it should have rendered
> completely black, again it rendered with a glow around the intersection
> point. 

Sounds like you didn't turn on the "casts shadows" button in the light's 
attributes requester.


Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 15:10:13 
Subject: Re: Standard Amiga?
From:    Jynx <premiergfx@liberty.liberty.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



> (Speak of which,--and please excuse this leaving of Imagine's orbit--but 
> has anyone heard rumor of the first 1,400 new amiga's rolling off the 
> assembly line?).  
> 

What you heard is somewhat true. There will be some A1200's & some A4000T's
shipping real soon.(Christmas Presents) The 060's for the A1200,A4000T,
3000 & 2000 look tasty also. A lot of coverage on both of these issues
in the euro mags. late
 
Brent Warp
Premier Productions


Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 15:16:15 
Subject: Re: optimisation
From:    Jynx <premiergfx@liberty.liberty.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Mon, 18 Sep 1995, Bill Boyce wrote:

> At 08:54 PM 17/9/95 -0700, you wrote:
> >
> >Naaaah, save the $$$ and buy a DEC Alpha.  For around $5000 (go ahead, 
> >flame me, someone told me that price) you can buy horsepower to shame a P6.
> >
> >-Bob
> >
> And even then you won't get real-time rendering. Previews are probably close
> to real time though. I think it's a bit hopeful to expect real time from a P6.

> It's only(!) about 1.5 times the speed of a Pentium at the same clock speed. i
e
> a 100MHz P6 is as fast as a 150MHz Pentium. Go ahead and get that P90, Robert.

> 
> >On Sun, 17 Sep 1995, Robert Byrne wrote:
> >
> >> Hello Vic, on Sep 15 you wrote:
> >> 
> >> > Oh yeah...the P6 is due to be released in the  near  future
> >> > and would be a beast for Imagine...wonder if Impulse is going
> >> > to optimise Imagine for windows, and put in a feature to render
> >> > on the fly ... ie anims doesn't have to be pre rendered but will
> >> > render and play instantaneously from the stage/project ed.
> >> > 
> >> > Just some thoughts.
> >> 
> >> Real time rendering?  I know Pentiums are fast, I'm going to order 
a P5-90,
> >> but not that fast. Tell me about the P6, I might hold off for its release.

Real time rendering....Sure, if you have a Cray SC. As far as previews 
go, a low budget pentium can produce some very speedy previews. Not to 
get away from Imagine to much......(i use Imagine on my Amiga, and 
pentium)......But, I also use 3D Studio for some animation jobs, and
you should see the full screen previews and such with it. Especially
on my DEC Alpha. Anyways.....
 
Brent Warp
Premier Productions
> >> > 
>> > > > >
> 
> 


Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 15:19:39 
Subject: Re: 4.0????
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: RobSampson@aol.com
> 
> on Compuserve where Impulse maintains a forum and library and where help
> with Imagine is available from GreG tsadillas and Tim Wilson who probably
> give better answers to more questions than you will ever see in here. 

There are three CompuServe areas I know where you can get Imagine help:

AMIGAVEND - Amiga Vendors, the first official Impulse section. Now feels 
like a dusty crypt, minus Indiana Jones.

ANVENA - PC ANimation VENdors A, the other official Impulse area, and 
the one getting all the traffic. Best place to ask Mike Halvorson a 
question.

GUGRPA - Graphics User GRouP A, a user-run area starring GreG tsadilas, 
one of the most outstanding Imagine users on the planet.

> I'm not pushing Compuserve, but this crap you see posted in here like
> that "sieg heil" post is not something you run up against on Compuserve
> and is one of the reasons that GreG does not bother to read this list
> anymore from what I understand from him.  If your looking towards an
> online service where you can get solid information about your questions
> on Imagine then CIS is an excellent place to be. 

Agreed. Where I live, CompuServe costs me $6.40 CDN/hour, compared to
$0.26 CDN/hour for Internet access -- and I still read every message in
the Imagine sections on GUGRPA and ANVENA. When people pay non-trivial
amounts of money for their online time, they tend to refrain from posting
trivial messages. The signal/noise ratio over there is incredible. In
addition, CompuServe's structure makes it quite impractical to spam the
entire system. Although I still think there's a place for the IML,
especially for people of low income and users outside North America, I
urge those for whom it's practical to do so, to take advantage of the
numerous "10 free hour" offers and investigate CompuServe. 


Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 15:25:50 
Subject: About bug fixes...a possible solution.
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Dave Jacob <jacob@altair.csustan.edu>
> 
> Giving up speed for windows doesn't sound fun at all...

I'd give up some speed to gain multitasking any day. Coming from an 
Amiga background, I have found working in Imagine under DOS aggravating, 
to say the least. What you lose in speed, you gain by not having to save 
your work, exit Imagine, reboot in Windows, run whatever made you want 
to quit Imagine in the first place (e.g. edit a brushmap), then reverse the 
process to get back into Imagine. And lord help you if the results of 
your brushmap don't satisfy you when seen inside your Imagine scene, as 
you'll have to go through those loops again and again.

Compare this to clicking on Photoshop to adjust the brushmap, save it, 
and click on Imagine to quickrender the results. A whole new world.


Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 15:45:52 
Subject: Re: Environment mapping
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: cjo@esrange.ssc.se
> 
> To illustrate it; imagine yourself sitting in the middle of a large room. 
> In front of you is a flat mirror. Through that mirror you will only see a 
> small part of the room. If you turn the mirror you will see another part 
> but you won't see _more_. Unless you put the mirror very close to your 
> eye.

Very well-put, Conny.

An environment brush is mapped onto a sphere enclosing the entire world. 
As seen from the top, this means that the entire width of the brushmap 
will be stretched around a 360-degree view, around the scene. If your 
camera is in front of a mirror that's, say, 500 units away and 200 units 
wide, the light rays joining the edges of the mirror to the camera will 
represent a rectangular cone with an apex angle of about 23 degrees:


TOP VIEW
--------           ___---|
               O---___   |      at the camera: the angle (<) is 22.6 deg.
               ^      ---|
               ^         ^
               ^         ^
            camera    mirror

This means that the mirror, in turn, will reflect a 22.6-degree wide 
cone out onto the imaginary environment sphere, which is 360 degrees 
wide. Therefore, you'd see about 1/16th the width of the environment 
brushmap reflected in your mirror. This explains why you're getting very 
little of the effect you'd hoped for when you selected your environment 
brushmap.

How can you cheat, and see a wider reflection in the mirror? One way is 
to make the mirror slightly convex by Fracturing it once or twice, and 
using Conform To Sphere to get a VERY SUBTLE curvature to the object. As 
a result, the mirror will reflect a wider view of your environment. This 
can work for stills mostly, and/or when the camera pretty much stays in 
front of the mirror, or else the curved edges will start to show.

You can also go to a paint program, cut out your entire environment image
as a brush, shrink it, and stamp it down in the area being reflected by
the mirror. This way, the mirror will still reflect a small 23-degree
portion of the image, but what's in that portion, is a thumbnail of the
entire image you'd like reflected. 

Or, you can keep the mirror flat, and bring the camera closer, so that 
the mirror occupies a larger angle of view as seen from the camera. That 
same angle will determine what part of the environment is reflected in 
the mirror.


Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 16:05:19 
Subject: Imagine 4.0 features...
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Matthew C. Polak <cv773@cleveland.Freenet.Edu>
> 
> *** Question: 'Randomize Colors' - Has anyone had trouble with this?
> Maybe I just did something really weird (twice?), because once I turned
> the feature on, I couldn't shut it off! I had to delete the object! (Good
> thing it was only a sphere or something!)

As you know, every face on an object gets its color from the 
object attributes, unless you give the face its own color by 
picking it in Pick Faces mode. Such coloration, however, is fleeting: as 
soon as you change the object's base attributes, the new information is 
applied to every face all over again! This bug/feature is the way for 
you to solve your problem: just enter the object's Attributes requester, 
select Color, and don't change anything. (There should be an "X" next to 
Color) Click on OK, and all your customized face colors will disappear.


By the way, here's a tip to help _prevent_ this overwriting of colors 
when tweaking the object's base attributes: when you have selected the 
faces you wish to color individually, make a subgroup from them. It 
makes it easy, after altering the object attributes, to pick the 
subgroup making up those faces, and re-enter the original color in 
Attributes.

If you have Essence, you can go a step further, and apply the Solid 
texture to this subgroup. Solid doesn't really take up any rendering 
time, and will prevent any changes to the base object from disturbing 
your subgroup of faces.

Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 16:07:53 
Subject: RE:Fire stuffy
From:    Granberg Tom <tom.granberg@TV2.no>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Matthew C. Polak, you wrote:
One last question for anyone who has sucess with this type of thing; can
anyone tell me how to make good-looking fire/flame/explosion/hot sparks type
effects. Some things similar to the nice pictures in the pamphlet.
 

If you think about the "2" with the plasma/fire glowy thing, I can answer 
that. Let's see..............weeeeell..........GOT IT.
I made the 2,copied it deleted all points and faces except for the outline edge.
 
I the extruded that, and used the wormwein texture plus a couple of mnttop for 
coloring and transparansy. Thats it, you may want to play around with the colors
 
a bit to get them right. Ahhhhhh, dont forgett to make it bright. Ofcourse there
 
are several other ways to achive this, but for stills, the above works very 
well. But for animations I may have had it done slightly otherwise, and added 
some particles. By the way, on sharkys cove homepage, there is a great tutorial 

writen and conducted by Stephen Blackmon, about these things, check it out!!

http://www.websharkx.com/
I think?

Later

Tom Renderbrandt Granberg


Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 16:18:01 
Subject: Re:F50
From:    Granberg Tom <tom.granberg@TV2.no>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi, all!
For everone that want to check this monster out, use netscape(or similar) and go
 
to: www.websharx.com:80/~cptvideo/pix/granberg/carX12.JPG


Ps. give me some toughts afterwards, will ya?
Later...sk

Tom Granberg


Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 16:35:48 
Subject: LISTEN!!
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: !LuM! <lumbient@superlink.net>
> 

<list of 10 questions deleted, 9 of which I answered "Yes" to>
> If you don't know it all then you have no right making fun of the
> lack of features or bugs in Imagine

Lumbient, I understand and agree with your sentiment -- people are being 
too critical of Impulse -- but can't let this pass without a comment. In 
your book, people who don't know the insides of 3-D programming have no 
business complaining about bugs or features. I disagree. If I find 
something in Imagine that doesn't work as promised in the manual, why 
would I be disallowed to mention it until I completed 2 years of college 
math? Your knowledge of trigonometry may be sound, but your logic is 
faulty. Finding bugs is a simple matter of observing a discrepancy 
between what's promised and the result achieved. Similarly, complaining 
about functionality can arise from comparison of the different products on 
the market, their price and feature list. It doesn't take a degree to be 
_allowed_ to make those comparisons.

> Also for all those who program, you can understand how annoying it is to
> debug a program like a raytracer!!! 

Agreed. There's a saying about every non-trivial program containing at 
least one bug after all the bugs have been found, and the corollary that 
any bug-free program must be trivial. (That's a joke, folks! Computer 
humour, you know?) For all the fun it must be for the folks at Impulse 
to come up with new and nifty toys-err, features to add to their 
program, they must also bear the responsibility that comes with being a 
programmer, and fix existing bugs, too. Whether Impulse has, indeed, 
left a bevy of bugs unresolved, is not for me to judge. I'm sure others 
will pipe in with their viewpoint.

> -------------SECRECTS-----------------
> Impulse has too many secrets.  I asked for the texture format and the FX
> format and they laughed and said no.  Its strikes me as funny that Impulse
> whines that Imagine has no 3rd party support yet they refuse to give out
> info.  Then several months ago they said they were releasing a developers
> package that costs a lot of money.   That sounds even dumber to me!  Why
> sould I pay to make Imagine more attractable?

You wouldn't. As a developer, you'd be paying to build a product that 
you could sell. That's a big difference. We're talking small-business 
here, not charity work.

If you intended to develop software that runs on Windows 95, I assume 
you'd similarly expect Microsoft to hand over full documentation and 
developer disks, free of charge?

There's a damn good reason Mike decided to impose a serious fee on 
Imagine developer docs, and that's to weed the amateurs out. If people 
start releasing clumsy, buggy, slow Imagine add-ons left and right, what 
do you think will happen? Users' renders will start crashing, or slow 
down, or misbehave in some way -- and Imagine will be unfairly smeared 
by it. The result: a product that has enough trouble getting respect as 
it is, will forever be tarred with the "oh, that buggy Amiga junk" 
brush. I support Mike's decision 100%.

If I were you, I wouldn't hold my breath on the whole third-party thing: 
as far as I know, only a handful of developers ever released successful 
Imagine add-ons: things like Essence/Forge, the early Surface Master/Map 
Master, the books... ask people like John Grieggs (Imagine Staging 
Language) or Milan Polle (textures) how much shareware registrations 
they ever received.

Imagine's market is mostly composed of hobbyists. People reluctant to 
pay the $100 it took to get every feature added from 3.0 to 4.0, will 
certainly not pay much more money to get deep implementations of a 
single feature, as found in anadd-on module. Look at the price of a 
3DStudio IPAS ($400 average?) -- and these IPASes are aimed at a market 
that paid $3000 for the base software. I believe the number of currently 
active Imagine users to be smaller, and much less eager to spend, than 
the 3DStudio crowd. This means that in order for an Imagine add-on 
developer to make a profit on their time and effort, they would either 
have to price their module much higher, or create quite simplistic 
add-ons.

The result will either be expensive, or underwhelming. This is why I 
believe users should seriously downgrade any expectations they may have 
concerning Imagine add-ons.

> If Imagine had thousands of more textures and hundreds of FX's and
> particle systems then I could see paying $1000 for it(even better if it
> had glows and lensflare!).

Ummm, your math is faulty. Even if people do develop those hundreds of 
FX's and thousands of textures, they'll certainly expect to be paid for 
them, no? This would make your investment in Imagine higher than the 
$1000 you mention, by a couple of orders of magnitude.

Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 16:53:16 
Subject: Novice needs help with animation
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: William Bogan <web@cvsd.cv.com>
> 
> I have made objects, used the action editor to designate
> the path for my camera and a path for the objects
> to follow. What do I do next to create an animation?

As you gleaned from the Shaddock book, you can animate without even 
stepping into the Cycle editor, whose purpose is to create objects that 
have an internal cyclic motion. I assume that's what you're trying to do.

My memory of 2.0 is fuzzy, but what you want to do is enter the Stage 
editor at the frame where you want Cycle object A to appear, load the 
object, position/size/align it, and save the results. Then go to the 
Action editor, where you'll click on the object's Actor bar. Here, you 
can adjust the exit frame, if you don't want the object to be seen up 
til the last animation frame, and you can also specify the number of 
Cycle editor cycles you wish to have the object perform. For example, if 
the object is a stick figure waving its arm up and down, starting in the 
"up" position, you could enter 3 cycles to have it wave 3 times. The 
motion will be stretched to fit whatever number of frames lie between 
the starting and end frame. You can also enter 2.5 cycles, to start with 
an "arm up" pose and end with an "arm down" pose.

These are very basic instructions, but they should get you started. 
Please reply with more detailed questions, and we'll kindly guide you 
along the process.


Welcome to the IML, by the way.


Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 17:00:27 
Subject: Preference: Brushes or Textures
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

David,

what a great discussion topic! The perfect thing to drag us away from 
those endless bitch & moan threads. (Oh, I hope I hope I hope I hope)

I guess it depends a lot on which machine you have. Textures are great 
if you have the horsepower to (a) get the fast feedback that allows lots 
of parameter experimentation, and (b) render scenes sometime this century.

Coming from a 25MHz Amiga 3000 w/10M background, I've always liked 
simple objects, adorned with brushmaps. 10M of RAM allowed me ample 
space for brushmaps, and I've always had a gut reaction against 
performing the same texture calculations over and over and over, rather 
than storing the results in brushmap form and using _that_ on every 
animation frame. Where I would use textures is when I intend to morph 
some parameters over time; apart from that, I'd always use a brushmap. 
Why waste the CPU cycles?

Of course, when you move to an ultra-fast platform, your outlook may 
change, and you may want to keep your life simpler by bypassing the 
steps needed to make a texture into a brushmap, and just say "what the 
h*!!, another 5 sec/frame won't kill me."

Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 17:02:57 
Subject: Re: Text in a circle
From:    --Craig <dalamar@MIT.EDU>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> -> From: "Granberg Tom" <tom.granberg@TV2.no>
> ->
> -> the text is aligned on the top edge of the circle. Now the first lett
> -> should be on the same X position as the circle, seen from the front v
> -> the first letter, Move the axis to the center of the circle(disk). Th
> -> basicly the way you do it. So the next letter you would move in x unt
> -> up with the circle(disk) x axis alignment and do the same as I did wi
> -> first letter.
> 
> Really, Tom? I'm certainly no Imagine expert... but I am lazy. All
> I do is create the text in spline editor, import it to Detail. Then
> JOIN the object for one axis (centered). Then I rotate the axis, and
> use CONFORM to Cylinder. With a little tweeking of the radius and size,
> it does all the hard work for you.
> 
> Just my two cents....
> 
>   | Mike van der Sommen                     / __  /__/ /__/  /_   \ /

And I believe you can then slice the object with itself to regain the
initial grouped letters, as Slice will separate non-contiguous
objects. Of course, I think you lose those nifty subgroups that the
Spline Editor creates for you, but they're probably lost in the Join
anyway.

  --Craig
dalamar@athena.mit.edu





Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 17:21:36 
Subject: Restoring my confidence
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Greg Searle <expgxs@cascade.santos.com.au>
> 
>   Even though I've been on this list a few weeks, I am getting
> the feeling there is a hostility between Impulse and some users.

Some IML members are more polite than others; some are really rude. Mike 
Halvorson has been known to exhibit the same array of tones. Often, when 
he's rude, it's justified.

> I get the feeling that they want to abandon the Amiga users who
> make 25% of thier costomer base and are loyal to the product.

Unfortunately, although Amiga users run 3 to 1 against PC users, 
Constant Upgrade subscriptions run 10 to 1 in favor of the PC. If you 
consider total sales to be a mix of historical data (people who bought 
Imagine eons ago, and are no longer using it) and current sales, you can 
see my opinion, which is that Constant Upgrades represent your current, 
active user base. Those are the people you're selling to; with the 
extremely reasonable amount Impulse asked for the Constant Upgrade, I 
would assume that those who didn't jump on the bandwagon are lost forever.

If you agree with this train of thought, then in the few years that 
Imagine has been available for the PC, its active user share has grown 
to 10 to 1 vs. Amiga owners.

> I get the feeling that registered users are not well supported 
> as I thought they would be.

Impulse has been spotty in user support. Phone tech support is a 
veritable roulette, where you don't know if you'll be helped, greeted as 
a numbskull, or ignored. People kept slipping off Impulse's customer 
database, resulting in unreceived newsletters and upgrade offers. On the 
other hand, I believe the Constant Upgrade price was quite generous, 
considering all that's happened to Imagine since version 3.0.
 
> I get the feeling some users think we should bow to Impulse and that they
> have the worlds greatest 3d renderer.

Yes, reading the debates here, I see how you would come to that 
conclusion. My personal feeling on the matter is this: I entered the 
world of Imagine with standard expectations regarding the company. I was 
taken aback by what I found. I adjusted my attitude (e.g. never took a 
delivery date for granted) and as a result, I have a different set of 
expectations when I deal with Impulse. It has made me a much happier 
customer. I'm able to bask in the joy of Imagine's many features, while 
ignoring some of the maddening aspects of dealing with Impulse. I've 
learned to rely on online user support, rather than Impulse tech 
support. I've learned to speak to Mike, and Mike only, when I've had to 
phone the company.

Basically, I learned quickly that people could bitch and complain all 
they want, Impulse was not going to change their ways. I had choices: I 
could bitch with the rest of'em and be quite aggravated; I could dump 
Imagine for other software; or I could focus my expectations on the 
software rather than its maker. I chose the latter, because it was the 
lowest-stress option, and it has brought me pleasure and relative 
serenity. Does that make me an Impulse yes-man, blindly dittoing 
whatever gets handed down? No, I still argue points and make 
suggestions. Does that mean I'm a quitter? Perhaps, some may think so, 
and I can see why they would. But I've made my decision. It became 
apparent that Impulse wasn't going to become perfect. I didn't want to 
go through the turmoil of learning another software package. I certainly 
didn't want to throw away the years of little tricks I'd learned, or the 
hours of pleasure I feel helping others learn this non-trivial program. 
So, I mellowed out and decided to enjoy life.


Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 17:31:12 
Subject: Spot sucking up a straw
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: NEWKIRK@delphi.com
> 
> Stephen: I'd think you could get the best visual impression on the liquid
> moving up the straw by animating some bubbles, varying sizes, moving up.

Yep, that brings to mind a simple fishbowl animation CBC shows during 
the extra 30-second spot after Sesame Street in the morning. They 
created an effective, yet disarmingly simple, bubble effect by having a 
few various-sized bubbles rotate along an off-center Z axis as they 
rise. You could do the same:

- In Detail, create some various-sized spheres, all some distance away 
from their axis. Save each as a separate object. The maximum distance or 
sphere radius should be such that the spheres would not stray beyond a 
vertical cylinder with the same radius as your straw.

- In Stage/Action, have each bubble follow the path that runs along the 
center of your straw. Their Y axis will align to the path. Then, add the 
Rotate20 F/X to make them rotate several times around the insides of the 
straw as they move along it. Use 1800 degrees around local Y, for example.

- By giving each bubble a different Rotate20 setting, they won't seem to 
be stuck together as a group.


This is just a tentative strategy, but it sounds promising. Whatcha think?


Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 17:36:46 
Subject: Freeze
From:    ALorence@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Is it possible to save the FREEZE data with a group of objects?  For some
reason, the group I'm working on loses the freeze settings when I save it.
 Is there something special I need to do?  I'm using PC 3.3.

Thanks.

Alan.

Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 17:56:09 
Subject: Re:Stage update problem(for Bill)
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Tom, I believe that those handy Position/Size/Alignment Bar menu items 
did not appear in Imagine until after version 2.0. If this is the case, 
here goes...

Bill, you can only make permanent changes in the Stage editor at a key
frame. A key frame is the last frame of one of the horizontal bars in the
Action editor. For example, if you set the max. # of frames to 30 and go
to Stage editor frame 10, load an object, save changes, and go to Action,
you'll see an Actor bar for that object, stretching from frame 10 to 30.
You'll also see Position, Size and Align bars, stretching from frame 10
to 10.  (Small bars indeed, but bars nonetheless)

The rule is:

      Any change you make in Stage, must be in the last
      frame of an Action bar. Otherwise, the change is lost as
      soon as you go to a different frame, or exit Stage.

Action editor bars specify the end values for any transformation. If an 
object starts at position 0,0,0 at frame 10, you'll typically have a 
one-frame bar showing that; and if the object then moves to 100,100,100 
by frame 30, you'll have a 19-frame position bar showing that, too. Even 
though the object's position will change over time, there is only one 
value stored in the timeline bar: the final value. If you were to go to 
frame 20, where the object is at 50,50,50, well--that doesn't reflect 
the value stored in the Action bar, which is 100,100,100. The FINAL 
value is always the one stored by Imagine, and the one you can change. 
This is why moving the object at frame 20 would accomplish nothing: 
nowhere in the staging file is the object position at frame 20 stored. 
What's stored is the position at frame 10, and the position at frame 30. 
Anything else is interpolated (calculated) by Imagine.

If you really want to affect an object partway through its Action bar, 
you have to split the bar in two; then, the first bar has a final value 
at frame X, which you can change interactively inthe Stage editor. This 
is what you do every time you want to change anything over time in Imagine: 
you typically have a one-frame bar at the beginning, followed by a long 
bar for the rest of the animation. The fact that you can interactively 
manipulate the object in both the first and last frames of the 
animation, is simply due to the fact that the first frame is the LAST 
frame of a tiny, one-frame bar, and therefore it's a key frame.

Ummm, is this clear? I've reworked this message 3 times already.


Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 18:01:21 
Subject: RE:Text in a circle
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

It should be noted that both methods described on the List are valid, 
and have their differences. Using straight text, Conformed to a 
Cylinder, gives geometrically-perfect curved text, whereas the "move 
each letter into place manually" method is inherently imprecise. 
Usually, it won't make a difference. I'm just the kind of guy who goes 
for numeric precision whenever he can, hoping he'll reap the rewards in 
some unforeseen future circumstance where slight variances will 
complicate his job tremendously. It's really a question of mindset.

One major difference, though, between the two methods: when 
conforming to a cylinder, the letters will be stretched where they 
lie further away from the cylinder; moving letters into place will leave 
the letterforms intact, but will create wedge-shaped gaps between the 
letters. Each effect has its use, but you should all be aware if this 
difference.

Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 18:14:53 
Subject: Texture mapping
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Remco v.d. Noord <rvdnoord@ivg.com>
> 
> 1. I have a triangular logo (2d, bitmap) and I want to wrap it up to
> something. To get it transparant, color 0 black should be black, right?
> But when I do this, black (of the wrap) is shown, instead of the meterial
> under it. What am I doing wrong?  (Using PC/486 with Imagine3, bitmaps
> drawn by Dpaint and PhotoShop.)

There are two kinds of bitmap files: palette-based images (usually, 
256-color and less) and non-palette-based (usually, 24-bit or 16-million 
colors).

If your brushmap is palette-based, Imagine's Genlock button will force 
palette color zero to be transparent. This means that any part of your 
image that is painted with the first palette position, will be 
transparent. The actual color does not matter; you could have the same 
color in another palette pot, and if you painted a circle with the 
latter, the circle would be visible. In your case, simply make sure that 
your logo is painted onto a background that has been filled with palette 
color zero.

If your brushmap is not palette-based, Imagine has no palette 
information on which to base its to-genlock-or-nor-to-genlock decision; 
in that case, it has to rely on a specific color value, and that value 
is found in the Preferences editor, under GENC. If you set GENC to 
000000 for example, everything that is totally black in your brushmap 
will appear as transparent. It could be the background, but it could 
also be a deep shadow on someone's face! You must ensure that the 
genlock color is not used anywhere else in the picture. In your case, 
you'd set GENC to the color of your background, and make sure that this 
color hasn't been used anywhere else.


Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 18:49:23 
Subject: RGB converter for DCTV
From:    Mike McCool <mikemcoo@efn.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Well, I finally got mine,--but I've gotta say, I don't know why I 
bothered.  Got it used, no software, no dox, but I assumed it was a 
simple patch, between the dctv and the RGB monitor/genlock.  

I hooked it up in what I assume is the correct position, nothing smoked 
when I turned everything back on,--but the rgb image is pathetic.  I 
expected something at least as good as the composite video signal.  I 
have both images displayed side by side on two 1084's, and the composite 
image is the dctv I know and love, the rgb image is dim, almost 
colorless. 

We were discussing this avenue to 24bit and video-out and genlocking dctv 
signals back in the summer, so I hope the list at large will excuse this 
not exactly Imagine related post.  Will someone who has this hardware 
please post me privately and assure me that I'm not doing everything I 
should, and that I didn't just throw my money away?

Thanks heaps.

Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 19:26:09 
Subject: Re:F50
From:    Granberg Tom <tom.granberg@TV2.no>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Kent Worley wrote:
when you put in windows do you use the slice function. and actually punch 
holes in the body of the car? I have a hard time with this.
 mumu@america.net

No, with the new smooth tool you can basicly build the whole lot and then pick 
the faces that make up the window and split it.

Later..

Tom Granberg


Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 19:38:40 
Subject: Re: Imagine 4.0 features...
From:    beeton@SEDSystems.ca (Gary Beeton - SED Systems)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

>Hello all!
>For the few of you that did not yet recieve the pamphlet from
>Impulse about the Imagine 4.0 upgrade and stuff, here is the
>complete list of features that will ~supposedly~ be added to
>Imagine 4.0....
>
>....
>- Metaballs editor with Special Effects.     -      (Ooooooo! Ahhhhhh! :-) )
>- Light arrays... soft edge shadows
>- Motion Blur - (also surely to be one of IM4's most valuable anim. features!)
>- Object Smoothing


FYI, everything but these last four features (I think) are already in 3.3.


Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 20:12:05 
Subject: LightArrays....???
From:    lumbient@superlink.net (!LuM!)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I had an Idea that may sound really stupid(nothing new for me)...
If Imagine has light arrays, then that means lights now have size...if
lights as size they should show in renders? Renderbrandt is that true?
Cause if it is then it would be trivial for imagine to add glows! 

                                            !LuM!

|--------------------------------------------------------\
|Anyone need a great checker floor?                       \
|Lumbient@superlink.net                                   /
|----ANYONE NEED ANYTHING BLOWN UP?--$40 AN INFERNO!-----<
|I can make the most realistic chrome spheres!            \
|They look great above the checkered floor!               /
|--------------------------------------------------------/


Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 20:15:12 
Subject: Re:text in a circle
From:    Granberg Tom <tom.granberg@TV2.no>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Mike Vandersomme wrote:
Really, Tom? I'm certainly no Imagine expert... but I am lazy. All
I do is create the text in spline editor, import it to Detail. Then
JOIN the object for one axis (centered). Then I rotate the axis, and
use CONFORM to Cylinder. With a little tweeking of the radius and size,
it does all the hard work for you.

I said it before, but I'll say it again nothing substitute hard work. You are 
perfectly right about conforming the text to a tube. But that will most 
certaintly deform your letters to "maybe" a degree of not being perfectly 
alright. This doesnt mean you cant do it, and it would work fine if the text was
 
long. But for a logo or short text,.......I dont know. But if someone like to do
 
it that way, good. My way of doing it isnt the only way, but it works for me so 

if anyone feel like doing it that way, fine, if they dont and prefer another 
way, that also perfectly fine. It is these kind of discusions that make the IML 

worth while, we all learn different aproaches of dealing with our ideas, and put 
them to life.

Later..

Tom

Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 20:20:47 
Subject: Re: LISTEN!!
From:    Vance Schowalter <viking@freenet.edmonton.ab.ca>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi, Charles.

Just jumping in on your comment about Imagine users being reluctant to  
pay the $100 to upgrade from 3.0 to 4.0. Personally, I'd love to, but I 
can't raise the cash in time to meet the deadline. As much as I'd love to 
have motion blurring, I'll have to live with 3.0, at least for a little 
while. *8^)


*******************************************
*    Vance Schowalter >>Image Master<<    *
*                                         *
* Internet: viking@freenet.edmonton.ab.ca *
*                                         *
*     "Affable little snow creature."     *
*******************************************


Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 21:01:25 
Subject: Re: Sound feature
From:    UNREGISTERED VERSION <dunc@eraser.demon.co.uk>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


>I can think of one right off the bat: Amigas and PCs handle sound 
>differently. Amigas don't need "Sound Cards" to play more than beeps. If 
>this feature were to be implemented, it would have to be platform 
>specific, and Impulse won't do that.

 I dont/wouldnt particularly want sound fx Imagine is a rendering program
and not an animation editor to add spot fx or what ever
 I think youre (well me) better off using the software designed to do the
job and not a piece of s/w that just has a passing interest

 If i want to add an embosed fx etc i dont try to do it with imagine i use 
an image processor or similar i do the same with sound 

 Each piece of s/w has its strengths if the sound was implemented all that
would happen is that we would get another 200+ mails complaining that the
sound fx doesnt support .wav or 8svx etc and it wont play loops etc and
impulse dont listern its buggy yeah ive read it all before

 well just my opinion

 \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\
 \\                           dunc@eraser.demon.co.uk                      \\
 \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\



Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 21:01:44 
Subject: Re: Cybervision
From:    beeton@SEDSystems.ca (Gary Beeton - SED Systems)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> I know Windows programs need to be written well to behave well.

Ahhh!  That explains why Microsoft applications are such dogs!!!  :)

Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 23:24:27 
Subject: Fire/flame/explosion FX (was Re: Imagine 4.0 features...)
From:    rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au (Robert Byrne)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hello Matthew,

> ....  can anyone tell me how to make good-looking
> fire/flame/explosion/hot sparks type effects. Some things similar to 
> the nice pictures in the pamphlet.

I can answer the fire part. The Amiga version of 3.0+ has a great Fire.itx,
but I don't think it was supplied with the PC version. I hope this is
rectified, it does an excellent job and renders fairly fast.

-- Bob

  :  Robert Byrne  : rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au :
  : Amiga A3000/25 :  Ballina, NSW  Australia  :


Date:    Friday, 13 October 1995 23:56:57 
Subject: Re: Sound feature
From:    rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au (Robert Byrne)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hello Roger, on Oct 12 you wrote:

> I can think of one right off the bat: Amigas and PCs handle sound 
> differently. Amigas don't need "Sound Cards" to play more than beeps. If 
> this feature were to be implemented, it would have to be platform 
> specific, and Impulse won't do that.

It would'nt have to be implemented to use internally generated sounds, my
understanding was that you would have a SFX timeline in the Action editor
and load a sound sample.  This could be any format, Wave for example.

-- Bob

  :  Robert Byrne  : rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au :
  : Amiga A3000/25 :  Ballina, NSW  Australia  :


Date:    Saturday, 14 October 1995 00:02:42 
Subject: Re: About bug fixes...a possible solution.
From:    web@cvsd.cv.com (William Bogan)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>
>
>I'd give up some speed to gain multitasking any day.

Hear hear!! Bring on WinImagine for those of us stuffed
in the PC world.

-Bill Bogan
--------------------------------------------------
"Where does he get those wonderful toys?"
                              the Joker, Batman 
--------------------------------------------------
You'd have thought he was talking about Imagine!
--------------------------------------------------


Date:    Saturday, 14 October 1995 00:55:33 
Subject: Converting anims to PC
From:    Darryl_Lewis@comlink.mpx.com.au (Darryl Lewis)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

 I have a number of IFF (amiga) anims that I'd like to convert to the PC.
They are looping anims, so is it possible to have looping anims on the PC?
What package can I use to play them, preferable that it can be triggered by
a command line rather that from windoze.

Thanks.
Darryl

-- Via DLG Pro v1.0

               #####\             _             /#####
               #( )# |          _( )__         | #( )# 
               ##### |         /_    /         | #####
               #" "# |     ___m/I_ //_____     | #" "#
               # O # |____#-x.\ /++m\ /.x-#____| # O #
               #m.m# |   /" \ ///###\\\ / "\   | #m.m#
               #####/    ######/     \######    \#####

Date:    Saturday, 14 October 1995 04:17:52 
Subject: Re: Restoring my confidence
From:    Fred Aderhold <fredster@netrix.net>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 05:21 PM 10/13/95 -0400, you wrote:

>
>Basically, I learned quickly that people could bitch and complain all 
>they want, Impulse was not going to change their ways. I had choices: I 
>could bitch with the rest of'em and be quite aggravated; I could dump 
>Imagine for other software; or I could focus my expectations on the 
>software rather than its maker. I chose the latter, because it was the 

If this doesn't end the bitching, nothing will. Thanks...

--------------------------------------------
Fred Aderhold
fredster@netrix.net
http://www.netrix.net/users/fredster

Daddy, what does formatting drive C mean?
--------------------------------------------


Date:    Saturday, 14 October 1995 04:43:28 
Subject: Re: new magazine
From:    Bill Boyce <bilboyce@iconz.co.nz>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 01:25 PM 11/10/95 -0400, Valleyview@aol.com wrote:
>I'm not trying to sell this magazine, just wanted to pass along what I think
>is a good find.
>
>Rick
>
>"3D Design" - 1-800-829-2505   $29.95/year domestic subscription
>
International number/website/e-mail etc??

Sounds interesting...

Bill Boyce


Date:    Saturday, 14 October 1995 06:16:18 
Subject: Re: LISTEN!!
From:    UNREGISTERED VERSION <dunc@eraser.demon.co.uk>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


>understand how annoying it is to debug a program like a raytracer!!!

 Yeah it maybe but if you going to sell something then perhaps you should
try a bit harder 


>to pull amiga let 'em.  Buy a pentium for $1700 and let life go on.  I for


 And then i could spend that much again (at least) to get the software setup
that i have on my amiga

>-------Upgrades & Bug fixes-----------
>If Impulse would just use the internet the way its supposed to then this

 YES There is a 3.0 patch on aminet But obviously this is a little old now



 \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\
 \\                           dunc@eraser.demon.co.uk                      \\
 \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\



Date:    Saturday, 14 October 1995 08:05:00 
Subject: Forge is Superior to PreView
From:    KEN_ROBERTSON@robelle.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

For creating textures, and fiddling around with parameters, I find
that Forge is far superior to the Texture Preview feature in 3.3.

One really nice thing about it (apart from the really slick
and intuitive interface) is the fact that it does iterative calculations
on the textures.  This means that you can get a good general idea
without having to wait too long.  It lets you mix and match textures
on-the-fly, disabling or enabling them, so you can watch the effect.

Sure, it can create brush-maps, but I mainly use it to create
attribute files that I can apply to an object using the "load" button
of the attribute requestor.

I do wish that Forge had a good database of Imagine's textures, tho.
For whatever reason, they do not.  (Maybe copyright stuff?)

Often I will multi-task Forge and Imagine 3.3, tweaking and applying
my texture attributes.
\KenR
-------------------------------------------------------------------
"The pants are no good without the belt, or is it the other way
around?"
          Dave Lee, CNR

Date:    Saturday, 14 October 1995 08:11:00 
Subject: Sound Feature
From:    KEN_ROBERTSON@robelle.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

No, no, no, no.  All I'd like is a simply "bong" (okay, maybe
a configurable 8svx file) that would play when a frame has
completed rendering.  On my old Amiga 1200/030/50Mhz, some renderings
can take an hour.  TEST renderings, that is.  It would be nice if
the machine went "bong" when the frame was completed.

Or even better, "ka*bong!" when an error occurs.  Hard drive full?
Ka*bong!  Missing lights?  Ka*bong!  Well, when I switch to
a Pentium sometime in the next six months with my 1.2 Gig+ drive,
that'll _never_ happen.  Hah.

\KenWishingOnAStarR
--------------------------------------------------------------------
"It's not easy being green."
                   Kermit The Frog

Date:    Saturday, 14 October 1995 09:09:38 
Subject: Re:Win-Imagine
From:    Bob Arnold <barnold@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


It's funny but it kinda seems that everyone here on IML thinks Windoze 
will slow Imagine waaaaay down ... it's very do-able to make fast grfx 
under Win but it's also very easy to make it a pooch.  It takes a lot of 
Win miles under the belt to work in the environment and come up with a 
tool (vs. a toy).  The real benefit (okay, the buttons are nice too) will 
be the ability to map out to a MASSIVE amount of virtual RAM IMHO.  -Bob


On 14 Oct 1995, Granberg Tom wrote:

> Hi
> 
> I just want to say something about what I saw when I visited them in August. 
> Zack was programing a draw routine under windows that apeaered to me to be 
> lightning fast, even faster than dos or at least as fast, very impressive. So 
I 
> for one looking forward to see what they come up with. When they put out win 
> Imagine.
> 
> Tom Granberg
> 
> 

Date:    Saturday, 14 October 1995 10:23:30 
Subject: Re:Win-Imagine
From:    Granberg Tom <tom.granberg@TV2.no>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi

I just want to say something about what I saw when I visited them in August. 
Zack was programing a draw routine under windows that apeaered to me to be 
lightning fast, even faster than dos or at least as fast, very impressive. So I 

for one looking forward to see what they come up with. When they put out win 
Imagine.

Tom Granberg


Date:    Saturday, 14 October 1995 10:36:33 
Subject: Re:Light arrays
From:    Granberg Tom <tom.granberg@TV2.no>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Lum you wrote:
*I had an Idea that may sound really stupid(nothing new for me)...
*If Imagine has light arrays, then that means lights now have size...if
*lights as size they should show in renders? Renderbrandt is that true?
*Cause if it is then it would be trivial for imagine to add glows! 

                      
The light arrays are realy a bunch of light "lines" positioned between the z-x 
axis, so the bigger the axis the larger the soft edge will be. Glows on the 
other hand are realy a post production feature, ok, you could make it a part of 

the renderer(show up in reflective obj) but this would take a lot of time. The 
post production aproach is in my opinion the way to go, since it could be writen
 
as you like it. The only thing I think it shouldnt be, is a global effect, it 
should be a flag in the lights attributes. Then when the post feature needs the 

information it would go look for it in the individual obj(axis)lights, wich is 
stored in the staging file. At least the staging file will tell it witch object 
apearing in the frame it is about to do, and can look in the attributes and see 

if that flag is set or not. Like the lensflare, all globalfx can find objects in
 
the scene, or rather could if the effect was writen to do it, like the 
lensflarefx.

Later 
Tom Granberg "Renderbrandt"
 

Date:    Saturday, 14 October 1995 11:21:09 
Subject: Sound Support
From:    jbk4@email.psu.edu (The Prophet)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

On the Amiga side:

  You can get MainActor(shareware) or MainActorPro(commercial).  It is great
for assembly & converting animations.  The version I use converts between
FLI/FLC/ANIM formats.  It supports ANIM5, ANIM7 long & short, ANIM8 l & s and
several grafix boards.  You can also add sound to your anims.

Jaeson K.
 ____            ____            _           _
( |  \          ( /  \          ( )       _ / )
 )|   )_   __    /   /_   _  __  /   __  ( X_)
( |  /~ \ /\_)  /---~/ ) / )/  )/~\ /\_)  / _
 )ll/  l/ \__ (/   (/   (_//__//  / \__  (___)
(____________)        (___/        (___)

Jaeson Koszarsky                  Amiga 3000
----------------                  -----------
cyberprophet@psu.edu              68040/30Mhz
jbk4@email.psu.edu                24Megs-ZIP
jason@chaos.ezgate.com            OS3.1

Date:    Saturday, 14 October 1995 12:25:49 
Subject: Re: Liquid in a straw (was Re: Moan, moan, moan.)
From:    sgiff@airmail.net (Stephen Gifford)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Thanks to the people who sent me replies on the liquid up a straw thing.
The perfect solution came from Robert Byrne who posted this:
>
>I've done something like this a while back.  I extruded a glass tube using
>a path to get a spiral shaped straw and kept that path as a reference for
>the liquid.  I then scaled down the template for the glass tube so it was
>the same size as the tube's hole.  I can't remember the method I used but
>you could either use the Grow F/X to extrude the liquid over time and
>follow the original path or have a cylinder "conform object to path" as it
>moves through the tube. The results I achieved were very realistic
>particularly when the liquid was a bright colour, it reflected into the
>glass and the straw took on its colour.
>
>-- Bob

And with a combination of Charles Blaquiere's bubbles,

>>Yep, that brings to mind a simple fishbowl animation CBC shows during 
>>the extra 30-second spot after Sesame Street in the morning. They 
>>created an effective, yet disarmingly simple, bubble effect by having a 
>>few various-sized bubbles rotate along an off-center Z axis as they 
>>rise. You could do the same:

>>- In Detail, create some various-sized spheres, all some distance away 
>>from their axis. Save each as a separate object. The maximum distance or 
>>sphere radius should be such that the spheres would not stray beyond a 
>>vertical cylinder with the same radius as your straw.

>>- In Stage/Action, have each bubble follow the path that runs along the 
>>center of your straw. Their Y axis will align to the path. Then, add the 
>>Rotate20 F/X to make them rotate several times around the insides of the 
>>straw as they move along it. Use 1800 degrees around local Y, for example.

>>- By giving each bubble a different Rotate20 setting, they won't seem to 
>>be stuck together as a group.

This creates a very realistic effect altogether.  Thanks


Date:    Saturday, 14 October 1995 13:17:20 
Subject: Sound Feature
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: KEN_ROBERTSON@robelle.com
> 
> No, no, no, no.  All I'd like is a simply "bong" (okay, maybe a
> configurable 8svx file) that would play when a frame has completed
> rendering.  On my old Amiga 1200/030/50Mhz, some renderings can take an
> hour.  TEST renderings, that is.  It would be nice if the machine went
> "bong" when the frame was completed. 
> 
> Or even better, "ka*bong!" when an error occurs.  Hard drive full?
> Ka*bong!

Here's an idea: an ARexx macro that monitors the size of the 
ram:quickrender file every minute, and sounds a "bong" when the size 
stops changing. This would solve your problem, and is one of the most 
basic ARexx macros you could ever write.

> Missing lights?  Ka*bong!

Well, that's one thing my macro solution wouldn't give you.


Date:    Saturday, 14 October 1995 13:43:31 
Subject: Re:Win-Imagine
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Granberg Tom <tom.granberg@TV2.no>
> 
> I just want to say something about what I saw when I visited them in
> August.  Zack was programing a draw routine under windows that apeaered
> to me to be lightning fast, even faster than dos or at least as fast,
> very impressive.

Wellll, all I can say is, I hope it's not some nonstandard hack. In the 
immediate future, hard-coded shortcuts may give you a performance boost, 
but the incompatibilities always come back to bite you later on, 
compared with doing everything the way the OS intended. And these days, 
anybody who's concerned about sluggish Windows performance has an 
accelerated video card anyway, so I don't feel much would be gained by 
using devious shortcuts. Here's to hoping that the fast draw routine you 
saw, used standard Windows procedures.


Date:    Saturday, 14 October 1995 15:26:00 
Subject: Text in a circle
From:    mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com (Mike Vandersommen)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

-> From: spack@mv.us.adobe.com->-> But doesn't this cause the letters to 'warp' 
due to the conformati=on?-> approach does not cause this to happen.  I guess it 
depends on wha=t o-> are looking for...Well, it can...but it depends on where yo
ur axis is and how you setyour radius and size. I've compared my logo with circu
lar letteringto Tom's (in the "glossy brochure") and I don't see much difference
.It seems, as long as your letters are separate objects, it simplyrotates each l
etter slightly to the bend. Try it...   /------------------------------         
  ___   ___  ___   ___  | Mike van der Sommen                     / __  /__/ /__
/  /_   \ /  | Santa Barbara, Ca.                     /___/ / \  /  /  /     / \
  | mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com     HAUS BBS (805-683-1388)  |        
   "Blackouts make for nice breaks in the day"   \______________________________
_______________________________--- =FE InterNet - GraFX Haus BBS - Santa Barbara
, Ca - (805) 683-1388

Date:    Saturday, 14 October 1995 15:31:00 
Subject: Text in a circle
From:    mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com (Mike Vandersommen)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

-> From: --Craig <dalamar@MIT.EDU>-> And I believe you can then slice the object
 with itself to regain =the-> initial grouped letters, as Slice will separate no
n-contiguous-> objects. Of course, I think you lose those nifty subgroups that t
h=e-> Spline Editor creates for you, but they're probably lost in the Jo=in-> an
yway.I haven't tried it, but I think you can even use conform to cylinderwith gr
ouped objects (thus saving your subgroups) but I don't seemuch advantage, since 
you can split faces into subgroups after youhave JOINED them anyway. Especially 
if you've used a bevel in spline.   /------------------------------           __
_   ___  ___   ___  | Mike van der Sommen                     / __  /__/ /__/  /
_   \ /  | Santa Barbara, Ca.                     /___/ / \  /  /  /     / \  | 
mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com     HAUS BBS (805-683-1388)  |           "
Blackouts make for nice breaks in the day"   \__________________________________
___________________________--- =FE InterNet - GraFX Haus BBS - Santa Barbara, Ca - (805) 683-1388

Date:    Saturday, 14 October 1995 16:39:41 
Subject: Re: text in a circle
From:    Valleyview@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Two good methods have been given.

Mike suggests conforming to a cylinder. This is easier and will not only
conform the text but also each individule letter. For example the bottom of
the letter "L'' will be curved to conform also. This is a great idea if that
is the look you want.

Tom suggests rotating each letter around a given center, which will keep each
letter in its original square look. Spacing can also be manipulated easier.
This may be just what you need.

Two methods for two different looks.

I do have a question for Tom, please correct me if I am wrong:
If in the spline editor, instead of adding the whole word as text, you were
to add each individule letter as text. This would pile all the letters on top
of each other with their axis all in the same position. Then after grouping
and going to detail, pick all and move all the axis at once to the rotation
center. Then you could just rotate each letter without moving any to "line
up" with the first. Will this work even if it is easier?

Rick

Date:    Saturday, 14 October 1995 16:39:41 
Subject: Re: Win-Imagine
From:    Valleyview@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Aren't all DOS programs 16 bit. And Windows used to be 16 bit, which, because
of the GUI, ran some programs slower. But most new windows programs (I hope
WinImagine) are 32 bit programs, so they should run FASTER?

Rick

Date:    Saturday, 14 October 1995 16:49:02 
Subject: Re: Just showin' off...
From:    Mike McCool <mikemcoo@efn.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

That's a gorgeous pic?  Any chance you'll share that object?  I realize 
that's like asking you to give away months of work.  

Since this is a welfare state, with ordinary currency on the decline, I 
could probably trade some of my ram stamps or my HD stamps for some 
Imagine Obj stamps, and offer you, say $100.  I might even have some 
Monopoly Money, which might be a little more valuable . . .  

All seriousness aside, that is a gorgeous strat. 

Date:    Saturday, 14 October 1995 16:51:00 
Subject: Restoring my confidence
From:    mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com (Mike Vandersommen)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

-> From: Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>->-> Basically, I learned quickly that p
eople could bitch and complain =all-> they want, Impulse was not going to change
 their ways. I had choic=es:-> could bitch with the rest of'em and be quite aggr
avated; I could d=ump-> Imagine for other software; or I could focus my expectat
ions on th=e-> software rather than its maker. I chose the latter-> So, I mellow
ed out and decided to enjoy life.Well said and MegaDittos Charles!And of course 
the 2 years supply of Lithium didn't hurt. :)   /------------------------------ 
          ___   ___  ___   ___  | Mike van der Sommen                     / __  
/__/ /__/  /_   \ /  | Santa Barbara, Ca.                     /___/ / \  /  /  /
     / \  | mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com     HAUS BBS (805-683-1388)  |
           "Blackouts make for nice breaks in the day"   \______________________
_______________________________________--- =FE InterNet - GraFX Haus BBS - Santa
 Barbara, Ca - (805) 683-1388

Date:    Saturday, 14 October 1995 18:11:27 
Subject: RE:converting anims to PC
From:    jbk4@email.psu.edu (The Prophet)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

MainActor can convert the anims to FLI/FLC for you, maybe AVI(I'm not
sure).

First, use mainactor to disassemble the amiga anim into individual
files.  The files may have to be converted to another format before
you could assemble the pc anim.  You'll have to check the docs on
that.  Once you have the correct format pix, you can use MainActor
to build the PC FLI/FLC anim.  

I've seen a pro version of MainActor in some recent Amiga mags.  It
does a lot more and supports many more formats.  

Jaeson K.
 ____            ____            _           _
( |  \          ( /  \          ( )       _ / )
 )|   )_   __    /   /_   _  __  /   __  ( X_)
( |  /~ \ /\_)  /---~/ ) / )/  )/~\ /\_)  / _
 )ll/  l/ \__ (/   (/   (_//__//  / \__  (___)
(____________)        (___/        (___)

Jaeson Koszarsky                  Amiga 3000+
----------------                  -----------
cyberprophet@psu.edu              68040/30Mhz
jbk4@email.psu.edu                24Megs-1GIG
jason@chaos.ezgate.com            OS3.1

Date:    Saturday, 14 October 1995 18:27:34 
Subject: Re: Environment mapping
From:    greggh@dialup01.odyssey.apana.org.au (Gregory Helleren)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi cjo (cjo), in <9510131235.aa23377@unixpc.esrange.ssc.se> on Oct 13 you wrote:


> Greg H wrote;
> >Is the prohibition of flat xz environment mapping a bug?
>
> No, it's most likely not a bug.
> The question is: what would a flat environment look like?
>
I flat reflection of the environment, as is given my a real flat mirror.
Spherical and cylindrical are find for curved or lumpy objects, but there
are times when flat is the only way to go.

Love Peace and dates
Gregg

--
+-----------------------------------------///\/\/\_Amiga Technologies_/\/\+
  Gregg Helleren         AMIGA is REBORN /// Lecturer Information Technology
  Developer - LaseRage                  ///  SEMC TAFE Western Australia
  Ferndale W.A. Australia ____/\___/\\\///   greggh@odyssey.apana.org.au
  CBMNET:greggh@laserage.adsp.sub.org\XX/    greggh@laserage.DIALix.oz.au
+--------------------------------------------------------------------------+



Date:    Saturday, 14 October 1995 19:42:19 
Subject: Imagine anims => MPEG
From:    rvdnoord@epsilon.nl (Remco v.d. Noord)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi, some questions from a beginner:

1. Does anyone have a program (PD?) to convert Imagine anims to MPEG anims?

2. Sometimes I got an error when I want to wrap a .lbm picure (PC -dpaint),
like "error loading brush". What's wrong?

3. Who has some nice WWW/FTP adresses for me?

4. How can I create this light-effect: like in real life, when it's foggy
outside and shine with a electric torch.


BTW using a PC.


Thanks,
        Remco


Date:    Saturday, 14 October 1995 20:44:23 
Subject: Re: Imagine anims => MPEG
From:    sgiff@airmail.net (Stephen Gifford)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

>Hi, some questions from a beginner:
>
>1. Does anyone have a program (PD?) to convert Imagine anims to MPEG anims?
>
>2. Sometimes I got an error when I want to wrap a .lbm picure (PC -dpaint),
>like "error loading brush". What's wrong?
>
>3. Who has some nice WWW/FTP adresses for me?
>
>4. How can I create this light-effect: like in real life, when it's foggy
>outside and shine with a electric torch.
>
>
>BTW using a PC.
>
>
>Thanks,
>        Remco
>
CMpeg is available at many different sites on the net.  Use Webcrawler or
some other search tool and you will find it.  CMpeg makes 24 bit animations
that are playable under Windows or Dos.  I just create an anim 320 x 240
that was 52 megs worth of files.  It compressed down to 900k and looks great
in 24 bit.  It has frame rates from 23 fps to 30 fps.  You can find a few
viewers like VMpeg also by same author Stefan Eckhart.  You can find a
Windows viewer by Compucore called Softpeg at this site:
http://www.cs.tu-berlin.de/~phade/mpeg.html it is nice and very fast.  It
requires no special video card, however it helps if you have a fast one.

Stephen G.


Date:    Saturday, 14 October 1995 20:53:39 
Subject: Just showin' off...
From:    Fred Aderhold <fredster@netrix.net>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Finally! Something I'm proud enough of to mention in the IML :)

I've spent the last month or so (off/on) modelling an electric guitar:

http://www.netrix.net/users/fredster/images/gallery/strat.jpg


--------------------------------------------
Fred Aderhold
fredster@netrix.net
http://www.netrix.net/users/fredster

Daddy, what does formatting drive C mean?
--------------------------------------------


Date:    Saturday, 14 October 1995 23:51:32 
Subject: Re: Forge is Superior to PreView
From:    rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au (Robert Byrne)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hello Ken, on Oct 14 you wrote:

> I do wish that Forge had a good database of Imagine's textures, tho.
> For whatever reason, they do not.  (Maybe copyright stuff?)

Unfortunately, this is one of Forge's downfalls, it is'nt totally
compatible with Imagine textures, some work some don't. TextureStudio on
the other hand accepts any texture and has many more features, such as axis
positioning and alignment, not bad for a $25 shareware program. I hope the
authors consider a version for the PC.

-- Bob

  :  Robert Byrne  : rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au :
  : Amiga A3000/25 :  Ballina, NSW  Australia  :


Date:    Sunday, 15 October 1995 00:28:26 
Subject: Compositing
From:    David Nix <WRNIX@uga.cc.uga.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

A semi Imagine related question-

In the  high end  marketplace, its  very common  to render  out elements
individually and composite them together for  the final piece. Do any of
you  have any  tips for  doing  this with  Imagine? I've  got ADPro  and
ProControl, but I  always seem to have a really  tough time with ADPro's
compositing  functions.  Are   any  of  the  third   party  ADPro  batch
controllers of any help?

Since ASDG/Elastic Reality has abandoned the  Amiga, I cant call them up
for help (not that they would  have anyhow), and currently I cant really
afford anything  else image processing wise...  Imagine currently doesnt
generate an alpha channel on its own, so what do you wizards suggest?

I  guess I'm  kinda  looking  for a  poor  man's  Wavefront Composer  or
AfterEffects type solution...

Oh, and on  a definite IML related topic, if  Dave Wickard is monitoring
the list, now would be a good time for a blanket posting to all of the various
ways to get his attention for unsubcribing... A few too many posters seem to
be stuck here... :-)


Dave Nix

Date:    Sunday, 15 October 1995 00:47:00 
Subject: Rendering Problems
From:    eduardo.gomez@canrem.com (Eduardo Gomez)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hello.   I'm  having  troubles  with  Imagine  3.0.   Sometimes when I'm
rendering the software crashes.  I have the problem when I try to render
certain proyects in particular, and on scanline mode.  Somebody wrote in
the  IML  that  long names for objects (specially when they are repeated
and  named  "XXX.1, XXX.2," etc) can cause troubles, so I made sure that
this  is  not the case.  This is all the info I can provide so far about
this problem. I would appreciate any help. Thanks.

E.G.


Date:    Sunday, 15 October 1995 02:00:02 
Subject: Re: Win-Imagine
From:    lumbient@superlink.net (!LuM!)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

>Aren't all DOS programs 16 bit.

They don't have to be.  DOS is 16-bit, but I use a dos extender to use
32-bit dos. A dos extender is a program that allows your program to run in
32-bit. Making a program doesn't really give it a lot of speed increse tho.

> And Windows used to be 16 bit, which, because
>of the GUI, ran some programs slower. But most new windows programs (I hope
>WinImagine) are 32 bit programs, so they should run FASTER?

In windoze a 32-bit app does gain some speed but not much, what gets faster
is the redraws(32-bit GDI's) and file reads and writes(32-bit file access).

>
>Rick

Hello Rick.

                                            !LuM!

|--------------------------------------------------------\
|Anyone need a great checker floor?                       \
|Lumbient@superlink.net                                   /
|----ANYONE NEED ANYTHING BLOWN UP?--$40 AN INFERNO!-----<
|I can make the most realistic chrome spheres!            \
|They look great above the checkered floor!               /
|--------------------------------------------------------/


Date:    Sunday, 15 October 1995 02:57:23 
Subject: Spline modelling vs. Forms Editor (was: modeller)
From:    Dave Hardenbrook <DAVEH47@delphi.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In regards to doing 3D splines, rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au (Robert Byrne) 
writes:
>My only suggestion is have a look at the Forms Editor and persevere with
>it. You can create some very complex objects with it, not just vases etc.

Does one really need a spline modeller at all when we have the Forms Ed.?

                             -- Dave

P.S. The above question assumes that the *renderer itself* does not
support 3D spline objects...

Date:    Sunday, 15 October 1995 03:19:39 
Subject: Re: Win-Imagine
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-14 14:15:10 EDT, you write:

>It's funny but it kinda seems that everyone here on IML thinks Windoze 
>will slow Imagine waaaaay down ... it's very do-able to make fast grfx 
>under Win but it's also very easy to make it a pooch.  It takes a lot of 
>Win miles under the belt to work in the environment and come up with a 
>tool (vs. a toy).  The real benefit (okay, the buttons are nice too) will 
>be the ability to map out to a MASSIVE amount of virtual RAM IMHO.  -Bob

If it's win95 compliant and coded to work with it there can be some major
speed increases.  I've seen this now working with Acad.  It used to run using
win32's and was a major dog to operate even on a P90 but when we started
running it under win95 there were some major speed increases.  It's supposed
to get even better once it becomes fully win95 compliant.  If Imagine is
written to work with windoze for workgroups then we won't get the benefit of
running under NT or win95 and when the P6 comes on the scene, it may actually
run slower.



Date:    Sunday, 15 October 1995 03:25:51 
Subject: Imagine 4
From:    Valleyview@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Instead of reading about the new features in 4 just go to www.websharx.com
and SEE the new features. Look under Captain Video's area in the blob
gallery.
Impressive! I can't wait.

Date:    Sunday, 15 October 1995 07:05:22 
Subject: Re: Just showin' off...
From:    Fred Aderhold <fredster@netrix.net>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 04:49 PM 10/14/95 -0700, you wrote:

>That's a gorgeous pic?  Any chance you'll share that object?  I realize 
>that's like asking you to give away months of work.  

Actually, I'd been thinking about putting it somewhere, I might just put it
up on my web page. First, I'll have to clean it up a bit. :) I'll let ya know...


Which leads to another question:

I've gotten objects off aminet before, and found that the creator's
directory structure was not the same as mine, and that was a pain in the
butt. I'd like to avoid that - anyone have any suggestions? Is that even
possible?

>All seriousness aside, that is a gorgeous strat. 

Thanks - Love that feedback!

--------------------------------------------
Fred Aderhold
fredster@netrix.net
http://www.netrix.net/users/fredster

Daddy, what does formatting drive C mean?
--------------------------------------------


Date:    Sunday, 15 October 1995 07:31:32 
Subject: Re: Text in a circle
From:    UNREGISTERED VERSION <dunc@eraser.demon.co.uk>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

 I think you lose those nifty subgroups that the
>Spline Editor creates for you, but they're probably lost in the Join
>anyway.

 No you dont 
  


 \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\
 \\                           dunc@eraser.demon.co.uk                      \\
 \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\



Date:    Sunday, 15 October 1995 08:22:35 
Subject: Re: Sound feature
From:    Bill Boyce <bilboyce@iconz.co.nz>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 09:56 AM 14/10/95 +1000, you wrote:
>Hello Roger, on Oct 12 you wrote:
>
>> I can think of one right off the bat: Amigas and PCs handle sound 
>> differently. Amigas don't need "Sound Cards" to play more than beeps. If 
>> this feature were to be implemented, it would have to be platform 
>> specific, and Impulse won't do that.
>
>It would'nt have to be implemented to use internally generated sounds, my
>understanding was that you would have a SFX timeline in the Action editor
>and load a sound sample.  This could be any format, Wave for example.
>
>-- Bob

What would be good (and many high end proggies have it) is to be able to
hear a soundtrack as you edit an animation in the stage editor. Eg, when
you generate a preview and 'scrub' the animation in playback, the sound
track would scrub with it so you can line up lip syncing etc. Does that
make sense (the explanation, not the feature)?

Bill Boyce


Date:    Sunday, 15 October 1995 08:27:17 
Subject: Re: Rendering Problems
From:    Bill Boyce <bilboyce@iconz.co.nz>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 07:47 PM 14/10/95 -0500, you wrote:
>Hello.   I'm  having  troubles  with  Imagine  3.0.   Sometimes when I'm
>rendering the software crashes.  I have the problem when I try to render
>certain proyects in particular, and on scanline mode.  Somebody wrote in
>the  IML  that  long names for objects (specially when they are repeated
>and  named  "XXX.1, XXX.2," etc) can cause troubles, so I made sure that
>this  is  not the case.  This is all the info I can provide so far about
>this problem. I would appreciate any help. Thanks.
>
>E.G.

Only thing I could suggest would be to eliminate objects etc from the project
(clone it first!) until the problem goes away, to narrow things down. Then
'we' can start to look at it for you!

Bill Boyce


Date:    Sunday, 15 October 1995 08:36:41 
Subject: Re: Imagine anims => MPEG
From:    Bill Boyce <bilboyce@iconz.co.nz>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 08:42 PM 14/10/95 +0100, you wrote:
>Hi, some questions from a beginner:
>
>1. Does anyone have a program (PD?) to convert Imagine anims to MPEG anims?
>
>2. Sometimes I got an error when I want to wrap a .lbm picure (PC -dpaint),
>like "error loading brush". What's wrong?

Stencil turned on in DPaint when you saved? A lot of prog's spit the dummy
when they try to load images when this is done.

>3. Who has some nice WWW/FTP adresses for me?

Specific interests? Check out http://www.websharx.com if you haven't already.
Lots of cool Imagine stuff

>4. How can I create this light-effect: like in real life, when it's foggy
>outside and shine with a electric torch.

