<Dickie> Anyway, what did you guys think of Petro's amiga song?
<Kosh> Haven't heard it TBH. Only saw his speech.
<Garibaldi> Which I think told a bit more than usual.
<Garibaldi> But mostly the happy happy stuff
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<Dickie> In what ways?
<Garibaldi> Well he mentions giving out hardware to developers (or something like that I think)
<Dickie> And cheap A1200s for usergroups...
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<Dickie> Do you think they'll be important (the usergroups that is) in the future of the Amiga?
<Garibaldi> Can't remember exactly what else was said but it was slightly better than expected.
<Garibaldi> Hm. Maybe.
<Kosh> Problem is that they still intend to charge for things like the RKRMs (Rom Kernel Reference Manuals). Hell the RKRM's aren't even the latest version - they should allow Amigaguide version of it to be uploaded to Aminet or summin - you have no idea how much trouble most developers have getting hold of decent dev material. Sure there's the Amiga Dev
<Kosh> CD, but that's only got the includes, autodocs and some examples. They should make things like RKRMS freely available, even if it's only the registered ones.
<Garibaldi> Although I think supporting the developers more to help get software for the computer is needed.
<Garibaldi> Yes I agree totally
<Kosh> Usergroups are important - but they are really only a representation of the latent market. We need a push to bring in new users.
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<Dickie> Petro talks of a need (a project even) for new hardware, which will take some time, do you think they have the cash, the manpower, or just the will?
<Kosh> The will: if Petro is an example, yes. The manpower: nope, the cash: nope.
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<Dickie> OS3.5 by november: do you think Jeff Schindler can pull it off?
<Garibaldi> Hm. Maybe.
<Garibaldi> I really hope they do.
<Kosh> Depends.
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<Dickie> Reckon they're taking too much on too quickly?
<Garibaldi> Well they should have been developing OS 3.5 ages ago.
<Kosh> Nope, infact I think it's not enough, too late. They've let the market slide for a long time and have to do a lot of work to get it back again.
<Kosh> They've had, what is it, 8 or 9 months to pull their act together....
<Garibaldi> It's a year since AI was bought by GW2K
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<Dickie> Don't you think it would take that to sort out two years of chaos and messing up?
<Garibaldi> But then what have they been doing to try and sustain the market. They've stayed quiet and appear to be doing nothing, so more leave to pastures new.
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<Dickie> Do you think their "Amiga hymn" and "'98 will be a fun ride" approach is going to work for them?
<Kosh> Dunnow. IMHO they are just tactics to try to stabilise the current market. Sure, that's very necessary, but people want hard facts and solid products rather than songs and promises.
<Garibaldi> Telling people everything is going to be great and the Amiga is back I think isn't fooling anybody.
<Garibaldi> They just don't appear to anybody to be doing anything.
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<Dickie> What do you think of Petro "unintentionally" mentioning Netscape may well be integrated into OS3.5/4?
<Dickie> Has it got anything to do with Windows 98 and the Explorer browser integration thing?
<Garibaldi> Well if it's true, it would be a good thing. Netscape is something that all computer users have heard of.
<Garibaldi> Hm. Don't know. Maybe.
<Kosh> I don't know if it would happen though.
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<Dickie> Also, what do you think of Petro's statement that P5, H&P, Fleecy and some other dude are all working as a team on OS3.5? Things are hotting up, eh?
<Kosh> Well, I've not heard that confirmed - if it's true then it's very good.
<Garibaldi> Hm. I don't know how P5 and H&P will work together well after P5's latest antics in the Powerup v warpos battle.
<Dickie> It's in his Finnish Saku Amiga show speech- hot off the press. (Well it was then- Erik)
<Dickie> http://tzimmola.tky.hut.fi/saku/saku98/transcript.html
<Kosh> Yep, I read it.. and heard it several weeks ago too
<Dickie> Seems the P5 - H & P wars are over already
<Garibaldi> I doubt it.
<Kosh> Ah, well.. I wouldn't lay money on it.
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<Dickie> They're also promising low-end and high-end developer kits for release at WOA 98 in November, does that help to ease your problems with the RKRM?