Create a cone, make it almost transparent (a little yellow) apply a fractal
type texture to the object and don't tack it. Move it by shifting the points
in point edit mode and storing them in states. This effectively makes the
texture stay still while the beam moves making it look like it is moving
through fog. Play around with this a little, you should get the result
you want. Can't remember what effect Fog has on textures, but play with that
too. Phew. That's off the top of my head, so E&OE!


>BTW using a PC.

OD, HS, NM

>
>
>Thanks,
>        Remco
Welcome

Bill Boyce

>
>


Date:    Sunday, 15 October 1995 09:59:39 
Subject: Re: compositing
From:    Doug Smith <doug@defocus.demon.co.uk>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi David,

        You wrote this about compositing:

: In the  high end  marketplace, its  very common  to render  out elements
: individually and composite them together for  the final piece. 

Try Photogenics, it's amazingly good, and only 55UKP.

It'll read standard Imagine output as well as IFF24 and a whole host of other 
formats.

You can do variable transparancy and all that sort of thing, and as it works 
with alpha channels you can even attempt some multilayer composition.

:  Imagine currently doesnt
: generate an alpha channel on its own, so what do you wizards suggest?
:

Render on top of a single colour background, then tolerance floodfill it in,
blur the paint layer, move paint layer to alpha, It'll take about 5 mouse 
clicks.
 
: I  guess I'm  kinda  looking  for a  poor  man's  Wavefront Composer  or
: AfterEffects type solution...
: 

You won't be disappointed.

Photogenics is Amiga only, It will work on ECS machines with a 16 colour 
preview (yuk), on AGA machines with 256 colour or HAM8 fast preview (slows 
down a lot if you use a DBL screenmode) and it supports any CyberGraphics 
card for fast 8/15/16/24 bit painting.

I'm not associated with Almathera in any way.

Cheers,

Doug.

--
Amiga 4000/40 2+12 2M CV64 - Not better, just different

Life's just not fair - this is a good thing.

Date:    Sunday, 15 October 1995 10:03:52 
Subject: Re: Spline modelling vs. Forms Editor (was: modeller)
From:    Doug Smith <doug@defocus.demon.co.uk>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi Dave,

        You wrote this about Spline modelling vs. Forms Editor (was:
modeller):
: In regards to doing 3D splines, rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au (Robert Byrne)
: writes:
: >My only suggestion is have a look at the Forms Editor and persevere with
: >it. You can create some very complex objects with it, not just vases etc.
: 
: Does one really need a spline modeller at all when we have the Forms Ed.?
: 

Well, Imagine is really a polygonal modeller, and I havn't seen anyone manage
to really integrate splines and polygons yet.

It sure would be nice to be able to load forms objects back into the forms
editor after you've played around with them in detail.

Cheers,

Doug.

--
Amiga 4000/40 2+12 2M CV64 - Not better, just different

Life's just not fair - this is a good thing.

Date:    Sunday, 15 October 1995 11:38:43 
Subject: Re: Text in a circle
From:    Paul Thompson <shinobi@gold.interlog.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> I haven't tried it, but I think you can even use conform to cylinder
> with grouped objects (thus saving your subgroups) but I don't see
> much advantage, since you can split faces into subgroups after you
> have JOINED them anyway. Especially if you've used a bevel in spline.

S'funny, but I don't recall anyone on the list mentioning that you can 
simply take your lettering from the spline editor (after extruding, of 
course) and going into the action editor, conform group/object to a 
circular or oval or square (or whatever) path, then snapshot the object.  
Works nicely, and you can choose a non-circular path.

My .02 cents worth.

Paul


Date:    Sunday, 15 October 1995 13:04:27 
Subject: Something WOW I saw
From:    gregory denby <gdenby@bach.helios.nd.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


Hi all,
Just got back from a conference where I saw something that dropped
my jaw to the floor.  This is 3D related so I thought I might mention
it here.

What I saw was the "gamma" version of a 3d digitizing tool that
simultaneously acquires surface geometry, coloration and translucency.
The hardware as it now stands handles fairly small objects, about
the volume of a cylinder 12" high and radius 5-6".  It will acquire
a simple object, such as a vase, in about 1 minute to a resolution
of .25 mm.  More complex objects require multiple re-alignments.
The most complex objects have taken about 4 hours.  The object files
resulting up to 10M.

If I figured correctly from the figures the guy mentioned, some objects
have 80,000 facets, but they are working on reduction algorithms which
will drop it down to around 5000, and still keep it looking pretty
good with the brush map applied.

The demo was running on either an Indigo or an Indy, I forgot to notice
which since the display was so facinating.  The fellow said the main
advantage to using SG was its built in 3d library, but really the
product would run on anything, just slower.

They are about 2 yaers from a commercial product.

The objects are viewable with stereo goggles, and the detail is
completely astonishing.  You can see the texture of paint and canvas
on scanned paintings, for instance.

Being a good Imagineer, I promptly hung the app when I tried rotating and
zooming an object simujltaneously:->.

Oh well, back to the foothills of the 3D Olympus.

Greg Denby

Date:    Sunday, 15 October 1995 13:58:34 
Subject: RE:Text in a circle
From:    UNREGISTERED VERSION <dunc@eraser.demon.co.uk>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  




>One major difference, though, between the two methods: when 
>conforming to a cylinder, the letters will be stretched where they 
>lie further away from the cylinder; moving letters into place will leave 
>the letterforms intact, but will create wedge-shaped gaps between the 
>letters. Each effect has its use, but you should all be aware if this 
>difference.

 This is right being lazy i joined a spline logo then conformed it to a path
in my logo was a U and it was splayed to say the least -i just left it 
noboby has said anything yet :) though i think i will have to do it again :(
or is it :) hmmm depends on how long it takes me to reposition the letters

 \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\
 \\                           dunc@eraser.demon.co.uk                      \\
 \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\



Date:    Sunday, 15 October 1995 14:25:00 
Subject: Converting anims to PC
From:    mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com (Mike Vandersommen)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

-> From: Darryl_Lewis@comlink.mpx.com.au (Darryl Lewis)->  I have a number of IF
F (amiga) anims that I'd like to convert to =the-> They are looping anims, so is
 it possible to have looping anims on= th-> What package can I use to play them,
 preferable that it can be tri=gge-> a command line rather that from windoze.I'v
e been out of the Amiga loop for a few years, so there may bea Anim to FLC (or A
VI) converter available already. If not, there use=dto be a program on the Amiga
 called Unmovie (I might still have it) t=hatextracts IFF frames from "IFF Movie
" format. You could then move thes=eframes to the PC, use Paint Shop Pro, Graphi
c Shop or HiJack to massconvert them to TGA/BMP ...whatever. Then use DTA or Vid
eo for Dos tocompile them into FLC/AVIs. There are lots of DOS FLC/AVI playersav
ailable. This is worst case scenerio.....assuming a standaloneAnim -> FLC conver
ter is unavailable.   /------------------------------           ___   ___  ___  
 ___  | Mike van der Sommen                     / __  /__/ /__/  /_   \ /  | Santa Barbara, Ca.                     /___/ / \  /  /  /     / \  
| mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com     HAUS BBS (805-683-1388)  |          
 "Blackouts make for nice breaks in the day"   \________________________________
_____________________________--- =FE InterNet - GraFX Haus BBS - Santa Barbara, 
Ca - (805) 683-1388

Date:    Sunday, 15 October 1995 14:49:00 
Subject: DPaint for Imagine
From:    mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com (Mike Vandersommen)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

-> From: Dylan Neill <dylann@pcug.org.au>->-> DPaint on PC is crap, this is one 
of the reasons I've kept my Amig=a f-> this long (oh yeh and also to run all the
 utils people seem to wri=te-> imagine but they never convert to PC :) But I use
 dpaint to do do =bru-> for PC imagine and they load straight in a work fine. Ma
ybe you sh=oul-> invest in a cheap A1200 or something?In all seriousness, in wha
t ways to you find Amiga DPaint avantageousover Windows Paint programs, Dylan? I
 haven't used my Amiga in solong I am really curious. If there is some "major" a
dvantage or usein regards to Imagine, that DPaint has...I might just keep my 200
0 fo=rthat use.   /------------------------------           ___   ___  ___   ___
  | Mike van der Sommen                     / __  /__/ /__/  /_   \ /  | Santa B
arbara, Ca.                     /___/ / \  /  /  /     / \  | mike.vandersommen@
caddy.uu.silcom.com     HAUS BBS (805-683-1388)  |           "Blackouts make for
 nice breaks in the day"   \_____________________________________________________________--- =FE InterNet - GraFX Haus BBS - Santa Barbara, Ca -
 (805) 683-1388

Date:    Sunday, 15 October 1995 14:58:08 
Subject: Re: imagine in the public eye
From:    Bob Arnold <barnold@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Sun, 15 Oct 1995, Kent Marshall Worley wrote:

>  If you watch the world series look for animations on the diamond vision 
> video screen at Atlanta-Fulton County Stadium. The video screen rarely 
> gets shown on TV but I just thought I would share my excitement for being 
> involved in the World Series and using Imagine for the graphics. 
>   Go Braves!!
>  Kent Worley
>  mumu@america.net
> 

Boy this mail server just gets uglier and uglier with all its mis- 
translated characters etc.  The way your text got to this end it *almost* 
looks like it says "Go Braves" which is an obvous, almost painful error. 
It OUGHT to say "Go Mariners".   -Bob   :)

Date:    Sunday, 15 October 1995 15:31:39 
Subject: Imagine in the public eye
From:    Kent Marshall Worley <mumu@america.net>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

 If you watch the world series look for animations on the diamond vision 
video screen at Atlanta-Fulton County Stadium. The video screen rarely 
gets shown on TV but I just thought I would share my excitement for being 
involved in the World Series and using Imagine for the graphics. 
  Go Braves!!
 Kent Worley
 mumu@america.net

Date:    Sunday, 15 October 1995 16:38:04 
Subject: Re: Snow and xmas tree...
From:    Dylan Neill <dylann@pcug.org.au>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

On Fri, 13 Oct 1995, Richard Gregor Mast wrote:

> have an amiga and lived on DPaint.  But I can't find anything I like on 
> the PC.  I have heard there is DPaint for the PC somewhere but have never 
> heard much more.
> 

DPaint on PC is crap, this is one of the reasons I've kept my Amiga for 
this long (oh yeh and also to run all the utils people seem to write for 
imagine but they never convert to PC :) But I use dpaint to do do brushes 
for PC imagine and they load straight in a work fine. Maybe you should 
invest in a cheap A1200 or something?

---
                               |\ /|
                                o O
  ________________________oOO_=( ^ )=_OOo___________________________
 |                        '''     U   '''                           |
 | Gumby Death Man (Dylan Neill) Amiga 1200/6/120  486DX2-66/24/500 |
 | Email: dylann@pcug.org.au   WWW: http://www.pcug.org.au/~dylann/ |
 |__________________________________________________________________|


Date:    Sunday, 15 October 1995 17:19:49 
Subject: Ferrari-F50,similar
From:    Granberg Tom <tom.granberg@TV2.no>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi, all!
For everone that want to check this monster out, use netscape(or similar) and go
 
to: www.websharx.com:80/~cptvideo/pix/granberg/carX12.JPG

Ps. give me some toughts afterwards, will ya?
Ps2. The picture is not shown in the html of the gallery, so you need the above 

name to see it. Just copy the URL and paste it.

Later...sk

Tom Granberg


Date:    Sunday, 15 October 1995 18:54:22 
Subject: Re: Win-Imagine
From:    George Lane <glane@qualcomm.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Sat, 14 Oct 1995 Valleyview@aol.com wrote:

> Aren't all DOS programs 16 bit. 

No. Not if you use a dos extender.

George Lane


Date:    Sunday, 15 October 1995 19:38:02 
Subject: Re:Win-Imagine
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Ted Stethem <tstethem@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us>
> 
> Even better if it is written with a driver for the Millenium card or 
> OpenGL.
> 
> On Sat, 14 Oct 1995, Charles Blaquiere wrote:
> 
> > Wellll, all I can say is, I hope it's not some nonstandard hack. In the 
> 
> > using devious shortcuts. Here's to hoping that the fast draw routine 
> > you saw, used standard Windows procedures.

Agreed. The list of 3-D software slated to use standard (read: 
acceleratable) 3-D APIs includes Byte By Byte's Soft F/X, Crystal 
Graphics' Topas Pro, Caligari's trueSpace, and Autodesk's 3DStudio MAX. 
And those are just the ones I'm aware of. As usual in 3-D, the 
competition is heating up for the Next Best Thing.


Date:    Sunday, 15 October 1995 19:40:49 
Subject: Re:Win-Imagine
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>
> 
> Wellll, all I can say is, I hope it's not some nonstandard hack.

As a follow-up, let me reassure everyone: Mike has just told me that 
Impulse has followed Microsoft's standards to the letter, and says there 
will be NO incompatibilities in WinImagine.


Date:    Sunday, 15 October 1995 20:14:49 
Subject: Compositing
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: David Nix <WRNIX@uga.cc.uga.edu>
> 
> A semi Imagine related question-
> 
> In the  high end  marketplace, its  very common  to render  out elements
> individually and composite them together for  the final piece. Do any of
> you  have any  tips for  doing  this with  Imagine? I've  got ADPro  and
> ProControl, but I  always seem to have a really  tough time with ADPro's
> compositing  functions.  Are   any  of  the  third   party  ADPro  batch
> controllers of any help?

The standard way to composite in Imagine is through the use of the 
Backdrop function, found in the Action editor's Globals Actor bar. 
Impulse has hinted at better compositing features in the future, such as 
actual alpha-channel support, and foreground plates. (The opposite of 
background plates) I don't know if these are meant for Imagine 4.0, 
however; there is no mention of them in the glossy 4.0 brochure.

When using the Backdrop function, you typically composite your scene in 
layers, starting with the one furthest from the camera. If you simply 
want to overlay your Imagine objects over the backdrop, you just do as I 
said.

If your project is too big, and you need to split it in two to fin in
memory, you can still have Imagine composite the two layers of foreground
objects, plus the backdrop, automatically! As others have mentioned,
including Patrick Sauvageau, you can actually _automate_ the process
within Imagine, by splitting your timeline into two sections. The first 
half uses the external image(s) as backdrop, and the second half uses 
__the pics output by the first half__ as its backdrop. Unfortunately, I 
believe there is no way to have Imagine use an image sequence that 
doesn't start at *0001, so you can't repeat the process.

Date:    Sunday, 15 October 1995 20:23:26 
Subject: Re: imagine in the public eye
From:    NEWKIRK@delphi.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

>   Go Braves!!
>  Kent Worley
>  mumu@america.net
 go Mariners 

Hell with both!  Go Imagine!
JN

Date:    Sunday, 15 October 1995 21:05:15 
Subject: Re: Imagine anims => MPEG
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Bill Boyce <bilboyce@iconz.co.nz>
> 
> >4. How can I create this light-effect: like in real life, when it's foggy
> >outside and shine with a electric torch.
> 
> Create a cone, make it almost transparent (a little yellow) apply a
> fractal type texture to the object and don't tack it. Move it by shifting
> the points in point edit mode and storing them in states.

Or, add an empty axis as the parent of your light cone, and apply the 
texture to the parent, with "apply to children" activated. This will 
allow you to move the entire cone object, rather than moving the points. 
This can come in handy for transformations which are easily applied to 
objects, but not to groups of points.

Date:    Sunday, 15 October 1995 21:08:23 
Subject: Imagine in the public eye
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Such a shame! If you were using Lightwave, you'd probably be in their
pages somewhere, but sadly, there's no similar showcase for Imagine
animators. Avenues such as Amiga-specific magazines, and video
collections of user animations, have dried up these past years. Why not
send a few images to Amazing Computing? They might use them some time if
they have an empty page... worth a try, no? 


Date:    Sunday, 15 October 1995 21:14:33 
Subject: Restoring my confidence
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Mike Vandersommen <mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com>
> 
> Well said and MegaDittos Charles!

ACK! PHHTTPT!

*PLEASE* don't tell me I've turned into the kind of hideous monster that 
inspires Dittoheads. %^S

> 
> And of course the 2 years supply of Lithium didn't hurt. :)

Oooo, gotta love those green-and-off-white pills! B^) Those of you who 
recognize the color scheme, will know what I mean... <g>

Date:    Sunday, 15 October 1995 21:20:26 
Subject: Re: text in a circle
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Valleyview@aol.com
> 
> If in the spline editor, instead of adding the whole word as text, you
> were to add each individule letter as text. This would pile all the
> letters on top of each other with their axis all in the same position.
> Then after grouping and going to detail, pick all and move all the axis
> at once to the rotation center. Then you could just rotate each letter
> without moving any to "line up" with the first. Will this work even if it
> is easier? 

Unfortunately, you can't use Shift-M when multiple objects are selected; 
only the axis of the first selected object will move. That's 
unfortunate, since this would've been a very clever solution.


Date:    Sunday, 15 October 1995 21:50:33 
Subject: Re: Win-Imagine
From:    lumbient@superlink.net (!LuM!)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

>to get even better once it becomes fully win95 compliant.  If Imagine is
>written to work with windoze for workgroups then we won't get the benefit of
>running under NT or win95 and when the P6 comes on the scene, it may actually
>run slower.

Actually when the P6 comes out you won't notice a big speed increase for
win95 apps. at all.  Intel has said that with its new chip design win95 will
be more of a bottleneck.  Intel says the reason being that win95 is not a
true 32-bit operating system.  Intel recommends OS/2 or Unix clones for its
new chips.
                                            !LuM!

|--------------------------------------------------------\
|Anyone need a great checker floor?                       \
|Lumbient@superlink.net                                   /
|----ANYONE NEED ANYTHING BLOWN UP?--$40 AN INFERNO!-----<
|I can make the most realistic chrome spheres!            \
|They look great above the checkered floor!               /
|--------------------------------------------------------/


Date:    Sunday, 15 October 1995 23:14:26 
Subject: Re: compositing
From:    Marty K <mk-tel@sik.ppoy.fi>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

On Sun, 15 Oct 1995, David Nix wrote:

> A semi Imagine related question-
> 
> In the  high end  marketplace, its  very common  to render  out elements
> individually and composite them together for  the final piece. Do any of
> you  have any  tips for  doing  this with  Imagine? I've  got ADPro  and
> ProControl, but I  always seem to have a really  tough time with ADPro's
> compositing  functions.  Are   any  of  the  third   party  ADPro  batch
> controllers of any help?
> 
Image FX has some nice methods for composition.Version 1.51 came out on
CU Amiga last spring (or was it earlier...). I have found it a valuable 
tool in some situations.


__    __  __  _ __  ___  _____  __ __ _  __    __    "Nothing is real"
'=\/T/='  I|\/| //\ I| )/ I| \\_/  I|/   '=\T\/='    mk-tel.sik.ppoy.fi
  /^^   * I|  |//~~\I|~\  I|  I|   I|\  *   ^^\        Pori, FINLAND
          ~~  ~~~  ~~~  ~ ~~  ~~   ~~ ~          http://www.ppoy.fi/~mk-tel


Date:    Monday, 16 October 1995 00:15:18 
Subject: Re: Spline modelling vs. Forms Editor (was: modeller)
From:    rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au (Robert Byrne)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hello Dave, on Oct 15 you wrote:

> In regards to doing 3D splines, rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au (Robert Byrne) 
> writes:
> >My only suggestion is have a look at the Forms Editor and persevere with
> >it. You can create some very complex objects with it, not just vases etc.

Actually, I was referring to your doing smooth organic objects, which is
what the Forms Ed does well.

> Does one really need a spline modeller at all when we have the Forms Ed.?

If splines were included in the Forms Ed, that would be ideal.

-- Bob

  :  Robert Byrne  : rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au :
  : Amiga A3000/25 :  Ballina, NSW  Australia  :


Date:    Monday, 16 October 1995 01:18:26 
Subject: Re: Ferrari-F50,similar
From:    Fred Aderhold <fredster@netrix.net>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 07:19 PM 10/15/95 +0200, you wrote:

>For everone that want to check this monster out, use netscape(or similar)
and go 
>to: www.websharx.com:80/~cptvideo/pix/granberg/carX12.JPG
>

Wow! Very smooth, Tom.

--------------------------------------------
Fred Aderhold
fredster@netrix.net
http://www.netrix.net/users/fredster

Daddy, what does formatting drive C mean?
--------------------------------------------


Date:    Monday, 16 October 1995 05:43:05 
Subject: Constant Upgrade Program
From:    expgxs@cascade.santos.com.au (Greg Searle)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

  Greetings
 
  Charles Blaquiere replied to my post

>> I get the feeling that they want to abandon the Amiga users who
>> make 25% of thier costomer base and are loyal to the product.

>Unfortunately, although Amiga users run 3 to 1 against PC users, 
>Constant Upgrade subscriptions run 10 to 1 in favor of the PC. If you 
>consider total sales to be a mix of historical data (people who bought 
>Imagine eons ago, and are no longer using it) and current sales, you can 
>see my opinion, which is that Constant Upgrades represent your current, 
>active user base. Those are the people you're selling to; with the 
>extremely reasonable amount Impulse asked for the Constant Upgrade, I 
>would assume that those who didn't jump on the bandwagon are lost forever.

>If you agree with this train of thought, then in the few years that 
>Imagine has been available for the PC, its active user share has grown 
>to 10 to 1 vs. Amiga owners.

  I don't know were this figure of 10 to 1 comes from, but if it is true
then Impulse must ask themselves, Why ? What are we doing wrong that Amiga
customers are not taking this up?

  I can not speek for other Amiga owners but for my case it was simple. The cons
tant Upgrade was to be paid yearly. How many years do I have to pay 
before a new version comes out? Will the constant upgrade program give me
value for money ? Why should I pay for bug fixes that should be available on
bulliton boards or ftp sites ? What are the features that Impulse are going
to include in this constant upgrade program that makes it worth my while to
consider parting with US$100 anually ?

   None of these questions were answered in the very few newsletters that I
have recieved from Impulse. But what really made me not join was that I wanted
to get to grips with Imagine 3.0 first, see if it really meets with my needs
and wants, and master it. Well I have mastered the bones feature which was my
1st priority (main reason I bought Imagine 3.0 + textures!) and have just
recently began to explore some of the other tools and features in detail,
such as particles.

   I other words, I haven't finised exploiting Imagine 3.0 yet in full. Now
that 4.0 is out soon I only really want one feature from it. Metaballs ! This
has justified me not taking up the constant upgrade program. One feature that
I really 100%, A++ want to use in 4.0 and it wasn't available in 3.1 - 3.3.
With metaballs it would reduce the time it takes to create the organic models
that I want immeasurably.

   However, If I used Imagine Professionly I would have gone into this constant
upgrade program as I would then need the latest tools and features. Other
Amiga users may have felt that Impulse were not delivering a good enough
product for the Amiga to justify this expense. This may be the case 
considering some of the posts here about the non Amiga feel and interface of
Imagine, and that other companies are producing a superior overall Amiga 
3D product and mabey support. I repeat, I personly think that Imagine is first 
developed on the PC and then ported to the Amiga. I also suspect Impulse are
very tight on resorces and can't support both platforms fully. This is
why IMHO 4.0 will the last Amiga version of Imagine no matter what.

>> I get the feeling that registered users are not well supported 
>> as I thought they would be.

>Impulse has been spotty in user support. Phone tech support is a 
>veritable roulette, where you don't know if you'll be helped, greeted as 
>a numbskull, or ignored. People kept slipping off Impulse's customer 
>database, resulting in unreceived newsletters and upgrade offers. On the 
>other hand, I believe the Constant Upgrade price was quite generous, 
>considering all that's happened to Imagine since version 3.0.

   Oh dear, If this is so then Impulse don't deserve Imagine. To let customers
slip off a registration database is totaly unacceptable. To treat customers
in the above manner would scare not only them away from future products but many

other potential buyers as well. One happy customer can create another by
that customers recomendation of your product by the aftersevices you provide.

   Oh well, Real3d is looking as a good alternative now that the price has
gone down for the Amiga version anyway. If only it wasn't so slow and
resource hungry I would have it now as well. Mabey in 12 months time.

Best regards to all

GREG SEARLE

( PS there seems to a lot af gregs on this list as well )

Date:    Monday, 16 October 1995 09:30:15 
Subject: Re: compositing
From:    sauvp@citi.doc.ca (Patrick Sauvageau)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>:
>The standard way to composite in Imagine is through the use of the 
>Backdrop function, found in the Action editor's Globals Actor bar. 
>Impulse has hinted at better compositing features in the future, such as 
>actual alpha-channel support, and foreground plates. (The opposite of 
>background plates) I don't know if these are meant for Imagine 4.0, 
>however; there is no mention of them in the glossy 4.0 brochure.
>
>When using the Backdrop function, you typically composite your scene in 
>layers, starting with the one furthest from the camera. If you simply 
>want to overlay your Imagine objects over the backdrop, you just do as I 
>said.
>
>If your project is too big, and you need to split it in two to fin in
>memory, you can still have Imagine composite the two layers of foreground
>objects, plus the backdrop, automatically! As others have mentioned,
>including Patrick Sauvageau, you can actually _automate_ the process
>within Imagine, by splitting your timeline into two sections. The first 
>half uses the external image(s) as backdrop, and the second half uses 
>__the pics output by the first half__ as its backdrop. Unfortunately, I 
>believe there is no way to have Imagine use an image sequence that 
>doesn't start at *0001, so you can't repeat the process.

Yes, you can use this method to compose any number of layer you want. If you
have to make a 3 layer/10 frames anim, do the first two layer as you
described; (frame 1-10 = layer one, frame 11-20 layer two: using pic* as
background). For the 3th layer, just let the "global" bar continue on the
frames 21-30. This way, frame 11 will use pic.001 as background, frame 20
will use pic.010, frame 21 will use pic.0011 (whitch is a composition of
frame 1 and 11) etc. You can compose any number of layer on a single anim.
Just remember to repeat all your lighting setup on each layer and have a LOT
of free disk space.

-----
Patrick Sauvageau
(sauvp@citi.doc.ca)



Date:    Monday, 16 October 1995 09:37:00 
Subject: CarX12...calling CarX12...
From:    KEN_ROBERTSON@robelle.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Caught your pic, Tom, re: the Ferrari-F50 (or whatever).
It's at www.websharx.com:80/~cptvideo/pix/granberg/carX12.JPG
for those who missed the address.

Indeed, a work of art.  Very smooth lines, and nice ripples in the water
next to the beast.  Did you model it after the one in your 18-car
garage?  ;-)

I especially like the bimps in the wheel wells.
\KenCan'TWaitFor4.0R
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Nice computers don't go down...but they do have their GPF's!

Date:    Monday, 16 October 1995 10:48:26 
Subject: Free 3-D magazine
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

A new magazine has popped up on my newsstand, 3D Design. It's nice, and 
I'll probably subscribe. Inside, I found an appealing offer: call (800) 
829-2505 and they'll send you a free issue. The number is obviously 
availa in the US, but also Canada; I just called'em.


Date:    Monday, 16 October 1995 13:11:00 
Subject: 2.0 PC Display settings
From:    weiss@epx.cis.umn.edu


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Does anyone have a clear description on how the preferences
display settings are used?

I am still having trouble "converting: saved 24 bit tiff and tga files
into Imagine 2.0 PC and wonder if my display settings are at fault, some
how.

A useless LITTLE line shows up, and that's all, regardless of perspective.

thanks,

jeff weiss




:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
jeff weiss  weiss@epx.cis.umn.edu  TCP/IP 44.94.249.101 N0IRR  612.825.4746 H  
::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::

Date:    Monday, 16 October 1995 14:01:00 
Subject: Win-Imagine
From:    mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com (Mike Vandersommen)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

-> From: Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>->-> As a follow-up, let me reassure eve
ryone: Mike has just told me th=at-> Impulse has followed Microsoft's standards 
to the letter, and says= th-> will be NO incompatibilities in WinImagine.Charles
, did Mike happen to mention if it was going to be stictlya 16-bit app? If so, w
ill a 32-bit app be available soon?   /------------------------------           
___   ___  ___   ___  | Mike van der Sommen                     / __  /__/ /__/ 
 /_   \ /  | Santa Barbara, Ca.                     /___/ / \  /  /  /     / \  
| mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com     HAUS BBS (805-683-1388)  |          
 "Blackouts make for nice breaks in the day"   \________________________________
_____________________________--- =FE InterNet - GraFX Haus BBS - Santa Barbara, 
Ca - (805) 683-1388

Date:    Monday, 16 October 1995 14:05:00 
Subject: Jungle drums
From:    mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com (Mike Vandersommen)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Just an interesting side note. If you think the grumbling directedtoward Impulse
 was bad, DON'T subscribe to the LIGHTWAVE mailinglist! :) Gads......   /-------
-----------------------           ___   ___  ___   ___  | Mike van der Sommen   
                  / __  /__/ /__/  /_   \ /  | Santa Barbara, Ca.               
      /___/ / \  /  /  /     / \  | mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com     HA
US BBS (805-683-1388)  |           "Blackouts make for nice breaks in the day"  
 \_____________________________________________________________--- =FE InterNet 
- GraFX Haus BBS - Santa Barbara, Ca - (805) 683-1388

Date:    Monday, 16 October 1995 14:09:07 
Subject: Imagine to VRML converter
From:    Peter Kovach <peter.joseph.kovach@medtronic.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Is there such a beast???  I would like to convert some imagine objects 
for display on the VR web software and it only currently supports
VRML objects.

THANKS.


Date:    Monday, 16 October 1995 14:51:34 
Subject: Re: imagine in the public eye
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-15 16:45:22 EDT, you write:

> If you watch the world series look for animations on the diamond vision 
>video screen at Atlanta-Fulton County Stadium. The video screen rarely 
>gets shown on TV but I just thought I would share my excitement for being 
>involved in the World Series and using Imagine for the graphics. 

Cool.  Nice to hear about Imagine being used for something like that.  As
much as I love Imagine renderings however, it is not enough to make me ever
watch baseball again:)

Bob...........


Date:    Monday, 16 October 1995 14:52:10 
Subject: Re: Win-Imagine
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In reply to some of my reservations about winimagine Mike (Crowbar) sent me
the following mail.

>Gang,
>
>Win Imagine is LIGHTING FAST,  NO SLOWDOWN IN 3.1 or 95 or NT infact its
>faster,
>much faster than DOS.
>
>Mike
>
>pass it on

EXCELLENT!!!!!!  If Mike is confident enough about the product to post about
it now then it's good enough for me.  Given that we absolutely need a windoze
version I can't wait.  Would be nice to at least pull the IML and reply while
rendering:)

Bob.................



Date:    Monday, 16 October 1995 18:40:10 
Subject: CarX12 reporting in, what's up?
From:    Granberg Tom <tom.granberg@TV2.no>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Ken Roberts wrote:
-Indeed, a work of art.  Very smooth lines, and nice ripples in the water
-next to the beast.  Did you model it after the one in your 18-car
-garage?  ;-)

Yeah, sure!!........Geeee, I'd wish I had a garage, not that I have anything to 

put in it, would be cooler if I could aford a car at all here in 
the, tax-hell-hole, of Norway!!!

But thanks Ken. Nice tought.

Later

Tom Granberg "Renderbrandt", Maybe someday I'll deserve that name?!


Date:    Monday, 16 October 1995 19:26:11 
Subject: Re: Imagine to VRML converter
From:    Gerard Menendez <gpm@netcom.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



Peter,

This months Computer Graphics World mentions a free VRML authoring tool 
from Caligari.  It can be downloaded for free from their homepage at 
www.caligari.com and the last sentence says "Existing geometries can be 
imported via DXF,3D STudio, Wavefront, Lightwave, and Imagine filters."

Gerard

On Mon, 16 Oct 1995, Peter Kovach wrote:

> Is there such a beast???  I would like to convert some imagine objects 
> for display on the VR web software and it only currently supports
> VRML objects.
> 
> THANKS.
> 
> 

Date:    Monday, 16 October 1995 19:35:38 
Subject: Re: Free 3-D magazine
From:    sgiff@airmail.net (Stephen Gifford)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

>A new magazine has popped up on my newsstand, 3D Design. It's nice, and 
>I'll probably subscribe. Inside, I found an appealing offer: call (800) 
>829-2505 and they'll send you a free issue. The number is obviously 
>availa in the US, but also Canada; I just called'em.
>
>
Yes, Ive read it.  There was some mention of Imagine in it regarding Meta
Balls and the person responsible to bringing it to Imagine users, the author
of WinBlob Alfonso Hermida.  It was a good magazine and looks like it will
outdo 3D Artist, especially since its monthly.  Can never get enough 3D so I
hope it doesn't hurt 3D Artist's sales.

s.g.


Date:    Monday, 16 October 1995 19:42:51 
Subject: Re: 2.0 PC Display settings -Reply
From:    sgiff@airmail.net (Stephen Gifford)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

>That's the pallette. For some reason, Imagine includes palette information
>even with 24 bit images. Some display programs misinterpret this as part
>of the image. The best way I've found to strip this garbage from TGA
>files is to use DTA - Dave's Targa Animator. Not only is it handy for this
>task, but it is also the best tool I've found yet (short of Premiere) for
>creating animations from your stills. 
>
>>From the DOS prompt, use
>
>dta /ft pic*.tga 
>
>in your project directory. The /ft switch indicates TGA as the output
>format, rather than the default FLC. 
>
DTA is nice and will convert Imagine IFF files directly to a Flic file, but
Video for Dos is a much better Flic creator.  The pallete is optimized much
better and creates a much smoother looking animation (less flicker).  Plus
it will create AVI and several other formats.  It is available just about
everywhere that DTA can be found.

Stephen G.


Date:    Monday, 16 October 1995 19:47:41 
Subject: Re: Re[2]: Win-Imagine
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-16 15:14:46 EDT, you write:

>>speed increases.  I've seen this now working with Acad.  It used to run
>using
>>win32's and was a major dog to operate even on a P90 but when we started
>>running it under win95 there were some major speed increases.
>
>Makes sense.  Win32s adds another layer, 'thunking' in this case to convert 
>32bit to 16bit calls.  In my experience, 16bit apps run faster under Win95
>than 
>under Win 3.1.
>
>-Scott
>spack@adobe.com

Well as long as Winimagine takes advantage of Win95 I'm happy.  I don't
really like win95, it's what Im stuck with since Amiga died.  I need to work
in the windoze environment and so I need Imagine to get there realitively
soon.  If I were to go to another product it would be Lightwave and that's
another $1000 plus the fact that I have to learn how to use it.  Just as soon
stay with Imagine and hope that Impulse can keep up with all the screwups
Microsoft and Intel make. Of course in an ideal world Imagine would move over
to the Mac and everyone would be happy:)

Bob...................



Date:    Monday, 16 October 1995 21:20:03 
Subject: Re: CarX12...calling CarX12...
From:    Stephen Wilkinson <wilks@lbm.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

On Oct 16,  9:37am, KEN_ROBERTSON@robelle.com wrote:
> Subject: CarX12...calling CarX12...
[snip]
> Indeed, a work of art.  Very smooth lines, and nice ripples in the water
> next to the beast.
[snip]

Yes, a very nice pic! Might I suggest that since the floor is reflective,
you put a texture map on the underside of the car of a dummy exhaust
system/transmission etc.. Might make it just a little more "believeable".

A very nice model!

Cheers,
Stephen
____________________________________
Stephen Wilkinson     wilks@lbm.com      "Programming is like pinball. The
Sr. Software Engineer                     reward for doing it well is the
LB&M Associates                           opportunity to do it again."
____________________________________



Date:    Monday, 16 October 1995 21:36:22 
Subject: 2.0 PC Display settings -Reply
From:    Craig Andera <CANDERA@f81.rfc.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

That's the pallette. For some reason, Imagine includes palette information
even with 24 bit images. Some display programs misinterpret this as part
of the image. The best way I've found to strip this garbage from TGA
files is to use DTA - Dave's Targa Animator. Not only is it handy for this
task, but it is also the best tool I've found yet (short of Premiere) for
creating animations from your stills. 

From the DOS prompt, use

dta /ft pic*.tga 

in your project directory. The /ft switch indicates TGA as the output
format, rather than the default FLC. 

You can obtain DTA from ftp.povray.org, or possibly oak.oakland.edu.

-Craig
candera@f81.rfc.com

PS: Howdy, neighbor. I work in Minneapolis.


Date:    Monday, 16 October 1995 21:40:00 
Subject: Re: Snow and xmas tree...
From:    rundio@winternet.com (Louis Sinclair)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

>   Also,  what paint programs does eveyone use for the PC.  I used to 
>have an amiga and lived on DPaint.  But I can't find anything I like on 
>the PC.  I have heard there is DPaint for the PC somewhere but have never 
>heard much more.
>***********************************************
>Rick Mast
>Roxter@Chopin.udel.edu
>***********************************************

Unfortunately, DPaint on the PC was very disappointing.  I use Micrografx
Picture Publisher and like it very much.  It is a much more sophisticated
bitmap editor than DPaint, and includes very powerful image manipulation
to boot.  After getting this program, I rarely use my Amiga for image work
(except for the rare occassion when AdPro does something that Picture
Publisher doesn't.)

You might want to als check out:
        - Photoshop (pricey, but very powerful - most service bureaus use it)
        - Fauve Matisse
        - Fractal Design Painter
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Louis Sinclair                                    rundio@winternet.com
-----------------------He who hesitates, waits------------------------


Date:    Monday, 16 October 1995 22:28:10 
Subject: WinImagine-The questions?
From:    lumbient@superlink.net (!LuM!)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Anyone have anyanswers to these WinImag questions?

10)Is it going to be a single interface(like TrueSpace) or Multi(like
imagine now)?
9)Will it run under correctly OS/2? (this would be more ideal than Win95,
faster)
8)Will the textures be DLL's? (this would be cool, really easy to make!)
7)Will the effects be DLL's? (see above)
6)Will it use windoze standard interface? (like the buttons and windows, or
will it be a cheap port like LW)
5)Will it ship on CD?
4)How many textures are with it?
3)Will it include 3rd party, add-on capability? (like LW, can I buy another
modeler)
2)Will it have glows? (hehehe, can really use them)
1)Will the texture playground still be there? (if its not I'll sue)
                                            !LuM!

|--------------------------------------------------------\
|Anyone need a great checker floor?                       \
|Lumbient@superlink.net                                   /
|----ANYONE NEED ANYTHING BLOWN UP?--$40 AN INFERNO!-----<
|I can make the most realistic chrome spheres!            \
|They look great above the checkered floor!               /
|--------------------------------------------------------/


Date:    Monday, 16 October 1995 23:23:26 
Subject: Re:carX12..calling carX12
From:    Granberg Tom <tom.granberg@TV2.no>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Stephen you wrote:
-Might I suggest that since the floor is reflective,
-you put a texture map on the underside of the car of a dummy exhaust..bla bla..


How about making the floor NON REFLECTIVE!!!..........just kiddin'
Well, the car was made for all you guys to see what could be achived by 4.0 new 

smoothing tool, it was not an atempt to make a ultra realstic car. But if you 
want to I'could ftp it to somewhere and you could go do it. I will maybe, just 
maybe do some more cars in the near future, that will kick some serious Alias 
dudes butt trough the water. Keep watching the pages at Sharkys, there will 
probably be some more pic's up there tonight, I think.

Later....

Tom G


Date:    Tuesday, 17 October 1995 02:25:54 
Subject: Simply FYI... :-)
From:    cv773@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Matthew C. Polak)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Just to let anyone know who cares...
I spoke to Impulse on the phone today, and the shipping dates
for Imagine 4.0 are supposed to be at the end of this week for
the PC version, and a week later (after PC shipping) for the
Amiga version.
Also, the actual TECH support number is: (612) 425-0557
I don't know if this info will help anyone (maybe save a few
phone calls or something :-)) but if it does.. Great!
 
Question: Does anyone else on the PC side of Imagine use the
Number Nine's 'Imagine-128' graphics accellerator? It is an
amazing card, (128-bit/4MB/24bit_color) but the only problem
 I have is it doesn't work in true-color mode in Imagine.
Impulse said to speak to Number Nine, however, last time
I called for tech support, i waited almost 45 minutes!!!
(Number Nine. Amazing products; slow tech support!) :-)
Anyone else out there experience similar problems? The
card is fully VESA compliant for 24-bit modes, but Imagine
just gives me a little fizzle of pixels all over the screen
when trying to access full-color.
Well, any help would be appreciated! :-)
Happy Rendering...                

--
_________________________________________________________________
{                       Matthew C. Polak                        }
{                    cv773@freenet.cwru.edu                     }
{_____________________________OHIO______________________________}

Date:    Tuesday, 17 October 1995 03:38:13 
Subject: PAR settings
From:    Curtcee@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I use DPS's PAR for making my Imagine animations and there is one thing that
I'm curious about. The "full screen" recommendation for the PAR is 752x480.
The first time I rendered frames at this resolution and output them to the
PAR I noticed that a large amount of the frame was cropped vertically and
horizontally. I assumed I would have to leave enough space along the frame
edges so objects in the frame wouldn't be cropped out. But after
experimenting with 640x480, 680x480, 700x480 etc., I found that 680x440
provided just enough picture area for a full screen image on my television
monitor (Panasonic CT1384). I guess I should also mention that 680x440
renders faster than 752x480 and the resulting files are smaller so I guess
the question for you PAR users is: Why 752x480??

Curtis Carlson
Curtcee@aol.com


Date:    Tuesday, 17 October 1995 04:17:40 
Subject: Imagine error and face normals
From:    osc@ix.netcom.com (Keith Pope)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Two questions:

1) Anyone ever gotten this error when trying to start Imagine?  I just 
installed it on a "dos big" 850MB HD.
        "memory allocation error. cannot load COMMAND. system halted"

2) I'm trying to fix some objects that Viewpoint Datalabs brokers for 
me.  It seems that some other 3d formats require normals on faces.  Is 
there a good Imagine to "normaled" (3DS?) program?

Thanks,
Keith

Date:    Tuesday, 17 October 1995 04:58:36 
Subject: Re: Jungle drums
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-16 15:52:32 EDT, you write:

>Just an interesting side note. If you think the grumbling directed
>toward Impulse was bad, DON'T subscribe to the LIGHTWAVE mailing
>list! :) Gads......

Really!  Is it because they are having trouble with the product, or because
Amiga owners are feeling abandoned or something like that?

Bob...........



Date:    Tuesday, 17 October 1995 04:58:39 
Subject: Re: Free 3-D magazine
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-16 16:14:06 EDT, you write:

>A new magazine has popped up on my newsstand, 3D Design. It's nice, and 
>I'll probably subscribe. Inside, I found an appealing offer: call (800) 
>829-2505 and they'll send you a free issue. The number is obviously 
>availa in the US, but also Canada; I just called'em.

Yeah I got the free issue through work, it was enough to convince me to
subscribe.  Looks like it is well done and will make handy reading material
in the reading library:)

Bob................


Date:    Tuesday, 17 October 1995 13:45:36 
Subject: Re:carX12..calling carX12
From:    "Scott J. Geertgens" <geertges@colorado.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> 
> YOU DOG! I just got a gander at http://www.websharx.com/~cptvideo, Ranger 
> Tom's Gallery #4 and my eye's are still bleeding :-) Cool images!
> 
> Sure would be nice to see a sample of one of your projects/objects and a 
> small tutorial *hint* *hint* :-) to help some of us mortals learn how to 
> make cool images or see some of your techniques...
> 
> lates,
>     Sharky - Official WebSharx Mascot
> 

   I must second that request :) Another thing that I noticed is that 
there is a lack of modelling tutorials. Many of the tutorials out there 
give tricks and tips for textures (which is great, don't get me wrong!), 
but no amount of texture tricks will make up for a poorly modelled object. 
Then again, maybe I'm the only one that needs such a thing :) 

                              SJG


Date:    Tuesday, 17 October 1995 13:59:01 
Subject: Re: PAR settings
From:    Jim Rix <jim@yakko.cs.wmich.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Mon, 16 Oct 1995 Curtcee@aol.com wrote:

> I use DPS's PAR for making my Imagine animations and there is one thing that
> I'm curious about. The "full screen" recommendation for the PAR is 752x480.
> The first time I rendered frames at this resolution and output them to the
> PAR I noticed that a large amount of the frame was cropped vertically and
> horizontally. I assumed I would have to leave enough space along the frame
> edges so objects in the frame wouldn't be cropped out. But after
> experimenting with 640x480, 680x480, 700x480 etc., I found that 680x440
> provided just enough picture area for a full screen image on my television
> monitor (Panasonic CT1384). I guess I should also mention that 680x440
> renders faster than 752x480 and the resulting files are smaller so I guess
> the question for you PAR users is: Why 752x480??
> 
> Curtis Carlson
> Curtcee@aol.com
> 
The 752x480 resolution is the dimensions for standard OVERSCAN NTSC 
video.  This resolution is very useful when projects from a video 
projector and you want as much pictures as possible.

Jim Rix
http://yakko.cs.wmich.edu/~jim

Date:    Tuesday, 17 October 1995 15:18:38 
Subject: DPaint PC/Amiga
From:    rvdnoord@epsilon.nl (Remco v.d. Noord)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

>On Fri, 13 Oct 1995, Richard Gregor Mast wrote:
>
>> have an amiga and lived on DPaint.  But I can't find anything I like on 
>> the PC.  I have heard there is DPaint for the PC somewhere but have never 
>> heard much more.
>> 
>
>DPaint on PC is crap, this is one of the reasons I've kept my Amiga for 
>this long (oh yeh and also to run all the utils people seem to write for 
>imagine but they never convert to PC :) But I use dpaint to do do brushes 
>for PC imagine and they load straight in a work fine. Maybe you should 
>invest in a cheap A1200 or something?

I once had an Amiga too (till v4.0 of Dpaint) but when I played with the PC
version of it, some things were better, some things (much) worse.
The advantages of the Amiga-versions were: animation, use of the OS (fonts,
multitasking, etc)
The advantages of the PC-versions were (Dpaint2-enhanced): incredible speed
(ok, thanks to my localbus-PC), easier to use gadgets. But NO use of
truetype fonts, etc. No VESA support (just 256 colors) and NO use of memory
above 640K.

Don't forget the latest PC-version is from the year 1989!! Really hard to
compare these 2 products!!!

But most of the functions found in V2/V3 of Amiga-Dpaint are also
implemented in the PC-version.

That's why I use Photoshop3 now for drawing this kind of work. Really great
software.

Remco
   


Date:    Tuesday, 17 October 1995 15:37:25 
Subject: Re: View point when modeling 3d object
From:    Drew_Perttula@altabates.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


the viewpoint in a quickrender comes from the rotation, zoom, position, etc. of 

the PERSP view. Use the A-Z-P buttons on that view and the recenter key to 
change its point of view. I believe that the quickrender lightsource will move 
with you, which may not be what you want.


______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________

:Subject: View point when modeling 3d object
:Author:  Peter Kovach <peter.joseph.kovach@medtronic.com> at ALTERNET
:Date:    10/17/95 3:32 PM


I have a dense question, but I am new to Imagine (actually I bought 
it when it first came out for the Amiga years ago, but never got around
 to using it).  

I now own Imagine 3.3 with the upgrade path ($100) to 4.0. 

O.K.  The QUESTION -

When I render an object, how do I set the viewpoint??  I have created 
people (bi-ped) objects and want to quick render them, BUT I want to view 
point to be from their eyes vantage point.  This is because I want 
pre-render views at various angle (e.g. looking down at ones self, 
seeing arms extended, etc) as if seeing oneself and I want to look at it 
via quick-render.

Thank you!



Date:    Tuesday, 17 October 1995 15:44:35 
Subject: Win-Imagine
From:    web@cvsd.cv.com (William Bogan)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> On Sun, 15 Oct 1995 Lumbient wrote:
> Intel says the reason being that win95 is not a
> true 32-bit operating system.  Intel recommends OS/2 or Unix clones for its
> new chips.

Question: Will Impulse ever port to OS/2? Not just use Win-Imagine in an
emulation? Or is there a UNIX Version of Imagine?

-Bill Bogan


Date:    Tuesday, 17 October 1995 16:53:38 
Subject: Re: Modelling tips?
From:    Drew_Perttula@altabates.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


     How about "Tom's day in the forms editor" or something and show us how 
     to make something cool. That's my weakest editor right now...


______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________

:Subject: Modelling tips?
:Author:  "Granberg Tom" <tom.granberg@tv2.no> at ALTERNET
:Date:    10/17/95 11:37 PM


Hi, I beginn to suspect a need for modelling tips. I would love to do that, but 

since my time is not unlimited, I have a small request. What kind of tutorials 
do you want, I need you to narrow it down a bit, ok.?!
     
Later.....
     
Tom G
     
     

Date:    Tuesday, 17 October 1995 17:11:55 
Subject: Re:carX12..calling carX12
From:    Sharky <sharky@websharx.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On 17 Oct 1995, Granberg Tom wrote:
[snipped some stuff]
> smoothing tool, it was not an atempt to make a ultra realstic car. But if you 

> want to I'could ftp it to somewhere and you could go do it. I will maybe, just
 
> maybe do some more cars in the near future, that will kick some serious Alias 

> dudes butt trough the water. Keep watching the pages at Sharkys, there will 
> probably be some more pic's up there tonight, I think.
> 
> Later....
> 
> Tom G
> 

Aloha Tom!

YOU DOG! I just got a gander at http://www.websharx.com/~cptvideo, Ranger 
Tom's Gallery #4 and my eye's are still bleeding :-) Cool images!

Sure would be nice to see a sample of one of your projects/objects and a 
small tutorial *hint* *hint* :-) to help some of us mortals learn how to 
make cool images or see some of your techniques...

lates,
      Sharky - Official WebSharx Mascot

Date:    Tuesday, 17 October 1995 18:31:29 
Subject: Imagine ported to BeBox?
From:    SPICE@DRYCAS.CLUB.CC.CMU.EDU


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Would anyone else like to see Imagine ported to the BeBox? Since it looks
like Amiga Technologies doesnt came about anyone but game players, so the
future of new, high end Amigas looks very doubtful. I really dont want to
have to buy a clone and the BeBox looks like the spiritual heir of the
Amiga.

                                Scott Corley


spice@drycas.club.cc.cmu.edu

Date:    Tuesday, 17 October 1995 18:32:25 
Subject: Re: Imagine to VRML converter
From:    Roger Straub <straub@csn.net>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Mon, 16 Oct 1995, Gerard Menendez wrote:

> 
> 
> Peter,
> 
> This months Computer Graphics World mentions a free VRML authoring tool 
> from Caligari.  It can be downloaded for free from their homepage at 
> www.caligari.com and the last sentence says "Existing geometries can be 
> imported via DXF,3D STudio, Wavefront, Lightwave, and Imagine filters."

I checked the WWW site. Sorry, all you Amiga studs, but it's Windoze only.

> 
> Gerard
> 

See ya,
      Roger

Date:    Tuesday, 17 October 1995 18:37:26 
Subject: Imagine Upgrade Policy question.
From:    SPICE@DRYCAS.CLUB.CC.CMU.EDU


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I know that the end of the $100 upgrade period for Imagine is Oct 31, but 
does that mean that the order must arrive before Oct 31, or that it must be
postmarked by Oct 31? I hope that its the latter as I want to upgrade my
Imagine but I don't think I'll be able to mail the upgrade off until late
Oct. 

                             Scott Corley

spice@drycas.club.cc.cmu.edu

Date:    Tuesday, 17 October 1995 18:46:24 
Subject: Re: View point when modeling 3d object
From:    Roger Straub <straub@csn.net>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Tue, 17 Oct 1995, Peter Kovach wrote:

> 
> When I render an object, how do I set the viewpoint??  I have created
> people (bi-ped) objects and want to quick render them, BUT I want to view
> point to be from their eyes vantage point.  This is because I want 
> pre-render views at various angle (e.g. looking down at ones self, 
> seeing arms extended, etc) as if seeing oneself and I want to look at it
> via quick-render.

With a humaniod object, if it's a group, create an axis in Detail, place 
it directly between the eyes of the human object, and make it the parent 
of the rest of the object. Now, in Stage, under the Display menu, there's 
a command called View from Object. Here's your ticket. Select it, choose 
the humanoid object, and Voila!

> 
> Thank you!
> 
> 

See ya,
      Roger

Date:    Tuesday, 17 October 1995 19:20:59 
Subject: Re: modeller
From:    UNREGISTERED VERSION <dunc@eraser.demon.co.uk>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


>Also, I want to know wether there are any good modellers out
>there that can import directly to Imagine...that is shareware and
>cheap] I'm trying to create some smooth organig type of objects,
>splines,

 If you have an amiga have a look at FreeForm in aminet/gfx/3d it
has a front end alot like caligari oh yeah its a spline editor
 And a tree generator for sculpt called tree something (though i havent
looked at it yet -it is quite old and you need something like pixelpro to
use it with imagine)


 \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\
 \\                           dunc@eraser.demon.co.uk                      \\
 \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\



Date:    Tuesday, 17 October 1995 20:03:24 
Subject: Re: Win-Imagine
From:    Sharky <sharky@websharx.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Tue, 17 Oct 1995, William Bogan wrote:

> Question: Will Impulse ever port to OS/2? Not just use Win-Imagine in an
> emulation? Or is there a UNIX Version of Imagine?
> 
> -Bill Bogan
> 

Not sure about OS/2, but I vaguely recall hearing that future versions of 
imagine "may" run on SGI boxes.  If that happens then chances are good 
that it will be UNIX based...just my guess...:-)

Aloha,
      Sharky

Date:    Tuesday, 17 October 1995 20:21:45 
Subject: Re: Imagine error and face normals
From:    Brian V Salisbury <bvs@viewpoint.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

On Oct 16,  9:17pm, Keith Pope wrote:

> 2) I'm trying to fix some objects that Viewpoint Datalabs brokers for
> me.  It seems that some other 3d formats require normals on faces.  Is
> there a good Imagine to "normaled" (3DS?) program?


We currently store data in Wavefront .obj format, and "fix" a lot of our
data in that program. Imagine objects look like swiss cheeze when converted
and read into wavefront. If you keep your data completely sealed like
a balloon, it is much easier to orient the normals for each group, if
they are inverted.

In order to take care of this with pc programs, try 3dstudio.
It allows you to edit the normals of the polygons. Lightwave and Truespace
also deal with normals as well. If you submit your data "cleaned up" in
one of these formats, you are more likely to get it through the pipeline
quicker, and make some cash.

Imagine doesn't deal with one sided polygons, so there is no way to edit
the direction of the normals in Imagine.




-- 
Brian Salisbury 
bs@viewpoint.com
(801)229-3053

"If you go flying back through time and you see somebody else flying
forward into the future, it's probably best to avoid eye contact."


Date:    Tuesday, 17 October 1995 21:06:03 
Subject: View point when modeling 3d object
From:    Peter Kovach <peter.joseph.kovach@medtronic.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I have a dense question, but I am new to Imagine (actually I bought 
it when it first came out for the Amiga years ago, but never got around
 to using it).  

I now own Imagine 3.3 with the upgrade path ($100) to 4.0. 

O.K.  The QUESTION -

When I render an object, how do I set the viewpoint??  I have created
people (bi-ped) objects and want to quick render them, BUT I want to view
point to be from their eyes vantage point.  This is because I want 
pre-render views at various angle (e.g. looking down at ones self, 
seeing arms extended, etc) as if seeing oneself and I want to look at it
via quick-render.

Thank you!


Date:    Tuesday, 17 October 1995 21:26:34 
Subject: Convert
From:    augioh4b@ibmmail.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

--- Received from GITD.PSG024  2164526              18OCT95  11.27
--- Received from GITD.PSG024  2164526              18OCT95  11.26
  -> IBMMAIL.INTERNET      IBMMAIL

Hi Imagineers,

Just need some help in converting non imagine objects to imagine
objects. eg. lightwave to imagine and povray to imagine.

What software would i need and which ftp sites can i get them
from?

PS. I use a PC ...

thanks
Vic

Date:    Tuesday, 17 October 1995 21:37:11 
Subject: Modelling tips?
From:    Granberg Tom <tom.granberg@TV2.no>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi, I beginn to suspect a need for modelling tips. I would love to do that, but 

since my time is not unlimited, I have a small request. What kind of tutorials 
do you want, I need you to narrow it down a bit, ok.?!

Later.....

Tom G


Date:    Tuesday, 17 October 1995 21:39:06 
Subject: SHARKY, where are you?
From:    Granberg Tom <tom.granberg@TV2.no>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi, I have tried to reach you 10's of times the last two weeks, but zipp.
So do you changed your email adress, or something. That's why I now using the 
IML in this way, no offense to the others who recieve this.

Reply, Sharky(E.S.) Or I will reveal your true identity!!!!!

Tom G


Date:    Tuesday, 17 October 1995 23:02:28 
Subject: Re: Tom's pics
From:    Sharky <sharky@websharx.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Tue, 17 Oct 1995, Steven M Powell wrote:

> Where can I get some of Tom's pictures that are supposed to be in the 
> Impulse flyer. Impulse hasn't sent me one, even after I called and ask 
> for one. I have purchased ALL of the Silver 1.0-3.0 , Imagine 1.0-4.0 
> Amiga and PC programs and even Terrian. Even though I have allready paid for 4
.0, I 
> would still like to see the flyer.
> 
> I dont use Netscape so I would like to know of a site other than Sharky's.
> 


Howzit! 

If there is enough interest (and if Captain Video and Ranger Tom don't 
mind) I can make symbolic links to the images in the websharx FTP 
directory. If there isn't, shoot me some e-mail and I can send them to 
you via mail attachment.

Aloha,
      Sharky

Date:    Tuesday, 17 October 1995 23:22:42 
Subject: Re: Imagine to VRML converter
From:    Tom Ellard <tome@next.com.au>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 09:09 AM 16/10/95 -0500, you wrote:
>Is there such a beast???  I would like to convert some imagine objects 
>for display on the VR web software and it only currently supports
>VRML objects.

There is a share modeller called Clay that loads GEO and saves VRML. You
will have to convert Imagine to GEO first of all.

http://www.sdsc.edu/SDSC/Partners/vrml/repos_software.html has a copy.

I'd also like to direct the attention of all PC Imagine users to 

http://www.us.paragraph.com/whatsnew/homespce.htm

This is a small VRML application you can use for free - it uses DOOM style
instant rendering.

Also find and download demos of a product called Renderware (I don't have
the address handy but LYCOS will find it easily). This is a render library
by Canon computer that renders 3D real time without hardware acceleration.
There is a demo where you can rotate and paint the surface of a phong shaded
object in real time, also a rollercoaster where you can drag the track
around while the car is actually running on it. All this discussion about
user interface should have these examples as part of the context.

Tom Ellard. Severed Heads.
The Chocolate Pizza of Music.


Date:    Tuesday, 17 October 1995 23:43:20 
Subject: Re: View point when modeling 3d object
From:    Gerard Menendez <gpm@netcom.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



Peter,

You can just activate the "A" button in the "perspective" window and rotate 
the view there.  That's the view that is quick rendered.


Gerard



Date:    Tuesday, 17 October 1995 23:55:55 
Subject: Re: View point when modeling 3d object
From:    Gerard Menendez <gpm@netcom.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



Roger,

Boy I gave a dumb answer to this.  I din't even read Peters question all the 
way through. Also, thanks for extending my reply about the VRML browser to 
include the important system info.


Gerard 


On Tue, 17 Oct 1995, Roger Straub wrote:

> 
> 
> On Tue, 17 Oct 1995, Peter Kovach wrote:
> 
> > 
> > When I render an object, how do I set the viewpoint??  I have created
> > people (bi-ped) objects and want to quick render them, BUT I want to view
> > point to be from their eyes vantage point.  This is because I want 
> > pre-render views at various angle (e.g. looking down at ones self, 
> > seeing arms extended, etc) as if seeing oneself and I want to look at it
> > via quick-render.
> 
> With a humaniod object, if it's a group, create an axis in Detail, place 
> it directly between the eyes of the human object, and make it the parent 
> of the rest of the object. Now, in Stage, under the Display menu, there's 
> a command called View from Object. Here's your ticket. Select it, choose 
> the humanoid object, and Voila!
> 
> > 
> > Thank you!
> > 
> > 
> 
> See ya,
>     Roger
> 

Date:    Wednesday, 18 October 1995 00:48:00 
Subject: Problems
From:    eduardo.gomez@canrem.com (Eduardo Gomez)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hello.   I'm getting gurus when rendering Imagine 3.0 (Amiga).  It seems
to  do so only in scanline mode and when rendering certain proyects.  It
usually goes to a state where the screen looks like a "multiripper-type"
program  scanning  the memory, but with grey-scale tones.  Of course, no
command  is  helpful but ^-A-A (reset).  Now, on top of that, this:  The
proyect,  a  stage  with  key and fill lights, two spheres and a flat (2
faces)  surface  as  a  background.  None of the objects has any texture
applied to it, just the standard attributes.  I was just trying to morph
one of the spheres into a second state where it gets almost transparent.
When  I  rendered  the  first  frame  (where no morphin occurs) I had no
problem.   But  on  the  following  frames,  where  the  morphing of the
transparency  attribute  takes  place,  a requester pops telling me that
there is "Not enough memory to set up objects".  The funny thing is that
thee  were  still  more than 5 megs fast and 800k chip mem.  available!
Then I found out that the transparency (filter) attribute is not working
at all. I bought this software second hand. Could it be corrupted? :((

E.G.


Date:    Wednesday, 18 October 1995 01:08:29 
Subject: Re: Forge is Superior to PreView
From:    rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au (Robert Byrne)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hello William, on Oct 17 you wrote:

> Is or will TextureStudio be available for PCs?

As I said in my previous message, "I hope the authors consider a version
for the PC." I'm surprised they did'nt go commercial, but that may be more
trouble than it's worth. Last I heard the two authors were deeply involved
with exam studies and could'nt devote a great deal of time to the software.
I'll send a message to them and post their response here.

-- Bob

  :  Robert Byrne  : rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au :
  : Amiga A3000/25 :  Ballina, NSW  Australia  :


Date:    Wednesday, 18 October 1995 01:49:02 
Subject: Normals, Modeling and Viewpoint DataLabs
From:    osc@ix.netcom.com (Keith Pope)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Rob Sampson asked about brokering models with Viewpoint DataLabs Intl.
They are always receptive to models, but do have stringent requirements 
since the data is translated to over 60 formats.  The best thing to do 
is to visit their web page at www.viewpoint.com and read about 
submitting your own models.  Also be sure to read the notes about 
Imagine in particular.  I did a T-Rex in Imagine and sent if off a few 
years back.  I made some money off of it, but they now have their 'seal 
of approval checklist' and I'm sure that without the normals in the 
TDDD format it does look like swiss cheese.

Brian V Salisbury mentioned the swiss cheese effect as well.  I have 
imported my Imagine models in the Demo of Truespace 2.0 and they look 
great when it interprets normals,  without normal interpretation... it 
looks horrible.

Tom Granberg has volunteered to write some tutorials for the IML.  I 
would like to see some on techniques for realistic organic shapes, 
folds of skin and clothes, and facial animation.

Thanks,
Keith

Date:    Wednesday, 18 October 1995 01:54:19 
Subject: Re: View point when modeling 3d object
From:    rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au (Robert Byrne)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hello Peter, on Oct 17 you wrote:

> When I render an object, how do I set the viewpoint??  I have created
> people (bi-ped) objects and want to quick render them, BUT I want to view
> point to be from their eyes vantage point.  This is because I want 
> pre-render views at various angle (e.g. looking down at ones self, 
> seeing arms extended, etc) as if seeing oneself and I want to look at it
> via quick-render.

The only way I can see to do this with a quickrender from the Detail Editor
is to first pick all the points in the objects head and delete them, then
rotate the perspective view to look from above. Of course the camera will
still be some distance from the object, not at eye level and if you zoom in
too close you will put the arms etc, out of frame.

The next best solution is to create a temporary Project and load it into
the Stage Ed and set your camera just in front of the nose.

-- Bob

  :  Robert Byrne  : rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au :
  : Amiga A3000/25 :  Ballina, NSW  Australia  :


Date:    Wednesday, 18 October 1995 04:11:00 
Subject: Decals on Glass
From:    mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com (Mike Vandersommen)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Ok, Imagine GURUS....need some help. I'm trying to map a brushon glass. How can 
I map a TIF image on a transparent object?I've made a drinking glass object and 
I want to put a color mapon it. When I make the attributes solid, it maps fine, 
but whenI add transparency to the object, the map disappears.Now if I select tra
nsparancy map, the wrap is visible, but partsof it are transparent. How can I ge
t the whole map to show solid,like a Decal on glass?   /------------------------
------           ___   ___  ___   ___  | Mike van der Sommen                    
 / __  /__/ /__/  /_   \ /  | Santa Barbara, Ca.                     /___/ / \  
/  /  /     / \  | mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com     HAUS BBS (805-683-1
388)  |           "Blackouts make for nice breaks in the day"   \_______________
______________________________________________--- =FE InterNet - GraFX Haus BBS 
- Santa Barbara, Ca - (805) 683-1388

Date:    Wednesday, 18 October 1995 08:35:38 
Subject: Re: View point when modeling 3d object
From:    Jim Rix <jim@yakko.cs.wmich.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Tue, 17 Oct 1995, Peter Kovach wrote:

> I have a dense question, but I am new to Imagine (actually I bought 
> it when it first came out for the Amiga years ago, but never got around
>  to using it).  
> 
> I now own Imagine 3.3 with the upgrade path ($100) to 4.0. 
> 
> O.K.  The QUESTION -
> 
> When I render an object, how do I set the viewpoint??  I have created
> people (bi-ped) objects and want to quick render them, BUT I want to view
> point to be from their eyes vantage point.  This is because I want 
> pre-render views at various angle (e.g. looking down at ones self, 
> seeing arms extended, etc) as if seeing oneself and I want to look at it
> via quick-render.
> 
> Thank you!

In order to affect what you are loking at you must move the camera in the 
stage editor.  I hope you know about how to do projects.

Select the camera.
Use your cursor to select the move button on the bottom.
Then with the mouse in the window you want to move the camera in drag the 
mouse, and the camera to the position you desire.
Next to change the point of view select rotate and reposition the axes of 
the camera.
Finally, from the menu bat select both the position and alignment bar.  
Then save the project.

Jim Rix

Date:    Wednesday, 18 October 1995 08:50:16 
Subject: Re: Normals, Modeling and Viewpoint DataLabs
From:    dgrant@dgrant.peinet.pe.ca (Dennis Grant)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

Hello Keith (Keith Pope), in <199510180149.SAA12380@ix4.ix.netcom.com> on Oct 17
 you wrote:

> Rob Sampson asked about brokering models with Viewpoint DataLabs Intl.
> They are always receptive to models, but do have stringent requirements 
> since the data is translated to over 60 formats.  The best thing to do 
> is to visit their web page at www.viewpoint.com and read about 
> submitting your own models.  Also be sure to read the notes about 
> Imagine in particular.  I did a T-Rex in Imagine and sent if off a few 
> years back.  I made some money off of it, but they now have their 'seal 
> of approval checklist' and I'm sure that without the normals in the 
> TDDD format it does look like swiss cheese.
> 
> Brian V Salisbury mentioned the swiss cheese effect as well.  I have 
> imported my Imagine models in the Demo of Truespace 2.0 and they look 
> great when it interprets normals,  without normal interpretation... it 
> looks horrible.

So what's a good way to transform an Imagine model without normals to another
format with normals?



- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
-
Dennis Grant               Cycor User Support - HTML Developer - Graphic artist
dgrant@cycor.ca     Amiga 4000/'030/6/120/'882 40/2XCDROM/USR14.4/Idek 17"/SLIP

                Visit Trog's Cave! http://www.cycor.ca/TCave/

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: 2.6.2

iQCVAwUBMIUUJbBqnxXa4HpNAQHiwwP/cw6j2pDCYXkPvmnAbWwu90FWD2UhI44o
k/duWZiLEB8uvzsg0gCIWH2QQ3VYFhM3ne4hV4Uh9fleKLJDnO4Tcv0NXWRQJxpY
ewJhtftlvQtu5jnzhsJNHJZaxeQ468Z5buC0gsKbxTkLPKmrPqs/B1H6Sz648Efm
KG/8esO39hs=
=qROX
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----


Date:    Wednesday, 18 October 1995 09:20:55 
Subject: Re: Tom's pics
From:    Steven M Powell <afn27231@freenet.ufl.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Tue, 17 Oct 1995, Sharky wrote:

> 
> If there is enough interest (and if Captain Video and Ranger Tom don't 
> mind) I can make symbolic links to the images in the websharx FTP 
> directory. If there isn't, shoot me some e-mail and I can send them to 
> you via mail attachment.
> 
> Aloha,
>     Sharky
> 
 That would great!!!!
Steven


Date:    Wednesday, 18 October 1995 09:38:35 
Subject: Making a Sofa
From:    S.A.Jalim@exeter.ac.uk


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

HI all

I`m currently building my front room and would like to hear any suggestions
as to how to make reslistic "soft" and slightly rounded at the edges cushions
to go on a sofa.

I am trying to use the spline editor to make a top view of a square shaped one
and then I extrude and round bevel it on both the front and back faces, but
then it looks too uniform, if you see what I mean.

Any suggestions as to a better way to make `em?

thanks

steve

______________________________________________________________________________
| Steve Jalim -> ge94saj@ex.ac.uk | http://www.ex.ac.uk/~ge94saj/steve1.html |
------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Date:    Wednesday, 18 October 1995 09:49:54 
Subject: Imagine 4.0 Upgrade Q?
From:    spack@mv.us.adobe.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Just so I don't misunderstand the Glossy Brochure.

If someone has subscribed to the Constant Upgrade program, then they don't need 

to pay $100 by Oct. 31 for 4.0 - RIGHT?

I suspect there are some, myself included who are not clear on this.  Impulse 
might be getting money that they shouldn't expect!

-Scott
spack@adobe.com


Date:    Wednesday, 18 October 1995 10:29:18 
Subject: Re: Imagine ported to BeBox?
From:    Udo K Schuermann <walrus@wam.umd.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Scott Corley <SPICE@DRYCAS.CLUB.CC.CMU.EDU> wrote:
> Would anyone else like to see Imagine ported to the BeBox? Since it looks
> like Amiga Technologies doesnt came about anyone but game players, so the
> future of new, high end Amigas looks very doubtful. I really dont want to
> have to buy a clone and the BeBox looks like the spiritual heir of the
> Amiga.

YES! I'd love to see Imagine on the BeBox!!  Just 'imagine' splitting up
the rendering task into N (user-definable) threads, each of which is
automagically given its own CPU by the operating system.  With later
versions of the BeBox you could expect to render an image up to 8 times
faster than with a single CPU computer... And the PPC603 isn't exactly
slow, to begin with.  Whoa, I gotta sit down. :)

I just wish the BeBox supported multiple screens like the Amiga does.  It's
one feature I will definitely miss when I buy a BeBox.  Well, you know what
they say: you can't have everything.

Check out http://www.be.com/ for some really cool stuff on the BeBox!

 |._.|_   Udo Schuermann             "The future's not what it used to be!"
 |(:)| )  walrus@wam.umd.edu                  -- Narn Ambassador G'Kar
 |_:_|/   http://www.wam.umd.edu/~walrus/        Babylon 5, "The Long Dark"

Date:    Wednesday, 18 October 1995 11:41:34 
Subject: Particles+Texture problem
From:    H.Kueck@AIGM.westfalen.de (Hendrik Kueck)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi,

What I am trying to do is something breaking through a graffity
painted wall. I used a particles object to create the wall and
mapped the graffity brush on it. I quickrendered it and it looked
ok. Then I created a state for the flat wall. After using "lock
state" in the brush requester, I did not get the wall with the
graffity on it any more when I quickrendered but only bricks with
different colors. I think Imagine looks up one pixel of the brush
for each brick. Am I doing something wrong or is this a bug in
Imagine? And is there a workaround for this? I need the "lock
state" switch to do the broken wall.

Bye,
  Hendrik



Date:    Wednesday, 18 October 1995 11:41:34 
Subject: Particles+Texture problem
From:    H.Kueck@AIGM.westfalen.de (Hendrik Kueck)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi,

What I am trying to do is something breaking through a graffity
painted wall. I used a particles object to create the wall and
mapped the graffity brush on it. I quickrendered it and it looked
ok. Then I created a state for the flat wall. After using "lock
state" in the brush requester, I did not get the wall with the
graffity on it any more when I quickrendered but only bricks with
different colors. I think Imagine looks up one pixel of the brush
for each brick. Am I doing something wrong or is this a bug in
Imagine? And is there a workaround for this? I need the "lock
state" switch to do the broken wall.

Bye,
  Hendrik



Date:    Wednesday, 18 October 1995 11:42:46 
Subject: Re: Decals on Glass
From:    Curcio Nicholas <curcion@db.erau.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Wed, 18 Oct 1995 RobSampson@aol.com wrote:

> In a message dated 95-10-18 06:46:04 EDT, you write:
> 
> >Now if I select transparancy map, the wrap is visible, but parts
> >of it are transparent. How can I get the whole map to show solid,
> >like a Decal on glass?
> 
> Apply the map like a decal using genlock.  If your using for example white on

This method does not work.  The problem is that the decal takes on the 
transparency of the object, thereby beconing invivsible.  The only ides I 
have is to make another object the size of your decal.  You could cut it 
out of the origanl glass object.  Apply the decal to this new, 
non-transparent object, and group the two together.

I hope this makes sense, and I hope there is an easier way to do this.  :)

Nik


Date:    Wednesday, 18 October 1995 12:12:27 
Subject: Re: Making a Sofa
From:    Mike McCool <mikemcoo@efn.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hey S.A.,

      I've got a sofa object I've been using for about a year now.  
Don't know where I got it, but probably Aminet.  Seems like I converted 
it to a LW object, as well.  

      This doesn't answer your modelling query,--but if you browse 
aminet/gfx/3dobj, I'm pretty sure there's a bunch of furniture ready 
made. 

Date:    Wednesday, 18 October 1995 12:19:56 
Subject: Re: Making a Sofa
From:    Drew_Perttula@altabates.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


     well, I can't comment on the relevence, but I made a quick couch by 
     the following steps.
     
     Sphere. Delete bottom half. In top view, pick top right quarter and 
     slide it away from the center. Do same with all other quarters. Now 
     you get the top of a "cushion". I scaled these cushions and built a 
     whole folding couch from them. Worked like a charm. A neat thing was 
     how the flat back of the cushion could be a different color for 
     clarity.


______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________

:Subject: Making a Sofa
:Author:  S.A.Jalim@exeter.ac.uk at ALTERNET
:Date:    10/18/95 2:30 AM


HI all
     
I`m currently building my front room and would like to hear any suggestions 
as to how to make reslistic "soft" and slightly rounded at the edges cushions 
to go on a sofa.
     
I am trying to use the spline editor to make a top view of a square shaped one 
and then I extrude and round bevel it on both the front and back faces, but 
then it looks too uniform, if you see what I mean.
     
Any suggestions as to a better way to make `em?
     
thanks
     
steve
     
______________________________________________________________________________ 
| Steve Jalim -> ge94saj@ex.ac.uk | http://www.ex.ac.uk/~ge94saj/steve1.html | 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
     
     

Date:    Wednesday, 18 October 1995 13:26:45 
Subject: RE: MODELLER
From:    Brad Molsen <moon@eskimo.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

      To all, 
With regards to modellers, if you have an Amiga you should go to Aminet 
and download Freeform3d 1.9 from gfx/3d. I've been using it for organic 
shapes for a couple of years now and find it quite useful. There are 
several tutorials provided in the quide and it is convertable to Imagine 
format among others. It runs for $40 to $60 I think.
The rail morphng is a very nice way to generate organic shapes!
                              later,Brad

Date:    Wednesday, 18 October 1995 13:47:05 
Subject: Re: Decals on Glass
From:    William E Costello <bill@Starbase.NeoSoft.COM>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> On Wed, 18 Oct 1995 RobSampson@aol.com wrote:
> 
> In a message dated 95-10-18 06:46:04 EDT, you write:
> > 
> > >Now if I select transparancy map, the wrap is visible, but parts
> > >of it are transparent. How can I get the whole map to show solid,
> > >like a Decal on glass?
> > 
> > Apply the map like a decal using genlock.  If your using for example white o
n
> 
> This method does not work.  The problem is that the decal takes on the 
> transparency of the object, thereby beconing invivsible.  The only ides I 
> have is to make another object the size of your decal.  You could cut it 
> out of the origanl glass object.  Apply the decal to this new, 
> non-transparent object, and group the two together.
> 
> I hope this makes sense, and I hope there is an easier way to do this.  :)
> 
Best thing I can think of is to make a mask of your decal in a paint
program.  The mask would have all the areas you want transparent one
color, and the areas you want solid another color.  Then use the mask
as a transparency map, and the normal decal as a color map.

Bill Costello

ps, i didn't try this, so I'm not sure it will work...



Date:    Wednesday, 18 October 1995 13:48:35 
Subject: Re: Normals, Modeling and Viewpoint DataLabs
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-18 00:11:47 EDT, you write:

>Brian V Salisbury mentioned the swiss cheese effect as well.  I have 
>imported my Imagine models in the Demo of Truespace 2.0 and they look 
>great when it interprets normals,  without normal interpretation... it 
>looks horrible.

Could you provide me with a little more detailed description of normals and
normals interpretation?  I afraid I'm quite a bit dense in this area:)


>
>Tom Granberg has volunteered to write some tutorials for the IML.  I 
>would like to see some on techniques for realistic organic shapes, 
>folds of skin and clothes, and facial animation.
>
>Thanks,
>Keith

I'm sure hints on how to use the software better would be beneficial to
everyone but I think even Tom will say that you can't teach someone to design
something.  I have been lucky in that I have acess to a solid modeler via
AcadR13 with excellent slice operations, chamfering, fillets ect which allows
me to create certain objects that would be extremely hard or impossible with
Imagine and can import all of these objects into Imagine which allows me to
modify them in ways which Acad will not.  I can definetly state that if you
have the ability to pick up a good solid modeler to compliment Imagine you
should do so.  It can save you allot of time.  That also brings up the point
that buying AcadR13 to do solid modeling would be stupid given the cost (I
use the program for work) but if anyone knows of a great solid modeler for a
reasonable price it might be worth talking about on here.  It really gives
you allot more options.

Bob.................



Date:    Wednesday, 18 October 1995 13:48:37 
Subject: Re: Decals on Glass
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-18 06:46:04 EDT, you write:

>Now if I select transparancy map, the wrap is visible, but parts
>of it are transparent. How can I get the whole map to show solid,
>like a Decal on glass?

Apply the map like a decal using genlock.  If your using for example white on
a black background set genc to 000000 and select genlock in the requestor and
Imagine will ignore the black background leaving the rest of your colors
applied like a decal.  If you want some other color to be the background
color imagine ignores then you need to figure out the hex code for it.  I
don't know why they just don't let you select the color with a standard rgb
setting like they do everywhere else.  However this should fix your problem.

Bob...........

Date:    Wednesday, 18 October 1995 14:16:50 
Subject: Imagine 4.0
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I just read that 4.0 for the pc will be shipping friday over on compuserve
and the amiga version a little while after that.  I've heard some people say
they did not think there would be a new manual with this version and others
who think there will be.  I was under the definite impression that there was
a new manual for this version and that some of the new textures would finally
get some documentation we could find in one place.  Anyone know for sure?

Also read a post that leads me to believe that the upgrade from 4.0 to the
windoze version of Imagine is going to be more than $200.  If one of you guys
that talks to Impulse regularly knows what the price is going to be could you
let the rest of us know.  

Date:    Wednesday, 18 October 1995 16:16:43 
Subject: Re: Modelling tips?
From:    CoryJ44@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


> How about "Tom's day in the forms editor" or something and show us how 
>     to make something cool. That's my weakest editor right now...

I second that one, Tom.  Any help you could give in the forms editor would be
appreciated greatly.

                                        Cory


Date:    Wednesday, 18 October 1995 17:02:21 
Subject: Re: Making a Sofa
From:    Brad Molsen <moon@eskimo.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

To all, 
3D Artist issue 19 had an article called "Upholstery Mapping" which might 
touch on this subject. The article was by Doug Kelly, who has been a 
contributor to this list in the past.
                                      later,
                                              Brad

Date:    Wednesday, 18 October 1995 17:13:16 
Subject: MILAN!!!
From:    Brad Molsen <moon@eskimo.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

On Sat, 7 Oct 1995, Gerard Menendez wrote:

> 
> 
> Milan,
> 
> I'd love to see this program and would be happy to post it to Aminet if 
> you need someone to do that.
> 
> 
> Gerard
> 
> 
> On Thu, 5 Oct 1995, Milan Polle wrote:
> 
> > Hi all,
> > 
> > just writing to let you know that a few days ago, I finished my
> > program that cleans up sliced objects. (To be honest, I didn't work on it
> > during the summer holiday; my brain didn't work because of the heat).
> > The only thing left to do is the doc file. Oh yeah, it's amiga-only (sorry).

> > Any people out there interested in it, maybe someone could put it on aminet
> > for me. And people without access to aminet can mail me for a copy.
> > 
> > Milan (milan@bmt.hku.nl)
> > 
> > - Still waiting for my credit-card to arrive, so I can upgrade to 4.0... -
> > 
> > 
> > 
> 
Milan, 
Did you ever get someone to upload your program to Aminet. If not I'd be 
happy to help. Sorry for the wide distribution but, for some reason when I try
to contact Milan direct I get a message saying that I can't get thru to his em
ail address.
                              later,
                                      Brad

Date:    Wednesday, 18 October 1995 19:40:49 
Subject: WinImagine-The answers!
From:    lumbient@superlink.net (!LuM!)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Mike H. wrote back to me:

10)Is it going to be a single interface(like TrueSpace) or Multi(like
imagine now)?  MULTI WINDOW AND SINGLE JUST LIKE IMAGINE NOW
9)Will it run under correctly OS/2? (this would be more ideal than Win95,
faster)IT WILL NOT RUN UNDER OS2
8)Will the textures be DLL's? (this would be cool, really easy to make!) YES
THEY WILL BE DLLS
7)Will the effects be DLL's? (see above)SAME SEE ABOVE
6)Will it use windoze standard interface? (like the buttons and windows, or
will it be a cheap port like LW)FULL WINDOWS NOT LIKE LW COMPLETE MICROSOFT
FOUNDATION COMPLIANCE PURRRRFECT
5)Will it ship on CD?YES
4)How many textures are with it?!100 or so
3)Will it include 3rd party, add-on capability? (like LW, can I buy another
modeler)NOT AT FIRST IN THE FUTURE
2)Will it have glows? (hehehe, can really use them) YEAH JUST LIKE IMAGINE
NOW<THIS IS VERY EASY WHATIS THE PROBLEM  
1)Will the texture playground still be there? (if its not I'll sue)YEP IT IS AND

WILL BE

                                            !LuM!

|--------------------------------------------------------\
|Anyone need a great checker floor?                       \
|Lumbient@superlink.net                                   /
|----ANYONE NEED ANYTHING BLOWN UP?--$40 AN INFERNO!-----<
|I can make the most realistic chrome spheres!            \
|They look great above the checkered floor!               /
|--------------------------------------------------------/


Date:    Wednesday, 18 October 1995 20:22:30 
Subject: Re: Modelling tips?
From:    sgiff@airmail.net (Stephen Gifford)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I was specifically impressed by the realism of the docking bay in Tom's
picture of the ship sitting on the floor in the docking bay.  The textures
on your spaceships and the floor and walls of the docking bay are extremely
well done.  I would certainly appreciate any insight into its creation.

Stephen G.


Date:    Wednesday, 18 October 1995 20:50:37 
Subject: Transparent
From:    augioh4b@ibmmail.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

--- Received from GITD.PSG024  2164526              19OCT95  10.50
  -> IBMMAIL.INTERNET      IBMMAIL
Hi all,

This may be related to the topic about the image on glass being
transparent, etc.

I am working on a PC and version 2 of Imagine.  I am having real
difficulty creating a plane to behave in such a way that when I
apply a brushmap to it, it will be transparent where the color is
black.

My bitmap image is say a black circle on a white background, and
when I apply this to a plane I want the black area (the circle)
to be see-through. How the hell do you do this] I'm getting
plenty of caffine just trying to solve this prob.

thanks
vic

Date:    Wednesday, 18 October 1995 21:12:07 
Subject: Re: Imagine 4.0 Upgrade Q?
From:    beeton@SEDSystems.ca (Gary Beeton - SED Systems)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

>Just so I don't misunderstand the Glossy Brochure.
>
>If someone has subscribed to the Constant Upgrade program, then they don't need
 
>to pay $100 by Oct. 31 for 4.0 - RIGHT?

RIGHT!  If you bought the Constant Upgrade Program you bought 4.0 (and
happen to get the interim 3.x updates too).  There seems to be a lot
of people on this list who think that the CUP bought one year's worth of
updates.  I don't know where they got that idea because it ain't true
(I would not have bought into the CUP if that were the case).


Gary
Standard Disclaimer:  I don't work for Impulse.  
                      I'm just a satisfied customer.

Date:    Wednesday, 18 October 1995 21:19:01 
Subject: Re: Normals, Modeling and Viewpoint DataLabs
From:    sgiff@airmail.net (Stephen Gifford)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

>I'm sure hints on how to use the software better would be beneficial to
>everyone but I think even Tom will say that you can't teach someone to design
>something.  I have been lucky in that I have acess to a solid modeler via
>AcadR13 with excellent slice operations, chamfering, fillets ect which allows
>me to create certain objects that would be extremely hard or impossible with
>Imagine and can import all of these objects into Imagine which allows me to
>modify them in ways which Acad will not.  I can definetly state that if you
>have the ability to pick up a good solid modeler to compliment Imagine you
>should do so.  It can save you allot of time.  That also brings up the point
>that buying AcadR13 to do solid modeling would be stupid given the cost (I
>use the program for work) but if anyone knows of a great solid modeler for a
>reasonable price it might be worth talking about on here.  It really gives
>you allot more options.
>
>Bob.................
>
Bob there is a program called TriSpectives that was just released for
Windows 95 which is supposed to be the first ACIS solid modeling/rendering
program written specifically for 95.  I was put on the beta program, and
while you can do simple things very quickly, it really was on the level of
Raydream as far as modeling more complex stuff.  I was not that impressed to
tell you the truth.  I don't know if you have seen Raydream artwork, but
everything tends to be made out of symetrical primitive type objects.  This
is great for certain things but it lacks the power of a complex modelling
program like Imagine.  Others may have a different opinion, and to tell you
the truth, I didn't spend that much time with it.  The cost is about $300
for the regular version and $500 for the pro version, which does animation
as well.

It is being advertised in several magazines, if you want more info just
email me.

Stephen G.


Date:    Wednesday, 18 October 1995 21:35:06 
Subject: Re: Glossy 4.0 Brochure etc
From:    Rick Dolishny <dolish@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

You were asking about glowing "Seaquest" lights in Imagine: they are 
already there! I know, you knew that too but why don't they work?
 
There's a button in the Lensflare Global Effect called Halo around 
lights. But when you accept the defaults and render, you see no halos, 
right?
 
The trick (isn't there always a trick with Imagine) is to select the 
light in the Stage editor, Right Amiga 'T' to Transform the light, then 
increase the size of the axis by, say, 100% to start. I suppose one last 
Seaquest step would be to go back to the Action Editor Lensflare effect 
and say '0' round and '0' faceted flares. You don't want underwater 
lights to flare, usually.

Now that I've figured this out, nice glowing lights are a snap.


Rick Dolishny          dolish@io.org
Ardee Productions - Toronto, Ontario


Date:    Wednesday, 18 October 1995 21:35:47 
Subject: Re: Imagine 4.0 Upgrade Q?
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-18 16:58:25 EDT, you write:

>If someone has subscribed to the Constant Upgrade program, then they don't
>need 
>to pay $100 by Oct. 31 for 4.0 - RIGHT?

The constant upgrade program was to take you from 3.0 to 4.0.  If your using
Imagine 3.3 right now, you will get 4.0 when it's released which is supposed
to be friday for pc users.

Date:    Wednesday, 18 October 1995 21:58:28 
Subject: Decal on glass
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Someone had asked about applying a decal to glass, and my reply was partially
wrong (as was also pointed out).  You can genlock a decal on glass but the
image map must be a filter map.  For a tiff file where you want black to be
the color that does not show up, set genc to 000000.  Apply the map as
required setting it to filter and selecting genlock.  The map will then show
up as a decal on the glass.  I tried this out, so I know that it does work.

Bob.............

Date:    Wednesday, 18 October 1995 21:58:54 
Subject: Re: CarX12 reporting in, what's up?
From:    Richard Heidebrecht <rheidebr@freenet.npiec.on.ca>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

On 16 Oct 1995, Granberg Tom wrote:

> 
> Tom Granberg "Renderbrandt", Maybe someday I'll deserve that name?!
> 

I saw your rendering of two planes flying over the desert (plane1.jpg, I 
think); you deserve that name now!


   ~Rick Heidebrecht~



Date:    Wednesday, 18 October 1995 22:02:22 
Subject: Re: 4.0 Docs and other things
From:    Rick Dolishny <dolish@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> My biggest wish is GLOWING LIGHTS!  I would love to animate a photon torpedo
> over an AVI!  I would love it to be flexible enough to allow neon signs,
> lightining, and changing intensity over time (like an explosion).  This would
> be for fun, mostly, but I also handle our Plant's slide presentation.It would
>  be nice to have a glowing Hobart sign.
>  

Thanks for the articulate 'wish list', a nicer change from the zig heil 
of late.

Glowing lights: I posted a reply earlier but it's worth repeating. The 
manual tells you to increase the axis to increase the Glow of a light 
(when using the Lensflare effect). But the manual does NOT tell you to 
increase the size of the axis via the Transform requester (not just 
hitting S then scaling the axis bigger). It works just great!


Rick Dolishny          dolish@io.org
Ardee Productions - Toronto, Ontario


Date:    Wednesday, 18 October 1995 22:12:09 
Subject: Environment maps (again)
From:    greggh@dialup05.odyssey.apana.org.au (Gregory Helleren)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Thanks to evry1 who responded with suggestions on my problem with
environment maps onto a flat plane. I just needed to know how these
little dudes worked :)

One suggestion I tried was to make a relatively small thumbnail of
the image and position it on a much larger environment map. Do get
the correct position I created a large grid in Deluxe Paint,
numbering each cell. A quickrender quickly showed my the relevant
size of and where to composite the little thumbnail. Of course the
gridlines were then removed :)

After a bit of adjustment, this looked great. The portion of the
environment map shown in the mirror even had a slight depth blur
(due to it's low resolution) which added to the realism.

Now the problem:
A ray trace of the scene revealed what I assume is a problem. The
mirror (whose color attributes are 0,0,0 and reflection attributes
are 255,255,255 etc) used to reflect some foreground objects.
However, when the environment map was applied to the mirror, no
foreground objects were reflected - just the environment map.

This is odd, since a global environment map still allows reflective
objects to reflect.

I was loathe to use the morph/mix setting since I assume that this
would have produced a ghostly like reflection.

I have worked around this oddity by compositing a thumbnail of the
environment map (appropriately placed) within the larger version
and using this as a global environment map. I removed the
environment map from the mirror's attributes. This is not quite
ideal, but it will have to suffice - my deadline approaches *eek*

Can anyone offer an explanation for the loss of reflectivity of
objects using environment maps? Does this also happen with color,
altitude,... maps?

Love Peace and inspiration
Gregg

--
+-----------------------------------------///\/\/\_Amiga Technologies_/\/\+
  Gregg Helleren         AMIGA is REBORN /// Lecturer Information Technology
  Developer - LaseRage                  ///  SEMC TAFE Western Australia
  Ferndale W.A. Australia ____/\___/\\\///   greggh@odyssey.apana.org.au
  CBMNET:greggh@laserage.adsp.sub.org\XX/    greggh@laserage.DIALix.oz.au
+--------------------------------------------------------------------------+



Date:    Wednesday, 18 October 1995 23:59:33 
Subject: Constant Upgrade Program
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Greg Searle <expgxs@cascade.santos.com.au>
> 
> 
> But what really made me not join was that I wanted to get to grips with
> Imagine 3.0 first, see if it really meets with my needs and wants, and
> master it. Well I have mastered the bones feature which was my 1st
> priority (main reason I bought Imagine 3.0 + textures!) and have just
> recently began to explore some of the other tools and features in detail,
> such as particles. 
> 
> 
>    I other words, I haven't finised exploiting Imagine 3.0 yet in full.
> Now that 4.0 is out soon I only really want one feature from it.
> Metaballs ! This has justified me not taking up the constant upgrade

Nice to hear from you! I believe I haven't seen your messages on the 
list before. Welcome.

You mention 3.0's Bones function, which is indeed a very deep subject to 
explore and master. I haven't even touched the thing myself. But, there 
are many, many features introduced in 3.1 and above, which are 
no-brainers to learn, and improve your working environment tremendously! 
They mostly fall in two categories: display and object attributes.

If you have an AGA Amiga, or one of the AGA-compatible boards, version
3.2 introduced new resolutions: 600 x 800, 768 x 1024, and 1024 x 1280,
all using a 256-color screen that allows more detail in greyscale
backdrop images. (That's another new feature: you can load an image into
the background of any of the 4 editing views, handy for rotoscoping)
These new screen modes allow you a more precise view on those complex
Bones objects. In addition, they use a 256-color screen, if you wish, 
giving you 32 levels of grey for the backdrops, and opening the door to 
one of the flashiest features yet: the texture playground! Basically, in 
the attributes requester or any of its sub-requesters, there's a 1-inch 
square thubmnail in the corner that automatically redraws every time you 
make any change to any parameter, giving you an immediate preview at the 
new attributes/texture settings.

This is the kind of new feature that requires zero of your time to learn,
yet enhances your Imagine experience tremendously. Attributes, as a
whole, have been turbo-charged: brushmaps can now modulate Specular,
Hardness, Shininess, Brightness, Fog length, Index of Refraction, Ambient
light, and Roughness. For example, applying a fractal-type brushmap to a
simple cube, using Index of Refraction mapping, will ray-trace into a
very convincing ice cube that only uses 12 faces! 

Your other questions have, I feel, been answered in Impulse's 
newsletters, but since I have no idea which you actually received, it 
could certainly be that you got a less complete picture than I did. And 
of course, as with everything else, being online certainly kept my 
awareness and knowledge level way up there. Whatever weaknesses Impulse 
may have had, in your opinion, in its previous material, I have to 
assure you that the new glossy color brochure pushing Imagine 4.0, with 
its list of 54 new features and some awe-inspiring images from top 
Imagine users, would awaken pretty much anyone who isn't dead. And if 
some Amiga Imagine users, who'd decided to pass up the Constant Upgrade 
program, decide to get this powerful new version 4.0, what'll it cost 
them? $100, the same $100 that would've gotten them onto the Constant 
Upgrade program in the first place.

> Other Amiga users may have felt that Impulse were not delivering a good
> enough product for the Amiga to justify this expense. This may be the
> case considering some of the posts here about the non Amiga feel and
> interface of Imagine, and that other companies are producing a superior
> overall Amiga 3D product and mabey support.

For an Amiga 3.0 user to upgrade to 4.0, would cost him $100. For her to
switch to, say, Lightwave, would cost her $995 MSRP for Lightwave, or
$845 MSRP for Real3D. If the Amiga user in your argument finds it too
expensive to spend $100 on the Imagine upgrade, I don't see how they 
would afford the other Amiga 3-D software.

>    Oh dear, If this is so then Impulse don't deserve Imagine. To let
> customers slip off a registration database is totaly unacceptable. To
> treat customers in the above manner would scare not only them away from
> future products but many other potential buyers as well. One happy
> customer can create another by that customers recomendation of your
> product by the aftersevices you provide. 

Agreed; there was a time when it seemed like Impulse missed users every 
time they put out a newsletter, and I agree that this certainly caused 
people to drop out of the Imagine scene in aggravation. But to be 
honest, I can't remember the last time I read such messages. Others will 
hopefully pipe in and fill the holes in my memory, but my point is that 
Impulse seems to have improved their user database and mailing system.

By the way, since written communications often don't carry "tone" very 
well, I must specify that I wrote this message using a gentle mental 
tone. I am countering your statements with points of my own, but I wouldn't 
want to leave you with the impression that I was arguing or putting you 
down.

Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 00:01:16 
Subject: Re: WinImagine-The answers!
From:    John Grieggs <grieggs@primenet.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> 
> Mike H. wrote back to me:
> 
> 10)Is it going to be a single interface(like TrueSpace) or Multi(like
> imagine now)?  MULTI WINDOW AND SINGLE JUST LIKE IMAGINE NOW

Um, I'm not sure I understand this answer.  Is it MDI?  Or something else?

> 9)Will it run under correctly OS/2? (this would be more ideal than Win95,
> faster)IT WILL NOT RUN UNDER OS2

Arrrgh!  This will most likely be the difference between Grizzly Bear
Labs continuing to provide 3rd-party support for Imagine and not.  I
have been holding on for the last couple of years on the promise of a
well-behaved Windows program.  Well-behaved windows programs run just
fine under OS/2.

Mike, I can't comprehend why you would choose to do one of the very few
things which make code not run under OS/2.  The only one I can think of
off-hand is the use of VXDs, which don't seem appropriate to rendering
programs.  Surely you didn't make a design decision to prohibit running
under OS/2?  If you're just having trouble getting it running, I'll help.

For free.

> 8)Will the textures be DLL's? (this would be cool, really easy to make!) YES
> THEY WILL BE DLLS
> 7)Will the effects be DLL's? (see above)SAME SEE ABOVE

Finally a good interface for the motion stuff I've been contemplating!  Too
bad I'd have to downgrade to be able to work on it.

> 6)Will it use windoze standard interface? (like the buttons and windows, or
> will it be a cheap port like LW)FULL WINDOWS NOT LIKE LW COMPLETE MICROSOFT
> FOUNDATION COMPLIANCE PURRRRFECT

Should work under OS/2 then...  Also NT and WIN95.

> 5)Will it ship on CD?YES
> 4)How many textures are with it?!100 or so
> 3)Will it include 3rd party, add-on capability? (like LW, can I buy another
> modeler)NOT AT FIRST IN THE FUTURE
> 2)Will it have glows? (hehehe, can really use them) YEAH JUST LIKE IMAGINE
> NOW<THIS IS VERY EASY WHATIS THE PROBLEM  
> 1)Will the texture playground still be there? (if its not I'll sue)YEP IT IS A
ND
> WILL BE
> 
Cool stuff overall - just the one big wart there...  :-(

>                                             !LuM!
> 
_john

Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 00:01:16 
Subject: Re: WinImagine-The answers!
From:    John Grieggs <grieggs@primenet.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> 
> Mike H. wrote back to me:
> 
> 10)Is it going to be a single interface(like TrueSpace) or Multi(like
> imagine now)?  MULTI WINDOW AND SINGLE JUST LIKE IMAGINE NOW

Um, I'm not sure I understand this answer.  Is it MDI?  Or something else?

> 9)Will it run under correctly OS/2? (this would be more ideal than Win95,
> faster)IT WILL NOT RUN UNDER OS2

Arrrgh!  This will most likely be the difference between Grizzly Bear
Labs continuing to provide 3rd-party support for Imagine and not.  I
have been holding on for the last couple of years on the promise of a
well-behaved Windows program.  Well-behaved windows programs run just
fine under OS/2.

Mike, I can't comprehend why you would choose to do one of the very few
things which make code not run under OS/2.  The only one I can think of
off-hand is the use of VXDs, which don't seem appropriate to rendering
programs.  Surely you didn't make a design decision to prohibit running
under OS/2?  If you're just having trouble getting it running, I'll help.

For free.

> 8)Will the textures be DLL's? (this would be cool, really easy to make!) YES
> THEY WILL BE DLLS
> 7)Will the effects be DLL's? (see above)SAME SEE ABOVE

Finally a good interface for the motion stuff I've been contemplating!  Too
bad I'd have to downgrade to be able to work on it.

> 6)Will it use windoze standard interface? (like the buttons and windows, or
> will it be a cheap port like LW)FULL WINDOWS NOT LIKE LW COMPLETE MICROSOFT
> FOUNDATION COMPLIANCE PURRRRFECT

Should work under OS/2 then...  Also NT and WIN95.

> 5)Will it ship on CD?YES
> 4)How many textures are with it?!100 or so
> 3)Will it include 3rd party, add-on capability? (like LW, can I buy another
> modeler)NOT AT FIRST IN THE FUTURE
> 2)Will it have glows? (hehehe, can really use them) YEAH JUST LIKE IMAGINE
> NOW<THIS IS VERY EASY WHATIS THE PROBLEM  
> 1)Will the texture playground still be there? (if its not I'll sue)YEP IT IS A
ND
> WILL BE
> 
Cool stuff overall - just the one big wart there...  :-(

>                                             !LuM!
> 
_john


Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 00:28:50 
Subject: Environment maps (again)
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Gregory Helleren <greggh@dialup05.odyssey.apana.org.au>
> 
> However, when the environment map was applied to the mirror, no
> foreground objects were reflected - just the environment map.

Interesting -- you seem to have stumbled onto a bug! Indeed, an 
individual object environment map should behave exactly as the Globals 
environment map, but I have verified what you say: when an object has 
its own environment map applied, Imagine doesn't seem to bother checking 
whether other objects will reflect onto your mapped object.

My test used a chrome sphere next to a yellow cone, in Trace mode. I 
applied a fractal greyscale brushmap to the sphere, using several modes. 
In all cases, the same brushmap was loaded into Globals Environment map.

1) with an Environment brushmap, the sphere did not reflect the cone, 
only the Globals brushmap image.

2) with an Altitude brushmap, the sphere was bumpy, and reflected both 
the yellow cone, and the Globals brushmap beyond it.

So, it's only Attributes/environment mapping that's broken. Applying 
another type of brushmap to an object will not, by itself, cause 
incorrect reflections.

Hey Mike, here's one for the bug list! (Unless they've been quietly 
working on it for 4.0)


Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 00:32:04 
Subject: Environment maps (again)
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I do, however, have to question why you're doing this:

> From: Gregory Helleren <greggh@dialup05.odyssey.apana.org.au>
> 
> After a bit of adjustment, this looked great. The portion of the
> environment map shown in the mirror even had a slight depth blur
> (due to it's low resolution) which added to the realism.
> 
> Now the problem:
> A ray trace of the scene revealed what I assume is a problem. The
> mirror (whose color attributes are 0,0,0 and reflection attributes
> are 255,255,255 etc) used to reflect some foreground objects.

If you're ray tracing, there's little point in applying an environment 
brushmap to an individual object, rather than using a Globals 
environment map. Sometimes, artistic license will dictate that the 
reflections on one object be totally different than those on the other 
objects in the scene, but I assume you're not in such a convoluted 
situation.

Please tell me: why do you want to apply an environment map to your mirror?

Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 00:36:15 
Subject: Re: Glossy 4.0 Brochure etc
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Rick Dolishny <dolish@io.org>
> 
> You were asking about glowing "Seaquest" lights in Imagine: they are 
> already there! I know, you knew that too but why don't they work?

<...>
 
> Now that I've figured this out, nice glowing lights are a snap.

Hey Rick! Does that mean you're using them on the Fish'n Canada show? 
Neat! So, are they gonna call it Fish'n Canada 2032 next season? <ducking>


Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 00:42:56 
Subject: Imagine to VRML converter
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Peter Kovach <peter.joseph.kovach@medtronic.com>
> 
> Is there such a beast???  I would like to convert some imagine objects 
> for display on the VR web software and it only currently supports
> VRML objects.

InterChange, by Syndesis, supports scads of 3-D formats, including 
Imagine and VRML. E-mail John Foust at 76004.1763@compuserve.com for 
more info.


Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 00:44:52 
Subject: Imagine Upgrade Policy question.
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: SPICE@DRYCAS.CLUB.CC.CMU.EDU
> 
> I know that the end of the $100 upgrade period for Imagine is Oct 31, but
> does that mean that the order must arrive before Oct 31, or that it must
> be postmarked by Oct 31? I hope that its the latter as I want to upgrade
> my Imagine but I don't think I'll be able to mail the upgrade off until
> late Oct. 

Mike has always been mellow about this. I'm sure he'd accept your money 
if postmarked by Oct. 31. You could always address it to him personally 
to ensure it gets his attention.


Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 00:50:42 
Subject: Re: Jungle drums
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: RobSampson@aol.com
> 
> In a message dated 95-10-16 15:52:32 EDT, you write:
> 
> >Just an interesting side note. If you think the grumbling directed
> >toward Impulse was bad, DON'T subscribe to the LIGHTWAVE mailing
> >list! :) Gads......
> 
> Really!  Is it because they are having trouble with the product, or 
> because Amiga owners are feeling abandoned or something like that?

Yeah, fill us in Mike V! More dirt, that's what this list needs! If not 
Imagine, then some other program!

<pause>

Bleah. That's not what I meant to say. I started off expressing my 
curiosity at what Lightwave's current shortcomings may be, then got a 
cute idea for a humourous remark, which unfortunately went against my 
request.

Two lines of text, and I shoot myself in the foot. Yuck. I'm turning 
this thing off right now, and going to bed.



Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 00:52:07 
Subject: Re: Making a Sofa
From:    rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au (Robert Byrne)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hello S.A.Jalim, on Oct 18 you wrote:

> HI all
> 
> I`m currently building my front room and would like to hear any suggestions
> as to how to make reslistic "soft" and slightly rounded at the edges cushions
> to go on a sofa.
> 
> I am trying to use the spline editor ......

I just made one in the Forms Editor in 2 minutes. Make the cross-section
square (top view) and play around with the other views with "90" selected.

Don't forget to seal top and bottom in the initial requestor.

-- Bob

  :  Robert Byrne  : rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au :
  : Amiga A3000/25 :  Ballina, NSW  Australia  :


Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 01:12:33 
Subject: Re: Problems
From:    rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au (Robert Byrne)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hello Eduardo, on Oct 17 you wrote:

> Hello.   I'm getting gurus when rendering Imagine 3.0 (Amiga). ......

> .....   But  on  the  following  frames,  where  the  morphing of the
> transparency  attribute  takes  place,  a requester pops telling me that
> there is "Not enough memory to set up objects".  The funny thing is that
> thee  were  still  more than 5 megs fast and 800k chip mem.  available!

What model Ami are you using, 800k Chip seems low.

Are you running any programs in the background, screen blanker etc?

I've been using Im V2.0 on an A500 with WB1.3 and 2.05 and Im V3.0 on an
A3000 with WB2.05 and 3.1 and never had a guru.

-- Bob

  :  Robert Byrne  : rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au :
  : Amiga A3000/25 :  Ballina, NSW  Australia  :


Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 05:54:59 
Subject: Re: PAR settings
From:    Curtcee@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I wrote the original letter about the PAR resolution settings, specifically
that I was using 680x440 instead of the "recommended" 752x480. I neglected to
mention that I was using an aspect ratio of 1/1. I believe I tried 6/7 and
things looked squished. 

>Jim Rix wrote: 
>The 752x480 resolution is the dimensions for standard OVERSCAN NTSC 
>video.  This resolution is very useful when projects from a video 
>projector and you want as much pictures as possible

So I guess this means as long as I don't "project" my video I have nothing to
worry about? If I were to copy my animations to Betacam SP and hand them over
to the local cable company for broadcast, the people watching on their plain
non-projecting TV's wouldn't look at my animation and say, "Look at those
ugly frame lines! Doesn't this guy know it's supposed to be 752x480? What a
doofus!"

Thanks for the input,
Curtis Carlson
Curtcee@aol.com


Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 08:16:40 
Subject: The glow issue . . .
From:    CoryJ44@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

   There seems to be a bit of a discrepancy here . . . some people are pretty
convinced that Imagine needs dedicated "glow-support", while others say that
glows are a simple feature to take advantage of in Imagine . . . if it's as
easy as the latter group says, could some of you post some tips?  How can we
make convincing neon or "warm" candle glows?  It's not that I don't believe
you, I'd just like to know how the gurus do it.

                                              Cory


Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 08:16:40 
Subject: The glow issue . . .
From:    CoryJ44@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

   There seems to be a bit of a discrepancy here . . . some people are pretty
convinced that Imagine needs dedicated "glow-support", while others say that
glows are a simple feature to take advantage of in Imagine . . . if it's as
easy as the latter group says, could some of you post some tips?  How can we
make convincing neon or "warm" candle glows?  It's not that I don't believe
you, I'd just like to know how the gurus do it.

                                              Cory

Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 08:56:33 
Subject: Re: Text in a circle
From:    Bill Boyce <bilboyce@iconz.co.nz>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 11:38 AM 15/10/95 -0400, you wrote:
>> I haven't tried it, but I think you can even use conform to cylinder
>> with grouped objects (thus saving your subgroups) but I don't see
>> much advantage, since you can split faces into subgroups after you
>> have JOINED them anyway. Especially if you've used a bevel in spline.
>
>S'funny, but I don't recall anyone on the list mentioning that you can 
>simply take your lettering from the spline editor (after extruding, of 
>course) and going into the action editor, conform group/object to a 
>circular or oval or square (or whatever) path, then snapshot the object.  
>Works nicely, and you can choose a non-circular path.
>
>My .02 cents worth.
>
>Paul
>
I said it first! I said it first!
(Gotta preserve that ego :)

Bill


Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 09:07:01 
Subject: Re: PAR settings
From:    Bill Boyce <bilboyce@iconz.co.nz>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 11:38 PM 16/10/95 -0400, you wrote:
>I use DPS's PAR for making my Imagine animations and there is one thing that
>I'm curious about. The "full screen" recommendation for the PAR is 752x480.
>The first time I rendered frames at this resolution and output them to the
>PAR I noticed that a large amount of the frame was cropped vertically and
>horizontally. I assumed I would have to leave enough space along the frame
>edges so objects in the frame wouldn't be cropped out. But after
>experimenting with 640x480, 680x480, 700x480 etc., I found that 680x440
>provided just enough picture area for a full screen image on my television
>monitor (Panasonic CT1384). I guess I should also mention that 680x440
>renders faster than 752x480 and the resulting files are smaller so I guess
>the question for you PAR users is: Why 752x480??
>
>Curtis Carlson
>Curtcee@aol.com
>
Well I grabbed some Beta SP stuff, shot using a Beta SP camera. The resulting
grabs where around 720 wide. I certainly wouldn't recommend going under 720 -
this is almost certainly less than full width video and may result in borders
on some TV's if you're broadcasting or distibuting. What's full width on your
monitor isn't necessarily video legal - it'll depend on your screen
adjustments.

Bill


Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 09:07:01 
Subject: Re: PAR settings
From:    Bill Boyce <bilboyce@iconz.co.nz>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 11:38 PM 16/10/95 -0400, you wrote:
>I use DPS's PAR for making my Imagine animations and there is one thing that
>I'm curious about. The "full screen" recommendation for the PAR is 752x480.
>The first time I rendered frames at this resolution and output them to the
>PAR I noticed that a large amount of the frame was cropped vertically and
>horizontally. I assumed I would have to leave enough space along the frame
>edges so objects in the frame wouldn't be cropped out. But after
>experimenting with 640x480, 680x480, 700x480 etc., I found that 680x440
>provided just enough picture area for a full screen image on my television
>monitor (Panasonic CT1384). I guess I should also mention that 680x440
>renders faster than 752x480 and the resulting files are smaller so I guess
>the question for you PAR users is: Why 752x480??
>
>Curtis Carlson
>Curtcee@aol.com
>
Well I grabbed some Beta SP stuff, shot using a Beta SP camera. The resulting
grabs where around 720 wide. I certainly wouldn't recommend going under 720 -
this is almost certainly less than full width video and may result in borders
on some TV's if you're broadcasting or distibuting. What's full width on your
monitor isn't necessarily video legal - it'll depend on your screen
adjustments.

Bill


Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 09:07:19 
Subject: Re: Imagine ported to BeBox?
From:    Marco Dufour <marduf@galactica.it>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

On Tue, 17 Oct 1995 SPICE@DRYCAS.CLUB.CC.CMU.EDU wrote:

> Would anyone else like to see Imagine ported to the BeBox? Since it looks

Forgive my ignorance, what's the BeBox?

> like Amiga Technologies doesnt came about anyone but game players, so the
> future of new, high end Amigas looks very doubtful. I really dont want to

If Amiga Technologies lowers its prices, Amiga will live longer. It's NOT 
true that there will be no new professional Amiga. It's true if you want 
to see something really new you should wait until March 1996. AmigaT will 
introduce the new models at CeBit (Hannover).

                              Marco Dufour
                              -------------------
                              marduf@galactica.it





Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 09:07:19 
Subject: Re: Imagine ported to BeBox?
From:    Marco Dufour <marduf@galactica.it>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

On Tue, 17 Oct 1995 SPICE@DRYCAS.CLUB.CC.CMU.EDU wrote:

> Would anyone else like to see Imagine ported to the BeBox? Since it looks

Forgive my ignorance, what's the BeBox?

> like Amiga Technologies doesnt came about anyone but game players, so the
> future of new, high end Amigas looks very doubtful. I really dont want to

If Amiga Technologies lowers its prices, Amiga will live longer. It's NOT 
true that there will be no new professional Amiga. It's true if you want 
to see something really new you should wait until March 1996. AmigaT will 
introduce the new models at CeBit (Hannover).

                              Marco Dufour
                              -------------------
                              marduf@galactica.it





Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 09:18:01 
Subject: Re: Modelling tips?
From:    Bill Boyce <bilboyce@iconz.co.nz>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 12:16 PM 18/10/95 -0400, you wrote:
>
>> How about "Tom's day in the forms editor" or something and show us how 
>>     to make something cool. That's my weakest editor right now...
>
>I second that one, Tom.  Any help you could give in the forms editor would be
>appreciated greatly.
>
>                                        Cory
>
'Thirded'. I've seen some lovely stuff done in forms. Never given it a good
go though. Hmmm. Maybe I shouldn't be so lazy.


Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 09:18:01 
Subject: Re: Modelling tips?
From:    Bill Boyce <bilboyce@iconz.co.nz>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 12:16 PM 18/10/95 -0400, you wrote:
>
>> How about "Tom's day in the forms editor" or something and show us how 
>>     to make something cool. That's my weakest editor right now...
>
>I second that one, Tom.  Any help you could give in the forms editor would be
>appreciated greatly.
>
>                                        Cory
>
'Thirded'. I've seen some lovely stuff done in forms. Never given it a good
go though. Hmmm. Maybe I shouldn't be so lazy.


Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 09:20:32 
Subject: Re: transparent
From:    Bill Boyce <bilboyce@iconz.co.nz>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 08:50 PM 18/10/95 EDT, you wrote:
>--- Received from GITD.PSG024  2164526              19OCT95  10.50
>  -> IBMMAIL.INTERNET      IBMMAIL
>Hi all,
>
>I am working on a PC and version 2 of Imagine.  I am having real
>difficulty creating a plane to behave in such a way that when I
>apply a brushmap to it, it will be transparent where the color is
>black.
>
>My bitmap image is say a black circle on a white background, and
>when I apply this to a plane I want the black area (the circle)
>to be see-through. How the hell do you do this] I'm getting
>plenty of caffine just trying to solve this prob.
>
>thanks
>vic
Check your brushmap positioning - make sure '+y' goes through the object
and it is within or covered by '+x' and '+z'. Usually my problems stem from
this...

Bill Boyce


Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 09:20:32 
Subject: Re: transparent
From:    Bill Boyce <bilboyce@iconz.co.nz>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 08:50 PM 18/10/95 EDT, you wrote:
>--- Received from GITD.PSG024  2164526              19OCT95  10.50
>  -> IBMMAIL.INTERNET      IBMMAIL
>Hi all,
>
>I am working on a PC and version 2 of Imagine.  I am having real
>difficulty creating a plane to behave in such a way that when I
>apply a brushmap to it, it will be transparent where the color is
>black.
>
>My bitmap image is say a black circle on a white background, and
>when I apply this to a plane I want the black area (the circle)
>to be see-through. How the hell do you do this] I'm getting
>plenty of caffine just trying to solve this prob.
>
>thanks
>vic
Check your brushmap positioning - make sure '+y' goes through the object
and it is within or covered by '+x' and '+z'. Usually my problems stem from
this...

Bill Boyce


Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 09:42:47 
Subject: Re: Imagine ported to BeBox?
From:    Bill Boyce <bilboyce@iconz.co.nz>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 10:29 AM 18/10/95 -0400, you wrote:
>Scott Corley <SPICE@DRYCAS.CLUB.CC.CMU.EDU> wrote:
>> Would anyone else like to see Imagine ported to the BeBox? Since it looks
>> like Amiga Technologies doesnt came about anyone but game players, so the
>> future of new, high end Amigas looks very doubtful. I really dont want to
>> have to buy a clone and the BeBox looks like the spiritual heir of the
>> Amiga.
>
>YES! I'd love to see Imagine on the BeBox!!  Just 'imagine' splitting up
>the rendering task into N (user-definable) threads, each of which is
>automagically given its own CPU by the operating system.  With later
>versions of the BeBox you could expect to render an image up to 8 times
>faster than with a single CPU computer... And the PPC603 isn't exactly
>slow, to begin with.  Whoa, I gotta sit down. :)
>

And the difference between a BeBox and a multi Pentium Windows NT box would
be .... ?

(Apart from installed software base, speed and security/backup/longetivity,
price etc etc)

Seriously, I wish them the best. We Amiga users know it can be done better.
I'd love to see it happen, even if it's just Bill Gates finding the 'optimise'
flag on his compiler :)

Bill Boyce


Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 09:56:33 
Subject: Re: Text in a circle
From:    Bill Boyce <bilboyce@iconz.co.nz>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 11:38 AM 15/10/95 -0400, you wrote:
>> I haven't tried it, but I think you can even use conform to cylinder
>> with grouped objects (thus saving your subgroups) but I don't see
>> much advantage, since you can split faces into subgroups after you
>> have JOINED them anyway. Especially if you've used a bevel in spline.
>
>S'funny, but I don't recall anyone on the list mentioning that you can 
>simply take your lettering from the spline editor (after extruding, of 
>course) and going into the action editor, conform group/object to a 
>circular or oval or square (or whatever) path, then snapshot the object.  
>Works nicely, and you can choose a non-circular path.
>
>My .02 cents worth.
>
>Paul
>
I said it first! I said it first!
(Gotta preserve that ego :)

Bill


Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 10:28:10 
Subject: Re: Particles+Texture problem
From:    Bill Boyce <bilboyce@iconz.co.nz>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 11:41 AM 18/10/95 CET, you wrote:
>Hi,
>
>What I am trying to do is something breaking through a graffity
>painted wall. I used a particles object to create the wall and
>mapped the graffity brush on it. I quickrendered it and it looked
>ok. Then I created a state for the flat wall. After using "lock
>state" in the brush requester, I did not get the wall with the
>graffity on it any more when I quickrendered but only bricks with
>different colors. I think Imagine looks up one pixel of the brush
>for each brick. Am I doing something wrong or is this a bug in
>Imagine? And is there a workaround for this? I need the "lock
>state" switch to do the broken wall.
>
>Bye,
>  Hendrik

Check :

You've entered the Lock state name in the brushmap requester and PUSH ENTER
after you type it in (or have selected it using browse)

Create a state called 'Default' first, then create other states for anything
you need to fix - and DON'T use the Default state for ANYTHING. It's just
they way it works.

Make sure you've selected Brushes (?) in the states requester

Check your brush axis location

That's all the catches that spring to mind,

Bill Boyce


Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 10:59:18 
Subject: I want info about IM4.0 and the costs from IM 3.3
From:    aciolino@rrddts.donnelley.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


     Okay, here's where I stand:
     
     1) I have been too busy to read the list lately.
     
     2) I have the current constant upgrade, and understand IM 4.0 (PC DOS) 
     is speeding it's way to my house tomorrow morning.
     
     3) I WANT WinImagine.
     
     4) I Want it CHEAP. And soon, but I can wait until 4.0 gets to my 
     house first :)
     
     5) I want to know How Much Money this will cost me, and When I can 
     Write the Check!
     
     6) I want to know how much the Constant Upgrade from WinIm4.0 to WinIm 
     5.0 will be.
     
     7) I want a bunch of jelly beans.
     
     Now, I'm pretty sure that of all the questions I have above, only #7 
     is answerable but I thought I'd put out a challenge to someone...maybe 
     Iron Mike himself! (Should I be so lucky!)
     
     Someone please inform me of this, with Charles' "kind, gentle tone" 
     that he used :)
     
     -AC

Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 13:26:00 
Subject: Decals on Glass
From:    mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com (Mike Vandersommen)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

-> From: Curcio Nicholas <curcion@db.erau.edu>->-> This method does not work.  T
he problem is that the decal takes on= th-> transparency of the object, thereby 
beconing invivsible.  The only= id-> have is to make another object the size of 
your decal.  You could =cut-> out of the origanl glass object.  Apply the decal 
to this new,-> non-transparent object, and group the two together.THANK you. You
r's is the first response that actually understandsthe problem I'm trying to sol
ve. BitMap wraps on a transparentobject also become transparent....Unfortunately
, your solution would not allow an irregular bitmapwrap (using GENLOCK button) t
o show just the map on a glass object.The project I'm trying to duplicate is the
 WHITE CocaCola logoon an old fashioned Coke bottle. I've tried Transparency map
, butfor some reason, WHITE seems to be the only color to become transpare=nt.I'
ll experiment some more....Thanks again.   /------------------------------      
     ___   ___  ___   ___  | Mike van der Sommen                     / __  /__/ /__/  /_   \ /  | Santa Barbara, Ca.                     /___/ /
 \  /  /  /     / \  | mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com     HAUS BBS (805-6
83-1388)  |           "Blackouts make for nice breaks in the day"   \___________
__________________________________________________--- =FE InterNet - GraFX Haus 
BBS - Santa Barbara, Ca - (805) 683-1388

Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 13:26:33 
Subject: Re: Imagine ported to BeBox?
From:    "Robert King (ART)" <king@satie.arts.usf.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

On Thu, 19 Oct 1995, Soeren Birk Jacobsen wrote:

> Well the point is that a few weeks ago A4000-60 Tower was released, 
> here in Denmark it is selling for approx $3000.- plus tax.
> 
> 
> kurgan  

Are the A4000's flying out the door at $3000-pluse tax?  What does 90 mhz 
Pentium go for over there?

I have 25 mhz 030 2500 but I'm going to get a pentium after hearing about 
the speed Imagine renders at.  I wonder what the comparison of an 060 
A4000 to 133 mhz Pentium in rendering speed would show? 

Robert King   king@arts.usf.edu


Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 13:42:00 
Subject: Decals on Glass
From:    mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com (Mike Vandersommen)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

-> From: William E Costello <bill@Starbase.NeoSoft.COM>-> Best thing I can think
 of is to make a mask of your decal in a pai=nt-> program.  The mask would have 
all the areas you want transparent o=ne-> color, and the areas you want solid an
other color.  Then use the m=ask-> as a transparency map, and the normal decal a
s a color map.I'll try it. However, does using a "mask" change the characteristi
csof how a wrap will be seen? If a color map takes on the attributecharacteristi
cs of the object (which it seems to do) wouldn't thetransparency map still be th
e only wrap visible?=2E..I didn't think this was going to be this hard. :)   /--
----------------------------           ___   ___  ___   ___  | Mike van der Somm
en                     / __  /__/ /__/  /_   \ /  | Santa Barbara, Ca.          
           /___/ / \  /  /  /     / \  | mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com  
   HAUS BBS (805-683-1388)  |           "Blackouts make for nice breaks in the d
ay"   \_____________________________________________________________--- =FE InterNet - GraFX Haus BBS - Santa Barbara, Ca - (805) 683-1388

Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 13:52:00 
Subject: Imagine 4.0 Upgrade Q?
From:    mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com (Mike Vandersommen)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

-> From: spack@mv.us.adobe.com-> Just so I don't misunderstand the Glossy Brochu
re.-> If someone has subscribed to the Constant Upgrade program, then th=ey-> to
 pay $100 by Oct. 31 for 4.0 - RIGHT?->-> I suspect there are some, myself inclu
ded who are not clear on thi=s.-> might be getting money that they shouldn't exp
ect!No! 4.0 is what you were paying the $100 for. You just got it a littl=ebit a
t a time. The only reason you'd have to pay another $100 is ifyou wanted to cros
s platform from Amiga to PC, which is why it costme $200 total (since I didn't b
uy into the constant upgrade deal).   /------------------------------           
___   ___  ___   ___  | Mike van der Sommen                     / __  /__/ /__/ 
 /_   \ /  | Santa Barbara, Ca.                     /___/ / \  /  /  /     / \  
| mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com     HAUS BBS (805-683-1388)  |          
 "Blackouts make for nice breaks in the day"   \________________________________
_____________________________--- =FE InterNet - GraFX Haus BBS - Santa Barbara, Ca - (805) 683-1388

Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 14:10:00 
Subject: Decal on glass
From:    mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com (Mike Vandersommen)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

-> Someone had asked about applying a decal to glass, and my reply wa=s p-> wron
g (as was also pointed out).  You can genlock a decal on glass= bu-> image map m
ust be a filter map.  For a tiff file where you want bl=ack-> the color that doe
s not show up, set genc to 000000.  Apply the ma=p a-> required setting it to fi
lter and selecting genlock.  The map will= th-> up as a decal on the glass.  I t
ried this out, so I know that it d=oesYes, that does work. However, my decal has
 white lettering in it.Apparently, white, using FILTER or Transparancy mapping, 
becomestransparent (or atleast the corresponding color register). I'vechecked pr
eferences, and while you can change the GENLOCK color,it appears you can't chang
e the FILTER/Transparency filter color.So, unless I'm missing something obvious,
 if you want white lettering(using GENLOCK mapping) on a transparent object, you
're outta luck.=2E..down, but not out! :)   /------------------------------     
      ___   ___  ___   ___  | Mike van der Sommen                     / __  /__/ /__/  /_   \ /  | Santa Barbara, Ca.                     /___/ 
/ \  /  /  /     / \  | mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com     HAUS BBS (805-
683-1388)  |           "Blackouts make for nice breaks in the day"   \__________
___________________________________________________--- =FE InterNet - GraFX Haus
 BBS - Santa Barbara, Ca - (805) 683-1388

Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 14:10:09 
Subject: Re: Decals on Glass
From:    Jim Rix <jim@yakko.cs.wmich.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Wed, 18 Oct 1995, Mike Vandersommen wrote:

> 
> Ok, Imagine GURUS....need some help. I'm trying to map a brush
> on glass. How can I map a TIF image on a transparent object?
> I've made a drinking glass object and I want to put a color map
> on it. When I make the attributes solid, it maps fine, but when
> I add transparency to the object, the map disappears.
> 
> Now if I select transparancy map, the wrap is visible, but parts
> of it are transparent. How can I get the whole map to show solid,
> like a Decal on glass?
> 
This couldn't be easier.

You will need two brushmaps.

The first is a normal color map.

The second is a transparency map where it it totally white where the 
object you want is not.

It is important to place the transparent map to cover the entire map with 
the color map matching the transparency map exactly.

One problem I had was during an animation using this technique.  There 
would be flashes on the boarder of the plane.