<Garibaldi> Well as long as developers actually can get RKRM books for free.
<Garibaldi> Or updated versions of it.
<Kosh> It should all be on the dev CD IMHO :)
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<Dickie> Will you buy the high-end kit come November though?
<Dickie> Or do you want it distributed among developers as standard?
<Kosh> Depends on how much cash I have - I spent nearly £500 on my system before Christmas - not easy when you are on a student income
<Garibaldi> I think if a developer approached AI for a program (be game or app) they should prehaps give them a kit on the condition that they finish it or something like that.
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<Dickie> What systems do you all rely on to develop Explorer?
<Garibaldi> I've got a 18MB 030 A1200 with SCSI Cd rom drive, zip drive and Microvetic 1438 monitor.
<Dickie> How are you developing the PPC side, does one of you actually own one of those godly things?
<Kosh> I've got 1200T, 030/ 882 (soon to be PPC), 18Mb Mem, 4xCd drive, 2Gb HD, other bits & pieces.. George has a 4000...with PPC
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<Dickie> AI said they heard from developers that business was picking up, do you think that could be true? Seeing GH are leaving etc.
<Garibaldi> I'm not too sure.
<Garibaldi> Nothing I've heard really showed that.
<Kosh> Don't know. As vulcan started Wasted dreams again, it would appare there may be.. can't say. Sadeness don't sem too pleased though.
<Garibaldi> CB seem happy enough with Myst sales.
<Kosh> That's true.. although that's not really a big surprise given Myst's quality.
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<Dickie> They also stated that G2K will support them/ donate cash, how commited do you think they are? Do you believe them?
<Dickie> Do you think Quake is going to be a massive hit for them?
<Kosh> Quake may be.. they have caused themselves a lot of damage by postponing the PPC version though. A lot of people had preordered that apparently and got very disillusioned when they announced the delays.
<Garibaldi> And cancelled the preorders too.
<Dickie> Surely not... that would be suicide almost.
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<Dickie> Do you think it's wrong they're concentrating on the 68K? Or is it simply business sense?
<Dickie> Does 68K series have anything to offer Quake at all?
<Kosh> 68K is too slow for Quake IMHO - even an 060 stuggles to get a decent framerate
<Garibaldi> Not really. Only playable on an 060 with GFX card
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<Dickie> Do you think it should have been PPC only to begin with?
<Garibaldi> No. But the ppc version should be high priority.
<Garibaldi> Infact should have been released at the same time. In the same box.
<Garibaldi> But must have been that powerup/warpos debacle that might have affected things.
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<Dickie> What do you think of the CE approval of the PPC cards for desktop machines, is this a blessing, or will it cause people to not upgrade and stay desktop, without a tower.
<Kosh> Have they? :) Didn't know that. I doubt it would make a lot of difference - a lot of people seem to want the tower anyway for the expansion room
<Garibaldi> well it must be a good thing. Not all would want to go and stick in a tower.
<Garibaldi> Like to hold onto their old machines.
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<Dickie> Has the mass towering up been a massive blessing for hardware cos?
<Dickie> Will it be vital in years to come?
<Garibaldi> The likes of the power tower where it is very easy to make is good.
<Garibaldi> I'll be getting one soonish. ;)
<Dickie> Everyone seems to be ;)
<Garibaldi> Certainly provides the option to expand more after that too.
<Kosh> Should have been in boxes from the start. After all, a custom case must have cost nearly as much as a bog standard PC case.
<Dickie> Wasn't the mobility of the custom cases, ie. for in front of the TV a la Spectrum style?
<Kosh> Dunnow really..
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<Dickie> Last question: what would you say to a PC user to convince them of the Amiga's abilities?
<Garibaldi> Um.
<Garibaldi> Thats a tricky one.
<Garibaldi> At the moment it would be hard to think of anything apart from a great OS that still works well with some of the third party additions.
<Garibaldi> I'd maybe wait a while and then show them E2260 and M&M in action. :)
<Dickie> You would, wouldn't you ;)
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<Dickie> Well, that's just about it...
<Dickie> Thanks for your time over these two conversations...
<Garibaldi> No problem at all.
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