Jim Rix
http://yakko.cs.wmich.edu/~jim

Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 14:14:08 
Subject: Re: Imagine ported to BeBox?
From:    Soeren Birk Jacobsen <kurgan@imada.ou.dk>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  





On Thu, 19 Oct 1995, Marco Dufour wrote:

> On Tue, 17 Oct 1995 SPICE@DRYCAS.CLUB.CC.CMU.EDU wrote:
> 
> > Would anyone else like to see Imagine ported to the BeBox? Since it looks
> 
> Forgive my ignorance, what's the BeBox?
> 
> > like Amiga Technologies doesnt came about anyone but game players, so the
> > future of new, high end Amigas looks very doubtful. I really dont want to
> 
> If Amiga Technologies lowers its prices, Amiga will live longer. It's NOT 
> true that there will be no new professional Amiga. It's true if you want 
> to see something really new you should wait until March 1996. AmigaT will 
> introduce the new models at CeBit (Hannover).
> 
>                             Marco Dufour
>                             -------------------
>                             marduf@galactica.it
> 
> 
> 
> 



Well as you probably know, Amiga is now owned by German based ES-COM one 
of the biggest PC-producers in Europe.
Now I live in, what RenderBrandt? would call Tax-Hell-Hole of Denmark (In 
fact we pay even more tax than Norwegians, cars are usually 3x the normal 
price in Germany and 4x US prices AT LEAST, a standard no frills Toyota 
(Japanese) is approx $25.000.-)

Well the point is that a few weeks ago A4000-60 Tower was released, 
here in Denmark it is selling for approx $3000.- plus tax.


kurgan  

Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 14:17:33 
Subject: PC Imagine
From:    Perry Lucas <plucas@vt.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


Hopefully the rumors of changing address with impulse aren't true as I just 
called to do so (I am getting on my knees and praying...) While doing so, I 
asked if the PC version of 4.0 would ship tomorrow, Friday, and was told 
that it mostly likely would NOT ship.  He said that they were trying their
hardest but it is unlikely that it will ship.  

Hey MIKE, please check to see if my address change went through!  
(From NJ to VA!)

--Perry

p.s. The guy that answered the phone wasn't rude either...


Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 16:24:24 
Subject: Re: Decals on Glass
From:    Curcio Nicholas <curcion@db.erau.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Thu, 19 Oct 1995, Mike Vandersommen wrote:

> Unfortunately, your solution would not allow an irregular bitmap
> wrap (using GENLOCK button) to show just the map on a glass object.

> The project I'm trying to duplicate is the WHITE CocaCola logo
> on an old fashioned Coke bottle. I've tried Transparency map, but
> for some reason, WHITE seems to be the only color to become transparent.
> I'll experiment some more....

Ok.  When I replied the first time I may not have been thinking too 
clearly.  How about this...

When you make the cut-out object, apply your CocaCola brush as a filter 
map first.  Make the letters black and the background white.  If you make 
the attributes of the cut-out object white with no filter or anything 
like that, the filter brush should do the job.  If the CocaCola letters 
weren't simply white, you could add the colored brush on top of the 
filter brush.

I hope this makes sense, and I THINK it should work.  If I get time 
tonight I'll try it myself.  Let me know how it goes.

Nik


Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 16:56:36 
Subject: Re: decal on glass
From:    sauvp@citi.doc.ca (Patrick Sauvageau)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com:
>-> Someone had asked about applying a decal to glass, and my reply was p
>-> wrong (as was also pointed out).  You can genlock a decal on glass bu
>-> image map must be a filter map.  For a tiff file where you want black
>-> the color that does not show up, set genc to 000000.  Apply the map a
>-> required setting it to filter and selecting genlock.  The map will th
>-> up as a decal on the glass.  I tried this out, so I know that it does
>
>Yes, that does work. However, my decal has white lettering in it.
>Apparently, white, using FILTER or Transparancy mapping, becomes
>transparent (or atleast the corresponding color register). I've
>checked preferences, and while you can change the GENLOCK color,
>it appears you can't change the FILTER/Transparency filter color.
>So, unless I'm missing something obvious, if you want white lettering
>(using GENLOCK mapping) on a transparent object, you're outta luck.
>
>...down, but not out! :)

You can use two maps, one for setting the transparency (black-for-genlock
background and 01 01 01 almost black for the letters) and another (genlock
black with white letters) for setting the colors. Be sure that the two
brushes axis are exactly the same.
Or you may try using "inverse video" or somthing like that in the brush
requester to use the same file, but i do not know how it will react with the
"use genlock" setting.

Good luck;
-----
Patrick Sauvageau
(sauvp@citi.doc.ca)


Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 19:55:50 
Subject: Re: I want info about IM4.0 and the costs from IM 3.3
From:    Perry Lucas <plucas@vt.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 10:59 AM 10/19/95 CST, aciolino@rrddts.donnelley.com wrote:
>
>     Okay, here's where I stand:
>     
>     1) I have been too busy to read the list lately.

        Too busy for Imagine, sheesh.
     
>     2) I have the current constant upgrade, and understand IM 4.0 (PC DOS) 
>     is speeding it's way to my house tomorrow morning.

        Most Likely not, I called this morning for an address change and
        the guy said it would be unlikely that it would ship tomorrow.
     
>     3) I WANT WinImagine.

        Multi-Tasking Finally
     
>     4) I Want it CHEAP. And soon, but I can wait until 4.0 gets to my 
>     house first :)

        $200 for registered users of 4.0
     
>     6) I want to know how much the Constant Upgrade from WinIm4.0 to WinIm 
>     5.0 will be.

        WinImagine is suppose to be 4.0 for windows with very few difference
        except windows related functions (help system etc.
     
>     7) I want a bunch of jelly beans.

        Go to your local candy store.  They'll stock you up.
     
--Perry


Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 20:19:53 
Subject: Re: Imagine 4.0
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-19 00:12:52 EDT, you write:

>Rob
>
>1st there is no NEW manual, there is a detailed read me file that you can
and
>should print out.  WE have complete listings of the textures in the doc and
>they
>should help, however with the new Texture playground you might not feel a
>need
>to use the docs.
>
>The upgrades to Imagine for window will be $200.00 from Imagine 4.0 DOS.
>
>Now I would like to ask, where did you get your impressions, from Impulse or
>from this list.
>
>Mike

Well I got the impression on the upgrade going to be more from one of your
posts on Compuserve.  Specifically I have quoted it here.

"Dennis

Not that many differences, there are some, actually many due to the fact that
it is not just a port like others, windows imagine is very windows and a full
implementation of the windows os
Of course you will be able to upgarde however the cost will be more than $200
when going from DOS 4.0

Mike"

Now that is a direct copy to clipboard of your message and it reads to me
that you have stated "the cost will be more than $200 when going from DOS
4.0"
I suspect this means that I got the impression on the cost from Impulse since
that is you right?  As to the manual, I am sure I heard talkings about that
over on Compuserve as well.  I cannot find any specific posts nor will I
attempt to dig through them.  I thought as well that it would be resonable
for a new version of Imagine to come with a manual.  Does a first time buyer
of Imagine 4.0 get a manual that says 3.0?   Hey I like to software and I
make allot of stuff with it.  I intend to upgrade to the windoze version.  I
hope this explains where I got my impressions from.

Bob.............




Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 20:19:56 
Subject: Re: Normals, Modeling and Viewpoint DataLabs
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-19 00:58:33 EDT, you write:

>Bob there is a program called TriSpectives that was just released for
>Windows 95 which is supposed to be the first ACIS solid modeling/rendering
>program written specifically for 95.  I was put on the beta program, and
>while you can do simple things very quickly, it really was on the level of
>Raydream as far as modeling more complex stuff.  I was not that impressed to
>tell you the truth.  I don't know if you have seen Raydream artwork, but
>everything tends to be made out of symetrical primitive type objects.  This
>is great for certain things but it lacks the power of a complex modelling
>program like Imagine.  Others may have a different opinion, and to tell you
>the truth, I didn't spend that much time with it.  The cost is about $300
>for the regular version and $500 for the pro version, which does animation
>as well.
>
>It is being advertised in several magazines, if you want more info just
>email me.
>
>Stephen G.

No thanks Stephen.  I just wanted to point out that acess to a good solids
modeler can enhance and greatly speed up production of a scene in Imagine.
 Most any solid I create still gets further attention in Imagine but there
are some things that could take virtually forever without access to both
programs.  Take something simple like a block of swiss cheese for instance.
 I can be done in Imagine but it's slice operations are so iffy that it would
be a real pain in the butt.  Using a solids modeler with excellent slice
capabilities it becomes as easy as adding as many and as varied balls to the
block as I desire and selecting slice.  I can select easily the final detail
level and whether I want to use phong on the object in Imagine or not by
selecting the number of isolines prior to slicing.  It also make producing
bubbles in a glass sphere ect very easy.  I venture to say however that Acads
modeler would be Tim Wilsons last choice for making something like his
"Humanoids".  Imagine for organics is simply superior hands down.

Bob...........

Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 20:41:28 
Subject: Re: decal on glass
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-19 14:26:52 EDT, you write:

>Yes, that does work. However, my decal has white lettering in it.
>Apparently, white, using FILTER or Transparancy mapping, becomes
>transparent (or atleast the corresponding color register). I've
>checked preferences, and while you can change the GENLOCK color,
>it appears you can't change the FILTER/Transparency filter color.
>So, unless I'm missing something obvious, if you want white lettering
>(using GENLOCK mapping) on a transparent object, you're outta luck.

Any chance of say making the lettering some other color to apply it while
rendering and then use flood fill and post process it to white?  I know it
depends on the object and there are many other complexities to consider but
if your scene lends itself to this you might get away with it.

Bob.............

Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 21:12:10 
Subject: Re: decal on glass
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Patrick Sauvageau <sauvp@citi.doc.ca>
> 
> You can use two maps, one for setting the transparency (black-for-genlock
> background and 01 01 01 almost black for the letters) and another (genlock
> black with white letters) for setting the colors. Be sure that the two
> brushes axis are exactly the same.

And to be sure that the two brushmaps match up exactly, you can use a 
feature introduced in 3.3: Dup Brush. Apply your Filter map, say. When 
position/size/alignment are perfect, Dup the brush, and change the 
filename/brush type of the duplicate to your Color map. Presto-change-o, 
the exact same numbers for both brushes.


Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 21:13:25 
Subject: Re: Constant Upgrade Program
From:    sgiff@airmail.net (Stephen Gifford)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Agreed; there was a time when it seemed like Impulse missed users every 
>time they put out a newsletter, and I agree that this certainly caused 
>people to drop out of the Imagine scene in aggravation. But to be 
>honest, I can't remember the last time I read such messages. Others will 
>hopefully pipe in and fill the holes in my memory, but my point is that 
>Impulse seems to have improved their user database and mailing system.
>
>By the way, since written communications often don't carry "tone" very 
>well, I must specify that I wrote this message using a gentle mental 
>tone. I am countering your statements with points of my own, but I wouldn't 
>want to leave you with the impression that I was arguing or putting you 
>down.
>
It would seem to me that Impulse would benefit greatly by putting up a Web
Page at this point.  They could post bug patches, put a weekly imagine news
update, and create an Art Gallery of Imagine work.  And a suggestion box.  I
wouldn't need them to waste postage and paper by sending me a newsletter,
and people who didn't have access to the Web could still recieve it.  They
could even put new versions of Imagine online and you would just type in a
code or something that would be mailed to you on a postcard and download
your upgrade.
I don't know if that last part would be feasible but I think the other
points would benefit them and us greatly.

Stephen G.>


Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 21:16:22 
Subject: Re: Environment maps (again)
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Gregory Helleren <greggh@dialup01.odyssey.apana.org.au>
> 
> Maybe I'll try doing an overhead mounted mirror this time! Hmmm always had
> a fancy for one of those in the bedroom :)

My old boyfriend, an auto mechanic, used to have one of these mounted on 
the ceiling above the bed. It bore the inscription, "Objects are larger 
than they appear".

<drum roll, rim shot>


Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 21:20:48 
Subject: Re: Environment maps (again)
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Gregory Helleren <greggh@dialup01.odyssey.apana.org.au>
> 
> So as to get the mirror to show a significant portion of the night scene
> a thumbnail of the night scene was created - as per your suggestion
> (thanks again). For obvious reasons I could not introduce a compensating
> curvature into the mirror.

Ahh, I get it. Articstic license, then: you wanted to show more of the 
environment than was mathematically accurate. Gotcha. And of course, due 
to the metallic dude (bummer about his head, BTW), you couldn't simply 
stick a plane with the cityscape behind the camera, as Metall-o-guy 
would've also reflected the plane.

I don't think your color mapping idea would work, as the color 
distortions from the cityscape brushmap would also appear in the areas 
where the mirror reflects the metallic dude.


Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 21:22:55 
Subject: Re: The glow issue . . .
From:    sgiff@airmail.net (Stephen Gifford)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

>   There seems to be a bit of a discrepancy here . . . some people are pretty
>convinced that Imagine needs dedicated "glow-support", while others say that
>glows are a simple feature to take advantage of in Imagine . . . if it's as
>easy as the latter group says, could some of you post some tips?  How can we
>make convincing neon or "warm" candle glows?  It's not that I don't believe
>you, I'd just like to know how the gurus do it.
>
>                                              Cory
>
For those interested in creating glows in Imagine, visit Stephen Blacmon's
page at:  http://www.websharx.com:80/~kinda/mainmenu.html

He has a tutorial specifically for this.  In short you create an sphere or
an enclosed object the size of the glow you want.  Add the Ghost.itx and
make it a fog object.  Make it a light source if you want the glow to light
up a wall or something like neon against a wall and that's it.  The color of
your glow will be the color of your fog object.

The density of your fog is the key to making a realistic looking glow for
lights and candles etc.  


Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 21:27:49 
Subject: Making a Sofa
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: S.A.Jalim@exeter.ac.uk
> 
> I am trying to use the spline editor to make a top view of a square
> shaped one and then I extrude and round bevel it on both the front and
> back faces, but then it looks too uniform, if you see what I mean. 
> 
> Any suggestions as to a better way to make `em?

Your idea is just great, since you can make the rounded-corner
rectangular outlines easily in the Spline editor, and its round-bevel
routines will take care of the roundness in the other plane. To add more
character to your cushions, I would suggest using that old Imagine
standby, the Detail editor's Magnetism function. Using it, you can select
the top points of the cushion, and lower them a bit, so the centermost
points get lowered the most. Presto -- instant depression; just add a 
small, squashed sphere to make the button that holds the cushion top & 
button together and creates that depression.



Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 21:30:45 
Subject: Upholstery mapping (was: Re: Making a Sofa)
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Brad Molsen <moon@eskimo.com>
> 
> 3D Artist issue 19 had an article called "Upholstery Mapping" which might 
> touch on this subject. The article was by Doug Kelly, who has been a 
> contributor to this list in the past.

Yeah, I'd always meant to ask about that: since Imagine allows tacking 
brushmaps to a State, why did Doug need to use Glenn Lewis' "Similar" 
utility to create the final model? Why couldn't he simply create the 
chair, call the state "normal", then unfold the surfaces, call that 
state "unfolded", apply and tack the brushmap to the "unfolded" state, 
and use the "normal" state in his scene? Anyone?


Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 21:39:32 
Subject: Re: PAR settings
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Curtis, the thing about overscan is, it depends on each individual TV's 
adjustments. You can't predict how much or how little a TV will 
overscan, so professionals have to render all the way to the edges, even 
if most people won't see that far; yet, they keep everything important 
inside a rectangle called the "safe zone". Lightwave can automatically 
display this area in its editors, as do most character generators. (If 
you were an advertiser, how would you like to see your commercial 
finally broadcast on late-night TV, only to be horrified at the 
lower-third title that says, "ALL 1-800-356-841"?)

Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 21:44:22 
Subject: Simply FYI... :-)
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Matthew C. Polak <cv773@cleveland.Freenet.Edu>
> 
> Question: Does anyone else on the PC side of Imagine use the
> Number Nine's 'Imagine-128' graphics accellerator? It is an
> amazing card, (128-bit/4MB/24bit_color) but the only problem
>  I have is it doesn't work in true-color mode in Imagine.

Did you try UniVESA?


Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 21:48:40 
Subject: Mike van der Sommen's Wrap transparency
From:    NEWKIRK@delphi.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Just a thought.  Try a two-wrap approach.  Use map you have for the logo,
and then: make a mask, with the logo in BLACK, the background WHITE, then
use this mask for the transparency map.  This should make the area of the
logo completely non-transparent, allowing the map to appear solid, and
the white of the map will set full transparency.  Of course, you could
probably shorten things overall by making the background coke-bottle
green... 8^)
Lemme know if this helps.  I'm gonna try it out when I'm done reading
my mailbox (60-70 messages tonight, one day's worth!)
Joel
newkirk@delphi.com
102627.1152@compuserve.com

Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 21:55:43 
Subject: The glow issue . . .
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: CoryJ44@aol.com
> 
> How can we make convincing neon or "warm" candle glows?  It's not that I
> don't believe you, I'd just like to know how the gurus do it. 

I have laid awake at night, pondering neon glows. What can I say, I've 
always liked the NBC "Let's all be there" neon sign of a few years back. 
My personal feeling on the matter, is that I can get perfectly good 
glows, by doing them in post-production. I'll render two versions of my 
Imagine scene: one normal, the other with every object that's not a 
light, painted solid black. Call that second project Glow. You blur the 
Glow images in a good image processor such as Imagemaster, and save as 
Glow-Blurred; you then make a greyscale version of them, and save as 
Glow-Alpha. Finally, you composite the normal images with Glow-Blurred, 
using Glow-Alpha as the (alpha channel/blend control buffer/whatever 
your program calls it)


NOTE: Once the greyscales are saved, you may want to go back 
to the color Glow-Blurred images and increase their Luminance to 100%, 
leaving Hue and Saturation alone. (Imagemaster has a handy-dandy 
operator called "HSV Set" that's perfect for these contrived techniques)
The reason for that is, if the alpha channel already carries the 
strength of the glow at any particular pixel, and you don't correct the 
luminance of the glow image, you'll end up compositing (at that pixel) 
the original Imagine scene, with a blurred Glow image where the glow's 
pixel color is hal-mixed with the black background, parts of your final 
image will show a very unrealistic glow with parts that are actually 
_darker_ than the original image! Glows should always add light, never 
subtract it. This is why I set the luminance of the blurred glow to 100%.


This may sound a bit dense, but I didn't feel like typing a 3-page 
expanded version of these instructions. The steps are all there, though.


Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 22:00:55 
Subject: View point when modeling 3d object
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Peter Kovach <peter.joseph.kovach@medtronic.com>
> 
> This is because I want pre-render views at various angle (e.g. looking
> down at ones self, seeing arms extended, etc) as if seeing oneself and I
> want to look at it via quick-render. 

I see Roger has already replied. You mention creating several preset 
views; depending how your object is set up (single object vs. group), 
and depending how Imagine's View From Object works, you might be able to 
add _several empty axes to your group, each defining a certain view. It 
would then be a matter of using View From Object with the proper axis, 
to get the desired predefined view. I'm just throwing this off the top 
of my head.



Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 22:02:41 
Subject: Re: Win-Imagine
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: RobSampson@aol.com
> 
> Given that we absolutely need a windoze version I can't wait.  Would be
> nice to at least pull the IML and reply while rendering:)

I agree, I've been doing it for years. <g> I read a question on the IML, 
flip over to Imagine to test my answer. Seems to get results.




Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 22:03:02 
Subject: Win-Imagine
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Mike Vandersommen <mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com>
> 
> Charles, did Mike happen to mention if it was going to be stictly
> a 16-bit app? If so, will a 32-bit app be available soon?

No idea.

Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 22:33:06 
Subject: Re: Modelling tips?
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: CoryJ44@aol.com
> 
> I second that one, Tom.  Any help you could give in the forms editor 
> would be appreciated greatly.

Same here. I've never been able to get my mind on the Forms editor, and 
always considered it a bit clumsy. (e.g. need to manually drag & 
position tons of points -- how on Earth can you create a smooth curve 
with _that_?) (I know, don't tell me -- "use 4.0's Smoothing function to 
clean up your object")



Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 23:13:48 
Subject: RE: Decals on glass.
From:    Jim Shinosky <tracker@en.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


To Mike V.,  
   If you are still having problems with your decal after trying all of the
solutions given so far, mail me and I'll put the definitive answer up on the
IML.  I don't have time to put it up right at the moment.  I've tested it and
I'm sure it's what you are looking for.

Jim Shinosky

Date:    Thursday, 19 October 1995 23:25:37 
Subject: Re: Decals on Glass
From:    CoryJ44@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-19 14:33:02 EDT, you write:

>The project I'm trying to duplicate is the WHITE CocaCola logo
>on an old fashioned Coke bottle. I've tried Transparency map, but
>for some reason, WHITE seems to be the only color to become transparent.
>I'll experiment some more....

Would making it _ever_so_slightly_ off-white solve your problem (255 255
254)?  Perhaps making it mathematically possible without changing the look
you want . . .


Date:    Friday, 20 October 1995 00:03:04 
Subject: Imagine Glows
From:    Tick@confusa.catt.ncsu.edu (Tyler Lund)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


      Someone recently posted info about the glow feature in the global
lens flare effect. It does look pretty good, as long as the light is not
obscured by any objects... Since the effect is completely post render, it
will draw the glow on top of objects even if the light is completely behind
an object.  Great for stills, but bad for animations or renderings where
you want to obscure the glow.  Also the glow only does a point source type
of glow, so you cannot make differt shapes glow either.  No neon signs
using this feature.  

      Someone was posting that glow effects were easy with the fog object
attribute.  I've never been able to make anything look good using this
method.  Can someone post some specific settings to try? 



--------------------------------------------------------,  
      ///  Tyler Lund                                  / Check out my web page f
or
     ///  Tick@confusa.catt.ncsu.edu                  / Keen Tick and Babylon 5 

 \\\///  http://www.catt.ncsu.edu/~tick/index.html   / Stuff!!  
  \\\/  Amiga 3000/25                               /
---------------------------------------------------'



Date:    Friday, 20 October 1995 01:04:55 
Subject: Re: Win-Imagine
From:    Falko@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

>Charles, did Mike happen to mention if it was going to be stictly
>a 16-bit app? If so, will a 32-bit app be available soon?

I have gotten a previous letter from MikeH stating that WinImagine is fully
Win32 compliant. It will run under Win31/311 only with Win32s installed.

I would also like to address the issue of "Windoze". I work with several
programs that are available in windows and dos versions. If it is a "WYSIWYG"
or other wise highly graphic application it is "MUCH" faster under windows
than dos.

Most users complaining of poor windows performance do not fully understand
how windows accesses system resources. All windows installations that I have
ever seen could be "tuned" for a minimum 15-20 percent increase in overall
performance. Some could see a 50-100 percent increase, and I have worked a
few that saw 3x to 5x increase in performance.

If any body has any specific questions, please E me privately. Don't want to
be accused of wasting bandwidth. I could fill a book about tuning windows.
I've had it since version 1.0. I've been "using" it since version 3.1. How's
that for a long time to wait for a usable product.

Falko@aol.com

Date:    Friday, 20 October 1995 01:11:47 
Subject: Re: Re[2]: Win-Imagine
From:    Falko@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

>stay with Imagine and hope that Impulse can keep up with all the screwups
>Microsoft and Intel make. Of course in an ideal world Imagine would move
over
>to the Mac and everyone would be happy:)

>Bob...................

I've used the Mac (and Amiga and, and, and). Count me out. If you like the
Mac - cool. But I do NOT like the Mac. I like the Amiga. I like OS/2 Warp
(but nothing will ever come of it - and don't talk to me about installation
and compatibility woes). But NOT the Mac.

Falko

Date:    Friday, 20 October 1995 01:29:04 
Subject: Re: WinImagine-The questions?
From:    Falko@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-16 18:47:28 EDT, you write:

>10)Is it going to be a single interface(like TrueSpace) or Multi(like
>imagine now)?

I think I like the multiple editors better than the single interface. But
with the ability to move from one to the other interactively. Like I'm in
stage and select a object, right-click menu and select detail editor, which
pops up with selected object, fine tune, exit detail, be returned to stage
editor with edited object in place.

>9)Will it run under correctly OS/2? (this would be more ideal than Win95,
>faster)

Who cares. I've tested OS/2 2.1 2.11 and 3.0/Warp against Win 3.1 3.11 95 on
the same hardware platform and have significant disagreement with you on
performance. Win311 and Win95 are the winners. This was done on a 486DX2/66,
16mb ram, 256kb cache, ATI mach32 VLB, 1.08gb 10ms HD, 4x IDE CD-ROM.

Oh, yeah. Almost forgot. OS/2 does not support Win32 applications.

>8)Will the textures be DLL's? (this would be cool, really easy to make!)
>7)Will the effects be DLL's? (see above)
>6)Will it use windoze standard interface? (like the buttons and windows, or
>will it be a cheap port like LW)
>5)Will it ship on CD?

150% agreement on the above!!

>4)How many textures are with it?

Ship it on CD, include tutorial/example files, lotsa procedural textures/fx
and plenty of seamless texture maps.

>3)Will it include 3rd party, add-on capability? (like LW, can I buy another
>modeler)

I'd like to see Photoshop compatible plug-in capability. Shareware utils like
PaintShopPro have it. Be neat to use Kai's various plug-ins to create/enhance
projects.

>2)Will it have glows? (hehehe, can really use them)
>1)Will the texture playground still be there? (if its not I'll sue)

Agreed!!

Date:    Friday, 20 October 1995 02:02:42 
Subject: Re: Screen Resolution for PC
From:    Falko@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-13 02:27:32 EDT, you write:

>The FAQ talks about the Amiga screen hack, is there one for the PC.
>
>Am I supposed to do something with the info reported by the video mode
>menu option.  I want to use 1024x768x24bit as the display mode for all
>editors, and the info reported was 8:8:8:8 at 24:16:8:0 in 4 bytes -
>specified.  What does this mean? 
>
>Kevin
>
>
If you have Imagine version 3.2 or later you can run in 256 color mode and at
640x480, 800x600, 1024x768, or 1280x1024. If your video card supports these
modes and VESA 1.2

Falko


Date:    Friday, 20 October 1995 02:50:39 
Subject: Re: Environment maps (again)
From:    greggh@dialup01.odyssey.apana.org.au (Gregory Helleren)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi Charles (Charles Blaquiere), in <Pine.BSI.3.91.951019002855.15520H-100000@pin
ch.io.org> on Oct 19 you wrote:

> I do, however, have to question why you're doing this:
>
> > From: Gregory Helleren <greggh@dialup05.odyssey.apana.org.au>
> >
> > After a bit of adjustment, this looked great. The portion of the
> > environment map shown in the mirror even had a slight depth blur
> > (due to it's low resolution) which added to the realism.
> >
> > Now the problem:
> > A ray trace of the scene revealed what I assume is a problem. The
> > mirror (whose color attributes are 0,0,0 and reflection attributes
> > are 255,255,255 etc) used to reflect some foreground objects.
>
> If you're ray tracing, there's little point in applying an environment
> brushmap to an individual object, rather than using a Globals
> environment map. Sometimes, artistic license will dictate that the
> reflections on one object be totally different than those on the other
> objects in the scene, but I assume you're not in such a convoluted
> situation.
>
> Please tell me: why do you want to apply an environment map to your mirror?
>
OK - there is this headless metallic dude sitting in front of a mirror.
There are several heads on a bench with eyeballs, hair, faces etc.
The backdrop is a long shot of sunset over a beach scence. The global
brush map is a city scene at night with lightning. The metallic dude's
right arm is outstretched, the hand hanging from the wrist and a laser
beam shoots into the mirror causing a ripple. The camera is located to
the left and back of the metallic dude's shoulder.

The metallic dude's back and sides reflect almost the full extent of the
globa brush map (night scene). The mirror reflects the front of the
metallic dude, the heads, the laser beam and the night scene.

So as to get the mirror to show a significant portion of the night scene
a thumbnail of the night scene was created - as per your suggestion
(thanks again). For obvious reasons I could not introduce a compensating
curvature into the mirror.

Since the environment map/reflection appears to be broken in 3.3 I was
forced to insert the thumbnail into an appropriate portion of the global
brush map. The only hassle here is that the metallic dude reflects this
as an annoying discontinuity in the larger city scene :(

It occurs to me (at this late hour) that I might have been better off
applying a colour map of the city scene to the mirror which would
hopefully preserve the reflection attribute. So why don't I do that.....
*yawn* maybe tomorrow :)

Love Peace and Monacles
Gregg

--
+-----------------------------------------///\/\/\_Amiga Technologies_/\/\+
  Gregg Helleren         AMIGA is REBORN /// Lecturer Information Technology
  Developer - LaseRage                  ///  SEMC TAFE Western Australia
  Ferndale W.A. Australia ____/\___/\\\///   greggh@odyssey.apana.org.au
  CBMNET:greggh@laserage.adsp.sub.org\XX/    greggh@laserage.DIALix.oz.au
+--------------------------------------------------------------------------+



Date:    Friday, 20 October 1995 02:57:06 
Subject: Re: Environment maps (again)
From:    greggh@dialup01.odyssey.apana.org.au (Gregory Helleren)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi Charles (Charles Blaquiere), in <Pine.BSI.3.91.951019001601.15520G-100000@pin
ch.io.org> on Oct 19 you wrote:

> > From: Gregory Helleren <greggh@dialup05.odyssey.apana.org.au>
> >
> > However, when the environment map was applied to the mirror, no
> > foreground objects were reflected - just the environment map.
>
> Interesting -- you seem to have stumbled onto a bug! Indeed, an
> individual object environment map should behave exactly as the Globals
>...
> Hey Mike, here's one for the bug list! (Unless they've been quietly
> working on it for 4.0)

*eek* a bug - odd that no1 else tripped over it!

Perhaps not evry1 wanted to do an "odd" scene like me?

Maybe I'll try doing an overhead mounted mirror this time! Hmmm always had
a fancy for one of those in the bedroom :)

Love Peace and fake black
Gregg



--
+-----------------------------------------///\/\/\_Amiga Technologies_/\/\+
  Gregg Helleren         AMIGA is REBORN /// Lecturer Information Technology
  Developer - LaseRage                  ///  SEMC TAFE Western Australia
  Ferndale W.A. Australia ____/\___/\\\///   greggh@odyssey.apana.org.au
  CBMNET:greggh@laserage.adsp.sub.org\XX/    greggh@laserage.DIALix.oz.au
+--------------------------------------------------------------------------+



Date:    Friday, 20 October 1995 08:00:53 
Subject: Re: constant Upgrade
From:    expgxs@cascade.santos.com.au (Greg Searle)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

  Greetings
 
  Charles Blaquiere replied to my post

>Nice to hear from you! I believe I haven't seen your messages on the 
>list before. Welcome.

   Thankyou.

  After my last post I resolved to give up to the end of the week (today) for
Impulse to send me an upgrade order form, or I will send them a constant upgrade

order form from one of my very few newsletters (3) that I have received, with an
 
accompaning letter for upgrading to 4.0. This I will do on Monday and thus have
9 days to reach Impulse via airmail. Living accross the International date line 

has it's advantages.

  Thankyou for the information that you have given me. In fact I have read more
information here on the features in Imagine 3.1-3.3 than was provided in the 
newsletters that I had recieved. If I had been on this list some months back I 
would have more likely joined the constant upgrade programme as I would have 
seen the benefits of doing so much more. I do have an A1200 with plenty of ram,
(12meg fast, 2meg chip) and a resonable accelerator, (40mz 030, 50 Mhz fpu Blizzard).
All purchased with Imagine in mind.

  Now for A question I wish to ask.

  I have Pixel Pro 3D (from a coverdisk) wich can convert DXF objects to Imagine
.
I have found an ftp site (avalon.chinalake.navy.mil) which has many objects in
3ds (3D studio format I presume) and some in DXF and others, Including Imagine.
Though most of the Imagine Objects seem to be those that can be found on Aminet 
and
are called TDDD objects.Oh, and almost everything is archived as .tar.Z or zip.

   Are there other sites that has a great number of DXF 3d objects that I can ac
cess?
I am particularly interested in organic objects of animals, especialy a horse. I
t
dosn't matter if the objects are in Lightwave or Real-3D either. I can convert
them to Imagine format.

   I would like to know if this list has a depositry of Imagine objects somewher
e 
other than Aminet. Even a PC site would be good if as I am lead to believe that 

Imagine object format is the same for both the Amiga and the PC.

   Much appreciated and thanks in advance.

   for those fellow Amigans who have the latest version of Pixel Pro that can 
convert 3D Studio to Imagine(I've been lead to believe), visit this site. 
There are I estimate 200-300+ 3ds objects, and many are usefull I'm sure.
Including a sofa.

   All the best.

   GREG SEARLE

So many worlds. So much to do. So little done. Such things to be.

Date:    Friday, 20 October 1995 09:17:53 
Subject: Re: Imagine Glows
From:    sauvp@citi.doc.ca (Patrick Sauvageau)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Tick@confusa.catt.ncsu.edu (Tyler Lund):
>      Someone recently posted info about the glow feature in the global
>lens flare effect. It does look pretty good, as long as the light is not
>obscured by any objects... Since the effect is completely post render, it
>will draw the glow on top of objects even if the light is completely behind
>an object.  Great for stills, but bad for animations or renderings where
>you want to obscure the glow.  Also the glow only does a point source type
>of glow, so you cannot make differt shapes glow either.  No neon signs
>using this feature.  

What version of Imagine do you use ? I think this bug have been corrected in
3.1 or 3.2. 

>      Someone was posting that glow effects were easy with the fog object
>attribute.  I've never been able to make anything look good using this
>method.  Can someone post some specific settings to try? 

Use the "Ghost" texture on your fog object, with default setting, or use a
normal, bright object whith the "fakely" texture to increase the
transparency on the edges. Work best with spheroide object.






-----
Patrick Sauvageau
(sauvp@citi.doc.ca)


Date:    Friday, 20 October 1995 09:20:55 
Subject: Speedtest (was Imagine BeBox port)
From:    cjo@esrange.ssc.se


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Robert King wrote;

>I wonder what the comparison of an 060 A4000 to 133 mhz Pentium in=20
>rendering speed would show?

OK.
This seems to be a topic that keeps on creeping back onto the IML every=20
once in a while. First time _I_ heard this question was sometime early this=
=20
year.

By that time Douglas Smith (who is now sadly enough intending to leave the=20
IML) and I decided to make a reference scene that could be spread around=20
and testrendered on various machines and then the result could be published=
=20
here on the IML.
We actually _did_ create such a scene, and an instruction on how it should=20
be used (all preferences have to be the same on all testmachines for=20
instance) but we never got around to distributing it.

*********************************************************************
My question to the IML is if I should distribute this test scene now.
*********************************************************************

I know that we had such a scene spread via the IML not too long ago (called=
=20
SPEEDCO.LHA) and that thread got a few responses but not that very many.
Perhaps because that project was not really that well planned (not=20
intending to scold the guy who set up that scene though...) and didn't even=
=20
use the same resolutions in the PC version and the Amiga version. bummer...

So, once again, what is YOUR opinion?
Do we need such a test?
Should I go ahead and distribute this speedtest project?

And yes, this project _is_ well planned. Doug and I sent it back and forth=20
to each other for a month before we dicided it was done.

I want YOUR vote!!!

Send an email to <cjo@kyla.kiruna.se> with the subject line reading
"IML speed vote: YES" or "IML speed vote: NO".

Please! Do not Reply to the address that this post came from, but send your=
=20
vote to the address 4 lines up.

I want YOUR vote Friday 27th October at the latest.
If I don't get enough votes I'll interpret that as a NO.

Remember, you have one week starting... ... NOW!  (tick... tick... tick...=20=
;)

*---------------------------------------------------------------*
|   Conny Joensson   |   Swedish Space Corp. Esrange            |
|   Kiruna           |   Satellite operations - Telecom Div.    |
|   Sweden           |   cjo@smtpgw.esrange.ssc.se              |
*---------------------------------------------------------------*

Date:    Friday, 20 October 1995 10:12:43 
Subject: Idea ...
From:    sherman@netcad.ENET.dec.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

FROM too long. Original FROM is 'Steve NACAD::Sherman LKG2-A/R5 pole AA2 DTN 226
-6992  20-Oct-1995 0957 <sherman@netcad.ENET.dec.com>'

----------------------  Original Message Follows  ----------------------

I have a coupla ideas about things I'd like to see in later versions of
Imagine:

1. A secondary grid.  This would be a grid that would appear in a different
color than the main grid.  It would be programmed differently from the regular
grid.  If I use the main grid to mark off 0.25", then the secondary grid might
be set to 1.00", for example.

2. Rulers.  I'd like to be able to mark a point and have Imagine automatically
calculate distances to other points.

3. Spreadsheets.  I'd like to be able to enter and tweek points from a spreadshe
et.
This might be a faster way to enter, for example, cube coordinates if I've alrea
dy
calculated what I want in advance.

4. Cut, copy and paste for points, lines and edges.  This is minor.  What I do n
ow
if I'm adding stuff to an object is select the respective points, split the object,
copy and paste the points, join and merge.  It would sure be handy to just copy,

for example, a collection of faces and just paste them wherever I want in the 
Detail Editor.


BTW, I absolutely love, *love*, LOVE the new view mode in perspective.  I love b
eing
able to zoom into and edit *any* points I want in a complex model.  It is SO muc
h
easier than having to hide points in other views.  And, it's SO much easier to s
elect
points in general.  I use it all the time now.


Steve

Date:    Friday, 20 October 1995 10:15:35 
Subject: Oh, and I forgot ...
From:    sherman@netcad.ENET.dec.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

FROM too long. Original FROM is 'Steve NACAD::Sherman LKG2-A/R5 pole AA2 DTN 226
-6992  20-Oct-1995 1011 <sherman@netcad.ENET.dec.com>'

----------------------  Original Message Follows  ----------------------

I'd like to be able to turn coordinates on by default.  I couldn't find 
anything in the preferences that would do this.  I could be missing something
here, so if any of y'all know how to do this I'd appreciate a tip.  Also,
I'd like to be able to specify drag box for point selection by default.
Again, I didn't find anything in preferences that would let me do this.
Thanks!

Steve

Date:    Friday, 20 October 1995 10:31:43 
Subject: Candle flame as light source
From:    bryant@tpworm.ENET.dec.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

FROM too long. Original FROM is 'Dick Bryant - 237-6502 20-Oct-1995 1025 <bryant
@tpworm.ENET.dec.com>'

----------------------  Original Message Follows  ----------------------

    Could someone give me some suggestions on how to model a candle flame
    and use it as a light source ?

    For instance, we have a candle sitting on a table in a room. The candle
    is burning and the flame is the only source of illumination in the room.
    The light wants to flicker with the flame and cast shadows on the
    other objects in the room that it illuminates.

    I'm using 3.3 on a PC.

    Dick


Date:    Friday, 20 October 1995 10:57:43 
Subject: Re: Imagine Glows
From:    dgrant@dgrant.peinet.pe.ca (Dennis Grant)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

Hello gmartin (gmartin), in <9509208141.AA814188130@fourseas.mv.us.adobe.com> on
 Oct 20 you wrote:

> You must be using an old version of Imagine. NewLensflare global effect takes 

> into account objects obscuring the light sources, it makes some very impressiv
e 
> effects - I have a great scene panning through a misty rain forest, where beam
s 
> of light break through the tree canopy and flare.


I'd like to see that...

Any chance of uploading the project to Aminet?

- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
-
Dennis Grant               Cycor User Support - HTML Developer - Graphic artist
dgrant@cycor.ca     Amiga 4000/'030/6/120/'882 40/2XCDROM/USR14.4/Idek 17"/SLIP

                Visit Trog's Cave! http://www.cycor.ca/TCave/

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: 2.6.2

iQCVAwUBMIfVBLBqnxXa4HpNAQHj+QP+Of+RvBbYyq3IhnLhmanywJEQLE0xlxNy
X3l8E2ogCIMPw437ocQQ2z2R5brELElxZmCyl+THb1qBlofqHGhDh7vVm66tBa+Z
y6Nd7FZa0UJal8Tcl/XAzvl6yEAH3GaewSeXT08LO/Hru8x2PYqnGz1l48JC58dy
BHgyEQfK7hM=
=/V2I
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----


Date:    Friday, 20 October 1995 11:29:51 
Subject: Re: Test message and bounces
From:    Bob Arnold <barnold@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


Yeah, what a waste of bandwidth, all these bogus replies from Lotus mail 
and Compuserve.  Can't someone kick their collective corporate butt and 
fix it?    -Bob of the North  (Nome, at the moment)



On Thu, 19 Oct 1995 RobSampson@aol.com wrote:

> In a message dated 95-10-19 10:54:15 EDT, you write:
> 
> >Is anyone else getting a message from Compuserve when they post to the 
> >IML stating that their message has bounced and cant be posted to the IML?
> 
> I get that everytime I post to the IML.  Someone posted about this some time
> ago and I was not affected, and then in the last few weeks it's been every
> message.  Anyone know whats going on?
> 
> Bob..............
> 
> 
> 

Date:    Friday, 20 October 1995 11:39:08 
Subject: Bug patches
From:    bryant@tpworm.ENET.dec.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

FROM too long. Original FROM is 'Dick Bryant - 237-6502 20-Oct-1995 1137 <bryant
@tpworm.ENET.dec.com>'

----------------------  Original Message Follows  ----------------------


Stephen Gifford writes:

>It would seem to me that Impulse would benefit greatly by putting up a Web
>Page at this point.  They could post bug patches, put a weekly imagine news
>update, and create an Art Gallery of Imagine work.  And a suggestion box.  I

People keep banging on Impulse about "bug patches". You just don't "bug patch"
applications the size of Imagine, you build a new execuitable. Since it's
not copy protected, you can't post it or thier piracy problems would get
even worse.

All, things being equal, the $100 constant upgrade  program is the best deal.
The only way they could post updates would be to use some kind of copy
protection (a dongle, etc) and I don't think thats very desirable.

The people who make their money selling hardware can afford to post free
upgrades to their software. The people who sell only software can't.

Dick


Date:    Friday, 20 October 1995 11:45:14 
Subject: 4.0 and video
From:    "Dan.Maclean" <MACLEDJ@pmitao.usa.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

 
From Dan MacLean:
 
I read the post about 4.0's features and am very excited about getting it in
the mail.  I was a bit disappointed when I read that the only PC animation
formats supported for backdrops in the stage editor (a GREAT addition!)  are
FLC and FLI.  Both are 256 color formats.  But thin I realized that Imagine
runs in 256 colors anyway and all that was needed was to have DTA (Dave's
Targa Animator) convert my FLH to an FLC.  Unfortunately, then I would have to
convert the FLH to separate Tiff files and use them as Backdrop images.
 
I have a question:Is there a way to have an Imagine object appear from "behind
" an object on a backdrop without doing it in post production?  An Ideal
situation would be an invisible object that you could place within the scene
that would always show the backdrop, even if something were behind it.
Thanks!


Date:    Friday, 20 October 1995 11:54:59 
Subject: Re: 4.0 Docs and other things
From:    "Dan.Maclean" <MACLEDJ@pmitao.usa.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

 
From Dan MacLean:
 
I haven't tried the ghost texture, but fog disappointed me.  Fog doesn't
behave like a true glow.  The brightness drops off toward the outer edges of a
glow, and a glow never appears darker than what is behind it.  i.e. a
lightsaber would not glow red in front of a bright white background, since the
red would be a lesser brightness value.  Fog does exactly this.  In addition,
a glow will appear in front of objects that obscure part of the glowing
object.  Fog does not behave this way either.
 
I've read suggestions about using the glow button on the lensflare effect.
I'll have to try this.  The new global lensflare works correctly, as far as I
know, in that it only disappears when the lightsource is totally obscured
(spelling?).  Unfortunately, this only allows for round lights and not neon
signs.Maybe you can combine many lightsources to get the effect?  Thanks for
your help!


Date:    Friday, 20 October 1995 12:03:39 
Subject: Re: Imagine Glows
From:    gmartin@mv.us.adobe.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

You must be using an old version of Imagine. NewLensflare global effect takes 
into account objects obscuring the light sources, it makes some very impressive 

effects - I have a great scene panning through a misty rain forest, where beams 

of light break through the tree canopy and flare.
_______________________________________________________________________________
:Subject: Imagine Glows
:From:    Tick@confusa.catt.ncsu.edu (Tyler Lund) at cc_smtp2
:Date:    20/10/95  12:03 am


      Someone recently posted info about the glow feature in the global
lens flare effect. It does look pretty good, as long as the light is not
obscured by any objects... Since the effect is completely post render, it
will draw the glow on top of objects even if the light is completely behind
an object.  Great for stills, but bad for animations or renderings where
you want to obscure the glow.  Also the glow only does a point source type
of glow, so you cannot make differt shapes glow either.  No neon signs
using this feature.  

      Someone was posting that glow effects were easy with the fog object
attribute.  I've never been able to make anything look good using this
method.  Can someone post some specific settings to try? 



--------------------------------------------------------,  
      ///  Tyler Lund                                  / Check out my web page
for
     ///  Tick@confusa.catt.ncsu.edu                  / Keen Tick and Babylon 5 

 \\\///  http://www.catt.ncsu.edu/~tick/index.html   / Stuff!!  
  \\\/  Amiga 3000/25                               /
---------------------------------------------------'




Date:    Friday, 20 October 1995 12:11:34 
Subject: Re: Imagine ported to BeBox?
From:    Udo K Schuermann <walrus@wam.umd.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Bill Boyce <bilboyce@iconz.co.nz> wrote:
> At 10:29 AM 18/10/95 -0400, you wrote:
>>Scott Corley <SPICE@DRYCAS.CLUB.CC.CMU.EDU> wrote:
>>> Would anyone else like to see Imagine ported to the BeBox? Since it looks
>>> like Amiga Technologies doesnt came about anyone but game players, so the
>>> future of new, high end Amigas looks very doubtful. I really dont want to
>>> have to buy a clone and the BeBox looks like the spiritual heir of the
>>> Amiga.
>>
>>YES! I'd love to see Imagine on the BeBox!!  Just 'imagine' splitting up
>>the rendering task into N (user-definable) threads, each of which is
>>automagically given its own CPU by the operating system.  With later
>>versions of the BeBox you could expect to render an image up to 8 times
>>faster than with a single CPU computer... And the PPC603 isn't exactly
>>slow, to begin with.  Whoa, I gotta sit down. :)
> 
> And the difference between a BeBox and a multi Pentium Windows NT box would
> be .... ?

a) The BeOS isn't written by Microsoft.  This _is_ A Good Thing(tm)!
b) The PPC is a RISC CPU that beats the Pentium esp. in floating point
   and later PPCs will nail Pentiums to the wall.  Heck, the higher end
   PPCs already do that.
c) The BeOS is said to be a breeze to program.  I've heard nothing but
   horrible things about the Windows API (although I confess, I know not
   if the WinNT API rectifies this -- I would guess it makes things only
   worse.)
d) The BeOS uses less than 4MB to run in; the remainder of RAM is available
   for your applications.  WinNT needs at three to four times the memory to
   "start."

Well, this is getting a bit far off track with respect to Imagine, so I'll
summarize the BeBox (with respect to us on the Imagine Mailing List) thus:

1) The BeBox is much faster than a Pentium
   (except for Pentiums hurled out of a Window from the 101st floor)
2) The BeBox has a very good price/performance ratio
   (this should definitely appeal to all us Imagine fans, PC & Amiga alike)

I suspect that Impulse's effort to port Imagine to the PC and now to
Windows has probably taught them a few things about how to isolate machine
dependencies in their code.  I'm sure that if they ported Imagine to the
BeBox quickly, they could have one killer product on the new platform.

Impulse!  When you port Imagine, see if you can't make the rendering engine
multi-threaded.  The BeOS would then automatically distribute the threads
among multiple CPUs.  The gain in rendering speed would be dramatic (the
BeBox would probably render images similar to a 300+MHz Pentium...)

Cheers!

 |._.|_   Udo Schuermann             "The future's not what it used to be!"
 |(:)| )  walrus@wam.umd.edu                  -- Narn Ambassador G'Kar
 |_:_|/   http://www.wam.umd.edu/~walrus/        Babylon 5, "The Long Dark"

Date:    Friday, 20 October 1995 12:39:49 
Subject: NT Magic
From:    aciolino@rrddts.donnelley.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


     NT will allow you to run under any of the platforms, and yes - there 
     is some *serious* penalty for running SGI NT programs on the Intel NT 
     system. But it works.
     
     In theory, Windows apps will run on any of the platforms because of 
     this cross-compatibility, but, once again at a CPU price.
     
     There are some things that won't run, but mostly these are device 
     drivers and VXD emulation software. 
     
     -AC
     

Date:    Friday, 20 October 1995 12:44:11 
Subject: Fixed
From:    Granberg Tom <tom.granberg@TV2.no>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi, 
Just want you to know that the problem with my mail server is now fixed, so if 
anyone are unsure if I have recieved mail that where ment for me, please mail me
 
again. My mail went down 18.10.95 and came back today.

Ps.I have recieved a lot mails regarding modelling tips, and I'am looking into 
it. So be patient, I will probably write something tonight........

Later....

Tom

Date:    Friday, 20 October 1995 12:53:51 
Subject: Re: Imagine Glows
From:    Tick@confusa.catt.ncsu.edu (Tyler Lund)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi Patrick, on Oct 20 you wrote:>=20> What version of Imagine do you use ? I thi
nk this bug have been corre=cted in> 3.1 or 3.2.=20>=20=20     I think this is m
y problem.  I'm using version 3.0.----------------------------------------------
----------, =20=20     ///  Tyler Lund                                  / Check 
out my==20web page=20    ///  Tick@confusa.catt.ncsu.edu                  / for 
keen Tick==20and=20=20\\\///  http://www.catt.ncsu.edu/~tick/index.html   / Baby
lon 5 Stuf=f!! =20=20 \\\/  Amiga 3000/25                               /-------
--------------------------------------------'

Date:    Friday, 20 October 1995 13:36:18 
Subject: Re[2]: Win-Imagine
From:    spack@mv.us.adobe.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

>I have gotten a previous letter from MikeH stating that WinImagine is fully
>Win32 compliant. It will run under Win31/311 only with Win32s installed.

As a warning to potential Win3.1/3.11 AND Win32s users - DON'T!  Win32s is a 
rats nest of trouble, and will result in a noticeable degradation of 
performance.  Crack open your wallet and get Win95.

-Scott
spack@adobe.com


Date:    Friday, 20 October 1995 14:15:49 
Subject: 4.0 and video
From:    "Dan.Maclean" <MACLEDJ@pmitao.usa.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

From Dan MacLean:
 
I read the post about 4.0's features and am very excited about getting it in
the mail.  I was a bit disappointed when I read that the only PC animation
formats supported for backdrops in the stage editor (a GREAT addition!)  are
FLC and FLI.  Both are 256 color formats.  But thin I realized that Imagine
runs in 256 colors anyway and all that was needed was to have DTA (Dave's
Targa Animator) convert my FLH to an FLC.  Unfortunately, then I would have to
convert the FLH to separate Tiff files and use them as Backdrop images.
 
I have a question:Is there a way to have an Imagine object appear from "behind
" an object on a backdrop without doing it in post production?  An Ideal
situation would be an invisible object that you could place within the scene
that would always show the backdrop, even if something were behind it.
Thanks!
-------------( end of letter
)--------------------------------------------------


Date:    Friday, 20 October 1995 15:02:28 
Subject: WinImagine on OS/2.
From:    Richard Gregor Mast <roxter@UDel.Edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

   This is not intended to say that one OS is better than another.  Simply
to set a few facts straight.  OS/2 running windows WILL run win32s
programs up until version 1.15.  After 1.15 Microsoft allowed programmers
to use VxD's which OS/2 doesn't support (But neither does Windows NT).  I
would assume that WinImagine doesn't use any VxD's because it is claimed
to run on NT and use Microsofts "standards".  Microsoft strongly urges
programmers not to use VxD's when writting software to run on all versions
of windows.  If that is the case it should run on OS/2.  TrueSpace2 which
was written using Win32s runs fine under OS/2.  TrueSpace2 also uses an
add-in called 3DR, which is copyrighted Intel Inc.  I don't know exactly
what it does but OS/2 supports it. 
   There is also another stumbling block for OS/2.  The is another API
called WinG.  This is used by some new games created for windows.  OS/2
does not support this that I have heard.  If WinImagine uses WinG that
could be the reason that Impulse is saying that WinImagine won't run under
OS/2.  I am trying to find a program that uses WinG and not VxD's but I
haven't been able to so far.  

Rick
   


Date:    Friday, 20 October 1995 15:14:29 
Subject: Re: Win-Imagine
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-20 01:56:35 EDT, you write:

>I agree, I've been doing it for years. <g> I read a question on the IML, 
>flip over to Imagine to test my answer. Seems to get results.

Ah you must be an Amiga user.  I really miss my Amigas sometimes.  Was really
nice not to loose the use of the computer just because Imagine was running.
 I wish they had remained and moved on to the PPC, I would never have bought
this Intel box.  But that is wishfull thinking and Pentium and Microsoft are
what is in right now.  

I have a question on something I have no idea about.  If I had an Alpha or
SGI running windozeNT would it be able to run a NT version of a program that
also ran on a Pentium? Does NT handle everything or would an NT version of
Imagine need to be written for risc processors?  I have seen adverstisements
that while not specific or addressing this in particular lead me to believe
that you could just take a windoze program over to one of these machines and
run it under NT.  If that is true then it would have to be under some
emulation right?  And that would slow things down?  Can someone provide the
real deal information on this for me?  I guess these questions are pretty
stupid for someone who has experience with this but my closest look at an
Alpha or NT was a preview of Pro Engineer they brought in to demo to the
engineering department where I work and our questions directed primarily
towards how PE would enhance our design process and not about the platform
itself.



Date:    Friday, 20 October 1995 15:14:31 
Subject: Re: The glow issue . . .
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-20 02:41:16 EDT, you write:

>For those interested in creating glows in Imagine, visit Stephen Blacmon's
>page at:  http://www.websharx.com:80/~kinda/mainmenu.html
>
>He has a tutorial specifically for this.  In short you create an sphere or
>an enclosed object the size of the glow you want.  Add the Ghost.itx and
>make it a fog object.  Make it a light source if you want the glow to light
>up a wall or something like neon against a wall and that's it.  The color of
>your glow will be the color of your fog object.
>
>The density of your fog is the key to making a realistic looking glow for
>lights and candles etc.  

Stephen perhaps if you attached your spark object for the list it could help
allot of people.  The effect you created with that in sculpt (which I believe
was also on the brochure) was really nice.  It's probably just me, but I
learn more in examining others objects or techiques with textures in Imagine
than reading about it in the mail.  Your spark object could probably provide
allot of insight to others.

Bob........



Date:    Friday, 20 October 1995 16:18:10 
Subject: Re: Imagine Glows
From:    Sharky <sharky@websharx.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Fri, 20 Oct 1995, Tyler Lund wrote:

> 
>       Someone recently posted info about the glow feature in the global
> lens flare effect. It does look pretty good, as long as the light is not
> obscured by any objects... Since the effect is completely post render, it
> will draw the glow on top of objects even if the light is completely behind
> an object.  Great for stills, but bad for animations or renderings where
> you want to obscure the glow.  Also the glow only does a point source type
> of glow, so you cannot make differt shapes glow either.  No neon signs
> using this feature.  
> 
>       Someone was posting that glow effects were easy with the fog object
> attribute.  I've never been able to make anything look good using this
> method.  Can someone post some specific settings to try? 

Aloha!

Rather than waste bandwidth, why not check out Steve Blackmon's excellent 
tutorials at http://www.websharx.com/~kinda  He's got a few tutorials up 
and after some serious hardware problems (and major storms in Florida) 
may be posting up more new tutorials soon!

Have a great weekend!
      Sharky

Date:    Friday, 20 October 1995 17:04:36 
Subject: Win-Imagine and NT
From:    sauvp@citi.doc.ca (Patrick Sauvageau)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

RobSampson@aol.com:

>I have a question on something I have no idea about.  If I had an Alpha or
>SGI running windozeNT would it be able to run a NT version of a program that
>also ran on a Pentium? 

A program is compiled for a specific processor; a Windows NT/Intel version of 
Imagine will not run on a Alpha machine unless Impulse make a special version.

The task of porting a prog from one NT platform to another is supposed to be 
trivial. Even Lightwave, with it's non-standard interface have been compiled 
for the Alpha, showing about 5-6 time the performance of the pentium on 
raytracing and 2 to 3 time the speed for non-raytracing rendering. 
(~300Mhz Alpha vs 120Mhz 586)

-----
Patrick Sauvageau
(sauvp@citi.doc.ca)


Date:    Friday, 20 October 1995 18:12:26 
Subject: Re: View point when modeling 3d object
From:    rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au (Robert Byrne)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hello Peter, on Oct 17 you wrote:

> When I render an object, how do I set the viewpoint??  I have created
> people (bi-ped) objects and want to quick render them, BUT I want to view
> point to be from their eyes vantage point.  This is because I want 
> pre-render views at various angle (e.g. looking down at ones self, 
> seeing arms extended, etc) as if seeing oneself and I want to look at it
> via quick-render.

The only way I can see to do this with a quickrender from the Detail Editor
is to first pick all the points in the objects head and delete them, then
rotate the perspective view to look from above. Of course the camera will
still be some distance from the object, not at eye level and if you zoom in
too close you will put the arms etc, out of frame.

The next best solution is to create a temporary Project and load it into
the Stage Ed and set your camera just in front of the nose.

-- Bob

  :  Robert Byrne  : rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au :
  : Amiga A3000/25 :  Ballina, NSW  Australia  :


Date:    Friday, 20 October 1995 18:37:06 
Subject: Re[2]: Imagine Glows
From:    gmartin@mv.us.adobe.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> Hello gmartin (gmartin), in <9509208141.AA814188130@fourseas.mv.us.adobe.com> 

on
> Oct 20 you wrote:

> > You must be using an old version of Imagine. NewLensflare global effect 
takes 
> > into account objects obscuring the light sources, it makes some very
impressive 
> > effects - I have a great scene panning through a misty rain forest, where
beams 
> > of light break through the tree canopy and flare.


> I'd like to see that...

> Any chance of uploading the project to Aminet?

Well, give me another 6 months or so. I've been working on this animation off 
and on for about 12 months now since the initial story board came about (that's 

when I'm not doing normal 'pay the bills' day work).

It follows the lives of several forest creatures and the 'survival' problems in 

the forests over abundant eco system. It's rendered in a realistic style (but 
with fictitious characters) rather than cartoon style and contains red teethed 
predator/prey sequences along with a lot of character animation.

If you folk are interested I can post some small jpg's of characters/scenes/
action already completed, I know the thread "text only posts" crops up from time
 
to time on this lively list - so perhaps mail me direct for the jpg's.

If you are one of the folk that I sent an example of how to make a furry/hairy 
object in Imagine, can you let me know if the posting was successful - Mail 
gateways are such a pain for breaking enclosures you know...


Date:    Friday, 20 October 1995 19:42:33 
Subject: Removing Textures
From:    web@cvsd.cv.com (William Bogan)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

TWMKTA:
[To whomever may know the answer]

Working in 2.0 Imagine. I have copied some of the .lha files from
aminet to look at style and construction, hopefully I'll learn
how to do some cool things.

One problem I've encountered is the textures on some objects.
Since I'm way behind in s/w releases I need to be able to remove
the textures (that I do not have) and would like to do so by
selecting all and doing it once. It doesn't seem to be possible.
What, if anything, am I doing wrong?

Much appreciated.
-Bill Bogan

Date:    Friday, 20 October 1995 20:01:00 
Subject: Win Imagine and .dll Files
From:    tongorad@lava.net (Brian T. McGraw)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hello All,
Some people have posted that Win Imagine will implement textures and
special effects as .dll files. They have indicated that this is a Good Thing.
I know a little bit about what a .dll is, but I don't know enough about them
to know why textures as .dll's is a Good Thing.  Can someone please
explain it to me?

Thanks,
Brian
 



Date:    Friday, 20 October 1995 20:18:50 
Subject: Re: Imagine Glows
From:    Roger Straub <straub@csn.net>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Fri, 20 Oct 1995, Tyler Lund wrote:

> you want to obscure the glow.  Also the glow only does a point source type
> of glow, so you cannot make differt shapes glow either.  No neon signs
> using this feature.  

Has anyone tried using the Haze FX? You can key it to a certain color, so 
when an object of that color passes behind something that isn't that 
color, the haze will overlap onto that object a little bit, like in real 
life. The only drawback is that the haze is measured in pixel-widths, so 
you have to reset it when you change resolutions. The other drawback 
(okay, so there are two) is that you can't have any other object of that 
color in the image. Other than that, you can play with it to your heart's 
content.

> 
> --------------------------------------------------------,  
>       ///  Tyler Lund                                  / Check out my web page
 for
>      ///  Tick@confusa.catt.ncsu.edu                  / Keen Tick and Babylon 
5 
>  \\\///  http://www.catt.ncsu.edu/~tick/index.html   / Stuff!!  
>   \\\/  Amiga 3000/25                               /
> ---------------------------------------------------'
> 
> 
> 

See ya,
      Roger

Date:    Friday, 20 October 1995 20:36:50 
Subject: Reflected fire
From:    George Allanson <ae418@ccn.cs.dal.ca>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi All

I am having some trouble creating good fires in a set that has several 
reflecting objects. Cool fire and fire ball can be applied to 3d objects 
but what I would like to use is fire, and that only works on plains. I 
have tried using cool fire and fire ball on fog objects with ghost but 
have not found the look I need, yet.

This might be a wish for win imagine a fire texture that can be applied 
to 3d objects with a function like ghost where the object fades when 
the surface angels away from the camera.

Thanks to all for a lively list it is some times hard to keep up with iml 
but it is worth the effort.

     George A.
     Halifax N.S. CDN

Date:    Friday, 20 October 1995 21:15:38 
Subject: Amiga constant 2 PC 4.0
From:    Gerard Menendez <gpm@netcom.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


Called Impulse today and was able to kick an extra $100 on top of my 
constant upgrade program to cover the Amiga to PC fee.  The man on the 
phone was helpful and polite.

I'll be delighted if the Amiga remains vigorous and I regret my decision 
to move over, but I don't expect it will.

Gerard

Date:    Friday, 20 October 1995 21:34:29 
Subject: Re: Bug patches
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-20 13:56:57 EDT, you write:

>People keep banging on Impulse about "bug patches". You just don't "bug
>patch"
>applications the size of Imagine, you build a new execuitable. Since it's
>not copy protected, you can't post it or thier piracy problems would get
>even worse.

Autodesk uses patches to fix bugs all the time and the AcadR13 executable is
5.6 meg in size.  Also the executable without .cfg files, textures,
attributes, effects ect would not be that usefull and so I am not sure piracy
would be a problem.  Add to that the fact that Imagine is just about
impossible to learn without the manual and again piracy does not seem to be a
big problem.  


Date:    Friday, 20 October 1995 23:39:50 
Subject: Bug-Patches
From:    NEWKIRK@delphi.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Plenty of developer support programs exist which calculate differences
between versions of executables, then create a diff, or patch, file, and
provide an end-user program to apply the patch, thereby updating an older
version to a newer one, without having to redistribute the entire executable.
Joel

Date:    Friday, 20 October 1995 23:44:38 
Subject: Re: Making a Sofa
From:    rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au (Robert Byrne)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hello S.A.Jalim, on Oct 18 you wrote:

> I`m currently building my front room and would like to hear any suggestions
> as to how to make reslistic "soft" and slightly rounded at the edges cushions
> to go on a sofa.
> 
> I am trying to use the spline editor ......

Apart from the Forms Ed I mentioned in an earlier post, you can mold a
flattened cube with the Deform Tool to get a rounded cushion.

-- Bob

  :  Robert Byrne  : rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au :
  : Amiga A3000/25 :  Ballina, NSW  Australia  :


Date:    Saturday, 21 October 1995 02:16:56 
Subject: Re: Removing Textures
From:    rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au (Robert Byrne)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hello William, on Oct 20 you wrote:

> Working in 2.0 Imagine. I have copied some of the .lha files from
> aminet to look at style and construction, hopefully I'll learn
> how to do some cool things.
> 
> One problem I've encountered is the textures on some objects.
> Since I'm way behind in s/w releases I need to be able to remove
> the textures (that I do not have) and would like to do so by
> selecting all and doing it once. It doesn't seem to be possible.
> What, if anything, am I doing wrong?

Nothing, you have to go through each object one at a time, select
Attributes and delete the textures one at a time. :-(

Imagine V3+ has a Strip Object function in the States menu which will do
what you ask. You can pick ALL objects and select Strip Obj. -> Textures.

-- Bob

  :  Robert Byrne  : rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au :
  : Amiga A3000/25 :  Ballina, NSW  Australia  :


Date:    Saturday, 21 October 1995 05:18:31 
Subject: Re: WinImagine on OS/2.
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-20 20:26:40 EDT, you write:

>of windows.  If that is the case it should run on OS/2.  TrueSpace2 which
>was written using Win32s runs fine under OS/2.  TrueSpace2 also uses an
>add-in called 3DR, which is copyrighted Intel Inc.  I don't know exactly
>what it does but OS/2 supports it. 
>   There is also another stumbling block for OS/2.  The is another API
>called WinG.  This is used by some new games created for windows.  OS/2
>does not support this that I have heard.  If WinImagine uses WinG that
>could be the reason that Impulse is saying that WinImagine won't run under
>OS/2.  I am trying to find a program that uses WinG and not VxD's but I
>haven't been able to so far.  

Out of curiosity do you know if Vistapro runs under OS/2?  As for WinG, I
know AcadR13c3 utilizes it but I am not sure about VxD's since I'm not sure
what they are.


Date:    Saturday, 21 October 1995 07:14:58 
Subject: Re: WinImagine on OS/2.
From:    Perry Lucas <plucas@vt.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 03:02 PM 10/20/95 -0400, Richard Gregor Mast wrote:
>   This is not intended to say that one OS is better than another.  Simply
>to set a few facts straight.  OS/2 running windows WILL run win32s
>programs up until version 1.15.  After 1.15 Microsoft allowed programmers
>to use VxD's which OS/2 doesn't support (But neither does Windows NT).  I
>would assume that WinImagine doesn't use any VxD's because it is claimed
>to run on NT and use Microsofts "standards".  Microsoft strongly urges
>programmers not to use VxD's when writting software to run on all versions
>of windows.  If that is the case it should run on OS/2.  TrueSpace2 which
>was written using Win32s runs fine under OS/2.  TrueSpace2 also uses an
>add-in called 3DR, which is copyrighted Intel Inc.  I don't know exactly
>what it does but OS/2 supports it. 

3DR is a realtime rendering engine.  Lots of memory and cpu speed are needed
if you do not have a graphics card that totally supports it.  Within Truespace2
if you move your object around under 3DR, you'll see how the lights hit the
object differently and such.  Its nice, but too slow even on a my p133 w/32
megs ram and a Diamond Stealth 64 w/2 megs of vram.  Hopefully when some of
the new realtime rendering chips come out, things will be faster...

--Perry


Date:    Saturday, 21 October 1995 11:01:16 
Subject: Re: Bug patches
From:    Joop.vandeWege@MEDEW.ENTO.WAU.NL (joop van de wege)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

>People keep banging on Impulse about "bug patches". You just don't "bug 
>patch" applications the size of Imagine, you build a new execuitable. Since 
>it's not copy protected, you can't post it or thier piracy problems would get
>even worse.

For the Amiga you could use 'spatch'. Impulse builds a new version without 
bugs then they run a diff utility (lpatch?) against it and the resulting file 
could be downloaded by people and with spatch you can merge the differences 
into your own executable. Works like a charm for Pagestream3, not exactly a 
small program.
There is one BUT and knowing Impulse this scheme probably doesn't work. They 
do (did) ship all kinds of different versions. V3.0, or pre V3, wasn't 
exactly the same for everyone.

Joop

Date:    Saturday, 21 October 1995 11:08:07 
Subject: Animation getting mangled
From:    pleatman@one.net


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


Hi,

I was working on my first animation yesterday. Something quite simple.
I was just moving an object up out of a plane.  There are 3 lights, 2
other objetcs in the back, the plane, and the object(s) moving through 
the plane.

There are 60 frames. The object tweens from 2 to 60.

I looked at many of the frames in the stage editor, everything was
visible, and moving as I expected. 

This morning, after letting it run last night, something happened
after the 21st frame.  First, one of the objects in the back dis-appeared
then the other.  Then, the area of the display started to narrow, finally
to about a 1/5 of the screen size.  The screen size was 320x200.

Then, on the last frame, everything was back to normal.

Has anyone ever seen this happen. Did it run out of memory, and just kept
going?  I looked today at the frames again in the stage editor, and 
everyhings looks good.  I'm confused :(

thanks for any help.

bob

Date:    Saturday, 21 October 1995 11:11:04 
Subject: Re: Particles+Texture problem
From:    H.Kueck@AIGM.westfalen.de (Hendrik Kueck)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> At 11:41 AM 18/10/95 CET, you wrote:
> >Hi,
> >
> >What I am trying to do is something breaking through a graffity
> >painted wall. I used a particles object to create the wall and
> >mapped the graffity brush on it. I quickrendered it and it looked
> >ok. Then I created a state for the flat wall. After using "lock
> >state" in the brush requester, I did not get the wall with the
> >graffity on it any more when I quickrendered but only bricks with
> >different colors. I think Imagine looks up one pixel of the brush
> >for each brick. Am I doing something wrong or is this a bug in
> >Imagine? And is there a workaround for this? I need the "lock
> >state" switch to do the broken wall.
> >
> >Bye,
> >  Hendrik
> 
> Check :
> 
> You've entered the Lock state name in the brushmap requester and PUSH ENTER
> after you type it in (or have selected it using browse)
> 
Yes.

> Create a state called 'Default' first, then create other states for anything
> you need to fix - and DON'T use the Default state for ANYTHING. It's just
> they way it works.
> 
I did so. I copied the "default" state and called it "Flat" and
used lock state with "Flat".

> Make sure you've selected Brushes (?) in the states requester
> 
Of course. As I wrote, the wall renders fine as long as I do not
use the lock state option.

> Check your brush axis location
> 
This is also ok.

> Bill Boyce

Bye,
  Hendrik


Date:    Saturday, 21 October 1995 12:05:51 
Subject: Re: Animation getting mangled
From:    Mike McCool <mikemcoo@efn.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> I have 8 fast and 2 chip.  How much are you using ?
> The odd thing was how the camera few shrank.

Hey Bob,

      My count is 18 and 2.  Wish it were more.  Yours really does 
sound like plenty, unless that anim of yours is quite complex.  

      Imagine is really a hog, though.  And there's something weird 
about the way it allocates ram.  It seems to bite off more and more with 
every frame.  

      Even with my 20 megs, I can sit there and watch it gobble more 
and more ram.  I STILL run out sometimes.  It's as if it isn't satisfied 
with loading an object just once.  It keeps it in ram, and loads it 
AGAIN and AGAIN.  I don't know how else to account for it. 

      This may sound like a real Rube Goldberg way of doing things, but 
I've found that when it starts getting low on ram, if I quit out of the 
render and reboot and start over at the point where I quit, it will go on 
and finish.  It's like a ram flush, freeing up all that allocated ram, so 
Imagine can re-load it.  

      Try this, see if it works for you.  

      Good luck. 

(I'm posting this to the list, as I'd like to get the experts take). 

Date:    Saturday, 21 October 1995 13:05:20 
Subject: Object conversion...VRML, etc.
From:    osc@ix.netcom.com (Keith Pope)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

WC2POV 2.6, available at the avalon site (ViewPoint now) and other 
areas, like AOL, is a hardy conversion program that reads in DXF, 3DS, 
WAV, OBJ, and a couple other file formats (not Imagine though) and 
exports to all of the above including VRML.

Keith Pope

Date:    Saturday, 21 October 1995 13:46:29 
Subject: Dupes
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Is anyone else getting allot of duplicate message traffic?

Date:    Saturday, 21 October 1995 14:10:50 
Subject: Multiple postings!!
From:    Peter Borcherds <prb@iafrica.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Is it only me, or is everybody getting multiple copies of messages on 
the IML.  I seem to be receiving three or more copies of IML messages 
- my software is set to delete messages from my server after 
downloading, so that isn`t the problem - 

Anybody else getting the same problems?

Peter Borcherds                           prb@iafrica.com
=========================================================
        Amiga 4000/030  68882/50mhz  10mb Ram  540mb HD     
=========================================================


Date:    Saturday, 21 October 1995 14:40:47 
Subject: Re: Multiple postings!!
From:    Rodney McNeel <rodman@infinity.ccsi.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

multiple repeats are ahappenin everywhere. at least the whining seems to 
have died down and the reaon for the IML coming thru. keep it up.

Date:    Saturday, 21 October 1995 15:07:26 
Subject: Environment map-mirror problem solution?
From:    "Frank.VanDerAuwera" <fvdauwer@uia.ua.ac.be>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

This might be a solution to the problem of the mirror having to reflect 
that metallic guy. It takes two render phases though.
first:
in the top view of yoour stage editor, determine the point exactly 
symmetrical to your camera, taking the plane of the mirror as a symmetry 
plane. That gives you the position of the virtual camerapoint from which 
you would see the mirrors image as an image through a "window".
don't know if this is clear, so here's some kind of ascii map:



         VC    virtual camera
         .  .
         .   .
         .    .
         -------  mirror
         .     .
         .    .                ...:edges of field of view of camera.
         .   .
         .  .
         RC    


now set up your scene with the background brushmap as you would like it 
to show up in the mirror, then create a big plane, color it black and cut 
out a window the size of your mirror.place it in the plane of your 
mirror, but a little bit behind it. now place your camera at the symmetry 
point(virtual camera position) and align it symmetrically to the 
"real"camera alignment. Shoot your scene as "seen from the looking-glass 
world" and store this image file
now, using a paint program, load in your image. It should be black, with 
a window showing what is to become your reflection image. crop the image 
to that window only and save it as a brushmap

render phase two: render your normal scene with the camera in its 
normal"real" position, and use a flat nonreflecting rectangle for your 
mirror. apply your brushmap image to this rectangle and it should show 
your reflection as you want it.

NOTE: this technique can be used to create surrealist images where the 
reflection is not exactly of the same world as the original...

Hope this works, can't check it as i am at my job...
greetings,

Frank


Frank Van der Auwera
University of Antwerp library

fvdauwer@uia.ac.be
fauwera@lib.ua.ac.be


Date:    Saturday, 21 October 1995 16:34:36 
Subject: Re: Animation getting mangled
From:    Mike McCool <mikemcoo@efn.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> > 
> > Check your world size, in globals, and make sure everything's 0.  
> > 
> 
> Everything is the same, for all frames.
> 

Hey Bob, 

      I read your other post, about things disappearing in Trace, but 
re-appearing in scanline.  This is DEFINITELY a world-size phenomenon.
  
      Anybody, help this guy out?  My globals size all 0's didn't seem to do 
the trick. . . .

Date:    Saturday, 21 October 1995 16:49:26 
Subject: Re: Animation getting mangled
From:    pleatman@one.net


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Sat, 21 Oct 1995, Mike McCool wrote:

> > I have 8 fast and 2 chip.  How much are you using ?
> > The odd thing was how the camera few shrank.
> 
> Hey Bob,
> 
>     My count is 18 and 2.  Wish it were more.  Yours really does 
> sound like plenty, unless that anim of yours is quite complex.  
> 
>     Imagine is really a hog, though.  And there's something weird 
> about the way it allocates ram.  It seems to bite off more and more with 
> every frame.  
> 
>     Even with my 20 megs, I can sit there and watch it gobble more 
> and more ram.  I STILL run out sometimes.  It's as if it isn't satisfied 
> with loading an object just once.  It keeps it in ram, and loads it 
> AGAIN and AGAIN.  I don't know how else to account for it. 
> 
>     This may sound like a real Rube Goldberg way of doing things, but 
> I've found that when it starts getting low on ram, if I quit out of the 
> render and reboot and start over at the point where I quit, it will go on 
> and finish.  It's like a ram flush, freeing up all that allocated ram, so 
> Imagine can re-load it.  
> 
>     Try this, see if it works for you.  
> 
>     Good luck. 
> 
> (I'm posting this to the list, as I'd like to get the experts take). 
> 


Well, I just deleted frames 22 through 59, and started the rendering.
I just took a look, and the same thing is happenining in the same places.

In frame 22, one object is missing, and things just get worse from there.
 
I just tried to generate frame 22 by itself, and same thing. I then went
to frame 22 in the stage editor, and did a quickrender, and it worked 
fine.  

What am I suppose to look at to figure this out?

bob

Date:    Saturday, 21 October 1995 18:12:09 
Subject: Re: dupes
From:    Perry Lucas <plucas@vt.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Yes, I have gotten duplicates of every message for the past
day or so.  I thought it might have been my server not deleting
the mail, however, it now seems that IML Listserv is resending
old traffic over and over.

--Perry

At 09:46 AM 10/21/95 -0400, RobSampson@aol.com wrote:
>Is anyone else getting allot of duplicate message traffic?
>


Date:    Saturday, 21 October 1995 20:09:37 
Subject: Re: Dupes
From:    NEWKIRK@delphi.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I'm getting 8-10 copies of some messages, not that many (thank God!) of
others (yet...)
Seems the IML has encountered a temporal distortion of some kind, sir. 8^)
JN

Date:    Saturday, 21 October 1995 20:13:19 
Subject: RE:RE:DUPESDUPES
From:    NEWKIRK@delphi.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I guess we can look forward to rereading these "are you getting dupes too?'
messages a half dozen times. 8^(
JN

I guess we can look forward to rereading these "are you getting dupes too?'
messages a half dozen times. 8^)
JN

Date:    Saturday, 21 October 1995 20:34:43 
Subject: Reflected fire
From:    George Allanson <ae418@ccn.cs.dal.ca>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi all

I am having some trouble creating good fires in a set that has several 
reflecting objects. Cool fire and fire ball can be applied to 3d objects 
but what I would like to use is fire, and that only works on plains. I 
have tried using cool fire and fire ball on a fog object with ghost but 
have not found the look I need yet. 

This might be a wish for win-imagine, fire texture that can be applied to 
spheres tubes ect. with a function like ghost where the object fades when the 
surface angels away from the camera.

Thanks to all for a lively list it is some times hard to keep up with iml 
but it is worth the effort 

George A.
Halifax N.S. CDN

Date:    Saturday, 21 October 1995 23:57:36 
Subject: Re: Bug-Patches
From:    rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au (Robert Byrne)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hello NEWKIRK, on Oct 20 you wrote:

> Plenty of developer support programs exist which calculate differences
> between versions of executables, then create a diff, or patch, file, and
> provide an end-user program to apply the patch, thereby updating an older
> version to a newer one, without having to redistribute the entire executable.
> Joel
> 

Some of you may remember that there was a patch for V2.9 to fix the Essence
texture incompatibility bug, it worked fine.

-- Bob

  :  Robert Byrne  : rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au :
  : Amiga A3000/25 :  Ballina, NSW  Australia  :


Date:    Sunday, 22 October 1995 00:25:00 
Subject: Re: Imagine Glows
From:    rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au (Robert Byrne)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hello Roger, on Oct 20 you wrote:

> Has anyone tried using the Haze FX? You can key it to a certain color, so 
> when an object of that color passes behind something that isn't that 
> color, the haze will overlap onto that object a little bit, like in real 
> life. The only drawback is that the haze is measured in pixel-widths, so 
> you have to reset it when you change resolutions. The other drawback 
> (okay, so there are two) is that you can't have any other object of that 
> color in the image. Other than that, you can play with it to your heart's 
> content.

I have'nt persisted with Haze because of another drawback. If you have
anti-aliasing set to a reasonable level the base haze colour is changed
when mixed with other object or background colours and you lose the effect.

-- Bob

  :  Robert Byrne  : rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au :
  : Amiga A3000/25 :  Ballina, NSW  Australia  :


Date:    Sunday, 22 October 1995 02:19:40 
Subject: Re: Win-Imagine
From:    Falko@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

RobSampson@aol.com

In a message dated 95-10-20 13:26:53 EDT, you write:

>I have a question on something I have no idea about.  If I had an Alpha or
>SGI running windozeNT would it be able to run a NT version of a program that
>also ran on a Pentium? Does NT handle everything or would an NT version of
>Imagine need to be written for risc processors?  I have seen adverstisements
>t

Versions of WinNT are processor specific. You have to have an ALPHA version
of WinNT and the NT application you wish to run. Processor Specific versions
of WinNT are usually supplied by the hardware vendor (ie DEC for the ALPHA).
However, a properly written NT application is supposed to only require some
minor adjustments and a recompile for each processor family it supports. The
machine code in the application has to be processor specific or you end up
running through an emulation layer like SoftWindows on the Power Mac. And
that certainly kills performance.

Falko

Date:    Sunday, 22 October 1995 02:30:14 
Subject: Re: Bug patches
From:    Falko@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

bryant@tpworm.ENET.dec.com

In a message dated 95-10-20 13:56:57 EDT, you write:

>People keep banging on Impulse about "bug patches". You just don't "bug
>patch"
>applications the size of Imagine, you build a new execuitable. Since it's
>not copy protected, you can't post it or thier piracy problems would get
>even worse.
>
>

I don't agree. Many vendors are supplying patches via version control
software which applies a differential patch to the existing file or files
which are involved. The only requirement is that you have the exact version
of the program for which the patch is designed. This means for instance if
you own IM 3.0 you can get all patches released for that version but not be
able to "upgrade" to say 3.3 with a patch released for that version. Version
control software creates a differintial file from the source version and the
"patched" version. This differential file contains only differential
information so you must have the original file from which the "patched"
version is calculated. Many, many vendors including Autodesk freely
distribute huge patches this way with little or no risk of piracy. The
Autocad 13 to corrective release 3 patch is available on the internet (about
12mb or so I think).

Falko

Date:    Sunday, 22 October 1995 02:36:49 
Subject: Re: Re[2]: Win-Imagine
From:    Falko@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

spack@mv.us.adobe.com

In a message dated 95-10-20 16:51:47 EDT, you write:

>As a warning to potential Win3.1/3.11 AND Win32s users - DON'T!  Win32s is a

>rats nest of trouble, and will result in a noticeable degradation of 
>performance.  Crack open your wallet and get Win95.
>
>

Agreed!! In my tests on Autocad 13, it runs MUCH better on Win95!!

Besides, as usual, at under $100 Microsoft is virtually giving away upgrades.

I'll remind you folks that major OS upgrades for the AMIGA were in a similar
price range.

Falko


Date:    Sunday, 22 October 1995 02:45:53 
Subject: Re: WinImagine on OS/2.
From:    Falko@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

roxter@UDel.Edu

In a message dated 95-10-20 20:26:40 EDT, you write:

> I am trying to find a program that uses WinG and not VxD's but I
>haven't been able to so far.  
>
>

Autocad 13 uses WinG for extremely fast screen redraws. Games are not the
only programs to use these libraries. WinG also works on Win31/311 with
Win32s. I do not think this is available on WinNT. Autocad 13 runs on all Win
platforms as it allows you to select the WinG features or not.

Falko

Date:    Sunday, 22 October 1995 02:57:27 
Subject: Re: Win-Imagine
From:    Falko@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Doug@defocus.demon.co.uk

In a message dated 95-10-20 21:53:59 EDT, you write:

>
>I hope '95 has sorted out this sort of thing, it would be nice to have a 
>viable alternative to Workbench for the future.
>
>

Windows 95 as well as Windows NT lets you do other things during application
starts and so forth. I will also admit that programming (including OS and
Workbench) is/was very slick on the Amiga and there was this responsive feel
to it, but I think in graphics intensive apps a good Windows machine is still
faster. The support hardware for graphics on the PC has outdistanced the
AMIGA. This is one of the reasons that made me switch. Windows has always had
"retargetable graphics" for instance. My current "working" resolution on my
PC is 1152x864x16bit color for another. Wondeful for graphics
editing/compositing or Web Surfing. Speaking of which, I can't WAIT to run
WinImagine at this resolution.

Falko

Date:    Sunday, 22 October 1995 03:22:00 
Subject: Decals on Glass
From:    mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com (Mike Vandersommen)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Thanks to all of you who sent tips on my Decal on Glass project.The dual map (fi
lter/color) with black on white and white on blackpics DID THE TRICK!!!One littl
e thing you have to remember. You must scale down theY axis of the map or else y
ou'll get a duplicate map on theback side of the glass or bottle object.   /----
--------------------------           ___   ___  ___   ___  | Mike van der Sommen
                     / __  /__/ /__/  /_   \ /  | Santa Barbara, Ca.            
         /___/ / \  /  /  /     / \  | mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com    
 HAUS BBS (805-683-1388)  |           "Blackouts make for nice breaks in the day
"   \_____________________________________________________________--- =FE InterN
et - GraFX Haus BBS - Santa Barbara, Ca - (805) 683-1388

Date:    Sunday, 22 October 1995 10:57:32 
Subject: World Size ( was mangled animations)
From:    pleatman@one.net


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


Mike McCool recommended changing world size to 0.
I looked and saw that I had 0 for 1-60.

I then changed the world size to a large number for everything.

The objects reappeared.

Can someone explain to me whatis going on?

In this animation, the object moves more into the center.

If the last frame works, and the first frame works, and the
 objects moves in a straight line between these two
positions, hwo can the world size of 0 be off.  

And from what Mike said, and the manual, it sounds like
an object will not be displayed in trace, if it does
not fit in the world size. But the objects I had, except
one, were not even moving....


bob


Date:    Sunday, 22 October 1995 11:13:50 
Subject: Re: World Size ( was mangled animations)
From:    Mike McCool <mikemcoo@efn.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> 
> If the last frame works, and the first frame works, and the
>  objects moves in a straight line between these two
> positions, hwo can the world size of 0 be off.  
> 
> And from what Mike said, and the manual, it sounds like
> an object will not be displayed in trace, if it does
> not fit in the world size. But the objects I had, except
> one, were not even moving....

Woah . . .  I assumed something was moving outside the world boundary.  
But if nothing's moving, I'm back to wondering if it IS a loss of ram 
problem.  I'll sure be glad when the experts jump in here . . . 

Date:    Sunday, 22 October 1995 12:56:43 
Subject: Re: Win-Imagine
From:    Curcio Nicholas <curcion@db.erau.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Sun, 22 Oct 1995 RobSampson@aol.com wrote:

> we go from here?  Although I could probably get the old lady to let me pick
> up an Alpha or SGI not even I am crazy enough to purchase a $15k program like
> Alias just for hobby reasons:)  Hardware platforms are just as critical to
> rendering as the software and the softwares performance is crucial as well.
>  Does anyone have any good ideas of where things are going?

Well, an SGI INDY costs about $5k, and Lightwave for the SGI is only 
around $1k I'm told.  That would be a nice setup.  :)  For about $2k more 
you can get the video output card, like a toaster.

nik


Date:    Sunday, 22 October 1995 13:09:24 
Subject: Re: World Size ( was mangled animations)
From:    Roger Straub <straub@csn.net>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Sun, 22 Oct 1995 pleatman@one.net wrote:

> 
> Mike McCool recommended changing world size to 0.
> I looked and saw that I had 0 for 1-60.

There's your problem. Imagine morphs the settings along a timeline, 
starting the first frame of the bar and ending the last. That's where 
your world size problem is coming in. Imagine morphed the World Size 
value from a large value in the first frame of your anim to a very small 
size towards the last frame, and as the value hit 0, Imagine expanded the 
world size to include all of your objects optimally. Try setting the 
Global size bar to just frame one, all size values at 0.

> 
> I then changed the world size to a large number for everything.
> 
> The objects reappeared.
> 
> Can someone explain to me whatis going on?
> 
> In this animation, the object moves more into the center.
> 
> If the last frame works, and the first frame works, and the
>  objects moves in a straight line between these two
> positions, hwo can the world size of 0 be off.  
> 
> And from what Mike said, and the manual, it sounds like
> an object will not be displayed in trace, if it does
> not fit in the world size. But the objects I had, except
> one, were not even moving....
> 
> 
> bob
> 
> 

See ya,
      Roger

Date:    Sunday, 22 October 1995 13:59:00 
Subject: Reflected fire
From:    mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com (Mike Vandersommen)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

-> From: George Allanson <ae418@ccn.cs.dal.ca>->-> I am having some trouble crea
ting good fires in a set that has sev=era-> reflecting objects. Cool fire and fi
re ball can be applied to 3d o=bje-> but what I would like to use is fire, and t
hat only works on plain=s.Huh...really? I was fooling around with the Fire textu
re just theother day and I applied it to a sphere. I did have to readjust thetex
ture's size and orientation, since it applied itself to thetop of the sphere. Yo
u might want to try it again.   /------------------------------           ___   
___  ___   ___  | Mike van der Sommen                     / __  /__/ /__/  /_   
\ /  | Santa Barbara, Ca.                     /___/ / \  /  /  /     / \  | mike
.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com     HAUS BBS (805-683-1388)  |           "Blac
kouts make for nice breaks in the day"   \______________________________________
_______________________--- =FE InterNet - GraFX Haus BBS - Santa Barbara, Ca - (
805) 683-1388

Date:    Sunday, 22 October 1995 14:19:47 
Subject: Re: Win-Imagine
From:    das@ceti.csustan.edu (David Alan Steiger)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

One caveat about the Indy.  It was designed more for 2d rather than 3d tasks.  I
'm
not sure, but I wouldn't be surprised if high-end PC's do alt least match, if no
t
outclass the Indy.

Also, although its $5k, its a Siicon Graphics machine, and any support hardware
I'm sure would carry a heftier price than PC hardware.

(Oops, thats Silicon Graphics)

Dave

Date:    Sunday, 22 October 1995 15:11:38 
Subject: Re: Win-Imagine
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-21 22:26:51 EDT, you write:

>Versions of WinNT are processor specific. You have to have an ALPHA version
>of WinNT and the NT application you wish to run. Processor Specific versions
>of WinNT are usually supplied by the hardware vendor (ie DEC for the ALPHA).
>However, a properly written NT application is supposed to only require some
>minor adjustments and a recompile for each processor family it supports. The
>machine code in the application has to be processor specific or you end up
>running through an emulation layer like SoftWindows on the Power Mac. And
>that certainly kills performance.
>
>Falko

Thanks for the info, I suspected that was the only way it really could work
but just was not 100% sure.  I hope this means that we might one day talk
Impulse into compiling for one of these machines.  I don't really see a
future with Intel right now.  The P6 from what I read will give marginal
performance increases and only for software that is properly written.  If
their at that stage now then it seems the only way to stay backwards
compatible would be through emulation on some new generation of chip and that
certainly is not any good for raytracing:)  I guess I'm just wondering where
the hardware is going since it is critical to operation of a rendering
program and I'm already not happy with the speed of my P90 with 40 meg of
ram.  I'm fairly certain I will not make the investment in a P6 so where do
we go from here?  Although I could probably get the old lady to let me pick
up an Alpha or SGI not even I am crazy enough to purchase a $15k program like
Alias just for hobby reasons:)  Hardware platforms are just as critical to
rendering as the software and the softwares performance is crucial as well.
 Does anyone have any good ideas of where things are going?

Bob...............



Date:    Sunday, 22 October 1995 15:11:41 
Subject: Re: Re[2]: Win-Imagine
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-21 22:56:58 EDT, you write:

>Agreed!! In my tests on Autocad 13, it runs MUCH better on Win95!!
>
>Besides, as usual, at under $100 Microsoft is virtually giving away
upgrades.
>
>I'll remind you folks that major OS upgrades for the AMIGA were in a similar
>price range.
>
>Falko

We were very impressed with AcadR13's performance increase under win95 as
well.  Ufortunately Autodesk seems to have been taken a bit off guard and we
had some plotter problems that will require the c4 patch to correct.
 Designer did not run at all.  Can't blame that on Microsoft though.
 Vistapro seems to work better as well but I never did any benchmarks with
it.  



Date:    Sunday, 22 October 1995 18:27:22 
Subject: Re: Win-Imagine
From:    Curcio Nicholas <curcion@db.erau.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Sun, 22 Oct 1995 RobSampson@aol.com wrote:

> >Well, an SGI INDY costs about $5k, and Lightwave for the SGI is only 
> >around $1k I'm told.  That would be a nice setup.  :)  For about $2k more 
> >you can get the video output card, like a toaster.

> Now thats good info.  Really a reasonable price, especially for a program
> like Lightwave.
> Where does the Indy stand say vs. a P90 on the speed charts?  I also did not
> know that they made the Toaster for that machine.  Another nice feature.
>  Perhaps there is another path to take.

Just let me clear a few things up here.  There isn't a Toaster for the 
INDY, per se.  The INDY is COVERED with inputs and outputs on its 
backside.  The only thing it doesn't have is video out.  That's what the 
$2k card is for.  :)

Ok.  I have a friend who's getting an INDY within the next couple of 
weeks.  One of SGI's sales reps is coming to school here to see my 
friend.  I'll try to get as much and as accurate info as I can, with 
references.  I won't post it to the list since this is no longer Imagine 
related.  Although it would be if Impulse would write it for the SGI's.  
;)  Anyone who wants the info, mail me.

nik


Date:    Sunday, 22 October 1995 20:19:47 
Subject: Re: Win-Imagine
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-22 13:26:54 EDT, you write:

>Well, an SGI INDY costs about $5k, and Lightwave for the SGI is only 
>around $1k I'm told.  That would be a nice setup.  :)  For about $2k more 
>you can get the video output card, like a toaster.
>
>nik
Now thats good info.  Really a reasonable price, especially for a program
like Lightwave.
Where does the Indy stand say vs. a P90 on the speed charts?  I also did not
know that they made the Toaster for that machine.  Another nice feature.
 Perhaps there is another path to take.

Bob............


Date:    Sunday, 22 October 1995 21:27:45 
Subject: Clarify reflect fire
From:    George Allanson <ae418@ccn.cs.dal.ca>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Thanks for the response I should have said I have tried fire on a 
cone and what I got was a very sharply defined edge from about the middle 
to the bottom that made it clearly look like fire mapped on a cone, even 
thining out the texture you still get the look on fire on an object. What I 
need is what you get with fire on a plain where it looks like a bon fire.
With three reflective objects positioned around the fire. As I said I tried 
ghost on top of diferent fire objects and got some intersting stuff but not 
the look I am trying for. 

What I am trying to do is create something like the pictures from 
the broshure the one with the blue egg over the volcano. My problem is 
I want a flat plain with a transparent blast spot, under the plain will be 
a second plain with a stylised hot lava look, the base of the flame can not 
be hidden and the flame should look like a cross between a gas flame and a 
bonfire. Thanks for any other sugestions. 

Date:    Sunday, 22 October 1995 21:47:24 
Subject: Re: World Size ( was mangled animations)
From:    pleatman@one.net


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Sun, 22 Oct 1995, Roger Straub wrote:

> 
> 
> On Sun, 22 Oct 1995 pleatman@one.net wrote:
> 
> > 
> > Mike McCool recommended changing world size to 0.
> > I looked and saw that I had 0 for 1-60.
> 
> There's your problem. Imagine morphs the settings along a timeline, 
> starting the first frame of the bar and ending the last. That's where 
> your world size problem is coming in. Imagine morphed the World Size 
> value from a large value in the first frame of your anim to a very small 
> size towards the last frame, and as the value hit 0, Imagine expanded the 
> world size to include all of your objects optimally. Try setting the 
> Global size bar to just frame one, all size values at 0.
> 
> > 
> > I then changed the world size to a large number for everything.
> > 
> > The objects reappeared.
> > 
> > Can someone explain to me whatis going on?
> > 
> > In this animation, the object moves more into the center.
> > 
> > If the last frame works, and the first frame works, and the
> >  objects moves in a straight line between these two
> > positions, hwo can the world size of 0 be off.  
> > 
> > And from what Mike said, and the manual, it sounds like
> > an object will not be displayed in trace, if it does
> > not fit in the world size. But the objects I had, except
> > one, were not even moving....
> > 
> > 
> > bob
> > 
> > 
> 
> See ya,
>     Roger
> 

Thanks Roger, I'll give that a try. The last thing I did was remove
the size bar altogther, and that seems to work.  What size does
it use then for the world size?

I am not sure I understand what you explained above.  Why did the
values keep getting smaller towards the end?

bob



Date:    Sunday, 22 October 1995 23:43:48 
Subject: Candle flame as light source
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Dick Bryant - 237-6502 20-Oct-1995 1025 <bryant@tpworm.ENET.dec.com>
> 
>      For instance, we have a candle sitting on a table in a room. The
> candle is burning and the flame is the only source of illumination in the
> room. The light wants to flicker with the flame and cast shadows on the
> other objects in the room that it illuminates. 
> 
>     I'm using 3.3 on a PC.

Random thoughts: you'll want to use trace mode, to have all those areas 
under the table that should be in shadow, appear that way. You'll have 
an empty axis in the middle of your flame, with the Light attribute set, 
as a light source. To prevent the flame and wick objects from blocking 
the light, (I assume the light axis will be somewhere in the center 
of all this) you'll need to give them a Fog Length -- anything over zero 
is fine, so you can use 0.001 for the wick, for example, and still have 
it appear as a solid object.

The light shining through the semitransparent flame, will be colored by 
it, so you can simply keep the light itself at 255,255,255 (Cast Shadows 
and Diminish Intensity activated) and let the flame give color to the 
light.

(By the way, I haven't been able to really test any of this, although I 
seem to remember others writing about the above points)

If you want the light to flicker, you _could_ create a keyframe every 
few frames, and morph between different values for the light 
intensity... how work-intensive! I hate having this programmable hunk of 
machinery sitting below my desk, and being forced to tell it every 
little thing. An easier solution follows:

Using your favorite method, create a skinny brushmap, maybe 1 pixel 
tall by 500 wide, with a greyscale noise pattern.

Add a primitive sphere (radius 0.01, 3 circle sections, 2 vertical 
sections) and position it around your light axis. Add the brushmap as a 
FlatX/FlatZ Filter map, and position it so the sphere lies inside one 
end of the brush. Save as state "Start". Then, move the brush to the 
sphere lies inside the other end, and save as state "End".

In your animation, when you morph the sphere from "Start" to "End", the 
brush will travel over it, modulating the transparency of the sphere 
between 0 and 100%; this, in turn, will block from 100 to 0% of the 
light from the empty axis placed inside the sphere. Presto-change-o, an 
automated flicker!

If the flicker doesn't seem right, you can vary the parameters you used 
to create the noise brushmap, for example increase the frequency if the 
effect looks more like the slow glow of a B-movie nuclear reactor, than 
a frisky little flame.

You can then use standard techniques (i.e. morph between states) to have
the flame grow and shrink to match the flicker. One way to get a visual
impression of the flicker pattern, is to create a primitive plane, 100
units wide by 1 tall, 100 sections wide by 1 tall, at position 0,0,0. 
Now Applique the noise brushmap to it. (Make sure you Edit Axes to
stretch the brushmap's Y axis to something like 20 units long before you
accept the brushmap requester) You'll get, in the Top view, a squiggly
shape that exactly represents the intensity variations in your flickering
light! Then, in the Front view, use the Drag Box to multi-select all the
points on the bottom half of the plane. Scale them in Y by zero, and
manually move them in Y only, towards -Y, until they rest at the base of
the shape, as seen in the Front view. The result: a 2-D object that looks
like a stock market graph. If you read it like a graph, in the Top view,
you can imagine time running left to right, and light intensity running
up and down. You have basically told Imagine to generate a map of the
contortions your flame should go through, automatically! All you need to
do at this point is print out the Top view, create a few states of your
flame at different heights, and use your printout as a guide to define
keyframes for your flame to grow and shrink. 


Date:    Sunday, 22 October 1995 23:50:07 
Subject: Decals on Glass
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Mike Vandersommen <mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com>
> 
> Thanks to all of you who sent tips on my Decal on Glass project.
> The dual map (filter/color) with black on white and white on black
> pics DID THE TRICK!!!

And of course, since Imagine converts everything to 24-bit once loaded 
into memory, you can do what I've always advocated, and take full 
advantage of that "feature" by creating your maps as super high-res, 
then shrink (with anti-aliasing) them down to the resolution you feel is 
reasonable for your project. They won't take up any more memory, but 
they'll look soooo much smoother!


Date:    Sunday, 22 October 1995 23:54:57 
Subject: Idea ...
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

One thing I've always wished for: a Cube primitive. I would venture a 
guess that this button, if added, would be the most-frequently used 
primitive. I know you can add a plane, extrude it, and recenter the 
axis, but...


Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 00:01:07 
Subject: Oh, and I forgot ...
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Steve NACAD::Sherman LKG2-A/R5 pole AA2 DTN 226-6992 20-Oct-1995 
> 
> Also, I'd like to be able to specify drag box for point selection
> by default. Again, I didn't find anything in preferences that would let
> me do this. Thanks! 

As far as I know, there isn't anything in Preferences for this. However, 
I strongly suggest you create three buttons ("Click", "Drag", and 
"Lasso") to easily switch selection modes. I use'em all the time.


Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 00:10:25 
Subject: Speedtest (was Imagine BeBox port)
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I would advise against it. A well-designed test was posted to CompuServe 
this summer, complete with Preferences files for Amiga and PC, to ensure 
everyone rendered under the same conditions. A wide variety of 
configurations were benchmarked, and the results of that study could 
simply be posted here, rather than start yet another long thread of 
back-and-forth messages between testers.

Now if only someone could dig it out of their archives, as I can't seem 
to locate my copy.


Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 00:20:57 
Subject: Re: transparent
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

>I am working on a PC and version 2 of Imagine.  I am having real
>difficulty creating a plane to behave in such a way that when I
>apply a brushmap to it, it will be transparent where the color is
>black.
>
>My bitmap image is say a black circle on a white background, and
>when I apply this to a plane I want the black area (the circle)
>to be see-through. How the hell do you do this] I'm getting
>plenty of caffine just trying to solve this prob.

If you want one color in a brushmap to have zero effect on the object, 
you must activate the Genlock button in the Brusmhap requester. In 
addition, the brushmap itself must be designed with genlocking in mind:

If your brushmap is 256 colors or less, it usually has a color palette 
associated with it. In that case, the Genlock button will inhibit color 
zero, the first position in the palette. It doesn't matter if that 
palette position holds black, hot pink, or what: anything drawn in color 
zero will not show up on your object. In your case, you'd draw a 
color-zero circle onto a black background. (Where the black would come 
from a different palette position, of course)

Note that it's the palette _position_ that counts, not the _color_ of 
the paint inside that palette position. For example, if palette 
positions zero and fifty are both black, and you draw two black circles 
onto a red background, using colors zero and fifty, only the black circle 
drawn using color zero will be transparent.

Now, if your brushmap has more than 256 colors (usually 16 million), it 
normally doesn't have a palette. In that case, there is no palette 
position zero for Imagine to genlock, so the program must revert to a 
specific _color value_. The genlock value is set in the Preferences 
editor's GENC parameter. I believe its default value is 010101, meaning 
anything that's drawn using an RGB color of (1,1,1) will be genlocked, 
i.e. have no effect on the object. If you were applying a 24-bit 
brushmap to your object, you'd draw a (1,1,1)-colored circle on top of 
the white background.


Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 00:27:54 
Subject: Re: Win-Imagine
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Curcio Nicholas <curcion@db.erau.edu>
> 
> Well, an SGI INDY costs about $5k, and Lightwave for the SGI is only 
> around $1k I'm told.  That would be a nice setup.  :)  For about $2k more 
> you can get the video output card, like a toaster.

Lightwave is $995 for Amiga and Intel, and $1,995 for Alpha and SGI.

The last time I checked, did the $5,000 Indy configuration even include 
a hard disk? I thought it was diskless, to be used on a network. (And to 
keep the large-type price in the brochure as low as possible) Someone 
please correct me on this.



Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 00:28:23 
Subject: Re: Decals on Glass
From:    rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au (Robert Byrne)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hello Mike, on Oct 22 you wrote:

> 
> Thanks to all of you who sent tips on my Decal on Glass project.
> The dual map (filter/color) with black on white and white on black
> pics DID THE TRICK!!!
> 
> One little thing you have to remember. You must scale down the
> Y axis of the map or else you'll get a duplicate map on the
> back side of the glass or bottle object.

You can make a face subgroup and restrict the maps to it.

-- Bob

Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 00:47:37 
Subject: Re: Constant Upgrade Program
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Stephen Gifford <sgiff@airmail.net>
> 
> It would seem to me that Impulse would benefit greatly by putting up a Web
> Page at this point.

You'll be happy to hear that Impulse will do just that, once all that 
4.0 work is done. Mike is looking forward to a more civilized forum, 
akin to what the IML used to be.


Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 01:57:29 
Subject: Re: idea ...
From:    Bush Doktor <sppcarso@ultrix.uor.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

On Sun, 22 Oct 1995, Charles Blaquiere wrote:

> One thing I've always wished for: a Cube primitive. I would venture a 
> guess that this button, if added, would be the most-frequently used 
> primitive. I know you can add a plane, extrude it, and recenter the 
> axis, but...

   That's one of the best suggestions in a while!



Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 02:26:32 
Subject: Re:cube
From:    augioh4b@ibmmail.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

--- Received from GITD.PSG024  2164526              23OCT95  16.27
  -> IBMMAIL.INTERNET      IBMMAIL

Hi all,

Just replying to the problem of creating a cube, I use to create
a cube/rectangular prism with the primitive cylinder, with the
following options ... sections=4 (ie 4 sides viewed from top),
height=whatever height you need, closed top and bottom, segments=1
and turn off stagger points.

Now when a prism is produced just rotate the axis since it is
rotated at 45 degrees.

I hope this helps..

Cheers
Vic Sarmiento

Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 03:33:35 
Subject: Hello
From:    "Ronald B. Mizrahi" <rmizrahi@jax.gttw.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I heard from a friend that there is a global group that is looking for =
people with Imagine PC and a PAR board.  I fit that category.  If anyone =
knows about this request, please contact me personally: =
rmizrahi@jax.gttw.com.

I am a professional 3D artist.  I am a registered Imagine user.  I =
render on a P120 with  32M of EDO memory and a P75 w/ 16M of FastPage =
RAM.  I can render in a variety of formats, however I normally render to =
a DPS PAR board (DR 2100) for the PC.

Please contact me with any information. =20

Thank you,

Ron Mizrahi
rmizrahi@jax.gttw.com


Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 06:03:20 
Subject: Re: clarify reflect fire
From:    Bill Boyce <bilboyce@iconz.co.nz>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 06:27 PM 22/10/95 -0300, you wrote:
>Thanks for the response I should have said I have tried fire on a 
>cone and what I got was a very sharply defined edge from about the middle 
>to the bottom that made it clearly look like fire mapped on a cone, even 
-SNIP-
>plain with a stylised hot lava look, the base of the flame can not 
>be hidden and the flame should look like a cross between a gas flame and a 
>bonfire. Thanks for any other sugestions. 
>

Two applications of the texture, at right angles to each other??

Bill Boyce


Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 06:03:24 
Subject: Re: PAR settings
From:    Bill Boyce <bilboyce@iconz.co.nz>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 01:54 AM 19/10/95 -0400, you wrote:
>I wrote the original letter about the PAR resolution settings, specifically
>that I was using 680x440 instead of the "recommended" 752x480. I neglected to
>mention that I was using an aspect ratio of 1/1. I believe I tried 6/7 and
>things looked squished. 
>
>>Jim Rix wrote: 
>>The 752x480 resolution is the dimensions for standard OVERSCAN NTSC 
>>video.  This resolution is very useful when projects from a video 
>>projector and you want as much pictures as possible
>
>So I guess this means as long as I don't "project" my video I have nothing to
>worry about? If I were to copy my animations to Betacam SP and hand them over
>to the local cable company for broadcast, the people watching on their plain
>non-projecting TV's wouldn't look at my animation and say, "Look at those
>ugly frame lines! Doesn't this guy know it's supposed to be 752x480? What a
>doofus!"

Further to my earlier post, I checked my Beta SP grabs, and the 'picture
information space', ie the the bits of frame with image data, where 710 x 566
(or 710 x 480(?)) on a NTSC machine. Thus I wouldn't recommend going under 710,
and I for one will continue to render at 752 wide, which seems to be the
accepted
standard. Better safe than sorry!

Bill


Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 08:12:00 
Subject: Tons Of Multiple Postings
From:    KEN_ROBERTSON@robelle.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I've read the same messages three or four times, dating back to
last Wednesday.  (October 18th.)   All of the messages seem to have
something like
   Return-Path: <root@deliverator.io.com>
in them...but just the REPEAT messages.  I hope that Mr. Moderator
is listening and can remote the problem.
\KenR

Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 12:48:51 
Subject: Re: Win-Imagine
From:    Curcio Nicholas <curcion@db.erau.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Sun, 22 Oct 1995, David Alan Steiger wrote:

> One caveat about the Indy.  It was designed more for 2d rather than 3d tasks. 
 I'm
> not sure, but I wouldn't be surprised if high-end PC's do alt least match, if 
not
> outclass the Indy.

You're joking aren't you?  The INDY just doesn't have the 3D graphics chips.
It doesn't do realtime 3D as fast as an Indigo Squared.  A 'high-end PC' 
doesn't have 3D graphics chips either, and I know for a fact that the 
processing power of an INDY destroys a pentium.  A PC outclass an INDY?
Impossible.

> Also, although its $5k, its a Siicon Graphics machine, and any support hardwar
e
> I'm sure would carry a heftier price than PC hardware.

I don't know what support hardware (besides the video output stuff) you 
would need.

nik


Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 13:06:51 
Subject: Apologies and a question
From:    Curcio Nicholas <curcion@db.erau.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


Hi, everyone!

FIrst of all I'd like to apologize to everyone for starting that INDY 
thread.  I'm praying it doesn't turn into a platform debate.  When I get 
all the info I can, I'll send to those who requested it.  OK?

Now for an IMAGINE (!) question.  I'm using 3.0 and am about to upgrade 
to 4.0.  Now, I thought that even in 3.0 you could see a backdrop picture 
through transparent ojects.  A render proved me wrong, so when was this 
fixed?  Or has it been fixed yet?  All I get in my tranparent objects is 
the color set in the globals, not the backdrop picture.

nik


Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 13:35:17 
Subject: Re: The glow issue . . .
From:    Soeren Birk Jacobsen <kurgan@imada.ou.dk>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Thu, 19 Oct 1995 CoryJ44@aol.com wrote:

>    There seems to be a bit of a discrepancy here . . . some people are pretty
> convinced that Imagine needs dedicated "glow-support", while others say that
> glows are a simple feature to take advantage of in Imagine . . . if it's as
> easy as the latter group says, could some of you post some tips?  How can we
> make convincing neon or "warm" candle glows?  It's not that I don't believe
> you, I'd just like to know how the gurus do it.
> 
>                                               Cory
> 
Well I usually do this:

-Create a 'roundish' object (what I mean it should be smooth around the 
 edges)
-set the 'fog' requester to 0.01 (you can set it to 0.0001, then the 
 requester just shows 0.00, but it's still 0.0001!!!!)
-add 'ghost' texture 
-set texturerequester foglength to 2 (this really depend on the size 
 of your object, fiddle with it)
-then there ist the edgevalue (I can't remember the name of this setting 
 but it's the next one..., set it to 1 (you can also set it to 0.9, but I 
 usually got with 1)
-set the object color to ... blue ???
-render
there you have it a glowing blue object.

Steven Blackmon has some great tutorials on 
'www.websharx.com:80/~kinda/tips/newtip.html' check them out!!!!!





kurgan

Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 13:42:09 
Subject: Re: Imagine ported to BeBox?
From:    Soeren Birk Jacobsen <kurgan@imada.ou.dk>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Thu, 19 Oct 1995, Robert King (ART) wrote:

> On Thu, 19 Oct 1995, Soeren Birk Jacobsen wrote:
> 
> > Well the point is that a few weeks ago A4000-60 Tower was released, 
> > here in Denmark it is selling for approx $3000.- plus tax.
> > 
> > 
> > kurgan  
> 
> Are the A4000's flying out the door at $3000-pluse tax?  What does 90 mhz 
> Pentium go for over there?
> 
> I have 25 mhz 030 2500 but I'm going to get a pentium after hearing about 
> the speed Imagine renders at.  I wonder what the comparison of an 060 
> A4000 to 133 mhz Pentium in rendering speed would show? 
> 
> Robert King king@arts.usf.edu
> 


Well about the speed I don't know (I'd hate to run Win NT/95)

prize:approx the same as A4000-60

Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 13:53:39 
Subject: Re: 4.0 Docs and other things
From:    Soeren Birk Jacobsen <kurgan@imada.ou.dk>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Fri, 20 Oct 1995, Dan.Maclean wrote:

>  
> >From Dan MacLean:
>  
> I haven't tried the ghost texture, but fog disappointed me.  Fog doesn't
> behave like a true glow.  The brightness drops off toward the outer edges of a

> glow, and a glow never appears darker than what is behind it.  i.e. a
> lightsaber would not glow red in front of a bright white background, since the

> red would be a lesser brightness value.  Fog does exactly this.  In addition,
> a glow will appear in front of objects that obscure part of the glowing
> object.  Fog does not behave this way either.
>  
> I've read suggestions about using the glow button on the lensflare effect.
> I'll have to try this.  The new global lensflare works correctly, as far as I
> know, in that it only disappears when the lightsource is totally obscured
> (spelling?).  Unfortunately, this only allows for round lights and not neon
> signs.Maybe you can combine many lightsources to get the effect?  Thanks for
> your help!
> 

Well... to do the 'glow in front of obscuring object'-thing, all impulse 
had to do was to include a 'globalflaring'-effect (not lensflare!!!!), 
and then add a 'no-flare-for-me'-flag on each object/attribute? 
unfortunately this is not the case.
All I can say is WISH HARDER!!!!!

kurgan

Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 14:12:00 
Subject: Gadgets
From:    mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com (Mike Vandersommen)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

-> From: Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>->-> As far as I know, there isn't anyth
ing in Preferences for this. Ho=wev-> I strongly suggest you create three button
s ("Click", "Drag", and-> "Lasso") to easily switch selection modes. I use'em al
l the time.Doing! Now that's a great suggestion. Why didn't I think of that!Some
times I completely forget about the Gadget editor.....   /----------------------
--------           ___   ___  ___   ___  | Mike van der Sommen                  
   / __  /__/ /__/  /_   \ /  | Santa Barbara, Ca.                     /___/ / \
  /  /  /     / \  | mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com     HAUS BBS (805-683
-1388)  |           "Blackouts make for nice breaks in the day"   \_____________
________________________________________________--- =FE InterNet - GraFX Haus BB
S - Santa Barbara, Ca - (805) 683-1388

Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 14:19:00 
Subject: Idea ...
From:    mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com (Mike Vandersommen)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

-> From: Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>->-> One thing I've always wished for: a
 Cube primitive. I would ventur=e a-> guess that this button, if added, would be
 the most-frequently use=d-> primitive. I know you can add a plane, extrude it, 
and recenter th=e-> axis, but...Personally, I'd much prefer a Sharon Stone primi
tive. Cubes I haveless trouble with... :)   /------------------------------     
      ___   ___  ___   ___  | Mike van der Sommen                     / __  /__/
 /__/  /_   \ /  | Santa Barbara, Ca.                     /___/ / \  /  /  /    
 / \  | mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com     HAUS BBS (805-683-1388)  |    
       "Blackouts make for nice breaks in the day"   \__________________________
___________________________________--- =FE InterNet - GraFX Haus BBS - Santa Bar
bara, Ca - (805) 683-1388

Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 14:27:06 
Subject: Tree Factory
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I've been looking at the demo for this program and it seems quite nice but it
will not export any models in the demo version (a reasonable precaution).
 Since it will only export to raw, dxf and lwo I was wondering if anyone has
used a registered version of this program and brought models into Imagine.
 It would also be nice if Imagine would import more object file formats than
it does.  I seem to remember the demo of Truespace could handle multiple
formats.  Some of the 3ds objects I have found which I can convert with a
utility called 3ds2im are really detailed and amaze me that people release
them to pd.  There are allot of other libraries out there I'd like to look in
but have no way to convert to Imagine's object format.  In anycase, if
someone is using "Tree Factory" with Imagine please let me know.

Bob...........

Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 14:55:41 
Subject: Re: Imagine Glows
From:    Roger Straub <straub@csn.net>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Sun, 22 Oct 1995, Robert Byrne wrote:

> 
> I have'nt persisted with Haze because of another drawback. If you have
> anti-aliasing set to a reasonable level the base haze colour is changed
> when mixed with other object or background colours and you lose the effect.

Not in my experience. From what I can tell, the Haze FX looks in the 
finished rendered image for all pixels of the key color, draws a circle 
with x radius (x is set in the FX requester, and is a number of pixels) 
around one of those key-colored pixels and fills in the circle with the 
key color with about 25% transparency, fading out at the edges. So 
anti-aliasing shouldn't matter, so long as your FX radius is greater than 
the number of pixels across that the AA uses.

> 
> -- Bob
> 
>   :  Robert Byrne  : rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au :
>   : Amiga A3000/25 :  Ballina, NSW  Australia  :
> 
> 

See ya,
      Roger

Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 15:03:31 
Subject: Re: idea ...
From:    Roger Straub <straub@csn.net>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Mon, 23 Oct 1995, Bush Doktor wrote:

> On Sun, 22 Oct 1995, Charles Blaquiere wrote:
> 
> > One thing I've always wished for: a Cube primitive. I would venture a 
> > guess that this button, if added, would be the most-frequently used 
> > primitive. I know you can add a plane, extrude it, and recenter the 
> > axis, but...
> 
>    That's one of the best suggestions in a while!
> 

How about Imagine's own programming language for macros? That way, any 
mathematically-definable object could be generated - even arrays of 
objects! Easy DNA strands, dodecahedrons, the possibilities are endless!

See ya,       
      Roger

Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 15:19:33 
Subject: Re: World Size ( was mangled animations)
From:    Roger Straub <straub@csn.net>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Sun, 22 Oct 1995 pleatman@one.net wrote:

> 
> Thanks Roger, I'll give that a try. The last thing I did was remove
> the size bar altogther, and that seems to work.  What size does
> it use then for the world size?
> 
> I am not sure I understand what you explained above.  Why did the
> values keep getting smaller towards the end?

Ok, sit back. You might want to get a cup of coffee. This is gonna be a 
long story.

Imagine used to have a "Transition Frames" box in every morphing 
parameter - actor, size, posn, alignment, and FX. This was so you could 
have a parameter morph to a different value and have it stay at the new 
value for a number of frames without having to add another bar. Such were 
the good days.

With the release of Imagine 3.0 (or was it 2.9?), Impulse removed the 
Transition Frames box from everything except for the Globals actor bar. 
Now, if you wanted to have something morph, you had to add one actor bar 
for the object as it was for a few frames, a bar for the morph time, and 
a bar for the new object to remain for a few frames. The middle bar is 
the length of time, in frames, that the object takes to morph to the new 
form.

This is where your problem is. Imagine starts out at a default World Size 
value (1024, I think). When you set the Global size bar to frames 1-60 
(let's say), you told Imagine to morph the world size from 1024, in the 
0th frame (Imagine starts its morphs from the first frame in the new 
bar), to 0, in the last frame. Imagine complied exactly as you told it - 
it made the world smaller and smaller, until on frame 59 the size was 
about 20 units. Then, on frame 60, when the size hit 0, Imagine thought, 
"Hey! The World Size is 0! I'd better look at the scene and make the 
world include everything!" So your scene was whole again.

Whew! I hope the preceding narration was of some help to some lost souls, 
and I hope my syntax explains the situation well enough. BTW, you're 
welcome! =u)

> 
> bob
> 
> 
> 

See ya,
      Roger

Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 15:49:10 
Subject: Fixed2
From:    Granberg Tom <tom.granberg@TV2.no>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi, After I sent this message on friday it went down again, so if anyone feel 
that they havent got any repliyes yet, thats why.
MESSAGE:
Just want you to know that the problem with my mail server is now fixed, so if 
anyone are unsure if I have recieved mail that where ment for me, please mail me
 
again. My mail went down 18.10.95 and came back today.

Ps.I have recieved a lot mails regarding modelling tips, and I'am looking into 
it. So be patient, I will probably write something tonight........

Later....

Tom

Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 15:49:13 
Subject: Shipping dates 4.0 (true!)
From:    Granberg Tom <tom.granberg@TV2.no>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Aha, that got your attention, I guess?
I dont know WHEN it ships, but I know WHY it isnt shipping ass planned. Want to 

know?....................ok, you are a patient group of people, arent you?
Well here is the story.
Last friday(I think) Scott(Impulse) mailed me and told me that, guess what?, his
 
hard disc went to heaven without leaving a departure note, very uncool and 
sadistic of the HD I'd say. This is probably why it is delayed, and belive me 
this is no joke.

Later...

Tom Renderbrandt


Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 15:50:14 
Subject: Forms editor
From:    Granberg Tom <tom.granberg@TV2.no>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Charles, I could not pass this up, since you wrote:
"use 4.0's Smoothing function to clean up your object")
I write:
Use 4.0's Smoothing function to clean up your object

Hi, hi.......well this is not as bad as you might think, the smoothing tool in 
my opinion replaces the forms editor by a factor of ten. Check it out when you 
get you hands on 4.0, great stuff, realy!!

Later....

Tom Renderbrandt


Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 15:52:15 
Subject: Light effects
From:    Granberg Tom <tom.granberg@TV2.no>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi

I am reading the mails now, 2 days worth, and heard something about creating 
"halos" or bright spots around your light sources. A thing you should know here 

is that the standard light sources is a bit hard to work with when trying to 
achive such effects(it can be done). I rarely use stage lights to other things 
than fill light. I have a directory called lights, where I save down light 
axis(detail) spots,parralel,underwater,sun, etc. Becouse I can use textures on 
them, and see the size of the axis. And to create a good halo effect like I did 

in one of the pictures at Captain Videos homepage, do the following.
Add and axis in detail, scale the axis(shift s) to the size you want the halo to
 
be. Then go to attributes and give it some redicelous large numbers like: 
800,500,500. If you dont want that light to light up your scene as a nuclear 
explotion, turn on the controlled fallof flag(the halo will still be "hot", 
infact hotter than you may think, try it). This will give the effect you are 
looking for.

Tom Renderbrandt


Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 15:54:16 
Subject: Modelling and Forms editor
From:    Granberg Tom <tom.granberg@TV2.no>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Charles you wrote:
-Same here. I've never been able to get my mind on the Forms editor, and 
-always considered it a bit clumsy. (e.g. need to manually drag & 
-position tons of points -- how on Earth can you create a smooth curve 
-with _that_?) (I know, don't tell me -- "use 4.0's Smoothing function to 
-clean up your object")

& others wanting to know: Same thing.

To be honest, I dont know what to use the forms editor for, frankly I dont see 
any use for it. At least not if you got 3.X, so this realy means that the 
turorials and tips I am going to write will not be about the forms editor. But 
there maybe others that know that editor, and I have seen amazing stuff coming 
out of it by others. Hope this dont make you guys upset?!

Later

Tom Renderbrandt


Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 16:39:56 
Subject: Re: Win-Imagine
From:    Sharky <sharky@websharx.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Sun, 22 Oct 1995, Curcio Nicholas wrote:

> 
> 
> On Sun, 22 Oct 1995 RobSampson@aol.com wrote:
> 
> > we go from here?  Although I could probably get the old lady to let me pick
> > up an Alpha or SGI not even I am crazy enough to purchase a $15k program lik
e
> > Alias just for hobby reasons:)  Hardware platforms are just as critical to
> > rendering as the software and the softwares performance is crucial as well.
> >  Does anyone have any good ideas of where things are going?
> 
> Well, an SGI INDY costs about $5k, and Lightwave for the SGI is only 
> around $1k I'm told.  That would be a nice setup.  :)  For about $2k more 
> you can get the video output card, like a toaster.
> 

Yikes....SGI INDY for $5,000?  basically you are talking a box 
with nothing on it. Not even a monitor.  Try at least $10,000 for 
anything that'll do a mediocre job, $18,000 for one that has a proper 
configuration (ie. 24bit instead of 8-bit graphics, 64MB RAM, 17" 
Monitor, accelerated graphics etc.) I looked at an SGI Indy web force 
setup for my webwork, and graphics, but it was just too pricey in any 
preferred configuration.

If you can afford that much machine, I probably would look at more SGI
specific software, since if you are spending that much on the machine, you
should consider buying software that really screams on it. Just my 
opinion though....:-)

Aloha,
      Sharky

Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 16:52:16 
Subject: Textures of space, was: modelling tips?
From:    Granberg Tom <tom.granberg@TV2.no>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


Stephen G. you wrote:
-I was specifically impressed by the realism of the docking bay in Tom's
-picture of the ship sitting on the floor in the docking bay.  The textures
-on your spaceships and the floor and walls of the docking bay are extremely
-well done.  I would certainly appreciate any insight into its creation.

First, thanks Stephen.
Tutorial: needs 3.2 or above (I think?)
The textures are not that hard realy, if you have a paint program like photoshop
 
/dpaint,or similar, you can make them in a snap. What I did was makin a couple 
of shapes , outlined them in a 50% darker color. The pic' was about 160X160 to 
start with. Then I used the airbrush tool to give it some "dirty" apperance, 
down strokes. Then I copied the whole thing as a "brush" opened a bigger blank 
picture 720X576. And stamped it down all over the place. Ofcourse you will have 

to add some more detail to it afterwards to get rid of the brush joins. Then I 
added some red lines to it. Save it, make a copy that is only grey tone and save 
that to. Go to Imagine add a plane, give it some color like: 50,50,50, hardness 

35. Then add the first image(color) as a color map and make it 50% 
visable(mix/morph). Duplicate that map and double click on it and change the 
file name to the grey one. And make it a specular map at 100%visable(mix/morph).
 
This is it realy. Why I duplicate the second image instead of adding it 
directly? Well, becouse it will be aligned to the first one, and that is what we
 
want. To give it some variance add dirt with these color values: 90,40,15(rust) 

and scale the texture axis so that Z is at least twice the lenght of x, I use to
 
scale it even more. To give it that feel of old run down look(rust from water 
that has run down the walls for years). The floor is made the same way, becouse 

if you add  the same pic as a specular map it wont give specular spots where it 

is black, and less where it is dark, and vice versa with bright parts of the 
image. That realy gives you a lot of choice to make cool surfaces without 
modelling it. If you look at one of my latest pics you will see the "board walk"
 
that goes around in the hangar. The walk are grids that where basicly made the 
same way as the above, with one exception, I also added the pic as a 
transparancy map and inversed it. You get the idea?

Later....

Tom Renderbarndt


Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 17:25:59 
Subject: Re: Dupes
From:    Tick@confusa.catt.ncsu.edu (Tyler Lund)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi RobSampson, on Oct 21 you wrote:

> Is anyone else getting allot of duplicate message traffic?
> 

      YES! I've gotten 5 or 6 copies of some messages.

--------------------------------------------------------,  
      ///  Tyler Lund                                  / Check out my web page
     ///  Tick@confusa.catt.ncsu.edu                  / for keen Tick and 
 \\\///  http://www.catt.ncsu.edu/~tick/index.html   / Babylon 5 Stuff!!  
  \\\/  Amiga 3000/25                               /
---------------------------------------------------'



Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 17:30:16 
Subject: SGI machines: Win-Imagine follow-up
From:    weiss@epx.cis.umn.edu


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At some point in the past, Sharky declared that:
> > 
> 
> Yikes....SGI INDY for $5,000?  basically you are talking a box 
> with nothing on it. Not even a monitor.  Try at least $10,000 for 
> anything that'll do a mediocre job, $18,000 for one that has a proper 
> configuration (ie. 24bit instead of 8-bit graphics, 64MB RAM, 17" 
> Monitor, accelerated graphics etc.) I looked at an SGI Indy web force 
> setup for my webwork, and graphics, but it was just too pricey in any 
> preferred configuration.
> 
> If you can afford that much machine, I probably would look at more SGI
> specific software, since if you are spending that much on the machine, you
> should consider buying software that really screams on it. Just my 
> opinion though....:-)

The cheapest Indy is a Challenge S server, no graphics board, and will cost
about $9k with educational discount. My recollection is that the
Indy (Challenge S with blah graphics, no 2nd ethernet,no fast&wide SCSI)
will be minimun $15k. And while a base Indy will run all of the Wavefron/Alias 
stuff, Open Inventor, Performer, i3dm, it lacks the accelerated hardware
of its big brothers and can be very painful to use with richly texture-mapped
scenes that heaven forbid--move! I was surprised. But not all SGI boxes
have geometry/reality engines or whatever they're called today.

Perhaps $35k is the minimum for a graphics-munching SGI.
I've seen an Onyx at the local SGI office. Absolutely incredible.
About $500,00 fully loaded? I can't remember.

jeff

> 
> Aloha,
>     Sharky
> 

:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
jeff weiss  weiss@epx.cis.umn.edu  TCP/IP 44.94.249.101 N0IRR  612.825.4746 H  
::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::

Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 17:52:35 
Subject: Re: Decals on Glass
From:    sgiff@airmail.net (Stephen Gifford)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


>And of course, since Imagine converts everything to 24-bit once loaded 
>into memory, you can do what I've always advocated, and take full 
>advantage of that "feature" by creating your maps as super high-res, 
>then shrink (with anti-aliasing) them down to the resolution you feel is 
>reasonable for your project. They won't take up any more memory, but 
>they'll look soooo much smoother!
>
Or you can use photoshop and and create your maps with Illustrator or Corel
and export them as Adobe Illustrator format, and bring them into PhotoShop
and Photoshop will antialias your vector art beautifully.

s.g.


Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 18:16:08 
Subject: Global Genlock Button...
From:    "Alex..." <A.Craig@dcs.warwick.ac.uk>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi all,

call me stupid, but I had the chance to play on Imagine 3 the other day, and
noticed that the "Genlock Background" button was missing from the Globals
info in the Action Editor...  Am I just being blind or has it really gone?

Cheers,
      Alex...

%---- \|/ ------------------ #include <.siggy.h> --------------------------%
%    (o o)       eezer@dcs.warwick.ac.uk    "Real men do it with a Z3 BLT" %
%-oOO-(_)-OOo---- Parallel Systems Group ---- University of Warwick, UK ---%

Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 18:34:54 
Subject: Re: Making a Sofa
From:    Kent Marshall Worley <mumu@america.net>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Wed, 18 Oct 1995 S.A.Jalim@exeter.ac.uk wrote:

> HI all
> 
> I`m currently building my front room and would like to hear any suggestions
> as to how to make reslistic "soft" and slightly rounded at the edges cushions
> to go on a sofa.
> 
> I am trying to use the spline editor to make a top view of a square shaped one

> and then I extrude and round bevel it on both the front and back faces, but
> then it looks too uniform, if you see what I mean.
> 
> Any suggestions as to a better way to make `em?
> 
> thanks
> 
> steve
> 
> ______________________________________________________________________________

> | Steve Jalim -> ge94saj@ex.ac.uk | http://www.ex.ac.uk/~ge94saj/steve1.html |

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------

> 
try experimenting with the fakely texture. It seems to give a soft 
roundness to sharp edges. It may not be right for a close up of the sofa 
but if viewed from a distance it could work.
   mumu@america.net 

Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 20:05:33 
Subject: Re:4.0 delay
From:    Granberg Tom <tom.granberg@TV2.no>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Doh......
I shouldnt have mailed that info.
I think they do have backups, but you still got to get a replacement. And get it
 
going again. And who knows what data that went belly up since the backup? Give 
'em some slack will ya'
The spline editor is still the same as far as I know.

Later...

Renderbrandt


Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 20:22:16 
Subject: Re: Win-Imagine
From:    sgiff@airmail.net (Stephen Gifford)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

>Well there was some good information there and one of the reasons I wanted to
>bring the subject up.  But I guess the basic essential of the question
>remains.  Where do we go after Pentium?  You mention that an Indy really
>meant to work with graphics is closer to $18k and that is out of the question
>even for most professionals without a large company.  My P90 leaves me
>impatient and a P133 won't really help much.  What is your opinion?  Maybe
>the PPC machine coming from IBM?
>
>Bob............
>
Well, if Apple is smart and wants to save itself it will have written NT
compatibility into its PowerePC chip or IBM has come out with a ri Power PC
chip that runs NT or one of the clone chip makers start making a PowerPC
that runs NT.  Everyone I've read says All windows users are moving towards
the NT environment anyway.  Most of the big 3D co's are developing for NT.
I do not have any worries about the future of Intel.  I will move to what
ever platform gives me the best performance/price ratio, although I hate to
picture myself owning anything with an Apple logo on it, mainly because of
Apples attitude and the attitude of it's tree hugger users.

Stephen G.


Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 20:32:37 
Subject: Just a tought about SGI-Indy
From:    Granberg Tom <tom.granberg@TV2.no>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

HI

I have tried a Indy once, and work with Crimson & Onyx's and know their power 
toward rendering and such. But even if the indy can outclass a pentium you will 

have to look at two other aspects.
1. The very hefty price tag on SGI software, it is hart stopping!!
2. What will happen when other machines catch up(pc's,macs,amiga?)

The SGI boxes is and will be for the time being a toy for the people who realy 
need the fire power and can afford the machines and the software such as 
Sodtimage, Alias/Wavefront, etc.

Just a tought

Later

Tom Renderbrandt

Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 20:35:40 
Subject: Re: Win-Imagine
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-23 15:57:14 EDT, you write:

>If you can afford that much machine, I probably would look at more SGI
>specific software, since if you are spending that much on the machine, you
>should consider buying software that really screams on it. Just my 
>opinion though....:-)
>
>Aloha,
>     Sharky

Well there was some good information there and one of the reasons I wanted to
bring the subject up.  But I guess the basic essential of the question
remains.  Where do we go after Pentium?  You mention that an Indy really
meant to work with graphics is closer to $18k and that is out of the question
even for most professionals without a large company.  My P90 leaves me
impatient and a P133 won't really help much.  What is your opinion?  Maybe
the PPC machine coming from IBM?

Bob............


Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 20:47:59 
Subject: Re: Apologies and a question
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-23 16:10:21 EDT, you write:

>FIrst of all I'd like to apologize to everyone for starting that INDY 
>thread.  I'm praying it doesn't turn into a platform debate.  When I get 
>all the info I can, I'll send to those who requested it.  OK?
>
>Now for an IMAGINE (!) question.  I'm using 3.0 and am about to upgrade 
>to 4.0.  Now, I thought that even in 3.0 you could see a backdrop picture 
>through transparent ojects.  A render proved me wrong, so when was this 
>fixed?  Or has it been fixed yet?  All I get in my tranparent objects is 
>the color set in the globals, not the backdrop picture.
>
>nik

I'm not sure which version fixed it but I know it works now.  Glass ect will
show the backdrop picture thru it.  I've utilized it many times when tracing.
 As for the Indy platform thing, I'm not sure there is a war or anything
going on.  But a debate on hardware is probably relevant to the software we
are using.  



Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 21:42:40 
Subject: SHARKY
From:    Granberg Tom <tom.granberg@TV2.no>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi.
I've tried to reach you at this adress, no dice: sharky@websharx.com
So what's up, doc?  Miss you very much!!

Tom Renderbrandt


Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 21:44:37 
Subject: New space station
From:    Vance Schowalter <viking@freenet.edmonton.ab.ca>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I'm working on a big(!!!) space station and I plan to put it up on AmiNet 
when finished. Actually this station is more mobile than the Babylon 5 
station. Instead of using jumpgates (in case of emergency), this station 
uses massive gravity drivers to move. Ok, ok, it's more of an 
intersteller ship than a station, but I'll leave its use up to other 
Imagine users.

I also plan to include a projectile probe with the station. One thing is 
missing, however. The station needs a name. I thought of perhaps, C.S.A. 
TITAN or C.S.A. ARGO. Any other suggestions?

*******************************************
*    Vance Schowalter >>Image Master<<    *
*                                         *
* Internet: viking@freenet.edmonton.ab.ca *
*                                         *
*     "Affable little snow creature."     *
*******************************************


Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 22:05:15 
Subject: Silicon Graphics
From:    Brian V Salisbury <bvs@viewpoint.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

On Oct 22,  2:19pm, David Alan Steiger wrote:
>
> One caveat about the Indy.  It was designed more for 2d rather than 3d tasks.
 I'm
> not sure, but I wouldn't be surprised if high-end PC's do alt least match, if
not
> outclass the Indy.
>
> Also, although its $5k, its a Siicon Graphics machine, and any support
hardware
> I'm sure would carry a heftier price than PC hardware.

> Dave
>-- End of excerpt from David Alan Steiger
--------------------------------------------------------
Actually, Indys are built for 3d. I work on one every day as a full time 3d
modeler. They have 3d hardware built in that blows away any standard pc. I
believe that this will change in the future, however as more and more 3d
graphics cards for the pc are released.

To get a decent Indy, you are looking at closer to $15,000 than $5,000, by
the time you have adequate ram, disk space and display options.

Then of course, there is the high price in sgi software.





-- 
Brian Salisbury 
bs@viewpoint.com
(801)229-3053

"If you go flying back through time and you see somebody else flying
forward into the future, it's probably best to avoid eye contact."


Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 23:12:16 
Subject: Apologies and a question
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Curcio Nicholas <curcion@db.erau.edu>
> 
> Now for an IMAGINE (!) question.  I'm using 3.0 and am about to upgrade
> to 4.0.  Now, I thought that even in 3.0 you could see a backdrop picture
> through transparent ojects.  A render proved me wrong, so when was this
> fixed?  Or has it been fixed yet?  All I get in my tranparent objects is
> the color set in the globals, not the backdrop picture. 

3.0 had some transparency problems, which were fixed in 3.1, I believe.



Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 23:15:08 
Subject: Re:cube
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: augioh4b@ibmmail.com
> 
> Just replying to the problem of creating a cube, I use to create
> a cube/rectangular prism with the primitive cylinder, with the
> following options ... sections=4 (ie 4 sides viewed from top),
> height=whatever height you need, closed top and bottom, segments=1
> and turn off stagger points.

Agreed, and that's a good solution. What I didn't like about it, was 
that you had to specify 1.414 * the desired cube side length, as the 
cylinder radius. I guess, looking back, I could've gotten used to this 
method, automatically entering 141.414 every time I created the "cylinder."

Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 23:17:40 
Subject: Re: idea ...
From:    Gerard Menendez <gpm@netcom.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Sun, 22 Oct 1995, Charles Blaquiere wrote:

> One thing I've always wished for: a Cube primitive. I would venture a 
> guess that this button, if added, would be the most-frequently used 
> primitive. I know you can add a plane, extrude it, and recenter the 
> axis, but...
> 
> 

I've always found a tube with four segments has better keystroke 
economy.  It would be nice to get right to the tube or cube with a button 
though.  Maybe put "Add" items options right on the first menu so you got 
all the way down to the type of primitive before you faced a requester.  
This is pretty low on my priorities since cubes and rects are fairly 
simple already.

If I'm using a large number of them, and I'm working with meters, 
I'll add a cube of one scale unit (if it's 1000 imagine units to the meter, 
a 1000 unit cube) and then making a box of any dimension is an easy copy 
paste and transform. 


Gerard


Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 23:23:19 
Subject: Global Genlock Button...
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Alex... <A.Craig@dcs.warwick.ac.uk>
> 
> call me stupid, but I had the chance to play on Imagine 3 the other day,
> and noticed that the "Genlock Background" button was missing from the
> Globals info in the Action Editor...  Am I just being blind or has it
> really gone? 

No, you're right. It's gone. And I can't recall anyone ever working 
around it.


Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 23:29:51 
Subject: Re: Imagine Glows
From:    Charles Blaquiere <blaq@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> From: Roger Straub <straub@csn.net>
> 
> > I have'nt persisted with Haze because of another drawback. If you have
> > anti-aliasing set to a reasonable level the base haze colour is changed
> > when mixed with other object or background colours and you lose the 
> > effect.
> 
> Not in my experience. From what I can tell, the Haze FX looks in the 

[...]

> So anti-aliasing shouldn't matter, so long as your FX radius is greater
> than the number of pixels across that the AA uses. 

Ummm, not quite true, Roger. For example, imagine a scene where Haze is
keyed off purple. If you have small details, say a purple tentacle only 2
pixels wide, both pixels will likely be anti-aliased with their
neighbors, and that area will show no Haze effect whatsoever, because
there is no purple to key off of. I agree with your point that these
pixels would still end up covered by part of the haze generated by nearby
purple pixels, but my point is that part of the effect will still be 
missing: smaller details will not generate any haze. Doing the haze, 
glow, or neon effect in post-processing, the way I envision it, would 
take into account all parts of objects you wish to be glowing, even 
those that are sub-pixel-sized, semi-transparent, or half-obscured by 
semi-transparent objects. A much more refined glow, if you will.



Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 23:32:05 
Subject: Decals on Glass
From:    NEWKIRK@delphi.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Further refinement:  make the bottle the color of the logo, and use just
the transparency map to "cut away" the non-logo portion of the bottle.
BTW, try using Cylindrical mapping for an easier time, just leave about
1/3 to 2/5 of the screen blank on either side of the logo, or, for a 
"proper" coke bottle, put the COKE logo in one half of the map, the
COCA-COLA logo in the other half, leaving a good amount of spacing.
(left space plus right space should equal center space for proper placement)
JN
____________________________________________
|                                          |
|        COKE             COCA-COLA        |
|__________________________________________|
8^)

Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 23:39:19 
Subject: Re: CUBE and other user-defined primitives
From:    NEWKIRK@delphi.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Here's a wish:  how about having spaces in the primitive requester for
a limited number of user-defined objects?  Pull up a Prim (hot-key or
button, of course) and select "CUBE" "ASTEROID" or whatever else you happen
to use frequently.  Maybe even save the UserPrimList for each project.
As a semi-workable alternative, have an assigned directory "PRIMS" and store
frequently used primitives there.  I've done that, plus assigns for "OBJECTS" 
(general catch-all) and "WRAPS". (now, if I could just get MagicFileRequester
or some such to patch into imagine... 8^(  )
Joel

Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 23:45:18 
Subject: Multi object formats (from Tree Factory message)
From:    NEWKIRK@delphi.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Just had a brainstorm. (have to clean up later) 
AutoPEG (sorry, I know it's Amiga, but that's what I have so that's where
my thoughts usually reside) patches in and waits for Imagine to try loading
a JPEG, then decompresses to IFF24 and redirects Imagine there.  Maybe the
same technique (probably even half or more of the source code) could be
used to patch in other object formats.  There are plenty of object-format
converters out there, Command Line controlled, maybe it could call one
of them, or even have conversion routines built-in, and do conversions
"on-the-fly" to TDDD... have to see if John Corigliano (AutoPEG) would
consider letting me play with his source code, maybe I could patch something
together...
Joel

Date:    Monday, 23 October 1995 23:56:14 
Subject: Re: Win-Imagine
From:    Falko@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

RobSampson@aol.com

In a message dated 95-10-22 12:27:04 EDT, you write:

> I guess I'm just wondering where
>the hardware is going since it is critical to operation of a rendering
>program and I'm already not happy with the speed of my P90 with 40 meg of
>ram.  I'm fairly certain I will not make the investment in a P6 so where do
>we go from here?

Let me make this also clear. The performance gains for applications and OS
written to take advantage of the P6 (also known as the Pentium Pro (r)) can
be substantial. The performance bottleneck for Intel currently lies not with
the hardware but the software. Once the Pentium Pro is an established
platform this will correct itself. If you remember back in the days when a
FPU chip was optional and cost $500+ Autocad didn't require it and using one
only got you modest performance gains. Now that Intel has quit messing around
and EVERY CPU chip has an onboard FPU many vendors are setting that beautiful
little FPU flag on their compilers. Same thing will happen with the Pentium
Pro. By the way, the Pentium Pro's FPU is as far beyond the the Pentium's as
the Pentium,s was beyond the 386/486 FPU. The only thing that made the 486
FPU outperform the 386/387 was that it was close-coupled (read on-chip). For
software and OS that know about the Pentium Pro's on-chip, write-back L1
cache and close-coupled (almost on-chip), write back L2 cache, enhanced
pipelining, out-of-order processing, and risc-like FPU performance, plus
enhancements that make SMP really inexpensive, WOW!! 

Now, on the other hand, if I could get all my favorite apps and utils in
WinNT/ALPHA form, I'd probably leave the old X86 right away. Can you Imagine
(pun intended) a ALPHA with 16 21264/300mhz cpus, 1gb ram, 1 terrabyte of
raid hard disk array, laboratory grade projection monitor system with 100+
inches of display (custom made wall you know).....  Hey!!! That's MY dream
and I can dream it MY way!!! <g>

Falko

Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 00:59:31 
Subject: Mathematically defined objects, etc
From:    NEWKIRK@delphi.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

For the Amiga, there's DUST, which allows all sorts of mathematically,
procedural, ly, and loop defined objects, including particle systems.
Don't know whats out on the PC side similar, but maybe DUST is or will
be.  I haven't registered DUST yet, so I don't do much with it, but it
looks to have some fantastic potential.  It's basically a 3D object
definition language, complete with object view windows and such.
With multi-tasking capability under AmigaDOS and Windows, run it together
with Imagine, and just use it as another editor screen.
Joel

Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 01:05:48 
Subject: Gadgets and Function Keys
From:    NEWKIRK@delphi.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Here's a question.  What do you think is your most used, custom (user)
defined gadget or function key?
For me, function key would be F1=PICK Select (since there's no requester
associated with the function, I've found it easier to have it on a key
than a button)
fav button would be Sphere and PRIM in detail, and TFORM, Light and Axis
in stage.
(TFORM and MOLD in detail too)
Joel

Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 02:30:52 
Subject: Idea^2....
From:    cv773@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Matthew C. Polak)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Roger Straub writes:
How about Imagine's own programming language for macros? That way, any
mathematically-definable object could be generated - even arrays of
objects! Easy DNA strands, dodecahedrons, the possibilities are endless!
------------------------------------------------------------------------
I think this could be a VERY useful feature, but might be hard for
Impulse to implement. If they could do this, it would also be REALLY
neat if they could provide us with a 'prog. language' for the FX in the
program! Hey, if you don't happen to have the right polgon-manipulation
effect you need, write one!! (Hey...maybe then we could pretend that ALL
of us have $15K Indys or $500,000 Onyxs, with the $20k programs that
do this sort of stuff! :-) ) Excuse my overexcitement, but I feel this
type of feature would greatly benefit lots of people doing animation.
(Or am I the only one?)
ALSO -- Thanks A LOT for the responses I got about the I-128! I've
haven't gotten a chance to mail a few people back about some UNIVESA/
UNIVBE issues we were discussing (namely because I've been busy and am
STILL trying to sort all the mail out of my box), but I would like to
pull together a few people who are now using or are thinking of buying
#9 products like the Imagine. Anyone interested, please E-mail me
personally (as not to waste precious bandwidth)
Okay, well...Good luck!
Happy rendering!
(BTW - Just call me 'Matt' The system I'm using prefers full names and
middle initials and stuff like that! I'm really an informal type of guy!) B-)

Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 02:38:06 
Subject: IML Focus, Spline Editor
From:    Mtucibat@cris.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

On 10-22, Charles Blaquiere wrote:

B> > From: Stephen Gifford <sgiff@airmail.net>
B> > 
B> > It would seem to me that Impulse would benefit greatly by putting up a
B> > Web Page at this point.
B> 
B> You'll be happy to hear that Impulse will do just that, once all that 
B> 4.0 work is done. Mike is looking forward to a more civilized forum, 
B> akin to what the IML used to be.
============

        Yes.  I've been wondering recently if there would be any interest
        or time to start a version of the IML that's moderated.  I think
        that would help focus the list a bit.  There are lots of places
        to get discussions of platform, OS, CPU, and all the other stuff
        that's been in the IML lately.  The IML was a special place to 
        discuss Imagine, and I very much appreciated that.  

        At least, if non-Imagine stuff just must be posted, maybe we could 
        add something Imagine-specific to the post.

        OBIB (Obligatory Imagine Bit):
        The controls in the Spline Editor are very useful, but the 
        Mode/Pick Method/Lock menu item doesn't appear to do anything. 
        If it was analagous to Lock in Detail, it should snap knots 
        to grid when in Knot Control mode, which would be very handy.
        Has anybody found this to do anything?

        -mikeT


* Offline Orbit 1.0a * ...Amiga: Designed to break the laws of physics...



Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 03:00:43 
Subject: 3ds to Imagine format
From:    expgxs@cascade.santos.com.au (Greg Searle)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


  Greetings all.

 Duncan asked

>So i was wondering if you new of something (amiga) that will convert
>3ds to a format that pix pro/imagine will handle ?

  Unfortunately no. I wish there was other than the new Pixel pro version.
$260 is what I have to spend to get this new version. Quite a bit of money
since I have other priorities. I was hoping something on the PC side would
be able to at least convert from 3ds to DXF file format. There is however a
conversion program listed at the avalon site for TDDD conversions. I'm going
to look into it soon to see what it is all about. I want to get at some of
these 3ds objects.

  Thanks for the info on the tomahawk site address. I'm going to visit it and
see what is there.

  GREG SEARLE

So many worlds. So much to do. So little done. Such things to be.

Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 04:20:54 
Subject: Re: Silicon Graphics
From:    Catherine A Tromanhauser <ctromanh@uoguelph.ca>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Mon, 23 Oct 1995, Brian V Salisbury wrote:

> Actually, Indys are built for 3d. I work on one every day as a full time 3d
> modeler. They have 3d hardware built in that blows away any standard pc. I
> believe that this will change in the future, however as more and more 3d
> graphics cards for the pc are released.
> 
> To get a decent Indy, you are looking at closer to $15,000 than $5,000, by
> the time you have adequate ram, disk space and display options.
> 
> Then of course, there is the high price in sgi software.
> 
Keep in mind though with the price tag of the Indy considerably lower than 
it's older siblings new software developers are entering the market 
with lower priced titles like Lightwave for $800 which should start to 
force original developers to compete.  As far as speed goes the standard 
R4000 CPUs run at 100mhz through a 64bit GIO bus system and SGI claims it 
has the fast 2-D performance in the world.  And the CPU and graphic cards 
can be upgraded should the need arise.  Just a couple more cents.

I felt the need to defend SGI from the negative talk.  I get my Indy on 
Nov. 4th.

Sully


Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 07:49:25 
Subject: Re: Silicon Graphics
From:    George Lane <glane@qualcomm.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


On Tue, 24 Oct 1995, Catherine A Tromanhauser wrote:

> Keep in mind though with the price tag of the Indy considerably lower than 
> it's older siblings new software developers are entering the market 
> with lower priced titles like Lightwave for $800 which should start to 

That's for PCs. Lightwave for SGI is $2K. Twice the cost for the same 
product.

> I felt the need to defend SGI from the negative talk.  I get my Indy on 
> Nov. 4th.

Congratulations. Just remember SGI software cost more. Now can we get 
back to Imagine?

George


Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 08:47:00 
Subject: Deja Vu!
From:    "Dan.Maclean" <MACLEDJ@pmitao.usa.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I'm getting sick of all this duplicate traffic!!  I must have read that
Message from the OS/2 guy five times!  I'm surprized my administrator hasn't
called complaining about my mailbox account being 603% of maximum.
 
From: Dan MacLean


Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 09:32:05 
Subject: Re: Tree Factory
From:    Ted Stethem <tstethem@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

On Mon, 23 Oct 1995 RobSampson@aol.com wrote:

> I've been looking at the demo for this program and it seems quite nice but it
> will not export any models in the demo version (a reasonable precaution).
>  Since it will only export to raw, dxf and lwo I was wondering if anyone has
> used a registered version of this program and brought models into Imagine.
> 
  There is a demo tree in .DXF format at the Tree Factory website. It 
imports into Imagine just fine (Imagine V3.1 and later).

Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 09:57:12 
Subject: Problems, my friends
From:    S.A.Jalim@exeter.ac.uk


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hello there,

Given the very cool responses to my last plea for help, here`s another poser:

I am running 3.3 on my 6meg/15megVMM 3000 and i`m building a living room scene
(yeah.. the one with that sofa) and the thing is that I have got to a stage
when I load objects in, and they appear in wireframe persp., but when scanlining

or tracing the scene, these objects (a picture and a coffee table) just don`t
render. (they do, however, show up during an colour shade render)

Is that the product of some memory limitation? My Virtual Memory comes from
VMM3.1.. does anyone here use that too? has anyone had any similar problems?

Also... sometimes I load an object in to teh stage editor, scale it and then
save changes, but the program seems to forget this and renders the scene with 
the object in question just as it was made in teh detail editor.

Can anyone help?? Please...


____Change of issue_____

I Feel the Need, The Need for Speed.
------------------------------------

What other alternatives are there to SGI? What about an Alpha DEC?  
There`s a company over here which sells them as NT servers for 7k UKP.
They claim that they are faster than Indys, 040 060 (obviously), the screamer
and that ShaBLAMM thingy (as far as i can remember). What`s more, there`s a
special version of LW for it, and that`s the same price as normal. Doesn`t 
that make more sense?

Hell.. what am i saying.. it`s not as if i`ll be able to afford one for years
yet is it??? (After all, for 15k you can buy a decent new car... how`s that
for putting the price of rendering beasts into perspective?)

anyway..

time to go

steve
______________________________________________________________________________
| Steve -> S.A.Jalim@ex.ac.uk | WWW http://www.ex.ac.uk/~ge94saj/steve1.html |
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

p.s. I want a cube primitive.. and maybe a flat disc one too (a cross between a
torus and a disc, if you see what i mean)

Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 11:10:05 
Subject: Favourite gadgets
From:    S.A.Jalim@exeter.ac.uk


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hiya all

Hmmm.. I use that f1 Pick Selected a lot too... esp. in the stage editor

I have set up buttons for wireframe, solid and newmode persp. views (does
anyone here actually use the shaded option?) as well as click, drag and lasso
(That`s a point.. how can i get the detail editor to start up with drag select
rather than click? is it possible?)

I like the fact that there`s a quickrender button available on 3.3 .. but does
that mean that ANY of the menu funtions are available thru buttons? (is this
a case of RTFM? i hope not... i left the manual at home when i came to uni)

there`s my bit for now.

bye

steve
______________________________________________________________________________
| Steve -> S.A.Jalim@ex.ac.uk | WWW http://www.ex.ac.uk/~ge94saj/steve1.html |
|----------------------------------------------------------------------------|
| Scully: Can you determine the cause of death?                              |
|           My instinct tells me that burial in cement is murder.            |
|____________________________________________________________________________|


Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 11:16:31 
Subject: Re: NON-DELIVERY of...
From:    cjo@esrange.ssc.se


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

>Anyone getting this message?   Why do the posts to the IML have to go=20
>through compuserve.com anyways.

Oh yes! Every darned time I post to the IML...

I tried to tell Dave W about it, but so far nothing has happened.

:-(

*---------------------------------------------------------------*
|   Conny Joensson   |   Swedish Space Corp. Esrange            |
|   Kiruna           |   Satellite operations - Telecom Div.    |
|   Sweden           |   cjo@smtpgw.esrange.ssc.se              |
*---------------------------------------------------------------*

Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 11:22:08 
Subject: Re: Shipping dates 4.0 (true!)
From:    cjo@esrange.ssc.se


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Tom "R" G wrote;

>I dont know WHEN it ships, but I know WHY it isnt shipping as planned.=20
>Want to know?....................ok, you are a patient group of people,=20
>arent you? Well here is the story.
>
>Last friday(I think) Scott(Impulse) mailed me and told me that, guess=20
>what?, his hard disc went to heaven without leaving a departure note, very=
=20
>uncool and sadistic of the HD I'd say. This is probably why it is delayed,=
=20
>and belive me this is no joke.

Well, you all know the story; TAKE BACKUPS!!

Not to save the data when your HD crashes, but to actually _prevent_=20
crashes. Once you have made backups you can be damned sure that the HD=20
won't crash on you.   ;-)

Speaking from experience...

*---------------------------------------------------------------*
|   Conny Joensson   |   Swedish Space Corp. Esrange            |
|   Kiruna           |   Satellite operations - Telecom Div.    |
|   Sweden           |   cjo@smtpgw.esrange.ssc.se              |
*---------------------------------------------------------------*

Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 11:44:12 
Subject: Re: idea ...
From:    cjo@esrange.ssc.se


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

>>One thing I've always wished for: a Cube primitive.

>Personally, I'd much prefer a Sharon Stone primitive. Cubes I have=20
>less trouble with... :)

Say what you wish about Sharon, but she is NOT primitive!    ;)

*---------------------------------------------------------------*
|   Conny Joensson   |   Swedish Space Corp. Esrange            |
|   Kiruna           |   Satellite operations - Telecom Div.    |
|   Sweden           |   cjo@smtpgw.esrange.ssc.se              |
*---------------------------------------------------------------*

Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 12:57:34 
Subject: Re: Multi object formats (from Tree Factory message)
From:    Curcio Nicholas <curcion@db.erau.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Mon, 23 Oct 1995 NEWKIRK@delphi.com wrote:

> Just had a brainstorm. (have to clean up later) 
> AutoPEG (sorry, I know it's Amiga, but that's what I have so that's where
> my thoughts usually reside) patches in and waits for Imagine to try loading
> a JPEG, then decompresses to IFF24 and redirects Imagine there.  Maybe the
> same technique (probably even half or more of the source code) could be
> used to patch in other object formats.  There are plenty of object-format
> converters out there, Command Line controlled, maybe it could call one
> of them, or even have conversion routines built-in, and do conversions
> "on-the-fly" to TDDD... have to see if John Corigliano (AutoPEG) would
> consider letting me play with his source code, maybe I could patch something
> together...
> Joel


How about a version of AutoPEG that uses datatypes???



Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 13:50:45 
Subject: Re: Win-Imagine
From:    Sharky <sharky@websharx.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Mon, 23 Oct 1995 RobSampson@aol.com wrote:

> In a message dated 95-10-23 15:57:14 EDT, you write:
> 
> >If you can afford that much machine, I probably would look at more SGI
> >specific software, since if you are spending that much on the machine, you
> >should consider buying software that really screams on it. Just my 
> >opinion though....:-)
> >
> >Aloha,
> >   Sharky
> 
> Well there was some good information there and one of the reasons I wanted to
> bring the subject up.  But I guess the basic essential of the question
> remains.  Where do we go after Pentium?  You mention that an Indy really
> meant to work with graphics is closer to $18k and that is out of the question
> even for most professionals without a large company.  My P90 leaves me
> impatient and a P133 won't really help much.  What is your opinion?  Maybe
> the PPC machine coming from IBM?

Hiya!

Well not sure where we go from here. But what's happened to me over the 
years is you wait for the price performance ratio to drop and your income 
to rise to the point that you can afford it.  I doubt that the IBM PPC is 
going to be a instant hit.  When I looked at the prices I figured I'd 
be better off picking up a dual-pentium machine, or a couple of separate 
pentiums for the same price and use one as a render machine.  At today's 
prices, for $18K you can easily buy a couple of pentiums and software. 
Maybe even toss in a notebook on the side.

Just my thoughts on it...I'd prefer to make do with what's available for 
now, until 3d graphics add-ons are more common (remember how uncommon 
SVGA and 24-bit color was on PC's not so long ago?) and integrated into 
mainstream software and/or the OS.

Aloha,
      Sharky

Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 13:50:51 
Subject: Favourite gadgets
From:    Mtucibat@cris.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

On 10-24, Steve Jalim wrote:

S> I like the fact that there`s a quickrender button available on 3.3 
S> .. but does that mean that ANY of the menu funtions are available
S>  thru buttons? (is this a case of RTFM? i hope not... i left the 
S> manual at home when i came to uni)
S> 
============
        Yes, 'tis true.  But fortunately this is one of the 
        (few) intuitive processes in Imagine.  Any menu item
        can be put on a user gadget, Fkey, or shift Fkey.

        The user gadgets are one of the big reasons to use a 
        full screen Imagine.  The extra space gives enough
        room for all the butons I need. :)

        -mikeT


* Offline Orbit 1.0a * ...Sleep is a poor substitute for Raytracing...


Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 14:15:17 
Subject: Re: SGI machines: Win-Imagine follow-up
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-23 21:22:47 EDT, you write:

>The cheapest Indy is a Challenge S server, no graphics board, and will cost
>about $9k with educational discount. My recollection is that the
>Indy (Challenge S with blah graphics, no 2nd ethernet,no fast&wide SCSI)
>will be minimun $15k. And while a base Indy will run all of the
>Wavefron/Alias 
>stuff, Open Inventor, Performer, i3dm, it lacks the accelerated hardware
>of its big brothers and can be very painful to use with richly
texture-mapped
>scenes that heaven forbid--move! I was surprised. But not all SGI boxes
>have geometry/reality engines or whatever they're called today.
>
>Perhaps $35k is the minimum for a graphics-munching SGI.
>I've seen an Onyx at the local SGI office
 
I've seen advertisements for a machine called the Modeler by SGI and they
seem to make it sound as though it were brought out to compete with the PC
platform.  Would something like this do a better job than say the upcoming P6
at running Imagine?


Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 14:15:25 
Subject: Re: Win-Imagine
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-23 23:55:35 EDT, you write:

>Well, if Apple is smart and wants to save itself it will have written NT
>compatibility into its PowerePC chip or IBM has come out with a ri Power PC
>chip that runs NT or one of the clone chip makers start making a PowerPC
>that runs NT.  Everyone I've read says All windows users are moving towards
>the NT environment anyway.  Most of the big 3D co's are developing for NT.
>I do not have any worries about the future of Intel.  I will move to what
>ever platform gives me the best performance/price ratio, although I hate to
>picture myself owning anything with an Apple logo on it, mainly because of
>Apples attitude and the attitude of it's tree hugger users.
>
>Stephen G.

Well if IBM brings on a PPC machine with NT and we get a dedicated NT version
of Imagine for it then the question is pretty much answered I suppose.  It
would probably be done in a price range that is very compatible with whatever
machine Intel was trying to stuff 18 million transistor chips into.  All we
need now is for IBM to bring it out and Impulse to compile an NT specific
version.  Well I guess we better wait for WinImagine first:)

Yeah, hug a tree, plant a spike, save an owl and kill a logger.  Are'nt
environmentalists great.

Bob...........



Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 14:25:47 
Subject: Re: problems, my friends
From:    cjo@esrange.ssc.se


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Steve Jalim wrote;,

>I am running 3.3 on my 6meg/15megVMM 3000 and ...
>... but when scanlining or tracing the scene, these objects (a picture and 
>a coffee table) just dont render. (they do, however, show up during an 
>colour shade render)
>
>Is that the product of some memory limitation? My Virtual Memory comes 
>from VMM3.1.. does anyone here use that too? has anyone had any similar 
>problems?

Could be. When you start to render the scene, switch to the WorkBench, 
click on that screen, and keep a close watch on the memory counter in the 
menu bar. If that comes anywhere near zero at any time your problem is most 
likely one of memory.

On the other hand, it _could_ be a virus...                    ;)

>Also... sometimes I load an object in to teh stage editor, scale it and 
>then save changes, but the program seems to forget this and renders the 
>scene with the object in question just as it was made in teh detail 
>editor.

Ahh, now this is more simple to answer.
Once you have scaled your object in the stage editor do "size bar" before 
you save changes.

>p.s. I want a cube primitive.. and maybe a flat disc one too (a cross 
>between a torus and a disc, if you see what i mean)

Yepp. I see what you mean. And I have done such objects lots of times.
Create a cone with 2 vertical sections and size it to 0 in Z.
Go to pick points, pick the point in the middle and delete it.   Voila!
If you want a thinner ring you can create the "cone" with more vertical 
sections and use "pick method: lasso" to delete all the inner points.

*---------------------------------------------------------------*
|   Conny Joensson   |   Swedish Space Corp. Esrange            |
|   Kiruna           |   Satellite operations - Telecom Div.    |
|   Sweden           |   cjo@smtpgw.esrange.ssc.se              |
*---------------------------------------------------------------*

Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 15:15:35 
Subject: Re: 3ds to Imagine format
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-24 02:18:19 EDT, you write:

> Unfortunately no. I wish there was other than the new Pixel pro version.
>$260 is what I have to spend to get this new version. Quite a bit of money
>since I have other priorities. I was hoping something on the PC side would
>be able to at least convert from 3ds to DXF file format. There is however a
>conversion program listed at the avalon site for TDDD conversions. I'm going
>to look into it soon to see what it is all about. I want to get at some of
>these 3ds objects.
>
>  Thanks for the info on the tomahawk site address. I'm going to visit it
and
>see what is there.
>
>  GREG SEARLE
>
>So many worlds. So much to do. So little done. Such things to be.

Andrey Zmievskiy wrote a program called 3DS2Im which is excellent for
importing 3DS objects into Imagine.  The shareware version had a limitation
of 25 objects but it was more than adequate enough to evaluate it's
effectiveness.  I registered it and so I can't uue you the shareware version,
I no longer have it but I have imported objects of 2.5 meg with about 65
objects in them and it performed flawlessly.  Once you had them in Imagine
you could export to DXF as your post says if that is what you really wanted
to do.  Andrey only wants like $15 for registration.  Someone on the IML may
have the shareware version and could send it to you.  

Bob............



Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 15:22:50 
Subject: PAL resolution; was: Re: PAR settings
From:    "Frank.VanDerAuwera" <fvdauwer@uia.ua.ac.be>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In case some might wonder what the "official" resolution is for a PAL 
full overscan video signal: it's 768x576

Frank Van der Auwera
University of Antwerp 

fvdauwer@uia.ac.be

On Mon, 23 Oct 1995, Bill Boyce wrote:

> At 01:54 AM 19/10/95 -0400, you wrote:
> >I wrote the original letter about the PAR resolution settings, specifically
> >that I was using 680x440 instead of the "recommended" 752x480. I neglected to

> >mention that I was using an aspect ratio of 1/1. I believe I tried 6/7 and
> >things looked squished. 
> >
> >>Jim Rix wrote: 
> >>The 752x480 resolution is the dimensions for standard OVERSCAN NTSC 
> >>video.  This resolution is very useful when projects from a video 
> >>projector and you want as much pictures as possible
SNIP> >

Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 15:34:00 
Subject: Decals on Glass
From:    mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com (Mike Vandersommen)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

-> From: rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au (Robert Byrne)-> > One little thing you have 
to remember. You must scale down the-> > Y axis of the map or else you'll get a 
duplicate map on the-> > back side of the glass or bottle object.->-> You can ma
ke a face subgroup and restrict the maps to it.Thank you! Good idea.ps. Interest
ing side note. You get 40% more tips on the IML if    you instruct a "wrong" tec
hique than if you ask "how do I    do this?"  <THANKS FOR ALL THE TIPS, GUYS) <g
rin>   /------------------------------           ___   ___  ___   ___  | Mike va
n der Sommen                     / __  /__/ /__/  /_   \ /  | Santa Barbara, Ca.
                     /___/ / \  /  /  /     / \  | mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.si
lcom.com     HAUS BBS (805-683-1388)  |           "Blackouts make for nice break
s in the day"   \_____________________________________________________________--
- =FE InterNet - GraFX Haus BBS - Santa Barbara, Ca - (805) 683-1388

Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 18:19:25 
Subject: Information
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

If someone on this list is also using Lightwave for PC under win95 could you
please contact me privately.

Bob.............

Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 18:37:03 
Subject: Re: problems, my friends
From:    beeton@SEDSystems.ca (Gary Beeton - SED Systems)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

>I am running 3.3 on my 6meg/15megVMM 3000 and i`m building a living room scene
>(yeah.. the one with that sofa) and the thing is that I have got to a stage
>when I load objects in, and they appear in wireframe persp., but when scanlinin
g
>or tracing the scene, these objects (a picture and a coffee table) just don`t
>render. (they do, however, show up during an colour shade render)
>
>Is that the product of some memory limitation? My Virtual Memory comes from
>VMM3.1.. does anyone here use that too? has anyone had any similar problems?

I use VMM on my A4000 with Imagine without problem.  You may not
have VMM configured properly (I can't help you there at the moment
'cause my Amiga is not handy).  The author of VMM is *very* good at
helping out - just drop him an email.

BTW, I beleive there is a newer version of VMM available on aminet.


Gary
beeton@SEDSystems.ca

Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 19:58:23 
Subject: Re:carX12..calling carX12
From:    Rick Dolishny <dolish@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I checked out Sharky's page and found your area... but I could not see 
or download the pix.

I'm using an Amiga and no Netscape browser. I just want to download the 
pix... espcially this car everyone is raving about. Any suggestions?



Rick Dolishny          dolish@io.org
Ardee Productions - Toronto, Ontario


Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 20:05:19 
Subject: Re: Tom's pics
From:    Rick Dolishny <dolish@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I just sent a letter to Tom G., and then this message below! How topical!

I too am using an Amiga without Netscape, and I'd love to see these 
images. I would suggest you offer your site guests an option to download 
the images if my 'terminal can't support graphics' like some other 
sites. That's just my suggestion, though. Thanks for all you effort so 
far, though. Your site came highly recommended, and I can see why 
(except for the graphics!).

In the mean time, I'd appreciate this X12 car everyone is raving about!

-Rick

> > 
> > I dont use Netscape so I would like to know of a site other than Sharky's.
> > 
> 
> 
> Howzit! 
> 
> If there is enough interest (and if Captain Video and Ranger Tom don't 
> mind) I can make symbolic links to the images in the websharx FTP 
> directory. If there isn't, shoot me some e-mail and I can send them to 
> you via mail attachment.
> 
> Aloha,
>     Sharky
> 

Rick Dolishny          dolish@io.org
Ardee Productions - Toronto, Ontario


Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 20:19:38 
Subject: Re: Particles+Texture problem
From:    Rick Dolishny <dolish@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

You were asking about shattering a brick wall.

Two problems, maybe solutions:

1) You did the right thing by creating a default state called "default". 
Create an additional state: "unbroken". Lock to state "default".

2) Try using Shatter FX instead of Particle. I think I read something 
about this FX being better at maintainting brushes.

Good luck.



Rick Dolishny          dolish@io.org
Ardee Productions - Toronto, Ontario


Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 20:25:02 
Subject: Imagine L/T; now that I have it
From:    weiss@epx.cis.umn.edu


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I am the proud registered user of L/T, now, but am confused over a few issues.
When I dropped into Impulse I was told that L/T is really an enhanced
version of 2.0, not a chopped version of 3.0.

But the manual they supplied was a 3.0 manual!?

I am wondering what features besides the cycle editor do not work in L/T,
and what I should be aware of before even trying slick features which may
be buggy in L/T. I guess the unsupported features that I try from the 3.0
manual will be obvious right away!

Some condemn the forms editor as far too tedious to use: is there an
alternative, other than upgrading to 4.0?

Thanks!

jeff weiss

:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
jeff weiss  weiss@epx.cis.umn.edu  TCP/IP 44.94.249.101 N0IRR  612.825.4746 H  
::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::

Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 20:30:26 
Subject: Re: The glow issue . . .
From:    Rick Dolishny <dolish@io.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

There are two ways to get really nice glows in Imagine. I'm doing a 
roller coaster ride right now that makes heavy use of oil candles and 
soft light casting shadows over the rocks of my tunnel ride... ah, the 
romance:

1) Add a light in Imagine Stage. "T" to transform the Axis. Make the
   size much larger than the default. I think it's 32... make it 200 or
   even more. In the Stage, Add the Lensflare Global FX. Render!

   This has always been in Imagine, but the default size is just too
   small! PS: don't scale the light; transform it using T or Stage.

2) For added effect (actually, in lieu of the FX if you're pressed for
   render time... but the two TOGETHER work great...) create a ball or
   tube around your light and make it Bright and Fogged. Render!

Beeee-utiful!


-Rick


On Thu, 19 Oct 1995 CoryJ44@aol.com wrote:

>    There seems to be a bit of a discrepancy here . . . some people are pretty
> convinced that Imagine needs dedicated "glow-support", while others say that
> glows are a simple feature to take advantage of in Imagine . . . if it's as
> easy as the latter group says, could some of you post some tips?  How can we
> make convincing neon or "warm" candle glows?  It's not that I don't believe
> you, I'd just like to know how the gurus do it.
> 
>                                               Cory
> 

Rick Dolishny          dolish@io.org
Ardee Productions - Toronto, Ontario


Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 20:37:43 
Subject: Re: Multi object formats (from Tree Factory message)
From:    Doug Smith <doug@defocus.demon.co.uk>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi NEWKIRK,

        You wrote this about Multi object formats (from Tree Factory message):
        
: Just had a brainstorm. (have to clean up later) AutoPEG (sorry, I know it's
: Amiga, but that's what I have so that's where my thoughts usually reside)
: patches in and waits for Imagine to try loading a JPEG, then decompresses
: to IFF24 and redirects Imagine there.  

: Maybe the same technique (probably
: even half or more of the source code) could be used to patch in other
: object formats.  There are plenty of object-format converters out there,
: Command Line controlled, maybe it could call one of them, or even have
: conversion routines built-in, and do conversions "on-the-fly" to TDDD...

It's a creditable idea, and while support for many object formats is a
"Good Thing"(tm) how often do you convert objects ?

How about this for a different twist to the idea.

One of the most requested enhancements for Imagine is to make it NOT load 
each object for every frame.

How about a background process that spotted imagine trying to open files, 
then redirected Imagine to a directory in RAM: sort of like an object cache.

Of course the process would have to check if the copy in RAM: was newer, but 
this isn't a problem.

: have to see if John Corigliano (AutoPEG) would consider letting me play
: with his source code, maybe I could patch something together... Joel
: 

Good Luck !


Cheers,

Doug.

--
Amiga 4000/40 2+12 2M CV64 - Not better, just different

D Haynie:"If you really grok the Amiga, Windows will make your head explode..."

Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 21:04:11 
Subject: Re: Win-Imagine
From:    Doug Smith <doug@defocus.demon.co.uk>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi Falko,

        You wrote this about Re: Win-Imagine:
: RobSampson@aol.com
: 
: In a message dated 95-10-22 12:27:04 EDT, you write:
: 
: > I guess I'm just wondering where
: >the hardware is going since it is critical to operation of a rendering
: >program and I'm already not happy with the speed of my P90 with 40 meg of
: >ram.  I'm fairly certain I will not make the investment in a P6 so where
: >do we go from here?
: 
: Let me make this also clear. The performance gains for applications and OS
: written to take advantage of the P6 (also known as the Pentium Pro (r)) can
: be substantial. The performance bottleneck for Intel currently lies not
: with the hardware but the software. Once the Pentium Pro is an established
: platform this will correct itself.

Can I just point out a couple of computer graphics axioms.

The hardware is never fast enough.
You always need 1.5x as much RAM as you presently have.
The project expands to use all the capacity of the machine.


Given that we're not going to see any scene with a reasonable level of 
complexity raytraced in real time in the immediate future, we're going 
to be stuck with fairly long waiting time for things to render.

I've been running an "Uptime" monitor over the last couple of months, and my
Amiga has managed about 40% usage.

This has recently peaked to just under 80% over the last week or two.
(I'm rounding up some half finished projects)

How do you folks manage ?

Is anyone out there organised enough to have their machine rendering or
modelling 100 % ?

Cheers,

Doug.

--
Amiga 4000/40 2+12 2M CV64 - Not better, just different.

Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 21:16:28 
Subject: Weird science
From:    augioh4b@ibmmail.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

--- Received from GITD.PSG024  2164526              25OCT95  11.16
  -> IBMMAIL.INTERNET      IBMMAIL
If anyone has the WEIRD SCIENCE double CD for Amiga please email
me personally.

My problem is this:
I am trying to read the Tutorials included in one of these disks
but only get mumbo jumbo out of it, which lead me to believe that
the docs were packed or saved some format other than straight
text.  The tutorial files all have the .PP extension, so I got
my dusty amiga 500 out and tried powerpack (v2.34) to unpack it
with no success.

Has anyone been able to successfully convert these files to
text,and if so please email me as to how it can be done. I have a
PC and a very old amiga 500 (1.3).

Thanks for your patience,
Vic Sarmiento

Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 21:46:37 
Subject: Re: idea^2....
From:    Doug Smith <doug@defocus.demon.co.uk>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi Matthew,

        You wrote this about idea^2....:

: Roger Straub writes:
: How about Imagine's own programming language for macros? That way, any
: mathematically-definable object could be generated - even arrays of
: objects! Easy DNA strands, dodecahedrons, the possibilities are endless!
: ------------------------------------------------------------------------
: I think this could be a VERY useful feature, but might be hard for
: Impulse to implement. If they could do this, it would also be REALLY
: neat if they could provide us with a 'prog. language' for the FX in the
: program! 
[snip]
: Excuse my overexcitement, but I feel this type of feature would greatly
: benefit lots of people doing animation. (Or am I the only one?)

The lack of any sort of macro facility is one of Imagine's greatest 
weaknesses.

A programming language would greatly enhance it's usability.

Even being able to bind multiple commands to one function key would be nice.

e.g how about one key to do,

Mode->PickGroups
Object->save

(ever made that mistake ?)

or 

Mode->PickGroups
Display->ZoomIn
escape
Mode->PickPoints

(One of my more common key sequences)

That sort of thing.

Of course a full ARexx port would be nice.


Cheers,

Doug.

--
Amiga 4000/40 2+12 2M CV64 - Not better, just different


Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 21:49:01 
Subject: Re: CUBE and other user-defined primitives
From:    Roger Straub <straub@csn.net>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Mon, 23 Oct 1995 NEWKIRK@delphi.com wrote:

> Here's a wish:  how about having spaces in the primitive requester for
> a limited number of user-defined objects?  Pull up a Prim (hot-key or
> button, of course) and select "CUBE" "ASTEROID" or whatever else you happen
> to use frequently.  Maybe even save the UserPrimList for each project.
> As a semi-workable alternative, have an assigned directory "PRIMS" and store
> frequently used primitives there.  I've done that, plus assigns for "OBJECTS" 


About this - If you had a Primitives directory, you wouldn't be able to 
modify the numbers for any of the extra primitives. Imagine, as it is 
now, uses mathematical equations to define all of its primitives; that's 
why you can specify how many vertical sections are in your sphere. If you 
just save out an object from Detail and have Imagine import it as a 
primitive, you can't modify any of those numbers.

Now, if Imagine had a programming language, you could program a RANDOMLY 
SHAPED asteroid, and have an unlimited number of options.

> Joel
> 

See ya,
      Roger

Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 21:53:14 
Subject: Re: Imagine Glows
From:    Roger Straub <straub@csn.net>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Mon, 23 Oct 1995, Charles Blaquiere wrote:

> 
> Ummm, not quite true, Roger. For example, imagine a scene where Haze is
> keyed off purple. If you have small details, say a purple tentacle only 2
> pixels wide, both pixels will likely be anti-aliased with their
> neighbors, and that area will show no Haze effect whatsoever, because
> there is no purple to key off of. I agree with your point that these
> pixels would still end up covered by part of the haze generated by nearby
> purple pixels, but my point is that part of the effect will still be 
> missing: smaller details will not generate any haze. Doing the haze, 
> glow, or neon effect in post-processing, the way I envision it, would 
> take into account all parts of objects you wish to be glowing, even 
> those that are sub-pixel-sized, semi-transparent, or half-obscured by 
> semi-transparent objects. A much more refined glow, if you will.
> 
> 
> 

Ok. I realize my mistake. I was thinking "big." And, since you put it 
that way, I totally agree with you. Perhaps have Imagine generate a 
fog-looking thing around bright objects. This, however would have to be 
an Actor FX, not a Global - The way I understand it, all Global effects 
are post-production thingies, only taking into account the final image 
and not the objects involved with the generation of those images. Actor 
effects work on the objects themselves.

See ya,
      Roger

Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 22:01:33 
Subject: Re: Favourite gadgets
From:    Roger Straub <straub@csn.net>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Tue, 24 Oct 1995 S.A.Jalim@exeter.ac.uk wrote:

> Hiya all
[snip]
> 
> I like the fact that there`s a quickrender button available on 3.3 .. but does

> that mean that ANY of the menu funtions are available thru buttons? (is this
> a case of RTFM? i hope not... i left the manual at home when i came to uni)
> 

Yes, you can. Go to the Preferences editor. Click on "User Gadgets." Pick 
the <new> space in the list. Give it a name and a comment. Then select 
the menu item you want from the menu. Click on save and use, and admire 
your new button. =)

> there`s my bit for now.
> 
> bye
> 
> steve

See ya,
      Roger

Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 22:21:16 
Subject: PD for PC?
From:    Mike McCool <mikemcoo@efn.org>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hey y'all, 

      Please excuse this nearly off-topic query,--but could someone 
give me an ftp or web site that's the equivalent of aminet, only for 
PC'ers?  

      I'm trying to get my brother into Imagine/LightWave, and I figure 
the easiest convincer would be to direct him to a site where he can nab 
some pix and perhaps get a taste of POV or something.  

      I know you Ibeamers have something like aminet, but I'm PC 
illiterate.  Please enlighten me, for the sake of my graphics-hungry 
brother? 

      Thanks a meg. 

Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 22:51:00 
Subject: Re: Win-Imagine
From:    Falko@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

RobSampson


>I guess the question would be how hard is it for people who are coding
 something like Imagine to come >up to speed on this.

Well, Mike told me early on to a question I posted here to the IML that
WinImagine would be written to the Microsoft Win32 spec. If they keep their
T's crossed and their I's dotted then P6 optimization will come primarily
from a good compiler. If they are writing to the MIcrosoft SDK then all
should be well, as this is C or C++. Again the compiler will do most of the
work of processor optimization.

Falko

Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 23:15:57 
Subject: Re: 3ds to Imagine format
From:    sgiff@airmail.net (Stephen Gifford)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Could someone please send me Andrey Zmievskiy's email address.

s.g.


Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 23:26:50 
Subject: Compuserve/Lotus bounces
From:    NEWKIRK@delphi.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

from reading the message header, it appears that there is a
"sgiff@airmail.net@CISHUB" on the distribution list for the IML, and that
the address in question is incorrect or doesn't exists.  The solution, if
that is the case, would be to remove said address from the list.
Joel

Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 23:30:09 
Subject: CSERVE/Lotus mail bounces
From:    NEWKIRK@delphi.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Many apologies, wrong address in my last post (sorry, SGIFF)
My brain's on standby power right now.    
Joel

Date:    Tuesday, 24 October 1995 23:42:32 
Subject: Re: Problems
From:    NEWKIRK@delphi.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Steve: I've encountered the same scaling problem in stage, with V2, and have
found the only way to satisfactorily overcome it is to delete and reload the
object in qestion into the scene (although a Transform Scale, as opposed to
mouse-visual scale, seems to often work)
Regarding vanishing objects, apart from the usual comment about world size,
how many/how complex are the objects in the scene?
I had trouble with a scene I waqs working on recently, with about 300 objects
where several objects wouldn't show up in trace, and a few less showed up in
scanline.  The fix I found was to scale the whole scene manuallyby .2, both obje
ct sizes and positions.  Apparently I'd hit some 
limitation on the rendering space occupied by objects, or some such, and
making the objects numerically smaller resolved it.
BTW, this was on an A2000, 50MHZ 030/882, with 11 megs real, 35 megs GigaMem,
so it would seem reasonable to assume I didn't truly hiyt a memory limit (actual
ly
confirmed by checking memory usage during render)
Joel

Date:    Wednesday, 25 October 1995 00:11:54 
Subject: Re:cube
From:    Gerard Menendez <gpm@netcom.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



> that you had to specify 1.414 * the desired cube side length, as the 
> cylinder radius. I guess, looking back, I could've gotten used to this 
> method, automatically entering 141.414 every time I created the "cylinder."

Your right, of course, I can see where a lot of problems I've had came 
from starting out boneheadedly setting a radius and side length to the 
same number.

Gerard
      

Date:    Wednesday, 25 October 1995 00:40:29 
Subject: Re: SGI machines
From:    CoryJ44@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-24 12:13:29 EDT, Rob writes:

>I've seen advertisements for a machine called the Modeler by SGI and they
>seem to make it sound as though it were brought out to compete with the PC
>platform.  Would something like this do a better job than say the upcoming
P6
>at running Imagine?

     First of all, I don't think existing versions of Imagine would run on an
SGI anyway, but perhaps that's not your point.  I was under the impression
that SGI's MIPS RISC chips and 64-bit system architectures were generations
ahead of any Pentium system's rendering power . . . has anything changed
lately?  I've seen various configurations in both platforms, and it would
seem as though any cutting edge SGI machine (low- or high-end) would outclass
any cutting edge PC on the market.  Even with the P6's new abilities, I would
guess that it would have a tough time keeping up with ANYTHING from SGI in
the arena of 3D modeling systems--(even if Impulse did decide to make an SGI
or Alpha version of Imagine).  In my limited experience, the performance
differences were so drastic that comparisons between PC/Mac/Amiga systems and
SGI machines aren't usually even bothered with.  Power users from either
perspective, correct me if I'm wrong.  This is an interesting thread, and I
think many of us have picked up some interesting info...I'm glad we've been
widening our perspective like this.

                                            Cory

Date:    Wednesday, 25 October 1995 00:44:41 
Subject: Re: Imagine Glows
From:    rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au (Robert Byrne)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hello Roger, on Oct 23 you wrote:

> On Sun, 22 Oct 1995, Robert Byrne wrote:
> 
> > I have'nt persisted with Haze because of another drawback. If you have
> > anti-aliasing set to a reasonable level the base haze colour is changed
> > when mixed with other object or background colours and you lose the effect.
> 
> Not in my experience. From what I can tell, the Haze FX looks in the 
> finished rendered image for all pixels of the key color, draws a circle 
> with x radius ......
> ...... So anti-aliasing shouldn't matter, so long as your FX radius is 
> greater than the number of pixels across that the AA uses.

I've done a haze effect with a rising sun on a pure blue background and it
was fine, but with smaller objects and multi-coloured backgrounds
anti-aliasing interferred with the colour haze keys off. Impulse even
mention this in the manual:-

Global Haze:

The  effect  keys  specifically  off  of  the  color  in the Red/Green/Blue
parameters.  On the edges of objects, pixels are antialiased and the FX may
not  exactly pick up the outer edge of the bright object you're lookin for.
This  is  more noticable in lower resolution images and if objects get very
small.

-- Bob

Date:    Wednesday, 25 October 1995 02:13:08 
Subject: ------=> Sorry NO Subject!
From:    imagine-relay@email.eag.unisysgsg.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 09:44 PM 10/23/95 -0600, you wrote:
>I'm working on a big(!!!) space station and I plan to put it up on AmiNet 
>when finished. Actually this station is more mobile than the Babylon 5 
>station. Instead of using jumpgates (in case of emergency), this station 
>uses massive gravity drivers to move. Ok, ok, it's more of an 
>intersteller ship than a station, but I'll leave its use up to other 
>Imagine users.
>
>I also plan to include a projectile probe with the station. One thing is 
>missing, however. The station needs a name. I thought of perhaps, C.S.A. 
>TITAN or C.S.A. ARGO. Any other suggestions?
>

How about C.S.A. IMAGINATION ??
Chris Hall.

|--------------------------------------------------------|\
| You have been spoken to by Chris Hall                  ||
| A very tall and generally nice bloke from Great Briton ||
|                                                        ||
| E- mail me at : Hmmm. That's a tough one.              ||
| WWW home page temporarily pulled down !!               ||
|                                                        ||
| Today's lucky lottery numbers are :-                   ||
|              40 05 17 37 35 07                         ||
|--------------------------------------------------------||
 \--------------------------------------------------------\



Date:    Wednesday, 25 October 1995 02:25:13 
Subject: ------=> Sorry NO Subject!
From:    imagine-relay@email.eag.unisysgsg.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

>$260 is what I have to spend to get this new version. Quite a bit of money
>since I have other priorities. I was hoping something on the PC side would
>be able to at least convert from 3ds to DXF file format. There is however a
>conversion program listed at the avalon site for TDDD conversions. I'm going
>to look into it soon to see what it is all about. I want to get at some of
>these 3ds objects.
>
There is a windows (pc) program called wcvt2pov that will convert between
3ds and dxf both way plus a host of other formats. It alows you the preview
and rotate the object, add colours to groups, adjust attributes( shing metal
glass etc) as well as add ground and sky. It is shareware and available from
ftp.pov.org. Hope this helps.
Chris Hall.

|--------------------------------------------------------|\
| You have been spoken to by Chris Hall                  ||
| A very tall and generally nice bloke from Great Briton ||
|                                                        ||
| E- mail me at : Hmmm. That's a tough one.              ||
| WWW home page temporarily pulled down !!               ||
|                                                        ||
| Today's lucky lottery numbers are :-                   ||
|              40 05 17 37 35 07                         ||
|--------------------------------------------------------||
 \--------------------------------------------------------\



Date:    Wednesday, 25 October 1995 04:37:01 
Subject: 3DS to Imagine
From:    osc@ix.netcom.com (Keith Pope)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

3DS2Imagine is available on one of the pages at Sharky's Website from 
one of the other artists.

The shareware works great!

I'm sending in my money to register.

Keith

Date:    Wednesday, 25 October 1995 06:48:00 
Subject: Minds Eye (again II)
From:    KEN_ROBERTSON@robelle.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Conny, don't give it up!  I've visited your web page, and you have
some nice stuff.  I agree, when I first saw Mind's Eye II and III it
was like going to a jazz concert and watching a virtuoso play - you
come away with the feeling of "I think that I'll retire now.".  You
must remember that these videos were done on pretty big machines, and
people were getting paid to do most of this stuff.

Imagine can pretty well do a lot of the stuff that is done there,
even the planet one with the exploding pods!  The pullback on the
tree to a full-blown biosphere has lots of bitmaps in it - a zillion
tricks.  Take a look at Sharky's Web Page  (www.websharx.com, I think)
to see what can be done with our "measly" Imagine, and perhaps you
can be bouyed into doing some more rendering.

You _may_ want to get an accelerator for that 500, tho...

\KenStillRenderingR

Date:    Wednesday, 25 October 1995 06:55:41 
Subject: Some processor speed info...
From:    CoryJ44@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

     For those of you who are interested, I dug up some benchmark results for
some 3D renders (600 by 600 raytraces) on a a 486-66, Pentium 90, MIPS 4400
200 mHz (one of the standard chips on SGI Indigos), and an Alpha 200.  I'm
not sure what each of the tests are exactly, but the systems were all
top-of-the-line and optimally configured (although the MIPS chip system was
from NEC and not an SGI), with 32 megs of RAM apiece...the values indicate
the time (in seconds) that each machine took to complete each test.

                    *486-66*     *Pentium 90*     *MIPS 4400*     *Alpha 200*
Texium Proj.   184.50           98.00                60.87
                88.9
MaxEDS         684.00         383.50              124.65               206.00
PV-Wave-       147.00           79.17                48.74
                76.5
Hamilton C     211.60          104.5                 57.38
                 82

     Also important to note...the hotter SGI machines (all of which use the
MIPS chips, I believe) are pumped up with tons of secondary cache, big
standard RAM configs, and 3D and video subsystems designed to further
distance them from the rest of the pack.  With the $20K software packages
like Alias and SoftImage, model manipulation w/ realtime rendering is the
norm.  In some cases they can trace a full frame more quickly than our
wireframe perspectives can redraw. But most of you knew that...and yes, I
know that this information is only indirectly related to Imagine, but this
kind of performance is eye-popping to a PC user who might have to wait a day
just to see a 3-second flying logo.  Hmmmmm, I can't imagine Impulse finding
much of a market among "prosumer" SGI users, but who knows?

                                             Cory
        
         


Date:    Wednesday, 25 October 1995 08:34:26 
Subject: Minds Eye (again II)
From:    cjo@esrange.ssc.se


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Could someone give me and hand picking up my jaw from the floor?

Just got II and III yesterday...

They sort of make you wonder; am I gonna try to achieve similar stuff with=20
Imagine on my trusty Amiga500 or am I just gonna hurl everything out the=20
window and give it all up before I get disappointed?

*---------------------------------------------------------------*
|   Conny Joensson   |   Swedish Space Corp. Esrange            |
|   Kiruna           |   Satellite operations - Telecom Div.    |
|   Sweden           |   cjo@smtpgw.esrange.ssc.se              |
*---------------------------------------------------------------*

Date:    Wednesday, 25 October 1995 09:30:30 
Subject: Re: PD for PC?
From:    Vaibhav Goel <vgoel@visinet.ca>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

On Tue, 24 Oct 1995, Mike McCool wrote:

>     Please excuse this nearly off-topic query,--but could someone 
> give me an ftp or web site that's the equivalent of aminet, only for 
> PC'ers?  
> 
>     I'm trying to get my brother into Imagine/LightWave, and I figure 
> the easiest convincer would be to direct him to a site where he can nab 
> some pix and perhaps get a taste of POV or something.  
> 

Here are some sites;

ftp.cdrom.com   Enormous site with everything from games to utils to 
graphics to freeware UNIX systems etc.

oak.oakland.edu  SimTel Site.  Full of DOS, Windoze stuff.

ftp.povray.org   Povray stuff and other graphics utils



Date:    Wednesday, 25 October 1995 10:11:46 
Subject: Re: problems, my friends
From:    S.A.Jalim@exeter.ac.uk


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> 
> Could be. When you start to render the scene, switch to the WorkBench, 
> click on that screen, and keep a close watch on the memory counter in the 
> menu bar. If that comes anywhere near zero at any time your problem is most 
> likely one of memory.

yeah./.. been there done that...

at worst i have

chip 1650 (ish)  VM (5600 ish) and realfast 4k


hmmm.. it`s low.. but not THAT low, surely

and why oh why won`t imagine use some of that chip ram?

maybe if i downgraded my machine.. or would that cause problems due to chip ram
being slower than fast?

> 
> On the other hand, it _could_ be a virus...                    ;)

gee.. thanks conny... i love you too :) heheh

> 
> >Also... sometimes I load an object in to teh stage editor, scale it and 
> >then save changes, but the program seems to forget this and renders the 
> >scene with the object in question just as it was made in teh detail 
> >editor.
> 
> Ahh, now this is more simple to answer.
> Once you have scaled your object in the stage editor do "size bar" before 
> you save changes.
> 
size bar? eh.. come again? what ..? pardon?? (RTFM STEVE"!!!!)


> >p.s. I want a cube primitive.. and maybe a flat disc one too (a cross 
> >between a torus and a disc, if you see what i mean)
> 
> Yepp. I see what you mean. And I have done such objects lots of times.
> Create a cone with 2 vertical sections and size it to 0 in Z.
> Go to pick points, pick the point in the middle and delete it.   Voila!
> If you want a thinner ring you can create the "cone" with more vertical 
> sections and use "pick method: lasso" to delete all the inner points.


cool.. you use the same method as me.. cool.. :) (i feel happy now)


thanks for the advice

steve

______________________________________________________________________________
| Steve -> S.A.Jalim@ex.ac.uk | WWW http://www.ex.ac.uk/~ge94saj/steve1.html |
|----------------------------------------------------------------------------|
| Scully: Can you determine the cause of death?                              |
|           My instinct tells me that burial in cement is murder.            |
|____________________________________________________________________________|

p.s. conny, d`you remember me from last year?
:)

Date:    Wednesday, 25 October 1995 11:25:53 
Subject: BOCA 2M video
From:    Steven M Powell <afn27231@freenet.ufl.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


Will Imagine work with the BOCA 2m card? anyone have one?
phoenix


Date:    Wednesday, 25 October 1995 11:44:04 
Subject: Re: The glow issue
From:    "Dan.Maclean" <MACLEDJ@pmitao.usa.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

 
From Dan MacLean:
 
>  Add a light in Imagine Stage. "T" to transform the Axis. Make the
>  size much larger than the default. I think it's 32... make it 200 or
>  even more. In the Stage, Add the Lensflare Global FX. Render!
 
When I select the light in the stage editor and choose "Transform" The
transform axis only requestor is ghosted and not usable!  I'm using Imagine
3.3 for the PC.  All I can do is scale the whole light, translate, etc.  I'm
not sure what good doing that does.


Date:    Wednesday, 25 October 1995 12:18:16 
Subject: Re: problems, my friends
From:    cjo@esrange.ssc.se


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

>>Could be. When you start to render the scene, switch to the WorkBench,
>>click on that screen, and keep a close watch on the memory counter in the
>>menu bar. If that comes anywhere near zero at any time your problem is most 
>>likely one of memory.

>yeah./.. been there done that...
>at worst i have
>chip 1650 (ish)  VM (5600 ish) and realfast 4k
>hmmm.. it`s low.. but not THAT low, surely

Are you talking "bytes" or "kilobytes" here?
If you've only got 1650+5600+4000 _bytes_ left while rendering, I'll say 
that is where your problem is.

>>On the other hand, it _could_ be a virus...                    ;)

>gee.. thanks conny... i love you too :) heheh

Well, I try all I can to help.     ;-)

>>Once you have scaled your object in the stage editor do "size bar" before 
>>you save changes.
 
>size bar? eh.. come again? what ..? pardon?? (RTFM STEVE"!!!!)

Yeah, right. RTFM. I don't remember which menu to select that from. That's 
why I didn't write anything about that.
But it's the 2nd or 3rd from the left I think...    :)

>p.s. conny, d`you remember me from last year?

Last YEAR!?! It wasn't THAT long ago, was it?
But yeah, of course I remember.
I won't forget a person who calls me "the next best thing to an on-line 
manual". :)

*---------------------------------------------------------------*
|   Conny Joensson   |   Swedish Space Corp. Esrange            |
|   Kiruna           |   Satellite operations - Telecom Div.    |
|   Sweden           |   cjo@smtpgw.esrange.ssc.se              |
*---------------------------------------------------------------*

Date:    Wednesday, 25 October 1995 14:33:01 
Subject: Mirror, Mirror
From:    Brad Molsen <moon@eskimo.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

To all, I ran across something I found a need for in Imagine last night 
as I was working on my faucet for my kitchen sink. I had loaded up a 
primitive disk, deleted the middle point and was busy dragging/moving 
points to acheive a good cross section to extrude into a faucet. When I 
realized that a mirror function would sure come in handy for moving or 
dragging points. All one would have to do is define an axis plane to 
mirror about and then start moving or dragging points. For instance in 
the front view if one wanted to move points in the xz direction they 
would define the mirror plane as the zy plane. They would only have to 
move the points on one side of the axis and the points on the other side 
would move at the same time, thus insuring a symmetrical shape. The only 
caveat would be that the axis was in the center of the group of points to 
be manipulated. A window would open when mirror was selected which would 
allow the user to define the axes of bisection. The edge of the plane 
would be defined by the lines used to show the existing axis symbol 
direction. In this way one could even rotate the axis and still be 
able to mirror using the "local" button to define which was the 
pertinent direction. 
Perhaps the copy/paste function could be part of the same tool.
 Right off I see it as a real advantage to the drag and move modes. 
                                              regards, Brad

Date:    Wednesday, 25 October 1995 14:45:00 
Subject: Transparency Mapping
From:    mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com (Mike Vandersommen)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Ok, without beating this thing to death, i've got one more problemto solve using
 transparency mapping of a logo on glass. I've gotthe maps to come out perfect o
n glass. However, when I tweekthe FILTER color of the object's attributes to ...
say..give thebottle a greener tint, the transparency map doesn't change withit. 
In other words, the bottle has a green tint, but the mapstill is clear transpare
nt.  Is there any way to allow theattributes of the object to match that of tran
sparent part ofthe map?   /------------------------------           ___   ___  _
__   ___  | Mike van der Sommen                     / __  /__/ /__/  /_   \ /  |
 Santa Barbara, Ca.                     /___/ / \  /  /  /     / \  | mike.vande
rsommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com     HAUS BBS (805-683-1388)  |           "Blackouts 
make for nice breaks in the day"   \____________________________________________
_________________--- =FE InterNet - GraFX Haus BBS - Santa Barbara, Ca - (805) 6
83-1388

Date:    Wednesday, 25 October 1995 15:10:02 
Subject: Re: SGI machines
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-25 00:03:09 EDT, you write:

>SGI machines aren't usually even bothered with.  Power users from either
>perspective, correct me if I'm wrong.  This is an interesting thread, and I
>think many of us have picked up some interesting info...I'm glad we've been
>widening our perspective like this.
>
>                                            Cory

Information I have gotten from several people seems to indicate that Impulse
is adhering to the standards they need to which might make it a fairly simple
thing to create an NT version of Imagine for Alpha or maybe a low end SGI
box.  Or perhaps if I have my information correct a strictly NT version of
Imagine could take advantage of a dual Pentium setup under NT???  I'm not
sure about that but it would also me nice.  When I moved from my Amigas with
about 12 meg ram (which I used to think was enormous) to a 486 with 20 meg my
scenes became correspondigly more complex as did the objects I tried to
create.  Now I use a P90 with 40 meg of ram and once again have pushed out to
where things take to long with it.  I realize I'll never be happy for to long
with whatever I'm using and so I wonder what I'll need to buy next, since
Imagine is the only program I own that requires in the words of Tim the
Toolman Taylor "MORE POWER" all the time:)
I also think you learn more about a program when your machine has a little
more under the hood because you become willing to experiment a little more.

Bob...........

Date:    Wednesday, 25 October 1995 15:52:24 
Subject: Re:True Glows
From:    Granberg Tom <tom.granberg@TV2.no>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi

I am reading the mails, and heard something about creating 
"halos" or bright spots around your light sources. A thing you should know here 

is that the standard light sources is a bit hard to work with when trying to 
achive such effects(it can be done). I rarely use stage lights to other things 
than fill light. I have a directory called lights, where I save down light 
axis(detail) spots,parralel,underwater,sun, etc. Becouse I can use textures on 
them, and see the size of the axis. And to create a good halo effect like I did 

in one of the pictures at Captain Videos homepage, do the following.
Add and axis in detail, scale the axis(shift s) to the size you want the halo to
 
be. Then go to attributes and give it some redicelous large numbers like: 
800,500,500. If you dont want that light to light up your scene as a nuclear 
explotion, turn on the controlled fallof flag(the halo will still be "hot", 
infact hotter than you may think, try it). This will give the effect you are 
looking for.

Tom Renderbrandt


Date:    Wednesday, 25 October 1995 15:59:29 
Subject: Re:True glows
From:    "Dan.Maclean" <MACLEDJ@pmitao.usa.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

From Dan MacLean:
Using an axis light did the trick!  Thanks!  I realize you can change the size
of the halo in the scene by changing the size of the axis, but how do you
change the intensity?  The example I did seemed kind of dim.  The halo was not
too noticable and it was on a completely black background.  I used settings of
R=22-,G=200,B=300 for the light because I wanted it blue.  Since the actual
hot spot of a bright blue light will appear white, I created a fog object and
put it in the middle.  I made sure to make it small enough not to obscure the
halo. To be truthful, I'm looking for that massive bright effect seen so much
on Babylon 5 when a ship's engines are on.  (By the way, this past week's
episode was one of the best!!!)


Date:    Wednesday, 25 October 1995 16:10:14 
Subject: Re: 4.0 and Video
From:    "Dan.Maclean" <MACLEDJ@pmitao.usa.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

From Dan MacLean:
Flh is a PC animation format that allows animations at various resolutions and
with more than just 256 colors.  There is also the Flt format and I'm not sure
of the differences.  Perhaps one is 16.7 million colors and the other is 16
bit color.  640x480x16bit seems to run well if there isn't a whole lot of
movement going on.  Unfortunately I don't think there is a standard for
320x200 at 16 or 24 bit.  320x200x256 colors SCREAMSon my 486DX4/100 w/ 20MB
ram! It is so f ast it produces what seems like a real time motion blur
effect. It has to be over 100 frames per second.I did a vistapro animation of
130 frames and you co uldn't follow it without slowing it down.  640x480 is
just too big. I wish the pc had double buffering (video cards have it, in
fact, but animation players don't use it.  Just games.)  Double buffering
makes slow playing animations look much better.
 
Enough rambling for now!


Date:    Wednesday, 25 October 1995 17:34:28 
Subject: Glows
From:    helmy@voyager.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Well i just tried the Glow idea using an axis and a fog object, and it
works great@! the only downside is that it can only really be circular.
When i first started using Imagine I always that that if you had a flat
triangular object, and if you gave it the LIGHT option that the triangle
would really turn into a light and emit a triangular emmision, which as
i fiigured out is not the case. (Just thought i'd share that with you,
not sure if other people thought like me)

One thing which i really wish was if Imagine could have a MUCH MUCH MORE
INTUITIVE Bones feature which wouldnt take so damn long to set up.  I
know i shouldnt use the word Lightwave, but it never hurts to reveal
other program's strengths, for example to make the letter "M" walk, so
the legs move and bend, all you have to do is to create an extruded M
object and actually PLACE BONES in the legs of the M, and by simply
moving the bones the body of the M moves and bends extremely nicely.  I
have a copy of Lightwave which i dont use, and one day i tried the
tutorial in the manual and was amazed as to how easy it is.  If there is
ANYONE out there who is good at bones, if you could tell us how to
create a walking "M", i would greatly appreacite it. (Dont get my wrong
i have used bones in Imagine but have never figured out how to atcually
cause a BEND in an object. )

I know i just wrote a lot but i've been away and just wanted to write to
you guys about my Imagine related feelings. =)

                           -------------------------
                             H"E"L"M"Y PRODUCTIONS
                           -------------------------
                              <3D & 2D AnImAtIoN>
                           -------------------------
                           Los Angeles-California-US
                           -------------------------
                           E-Mail: Helmy@Voyager.Com
                           -------------------------



Date:    Wednesday, 25 October 1995 17:42:57 
Subject: Re: Some processor speed info...
From:    craigh@fa.disney.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

On Oct 25,  2:55am, imagine-relay@email.eag.unisysgsg.com wrote:
>
>
>      Also important to note...the hotter SGI machines (all of which use the
> MIPS chips, I believe) are pumped up with tons of secondary cache, big
> standard RAM configs, and 3D and video subsystems designed to further
> distance them from the rest of the pack.  With the $20K software packages
> like Alias and SoftImage, model manipulation w/ realtime rendering is the
> norm.  In some cases they can trace a full frame more quickly than our
> wireframe perspectives can redraw. But most of you knew that...

Okay, this is getting a little out of hand.

I work every day on Indigo 2 Extremes with MIPS R4400's, 120 MB of RAM (and
some with 256 MB of RAM) and 1 Gig HardDrives.  I can tell you for a fact that
these machines do not trace (I assume that you mean ray trace) faster than my
Amiga 4000 will do a screen re-draw.  In fact it is not even close.

The SGI's currently have the advantage of hardware rendering.  They have
special gouraud shading algorithms (accessed by GL or Open GL calls in the
software) that are programmed into chips which allow solid, shaded objects to
appear extremely fast on screen.  Programs like Alias do not even use this
capability very well.  Programs like Prisms and SoftImage do, and allow for
almost realtime playback in this gouraud shaded preview.

Now, this image (unless the SGI machine has a reality engine) is not
anti-aliased and is not a perfectly rendered picture.  It uses Gouraud shading
(fast, but not as good as Phong shading) and it uses z-buffer routines which
sometimes give inaccurate intersections.  On some machines, texture mapping is
supported.  This is only like Imagine's brush wrapping, no procedural textures
can be generated fast enough for this preview.

Ray tracing is done in software and is very CPU intensive.  It is also very
slow- on any SGI workstation.  We render images here at Disney for film and
have them take an hour or more sometimes per frame.  And this is without
ray-tracing!  And we render all of our different levels seperately.

Don't be fooled into thinking that SGI's are 10 times faster than Pentiums at
ray tracing.  They are not.  They may be two to three times faster than a
mid-level Pentium (P5) at such a CPU intensive task, but the faster Pentiums
and the new P6 will change that.

PCs are rapidly closing the gap and will soon match (or come very close to)
current SGI workstations once hardware rendering chips are standard and
supported, and everything is fully 32 bit.  SGI's will always be better at some
things, but for the things that concern us most, like rendering speed, PCs are
definitely the most bang for the buck.

Craig



-- 
 _____________________________________________________________________________
            __
          #####       Craig Hoffman
         #~ ~###      craigh@fa.disney.com
          @ @ #?)
          <  /|       Walt Disney Feature Animation 
          `-' /
          |__/
 _____________________________________________________________________________


Date:    Wednesday, 25 October 1995 18:07:19 
Subject: Associate Ideas
From:    mrivers@tbag.org (Michael Rivers)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Ok here's an idea for you to ponder:
The was supposed to be access from the Stage to the individual
objects in a group in version 3.0, well, it's not.  So as an
alternative, the Associate action bar makes a reasonable
substitute.  However, Impulse needs to expand on this by:

1.  Be able to save the Associate structure in the stage
    or action eds. This would be similar to saving a Group,
    however there would be no points, faces, edgeds, etc just
    references to object files, and contain pos, ali & size.
2.  Ofcourse #1 would be usless without being able to load
    the association back into into a project.
3.  In the stage and action editor, the Association should
    act like a group in the detail editor, if you move the
    parent, the children move with it.
4.  The bone system could be incorporated into this.  ex.
    associate a bone.  (of course there'll need to be
    this new object type in the action & stage eds to
    go with nornmal object, axis & light.

Discuss amongst yourselves...


Date:    Wednesday, 25 October 1995 18:27:14 
Subject: Re: Particles+Texture problem
From:    Roger Straub <straub@csn.net>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Tue, 24 Oct 1995, Rick Dolishny wrote:

> 
> 2) Try using Shatter FX instead of Particle. I think I read something 
> about this FX being better at maintainting brushes.

By this I think you mean the Shredder FX. Unless, of course, the Shatter 
FX is only included in the PC version of Imagine. =(

> 
> Good luck.
> 
> Rick Dolishny          dolish@io.org
> Ardee Productions - Toronto, Ontario
> 

See ya,
      Roger

Date:    Wednesday, 25 October 1995 19:02:43 
Subject: Re:Power under the hood
From:    Granberg Tom <tom.granberg@TV2.no>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Bob wrote:
-I also think you learn more about a program when your machine has a little
-more under the hood because you become willing to experiment a little more.

Yepp, you are so right, the things I do now is like light years away from what I
 
was used to do due to power constraints on my Amiga (still got it 
tough-4040warp 50mb ram + PAR)

Later....

Renderbrandt

Date:    Wednesday, 25 October 1995 19:06:40 
Subject: Re: Transparency Mapping
From:    Jim Shinosky <tracker@en.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


I had a feeling you were going to have this problem eventually.  When you
first posed this problem I decided to create a coke bottle myself.  Here's
what I did:

1. Created a crudely shaped coke bottle.
2. Went into Photoshop and created 2 image maps that will be cylindrically
wrapped around the coke bottle. They looked like this:

                     ************************************
                     *                                  *
                     *                                  *
                     *               C                  *
                     *               O                  *
                     *               C                  *
                     *               A                  *
                     *               |                  *
                     *               C                  *
                     *               O                  *
                     *               L                  *
                     *               A                  *
                     *                                  *
                     *                                  *
                     ************************************

This is a crude representation.  The actual image maps were actually taller=
..
You might have to play with the amount of space around the letters so that
they don't get stretched when the image is wrapped on the bottle.  I was=20
lucky and got right the first time. =20

Now the first image map acted as the filter map.  The letters were black=20
and the dead space was white.  If however you want to have colored glass
with colored transparency, then you replace the white with the color of the
light passing through the glass.  I did it with a brownish color sort of li=
ke
a beer bottle.

The second image map is the same as the first only the letters are now=20
white and the background color is black(which gets genlocked out just as=20
it does in the first image)  This is your color map so that the letters sho=
w
up.=20

One other thing you might want to try is to take the second image map and
smooth it out a little and create a third image map which will act as a bum=
p
map.  When you apply it, change the mix/morph value to a very low=20
number.  This will give the impression that the letters are actually=20
painted onto the surface and have a small amount of bumpiness to them just
as in real life. =20

Each of the image maps get placed on the object in the order that I describ=
ed
them.  Now Mike, I know that you know that I know that you know some of thi=
s
stuff already, but I thought I would go through the whole procedure for=20
anyone checking in late.  Enjoy!

Jim Shinosky


On Wed, 25 Oct 1995, Mike Vandersommen wrote:

>=20
> Ok, without beating this thing to death, i've got one more problem
> to solve using transparency mapping of a logo on glass. I've got
> the maps to come out perfect on glass. However, when I tweek
> the FILTER color of the object's attributes to ...say..give the
> bottle a greener tint, the transparency map doesn't change with
> it. In other words, the bottle has a green tint, but the map
> still is clear transparent.  Is there any way to allow the
> attributes of the object to match that of transparent part of
> the map?
>=20
>    /------------------------------           ___   ___  ___   ___
>   | Mike van der Sommen                     / __  /__/ /__/  /_   \ /
>   | Santa Barbara, Ca.                     /___/ / \  /  /  /     / \
>   | mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com     HAUS BBS (805-683-1388)
>   |           "Blackouts make for nice breaks in the day"
>    \_____________________________________________________________
> ---
>  =FE InterNet - GraFX Haus BBS - Santa Barbara, Ca - (805) 683-1388
>=20

Date:    Wednesday, 25 October 1995 20:52:27 
Subject: Re: PD for PC?
From:    Chris Hall <Chris.Hall@dial.pipex.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 10:21 PM 10/24/95 -0700, you wrote:
>Hey y'all, 
>
>     Please excuse this nearly off-topic query,--but could someone 
>give me an ftp or web site that's the equivalent of aminet, only for 
>PC'ers?  
>
>     I'm trying to get my brother into Imagine/LightWave, and I figure 
>the easiest convincer would be to direct him to a site where he can nab 
>some pix and perhaps get a taste of POV or something.  
>
>     I know you Ibeamers have something like aminet, but I'm PC 
>illiterate.  Please enlighten me, for the sake of my graphics-hungry 
>brother? 
>
>     Thanks a meg. 

You can try ftp.povray.org or www.povray.org where you can find lots of
stuff about povray and polyray.

For some pictures try http://www.aloha.com/~sharky/index.html. You will find
hours of inspiring pictures here as well as some useful utils. For some
movies try http://www.alias.com:80/Product/library/mpgdesc/alias.html where
the are lots of interesting mpeg movies. Or one of these for pot luck (they
are all in my bookmark file. Must have kept them for a reason!) :-

http://moose.erie.net/~iansmith/
http://www.websharx.com:80/~silicon/homepage.html
ftp://ftp.websharx.com/pub/imagine/
http://agora.leeds.ac.uk/csznml/contents.html

Have fun with these.
Chris Hall.

|--------------------------------------------------------|\
| You have been spoken to by Chris Hall                  ||
| A very tall and generally nice bloke from Great Briton ||
|                                                        ||
| E- mail me at : Hmmm. That's a tough one.              ||
| WWW home page temporarily pulled down !!               ||
|                                                        ||
| Today's lucky lottery numbers are :-                   ||
|              40 05 17 37 35 07                         ||
|--------------------------------------------------------||
 \--------------------------------------------------------\



Date:    Wednesday, 25 October 1995 23:09:52 
Subject: Re:Real glowsII
From:    Granberg Tom <tom.granberg@TV2.no>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi Dan.
To increase the intensity of the flare, just increase the RGB values, so if you 

want it blue. Multiply your current RGB values with say 3 or 4, so that you get 

something like 300,400,600. Bluish but hot as hell when you use the contolled 
fallof and Lensflare.

Later.....

Renderbrandt


Date:    Wednesday, 25 October 1995 23:27:06 
Subject: Retina Z2 Problems...
From:    Jynx <premiergfx@liberty.liberty.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


Is there anyone successfully using the Retina Z2 with Imagine v3.3?
Is this a bug in the software. When I called the tech support line
the guy told me that the last retina board that Noahji sent them was v1.0!
I am using RetinaEmu v2.3. I have tried the SMOD, S256, & USE RETINA
settings. I have also tried various other settings in RetinaEmu. Of course
this is the Amiga version of Imagine. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
 
Brent Warp
Premier Productions
Premiergfx@liberty.liberty.com


Date:    Thursday, 26 October 1995 00:02:48 
Subject: Re: Decals on Glass
From:    rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au (Robert Byrne)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hello Mike, on Oct 24 you wrote:

> ps. Interesting side note. You get 40% more tips on the IML if
>     you instruct a "wrong" techique than if you ask "how do I
>     do this?"  <THANKS FOR ALL THE TIPS, GUYS) <grin>

Probably because it's easier to fill in the blanks rather than write the
whole solution. :-)

-- Bob

Date:    Thursday, 26 October 1995 00:05:00 
Subject: Texture/Attrib library
From:    mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com (Mike Vandersommen)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I was wondering if anyone ever put up an Imagine Texture/Attributeslibrary on th
e Web? Since Imagine can save attributes and texturesettings in the attrib files
, it sure would be great to have acollection of all these great texture/attribut
e settings todownload. Rather than give long discriptions of how to get a greatN
eon Light....or lizard skin, why not have a dumping station forsaved attrib file
s with the settings already make up.I have this great dinoskin premade texture s
omeone included with adinosaur object.  Sure would save lots of time to share th
ereally good ones.If this has already been done....how about pointing me to a We
bsite.ps. I've got all the regular glass, chrome, plastic etc. attribs.    Maybe
 even include a little readme file on how to apply to    certain objects. ..blah
..blah..   /------------------------------           ___   ___  ___   ___  | Mik
e van der Sommen                     / __  /__/ /__/  /_   \ /  | Santa Barbara,
 Ca.                     /___/ / \  /  /  /     / \  | mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com     HAUS BBS (805-683-1388)  |           "Blackouts
 make for nice breaks in the day"   \___________________________________________
__________________--- =FE InterNet - GraFX Haus BBS - Santa Barbara, Ca - (805) 
683-1388

Date:    Thursday, 26 October 1995 00:28:52 
Subject: Washer Primitive (was Re: problems, my friends)
From:    rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au (Robert Byrne)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> > >p.s. I want a cube primitive.. and maybe a flat disc one too (a cross 
> > >between a torus and a disc, if you see what i mean)
> > 
> > Yepp. I see what you mean. And I have done such objects lots of times.
> > Create a cone with 2 vertical sections and size it to 0 in Z.
> > Go to pick points, pick the point in the middle and delete it.   Voila!

> > If you want a thinner ring you can create the "cone" with more vertical 
> > sections and use "pick method: lasso" to delete all the inner points.

Rather than create another cone with more vertical sections just pick the
inner points and scale them.

-- Bob

  :  Robert Byrne  : rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au :
  : Amiga A3000/25 :  Ballina, NSW  Australia  :



Date:    Thursday, 26 October 1995 02:14:19 
Subject: Glows, I have an idea...
From:    lumbient@superlink.net (!LuM!)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

-----WHAT?-----
   Everyone's been talking about imagine's glows and I have a suggestion for
Impulse.  OK, you know how an axis can be turned into a light?  How about
adding a button that can turn and axis into a glow?  It would seem easy to
add to a renderer.

-----HOW?-----
   You would select the button in the attributes requestor, then another
requestor would pop-up and ask for color, drop-off, intensity, size(measured
in percent of finally picture res.), and possibly textures(ever want a
metallic stary glow? or a ring 'donut' of light instead of a halo?).
   Later, in the stage editor, the axis would be added to a list, and check
for percentage of visibility(based on size).  All this would be stored in an
interface. After render the FX would read this list and perform a glow on
each location with an intensity base on the percent viewable, original
intesity, color, and any textures.  Also it would be cool if the intensity
can be interpolated over time to make cool explosions, the intensity would
rise over time then drop off.

-----REASON-----
  Why do this instead of just adding lights?  Well if I was blowing up a
building, I would need about 20 lights to make a smooth glowing inferno :)
but raytrace that puppy and you inferno costs a lot of clock cycles!!
Second If i used the haze thingy I would need a color to key off of...what
if somethin else in my scene has the same color as the key color? OPPS! you
get an ugly scene, and not to mention if the haze color never shows up(the
object gets too small or occluded by a transparent obj.) then the color
never hazes. 
  I feel that my solution is viable and the only real why to do good(I don't
want to say LW flares.. :) and pretty flares.

----ALSO OF IMPORTANCE----
I REALLY WISH THE BACKGROUND IMAGE FOR RENDERS SHOULD BE MOVED TO THE
SUBPROJECT REQUESTOR THING.  THE REASON IS IF I HAVE 4 SUBPROJECTS WITH
DIFFERENT RESOLUTION I HAVE TO CHANGE THE NAME OF THE IMAGE IN THE ACTION
EDITOR ALL THE TIME!!  IT SHOULD BE IN THE SAME REQUESTOR WITH THE
RESOLUTION OF THE RENDERS!!!


NOTE TO IMPULSE:
I WISH THIS COULD BE ADDED, I ALSO FEEL MOST PEOPLE WOULD AGREE INCLUDING
YOU BETA TESTERS!!

                                            !LuM!

|--------------------------------------------------------\
|Anyone need a great checker floor?                       \
|Lumbient@superlink.net                                   /
|----ANYONE NEED ANYTHING BLOWN UP?--$40 AN INFERNO!-----<
|I can make the most realistic chrome spheres!            \
|They look great above the checkered floor!               /
|--------------------------------------------------------/


Date:    Thursday, 26 October 1995 02:27:34 
Subject: 3DS2IM 3DS to Imagine Converter
From:    osc@ix.netcom.com (Keith Pope)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

The address where I picked it up was 
http://www.websharx.com/~silicon/im.html.

It works well.  Give it a shot.

Keith


Date:    Thursday, 26 October 1995 02:40:40 
Subject: Re: Retina Z2 Problems...
From:    Bush Doktor <sppcarso@ultrix.uor.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

On Wed, 25 Oct 1995, Jynx wrote:

> Is there anyone successfully using the Retina Z2 with Imagine v3.3?
>  
> Brent Warp

     I'll trade you a firecracker board for it, I know it'll work
with 3.3.  :-)



Date:    Thursday, 26 October 1995 07:54:47 
Subject: Re:4.0 and Video
From:    "Dan.Maclean" <MACLEDJ@pmitao.usa.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

From Dan MacLean:
About creating flh 16bit animations:  There is a PC shareware program called
"Dave's Targa Animator" that runs in DOS and will convert a series of images
in various formats into FLC,FLH,FLT,and FLI formats.  It has many features
like croma keying, overlays using alpha channels, and one of my favorite; the
ability to take captured video frames and increase delta compression.  It does
this by comparing adjacent frames on only updating the pixels that are
SIGNIFICANTLY different rather than just different.  This makes Delta
compression of frames very efficient for captured video.  Unfortunately, all
this is just a hobby of mine and I have little time to play with it.
 
What do you use to create MPEG animations?  I've tried to use CMPEG an always
get "illegal targa variant" errors and gave up.  I like the quality and
compression of MPEG compared to Indeo and Cinepak for AVI's.
 
Thanks!


Date:    Thursday, 26 October 1995 09:14:26 
Subject: Re: Mirror, Mirror
From:    rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au (Robert Byrne)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hello Brad, on Oct 25 you wrote:

> To all, I ran across something I found a need for in Imagine last night 
> as I was working on my faucet for my kitchen sink. I had loaded up a 
> primitive disk, deleted the middle point and was busy dragging/moving 
> points to acheive a good cross section to extrude into a faucet. When I 
> realized that a mirror function would sure come in handy for moving or 
> dragging points. .........

Lately it seems I have to keep reminding people of the Forms Editor, the
least used editor of all. This can be a very complex tool but even for
simple tasks like the faucet example, it has the mirror point movement
capability built in.
If you have to use the Detail Ed and you want a symmetrical shape you can
make just half of the object in the Front View then scale it using a value
of -1 in the X or Z plane.

-- Bob

  :  Robert Byrne  : rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au :
  : Amiga A3000/25 :  Ballina, NSW  Australia  :


Date:    Thursday, 26 October 1995 09:37:31 
Subject: Re: Texture/Attrib library
From:    dgrant@dgrant.peinet.pe.ca (Dennis Grant)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

Hello Mike (Mike Vandersommen), in <9510260241589603@caddy.uu.silcom.com> on Oct
 26 you wrote:

> 
> I was wondering if anyone ever put up an Imagine Texture/Attributes
> library on the Web? Since Imagine can save attributes and texture
> settings in the attrib files, it sure would be great to have a
> collection of all these great texture/attribute settings to
> download. Rather than give long discriptions of how to get a great
> Neon Light....or lizard skin, why not have a dumping station for
> saved attrib files with the settings already make up.
> 
> I have this great dinoskin premade texture someone included with a
> dinosaur object.  Sure would save lots of time to share the
> really good ones.
> 
> If this has already been done....how about pointing me to a Website.
> 
> ps. I've got all the regular glass, chrome, plastic etc. attribs.
>     Maybe even include a little readme file on how to apply to
>     certain objects. ..blah..blah..

I'd be willing to make a page for this, if one doesn't exist already.


- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
-
Dennis Grant               Cycor User Support - HTML Developer - Graphic artist
dgrant@cycor.ca     Amiga 4000/'030/6/120/'882 40/2XCDROM/USR14.4/Idek 17"/SLIP

                Visit Trog's Cave! http://www.cycor.ca/TCave/

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: 2.6.2

iQCVAwUBMI+rOLBqnxXa4HpNAQGbnAP6A0zPfpwiaHQK/JXKjHhu8LCNDX6x3WkB
fMTYJISGj9n6Y/Rr1yG4LWHdOrQXGqxoKvsiWtysD/LXRiKkn9riD/R5JaRKJ+2Q
PtvsSYJjr/WyBjZVw6BssDJ6I4JMSKO/5LmLRBpfEKeyk02hc+TArdSXbeixSFWq
LoavYun/Rag=
=MTj4
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----


Date:    Thursday, 26 October 1995 09:52:28 
Subject: Normal unification?
From:    sherman@netcad.ENET.dec.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

FROM too long. Original FROM is 'Steve NACAD::Sherman LKG2-A/R5 pole AA2 DTN 226
-6992 <sherman@netcad.ENET.dec.com>'

----------------------  Original Message Follows  ----------------------

Viewpoint mentions that Lightwave and 3D-Studio feature normal unification
capabilities.  Imagine doesn't care since it doesn't use normals on faces.
But, if I want to export a DXF file that can be read by another tool, it
may be desireable to fix the normals.  Sure would be nice if Imagine could
do this automatically.  (I'd love it if someone could tell me this is a 
new feature, but I doubt it ...)  So, is there another tool around that
anyone knows of that I could grab for cheap to unify normals?  Thanks!

Steve

Date:    Thursday, 26 October 1995 10:21:07 
Subject: Re: problems, my friends
From:    S.A.Jalim@exeter.ac.uk


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


If you remember, readers, in the last installment of this thrilling tale, the po
or little
boy called steve was being visited by the nasty Mr.Guru far too often.
Fortunately, help was at hand in the form of Conny, as a knight in shining armou
r. He suggested
that there might have been a lack of memory, but was it that??... read on...  


Steve actually had during a render

> >1650k chip
> >5600k VM
> >4k fast
> 

free

conny said:

> Hmm, well, then it ain't that...
> 

Yeah. i guess not..  I cleaned up my VMM partition last night after finding a ba
d block in it
(ack!) and i`m thinking that the object (maybe that darn sofa) was corrupted by 
the bad memory and
so can`t be rendered properly now :(

Back to the drawing board.  anyone willing to give me 12meg of a3000 zipps so i 
don`t have
to use VMM anymore?? (yeah.. right,.. :)  )

steve

Date:    Thursday, 26 October 1995 10:44:16 
Subject: Re: The Glow Issue
From:    "Dan.Maclean" <MACLEDJ@pmitao.usa.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

From Dan MacLean:
Thanks for all your help with creating a glowing light.  It is definitelymore
realistic than using haze.  However, I quick animation I did of a light
passing behind an object shows that the halo "blinks out" instantly when the
light passes behind that object.  Imagine must see this axis light as a
pinpoint rather than something with size.  Changing the axis size increases
the size of the halo, but not the light.
 
To illustrate, let me give an example of a large light: the sun!  If you were
to do a sunrise withthis method (creating a center ball so you can "see" the
li ght and creating an axis and making it a light and choosing halo from the
newflare effect) then the sun's glow would suddenly blink on after the center
of the ball passed over the horizon.  I'm guessing the actual lens flares
blink on and off in the same manner.  Any ideas?
 
I hope this is fixed with 4.0.  It seems to me that it would be a simple
matter to add different types of "halos" to produce starburst type effects and
lights that aren't necessarily round.  Also, it would be nice to have the
ability to create that halo effect without using a light.  To get the size
halo I wanted, I had to use settings of 600,600,700 which washed out anything
near the light.
 
Just some ideas.  I guess I'm really hoping that Imagine will turn into
Lightwave one day.  But that won't happen.  I'm having fun anyway.  Thanks!


Date:    Thursday, 26 October 1995 11:09:05 
Subject: Background resolutions and subproject
From:    sauvp@citi.doc.ca (Patrick Sauvageau)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

RobSampson@aol.com:
>In a message dated 95-10-25 23:03:17 EDT, you write:
>>I REALLY WISH THE BACKGROUND IMAGE FOR RENDERS SHOULD BE MOVED TO THE
>>SUBPROJECT REQUESTOR THING.  THE REASON IS IF I HAVE 4 SUBPROJECTS WITH
>>DIFFERENT RESOLUTION I HAVE TO CHANGE THE NAME OF THE IMAGE IN THE ACTION
>>EDITOR ALL THE TIME!!  IT SHOULD BE IN THE SAME REQUESTOR WITH THE
>>RESOLUTION OF THE RENDERS!!!
>>
>>NOTE TO IMPULSE:
>>I WISH THIS COULD BE ADDED, I ALSO FEEL MOST PEOPLE WOULD AGREE INCLUDING
>>YOU BETA TESTERS!!
>>
>>                                            !LuM!
>
>You have my vote on that one.  Most of my final renders are in 1024x768 but
>that is to large to test render in.  Would be nice to select different
>background sizes based on subproject or have it not matter what the
>resolution of the backdrop is.

I have to desagree; it would be a lot more logical to allow Imagine to
automaticaly scale the background image to fit the resolution, maybe in a
tempory file.

If your background is also rendered in Imagine, you may include the
background scene as frame 1 and foreground scene as frame 2, this way, each
of your subproject will have it's own background image and if you change the
subproject, Imagine will just create a new background Image.
-----
Patrick Sauvageau
(sauvp@citi.doc.ca)


Date:    Thursday, 26 October 1995 11:54:04 
Subject: Re: Texture/Attrib library
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-26 06:58:07 EDT, you write:

>I was wondering if anyone ever put up an Imagine Texture/Attributes
>library on the Web? Since Imagine can save attributes and texture
>settings in the attrib files, it sure would be great to have a
>collection of all these great texture/attribute settings to
>download. Rather than give long discriptions of how to get a great
>Neon Light....or lizard skin, why not have a dumping station for
>saved attrib files with the settings already make up.

Something else along these lines I was thinking about is that it would be
nice if Imagine gave you some sort of notepad in each subproject for keeping
thoughts in and if that file automatically included a utility that would look
at the objects used in a scene and write out each objects attributes in the
order that they appear in a group.  Useless information for some but to me it
would be very helpfull.  Anyone else.

Bob...........


Date:    Thursday, 26 October 1995 12:54:00 
Subject: Re: Glows, I have an idea...
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-25 23:03:17 EDT, you write:

>I REALLY WISH THE BACKGROUND IMAGE FOR RENDERS SHOULD BE MOVED TO THE
>SUBPROJECT REQUESTOR THING.  THE REASON IS IF I HAVE 4 SUBPROJECTS WITH
>DIFFERENT RESOLUTION I HAVE TO CHANGE THE NAME OF THE IMAGE IN THE ACTION
>EDITOR ALL THE TIME!!  IT SHOULD BE IN THE SAME REQUESTOR WITH THE
>RESOLUTION OF THE RENDERS!!!
>
>
>NOTE TO IMPULSE:
>I WISH THIS COULD BE ADDED, I ALSO FEEL MOST PEOPLE WOULD AGREE INCLUDING
>YOU BETA TESTERS!!
>
>                                            !LuM!

You have my vote on that one.  Most of my final renders are in 1024x768 but
that is to large to test render in.  Would be nice to select different
background sizes based on subproject or have it not matter what the
resolution of the backdrop is.

Bob.............



Date:    Thursday, 26 October 1995 13:04:52 
Subject: Re: 4.0 and Video -Reply reply
From:    "Dan.Maclean" <MACLEDJ@pmitao.usa.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

For Craig
From Dan MacLean:
 
Why would tga files contain pallet information?  If they are 24bits I don't
see the need.  I'm just curious.  Looks like I'll have to give Cmpeg a try
again.  I'm sure I'll find it on compuserve.  Can you recommend a good MPEG
player? I remember xing's player was really fast but cropped the image unless
you registered.
 
About a year ago I tried an animation format called "new age image processor"
that produce really good compression.  The drawback was that the player would
only play off a hard disk.  To get decent playback speed I had to create a ram
disk!  But it was capable of 640x480x256 playback at decent speed.
 
Thanks again!


Date:    Thursday, 26 October 1995 13:18:28 
Subject: RE: Texture/Attrib library
From:    Douglas.D.E.F.Smith@Woodford.avro.bae.eurokom.ie


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

FROM too long. Original FROM is 'Douglas Smith 0161-439-5050x4084 <Douglas.D.E.F
.Smith@Woodford.avro.bae.eurokom.ie>'

----------------------  Original Message Follows  ----------------------


>I was wondering if anyone ever put up an Imagine Texture/Attributes
>library on the Web? Since Imagine can save attributes and texture
>settings in the attrib files, it sure would be great to have a
>collection of all these great texture/attribute settings to
>download. Rather than give long discriptions of how to get a great
>Neon Light....or lizard skin, why not have a dumping station for
>saved attrib files with the settings already make up.

Great Idea !

One minor point though, are the Amiga and PC saved attributes files the same?

I seem to recall someone mentioning problems.

Perhaps some dual platform Imagine user could confirm/refute this.

Cheers, 

Doug.
--
Home: doug@defocus.demon.co.uk
Work: douglas.d.e.f.smith@woodford.avro.bae.eurokom.ie (no binaries please)



Date:    Thursday, 26 October 1995 13:28:55 
Subject: Re: Transparency Mapping
From:    cjo@esrange.ssc.se


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Jim Shinoski wrote;

>Now Mike, I know that you know that I know that you know some of this=20
>stuff already,

Eh, hang on. Give me a minute and I'll have this one figured out.

*---------------------------------------------------------------*
|   Conny Joensson   |   Swedish Space Corp. Esrange            |
|   Kiruna           |   Satellite operations - Telecom Div.    |
|   Sweden           |   cjo@smtpgw.esrange.ssc.se              |
*---------------------------------------------------------------*

Date:    Thursday, 26 October 1995 13:56:43 
Subject: Glows...
From:    milan@Gent.hku.nl (Milan Polle)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi all,

about the glows question, ISN'T ANYBODY USING MY ANMFLARE TEXTURE?
It makes a really neat flare out of a cube (or any object at all)
viewable from any angle, responding to relative camera position and
has a seperate edge color. IS ANYBODY USING MY TEXTURES AT ALL?
I won't complain about the shareware fee, nobody is paying, so
who cares. How about my metal texture, it is my personal favourite.
I would like to have some feedback, send me some jpegs that use my
textures or something. It makes creating textures a lot more fun.
I have a lot of textures waiting to be finished (snow, parquet
and some more neat stuff), but I need some motivation to release
them. Oh yeah, my textures are amiga-imagine3.x only.
Anybody tested cleanupslice yet ? Let me know what you think.

Mail to milan@bmt.hku.nl, if it won't work, mail to the list
(sorry).

Let your Imagination run wild,

greetings, Milan



Date:    Thursday, 26 October 1995 14:12:40 
Subject: Re:Craig and processor speed info...
From:    "Dan.Maclean" <MACLEDJ@pmitao.usa.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

From Dan MacLean:
When you say Disney feature animation I'm sure you mean California.  But just
in case you are at the Disney/MGM Studios theme park I used to work there in
operations up to 10 months ago.  I was fascinated with what little CGI work
they did.  I remember an animated short about a rocking horse breaking free
from its slides and haven't heard of it since.  I've always been interested in
special effects in general and Computer Graphics specifically.I'm no artist,
but using Imagine allows me to do things that would be impossible for me to do
with traditional means.
 
I've since moved my family to Ohio where I work as a manufacturing engineer.
I'm lucky that I have the ability to use Imagine and captured video frames in
my job creating work instructions.  It is hardly the cutting edge though!  But
it is a lot of fun reading from people who are doing what I secretly dream of
doing.  Thank you and keep it up!


Date:    Thursday, 26 October 1995 14:26:41 
Subject: Re: Win-Imagine
From:    Jim Rix <jim@yakko.cs.wmich.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



> I've been running an "Uptime" monitor over the last couple of months, and my
> Amiga has managed about 40% usage.
> 
> This has recently peaked to just under 80% over the last week or two.
> (I'm rounding up some half finished projects)
> 
> How do you folks manage ?
> 
One the two Amigas I have they both have close to 100% "Uptime."  It is 
impossible to have 100% because of acts of God.

Jim Rix
http://yakko.cs.wmich.edu

Date:    Thursday, 26 October 1995 14:50:45 
Subject: Re: Transparency Mapping
From:    Jim Rix <jim@yakko.cs.wmich.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Wed, 25 Oct 1995, Mike Vandersommen wrote:

> 
> Ok, without beating this thing to death, i've got one more problem
> to solve using transparency mapping of a logo on glass. I've got
> the maps to come out perfect on glass. However, when I tweek
> the FILTER color of the object's attributes to ...say..give the
> bottle a greener tint, the transparency map doesn't change with
> it. In other words, the bottle has a green tint, but the map
> still is clear transparent.  Is there any way to allow the
> attributes of the object to match that of transparent part of
> the map?
> 

Unfortunately, a filter map totally overrides an objects base 
attributes.  In order to get the object to have the tranparency you want 
you must change the rgb values of the filter map.

To compute what color you want you object to appear you must use reverse 
colors.  This means the following.

Determine the color you want to have you object.  Find that colors rbg 
values that range from 0; totally absent, to 255; totally present.  
Subtract these three RGB values from 255 and use them to make the color 
you want.  This way Imagine will make your object to colors which are in 
the filter map.

Jim Rix
http://yakko.cs.wmich.edu

Date:    Thursday, 26 October 1995 15:08:24 
Subject: World Builder
From:    jprusins@cybergrafix.com (John Prusinski)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi,
I just got a promotional package (video & brochure) for a piece of software 
called World Builder from Digimation; thought it might be of interest to 
others on the list.  The software seems to be VERY similar to VistaPro, with 
a couple of major improvements and one major drawback (and some minor ones).

The major advantages over VistaPro are 1: realistic water, including 
animatable ripples/waves and reflections; and 2: Over 100 kinds of extremely 
realistic vegetation, (craggy bark on trees, real 3D leaves on trees & 
bushes, flowers. etc.) including animatable realistic grass.  The tape that 
came with it is fairly amateurish in production quality, and is mostly a 
slide show of still images, but at the end there are several stunning 
animated sequences, including a closeup flyover of a grassy riverbank with 
the grass BLOWING IN THE WIND very realistically.  They claim to use a 
particle animation system for this, and I was trying to figure out how to 
accomplish a similar effect in Imagine... I can imagine (pun) using perhaps 
spline editor-created blades of grass as the base object for the particle 
effect, and setting some key frames for the motion, but I'm not sure how to 
get the effect of having the "root" end of the blades anchored while the 
tips wave in the "breeze".  If anyone has any ideas I'd be interested to 
hear them.
The other big plus about this software is that it imports 3DS files; one of 
the animated sequences showed the well-known 3DS T-Rex tromping through an 
African savannah-like landscape, from the POV of his prey, with the jaws 
snapping at you as he towers over you.  Apparently it also exports in 3DS 
format, which probably leads to some huge files, but might be useful if you 
have one of those 3DS to IOB converters...

On the negative side, from the tape it would seem that the vegetation is not 
very customizable, unless the people who put the tape together were just 
lazy... I saw the camera pass three trees in a row that appeared identical 
in terms of shape (number and angle of branches, leaf mass, etc.).  And, oh 
yes, the big drawback: the sofware retails for around $1200 ($995 
introductory offer...)

John

________________________________________________
|  "The next great step toward a planetary holism is a     |
|    partial merging of the technologically transformed    |
|    human world with the archaic matrix of vegetable     |
|    intelligence that is the Overmind of the planet."        |
|                                                    -Terence McKenna         |
|_______________________________________________| 


Date:    Thursday, 26 October 1995 16:27:57 
Subject: Glows the annoying way!
From:    "Dan.Maclean" <MACLEDJ@pmitao.usa.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

From Dan MacLean:
I've mentioned this on compuserve; I have a convoluted way to achieve glows.
-Render the scene as usual with white discs with soft edges where lights are.
-Render the scene with no lights and the white discs as bright objects.
-Use an image editing program (I have Photostyler 2.0) to blur the white on
black image.  You can adjust the color too if you want colored lights.
-Composite the blurred image with the full rendering using "add" (otherwise
the black will darken the full rendering.
 
 
 
The main problem is that objects don't get "brighter" when the get closer to
the camera.  They just get bigger, which really doesn't happen with a glow.
But it looks good!  It is just really time consuming.
 
I think this shows how easy it would be for Imagine to accomplish this same
effect as a post rendering process.  In addition, Imagine could keep track of
how close the light is to the camera and adjust the "hotness" of the glow
accordingly.
 
Note to everyone:  Whenever anyone of you gets 4.0, I expect you to start
singing!  We need the scoop.  Some of us are very impatient.


Date:    Thursday, 26 October 1995 17:23:07 
Subject: Re: Some processor speed info...
From:    Curcio Nicholas <curcion@db.erau.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Wed, 25 Oct 1995 craigh@fa.disney.com wrote:

> Okay, this is getting a little out of hand.

Speaking of getting out of hand...

Would you mind explaining to me why my room mates OLD Indigo with only a 
33Mhz R3000 renders the same scene 6 times faster than his A4000/040/25?  
Does that mean that the 133Mhz R4400's aren't any faster than a 33Mhz R3000?

nik

P.S.  When I stated a week ago that the SGI version of LighWave is $1k, I 
was indeed incorrect.  That's the NT/Mips version.  Sorry about that.  I 
saw the Mips and not the NT.  The SGI version IS in fact $2k.  Of course, 
WinImagine is about $1700....

Date:    Thursday, 26 October 1995 18:27:50 
Subject: Re: Imagine ported to BeBox? (fwd)
From:    Soeren Birk Jacobsen <kurgan@imada.ou.dk>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


On Thu, 19 Oct 1995, Robert King (ART) wrote:

> On Thu, 19 Oct 1995, Soeren Birk Jacobsen wrote:
>
> > Well the point is that a few weeks ago A4000-60 Tower was released,
> > here in Denmark it is selling for approx $3000.- plus tax.
> >
> >
> > kurgan
>
> Are the A4000's flying out the door at $3000-pluse tax?  What does 90 mhz
> Pentium go for over there?
>
> I have 25 mhz 030 2500 but I'm going to get a pentium after hearing about
> the speed Imagine renders at.  I wonder what the comparison of an 060
> A4000 to 133 mhz Pentium in rendering speed would show?
>
> Robert King     king@arts.usf.edu
>


Well about the speed I don't know (I'd hate to run Win NT/95)

prize:approx the same as A4000-60


Date:    Thursday, 26 October 1995 18:30:36 
Subject: Re: The glow issue . . . (fwd)
From:    Soeren Birk Jacobsen <kurgan@imada.ou.dk>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  




On Thu, 19 Oct 1995 CoryJ44@aol.com wrote:

>    There seems to be a bit of a discrepancy here . . . some people are
pretty
> convinced that Imagine needs dedicated "glow-support", while others say
that > glows are a simple feature to take advantage of in Imagine . . . if
it's as > easy as the latter group says, could some of you post some tips?
How can we > make convincing neon or "warm" candle glows?  It's not that I
don't believe > you, I'd just like to know how the gurus do it.
>
>                                               Cory
>
Well I usually do this:

-Create a 'roundish' object (what I mean it should be smooth around the
 edges)
-set the 'fog' requester to 0.01 (you can set it to 0.0001, then the
 requester just shows 0.00, but it's still 0.0001!!!!)
-add 'ghost' texture
-set texturerequester foglength to 2 (this really depend on the size
 of your object, fiddle with it)
-then there ist the edgevalue (I can't remember the name of this setting
 but it's the next one..., set it to 1 (you can also set it to 0.9, but I
 usually got with 1)
-set the object color to ... blue ???
-render
there you have it a glowing blue object.

Steven Blackmon has some great tutorials on
'www.websharx.com:80/~kinda/tips/newtip.html' check them out!!!!!





kurgan


Date:    Thursday, 26 October 1995 18:32:25 
Subject: Re: 4.0 Docs and other things (fwd)
From:    Soeren Birk Jacobsen <kurgan@imada.ou.dk>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


On Fri, 20 Oct 1995, Dan.Maclean wrote:

>
> >From Dan MacLean:
>
> I haven't tried the ghost texture, but fog disappointed me.  Fog doesn't
> behave like a true glow.  The brightness drops off toward the outer edges
of
a
> glow, and a glow never appears darker than what is behind it.  i.e. a
> lightsaber would not glow red in front of a bright white background, since
the
> red would be a lesser brightness value.  Fog does exactly this.  In
addition,
> a glow will appear in front of objects that obscure part of the glowing
> object.  Fog does not behave this way either.
>
> I've read suggestions about using the glow button on the lensflare
effect. > I'll have to try this.  The new global lensflare works correctly,
as far as
I
> know, in that it only disappears when the lightsource is totally obscured
> (spelling?).  Unfortunately, this only allows for round lights and not
neon > signs.Maybe you can combine many lightsources to get the effect?
Thanks for > your help!
>

Well... to do the 'glow in front of obscuring object'-thing, all impulse
had to do was to include a 'globalflaring'-effect (not lensflare!!!!),
and then add a 'no-flare-for-me'-flag on each object/attribute?
unfortunately this is not the case.
All I can say is WISH HARDER!!!!!

kurgan


Date:    Thursday, 26 October 1995 18:42:00 
Subject: New from impulse
From:    drift@nighthawk.com (Drift Dennis)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

 I talked to Mike H the other day concerning winimagine and future things.
Being a subscriber to both the PC and Amiga ungrade programs, I am
interested in both upgrade paths and in WinImagine.
 He said that after WinImagine is out, probably in Jan or Feb, he has
another project that he has been playing with that he wants to complete. He
says that this piece of software could make all present 3D programs obsolete.
 My impression from what he did and didn't say suggests some kind of
animation creation program working in 3D with objects created elsewhere.
Object creation is not what the program seems to be about so much as
animation. Info is very sketchy to nearly nonexistant at this time, he said
he would not talk about it.
 Anywho, any Amiga upgrades, nor possibly even DOS upgrades are actually
being planned at this time, NOR are they being NOT considered, if that makes
sence.
 Its a wait and see game for now.
 Those on the constant upgrade programs should be seeing 4.0 soon ??????
 WinImagine will be available to all upgraders when it is available
Drift
 Drift Dennis    
   {kc7ot}                  
 drift@nighthawk.com                     May The Force Be With You
 
 NightHawk Production
 3D graphics and animation
 9403 Marilla Dr 
 Lakeside, California               The true miracle is that we exist at all, 
 92040-2801                             let alone the we are here and now.
 PHONE 619-390-8375
 FAX   619-390-8375       PLEASE STOP BY OUR WEB SITE, we would appreciate
                           hearing from you at http://www.nighthawk.com
   Using Amiga and PC technologies in symbotic harmony                        
****************************************************************************
******
A2k-030@50mhz+20Meg/A4k-040@40Mhz+50Meg/PAR/1stopMusicShop/+6gigHDspace&PC+20Meg

****^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
^^^^^^


Date:    Thursday, 26 October 1995 18:43:00 
Subject: Speed trials
From:    drift@nighthawk.com (Drift Dennis)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

 I haven't really figured out how to decode the files sent out for speed
trials here some short time ago. But I do have a comparison that may be of
interest. Since I am also unsure as to how to send the picture file, I am
not including a copy of the chosen scene herein.
 The scene was a flat plane made to look like water with waves.
 Standing in a row, parallel to the screen are 6 pillers of jade and gold
with crowns of diamond.
 Background Pic is a photo of a very red cloudy sunset
 A chrome looking pic is set for refections
 A large Gold Extruded company logo is floating in air in front of the
pillers, tilted to catch the sole lightsourse above and to the right of the
camera. This casts a large shadow over parts of the pillers and water.
 An Amiga 4000, 40 Mhz Warp Drive, 50 Megs of Ram, PAR, and about 4 gigs of HD
     20 Minutes 17 seconds
 A 486DX2-66, 16 Megs of RAM, 2 gigs of HD, S3 windows accel video card
     20 minutes 11 seconds
 A 586-100, 24 Megs of RAM, 2 Gigs of HD, Diamond Stelth 64 video card
     11 minutes 20 seconds

 I upgraded my 486 by giving my father the 486 mother board and buying
myself the CYREX 586 MB. I didn't want to replace all of my VLB bus boards.
As it is, I was have some problems with the old video bios clashing with the
586 bios, or  some such BS, so I relaced the vid card with a diamond stealth
64. The 586 does not like this card either, at least not untill I loaded in
Win 95. Then the win 95 diamond stealth drivers it doesnt mind, but I still
cannot load in the drivers that came with the board.
 But for relativly little money, I cut my rendering in time almost in half,
and got specs slightly better then a pentium 75, or was it a 90??? I don't
remember......
 Drift Dennis    
   {kc7ot}                  
 drift@nighthawk.com                     May The Force Be With You
 
 NightHawk Production
 3D graphics and animation
 9403 Marilla Dr 
 Lakeside, California               The true miracle is that we exist at all, 
 92040-2801                             let alone the we are here and now.
 PHONE 619-390-8375
 FAX   619-390-8375       PLEASE STOP BY OUR WEB SITE, we would appreciate
                           hearing from you at http://www.nighthawk.com
   Using Amiga and PC technologies in symbotic harmony                        
****************************************************************************
******
A2k-030@50mhz+20Meg/A4k-040@40Mhz+50Meg/PAR/1stopMusicShop/+6gigHDspace&PC+20Meg

****^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
^^^^^^


Date:    Thursday, 26 October 1995 19:15:11 
Subject: RE: Glows.....Hey, Milan.....
From:    Michael Whitten <mw@lenti.med.umn.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


>Hi all,
>
>about the glows question, ISN'T ANYBODY USING MY ANMFLARE TEXTURE?
>It makes a really neat flare out of a cube (or any object at all)
>viewable from any angle, responding to relative camera position and
>has a seperate edge color. IS ANYBODY USING MY TEXTURES AT ALL?
>I won't complain about the shareware fee, nobody is paying, so
>who cares. How about my metal texture, it is my personal favourite.
>I would like to have some feedback, send me some jpegs that use my
>textures or something. It makes creating textures a lot more fun.
>I have a lot of textures waiting to be finished (snow, parquet
>and some more neat stuff), but I need some motivation to release
>them. Oh yeah, my textures are amiga-imagine3.x only.
>Anybody tested cleanupslice yet ? Let me know what you think.

>Mail to milan@bmt.hku.nl, if it won't work, mail to the list
>(sorry).
>
>Let your Imagination run wild,
>
>greetings, Milan

I dl'ed your four excellent textures a year ago from Aminet and the docs said
they were freeware....but, now you're talking about even newer things I 
have'nt heard about.  You sold me, Milan, I think you're stuff is great and
I'm sure others think exactly the same way.  Is your newer shareware software
on Aminet?  

Michael

PS: (My favorite of yours is the clipmap texture.)

 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
 +    M.D. Whitten   mw@lenti.med.umn.edu    Sentience is overrated.   +
 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+


Date:    Thursday, 26 October 1995 19:35:54 
Subject: Re:4.0 and Video
From:    sgiff@airmail.net (Stephen Gifford)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

For those interested in a good Windows Mpeg player works in 95 or 3.1 contact
this Website:  http://www.cs.tu-berlin.de/~phade/mpeg.html

Download Compcore's Softpeg for Windows.

s.g.


Date:    Thursday, 26 October 1995 19:46:29 
Subject: PAR PC
From:    sgiff@airmail.net (Stephen Gifford)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Just curious if anyone has a PAR for the PC.  I just bought one, and on the back

of the box it says that it can render directly to the PAR drive on the
Amiga.  It is not clear whether it does so on the PC.  Question is, can you
render directly to PAR and also do you use the Field render option when
doing so.  Also is there any compatibility problems with using it under Win 95?

Thanks.

Stephen G.


Date:    Thursday, 26 October 1995 21:00:17 
Subject: Re: 4.0 and Video
From:    Chris Hall <Chris.Hall@dial.pipex.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 04:10 PM 10/25/95, you wrote:
>>From Dan MacLean:
>Flh is a PC animation format that allows animations at various resolutions and
>with more than just 256 colors.  There is also the Flt format and I'm not sure
>of the differences.  Perhaps one is 16.7 million colors and the other is 16
>bit color.  640x480x16bit seems to run well if there isn't a whole lot of
>movement going on.  Unfortunately I don't think there is a standard for
>320x200 at 16 or 24 bit.  320x200x256 colors SCREAMSon my 486DX4/100 w/ 20MB
>ram! It is so f ast it produces what seems like a real time motion blur
>effect. It has to be over 100 frames per second.I did a vistapro animation of
>130 frames and you co uldn't follow it without slowing it down.  640x480 is
>just too big. I wish the pc had double buffering (video cards have it, in
>fact, but animation players don't use it.  Just games.)  Double buffering
>makes slow playing animations look much better.
> 
>Enough rambling for now!
>

FLH is high-colour and FLT is true colour. A utility exists called Dave's
Targa Animator that will take a collection of TGA (or gif, pcx, jpg etc) and
make them into either FLI,FLH or FLT format files. Another utility exists
that will play these FLH and FLT file called Daves Flic Viewer. It loads the
anim into ram and plays it from there giving very good performance with
loads of colours at 640x480. DTA will do a host of other useful things as
well and is well worth getting. If you are interested they can both be had
from ftp.povray.org.

Chris Hall.

|--------------------------------------------------------|\
| You have been spoken to by Chris Hall                  ||
| A very tall and generally nice bloke from Great Briton ||
|                                                        ||
| E- mail me at : Hmmm. That's a tough one.              ||
| WWW home page temporarily pulled down !!               ||
|                                                        ||
| Today's lucky lottery numbers are :-                   ||
|              40 05 17 37 35 07                         ||
|--------------------------------------------------------||
 \--------------------------------------------------------\



Date:    Thursday, 26 October 1995 22:25:28 
Subject: To: Dan MacLean
From:    beeton@SEDSystems.ca (Gary Beeton - SED Systems)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

>I'm lucky that I have the ability to use Imagine and captured video frames in
>my job creating work instructions.

Dan,

I wish to know more.  Could you email me privately?  Thanks.

Gary Beeton
beeton@SEDSystems.ca 

Date:    Friday, 27 October 1995 00:25:37 
Subject: Re: INTUITIVE Bones
From:    Valleyview@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I don't have any experience with LW, but from what I have seen and read,
"bones" basically works the same in all packages. You place your bones,
establish heirarchy, and use direct or inverse kinematics to move them.

I am just about finished with a lengthy tutorial that I have been working on
for some time. (I haven't been working a long time on it, it has just taken
me a long time) It covers some modeling, bones, IK, states, and animation.
I'm trying to make it detailed for the new user. It is just a rough draft,
but if you would be interested it "beta testing" it, let me know and I'll
send it to you. It includes objects at differant levels of completion to
coincide with the tut. 

I also built a walking "M" in under 10 minutes. (actually I had to spend
another 5 minutes correcting a stupid "haste makes waste" mistake)  I will
include it.

Rick

ps - If you are interested let me know if you can receive and use zip or lha
files.

Date:    Friday, 27 October 1995 01:27:47 
Subject: Re: new from impulse
From:    sgiff@airmail.net (Stephen Gifford)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I have an idea for a new feature that I think would save a lot of time.  In
the detail editor when selecting points you have three options.  Point and
click, Drag Box and Lasso.  If you have ever tried to use the later of the
three, you may have noticed that it is quite difficult to navigate the mouse
in lasso mode through a complex maze of points.  Especially if you have a
little nasty piece of dust or lint that is causing your mouse to not roll
smoothly.  What about a lasso mode that would act like a pair of scissors
and allow you to cut out a section by creating a polygon around the
selection you were trying access.  This way you could easily navigate
through a complex maze my simply clicking and moving the mouse to draw the
selection instead of trying to actually draw a smooth line.  You could also
add an automatic scrolling feature that would move the screen automatically
as you approach the edge.  This is not new technology or anything.  A lot of
Winders and probably Amiga programs have been using this type of selection
tool for years.

Stephen G.


Date:    Friday, 27 October 1995 02:38:23 
Subject: Smoothing and point reduction
From:    ALANULL@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

A couple of questions:

1.  Will 4.0 support adjustable smoothing?  By that I mean you can
interactively set the the angle from 0 to 180 degrees that is smoothed
between 2 surfaces.  This may help clean-up the edges after the Boolean
operations.

2.  Any programs out there for point reduction, DXF would be fine.  Again I
would like this for after boolean operations.  Typically there is no way for
me to select the for smoothing (way too many points to work out, especially
when doing complex organic objects.)

Thanks for any suggestions.

Date:    Friday, 27 October 1995 02:59:50 
Subject: Some forms editor tips
From:    David Alan Steiger <das@ceti.csustan.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hello.

I love Imagine's forms editor.  I think its one of its best features.  I
must admit I didn't really get into it until a year ago.  But now most of
my good objects are at least partly based in the forms editor.  I built an
animatable human figure for a game I am involved with, composed entirely of
form objects.
      To me it's a more intuitive way of creating objects.  I've worked
with sculpting clay, and making objects feels similar to what I've been 
taught.  Now I don't know what I would do without the forms editor!  

I'm no Renderbrant, but here are some tips for beginners.
(It's late, so excuse me if it makes no sense)

1) Don't expect precision.  

      The forms editor isn't made for exact, mechanical objects.  You can
make them, but expect to do a lot of vertex tweeking.
      Its great for torsos, drumsticks (both kinds) muscles, and rounded
objects like chicklets, old refrigerators, or safes.

2) Top view is a little different from Front & Right.

      The default section type, "X-Y cross section" causes the Top view
to work somewhat differently than the Front and Right views.  "Y-Z cross
section" does the same for the Right view.  I'll keep my talk to the 
default X-Y.
      Each pair of points in the Front or Right view correspond to a
ring (cross-section) in the shape of the Top view shape.  The width between
these two points in the Front view define the cross-section's X-size.  The
width between these two points in the Right view define the cross-section's
Y-size.  The Top view shap will be squashed and stretched to fit these sizes.
The points of each view also define the angle of the cross section.
      The Front and Right views alone define the max width, height, and
depth of the object.  So what does the Top view do?  
      The Top view shape's effect is relative.  If you scale X and Y
simultaneously, nothing will change.  Only the position differences between
its vertices make a difference.

3) The most important point with the Top view is the fact that you may have
multiple cross-section shapes.  

      This allows you to create a whole sword out of one form.  Circular
cross-section hilt.  Square T-bar.  Thin diamond-shaped blade.  And Imagine
will morph between two defined cross-sections.

4) At first, keep angles gentle.  

      Usually, severe jagged edges, peaks, or troughs only work well if
or it's done in the Top view, or some sort of symmetry is active.
      I have many forms that break this rule, but following it will keep
you from frustration while you learn.

5) At first, keep Front and Right points at roughly the same height.

      Note that when you drag a point in the Front or Right views, you
get feedback as to where its partner point and the other view's partner
points are.  This is important.  A lot of my first screwups were because of
overlap problems.
      This isn't to say you must follow this rule, many of my better
forms don't.  But you have to be careful not to get overlapping mess-ups.

6) Rotate that perspective view!

      A lot of forms errors can be hidden behind (or worse, inside) an
otherwise nice form.


Hope this helps a bit.

Dave

------------------/-------------------------------------/---------------------
David Steiger    / CSU Stanislaus / Computer Artist,   / If you can read this,
das@csustan.edu /  CS/Art major  /  Slipshod Software /  I'm procrastinating!
--------------------------------/---------------------------------------------


Date:    Friday, 27 October 1995 05:00:28 
Subject: Re: PAR PC
From:    Curtcee@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

On 10/26/95 Stephen Gifford wrote:
>Just curious if anyone has a PAR for the PC.  I just bought one, and on the
back
>of the box it says that it can render directly to the PAR drive on the
>Amiga.  It is not clear whether it does so on the PC.  Question is, can you
>render directly to PAR and also do you use the Field render option when
>doing so.  Also is there any compatibility problems with using it under Win
95?

I have the PAR for the PC and I was originally told that Imagine
(specifically) had some sort ot problem when you tried a direct capture to
the PAR. Because of this I always have used the intermediate method (render
the frames to the system hdd and then run PAR and import them to the PAR
drive). I never actually tried the direct method using Imagine so maybe the
last upgrade or two has corrected the problem. And as for field rendering,
well it depends on how long you want to wait for your renders. My own
experience has taught me that field rendering is not essential but in some
circumstances (lots of movement or fast movement at least) it is preferable
to frame rendering. I may be wrong (and the last time I did this I wasn't
wrong) but field rendering actually takes twice as long as frame rendering.
And I plan to be the last human being to buy Win95 so I can't help you there.
I have never tried to run the PAR "under" Win 3.11 either. When I run a DOS
program I ALWAYS quit Windows. Hope this didn't just leave you even more
confused.

Curtis Carlson
Curtcee@aol.com



Date:    Friday, 27 October 1995 09:21:32 
Subject: Re: 4.0 and Video -Reply reply
From:    Bill Boyce <bilboyce@iconz.co.nz>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 01:04 PM 26/10/95, you wrote:
>For Craig
>>From Dan MacLean:
> 
>Why would tga files contain pallet information?  If they are 24bits I don't

Pallet information is interpreted thusly :

 6
___
___
___

Means stack no more than 6 files to a pallet.

(forgive me, it's late and it's been a busy week)


Date:    Friday, 27 October 1995 09:47:19 
Subject: Re: Win-Imagine
From:    Bill Boyce <bilboyce@iconz.co.nz>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 08:22 PM 23/10/95 -0500, you wrote:
>Well, if Apple is smart and wants to save itself it will have written NT
>compatibility into its PowerePC chip or IBM has come out with a ri Power PC
>chip that runs NT or one of the clone chip makers start making a PowerPC
>that runs NT.  Everyone I've read says All windows users are moving towards
-SNIP-
>Stephen G.
>
Err, NT is written for a particular processor, not the other way around. Oh,
and the Power PC chip is basically an IBM chip which Apple has used.

I believe a version of NT is coming for the PPC, too.

None of which will run Imagine (just to keep it relevant :)



Date:    Friday, 27 October 1995 09:47:23 
Subject: Re: PAL resolution; was: Re: PAR settings
From:    Bill Boyce <bilboyce@iconz.co.nz>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 03:22 PM 24/10/95 +0100, you wrote:
>In case some might wonder what the "official" resolution is for a PAL 
>full overscan video signal: it's 768x576
>
>Frank Van der Auwera
>University of Antwerp 
>
>fvdauwer@uia.ac.be

Actually PAL is an analog standard, and as such any discussions of
horizontal resolutions are fairly arbitrary. The engineers where I
record often comment on the excessive width of my output when I
use 768 x 576. Usually I use 752 x 576, which is fine.


Date:    Friday, 27 October 1995 09:52:04 
Subject: Re: Glows, I have an idea...
From:    Bill Boyce <bilboyce@iconz.co.nz>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 07:54 AM 26/10/95 -0400, you wrote:
>In a message dated 95-10-25 23:03:17 EDT, you write:
>
>>I REALLY WISH THE BACKGROUND IMAGE FOR RENDERS SHOULD BE MOVED TO THE
>>SUBPROJECT REQUESTOR THING.  THE REASON IS IF I HAVE 4 SUBPROJECTS WITH
>>DIFFERENT RESOLUTION I HAVE TO CHANGE THE NAME OF THE IMAGE IN THE ACTION
>>EDITOR ALL THE TIME!!  IT SHOULD BE IN THE SAME REQUESTOR WITH THE
>>RESOLUTION OF THE RENDERS!!!
>>

4.0 does it the way it should be - not in subprojects, still in Globals,
but independent. That is, the backdrop is scaled to fit the current 
resolution. We've waited far to long for this feature, that's for sure!
If I see "Backdrop image is the wrong resolution" once more, I'll scream.


Date:    Friday, 27 October 1995 09:57:02 
Subject: Re: Texture/Attrib library
From:    Bill Boyce <bilboyce@iconz.co.nz>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 09:37 AM 26/10/95, someone wrote:
>-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
-SNIP-
>
>
>

Is a 50 line post really necessary for a one line reply??? Please people,
trim your quotes and keep the bandwidth down! Some of us pay for our mail.

Nothing personal, just a general comment.


Date:    Friday, 27 October 1995 10:00:23 
Subject: Re: Transparency Mapping
From:    Bill Boyce <bilboyce@iconz.co.nz>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 02:50 PM 26/10/95 -0400, you wrote:
>
>Unfortunately, a filter map totally overrides an objects base 
>attributes.  In order to get the object to have the tranparency you want 
>you must change the rgb values of the filter map.
>
>To compute what color you want you object to appear you must use reverse 
>colors.  This means the following.
>
>Determine the color you want to have you object.  Find that colors rbg 
>values that range from 0; totally absent, to 255; totally present.  
>Subtract these three RGB values from 255 and use them to make the color 
>you want.  This way Imagine will make your object to colors which are in 
>the filter map.
>
>Jim Rix
>http://yakko.cs.wmich.edu
>
Or you could set the colour in the filter map to the ones you want,
and click Inverse Video in the Brushmap requester. 
Just seemed easier...


Date:    Friday, 27 October 1995 23:57:00 
Subject: Texture/Attrib libraries
From:    mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com (Mike Vandersommen)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

-> From: Douglas Smith 0161-439-5050x4084-> Great Idea !-> One minor point thoug
h, are the Amiga and PC saved attributes file=s t-> I seem to recall someone men
tioning problems.Actually, the attribute files are interchangable with Amiga/PC.
 Thetextures aren't, but all the attrib file does is set the parameters a=ndloca
tion for the texture....and that's the big plus!   /----------------------------
--           ___   ___  ___   ___  | Mike van der Sommen                     / _
_  /__/ /__/  /_   \ /  | Santa Barbara, Ca.                     /___/ / \  /  /
  /     / \  | mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com     HAUS BBS (805-683-1388)
  |           "Blackouts make for nice breaks in the day"   \___________________
__________________________________________--- =FE InterNet - GraFX Haus BBS - Sa
nta Barbara, Ca - (805) 683-1388

Date:    Saturday, 28 October 1995 00:05:00 
Subject: Transparency Mapping
From:    mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com (Mike Vandersommen)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

-> From: Jim Rix <jim@yakko.cs.wmich.edu>->-> Unfortunately, a filter map totall
y overrides an objects base-> attributes.  In order to get the object to have th
e tranparency yo=u w-> you must change the rgb values of the filter map.Yes, tha
t was pointed out....and it works just fine.-> To compute what color you want yo
u object to appear you must use-> reverse colors.  This means the following.->->
 Determine the color you want to have you object.  Find that colors= rb-> values
 that range from 0; totally absent, to 255; totally present.-> Subtract these th
ree RGB values from 255 and use them to make the =col-> you want.  This way Imag
ine will make your object to colors which =are-> the filter map.Huh? All I did w
as take the RGB values from the FILTER setting inattributes and duplicated that 
color in Photo Finish. Then I filledthe "White" of my filter map with that color
 and it turned outjust right. ... is that what you meant?   /-------------------
-----------           ___   ___  ___   ___  | Mike van der Sommen                     / __  /__/ /__/  /_   \ /  | Santa Barbara, Ca.           
          /___/ / \  /  /  /     / \  | mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com   
  HAUS BBS (805-683-1388)  |           "Blackouts make for nice breaks in the da
y"   \_____________________________________________________________--- =FE Inter
Net - GraFX Haus BBS - Santa Barbara, Ca - (805) 683-1388

Date:    Saturday, 28 October 1995 01:59:24 
Subject: Re: Mirror, Mirror
From:    rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au (Robert Byrne)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hello Brad, on Oct 27 you wrote:

> Robert, Thanks for your reply regarding the mirror point function. I 
> realize that the faucet could have been created in the Forms editor,"the 
> least used editor of all". My problem with the forms editor is the 
> interface. When I am working to create some form using the editor I have 
> trouble with only being able to see the section of points that I am 
> presently moving. If I have a definite shape in mind it is hard to 
> visualize what the preceding shape was in order to increase or decrease 
> the current groups shape. I have always thought that an onion skin effect 
> would make the forms editor much more user friendly.

Could'nt agree more. As far as I can see, the Forms Ed has'nt changed since
V2.0 except maybe for Backdrops and some of the extras added to the Detail
Ed like Smooth Edge Line would improve things.
I find I rely heavily on the Perspective view when changing cross-sections
to see how things are progressing. The thing I found hard to come to grips
with is that the Top view only represents the shape of the cross-section
not the size of the object, size is determined in the other two views. I
generally play around with the points in the Front and Side views to get a
general shape and then refine key areas one at a time to build up some
detail. I've made a complete monitor object with detailed mouldings solely
in the Forms Ed. I've also made the six large arms in a Deep Space 9 type
space station and then conformed them to a curved path in the Detail Ed.

> I agree with your 
> assessment about this editor being the least used. Perhaps someone at 
> Impulse, if they want to continue to include this editor in the package, 
> should be asking themselves why it is and see if they can remedy some of 
> the things that make it so. Maybe an informal questionaire. How about it 
> Imagineers, why don't some of you others use it more?
>                             regards, Brad

It's a powerful editor, but you have to devote a lot of time to it to get
results.

-- Bob

  :  Robert Byrne  : rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au :
  : Amiga A3000/25 :  Ballina, NSW  Australia  :


Date:    Saturday, 28 October 1995 02:13:13 
Subject: Re: Mirror, Mirror -Reply
From:    rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au (Robert Byrne)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hello Peter, on Oct 27 you wrote:

> How do I transfer my object from the detail editor to the forms editor???
> 
> When I save it (or load one from another machine), the FORMS editor
> ALWAYS says it is in the WRONG format.

You can load a Forms object into the Detail Ed but not the reverse. Forms
objects are a special format and have information for the shape of each key
slice and then interpolate between them.

-- Bob

  :  Robert Byrne  : rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au :
  : Amiga A3000/25 :  Ballina, NSW  Australia  :


Date:    Saturday, 28 October 1995 11:33:27 
Subject: Re: Texture/Attrib libraries
From:    gregory denby <gdenby@twain.helios.nd.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


This sounds like a great idea, but, as Mike van der Sommen says:
>but all the attrib file does is set the parameters and location
>for the textures....
This seems to be a problem, because everyone does not have the same
directory structure.  I've not tried moving attibutes from one
machine to another, but won't the same problem show up that happens
when you move an object with texture assignments.  That is, if
created with a path like "3d/imagine/textures," and used later
in a set-up like "im33\textures," you just gewt an error message,
and have to re=load and re-set the textures.

So here's a project for you generous souls with programing skills.
How about a little app that will decode the attribute file into
human readable text so that at least the  various object and texture
parameters can be transfered.

Greg Denby

Date:    Saturday, 28 October 1995 13:33:00 
Subject: Re: new from impulse
From:    Damon LaCaille <nomad@aloha.net>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


Michael,
  I don't think you're getting the right idea.  It looks to me as if he's 
saying that the reason they are even considering continuing Amiga support 
is because of the number of people either upgrading or purchasing the 
Amiga version of Imagine, not because people continue to bitch.

or perhaps I read the message all wrong, but I think most people would 
agree that's what he's trying to say...

*===================*===========================*
| Damon L. LaCaille |  Email - nomad@aloha.net  |
*===================*================*==========*
| "That's a pretty stupid idea John, | A3000/25 |
| I'm afraid I'll have to kill you." |  10/540  |
*====================================*==========*

On Sat, 28 Oct 1995, Michael Rivers wrote:

> See, the squeeky wheel does get the oil :)
> People(or Amiga users in particler), keep on bitch'n about
> Impulses lack of developement for the Amiga :)
> 
> 
> \c3On Fri 27-Oct-1995  8:48p, Mike Halvorson wrote:\q1
> MH> Michael
> 
> MH> ESAD
> 
> MH> Have a nice day, its always good to know that some people are as negative
> MH> as
> MH> they can be and assume that of others.  Your assumption is wrong and I
> MH> have not
> MH> heard of many users going to lightwave, so you must be hearing things.
> MH> You might also like to know that due to the high rate of returns from
>     ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> MH> Amiga
> MH> users we are now considering the next level of development for the Amiga,
>     ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> MH> things
> MH> like Arrex and a new interfact to go along with the present OS.  Of course

>     ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> MH> this
> MH> will mean nothing to you becuase you will have gone to Lightwave and have
> MH> taken
> MH> your cheerfull attuitude and will share it with them, I am sure they will
> MH> be
> MH> happy to welcome you to the fold.  I wonder what you willfind to bitch
> MH> about
> MH> with NewTek,  some people just never get it.
> 
> MH> Mike
> 
> 

Date:    Saturday, 28 October 1995 13:47:00 
Subject: Texture/Attrib library
From:    mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com (Mike Vandersommen)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

-> From: dgrant@dgrant.peinet.pe.ca (Dennis Grant)-> I'd be willing to make a pa
ge for this, if one doesn't exist alrea=dy.-> ---> Dennis Grant               Cy
cor User Support - HTML Developer - G=rapI tried Emailing you directly but I got
 a bounce....So in case you didn't get my Email....that would be great ifyou cou
ld set up a Texture/Attribute depository. Let me know whenit's set up and I'll u
pload the one or two cool attrib files Ihave.If we could get everyone on the IML
 to send you one or two of theirbest attrib/texture setups, we'd be really cooki
n'.Keep me posted on when/where/how....   /------------------------------       
    ___   ___  ___   ___  | Mike van der Sommen                     / __  /__/ /
__/  /_   \ /  | Santa Barbara, Ca.                     /___/ / \  /  /  /     /
 \  | mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com     HAUS BBS (805-683-1388)  |      
     "Blackouts make for nice breaks in the day"   \____________________________
_________________________________--- =FE InterNet - GraFX Haus BBS - Santa Barbara, Ca - (805) 683-1388

Date:    Saturday, 28 October 1995 16:23:58 
Subject: White spot on my mapped object
From:    weiss@epx.cis.umn.edu


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

A probably basic question!

I made a 'button' using the detail editor, creating a plane,extruding it,
and then conforming it about a sphere.

Then I applied a wood oak brush map.

When I quick render, there's always a white spot in the very center of
the button.

The specular highlight is elsewheres, and looks well, specular, so I presume
that isn't the issue.

Ideas?

Thank you,

Jeffrey 


:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
jeff weiss  weiss@epx.cis.umn.edu  TCP/IP 44.94.249.101 N0IRR  612.825.4746 H  
::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::

Date:    Saturday, 28 October 1995 17:54:51 
Subject: Re: new from impulse
From:    mrivers@tbag.org (Michael Rivers)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

See, the squeeky wheel does get the oil :)
People(or Amiga users in particler), keep on bitch'n about
Impulses lack of developement for the Amiga :)


\c3On Fri 27-Oct-1995  8:48p, Mike Halvorson wrote:\q1
MH> Michael

MH> ESAD

MH> Have a nice day, its always good to know that some people are as negative
MH> as
MH> they can be and assume that of others.  Your assumption is wrong and I
MH> have not
MH> heard of many users going to lightwave, so you must be hearing things.
MH> You might also like to know that due to the high rate of returns from
    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
MH> Amiga
MH> users we are now considering the next level of development for the Amiga,
    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
MH> things
MH> like Arrex and a new interfact to go along with the present OS.  Of course
    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
MH> this
MH> will mean nothing to you becuase you will have gone to Lightwave and have
MH> taken
MH> your cheerfull attuitude and will share it with them, I am sure they will
MH> be
MH> happy to welcome you to the fold.  I wonder what you willfind to bitch
MH> about
MH> with NewTek,  some people just never get it.

MH> Mike


Date:    Saturday, 28 October 1995 21:50:00 
Subject: Texture/Attrib library
From:    mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com (Mike Vandersommen)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

-> This seems to be a problem, because everyone does not have the sam=e-> direct
ory structure.  I've not tried moving attibutes from one-> machine to another, b
ut won't the same problem show up that happen=s-> when you move an object with t
exture assignments.  That is, if-> created with a path like "3d/imagine/textures
," and used later-> in a set-up like "im33\textures," you just gewt an error mes
sage,-> and have to re=3Dload and re-set the textures.Well, yes. But so what? Th
e problem is not "where" the texturesare but how to configure them for the effec
t you want.Locating textures is not really a problem anymore....atleast since 3.
=3.Now, even though you may have your attribute files point to a differe=ntdirec
tory for textures (even brushmaps) 3.3 has a browse button toquickly locate ever
ything. As long as you know what texture is needed=,you just point to it.Once yo
u have your attribute file pointing to all the right locations=,just resave it f
or next time. Small price to pay. Much betterthan spending hours getting a texture combo to look right, especiallyif someone already has done al
l the work for you.   /------------------------------           ___   ___  ___  
 ___  | Mike van der Sommen                     / __  /__/ /__/  /_   \ /  | San
ta Barbara, Ca.                     /___/ / \  /  /  /     / \  | mike.vandersom
men@caddy.uu.silcom.com     HAUS BBS (805-683-1388)  |           "Blackouts make
 for nice breaks in the day"   \________________________________________________
_____________--- =FE InterNet - GraFX Haus BBS - Santa Barbara, Ca - (805) 683-1
388

Date:    Saturday, 28 October 1995 22:16:13 
Subject: Re: White spot on my mapped object
From:    Curcio Nicholas <curcion@db.erau.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Sat, 28 Oct 1995 weiss@epx.cis.umn.edu wrote:

> Then I applied a wood oak brush map.
> 
> When I quick render, there's always a white spot in the very center of
> the button.

I'd check the brushmap axes if I were you.  Make sure that your object is
within the positive x, y, and z bounding box of the brush that you see 
when you click on "Edit Axis" in the brush requester.

Good luck!

nik


Date:    Saturday, 28 October 1995 23:04:55 
Subject: Re: Kinematic Controls and Constraints
From:    RJay9@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I've been trying to get Imagine's Kinematic controls to work and its driving
me crazy.  I've set up the necessary pairs of grouped object and when I move
(actually rotate) the lowest level child in the chain all seem to work when I
watch the bounding boxes in the interactive on screen rotate mode.   But when
I exit the interactive mode all that has moved are the axis of the objects
other than the lowest child which has rotated.  All the other objects in the
chain have their axis moved as I want, but the points and surfaces haven't
moved!!!  What am i missing??

While I'm asking questions, what does the joint locks (on the Freese Items
requestor) do and how do you use it?  Is it part of my problem?  Is there any
useful documentation on kinematic controls?

Thanks for your help..

Jay Ruppel

Date:    Saturday, 28 October 1995 23:05:00 
Subject: Re: Where is Apex
From:    RJay9@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Does anyone know what has happen to Apex.  I'm tring to update to the  PC
versions of Essence, but I've gotten no response to faxes and the phone just
rings whenever I call?  Whats up?

Jay Ruppel

Date:    Sunday, 29 October 1995 00:27:55 
Subject: Re: Win-Imagine/ PPC
From:    Bill Boyce <bilboyce@iconz.co.nz>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 06:22 PM 27/10/95 -0600, you wrote:
>
>
>On Fri, 27 Oct 1995, Bill Boyce wrote:
>
>> and the Power PC chip is basically an IBM chip which Apple has used.
>
>Wrong. The PowerPC is a Motorola RISC(I think) chip. IBM had nothing to 
>do with it's development, distribution, marketing, etc., etc., on ad 
>infinitum. I don't mean to sound like an asshole or anything; just 
>pointing out a mistake. =)
>
>See ya,
>     Roger
>
Thanks for making me check my facts, but beg to differ. IBM was instrumental
- quote from Motorola's web site :

"FISHKILL, N.Y., October 26, 1995 - IBM and Motorola today announced plans to
collaborate on the development of common semi-conductor manufacturing
processes to build future generations of the most advanced PowerPC(tm) chips. 

Both IBM and Motorola manufacture PowerPC microprocessors designed by the
Somerset Design Center, part of a powerful technology alliance between
Apple, IBM and Motorola."

PPC is based on an IBM Risc chip (the RS/6000) with help from Motorola, 
and is manufactured by Motorola and IBM, and other vendors.
Interestingly it is estimated it only costs $75 to make PPC601, compared
to $480 for Intel to make a Pentium!

It'll be interesting to see what Escom has decided to go with for future
Amigas. So we can run Imagine faster (had to tie it in somehow!)


Date:    Sunday, 29 October 1995 00:42:38 
Subject: Re: Kinematic Controls and Constraints
From:    Bill Boyce <bilboyce@iconz.co.nz>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 07:04 PM 28/10/95 -0400, you wrote:
>I've been trying to get Imagine's Kinematic controls to work and its driving
>me crazy.  I've set up the necessary pairs of grouped object and when I move
>(actually rotate) the lowest level child in the chain all seem to work when I
>watch the bounding boxes in the interactive on screen rotate mode.   But when
>I exit the interactive mode all that has moved are the axis of the objects
>other than the lowest child which has rotated.  All the other objects in the
>chain have their axis moved as I want, but the points and surfaces haven't
>moved!!!  What am i missing??
>

sounds like you need to do a Bones Update ?


Date:    Sunday, 29 October 1995 01:23:11 
Subject: Re: Transparency Mapping
From:    sgiff@airmail.net (Stephen Gifford)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I wanted to post this but couldn't find the article when the topic was being
discussed.  But here is a small excerpt from an article in 3D artist mag.
Issue #18  written by Wolfgang Neugebauer and Robert Kubin.  They have a CD
Rom that can be purchased full of clip maps.  They can be reached at Modern
Media Technologies, Gugerlehnerstr. 22, A-4400 Steyr, Austria,
43-7252/540-382, -384 fax.

The article was on creating Transparency Maps or Clip Maps.  This section
deals with Imagine:

>>The Principle:

It is enough to represent some objects such as a door, with a colorful 2d
picture mapped onto a 3D rectangular object.  But more complex pictures ,
such as people or trees, are a bigger problem.  You have to use a method to
cut away the picture's background-to make the background transparent.

To do this, we use two different bitmap files.  One file contains the color
picture of the object (the color map), wh9le the other (the alpha map)
contains the grayscale bitmap, which defines the transparent parts of the
color map.

Before going into your animation program, generate the alpha map from you
scanned bitmap.  Use an image processing tool such as Adobe Photoshop to
black out the background.  Create a copy of the file and convert it to
grayscale.  Modify contrast and brightness until you get a pure black and
white contrast between the object and its background.  Finally, invert the
bitmap if your program uses white to define transparency (most do), and save
as a separate file.  

Tutorial

In Impulse Imagine, both maps (brushes) are activated using Add Brush in the
Attributes requester.  Press the Color gadget for the color brush (map), and
the Filter button for the alpha map.  White areas of the alpha map define
total transparency.  Activate Transform Axes for the first brush, and note
the values for Size and Position.  Change to the second brush, activate
Transform Axes, and insert the noted Size and Position in the string
gadgets.  Using this procedure guarantees that both maps are located at the
same place with exactly the same size.  The mapping type (preferably Flat X,
Flat Z) should be the same, too.<<


Date:    Sunday, 29 October 1995 01:31:55 
Subject: Re: Where is Apex
From:    sgiff@airmail.net (Stephen Gifford)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

>Does anyone know what has happen to Apex.  I'm tring to update to the  PC
>versions of Essence, but I've gotten no response to faxes and the phone just
>rings whenever I call?  Whats up?
>
>Jay Ruppel
>
I received a newsletter from them in July announcing Essence textures that
were available for the PC (volumes 1 & 2).  It says in the newsletter that
the textures were for 3.0 and above.  I do know that some or all of the
textures for Imagine 3.3 had to be re-written.  At the time of their release
3.3 was not available so maybe they do not work with Imagine 3.3.  I hope
that he eventually creates Forge for Windows.  I have called many times
myself in years past and usually only got an answering machine.  Maybe he
has gone out of business.  Hopefully someone will confirm if this is true.

Stephen


Date:    Sunday, 29 October 1995 01:46:00 
Subject: Re: White spot on my mapped object
From:    sgiff@airmail.net (Stephen Gifford)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

>A probably basic question!
>
>I made a 'button' using the detail editor, creating a plane,extruding it,
>and then conforming it about a sphere.
>
>Then I applied a wood oak brush map.
>
>When I quick render, there's always a white spot in the very center of
>the button.

When doing a quick render, unless you change the angle of your lighting, the
Specular should always be in the center of a spherical object.  Why are you
using the conform to sphere feature to create a button.  Just create the
profile shape and sweep it.  Or you could cut a sphere in half and use half
of it as a button.  Or you could use forms editor and build one lickety
split.  I can think of no other reason for a specular spot that is not a
specular spot unless it really is a specular spot or you have your brushmap
axis skewed to some strange position and it is not covering the object
completely thus creating a white spot.

s.g.


Date:    Sunday, 29 October 1995 01:48:09 
Subject: Re: Win-Imagine/ PPC
From:    sgiff@airmail.net (Stephen Gifford)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


PPC is based on an IBM Risc chip (the RS/6000) with help from Motorola, 
>and is manufactured by Motorola and IBM, and other vendors.
>Interestingly it is estimated it only costs $75 to make PPC601, compared
>to $480 for Intel to make a Pentium!
>

Really, then why even after Apple supposedly lowering prices over the last
couple of years are their systems still so much more expensive than PCs of
the same class?

s.g.


Date:    Sunday, 29 October 1995 02:47:39 
Subject: Re: Kinematic Controls and Constraints
From:    sgiff@airmail.net (Stephen Gifford)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

>I've been trying to get Imagine's Kinematic controls to work and its driving
>me crazy.  I've set up the necessary pairs of grouped object and when I move
>(actually rotate) the lowest level child in the chain all seem to work when I
>watch the bounding boxes in the interactive on screen rotate mode.   But when
>I exit the interactive mode all that has moved are the axis of the objects
>other than the lowest child which has rotated.  All the other objects in the
>chain have their axis moved as I want, but the points and surfaces haven't
>moved!!!  What am i missing??


You need to hit the bones update button under the States menu.  To make your
points on your object re-align themselves to the bone structure.  I do not
know about using the freeze yet, but it constricts the movement to axis that
you specify.

Stephen


Date:    Sunday, 29 October 1995 09:16:14 
Subject: Re: White spot on my mapped object
From:    weiss@epx.cis.umn.edu


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At some point in the past, Curcio Nicholas declared that:
> On Sat, 28 Oct 1995 weiss@epx.cis.umn.edu wrote:
> 
> > 
> > When I quick render, there's always a white spot in the very center of
> > the button.
> 
> I'd check the brushmap axes if I were you.  Make sure that your object is
> within the positive x, y, and z bounding box of the brush that you see 
> when you click on "Edit Axis" in the brush requester.

Thanks to you and everyone else who replied.

You're all right on, and the manual further describes that one must size a map 
according to the top right quadrant of the bounding box.

While I don't quite understand why the one quadrant should be the mapping
reference and not the entire bounding box, I'll accept and read more thoroughly
before posting again!

nks,

Jeff
> 
> Good luck!
> 
> nik
> 
> 

:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
jeff weiss  weiss@epx.cis.umn.edu  TCP/IP 44.94.249.101 N0IRR  612.825.4746 H  
::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::

Date:    Sunday, 29 October 1995 10:06:29 
Subject: Re: PAR PC
From:    Roger Straub <straub@csn.net>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Sat, 28 Oct 1995 Curtcee@aol.com wrote:

> Stephen Gifford:
>                                                                   10/27/95
> there was a problem and it had something to do with some of the FX in
> 

The problem is this: Imagine normally writes out a frame after completing 
it, then loads it back in for Global FX passes. I hear that PAR takes the
completed file from the HD before Imagine can load it back in. So, if you 
use the direct capture method, just don't use any Global FX.

> Curtis Carlson
> Curtcee@aol.com
> 
> 

See ya,
      Roger

Date:    Sunday, 29 October 1995 10:59:11 
Subject: Re: White spot on my mapped object
From:    das@ceti.csustan.edu (David Alan Steiger)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Change the "Color" attribute of your button to, say, red.  Rerender.
If the spot is now red, its a brush axis prob, if not its specular.

Dave

Date:    Sunday, 29 October 1995 11:15:04 
Subject: Re: Texture/Attrib libraries
From:    Roger Straub <straub@csn.net>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Sat, 28 Oct 1995, gregory denby wrote:

> 
> 
> So here's a project for you generous souls with programing skills.
> How about a little app that will decode the attribute file into
> human readable text so that at least the  various object and texture
> parameters can be transfered.

I have a solution, for Amiga users, anyway. Glenn Lewis's T3DLIB package 
of software includes two programs: set_brush_path and set_texture_path. 
These will read any imagine object and change the path for the brushmaps 
and textures! The only catch is that the actual programs aren't included 
in the shareware release - you have to register.

> 
> Greg Denby
> 

See ya,
      Roger

Date:    Sunday, 29 October 1995 11:35:15 
Subject: Re: Kinematic Controls and Constraints
From:    Roger Straub <straub@csn.net>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Sat, 28 Oct 1995 RJay9@aol.com wrote:

> I've been trying to get Imagine's Kinematic controls to work and its driving
> me crazy.  I've set up the necessary pairs of grouped object and when I move
> (actually rotate) the lowest level child in the chain all seem to work when I
> watch the bounding boxes in the interactive on screen rotate mode.   But when
> I exit the interactive mode all that has moved are the axis of the objects
> other than the lowest child which has rotated.  All the other objects in the
> chain have their axis moved as I want, but the points and surfaces haven't
> moved!!!  What am i missing??

After you move bones around, you have to pick the parent object (the one 
with faces) and do a Bones Update. This will conform all of the faces to 
the positions of the bones.

> 
> While I'm asking questions, what does the joint locks (on the Freese Items
> requestor) do and how do you use it?  Is it part of my problem?  Is there any
> useful documentation on kinematic controls?
> 

I think I can help here. The move and rotate constraint controls only 
affect the axis you freeze. So, if you want the bottom of a finger to 
stay in place, you will click on all of the move boxes.

Joint locks are different. These will constrain the rotation of the rest 
of the bones in the finger to certain axes. So, if you want to have the 
finger joints to rotate just on the X axis (as most human fingers do), 
you click on the Y and Z joint locks. Then you can select the tip of the 
finger and move it, and the joints will only rotate in X, and the bottom 
of your finger won't move.

> Thanks for your help..
> 

No problem at all.

> Jay Ruppel
> 

See ya,
      Roger

Date:    Sunday, 29 October 1995 11:39:04 
Subject: RE: Apex
From:    jbk4@email.psu.edu (The Prophet)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I also received a newsletter from them this summer.  It said that new
software would be available this fall(october, I think, I'll have to
look for the newsletter).

There would be a version of the essence textures for the PC.  A new
program call 'Tsunami' would replace Forge.  This would be avail for
PC and Amiga.  I don't remember if it said anything about new textures
but I'm sure that there will be something.

Steve was working with Alan Hastings(NewTek) on Essence for Lightwave.
Presently Lightwave doesn't support external textures like essence but
a newer version will add such support.  I think that he was also working
on a version for Real3D or maybe Aladdin?

Jaeson K.
 ____            ____            _           _
( |  \          ( /  \          ( )       _ / )
 )|   )_   __    /   /_   _  __  /   __  ( X_)
( |  /~ \ /\_)  /---~/ ) / )/  )/~\ /\_)  / _
 )ll/  l/ \__ (/   (/   (_//__//  / \__  (___)
(____________)        (___/        (___)

Jaeson Koszarsky                  Amiga 3000+
----------------                  -----------
cyberprophet@psu.edu              68040/30Mhz
jbk4@email.psu.edu                24Megs-1GIG
jason@chaos.ezgate.com            OS3.1

Date:    Sunday, 29 October 1995 13:50:09 
Subject: Essence Worley Laboratories Inc. (Apex Software Publishing)
From:    merlin@cyberspc.mb.ca (grant goss)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

405 El Camino Real, Suite 121
Menlo Park, CA 94025 USA


Order Line: 415-322-7532

Fax: 415-322-8349

Internet e-mail: sales@worley.com
                 support@worley.com





                              merlin@cyberspc.mb.ca

Date:    Sunday, 29 October 1995 14:47:54 
Subject: Re: Win-Imagine
From:    George Lane <glane@qualcomm.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Fri, 27 Oct 1995, Bill Boyce wrote:

> Err, NT is written for a particular processor, not the other way around. Oh,
> and the Power PC chip is basically an IBM chip which Apple has used.
 
> I believe a version of NT is coming for the PPC, too.

NT has been running on Motorola's PPC machines - the PowerStacks - for 
quite a while. There's not software that runs on it though. It would be a 
nice machine for software like Imagine and Lightwave, but the Alphas 
seem to have the market since there is more software available like 
Photoshop.

George Lane
Opinions are mine only. No employer would claim them.



Date:    Sunday, 29 October 1995 14:57:12 
Subject: Re: Win-Imagine/ PPC
From:    George Lane <glane@qualcomm.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


On Sun, 29 Oct 1995 RobSampson@aol.com wrote:

> CPU's and OS's are critical to any rendering package and so I think the
> discussion is relevant.  Would be nice to get over to a PPC under NT with
> Imagine and Lightwave.  I'm sure many graphics packages running now would
> benefit since I think the PPC holds more potential for us right now then
> anything Intel has in mind at the moment.

Some software vendors seem to be hesitant since they aren't sure that the 
NT/PPC machines will catch on. They seem to be waiting for a market to 
develop. They have to buy more machines that aren't the same as anything 
they already have, and they don't want to support a version of software 
that only has a few customers. But, since there's no S/W, no one's 
buying the machines. It's the chicken and egg syndrome.

George Lane
Opinions are mine only. No employer would claim them.

Date:    Sunday, 29 October 1995 15:59:22 
Subject: Re: Win-Imagine/ PPC
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-28 19:54:25 EST, you write:

>PPC is based on an IBM Risc chip (the RS/6000) with help from Motorola, 
>and is manufactured by Motorola and IBM, and other vendors.
>Interestingly it is estimated it only costs $75 to make PPC601, compared
>to $480 for Intel to make a Pentium!
>
>It'll be interesting to see what Escom has decided to go with for future
>Amigas. So we can run Imagine faster (had to tie it in somehow!)<<

CPU's and OS's are critical to any rendering package and so I think the
discussion is relevant.  Would be nice to get over to a PPC under NT with
Imagine and Lightwave.  I'm sure many graphics packages running now would
benefit since I think the PPC holds more potential for us right now then
anything Intel has in mind at the moment.



Date:    Sunday, 29 October 1995 15:59:24 
Subject: Re: Mirror, Mirror
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-28 23:09:31 EST, you write:

>It's a powerful editor, but you have to devote a lot of time to it to get
>results.
>
>-- Bob<<

I agree with that, but I think you would also have to add that it is a
specialty type item.  Not really designed for everyday use but for particular
items.  While it (as could any software) benefit from suggestion and overhaul
I think it's very nature will continue to make it a least used editor for
many because it is so special.  I have found that once I started using Acad's
new solids modeler that it was extremely beneficial but limited.  Imagine and
Acad's modeling compliment each other extremely well and when I get Lightwave
I am sure it will have features that will further enhance my abilities.  The
end result I suppose is having enough of the right tools to make the job
simple much as in the construction of real world objects.  We may all have a
plane in the garage, but how many times do you use it.

Bob....................




Date:    Sunday, 29 October 1995 18:38:21 
Subject: Re:carX12..calling carX12
From:    Brad Molsen <moon@eskimo.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

On Tue, 24 Oct 1995, Rick Dolishny wrote:

> I checked out Sharky's page and found your area... but I could not see 
> or download the pix.
> 
> I'm using an Amiga and no Netscape browser. I just want to download the 
> pix... espcially this car everyone is raving about. 

To Rick and all, 
      I was also having this problem with regard to alot of netsights. 
If you are using Amosaic or some other program that can us arexx scripts. 
I found a free script file on aminet that allows the viewing of pics if 
one doesn't have 3.0 for the Amiga. Contact me off the list and I will be 
happy to give you the particulars.
      To Tom and other home pagers it would be nice to be able to see 
what you have on your homepages if one doesn't have online viewing 
capabilities. Is it possible to display your works as gifs, iffs or jpegs 
in the html page format?
                              regards Brad 

Date:    Sunday, 29 October 1995 23:13:00 
Subject: Re: Where Is Apex
From:    jbeard@cix.compulink.co.uk (Joe Beard)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> Does anyone know what has happen to Apex.  I'm tring to update to the  
> PC
> versions of Essence, but I've gotten no response to faxes and the phone 
> just
> rings whenever I call?  Whats up?
> 

I wish I knew. I tried to order the PC Essence as well after receiving 
the newsletter, but so far they haven't replied to the numerous emails I 
have sent them. 

Joe


Date:    Monday, 30 October 1995 03:54:04 
Subject: Bones tutorial
From:    Valleyview@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I've sent out a "beta" bone tutorial to those that requested. This was the
first time I did a large batch mailing so I hope it worked. That and the fact
that my server messed up at least once. If you requested it and didn't
receive it, hollar. I'll try to find the trouble.

Rick

Date:    Monday, 30 October 1995 05:51:28 
Subject: Re: Win-Imagine/ PPC
From:    Bill Boyce <bilboyce@iconz.co.nz>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 10:59 AM 29/10/95 -0500, you wrote:
>In a message dated 95-10-28 19:54:25 EST, you write:
>
>>It'll be interesting to see what Escom has decided to go with for future
>>Amigas. So we can run Imagine faster (had to tie it in somehow!)<<
>
>CPU's and OS's are critical to any rendering package and so I think the
>discussion is relevant.  Would be nice to get over to a PPC under NT with
>Imagine and Lightwave.  I'm sure many graphics packages running now would
>benefit since I think the PPC holds more potential for us right now then
>anything Intel has in mind at the moment.
>

Amen. Apparently the PPC620, the latest PPC chip, has much improved floating
point performance, and the earlier ones already kicked the Pentiums butt
for floating point - critical to 3D rendering.

Bill Boyce


Date:    Monday, 30 October 1995 05:54:45 
Subject: Re: Animated Grass Quickie
From:    Bill Boyce <bilboyce@iconz.co.nz>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 02:29 PM 27/10/95 +1000, you wrote:
>> Hi,
>The Sway F/X was designed with swaying grass in mind.  You create your
>blades of grass and group them to a parent axis or the ground they are
>planted in if you like.  The effect is applied to the children of the
>grouped object so unfortunately you can't use particles to create your
>grass.

You can however make a blade of glass, replicate it using a plane as a path,
then slice the resulting object (make sure your grass blades don't overlap)
to get a group of blades which you can 'sway'. Just tried it - looks great!

Hmm, I think I made a 'quickie'!

Bill Boyce


Date:    Monday, 30 October 1995 11:23:58 
Subject: SpeedTest v2
From:    cjo@esrange.ssc.se


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

The voting time for Doug's and my speedtest project has expired, and I=20
didn't get nearly enough as many votes as I think I need to make it all=20
worth while.
So, I won't do any more work on it and I won't distribute it.

Sidenote: You all know Tom "R" Granberg.
          Well, check out the "Image Of The Month" page in my www corner.

cya

*---------------------------------------------------------------*
|   Conny Joensson   |   Swedish Space Corp. Esrange            |
|   Kiruna           |   Satellite operations - Telecom Div.    |
|   Sweden           |   cjo@smtpgw.esrange.ssc.se              |
*---------------------------------------------------------------*

Date:    Monday, 30 October 1995 12:46:30 
Subject: Re: PAL resolution; was: Re: PAR settings
From:    "Frank.VanDerAuwera" <fvdauwer@uia.ua.ac.be>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Any video signal is analog, of course, not only PAL. (Also SECAM and NTSC 
and...)

I got the resolution values from the specifications of a "Video machine" 
<digital> video controller/editor though, where it says 
"blah blah the standard resolution of 768x576 pixels blah blah"

Anyway that's also the resolution the people i make animations for ask me to 
use...

Greetings,

Frank

 Frank Van der Auwera 
University of Antwerp library

fvdauwer@uia.ac.be
fauwera@lib.ua.ac.be

On Fri, 27 Oct 1995, Bill Boyce wrote:

> At 03:22 PM 24/10/95 +0100, you wrote:
> >In case some might wonder what the "official" resolution is for a PAL 
> >full overscan video signal: it's 768x576
> >
> >Frank Van der Auwera
> >University of Antwerp 
> >
> >fvdauwer@uia.ac.be
> 
> Actually PAL is an analog standard, and as such any discussions of
> horizontal resolutions are fairly arbitrary. The engineers where I
> record often comment on the excessive width of my output when I
> use 768 x 576. Usually I use 752 x 576, which is fine.
> 
> 

Date:    Monday, 30 October 1995 13:07:56 
Subject: Re:  Textures...
From:    milan@Gent.hku.nl (Milan Polle)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi Alex,

I have sent the textures out on the list and they are on Aminet in gfx/3d
called textures.lha (how original). And they are... attached below, if
you can handle uuencodes. Hope you like them, let me know what you think.
(and send me a jpg if you use them in something neat)

Greetings, Milan (milan@bmt.hku.nl)


--> ATTACHEMENT: textures.lha <--



Date:    Monday, 30 October 1995 14:14:54 
Subject: Imagine & Cyberstorm60 problems
From:    bcbisig@wawona.vmsmail.ethz.ch (Daniel A. Bisig)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I recently upgraded my cyberstorm40 board to the cyberstorm60.
Since then I get some nasty problems running imagine 3.3.
The program is quite stable during modelling but if things come to
rendering, the program usually crashes. Running the program Cyberpatch
or not doesnt make any difference.
 
Till know I never heard from anyone who has/had a similar problem.
Therefore I send this message to this mailing list to hear about
people who are running imagine under similar conditions without
any problems and how they solved possible previous problems.
 
My Szstem is an A4000 equipped with:
      
      Fastlane ZIII
      IV24
      Emplant deluxe
      Cyberstorm60
      16 Mega Fastram
      Workbench V.3.1
      Kickstart V.3.0
 
Thanx in advance for any hints and suggestions.
 
      Daniel A. Bisig

Date:    Monday, 30 October 1995 15:31:41 
Subject: Texture to create pseudo bevels ?
From:    H.Kueck@AIGM.westfalen.de (Hendrik Kueck)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hello,

would it be possible to write a texture that gives normal edges a
round look so that you see highlights on the edges?
Or is there perhaps already a texture that is capable of doing
this?

Bye,
  Hendrik




Date:    Monday, 30 October 1995 15:44:30 
Subject: Re: PAR PC
From:    Ed Totman <etotman@gort.ucsd.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

On Sat, 28 Oct 1995 Curtcee@aol.com wrote:

> by two different people from Impulse at the time I bought my PAR (4/95) that
> there was a problem and it had something to do with some of the FX in
> Imagine. Since I wasn't sure what they were talking about I just never tried

It's true that most if not all of the (action editor?) FX will not work
when rendering directly to the PAR because Imagine renders the frame then
attempts to re-open the file to perform the FX, which doesn't work since 
the frame is already compressed.  Regardless, I've been very happy with 
the power of Imagine and the PAR PC.


Date:    Monday, 30 October 1995 16:38:23 
Subject: Re: Imagine & Cyberstorm60 problems
From:    Steven M Powell <afn27231@freenet.ufl.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I would like to here of any 060 problems. I am thinking of getting the 
new 060 board for the 1200 (1260 I think). Anyone using one?

Phoenix


Date:    Monday, 30 October 1995 17:13:19 
Subject: Re: Imagine & Cyberstorm60 problems
From:    gmartin@mv.us.adobe.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> Subject: Imagine & Cyberstorm60 problems
> From:    bcbisig@wawona.vmsmail.ethz.ch (Daniel A. Bisig) at cc_smtp2
> Date:    30/10/95  7:19 am

> <deleted>

No problems with Imagine 3.3 and Cyber060 here. I am using native Amiga display,
 
and I did change the 'capasitance' jumper on the main CS board for adjusting RAM
 
access time as all my ram is 70ns (the system reboots frequently otherwise with 

memory problems). Rendering/Tracing is just fine, though it's too easy to find 
new and exciting ways to eat cpu cycles :)

Just while I'm here anyone recomend a good gfx board for use with Imagine, for 
higher resolution editors or a faster 256K colour display (can you do both)? 
Does the Retina work well, does the CyberGfx work... :)

My fave user buttons are L (load), S (save), R (quickrender).


Date:    Monday, 30 October 1995 17:13:19 
Subject: Re: Imagine & Cyberstorm60 problems
From:    gmartin@mv.us.adobe.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

> Subject: Imagine & Cyberstorm60 problems
> From:    bcbisig@wawona.vmsmail.ethz.ch (Daniel A. Bisig) at cc_smtp2
> Date:    30/10/95  7:19 am

> <deleted>

No problems with Imagine 3.3 and Cyber060 here. I am using native Amiga display,
 
and I did change the 'capasitance' jumper on the main CS board for adjusting RAM
 
access time as all my ram is 70ns (the system reboots frequently otherwise with 

memory problems). Rendering/Tracing is just fine, though it's too easy to find 
new and exciting ways to eat cpu cycles :)

Just while I'm here anyone recomend a good gfx board for use with Imagine, for 
higher resolution editors or a faster 256K colour display (can you do both)? 
Does the Retina work well, does the CyberGfx work... :)

My fave user buttons are L (load), S (save), R (quickrender).


Date:    Monday, 30 October 1995 17:30:52 
Subject: Re: Workbench 3.1
From:    Steven M Powell <afn27231@freenet.ufl.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

The original flyer for the constant-upgrade program said that you will 
get a COMPLETE program with MANUAL when the version is released, so if 
someone goes out to buy 4.0 off the shelf, they get a 3.0 manual with 
docs on disk? I hope this is an error. Would someone confirm this please.

phoenix


On Fri, 27 Oct 1995 RobSampson@aol.com wrote:

> In a message dated 95-10-27 15:56:19 EDT, you write:
> 
> >Thanks.. and whoever gets 4.0 first, tell us about the new manual!
> >
> >   Bill
> 
> Well there is no new manual.  Just docs on disk for 4.0.  More laser printer
> papers laying all over the place with no way to access information readily.
> 
> 
> 

Date:    Monday, 30 October 1995 17:33:58 
Subject: Re: Animated Grass Quickie
From:    jprusins@cybergrafix.com (John Prusinski)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


>
>You can however make a blade of glass, replicate it using a plane as a path,
>then slice the resulting object (make sure your grass blades don't overlap)
>to get a group of blades which you can 'sway'. Just tried it - looks great!
>
>Hmm, I think I made a 'quickie'!
>

Sounds interesting... not quite clear to my 3Dfuddled brain, however... in 
my experience you need a "slicer" and a "slicee" for the slice operation.  
If the plane-replicated blades of grass are your "slicee" object, what is 
the "slicER'?

John.


Date:    Monday, 30 October 1995 19:18:18 
Subject: Re: Animated Grass Quickie -Reply
From:    Craig Andera <CANDERA@f81.rfc.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Actually, one of the nice "hidden features" of Imagine is the ability to
separate non-contiguous objects into their component sections. This is
accomplished by Slicing the object with itself. 

Give it a try:
- Create two primitive spheres. 
- Move them apart until they don't overlap.
- Pick both and Join. You now have a single non-contiguous
(continuous?) object. 
- Pick the new object and Slice. This should create a group with two
objects (i.e. each of the original spheres). 

-Craig

>>> John Prusinski <jprusins@cybergrafix.com> 10/30/95 10:33am >>>

>
>You can however make a blade of glass, replicate it using a plane as a
path,
>then slice the resulting object (make sure your grass blades don't
overlap)
>to get a group of blades which you can 'sway'. Just tried it - looks
great!
>
>Hmm, I think I made a 'quickie'!
>

Sounds interesting... not quite clear to my 3Dfuddled brain, however... in 
my experience you need a "slicer" and a "slicee" for the slice operation.  
If the plane-replicated blades of grass are your "slicee" object, what is 
the "slicER'?

John.




Date:    Monday, 30 October 1995 20:27:27 
Subject: Imagine & Cyberstorm60 problems
From:    bcbisig@wawona.vmsmail.ethz.ch (Daniel A. Bisig)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I recently upgraded my cyberstorm40 board to the cyberstorm60.
Since then I get some nasty problems running imagine 3.3.
The program is quite stable during modelling but if things come to
rendering, the program usually crashes. Running the program Cyberpatch
or not doesnt make any difference.

Till now I never heard from anyone who has/had a similar problem.
Therefore I send this message to this mailing list to hear about
people who had similar problems and got them solved or have at least
some suggestions of how to solve them.

My System is an A4000 equipped with:
      
      Fastlane ZIII
      IV24
      Emplant deluxe
      Cyberstorm60
      16 Mega Fastram
      Workbench V.3.1
      Kickstart V.3.0

Thanx in advance for any hints and suggestions.

      Daniel A. Bisig

Date:    Monday, 30 October 1995 20:46:23 
Subject: To Jim Rix
From:    Granberg Tom <tom.granberg@TV2.no>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi there

Just want to know how you made the two planets on your homepage(stunning 
realism) did you use actual photos of the planets? If so, did you do something 
with them (post prod.) before you mapped them on.?
Curious....

Tom Granberg "Renderbrandt"


Date:    Tuesday, 31 October 1995 01:51:14 
Subject: Re: Animated Grass Quickie
From:    rbyrne@3dform.edex.edu.au (Robert Byrne)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hello Bill, on Oct 30 you wrote:

> You can however make a blade of glass, replicate it using a plane as a path,
> then slice the resulting object (make sure your grass blades don't overlap)
> to get a group of blades which you can 'sway'. Just tried it - looks great!
> 
> Hmm, I think I made a 'quickie'!
> 
> Bill Boyce

I just tried it too! It does look good. I replicated tall pyramids (Cone
primitive with 3 sections). Kinda reminded me of quills on a Porcupine's
back :-)

-- Bob

Date:    Tuesday, 31 October 1995 03:06:31 
Subject: New article
From:    Granberg Tom <tom.granberg@TV2.no>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi
Just want to say that there is a somewhat helpfull article on Captain videos 
homepage at www.websharx.com
The article is about HOW to design spaceships, not how to use Imagine, but never
 
the less I think it would be usefull to think about the actuall design process 
instead of just a particular tools. Have a look and see what you think, if you 
like it I will write more on the subject of design as well as utillise certain 
tools such as Imagine.

Ps. The V4.0 is now in the process of being duplicated so it will be out 
soon(I hope!?)
Later

Tom

Date:    Tuesday, 31 October 1995 05:03:00 
Subject: 24Bit Quickrender
From:    m.rubin9@genie.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I've been using a Picasso board (No Cybergraphics) with Imagine 3.3
at 800x600 for a while, but I can't find any way to make it display
quickrenders in 24 bit.

By changing QUFF in Prefs to ILBM 24 I should be able to view a 24 bit
QR, but it continues to appear as HAM.  Strangely enough, if I load
this same image into AdPro and save from there to the Picasso it DOES
show up as 24 bit!

I also seem to remember having a similar problem with Opal.

Any ideas or workarounds?

Floater





Date:    Tuesday, 31 October 1995 07:32:09 
Subject: Re: Retina Z2 Problems...
From:    kkalnasy@eskimo.com (Kent Kalnasy)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

At 11:27 PM 10/25/95, Jynx wrote:
>Is there anyone successfully using the Retina Z2 with Imagine v3.3?

Yes, right along with the versions from 2.something when you had to
patch the Imagine binary to take advantage of screens larger than
640x400.  The newer versions, thankfully, don't make you do that.
I currently use Imagine at 1024x768, which means I give up the
texture previews within Imagine, but Forge works great for that!

>Is this a bug in the software.

Is what a bug in the software?

>When I called the tech support line
>the guy told me that the last retina board that Noahji sent them was v1.0!
>I am using RetinaEmu v2.3. I have tried the SMOD, S256, & USE RETINA
>settings. I have also tried various other settings in RetinaEmu. Of course
>this is the Amiga version of Imagine. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

What kind of problems are you having?

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 Kent Kalnasy, Mac, UNIX and Amiga specialist!            kkalnasy@eskimo.com
 "The best laid plans of mice and men..."                 Seattle, Washington
------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Date:    Tuesday, 31 October 1995 10:54:03 
Subject: Re: Texture to create pseudo bevels ?
From:    cjo@esrange.ssc.se


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

>would it be possible to write a texture that gives normal edges a round=20
>look so that you see highlights on the edges?
>Or is there perhaps already a texture that is capable of doing this?

That depends.
If you stick to a square object you could use "bathtile" and size the tiles=
=20
to the same size as your plane.

*---------------------------------------------------------------*
|   Conny Joensson   |   Swedish Space Corp. Esrange            |
|   Kiruna           |   Satellite operations - Telecom Div.    |
|   Sweden           |   cjo@smtpgw.esrange.ssc.se              |
*---------------------------------------------------------------*

Date:    Tuesday, 31 October 1995 11:41:52 
Subject: Re: 24Bit Quickrender
From:    sauvp@citi.doc.ca (Patrick Sauvageau)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  


m.rubin9@genie.com wrote the following:
> I've been using a Picasso board (No Cybergraphics) with Imagine 3.3
> at 800x600 for a while, but I can't find any way to make it display
> quickrenders in 24 bit.
(...)

djm2@ra.msstate.edu (Dan Murrell Jr.):
>Until Imagine supports more graphics systems, you may be stuck.
>It could be possible probably to write some sort of daemon that
>waits in the background for your quickrender file to be written,
>then snatching it up for your favorite viewer.  Imagine would probably
>still show the picture as HAM, but then a followup screen would open
>showing the picture in 8/24 bit or so.  Unless there's a way to make
>Imagine not show the quickrender?

I allway start the Fkey commodity when I start Imagine. Fkey do the command
"vt ram:quickrender" every time I press the "Help" key (vt is ViewTek). I
did this to show the quickrender in ham-8 in the old day of Imagine 2.0.
It's still usefull to re-show a quickrender. I do not think that it's
possible to instruct Imagine to not show the quickrender. If you have a
viewer that can show an iff-24 picture on your graphic card, the Fkey
utility is the way to go; is easy, fast and do not interfere since nobody
seems to use that "help" key.

One of my friends used Fkey to play a sample of Homer Simpson's famous
"Doh!" each time he press the Help key, so when he make a mistake, he looked
at you with a serious face and press the key, then return to his work. 

-----
Patrick Sauvageau
(sauvp@citi.doc.ca)


Date:    Tuesday, 31 October 1995 12:13:15 
Subject: Imagine4.0 order
From:    milan@Gent.hku.nl (Milan Polle)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

Hi all,

first of all my excuses for sending a large uuencode over the list. I
thought I was sending it privatly (I didn't know the from: part could
be the mailing list as well). On the other hand, people who wanted my
textures know have them :)
Now a question to people who ordered Imagine4.0, did Impulse already
take the money from your bank account? I have sent an order form
I printed myself, over the fax (I expected that the actual order form
from Impulse would be unreadable when faxed). But as Impulse didn't
take the money yet, I am wondering if my order came thru.
BTW I have worked on the attribute lister proggy last night for
about 1 hour and it is already half finished (if everything goes well)
it will also list attributes of objects and whole groups. Expect it
soon...

Greetings, Milan (reply to: milan@bmt.hku.nl)



Date:    Tuesday, 31 October 1995 12:33:17 
Subject: Re: 24Bit Quickrender
From:    "Dan Murrell Jr." <djm2@Ra.msstate.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In imagine@email.eag.unisysgsg.com on 24Bit Quickrender,
m.rubin9@genie.com wrote the following:

> I've been using a Picasso board (No Cybergraphics) with Imagine 3.3
> at 800x600 for a while, but I can't find any way to make it display
> quickrenders in 24 bit.

First of all, get Cybergraphics.  It's sooooo much faster at drawing to
the screen ou won't believe it, especially with your Picasso.  And
ChangeScreen still works fine to promote Imagine's screen, assuming
you use that.

> By changing QUFF in Prefs to ILBM 24 I should be able to view a 24 bit=

> QR, but it continues to appear as HAM.  Strangely enough, if I load
> this same image into AdPro and save from there to the Picasso it DOES
> show up as 24 bit!

> Any ideas or workarounds?

Until Imagine supports more graphics systems, you may be stuck.
It could be possible probably to write some sort of daemon that
waits in the background for your quickrender file to be written,
then snatching it up for your favorite viewer.  Imagine would probably
still show the picture as HAM, but then a followup screen would open
showing the picture in 8/24 bit or so.  Unless there's a way to make
Imagine not show the quickrender?

Dan

--=20
                                        __
Sent from Danimal's AmiTCP-ing Amiga 3000/ Amigas!/Saturday morning Wres=
tling/
  Dan Murrell Jr.   IRC's Danimal     /// James Taylor/Pink Floyd/Roger>=
Dave!/
      djm2@ra.msstate.edu         \\\/// Imagine/Essence/AmiTCP/AMosaic/=
3Dgfx/



Date:    Tuesday, 31 October 1995 13:41:00 
Subject: HTTP rips
From:    mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com (Mike Vandersommen)


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

If this is common knowledge forgive me (I'm always the last to knowANYTHING)....
but have you ever hit a really cool Web page withdynamite pictures but no way to
 download them? If you are usingNetScape, just right mouse click on ANY image an
d you can save it.shhhhhh....this is not supposed to be widely known. :)   /----
--------------------------           ___   ___  ___   ___  | Mike van der Sommen
                     / __  /__/ /__/  /_   \ /  | Santa Barbara, Ca.            
         /___/ / \  /  /  /     / \  | mike.vandersommen@caddy.uu.silcom.com    
 HAUS BBS (805-683-1388)  |           "Blackouts make for nice breaks in the day
"   \_____________________________________________________________--- =FE InterN
et - GraFX Haus BBS - Santa Barbara, Ca - (805) 683-1388

Date:    Tuesday, 31 October 1995 13:44:50 
Subject: Water animation question (ripples)
From:    pleatman@one.net


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



  Hi,

   After seeing the simpsons the other night I was wondering if I would
   be able to do this effect with Imagine.  

   Is it possible to have an objects come out of a pool of water
   and create the ripple effect the object would cause in the water?

   Thanks for any ideas

   bob



Date:    Tuesday, 31 October 1995 14:11:39 
Subject: Re: Workbench 3.1
From:    RobSampson@aol.com


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

In a message dated 95-10-30 17:31:29 EST, you write:

>The original flyer for the constant-upgrade program said that you will 
>get a COMPLETE program with MANUAL when the version is released, so if 
>someone goes out to buy 4.0 off the shelf, they get a 3.0 manual with 
>docs on disk? I hope this is an error. Would someone confirm this please.
>
>phoenix

Halvorson sent me mail stating that there is no new manual for 4.0.  Not much
else I can say.

Bob...........



Date:    Tuesday, 31 October 1995 14:26:26 
Subject: Re: Imagine4.0 order
From:    Steven M Powell <afn27231@freenet.ufl.edu>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  



On Tue, 31 Oct 1995, Milan Polle wrote:

> Now a question to people who ordered Imagine4.0, did Impulse already
> take the money from your bank account? I have sent an order form

Yes, they cashed my check last year.


Date:    Tuesday, 31 October 1995 15:54:06 
Subject: .geo converter
From:    Paul Thompson <shinobi@gold.interlog.com>


  ----------------------------------------------------------------------------  

I need to convert several objects from imagine format to .geo format.  
Does anyone know if a conversion program exists on the PC.  Thanks!!

Paul


